Propagating non-Islamic religions is forbidden under Sharia. That is bad enough, but of course, the "crime" of bearing witness to one's faith in public lies somewhat in the eye of the beholder. Ultimately, to continue to exist in daily life while self-identifying as a non-Muslim -- perhaps even having the unmitigated gall to do so joyfully -- is to make a non-Islamic faith visible, and to risk becoming a target. "Algeria: Clampdown on Protestants, 7 churches closed," from ANSAMed, May 24 (thanks to Nigel):
(ANSAmed) - ALGIERS, MAY 24 - A new clampdown on Christian protestants in Algeria. The Algerian 'wilaya' (province) of Bejaia has ordered 7 places of worship of this religious group to be closed. The measure, el Watan reports on its website, was issued on May 8. It was made executive on the 22nd and announced yesterday. Sources in the Vatican nunciature in Algiers have told ANSAmed that Catholic churches are not affected by the measure, and that the measure does not regard national territory.
The Algerians may also see an easier target in local, unaffiliated churches, who have no diplomatic recourse as Catholic communities would through the church hierarchy.
Mustapha Krim, president of the Protestant Church in Algeria, has appealed against the measure, which speaks in general terms of the closing of places of worship ''for religious worship other than the Islam''. Krim has said that he has visited the Ministry of Religious Affairs in an attempt to postpone the implementation of the measure. He underlined that he has not been informed about it in time. Protestants, a rapidly growing movement in Algeria, has been targeted for several years by the Islamic religious authorities and civilians.
The government accuses the Protestants of proselytism, a serious crime in a country where Islam is the State religion and Muslims are not allowed to convert to other religions. In Algeria, other religions than the Islam can register and obtain an official status, provided they will not try to recruit new followers among the local population. The small Catholic community in fact counts nearly only foreign members, with a few Algerians from the time of French colonialism. The attitude of the Protestants is different: in 2001 some North American Protestant ministers started preaching in the Berber region Kabylie. According to the Ministry of Religious Affairs, today there are around 50 thousand Protestants in the country, with 10 thousand observant Protestants divided in 33 communities.
In 2006, the Algerian government passed a law that punishes anyone who tries to convert a Muslim to Christianity, punishable with two to five years in prison and fines ranging from five to ten thousand euros. Several Protestant churches have been closed in the past. Early in 2010 a Protestant place of worship in Tizi-Ouzou, around 60 km east of Algiers, was attacked and set on fire by groups of Muslim extremists; the police did not intervene. (ANSAmed).
"In 2006, the Algerian government passed a law that punishes anyone who tries to convert a Muslim to Christianity, punishable with two to five years in prison and fines ranging from five to ten thousand euros"-
Muslims living in the west and other non Muslim countries beat their chests and proudly procalim when somebody embraces Islam. When Casius Clay became Mohamed Ali and Cat Stevens became yousuf Islam, Americans and Britishers never bothered to punish them or imprison these converts. This is the beauty of tolerance our faith teaches us.
It's fine if Muslims seek converts to their faith from other religious folks. But it's completely disallowed by Islamic doctrine that non-Muslims can (without threats of death or bodily harm) seek converts to their respective faith by soliciting Muslims to this effect.
Disgusting. Hypocritical. Repulsive. Evidentiary of the closing of the mind to competing ideas. Pure control-freak behavior. Antithetical to the basic liberties articulated in the First Amendment to the United States of America. But oh so very Islamic.
That's to "the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America," a document which is incompatible throughout with Islam.
Now more than ever it has become time to proselytize the Roman way.
If Western Civilization must move back fourteen hundred years to accommodate one billion current sh*theads stuck in said century, then let Western Civilization do it right, as it did way back when.
Clean up and move on to a MUCH brighter future.
Yes, I am disgusted by the actions of the Algerian government. But this action suggests that Algerian Evangelicals are on the move. Praise God!
Brother Augustine of Hippo, we are returning!
There is some hidden good news in this item.
Given that the Protestant presence in Algeria was probably limited to handfuls of foreign residents a few decades ago, but now that there are a number of churches away from major cities and clergy with names like Mustafa, I daresay someone, or quite a few someones, has been proselytizing. Given that Algeria is tightly closed to foreign Christian workers, I strongly suspect these proselytizers were themselves Arabs and Amazigh.
But I also know that this is a backwash from North African immigration to Europe and North America, which resulted in numbers of people leaving Islam for Christianity. Some decided that the folks back home needed the Gospel, too, and carried it back to the Maghreb. This is why I am not for closing the door to immigration, and for Christians having a little bit of confidence in our own God and a little more boldness in sharing it with others. Supposedly, we Christians honor a Messiah who rose body and soul from the dead after three days, and reigns from heaven, while Islam has a "final prophet" and "perfect man" who lies in a grave at Medina in Arabia, awaiting the trumpet of the archangel to rise and face judgment along with the rest of us sinners on the last day. I praise God that someone acted on such a faith and spoke to some of the strangers among us about it.
