UPDATE: In recent days, word has gotten out that apparently no CUA students are party to Banzhaf's suit, though the effort remains an equally insidious social engineering effort against CUA. The agenda remains the same.
Crucifixes? At a Catholic university? How about that.
Of course, at the heart of this complaint is the hope of establishing a Muslim prayer space on the campus that would be subject to different standards than the rest of the university -- a little enclave of Islamic law where its ban on the display of crosses would be "respected."
It is mentioned below that Muslim students say they like CUA because they feel "safe" and "comfortable." They are receiving the benefits of what Catholics have built at CUA, but are expecting more. They want to bend the institution to their own purposes for their own "comfort."
They think it's a fine place, if it just weren't so, you know, Catholic, and therefore un-Islamic. "University Accused of Discriminating Against Muslims," from CUA's The Tower, October 20 (thanks to B.):
New charges have recently been filed against the University on counts of illegal discrimination against its Muslim and female students. The allegations are being reviewed by the District of Colombia Office of Human Rights (OHR), which has the strictest discrimination laws in the country. President John H. Garvey and the University is being urged to respond to the charges.
John F. Banzhaf III, the George Washington University Professor of Public Interest Law who initiated the legal controversy surrounding same-sex residence halls, is also the one behind these new charges.
You'll want to read this sitting down:
The official allegations claim that CUA, “does not provide space – as other universities do – for the many daily prayers Muslim students must make, forcing them instead to find temporarily empty classrooms where they are often surrounded by Catholic symbols which are incongruous to their religion,” according to a press release on PRLOG.com.
This formal complaint also maintains that the new same-sex residence halls are particularly discriminating against female students, which is a new position on the same-sex lawsuit that began last month.
For both aspects of the complaint: it's a Catholic university, a private institution. No one is being forced to attend it. On the other hand, its very nature and identity puts a giant target on it for social engineering.
Banzhaf claims that the University is denying Muslim students the same benefits that students of other religions are able to enjoy since there is no formal Muslim association sponsored by Catholic University but the Columbus School of Law has an association for Jewish students
“Denying Muslim students the opportunity for form a student group on campus could hardly be based upon any fundamental Catholic doctrine since Georgetown University not only has such a Muslim student group, but also provides its Muslim students with a separate prayer room and even a Muslim chaplain,” said Banzhaf in that press release.
“An important reason [that Muslims are gravitating towards Catholic universities] is that the Muslim students, especially those who are observant, feel comfortable and safe at the institution,” said President Garvey in an interview with NPR in December of 2010. “It’s a place where their own faith practices are mirrored by our own. And they feel both welcome and understood at the campus.”
Gentlemen, start your platitudes:
“Even though it’s a Catholic school, a lot of its teachings are very similar to Islam,” said Al Salmi. “It teaches respect, community service, love, worship etc. which are things that Islam also teaches.”
The discrimination charge asserts that although OHR has been investigating alleged discrimination on campus since Banzhaf’s lawsuit began, “neither the President nor anyone else speaking for the University has sought to explain to the public, or even to CUA’s own students, why it believes that its discrimination does not violate the Human Rights Act.”
“As University spokesman, I have repeatedly explained to anyone who has asked me, including the media, that we reject the premise of Banzhaf’s argument, namely that single-sex residence halls are discriminatory,” said Victor Nakas, University Vice President of Public Affairs. “And we also reject his assumption that the Human Rights Act requires residence halls to be co-ed.”
That does a fine job of illustrating the mindset at work here. Rules and standards are hate and discrimination.
As these charges are being considered by the Office of Human Rights, the University administration said they will continue to work towards the betterment of its students.
“Catholic University is committed to the religious freedom and dignity of all members of its community,” said Nakas. “This includes the dozens of Muslims who come to the University for its academic excellence as well as its demonstrated history of outreach and dialogue to people of all faiths.”
I'm sorry, but could someone please explain to me exactly what the issue is about same-gender dorms and why that's discriminatory?
Possible issues:
1. You might have to get up and go somewhere to hook up. It might be, like, cold out, or raining. Maybe it's discrimination in that same-sex hookups are unaffected.
2. Alterative gender identities. I understand that has been argued at other universities in the U.S., though I'd hazard a guess that it applies less at CUA.
3. The argument that separation for any reason at all, ever, or the acknowledgement of difference is marginalization. That is absurd here, as it applies to sleeping/showering quarters, while the rest of the campus is co-ed.
