The sad, sad lack of solidarity among Christians

The Archbishop of Canterbury is leading the way. He has said that terrorists "can have serious moral goals" and that "Bombast about evil individuals doesn't help in understanding anything." He has subsequently worked with Muslim leaders in England, and on the third anniversary of 9/11 spoke, by invitation, at the Al-Azhar University Institute in Cairo on the subject of the Trinity. He stated that the followers of the will of God should not be led into ways of violence. He contributed to the debate prior to the 2005 United Kingdom General Election criticising assertions that immigration was a cause of crime. Williams has argued that the partial adoption of Islamic Sharia law in the United Kingdom is "unavoidable" as a method of arbitration in such affairs as marriage, and should not be resisted.

... he added that "any person can commit a crime in the name of religion and it is not particularly Islam to be blamed. Some persons committed deeds in the name of Islam but the deeds contradict Islamic belief and philosophy completely." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rowan_Williams

wake up and do what exactly? as you say, Christians turn the other cheek. Leaders, like the Pope, encourage tolerance and dialogue with these maniacs. They are behaving as a proper Christian should of course, as Jesus told his followers to lay their swords down. It's admirable, but how can such pacifist counsel compete with "When you meet the unbelievers, strike them in the neck"?

I do not mean to insult Christianity, I am not a Christian but I respect the teachings of Jesus and being raised Catholic, I still feel reverence for the majesty of the church. but a Christian will die meekly while still professing his faith. A Muslim, on the other hand, would lie and repudiate his faith so he could be set free in the hopes of fighting the jihad another day. How can a honest, gentle people possibly counter those willing to blow up themselves up in an Israeli pizza place?

the bible: beat your swords into plowshares
the quran: fight them until the last day!

"They should demand that imams declare void ...."

But how do you know it wouldn't just be another exercise in taqiyya??

As secularization has increased, religion has become much more a personal matter than a wider social one. The benefits are obvious in that sectarian strife between Christians has generally decreased although I must say it is a pity and shame that following the precepts of Christ didnt lead to such relative peace in the first place. But the downside is also that many are less forthright about their faith and may be less inclined to identify themselves as a Christian of whatever dem=nomination than as a citizen of a particular country. And how many are even aware of the suffering of fellow believers at the hands of the Moslems? How often is the blame for the conflicts made to appear evenly distributed between Moslems and Christians?

If one simply asks "Is what happening to Christians or other religious minorities in countriss like Iran and Pakistan just?" then one can spark one's inner moral compass into action, no matter what one's faith, Christian, Jew, Hindu, Buddhist or secular humanist. One need only to be able to see.

"It is time for this giant to wake up."
And a giant young lady did just that.
http://crossmuslims.blogspot.com/2011/05/unholy-koran.html

Christians will not hesitate to fight evil but that evil must be beyond question, as was true during the WW2 when our national and church leaders did not hesitate to call evil by its name.
Now, evil masquerades as a gentle, spiritual faith system, even relating itself to our own. Christians don't know what to do when our own govt. and churches invite and give total support to the introduction of Islam into our country. Can our leaders be so far wrong, they say? The notion that our leaders could actually be in league with evil is totally unacceptable to them.

American Christians are still confused about Islam. They will put on their armor and pick up the sword when enough of them are completely convinced they will not be slaying the innocent.
I recently spoke at length with my pastor about my fears about Islam, stating the facts that I have learned, and they were all news to him.

Well here's one reason Christians are not being defended:

http://www.israeltoday.co.il/tabid/178/nid/22870/language/en-US/Default.aspx

THeir representatives are too busy defending Islam!!