I am deeply moved by the work of these brave brethren in a place where Satan has his seat (cf. Rev. 2:13). Indeed, seeing the bigoted behavior of the Algerian government and the ferocity of Islam-incited mobs, the Algerian Christians are hitting the very gates of Hell itself. But I am also encouraged. The core Islamic lands from Morocco to Pakistan were long considered an almost impossible mission field. But the Holy Spirit has apparently ignored our analyses of the situation and has decided that these lands have been under spiritual drought for way too long, and has sent some of his rain to bring life to these lands of death. May God continue to bless this work.
From the article: "A new clampdown on Christian protestants in Algeria"
The deluded followers of Muhammad's sick cult of Islam will forever try to "clampdown" hard and force itself on the adherents of other religions...
Dearbornistan,Michigan has already worked at becoming sharia compliant after arresting Christians on a public sidewalk less than 2 years ago for proselytizing, shall we say to close to a Muslim fair and after Muslims complained.
But it is happening other places, in California a Pastor and 2 others where reading the Bible out loud near a DMV Office and a security called a California Highway Patrol officer over. The Highway patrol officer took the book from the Pastor and arrested him read article here:
California: Christians Arrested for Reading the Bible in Public
http://answersforthefaith.com/2011/04/29/california-christians-arrested-for-reading-the-bible-in-public/
What I found most interesting is that the Highway patrol trains to handle traffic and not deal with these kind of issues. Somehow this officer failed to recognize these peoples 1st amendment rights under the constitution.
Hey Kepha,
Although I don't know you from a hole in the wall, I think your comment stinks...
"...But the Holy Spirit has apparently ignored our analyses of the situation and has decided that these lands have been under spiritual drought for way too long, and has sent some of his rain to bring life to these lands of death. May God continue to bless this work..."
Consider backing off, bud. In my not so humble opinion, Christian zealots like yourself should not be considered representative of most Jihad Watchers...
Protestants, a rapidly growing movement in Algeria, has been targeted for several years by the Islamic religious authorities and civilians.
...............................
"Civilians" should be read here as *Muslim mobs*.
More:
Early in 2010 a Protestant place of worship in Tizi-Ouzou, around 60 km east of Algiers, was attacked and set on fire by groups of Muslim extremists; the police did not intervene. (ANSAmed).
...............................
Of course they didn't. How common is this? We have seen the authorities in Muslim countries stand back many times while Christians and other Infidels are attacked.
Just recently, this had happened in Pakistan, in Egypt, in Indonesia, and in Nigeria—and likely many other parts of Dar-al-Islam as well. In all these cases, the police are either indifferent to non-Muslim suffering and rights, are frightened of the Muslim mob, or are in sympathy with the violent oppression in the first place.
Muhammad was an evil mad man. Yet the Muslims are taught they must believe, respect, and follow every part of this sick mans primitive cult...
Sources in the Vatican nunciature in Algiers have told ANSAmed that Catholic churches are not affected by the measure, and that the measure does not regard national territory.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
It is a mistake for the Vatican not to condemn this move against Protestant Christians. (First they came for the Protestants, then they came for..., etc.) More importantly, St. Paul teaches that "when one part of the Body of Christ suffers, we all suffer." Christians of all creeds, as well as all other creeds, must stand together against this systematic brutality and expulsion so common in Muslim- controlled places.
Kepha, you are absolutely correct. Algeria is experiencing spiritual rebirth of an authenic nature and Satan won't have it.
If you took a sheet of paper and listed the ideals of Satan on one side and those of Allah on the other, the lists would be identical. The work of Islam is a work forged in hell. Opus Diablo.
I have been aware over the years of a teaching that says that Satan has inhabited a couple of different cities during the years, but did not move his seat, or throne someone might say. One was Berlin during the reign of Hitler and the other was Moscow during Stalin's reign and others. It is taught that Satan finally moved his SEAT to Brussels, Belgium after it became the capital of the European Union. This, it is taught, is in preparation for His final move to Jerusalem when he waltzes in and seats himself on Davids throne JUST before Jesus returns. A speculative case can be made for this end time move, however, this is not to be in substitution of basic Christian doctrine.I mention it only because you referenced Rev.2:13 during your post. However, there is a very strange building in Brussels, Belgium that some people have taken a long look at.
