Remember why Hamas is considered a terror group in the first place: consider the "Glory Record" that used to be on its website. You can still see it here, via the Wayback Machine. Just in case that is not accessible, here are some excerpts in which Hamas considered attacks on Israeli civilians something that gave it "glory":
Hamas operations -The Glory Record[...] 3. Boureen Operation: The militant Hamdan Hussein Al:najar, a member of Hamas, killed the Israeli settler Ya'coub Berey using a big rock as his weapon. The militant was shot down as a martyr after he had ambushed an Israeli patrol using the dead settler's weapon.
[...] 6. Bus No. 405 Operation: Militant Ahmed Hussein Shukry, a member of Hamas, was able to lead an Israeli soldier to a secluded place in Tel Aviv where the militant hit the soldier with a chisel and killed him on 8 September 1989. The following day, the militant got on bus No. 405 and stabbed the driver to take over the bus; however, the passengers were able to stop the militant.
[...] 12. Keryat Youval Operation: The militant Mohammed Mustafa Abu Jalala stabbed four Israelis and injured another at a bus station in Keryat Youval in Jerusalem before he was arrested by the Israeli forces.
13. Askalan Road Operation: While driving a taxi, the militant Jameel Ismail Al:baz, a member of Hamas, ran over a group of Israelis waiting on this road on 19 July 1991. He was able to kill corporal Nadaf Der'ey and injure another soldier. Then the militant was able to escape but he was later arrested by the Israeli forces.
[...] 15. Shailou Operation: A military group belonging to Al Qassam Brigades attacked an Israeli bus carrying some settlers on their way to Tel Aviv to participate in demonstrations organized by the extremist party Likud against the peace process. The bus was completely destroyed; two Israelis were killed and five more were injured.
[...] 17. Eid Al-maskhara Operation: The militant Ra'ed Al:reefy attacked an Israeli crowd in Jaffa on 17 March 1992. He was able to kill 2 and injure 21 Israelis who gathered to celebrate Eid Al:maskhara, also known as Al:boureem.
18. Beit Lahya Operation: On the third anniversary of Sheikh Ahmed Yassin's arrest, a group belonging to Al Qassam Brigades attacked an Israeli settler at Beit Lahya and shot him down then withdrew safely.
[...] 21. Carlo Factory Operation: Four militants belonging to Al Qassam Brigades broke into a citrus packing factory (Carlo) near Nahal Oaz at 2:30 p.m. on 25 June 1992. Three militants stabbed two Israelis while the other was guarding. The Hamas members wrote some slogans and considered this operation as a gift for Yitzhak Rabin on the occasion of winning the Israeli elections.
[...] 26. Al Haram Al-Ibrahimy Operation: Two militants belonging to Al Qassam Brigades attacked an Israeli group near Al Haram (the Shrine) in Hebron. One of the militants attacked the group while the other was on guard. The Israeli forces admitted that only one Israeli was killed and another was injured although the Israeli authorities were shocked by this audacious and well-planned operation. Thereafter they arrested many members of Hamas.
[...] 49. Martyr Hatem Al:muzein Operation: Despite the intensive existence of the Israeli forces, the Curfew and the military siege, a member of Al Qassam Brigades stabbed a 38-year-old Israeli settler, Sha'ya Doytch, from Kfar Yam, a settlement of Ghosh Qateif at 7:00 a.m., while he was working at his greenhouse west of Jan Oar. He was taken to Sarouka Hospital in Beir Sheiba'a, but he died one hour later.
[...] 56. The Revenge Operation: As soon as the Israeli forces announced the execution of the six heroes, Al Qassam Brigade militants put explosives in a 15-storey shopping centre in Tel Aviv on 16 May 1993. The building was completely destroyed and several Israelis were killed and others injured. The Israeli forces admitted that one Israeli had been killed and 40 were injured as a result of a gas bottle explosion in order to cover up the operation.