Is it permissible for Christians to use force in their defense of others? Do we "turn the other cheek" when someone strikes us across the face? Part of the problem comes from misunderstanding and misuse of the scripture. Yes, the Bible does command us to turn the other cheek. So, what does that mean? It simply means this, don't respond to stupid insults. I was a police officer for most of my adult life. I've been called everything from "pig" to "bastard" to ... well you get the idea. I don't respond, I turn the other cheek. But pull a gun or a knife and I will shoot you. I have a Biblical right to do so. Attack my family, I will shoot you. One of the problems is people don't know what the Bible really teaches. (I won't go into the gov't role in the use of force due to space restraints) Beating swords into plowshares is a Kingdom statement when Jesus lit. rules on earth. It doesn't refer to the now. There is no Biblical command that says I have to stand still and watch my wife being raped. In fact, it violates the principle of my duties as a husband. It isn't love. I also served most of my adult life as a pastor so I've seen both sides of the coin. One of the problems today is the failure of our gov't to do what our constitution calls for, "provide for the common defense." In the early days before our forefathers declared our country's independence, when faced with attack and rape and murder, the people gathered together and formed militia's to protect. Our forefathers didn't like standing armies, but they believed in a citizens right to self defense. I believe that too many people are selfish, cowardly and apathetic. If it isn't happening to me or mine, too bad. Would our forefathers have stood by and let this open threat from Muslim leaders go unanswered? Don't you believe it. Sing what you know of the Marine Hymn..."from the halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli"... Another problem is our gov't leadership that tries to appease the tyrants instead of dealing with them. So, if you're attacked defend yourself. If your neighbor is attacked, defend him as well. Vote out those who appease Islam, it was tried in the past (Barbary Wars) and didn't work then, it won't work today.

There's an interesting book in the Cambridge Classics of Political Thought series: John Knox's _On Rebellion_, a series of sermons and tracts defending the right of rebellion in certain situations.

There is a long tradition of "just war" thinking among Christians, and I think of myself as standing in that tradition. However, the real difference between the just war doctrine and Islam's doctrine of jihad is that Islamic jiad of the sword is a Qur'an- and Hadith-mandated means of spreading the faith; the New Testament, however, mentions only preaching, prayer, and ethical example as the "spiritual weapons" of Christian "warfare". The just war doctrine drew more heavily on the Old Testament, which speaks of Israel's war of conquest of the Land of Canaan, its defensive wars, and even the rebellion of David against his father-in-law Saul. Yet even with this, most Christian theologians who affirm the just war doctrine would support the idea that it is the normal and proper way to spread the faith.

But there is also another doctrine in Christianity that Islam does not share: remaining sin in a Christian means that it is possible for one who enjoys divine grace and knows divine truth to wrong a non-believer. When this happens, amends and repentance before God are in order. This means that if a Christian gets beaten up by a non-believer, we may ask ourselves, "did he do something to provoke the other guy?"

And, because Islam seems to lack such a belief, many of us are all the more certain that Islam cannot possibly be of divine origin; and must necessarily be either of man or of the devil--or both.

I would go a step further and note that conscientious Christians are not influential in media circles. If they were, there would be far more reporting of the kind that we need to go either to the Barnabas Fund site or come here to see.

And, since the Abp. of Canterbury is mentioned, we unfortunately have our enemies leading some of our churches.

How do we expect Christians to unite when we have Churches who basically bowed to Islam, in the West! The Churches are not forced here in the West, like in Islamic-ruled countries, but why are they "making a pact with the Devil" - they're too afraid to criticize Islam and thus, letting the Muslims in the West be continuously drowned in the evil lies of Islam! Nowhere in the Bible calls for such a pact with evil, but to tell the truths against evil - so that Muslims especially in the West can reflect on the evilness of Islam and to seek out the true God, where they are free to, in the West. Most Muslims don't have that chance to hear the truths mostly in Islamic-ruled countries (I can understand the Churches in such oppressive situation) but in the free West, why are many Western Churches so pathetically afraid to tell the truths about the evilness of Islam? If they really love to help Muslims, the Churches should awaken them from the evilness of Islam; not push them further towards such evil! That is Satanic love that tolerates evil, not Christ's love, who hates evil!

Much of the persecution of Christians by Muslims are the result of preaching they hear at the Mosques along speeches from other popular Imams. The problems with Christianity today are that it suffers from liberalization and secularization, a lack of conviction,loyalty, and commitment and a total disappearance of leadership.

Ronald, thank you. I have not heard important parts of the scriptures explained so succinctly before.

Unfortunately the Archbishop of Canterbury isn't the only one who believes in turning the other cheek and in Christians having to suffer to come closer to God.

The Bishop of Bradford, Nick Baines, is another example of extreme masochistic dhimmitude. He said in an article in the Daily Telegraph (link below)that Christians in his parish should "accept" being a minority" (there's a 95% Muslim presence) and learn to "work with it".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/8631059/Christians-should-learn-how-to-be-a-minority-from-Muslims-bishop-says.html

This man truly believes in a totally sanctimonious way that the rest of us are blind and his way is best. In other words he believes that to capitulate to Islamism is the way he and other righteous Christians can earn their reward in heaven. What an oaf. To refuse to realise that while he may feel it's fine to be a martyr for Christianity - Christians aren't the only ones who will suffer if influential clergymen like him don't speak up. We'll all be slaves to Islam.

