This is part of the Great American Islamic Interest Group Shell Game on the nature of... that thing we're not supposed to talk about (but we do). It goes something like this, not necessarily in order.
1. Yes, we see there is a problem and we feel your pain. In fact, we're victims here, too (see next item).
2. Our religion has been hijacked by a Tiny Minority of Extremists.
3. Let us handle this ourselves. We'll take care of it, except there's not really a problem except for a Misunderstanding of Islam, for which the solution is a return to the fundamental texts and teachings of Islam.
4. Stop quoting chapter and verse of the fundamental texts and teachings of Islam, and Muslims who use them to justify violence and the subjugation of nonbelievers. You'll cause "backlash" and "radicalize" people against you. Also, you don't speak Arabic. Did we mention that? Alhamdulillah, we did!
5. You won't stop criticizing us? You hate us. And criticizing us is incitement. To "backlash." You're an extremist. Probably a neo-con, Christian "fundie" extremist. Extremism is the problem across the board.
6. But don't say "Islamic extremist." This isn't really Islam, and the problem isn't Islam. Please also stop noticing the disproportionate participation of Muslims quoting chapter and verse in acts of terrorism (see also: Item 4).
7. Just... shut up. We're the victims here (see Items 1, 5). You're the problem.
"Groups object to St. Paul Somali seminar, call it anti-Muslim," by Richard Chin for the Pioneer Press, November 7:
A group of Islamic and Somali organizations said Monday that an upcoming educational seminar on Somalia organized by former Ramsey County sheriff Bob Fletcher is anti-Muslim and anti-Somali and will lead to a rise in racial and religious profiling.
The seminar, called "Understanding the People of Somalia," will be put on Thursday at the Crowne Plaza Hotel in St. Paul by the Center for Somalia History Studies, an organization founded by Fletcher this year.
The seminar brochure says training will be provided on al-Shabaab, "an Islamic Extremist Organization," and says that topics covered will include "Clans and Sub Clans," "Black Hawk Down," "Youth Gangs," "Transition to America" and "Somali Culture."
But a message being emailed to law enforcement agencies throughout the state who might be sending people to the seminar warns that the attendees "will receive inaccurate and biased information about Muslims and Somalis," according to A. Lori Saroya, president of the Minnesota chapter of the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR-MN).
The message says two speakers at the seminar - Omar Jamal, former executive director of the Somali Justice Advocacy Center, and Abdirizak Bihi, director of the Somali Education and Social Advocacy Center - are "unrepresentative of their community and unqualified to speak on the topics outlined in the upcoming presentation."
The message describes Jamal as "highly controversial and a convicted felon" and Bihi as having a "checkered past" and "no known educational qualifications."
A woman obtained a harassment restraining order against Bihi in 2004 after she said he stalked and threatened her in a dispute over Somali terrorism. This year, she praised him for his work with Somali youth.
On Monday, Bihi told the Pioneer Press that he did not wish to immediately comment.
The CAIR-MN message also objected to the description of al-Shabaab as an "Islamic extremist terrorism" organization because it "fails to distinguish between Islam and terrorism."
The message is endorsed by about 30 organizations, according to Saroya, including mosques, Islamic centers, the Muslim American Society of Minnesota and Somali Action Alliance.
Saroya said she feared the seminar would result in "just a lot of bias and misinformation."
Fletcher, now a St. Paul police watch commander, noted that aside from himself, the three other speakers at the seminar are Somali.
"I am befuddled that three Somali persons could be perceived as anti-Somali," he said.
The whole point is to derail the discussion from unpleasant and inconvenient matters.
He said that Jamal has been a controversial figure but that he holds an official position as a Somali representative to the United Nations. Fletcher also said Jamal is not a convicted felon.
"That's a slanderous statement," Fletcher said.
Jamal declined to comment, saying he'd rather leave that to Fletcher.
Federal jurors in Memphis, Tenn., found Jamal guilty of five felony counts of immigration fraud in 2005.
Fletcher said it is correct to characterize al-Shabaab as an Islamic extremist terrorism organization.
The State Department designated al-Shabaab a foreign terrorist organization in February 2008.
However, Fletcher said, "the conference is directed at the history and culture of the community. There will be very little discussion of religion itself."
He said he has invited Saroya to participate in the seminar.
Saroya said CAIR-MN was not invited to be part of the seminar, adding that "no Somali organization" would sign on because "that would give Bihi and Jamal legitimacy."
"I would hope that people would wait to see the training before they pass judgment on it," he said. "Ninety percent of the training will be viewed as really not controversial."
"It's an informational seminar. There's nothing ideological about it," said Dahir Jibreel, the current executive director of the Somali Justice Advocacy Center, who will be speaking at the meeting.
"If there's one person who can speak for Somali issues to the media, it's myself," Jibreel said. "There is nothing anti-Muslim or anti-Somali in the seminar. I am a Muslim."