Just once I'd like to see nuisance lawsuits of this type thrown out of court so fast that the complainants and their lawyers skid on their bums across the street into a curbside waste basket...and I'd like it captured and posted on youtube.
It's time for the administration at CUA (and particularly Georgetown U) to remember one particular spiritual work of mercy: to admonish the sinners. These Moslems need to be clearly, pointedly and consistently -albeit politely- challenged for their beliefs while they attend this private institution.
...said Al Salmi: “It teaches respect, community service, love, worship etc. which are things that Islam also teaches.”
Prove it. Show me where love is an admired virtue. Please exclude the zillions of verses that tell me whom Allah loveth.
Chatillon, that would be nice except this isn't a lawsuit, to be dispassionately considered based on the merits of the case. This is a case inexplicably before the Thought Police, the Office of Human Rights.
Certainly they can pray in the bathrooms, right? When a nursing mom doesn't have a room she has to use the bathrooms. Haven't seen a crucifix there yet. Better yet, they can close their eyes while they pray so they can be really, really introspective about their obedience to the slaveholder Allah.
If it is indeed still an actual " Catholic" school, then I suppose it would be OK to require mandatory Catholic study and prayer classes for all students?
" a lot of its teachings are very similar to Islam,"
True, the Qur'an itself says that Jesus is way better than Muhammad. Even Satan knows that Jesus is God, so what! Faith must be translated into Charity otherwise it's useless.
A brief comparison between Jesus and Muhammad from the Qur'an and the Hadith.
http://crossmuslims.blogspot.com/2011/05/saint-and-sinner.html
Rush Limbaugh speaks on this story 26Oct2011, 2:10 pm
Muslims should not be allowed in Christian schools. They only go to cause trouble. Muslims want prayer rooms and foot baths and what not for the same reason my big black lab pees on the neighbour's trees; marking territory.
Usual whining, moaning and complaining followed by arrogant supremacist claims of unearned special entitlement. No other religion does this. http://crombouke.blogspot.com/2010/01/islamic-supremacism-and-muslim-sense-of.html
"...where they are often surrounded by Catholic symbols which are incongruous to their religion."
“Even though it’s a Catholic school, a lot of its teachings are very similar to Islam,” said Al Salmi. “It teaches respect, community service, love, worship etc. which are things that Islam also teaches.”
Yep, the doublespeak inherent in Islam... We love Catholic University, now take down those infidel crosses, kuffar.
Let's face it: Moslems just can't get comfortable in America.
*** 33:21 ***
There's one solution to that.
"...forcing them instead to find temporarily empty classrooms..."
So? It's what Christians have always had to do in secular schools and workplaces.
These Muslims need to get over it or find another school. I'm quite surprised they would choose a Catholic university, of all possible places they could go.
The university needs to stop taking students with financial aid, then there are NO grounds for complaint from anyone...like Hillsdale College.
Oh, so they love it so much that they choose to sue it to make it more like what they want it to be instead of what it is ... and the current way it is was why they chose to be there some time ago? That sounds like a mobius strip logic - the side you want is always the one you are not on.
Well, this one isn't really complicated.
There are hundreds of universities in America, and most of them are secular. Students who declined their secular opportunities and chose to attend a Catholic university must have expected to find their surroundings Catholic. If they later discover that these surroundings cause unbearable discomfort, they can either transfer to a more congenial environment or they can learn tolerance.
Come to think of it, I imagine the Muslim students are very happy with the segregated halls of residence. If they win their prayer room, will they lose their single-sex dormitories?
Robert Spencer, are you in any position to give us a complete list of all the Islamic universities in the world that contain a Catholic chapel? Failing that, can you list the ones that allow Catholic students complete freedom to pray in empty classrooms, unhampered by images of crescents, scales and swords?
If the name John Banzhaf looks familiar, it's because he's the guy who filed all those lawsuits against McDonald's claiming their food made people fat.
And I'd like to ask those defending the Muslim students if they would be welcoming to having Islamic centers of learning accomodate Christians with chapels or hire a priest.
there's only 2 questions that needed to be asked 1. why are muslims at a CATHOLIC school really? 2. once again why is a muslim at a CATHOLIC school?
Muslims want segregation at weddings, swimming pools, mosques and a mass of other places, but now they moan about segregation at dormitories?
And that these are "particularly discriminating against female students"?!
So the Muslims would rather female Muslim students be surrounded by male Catholics???
