Our "Frenemy" and Ally (all seven user-contributed definitions at Urban Dictionary work rather well) takes its double game to a new level. "Pakistan let China see "stealth" chopper from bin Laden raid," by Rosalind Russell for Reuters, August 14 (thanks to all who sent this in):
ISLAMABAD (Reuters) - Pakistan gave China access to the previously unknown "stealth" helicopter that crashed during the commando raid that killed Osama bin Laden in May despite explicit requests from the CIA not to, the Financial Times reported on Sunday.
The revelation, if confirmed, is likely to further shake the U.S.-Pakistan relationship, which has been improving slightly after hitting its lowest point in decades following the May 2 bin Laden raid.
During the raid, one of two modified Blackhawk helicopters, believed to employ unknown stealth capability, malfunctioned and crashed, forcing the commandos to abandon it.
"The US now has information that Pakistan, particularly the ISI, gave access to the Chinese military to the downed helicopter in Abbottabad," the paper quoted a person "in intelligence circles" as saying.
Pakistan, which enjoys a close relationship with China, allowed Chinese intelligence officials to take pictures of the crashed chopper as well as take samples of its special "skin" that allowed the American raid to evade Pakistani radar, the newspaper reported.
No one from the Pakistani army was available for comment, but the Inter-Services Intelligence Directorate (ISI), Pakistan's top spy agency, denied the report. The paper said Pakistan's top general, chief of army staff Ashfaq Kayani, denied that China had been given access.
And besides, when does China make any cheap, pirated knockoffs? Oh, wait...
The surviving tail section, photos of which were widely distributed on the Internet, was returned to the United States following a trip by U.S. Senator John Kerry in May, a spokesman for the U.S. embassy told Reuters.
Shortly after the raid, Pakistan hinted that it might give China access to the downed chopper, given its fury over the raid, which it considers a grievous violation of its sovereignty.
"We had explicitly asked the Pakistanis in the immediate aftermath of the raid not to let anyone have access to the damaged remains of the helicopter," the Financial Times quoted the source as saying.
In an incident such as the helicopter crash, it is standard American procedure to destroy sophisticated technology such as encrypted communications and navigation computers.
Pakistan is a strategic ally to the United States but the relationship has been on a downward spiral since the killing of the al Qaeda leader in the raid by U.S. forces.
Islamabad was not informed in advance and responded by cutting back on U.S. trainers in the country and placing limits on CIA activities there.
The fact that the al Qaeda chief lived for years near the Pakistani army's main academy in the northwestern garrison town of Abbottabad reinforced suspicions in Washington about Islamabad's reliability in the war against militant Islamists.
There are also growing frustrations with Pakistan over its reluctance to mount offensives against militant factions in the northwest who are fighting U.S.-led foreign forces across the border in Afghanistan.
In a show of displeasure over Pakistan's cutback in U.S. trainers, its limits on visas for U.S. personnel and other bilateral irritants, the United States recently suspended about a third of its $2.7 billion annual defense aid to Pakistan.
Despite this, both sides have tried to prevent a breakdown of relations.
Screw "relations". It's past time for us to cover our "relations" with Pakistan in oil and to shoot a bazooka at those relations.
First this, then leaking info to the Taliban leading to the deaths of a chopper full of Navy SEALS, some of who were part of SEAL Team 6 that took out OBL.
Screw Pakistan. Let it be China's problem. There won't be any of this hearts-and-minds bs if the Taliban starts messing with the ChiComs. Anyway, the dust-up would rid the world of a few more of these monsters, and the bloody nose the godless Chinese would likely get in the process would do them good. Give our support to India instead.
I wonder if the Americans included an extra layer of deception in this raid on bin Laden's ISI hideout?
I mean that they might have rigged up a helicopter to look like cutting-edge technology, crashed it on purpose and then begged the corrupt Pakistanis not to let the Chinese get their hands on it at 'any price'.
Natch, the corrupt and greedy Pakistani military would think they had a saleable commodity and charge the Chinese a barrow loads of Rupees to take some bits of worthless wreckage home.