[...] 61. The Two Martyrs, Hatem Al-muhtaseb and Ya'coub Mutaw'e Operation: It was a violent clap for Rabin when a commando group belonging to Al Qassam Brigades hijacked a bus on HI-25 west of Jerusalem at 7:30 a.m. on 1 July 1993 during the rush hour. The group was able to penetrate the security siege and reached the target bus from 100 metres from the Israeli police headquarters. However, the passengers were able to leave the bus because something wrong happened and so the group engaged in battle with the Israeli forces. Meanwhile, the militants Maher Abu Srour and Mohammed Al-hindy hijacked another car driven by an Israeli lady after the militant Othman Saleh had been injured. They bombed the car and all three were killed in addition to another Israeli soldier and lady that were on the bus. The militant Othman Saleh was taken captive although he was unconscious and kept saying "Allahu Akbar" while the Israeli forces were investigating him. A manifest was found on him with the following demands:
A. The bus must be driven to the Lebanese borders.
B. Al:sheikh Ahmed Yassin must be safely released immediately.
C. Fifty captives belonging to Hamas, 50 belonging to the other Palestinian formations such as Fateh, Al:jehad Al:Islamy and the Democratic Front, etc., must be released.
D. Al-sheikh Abdelkareem Obeid must also be released.[...] 67. Downtown Hebron Operation: During these serious conditions in which the disgraceful peace treaty was signed, the militants belonging to the Martyr Abdallah Azzam group ambushed an Israeli bus at the Hebron-Keryat Arba'a junction on Sunday, 12 September 1993. The militants shot the soldiers down and took their papers and weapons, including an M-16 rifle and a Klashenkoff after which they withdrew safely.
[...] 69. Askalan Operation: Al Qassam militants were quite active in the 1948-occupied territories when the militant Ala'a Al-kahlout stabbed an Israeli bus driver while travelling from Askalan to Asdoud on Sunday, 12 September 1993. The militant detonated all the explosives he had on the bus causing injuries to several Israelis. One of the passengers was able to shoot the militant down who was later martyred. The Israeli forces admitted that the bus driver was killed and three Israeli passengers were injured.
[...] 77. Beit Kahel Operation: In revenge for the bloodshed caused by the Israeli aggression and attacks on the Palestinian towns, villages and camps, Al Qassam Brigade militants ambushed Rabbi Haim Drucman's car, a prominent chief of the racial Zionist movement, Gosh Amunim and an ex-member of Parliament. They fired at his car near the Beit Kahel junction at 8:30 a.m. on Sunday, 7 November 1993. The driver was killed but the Rabbi, who is responsible for the settlement process, was seriously injured.
78. Hebron Operation: As part of the war waged by Al Qassam Brigades against the Israeli settlers, a group belonging to the battalion attacked a vehicle belonging to an Israeli settler near Hebron on Monday, 6 December 1993. Two settlers were killed and three were injured.
79. Hamas Operation: Two militants belonging to Al Qassam Brigades used a car to drive over an Israeli vehicle near Beitonia, southwest of Ramallah, at the industrial zone on Wednesday, 22 December 1993. They killed two and injured three other Israelis from Doulb, who were also in the car.
[...] 82. Al-khdeireh Operation: During the Israeli memorial day celebrations of the Israelis killed in the Arab-Israeli wars and one week after the revenge operation, the militant Ammar Amarneh, a member of Al Qassam Brigades, blew up an Israeli bus belonging to Eaged working on line 8 at Al:khdeireh, northwest of Tulkarm, on 31 April 1994. Five Israelis were killed and more than 32 were seriously injured.
[...] 85. Dezenkov Street Operation: In an immediate reaction to the previous operation, the militant Saleh Abdelraheem Sawy bombed an Israeli bus at Dezenkof Street in downtown Tel Aviv on 19 October 1994. The explosion was rather violent, leaving 22 Israelis dead, 47 injured and seriously damaging many shops. Israelis were confused and shocked by this operation, causing Yitzhak Rabin to shorten his visit to London.
Recep Tayyip Erdogan merits the contempt of all free people.
"Turkey's Erdogan: Hamas is a political party, not a terrorist group," from Haaretz, May 12 (thanks to Block Ness):
Hamas is not a terror organization, Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan said in an interview with U.S. television late Wednesday, saying he felt the recently penned Palestinian reconciliation agreement was an essential step toward Mideast peace.Erdogan's comments came one day after Hamas Gaza strongman Mahmoud Zahar said that while his organization would accept a Palestinian state within 1967 borders, it would never recognize Israel, as a result of the damage such a move would do to Palestinian refugees in the "diaspora."...
