Indonesia: Government official sparks outrage by divorcing his 16-year-old bride by text message

"The Prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with 'Aisha while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e. till his death)." (Bukhari 7.62.88)

So the child marriage isn't the problem. The divorce by text message, however -- that's going too far!

"Man who divorced his child bride by TEXT MESSAGE could be sacked in Indonesia - as Twitter backlash also claims judge who joked women 'enjoy rape,'" by Alex Gore in the Daily Mail, February 18 (thanks to David):

A government official who sparked outrage by marrying a child bride could be sacked after divorcing her by text message four days into their marriage.

Aceng Fikri, 40, chief of Garut district in West Java province, Indonesia, was already married with two children when he wed the young girl.

In another case that highlights attitudes towards women's rights in the Southeast Asian country, a judge joked during a supreme court job interview that women might enjoying being raped.

But both officials are now at risk of losing their jobs, which has been seen as a small step forward by campaigners.

The supreme court has recommended the president dismiss Fikri for violating the marriage law, and police are investigating the case because it involves a minor.

The country's judicial commission has also called for Judge Muhammad Daming Sunusiat to be sacked for his comments about rape.

Unregistered polygamous marriages, such as Fikri's, are common in the archipelago. Although divorce by text message is rare, it is allowed under Islamic sharia law.

His ex-wife Fani Oktarahas, who was the legal age of 16 when she married him, denied his claims that she was not a virgin.

A photo of the wedding last summer was posted on the internet and caused a public outcry in the local media and on Twitter, blogs and Facebook.

Thousands of people took to the streets in December to protest, with student and women's rights activists demanding he resign.

Protesters trampled and spat on photos of his face before setting them ablaze outside the council building in Garut.

President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono responded by issuing a rare public condemnation of the 40-year-old official and his illegal marriage.

There has also been anger last month over the comments made by Judge Muhammad Daming Sunusiat at a parliamentary selection panel for a supreme court position.

He said it could be a mistake to impose the death penalty for rape because both the attacker and the victim 'might have enjoyed' it.

The remark reportedly drew laughter from panel members. Sunusi later apologised and said he had been joking.

Ha ha!

Not only was Sunusi rejected for the job, but the country's Judicial Commission recommended that he be dismissed from his position on the South Sumatra high court.

But the supreme court would have to agree, and it has said such punishment would be too severe because he made the remark in an interview, not during a trial.

Husein Muhammad,of the commission on violence against women, said: 'Enough is enough!

'Our officials should no longer mess around and issue ridiculous statements even as a dumb joke.'

Women in the social-media-obsessed country have been rallying, online and on the streets, against sexists comments and attacks on women for some time.

The movement in a country of 240 million people, most of whom practice a moderate form of Islam, appears to be having some impact on the largely secular government.

Husein Muhammad added: 'We are living in a different era now. Now we have supporting laws and social media to bring severe consequences and social sanctions.'

But rights groups argue the country remains far behind on many issues involving gender equality and violence. Rape cases often are not properly investigated, and victims are sometimes blamed.

In 2011, after a woman was gang raped on a minibus, then-Jakarta governor Fauzi Bowo drew protests after warning women not to wear miniskirts on public transportation because it could arouse male passengers. Bowo lost his re-election bid last year.

A sex-trafficking case involving a 14-year-old girl prompted education minister Mohammad Nuh to say last year that not all girls who report such crimes are victims.

He said: 'They do it for fun, and then the girl alleges that it's rape.'

His response to the criticism he received was that it's difficult to prove whether sexual assault allegations are 'real rapes.'...

In the West Java official's case, it was the text-message divorce that prompted outrage more than his unregistered second marriage, though such weddings raise issues about women's rights.

They are regularly performed for Indonesians ranging from poor rice farmers to celebrities, politicians and Muslim clerics.

Polygamy remains common in many Muslim countries, based on Islamic teachings that allow men to take up to four wives.

In Indonesia, men are allowed to marry a second wife only after the first gives her blessing. Since most women refuse to agree to share their husbands, unregistered ceremonies, or 'nikah siri,' are often secretly carried out by an Islamic cleric outside the law.