How bizzarre...
Please excuse the abrogation ... "when in (a) Roman Catholic University, do as the Islamists always do!" ... Arrogantly Bitch and Complain.
I'm surprised that the Muslim faithful are not insisting that any (Catholic) clergy yield right of way on any pedestrian paths, lower their heads when passing and willingfully subject themselves to verbal and corporal abuse.
Hopefully the Muslims were religiously observant enough to treat the Christians harshly.
After all, do they not know that:
1-They can not pass on the right of A Muslim but on the left
2-They can not testify against Muslims in court of law.
3-They can not ride a horse or a camel but only a donkey or a mule.
4-They should wear special costumes to be identified ,when walking in the streets
5-They should wear tag in their neck as prove that they have paid their Taxes (Jizyah)
6-They can not own any weapon to defend themselves.
7-They are not allowed to defend themselves ,i.e .if they were beaten by a Muslim,but they may try to cool him down
8-Religious celebrations in Public are not allowed, crosses in Public and on Churches are not allowed.
9-Their Houses and Shops should not be higher than Muslims but may be lower.
10-Preaching their beliefs is not allowed, touching The Koran or reading it , is prohibited 11-They should pay yearly Jizyah (non Muslims special taxes) ,these Taxes,should be paid in a festival,Muslims should remind them ,that they are infidels, and slap them on their necks as a reminder.
12-Their Jobs should not be higher than Muslims ,but only in necessity,(i.e) if they can not find Muslim to fill the Job
13-Children Of Muslims are encouraged to threw stones on them,when they walk in the streets
14-They are not allowed to build new churches or restore the old one
15-A Musilm should not be Punished (Executed) for killing Non-Muslims,
If any of these Laws broken they are subject to slavery,Jail,Execution and their wives ,will be taken as concubines, and their children as slaves,
If a person cannot be forced to accept a religious belief, and thus cannot be forced to practice such belief, then no "Muslim" can be recognized as being compelled to pray.
If a Muslim must pray, is it the result of some irresistible impulse, like the so-called disease of alcoholism? Or is it fear that some devout Muslim might take offense at their abandonment of Islam, inferred from their refusal to vigorously and incessantly pray, and threaten them with physical harm? The compulsion is a function of Islam's capital punishment for apostasy. Our government should instead emphasize that freedom of conscious is a superior policy choice rather than reinforcing the fear of violence or retribution that any individual Muslim feels from fellow Muslims.
By analogy, government is willing to meddle in a marriage relationship in the case of domestic violence. The prospect of Muslim on Muslim violence, as prescribed in the tenets of Islam, provides the compelling government interest in assuring that individual freedom of conscious is protected for any and all individuals.
If a Muslim "must" pray, then we must examine this perceived compulsion. The vigorousness and frequency of praying looks to me like an obsessive compulsive disorder, perhaps explained by an ever-present fear of other equally fearful Muslims. It is a dysfunctional mess, a manifestation of a tyrannical social order.
Most of the important points about this issue have already been made. There is this, though:
The official allegations claim that CUA, “does not provide space – as other universities do – for the many daily prayers Muslim students must make, forcing them instead to find temporarily empty classrooms where they are often surrounded by Catholic symbols which are incongruous to their religion,” according to a press release on PRLOG.com.
This formal complaint also maintains that the new same-sex residence halls are particularly discriminating against female students, which is a new position on the same-sex lawsuit that began last month.
.........................
I suppose John F. Banzhaf doesn't realize that he is working at cross-purposes here. Muslims and feminists may both be "disgruntled" at Catholic universities, but in very different ways.
If Banzhaf is successful here, he will have to go back in a few years and sue the Catholic University of America for having co-ed dorms, which is "discriminatory" towards Muslims...
Green Infidel wrote:
Muslims want segregation at weddings, swimming pools, mosques and a mass of other places, but now they moan about segregation at dormitories?
And that these are "particularly discriminating against female students"?!
So the Muslims would rather female Muslim students be surrounded by male Catholics???
How bizzarre...
.........................
Green Infidel, this is just one of the oddities of the Muslim/leftist alliance. It is not actually Muslims pushing for co-ed dorms.
The Catholic college was retarded to let them in at all to begin with, stupid dhimmies! Riddle me this, how many madrassas would offer prayer space for CATHOLICS or allow a JEWISH student association? Don't answer all at once now!