Speaking to Charlie Rose on Wednesday, however, the Turkish PM chimed in on the recently achieved unity agreement between rival Palestinian factions Fatah and Hamas, indicating that he did not feel Hamas was an obstacle in achieving Mideast peace.
"Let me give you a very clear message, I don't see Hamas as a terror organization. Hamas is a political party -- it emerged as a political party that appeared as a political party," Erdogan told Charlie Rose, adding: "it is a resistance movement trying to protect its country under occupation."
Going further, the Turkish PM said the world should not "mix terrorist organizations with such an organization, and they entered into the elections," adding that Hamas "won the elections, they had ministers, and they had parliament speakers who were imprisoned by Israel, about 35 ministers and members of parliament in Israel prisons."
"Where is terrorism? They entered into the elections and after the elections this is how they were reacted, I mean, calling them terrorists, this would be disrespect to the will of the Palestinian people," Erdogan added.
Referring to the impact the unity agreement Hamas signed with Fatah, Erdogan said: "I am very pleased with what had happened. I am very pleased. Let me express it very clearly, because this is what we wanted to see for many years."...
It just gets clearer and clearer with Turkey as each month passes, doesn't it? I'm just waiting for them to declare outright war on Israel...they may as well.
Robert,
They're just moving further and further down the path away from secularism, towards an Islamic theocracy, aren't they?
"Terrorist" is a useless word because it has no meaning for the perpetrators -- they feel no terror, they see themselves as resistance fighters. They and we should instead call them what they are: "murderers of civilians."
""Turkey's Erdogan: Hamas is a political party, not a terrorist group,"
It is clear to see on what side of the fence Erdogan sits..
"Where is terrorism? They entered into the elections and after the elections this is how they were reacted, I mean, calling them terrorists, this would be disrespect to the will of the Palestinian people," Erdogan added.
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As though standing for elections categorically renders a group civilized. Famously, *Adolph Hitler* was initially democratically elected.
And how did *Hamas itself* "react" to their election? By barbarically turning on their Fatah rivals—throwing them out of windows, shooting them in the knees so that they could not escape, and following them into hospitals to finish them off. The survivors had to *flee to Israel* for sanctuary.
They have only been able to "reconcile" with Fatah because Fatah hates Israel even more than they hate their bloody-minded rivals in Gaza.
Nor has Hamas been neglecting Israel herself—they regularly lob missiles into civilian centers there.
More:
Going further, the Turkish PM said the world should not "mix terrorist organizations with such an organization, and they entered into the elections," adding that Hamas "won the elections, they had ministers, and they had parliament speakers who were imprisoned by Israel, about 35 ministers and members of parliament in Israel prisons."
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That, of course, should tell Charlie Rose and his audience something of the nature of these "ministers", but I don't know if it will...
More:
Referring to the impact the unity agreement Hamas signed with Fatah, Erdogan said: "I am very pleased with what had happened. I am very pleased. Let me express it very clearly, because this is what we wanted to see for many years."...
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I'm sure that Erdogan—who has been fast Islamizing Turkey for years—is being quite candid here.
From the horribly politically correct wikipedia article for this clown "On April 14, 2007, an estimated 300,000 people marched in Ankara to protest the possible candidacy of Erdoğan in the 2007 presidential election, afraid that if elected as President, he would alter the secular nature of the Turkish state."
How right they were. Sadly he's got a firm grip on the turkish media so it will be reported in very favourable terms, if at all, and his islamification is in small steps, so most are unaware of how close he is to turning turkey back into a sharia state.
My bedtime prayer:
Now I lay me down to sleep,
I pray the Lord my soul to keep
From Recep Erdogan...
And please can Turkey be kept out of NATO?
Amen.
I think his ties with Iran will keep Turkey out of NATO and the EU.... for now.
It's what happens if he leaves power and a secular successor gets in and accepted into one or both organisations, followed by his re-ascension to power after they have got in that way that we should worry about
Such blatant hypocrisy. The US considers the PKK(which also has a political wing) as a terrorist organization.