Some of the marriages are simply a cover for prostitution. A cleric is paid to conduct 'contract marriages' as short as one night in some parts of Indonesia, usually for Middle Eastern tourists.

Practices differ slightly elsewhere, with men in places such as Malaysia sometimes marrying outside the country to avoid informing existing spouses and seeking permission from an Islamic court....

Temporary marriage, or mut'a, is the practice of entering into a marriage with a time limit: the couple is married only for a night, or a week, or whatever time period their agreement specifies. So in other words, it is prostitution under the guise of morality. Temporary wives are found in large numbers in seminary towns where young clerics-in-training are away from home and lonely.

This is a Shi'ite concept that mainstream Sunnis ostensibly reject; the Shi'ites point out that Muhammad allowed it, while the Sunnis maintain that he later abolished the practice. Shi'ites also justify it by reference to Qur'an 4:24, which says: "And those of whom ye seek content (by marrying them), give unto them their portions as a duty. And there is no sin for you in what ye do by mutual agreement after the duty (hath been done)." They see in that reference to "what ye do by mutual agreement" the allowance of a time limit.

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This is a test.

this, too, is a test

i continue to be repulsed by thoughts of Muhammad (recently contrived) who is supposed to be the model of behavior for the brothers, when this phantasm promotes pedophilia through SHARIA which enslaves men and women to certain immorality, offensive to the Lord of All Living.

"The Prophet"

...ahem he's not my prophet!

Are we really able to comment again?

Jihad Watch has been the victim of a really nasty cyber attack. Comments have been down for almost a week, and there were several days when Robert Spencer could not even post articles.

Bravo to Mr. Spencer and his tech team!

Jihadists and their enablers *won't* shut us up!

Are we really able to comment again?

Jihad Watch has been the victim of a really nasty cyber attack. Comments have been down for almost a week, and there were several days when Robert Spencer could not even post articles.

Bravo to Mr. Spencer and his tech team!

Jihadists and their enablers *won't* shut us up!

Sorry about the double post. The first time I tried to post this, it hung up for fifteen minutes, so I thought it had stalled.

Of course, if Indonesia does sack this judge, they will be "going against Islam". There's *nothing* un-Islamic, alas, about "marrying"—and then discarding—any wife, even a child.

And look at his reason for abandoning this girl:

"His ex-wife Fani Oktarahas, who was the legal age of 16 when she married him, denied his claims that she was not a virgin."

Of course, she probably isn't a virgin *now*.

One might reasonably assume that this child is better off without this vicious creep of a "husband"—except that now she has been abandoned and her honor besmirched—by a "judge", no less.

Her options are not quite as devastating as they'd be in a full Shari'ah state, where she would likely face legal abuse or worse—but they're still pretty bleak.

God, I hate Islam.

Don't forget folks, that divorce from your child bride is easy. All you have to do is say it three times and that's it!
However, divorce by text message... well that's a difficult one.
Would Mohammed allow it? Muslims hate technology (unless it's technology of weapons and warfare)so does texting count? After all, every scientific fact is found in the Koran (except for phones of course). The Sun sets in a muddy swamp, the Earth is flat mmm.. it is very tricky. Does divorce by text count? Maybe, maybe not... who cares? She's a little slut anyway.
I divorce thee
I divorce thee
I divorce thee

Softly Bob wrote:

However, divorce by text message... well that's a difficult one.
Would Mohammed allow it? Muslims hate technology (unless it's technology of weapons and warfare)so does texting count?
....................................

Bob, I believe you are *mostly* right when you cite weaponry as the exception to the ban on "Bi'da" (innovation).

Weaponry is the *main* exception—but not the only one. One sees condemnation in the Muslim world over the use of YouTube and social media—*unless* it is in the service of Islam.

Ergo, having a picture of even a squeaky-clean, family-friendly pop star like Celine Dion is Haram, but watching beheading videos on the same device is not.

So—back to the issue at hand.