A little OT, but related: Algeria has not yet experienced the "Arab Spring." Neither have Morocco, Mauritania, Chad and Niger. I wonder when their citizens will wake up and want to be part of the action and start rioting. Same for Ethiopia and Somalia. Ditto Oman. All Muslim countries, all under repressive regimes and due for revolt. Wouldn't mind seeing the whole region descend into sectarian turmoil.
Despite the useful idiots who would ascribe the turmoil as being due to racism, colonialism, and capitalist exploitation, there are just as many others, perhaps more, who, in the accompanying crimes that would be committed in the name of Islam, would suddenly recognize be able to see the true face of Islam.
Kepha
I understand that a good deal - indeed, perhaps the greater part - of the work has been done by radio: gospel broadcasts in French, in Arabic and also (most important of all) in the Berber language/s, from a station on the Mediterranean coast of Europe (guess where - you might be surprised).
Recitation and exposition of the Biblical scriptures in the mother tongues - this is especially appealing to the Berber whose native tongue has always been scorned and suppressed by the Arab Muslim colonisers - plus lots of Christian songs in appropriate styles. People listen in, and keep listening, and then they write away for scriptures, and then they read, and they pray...
That has been the way of it, in most cases.
Here's an article from January 2007.
http.//christianitytoday.com/tc/2007/001/14.57.html
God's Time for Algeria
"...My translator was a product of this phenomenon. On the way to my accommodations, Davy shared how he had loved to listen to Christian music on Radio Monte Carlo when he was a university student. Eventually, at his request, they sent him a copy of the Gospels. Reading Jesus' Sermon on the Mount made a big impact, especially the phrase "love your enemies."
"I had never found that phrase anywhere in Islam," he explained. "There was a great difference between the Qur'an (Muslim holy book) and Injil (New Testament). In the Gospel it was like talking to God as a friend. In Islam you are a servant. I accepted Jesus because He practiced what He preached—and He gave me fellowship with God."'
'Unfortunately, Davy hadn't had any other fellowship, since it was 12 years before he met another Christian.'
In other words: in this case at least, and probably many others, there was no boots-on-the-ground evangelist involved at all.
More:
'"Ali" and "Lilly," a delightful couple on the staff, are former Muslims who have the responsibility of following up responses from Christian TV.
'Two years ago the channel began listing Ali's mobile phone number as a contact.
'It was a risk, of course, and the pair is sometimes hassled by hate calls. But they'll never forget the very first response they received, at 6 a.m. The caller said he had been following Christ since 1999 and he couldn't wait to meet Ali. Until he saw that number on the screen, he hadn't known that there was another Christian in all of Algeria!' END QUOTE
Radio, and satellite TV, broadcasting the gospel into homes in dar al Islam, in the mother tongues of the listeners. That seems to be working quite well.
I don't think that allowing an unlimited flood of Muslims into the non-Muslim lands - on the assumption that there is no problem because they will all convert to Christianity - is a terribly good idea. Would you have told the British in 1939 to surrender and invite the Nazis into Britain so that every Nazi could be given a Bible?
I see the link didn't come up.
This one does, however, seem to work.
http://www.christianity.com/Christian%20Living/Features/11622707/
Saleem, it is clear even without you noting it, that you do not know anything about Kepha. When you have been commenting intelligently and cogently for as many years here as Kepha has, agree with him or not, then we might discuss it further.
Sonofwalker,
Cool. And I wish nothing but the best for both you and Kepha...
No offense intended...
Kepha sets out a clear problem for people like me, i.e. non-Christian anti-jihadis intent on combating Islam and protecting non-Muslims by doing so. I couldn't care less about people being Christians for the sake of Christianity. I am very much concerned about people being persecuted by Muslims for being Christians-- or Jews or Hindus, et c. My concern for Christians is that, unlike Jews who can go to Israel, or Hindus who are more or less welcome to return to India, and other people who have some refuge in the world usually, Christians have nowhere specifically to go to if they are persecuted only because they are Christians. Communists can go to Cuba. But Christians have no right to go to Sweden simply because they are Christians. Oh, that must have been a bad example. There is nowhere for Christians to flee to specifically because they are Christians. Unlike Kepha, I'm not so happy that more Christians are being persecuted, therefore the good news is that there are more Christians. A Christian can like that, and I can respect it within the context it's presented in; but over all, I think it means that more than ever there must be a Christian refuge, and damned soon. Other wise there will simply be a lot of dead martyrs. That strikes me, a non-believer, as a bad thing. I would be happier to have more believers, in spite of anything I might believe or not, living and fighting somewhere rather than cheering from the heavens.