Of course Erdogan doesn't consider Hamas a terrorist organization. Because he has embraced evil himself he cannot distinguish good from evil just like a pedophile thinks adult-child sex is normal.
I am not saying for one minute that Erdogan doesn’t know who he’s in bed with. But I don’t think enough credit is given to how dangerous hamas are.
They are not just an army of terrorists, they do run to a degree a government, but more than that, they are an organization running massive charity projects, for some plastinians, long before they took power they were the only place the destitute could turn to. so if you were to go as some libatard journalist or politician from the west, they will show you hospitals, outreach and food banks, not rocket factories.
And yes, I think the time has come for us to support the PKK in their struggle for independence from an oppressive occupier.
And whose this turnip here trying to compare Jewish women wearing sheitels with the black bags that moslims wear? What planet are you on?
"And yes, I think the time has come for us to support the PKK in their struggle for independence from an oppressive occupier."
This is a bad idea, we should not sink to Erdoğan's level by supporting a terrorist organization. Furthermore, I keep seeing people advocating that we support/arm the kurds to create instability in Turkey. Kurds in Turkey tend to be more religious, and they harass local christians. Don't forget the participation of Kurdish tribesmen during the Armenian genocide. A better approach would be to back the pro-western secularist opposition parties such as the CHP, which is Israel friendly(they have tried to stop the 2nd Gaza flotilla) has been gaining more support as of late due to Erdoğan's poor management of Turkey. Turkey has the 2nd largest NATO army, and is stronger by far than most muslim countries; allowing it to reislamize would be a disaster for the west. Unfortunately, European useful idiots have backed Erdoğan as a harbinger of increased democratization in Turkey, in reality, he has dismantled press freedom, stoked antisemitism, and aligned Turkey's axis towards Iran and the Arab states. Thus, supporting the Kurds would only serve to further strain relations between Washington and Ankara.
sorry, the PKK comment was tongue in cheek, I am well aware they are terrorists. The idea of us supporting them is just as ridiculous as Turkey backing hamas.
"Let me give you a very clear message, I don't see Hamas as a terror organization. Hamas is a political party -- it emerged as a political party that appeared as a political party....it is a resistance movement trying to protect its country under occupation."
As Walid Shoebat has pointed out, the REAL occupation is the occupation of Palestinians' minds with hate - this occupation has been going on for decades. This is the occupation whereby two year old children are indoctrinated to hate Jews and that it's a good thing to kill them. This is the occupation - none else. It's an absolute crime and moral perversion to be rearing a society that is taught and imbibed to HATE. No wonder they have so many willing to blow themselves up for Allah by the time they're a teenager. Palestinian 'society' honours these murderers by naming streets after them, putting up posters of them, economically paying off those families who give their son and/or daughter to the jihad....these are crimes of the worst sort and yet most of the world refuses to recognise this and remain asleep. May the truth win. It will and it damn well will. It has to.
Turkey is already a NATO member.
Time to suspend their membership then...
So I guess Turkey is cool with having rockets launched into thier cities, and having thier families throats slit in the middle of the night. Good to know, it shows how truly open minded and accepting they are, Islam is tolerance see.
Oh god what an idiot.
It makes sense. Recently, Turkey has been getting bigger and bigger in the small arms trade. Their company ATI, has been turning out high quality arms and ammunition for a couple of years. They also manufacure for several leading american company's, like Springfield Armory. I had no problem patronizing them, because I thought my money was staying in a "friendly" country. Ethically, I'll have to find another 223 vendor. What a shame......
Lanastalem wrote:
Kurds in Turkey tend to be more religious, and they harass local christians. Don't forget the participation of Kurdish tribesmen during the Armenian genocide.
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Very true, Lanastalem. During the late 19th- and early 20th-centuries, Kurds were both horribly oppressed by the Ottoman empire and their successors *and* some of the bloodiest murderers of the poor Armenians.
Such things, alas, are hardly mutually exclusive. And while I generally have some sympathy for Kurds today, we cannot forget that they have been steeped in the same hideous ideology of Islam as have other Turks, Iraqis, and Iranians.