Is allowing a respected Muslim to f*ck a teenage girl and then discard her, while demeaning her and possibly ruining her future—in the most convenient way possible and while asserting Islamic norms of virginity—Haram?

I wouldn't bet on it. Sounds just as Halal as can be—the use of Infidel technology notwithstanding.

Good to be back. Highly instructive how the enemies of freedom seek all kinds of ways to destroy freedom, as they have this past week or so at Jihad Watch. But they never win in the end. Never.

Freedom always prevails eventually. Keep this in mind all you totalitarian turds out there, be you leftist or Islamic.

Good to hear other freedom lovers on this blog. We are back and the battle continues against the EVIL = ISLAM. Thanks Robert for all you do.

From Robert's article: "Temporary marriage, or mut'a, is the practice of entering into a marriage with a time limit: the couple is married only for a night, or a week, or whatever time period their agreement specifies. So in other words, it is prostitution under the guise of morality. Temporary wives are found in large numbers in seminary towns where young clerics-in-training are away from home and lonely."
"This is a Shi'ite concept that mainstream Sunnis ostensibly reject; the Shi'ites point out that Muhammad allowed it, while the Sunnis maintain that he later abolished the practice [...]"

Though the Sunnis developed something that has a similar effect, the so-called "traveler's marriage", i.e., zawaj al-misyar (or nikah al-misyar).

As for the concepts of nikah and mut'ah, this extensive quote by a commenter on Translating Jihad is quite an eye-opener on the Islamic notion of marriage. As you read this, contrast this with modern Western concepts of marriage:

http://www.translatingjihad.com/2011/03/update-fatwa-it-is-permissible-to-have.html


Law of desire: temporary marriage in Shi'i Iran (1989) Syracuse University Press, Syracuse, New York
By Shahla Haeri

p. 46, excerpts from the chapter on Permanent Marriage

“The purpose of observing ‘idda is twofold: First, to make sure the woman is not pregnant by the man who has divorced her, and second, to “purify her womb,” tathir-i rahim, for the next man who might be marrying her.”
“The obligation to keep ‘idda, like the payment of brideprice, depends on the accomplishment of the penetration. Keeping ‘idda is not required where marriage has not been consummated.”
Those under the age of nine likewise are exempt from abstinence, regardless of whether or not consummation has taken place. In all these categories, the assumption is that a possibility of pregnancy is remote, and therefore a mixing of parentage is prevented.”
“Purity of womb—or its pollution—is religiously meaningful insofar as the separation of potential paternal genes is concerned. A woman past menopause, therefore, does not pose a threat to men by getting their seeds mixed up.”

p. 30 (regarding both permanent and temporary marriage)
An Islamic marriage is defined as “that type of contract, ‘aqd, which gives ownership, tamlik, over intercourse, vaty, not like buying a slave girl whose ownership entitles her master a right to intercourse” (Hilli SI, 428).”

Chapter Permanent Marriage: Nikah, page 33-34

“Throughout the centuries, virtually unchanging language is used to define the Shi’i institution of marriage. Hilli (SI, 428), the thirteenth-century scholar, defines a contract of marriage as “that type of contract which ensures domination over the vagina, buz’, without ownership, milkiyyat,” as in the case of a slave girl.1 Hilli’s ambivalence regarding similarities between a contract of sale and of marriage is underscored by yet another of his definitions of nikah. On the one hand, he suggests that “marriage is a kind of ownership” (517), but on the other, he argues, an ‘aqd [marriage] and ownership, milkiyyat, do not mix” (446), meaning that a man may have intercourse with his own slave girl but he may not marry her—unless he first sets her free.2 He can, however, marry another man’s slave girl. Note that Hilli’s distinction is not between the existence or lack of ownership, but between what I call a “complete ownership,” as in the case of owning a slave girl, and a “partial ownership,” as in the case of a contract of marriage. Although legally this injunction makes it unlawful for a man to own his wife completely, it allows him to own part of his wife’s body and, consequently, the right to control her activities. In the tradition of his predecessors, Jabiri-Arablu, a contemporary scholar, after giving several interpretations of the term nikah, concludes that “nikah is a contract for the ownership, tamlik, of the use of [the] vagina” (1983, 175)."