I mean, it's not like the Americans couldn't have turned the 'wreckage' of the 'crashed' chopper into charred cinders....right?
I think there's a bit of Hollywood special effects chicanery involved in this ruse.
Makes good sense, that does Buraq.
Indeed. China wouldn't have second thoughts about bombing Porkistan back not to the Stone Age, but to the Paleozoic Era if need be.
An American President may well have sanctioned the deception that Buraq suggests, but we are dealing with a Muslim Marxist usurper who wants to change America.
"Buraq", so you truly believe this was a ruse to test the Pakis faithfulness to us?
I also agree with "Guy Macher", that we are dealing with a "Muslim Marxist usurper", a Manchurian President.
Anything is possible. But for Pakistan to deal with China and give them top secret information about our stealth technology when they were told not to just shows where their trust is. I knew full well they would turn coat. They've been using the US for years while taking billions in jizya.
I do believe we cannot trust Pakistan and we should ally with India, get our young Marines and army personnel out of Afghanistan and get them safely home before the whole of Asia sets itself on nuclear fire.
"Buraq", so you truly believe this was a ruse to test the Pakis faithfulness to us?
I don't know what to believe. But then, the Pakistanis might be in the same situation - not knowing what to believe. War is deceit!
It's not uncommon for one side to make 'mistakes' the other thinks are real gaffes. It's part of the con.
For example, during WW2, the British dumped a body loaded with 'secret' documents and maps in the sea near Punta Umbria in Spain. The Nazis found the body and thought they had scooped the Allies war plans.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mincemeat
Could it be that Obama is poacher turned gamekeeper? Muslim turned Christian? There are Muslims leaving Islam in droves, y'know!
Whatever the truth is, I find it strange that top-notch elite soldiers would take out bin Laden and yet leave a 'top secret' chopper to the welcoming arms of crooks like the ISI. They could easily've carbonized it.
Pakistan offered China a permanent naval base on it's southern coast...Welcome to my home, said the spider to the fly...
It may be a strategic location for China, but it would also be a target for the Taliban...They don't like Chinese invaders anymore than they like American invaders...
Perhaps the thing to do is give ISI an up-close and personal look at some other items in our military inventory: the Tomahawk cruise missile, for instance. We could send a couple of dozen right to their head shed.
"Pakistan offered China a permanent naval base on it's southern coast...Welcome to my home, said the spider to the fly...
It may be a strategic location for China, but it would also be a target for the Taliban...They don't like Chinese invaders anymore than they like American invaders..."
Yes, which is the likely reason why China turned down the offer. China did take Myammar aka Burma up on an offer for a listening post on its coastline, but Myammar is a Chinese vassal state and quasi-North Korean wannabe, so the offer was less dangerous.
"Pakistan offered China a permanent naval base on it's southern coast..."
...
"China...turned down the offer."
Would that our strategic planners had had similar good sense when it came to getting involved militarily with Afpakistan.
I'm not surprised about Pakistan showing China parts of the downed helicopter. Pakistan has always looked to China as a counterweight to India, and has gotten much aid from them. I'm almost certain that China gave Pakistan information about nuclear weapons technology, too.
However, given that East Turkistan separatists are getting training in Pakistan, which have caused some strain between Islamabad and Beijing, I think there may be some rethinking on Beijing's part.
But, the important thing is that when it comes to matters of concern to the Muslim Ummah, Pakistan will always side either officially or unofficially with Islamist forces. They'll play doble games with either Washington or Beijing to keep the aid flowing, but when the chips are down and it comes down to either pleasing the aid donors or pleasing its own street, which is avidly Islamist, Pakistan will cater to its own street.
If US still does not recognize this wolf in sheep's clothing then nobody can help them and the rest of the Western world. No Muslim individual or a Mslim country can ever be trusted as their only aim is to furhter Islam and nothing else! They will deceive any infidel for sure to achieve their objective!
Hi everyone,
This gives new meaning to the phrase "Stealth Jihad"