What part of CATHOLIC do they not understand? DO the stupid Catholic doormats realize that the islamic prayers specifically call for the destruction of non-muslims, which would include Catholics? I expect the school will cave, because my fellow Catholics are largely, and sadly, a spineless lot and a bunch of dhimmi doormats. And people wonder why I am non-practicing, sorry, I'm not interested in participating in my culture's suicide.
You are absolutely right.
In one of these Human Rights hearings, or more preferably in a court of law, someone has to posit the question: "You say you have to pray five times a day. What do you mean you "have to" ? What would happen if you don't?"
Spoilt brats do not even understand the concept of discrimination! Why don't they do some soul-searching about the situation of Catholics in Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, the Philippines! Can they honestly say that viewing a crucifix IN A CATHOLIC INSTITUTION (although many practicing Catholics might dispute the label applied to most universities today) compares to what's going on with Catholics and other Christians in the Muslim-dominated world?!?
Good points, especially the myth about needing to pray 5 times a day. It is a well known fact that muslims may be excused from prayers at specific times and make them up later in the day at home.
And the same goes for the hijab (the muslim brotherhood logo) , burka etc., they are NOT a religious mandate they are a personal choice or husband's wish to mark his property.
I fail to understand how lawyers cannot win cases against this mythical "discrimination" if these are simply muslim preferences. We are being had in more ways than one.
Let's see, it is the CATHOLIC University of America for a reason... don't like it, go to the University of Cairo then.
There are a few open questions here:
If Islam is so superior and invented everything worth having, then why don't they study on Islamic universities instead of seeking out the last bastions of conservatism and trying to wreck them?
Reminds me of the first token Muslima by the CDU, the phony 'Christian Democrats' in Germany, who elevated a Muselmanic moron to ministerial honors. Her first act was to call for the removal of crucifixes from classrooms:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,691562,00.html
A Muslim woman's appointment as the first state minister with Turkish roots was meant to be a coup for Germany's conservative Christian Democrats. But Aygül Özkan ignited a firestorm by stating that crucifixes should be banned from classrooms. German commentators say the incident has damaged Chancellor Angela Merkel's party.
If you see enough crosses you might convert?
Somebody should start making pointed remarks about Vampires.
As a God-bless-King-Billy Calvinist, I also object to portraying ANY of the three persons of the Holy Trinity, taking my stand on the commandment, "thou shalt not make any graven image...and call it God". Yes, God became man in Jesus Christ, but he left no description of how he looked, probably to discourage attempts to re-create Jesus in our own image.
But, if I am borrowing some space in a Catholic classroom, or taking a workshop at a Catholic institution (as I did to get my teaching certificates) I am allowed to divert my gaze. I'd urge these hyper-sensitive Muslims to do the same.
Also, I've lived in places even more idolatrous, where the dominant religions were Buddhism and Daoism. I'm allowed to refrain from devotion there, too.
As for John Banzhaf (or Bonsai, a stunted tree), he should go bite his tongue.
Hmmmm .... Arrogant or stupid? Hmmmmm ....
I'll go with arrogant AND stupid.
The unfortunate likelihood however, is that nobody at the university has the brains or stones to put those idiots on probation.
Sigh. So few in positions of any authority don't get it that they are being set up for a fall -- and that by people who have no power other than the cooperation of their victims.
Indeed!
And even more to the point, the vampire has no power to come into your house unless you invite him.
There's great wisdom in folk tales.
So garlic might work?
Catholic Popes have officially condemned Modernism, which reduces the pursuit of God to a merely human past time by pretending all religious teachings are the same. Islam is not the same as Catholicism, and it is shameful that the clergy is so naive and that jihadists are so deceitful. The Catholic faith was founded by Jesus Himself and passed down by the Apostles and their successors to establish the Kingdom of God in the hearts of willing people. Islam was founded 600 years after Jesus, with Mohammad rewriting the Bible to further his political ambitions, specifically perfecting the doctrines of jihad conquest and plunder of non-Muslims. The two religions have different goals.
Further, these two religions may resemble each other in certain external practices, like charitable giving, but the reasons behind such practices are not the same. For example, Catholics are encouraged in the Bible to tithe and to give alms to support the work of the church and to help others, showing the love of God to them. Muslims are required to give to Muslim charities, which can only help Muslims in need, as they are considered superior to non-Muslims, and Muslim causes like jihad against non-Muslims. Islam is not Catholicism, and Islamic mandates should not have to be accommodated in a Catholic institution.
LOL!