It is a sad fact that there exists a lack of solidarity amongst christians when it comes to islam. It is a serious failure and a dangerous one. But the problem is created by the supposed leadership. I feel sorry for christians and other persecuted religions but one has to face the fact that, certainly in the case of christianity, there exists an almost schizophrenic reasoning brought about by its leadership. Take Rowan Williams. Here is a man, so wrapped-up in his own piety and wonderment; the 'leading' voice of the church of England, saying that poor old christians must suffer the perils set before them, even to the detriment of civilisation as we know it. And also the obviously dangerously-unpatriotic bishop of Bradford, telling his congregation they MUST accept the dominance of islam. They both preach this nonsense to a 'flock' who have, by now, become so confused by the conflict created by the idealistic outpourings and the actual reality that it's little wonder they don't know how to feel. The time will come when the patience of the people will crack and the 'just war' mentioned earlier will be fought with or without the these silly edicts from Noggin the Nog and his appeasers.

They ought to get the flock out of it!

The proud people of Israel will show us the way....

Thank you for this article. Clearly as you put it " Unlike Muslims, Christians are respected for their deeds and values. It is time for this giant to wake up."
We have witnessed the absence of deed, remember the dog in the night that didn't bark?
Of course, it wasn't just Saint Rowans of Canterbury flipping Leftist Psalms out. We have a pews full of those prostrate before the altars of "PC", (political correctitude or philosophical constipation) in more than few confessional confederations. The idea of magenta or black cassocks is hardly a point to fall back on.
But, "Cui bono?" in their thinking? To paraphrase Churchill, that they'll be 'beheaded last' - or are they going to "SUBMIT" and give unto Caliph that which he demands, the jizya.
No more snooze alarms - better sleep with one eye open.
But, I know better.
There's an inner coward in me that wills my death, that I may die in this country while it is still free.

Christianity, the ultimate, "turn the other cheek" seventy times seven times, masochists and Islam, the ultimate kill or enslave anybody who is different, sadists are made for each other, aren't they?

Christians who are true to the teachings of Christ are doctrinally unable to defend themselves. Only the somewhat deranged Saul/Paul gave them a way out to defend themselves.

{^_^}

I don't think it's quite fair to talk about the lack of solidarity among Christians. Many of us know about what is going on around the world and actively support ministry organizations that seek to do what they can to report on and ameliorate the suffering of Christians around the globe.

But outside of those organizations and those of us who know about them, it's as if suffering Christians don't exist. In fact, as far as many people know, there are parts of the world - Malaysia, Sudan, Egypt for example - where Christians don't exist at all!

I think it's because of the stranglehold that the leftist elites have on the media and the education system. It really seems to me that most leftists don't know suffering Christians exist and don't want to know and are trying very hard not to find out! So it's no wonder that most people generally have no clue either. And of course, this means that too little will be done for them.

Thank you for this article, Nicolai Sennels. It is inspiring and I respect you very much, also because of your earlier work.

I am from a divided family, most older brothers/ sisters are still Christian and the younger ones more darwinist. The new generation under us is also divided along those lines. But still there is nothing like a rift and sometimes even very interesting debate.

I have questioned Christian family-members and colleagues about this situation and they are all politically correct. as was the Christian Democratic party in Holland as well as it's leader. The Freedom party won very big in the 2010 elections, taking many voters from the Chr.Dem party which lost dramatically. It's leader had to leave politics altogether. And I believe this was due to the CD party's stupid appeasement political correct stance towards Muslims.

My Christian talking partners all say that yes they are aware of the plight of fellow-christians but that only diplomatic endeavour can lessen this plight.

They look only nationally, not global. They assert that Muslims in Democratic countries are distinct from Muslim oppressors in Islamic countries. And not responsible at all. Hence it is unacceptable to those Christians, who only desire to appease, declare innocent, protect all "poor Muslims" minority in Holland as they are, to hold Muslims accountable for what co-religionists of them do.

But that is exactly what I hope that Democratic society will evolve toward: Holding Muslims in Western countries and India accountable for openly belonging to an organisation that harbors so many oppressors, even killers, of religious minorities in a global context. And these are making victims all the time, as shown above. And I believe most Muslims look pretty global too. And are loyal to the global Ummah, over loyalty to the nation they live in.