Fletcher said the $150, 8 a.m. to 4 p.m. seminar is being marketed primarily to government agencies that serve the Somali community. He said he expects fewer than 100 participants.
Al Shabaab is best thought of simply as a group of **DEVOUT** Muslims.
$150 a pop for a dinner and a talk to govt. agencies that service the Somali community?
I think an email would have sufficed in these economic times.
Minnesota: Hamas-linked CAIR objects to description of al-Shabaab as an "Islamic extremist terrorism organization"
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**Good God**.
Al-Shebaab is so bad, they make the old "Islamic Courts" regime—themselves crazed Jihadists—look "moderate" in comparison.
Al-Shebaab has murdered countless Somali civilians for the crime of being "insufficiently Islamic"—including a *little 13-year-old rape victim*, who they *stoned to death*.
Some here may take issue with the term "Islamic extremist"—as do I, they are orthodox Muslim—but still, if the term "Islamic extremist terrorism organization" does not apply to *Al-Shebaab*, then the term is utterly meaningless.
Efforts have been made to make the *Taliban* look "moderate", and now Al-Shebaab. If Muslims regard these groups as "moderate", then they are revealing themselves as Jihadists to the core.
... govt. agencies that service the Somali community?
So long as the gubmint checks keep rolling in, the Somalis will behave themselves, here at least. If they feel the urge to actualize their belief system, Dar al-Islam is but a short plane ride away.
Understanding the People of Somalia
That couldn't be made simpler: they're Moslems.
If you ascribe anything else to them, you're only confusing matters.
Omar Jamal, former executive director of the Somali Justice Advocacy Center, and Abdirizak Bihi, director of the Somali Education and Social Advocacy Center
Has anybody axed just what it is they're advocating, or why taxpayer dollars are given to them to do it?
Bihi told the Pioneer Press that he did not wish to immediately comment.
Neither does the Pioneer-Press. Better to leave some things left unsaid, and the Pioneer-Press rivals its cross-river rival in the globo-socialism department, so its staff harbors warm feelings for gubmint money mooches with the added glamour of being Moslems.
I think the word 'extremist' should, always, be replaced with 'orthodox'.
The extremist or radical Islam tag really implies that it is a fringe view, or somehow Islamically de-legitimized.
Orthodox Islamic terrorism is what it is.
Al-Qaeda is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
Hamas is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
The Muslim Brotherhood is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
Taleban is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
Hizballah is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
Al-Shadaab is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
All the Jamaat Islameeyas are orthodox Islamic terrorist groups.
The LeT is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
Boko Haram is an orthodox Islamic terrorist group.
CAIR, which apologizes for all of these, is just not orthodox enough.
Just a matter of time before CAIR decides to go openly orthodox and launch its jihad on US soil.
Al Shabaab is best thought of simply as a group of **DEVOUT** Muslims.
I'm sure it suffices to say they are devout. We wouldn't want to offend anyone. No ...it defames religion ...hummmm ..this is a difficult one,
How about "a group of Somali men"? Nope, too specific.
"A group of Africans"! There! Oops, no: it opens up to be accused of bigotry and racism.
"A group of men". My last offer. I suppose they are men?
Isn't the term "Islamic terrorist group" redundant?? Or are you just going for stylistic emphasis?? Or just distinguishing from Islamic groups whose main agenda is something other than terror (you know - Islamic stamp collectors, Islamic book clubs (This month's selection: THE KORAN!! AGAIN!!!), Islamic astronomers, etc)??
""...will receive inaccurate and biased information about Muslims and Somalis,"
As always, CAIR (".... Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas-linked organization spreading disinformation about Islam and terror, opposing anti-terror activity, and defaming freedom fighters. CAIR was one of the many Islamic groups that was named an unindicted coconspirator in the Holy Land Foundation Hamas jihad funding trial.") is terrified of the facts. The truth will set us free (from islam) and they know it.
al-Shabaab has history & culture?
LOL!
Hmm.
Non-Muslims interested in getting a handle on Somalia and Somalis - which means, getting a handle on what centuries of Islam have done to a particular African ethnos - would be better off skipping the conference and reading Ayaan Hirsi Ali's two books - 'Infidel' and 'Nomad'.
Especially 'Nomad'.
Would be interesting to know if University of Minnesota is represented as it has its own law enforcement department and is victimized by somalians from the north side of town, especially the west bank part of the U and Dinky Town. One would have to check the university police reports posted by law and available to the public-if they take the time to check.
rationallyTruthful wrote:
I think the word 'extremist' should, always, be replaced with 'orthodox'.
The extremist or radical Islam tag really implies that it is a fringe view, or somehow Islamically de-legitimized.
Orthodox Islamic terrorism is what it is.
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Of course, I agree. My main point, though, was that if efforts are being made to make particularly horrifying Jihadist groups like *the Taliban and Al-Shebaab* look "moderate"—and these efforts are not challenged—this is the height of insanity.
It is a blatant attempt to legitimize the completely indefensible—and must be fought at every turn.