But it is what it is, and Kepha's point has to be addressed. It doesn't work for me, but I'm not qualified to discuss it with those who might differ. I see one more dead Christian as yet one man fewer to help us fight Islam. Yet, if these people weren't willing to die for their Christian beliefs, they would likely be Muslims instead. They are Christians. How does one argue that they should as committed Christians flee and fight later?
Hey Saleem bud are you a christian phobe! Kepha is exercising his rights of free speech in this country. Does it bother you that christians would want to convert islamists in algeria when islamists have no problem with the reverse scenario. Jihad watch is about exposing islamist extremist fundamentalism and its consequences and from what I've seen christian proselytizing has not qualified for the terrorist label zealot or not. Kepha brings up more issues with the miles long list of contradictions that is islam and is in keeping with the spirit of this forum!
I don't mean to be slagging you, Saleem, but Kepha is an expert of high repute in his field and is a genuine benefit to those of us here who have followed his thought over the years.
So, we all hang together here, even if by separate threads.
I am a Christian phobe?
No, sorry, bud, I am not.
I am an ex-Muslim.
Islam is obviously the one and only religion that is truly evil and that mankind should be hold in utter contempt...
ha ha, wishing you all the best too, Walker...
Saleem, if you're up for some adventure in a year from now, give or take, you might consider joining me in South Sudan. Give it some thought.
For Those Who Do Not Believe in Christ:
Let us pray
For those who do not believe in Christ,
That the light of the Holy Spirit
May show them the way to salvation.
Almighty and eternal God,
Enable those who do not acknowledge Christ
To find the truth
As they walk before you in sincerity of heart.
Help us to grow in love for one another,
To grasp more fully the mystery of your godhead,
And to become more perfect witnesses of your love
In the sight of men.
We ask this through Christ our Lord.
Amen.
Well, you have been hearing some interesting "teachings", haven't you? So, Satan simultaneously took up residence in both Berlin and Moscow during the 30s and 40s, and has now moved his "seat" to Brussels and the EU, eh? This is fascinating stuff! Pray tell, where did you come across these wise and learned "teachings"?
I don't think you'll get Kepha to agree with you that the Holocaust was the work of Satan, however, since for him it was but one of "those awesome providential temporal judgments we call history" wherein nations "become so corrupt and hardened that they need to be plucked from the face of the earth".
This, at any rate, was his reply to my suggestion that he believes "that the persecution of Jewish people over the past two millennia, including the Holocaust, was something they brought upon themselves":
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/05/palestinian-jihadist-protesters-confront-israeli-troops-at-four-borders.html#comment-788958
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/05/palestinian-jihadist-protesters-confront-israeli-troops-at-four-borders.html#comment-789500
Those who violate Mosaic Law, according to Kepha, "deserve very great punishments, all the way to eternal fire and brimstone". Given that he believes this, I suppose he reckons that a little time inside Hitler's ovens was a small price to pay for breaking such superlative moral commandments as "thou shalt not suffer a witch to live".
Sorry: the previous comment was intended as a response to "guide inside"'s reply to "Kepha" here:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/05/algerian-province-closes-7-churches-in-crackdown-on-alleged-proselytizing.html#comment-791285
You're welcome to your opinion. Just remember that while our religion also believes in a Hell, it doesn't want to hasten anyone on his way thither.
Hey, I'm an old consular officer and I'm not for unrestricted immigration. I was simply urging "Christian zealots" around here to have little more faith in their own God when dealing with Muslim immigrants.
I am NOT happy about persecution. I simply realize that it is something that comes and goes. Is it wrong for me to see a silver lining in a cloud?
As usual, "Damian" is completely full of crap.
You must have gone on a long and tortuous mental journey to find that response, "gravenimage". Care to substantiate it?
"Damian's" entire point is that Christians and other anti-Jihadists are as fanatical and homicidal as are Muslims—perhaps more so—and that they relish the murder of non-Christians—including supposedly finding satisfaction *with the Holocaust*.
He believes—or claims to believe—that any concerns about the horrific violence and depredations of Islam indicate a desire to launch a "new Crusade"—in other words, that caring about the victims of Muslims is no more than a desire to harm Muslims, and that any Christian or other anti-Jihadist who won't admit this "isn't being honest".
His entire history of postings here is not merely moral equivalence, but to minimize the threat of Islam while sneering at anti-Jihadists for their supposed hypocrisy and viciousness.
What is his ultimate purpose here? While it is possible that he is Muslim himself, I believe it is more likely that he is simply such a thorough-going nihilist that he seeks to weaken virtue and decency without replacing it with anything else.
Of course, Islam would be all too happy to fill the breach.
Is this something that "Damian" doesn't believe could happen, or does he simply not care?
Oh dear ... I really should have known better than to ask, shouldn't I? This doesn't merit a reply, since it consists of nothing but completely baseless assertions.