But with the way out that since Muslims in the West and India cannot oust Muslims elsewhere out of their common organisation, that they themselves step out of this common organisation, the Ummah, somehow.

Retaining their religion that is the harmless part of Islam and somehow assuring themselves they can still be eligible for heaven and will still not be committing acts landing them in hell.

But organising a new organisation of Islam-interpretation, acceptable in a democracy and changeable and with conditions upon membership. So that no oppressor of religious minorities, or women for that matter, is allowed to be or stay in their new organisation. Only such New Muslims with a New Islam-organisation I see in the far future as credible, trustworthy, changeable and acceptable.

When such a new Islamic organisation exists, then it is time to hold all "old, default" Muslims accountable for absolute reciprocity, that is equal treatment of minorities in both Islamic AND democratic societies. But with the West not stooping to the Islamic level, but instead expelling old default Muslims to Islamic countries in retaliation of oppression of minorities by old default Muslims.

But this is not valid now, and we must democratically evolve towards it. And already the growing freedom party declares that Islam may be a religion but it is also a totalitarian political ideology.

In future membership of it in an old, default form, should be considered unlawful in a democratic society.

God rest the souls of those who die true martyr deaths for the true and living God. A true understanding of the teaching of Jesus would clear up alot of the confusion of being taught by many "christian" leaders of today. In a true and just civil sociaty founded on true enlightenment of Gods word men would not just meekly lay their heads on the chopping block of invading hordes of barbaric hoards of heathen. They would fight to protect thir lives, families, possessions and faith. Turning the check is dealing with excesses of abuse in such sociaty for the peace of all. In such there is ordained of God "ministers" who bear not the sword in vain to execute judgement against evil doers. The US and western "christian/jewish world on the other hand is confronted with a political ideology cloaked in the religious garb. As was their dead prophet of Mecca who was a bloodthirsty murderer of the innocent, a thief, a liar, an extortioner, and a child molester with a nine year old wife...so are they. Evil, and anyone submitting their mind and spirit to that false prophets teaching in the Koran is poisened by its antichrist supreamist thinking. Christian peaples, nations, must protect their sociaty and borders and gates from these sons Lucifer and fight the good fight of faith. If not and we do not join together we will be destroyed. We must rise up from within and overthrow even their plant in the White House who banned the day of prayer but who established the day of prayer for Moslems in 2009. He is a evil liar who wants to destroy everything Godly in America and most of all christians and those of Isreal. We must rally around Jesus Christ who said as he rose to head to the cross..."he that hath no sword let him sell his garment and buy one..."

I read the comments of Kepha and Peter Shearer both. Hello both and thanks, I appreciate them a lot.

Look, Kepha, what you wrote about; anti-Christian attitudes; I too am all too familiar with that in Holland. And being a former Christian with a Christian family that I love, it hurts me. It is mostly undeserved and also stupid or arrogant. Veeery overdone. Me; I am content with their democratic non-violent attitude and I trust them completely.

But the astonishing aspect of this is: In my experience it was the leftists, generally speaking, that did the virulent attacking on Christianity. Now they defend, excuse, whitewash Muslims and Islam every chance they get. Worse, they take them in and get their votes.

While at the same time it was our VVD, calling themselves liberals, but from your standpoint rather free-market, individual-empowering right in Holland, always very opposed to the Left, that defended and allied-with the Christians and their big political party.

That is reason all the more why it astonishes me that it is a big part of the Christians that now side with the left on the issue of our relations to Muslims. Look, the Leftists, they are hopeless, they ally themselves with the Muslims against the so-called right-wing and America. They seem to see America as worse than the Muslims. Totally disgusting. While the VVD is the close ally of the Freedom Party. Only still too political correct to my taste.

But the Christians, not having suffered from the VVD BUT an awesome lot from the Leftists (Labour, Socialist Party, GreenLeft and such) still take a position that also defends Muslims and in consequence they even defend Islam, their mortal enemy for centuries. As I said, looking national, not global. Concerned with loving their Islamic countrymen, but abandoning the many Christian victims of foreign Muslims. Saying they have no influence there and that Dutch Muslims are diferent, not connected (while not asking them about their loyalties, which I suspect are NOT to Holland first) and not to be held accountable.

Whereas, as I hope you and Peter Shearer and many JW-ers too, look global and if I have to chose I rather defend global victims of Islam than local adherents to Islam.

But these Christians ....... But of course not all of them.