“[…] Hilli…writes that nikah is a “sort of ownership” and that it is “similar to the [contract of] sale,” on the other hand he emphasizes that “the purpose of the exchange of the vagina, mu’avizih-i buz’, is reproduction and recreation, and not just financial exchange” […]
“The ambivalence regarding classification of the definition of the contract of marriage is underscored by the confusion surrounding the definition of the term nikah itself. Emphasizing its literal meaning, some have interpreted it as intercourse, vaty.4 Others, stressing its contractual and obligational aspects, have referred to it as an ‘aqd, a contract. Citing Sahib-I Javahir, Murata writes: “For the Sunnis nikah means intercourse, and since marriage implies intercourse, then the word nikah has been used in the contract” (1974, 2). In contrast, Murata continues, Raghib maintains, “Intercourse is not the meaning of nikah because of its shamefulness, qubh, but that it is used as an analogy for that [intercourse]. Therefore the real meaning of nikah is ‘aqd, contract” (see also Jabiri-Arablu 1983, 174-75; Farah 1984, 14; “Nikah” 1927, 912).”
[…] “Noting the diversity of opinions, Langarudi, a contemporary Iranian Shi’i scholar […] argues [...] “intercourse is the raison d’etre of marriage” (5)
“Likewise, Imami defines nikah as a “legal relationship, created between a man and a woman as a result of a contract that permits them to enjoy each other sexually” (1971, 4:268)”
------------------------------------------

From Al-Sistani (Iraq, Shia), which shows some variation in the rules:

"Divorce » Iddah of Divorce
2519. A wife who is under nine and who is in her menopause will not be required to observe any waiting period. It means that, even if the husband has had sexual intercourse with her, she can remarry immediately after being divorced.
2520. If a wife who has completed nine years of her age and is not in menopause, is divorced by her husband after sexual intercourse, it is necessary for her to observe the waiting period of divorce. [...]
2524. If a woman who has completed nine years of age, and is not in menopause, contracts a temporary marriage, for example, if she marries a man for a period of one month or a year and the period of her marriage comes to an end, or her husband exempts her from the remaining period, she should observe Iddah. If she sees Haidh, she should observe Iddah for two periods of Haidh, and cannot marry again during that period.
But if she does not see Haidh, then she should refrain from marrying another man for forty five days. And if she is pregnant, she should observe Iddah till the birth or miscarriage of the child, or for forty five days and as a recommended precaution, she should wait for whichever period is longer. [...]"

Hey KofK, thanks for that. Quite illuminating, isn't it?

One sick ideology.

Hi, Wellington ...

This is off topic; you may recall that you and I were briefly discussing John Brennan's conversion to islam on February 9 (the day comments became disabled), here:

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2013/02/hamas-linked-cair-other-islamic-supremacist-groups-waging-war-against-free-speech.html#comment-930421


And then on February 12th Robert posted this headline:

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2013/02/former-fbi-agent-says-john-brennan-converted-to-islam-in-saudi-arabia-in-the-1990s.html#comments

Since then this story has been featured on some tv news stations, too. Hope you are well, my friend.

Yes, one sick ideology alright. Lets' put it this way: I'm no longer surprised, but never cease to be amazed and/or disgusted.

Looks as though comments are back.

Excellent.

Hi, everybody!

I suggest that we *all*, over the next week of so, if we have not already done so, should put something in Mr Spencer's tip jar, with a view to his being better able to afford good IT debuggers as required.

Looks as though comments are back.

Excellent.

Hi, everybody!

I suggest that we *all*, over the next week of so, if we have not already done so, should put something in Mr Spencer's tip jar, with a view to his being better able to afford good IT debuggers as required.

Glad to see everybody back!

I agree w/ Kinana - not just the Misyar, but there is another type of temporary marriage that Sunnis practice - just forget the name at the moment. Read it on Hesperado some weeks ago

Glad to see the comments are back! Might we expect more details on this hack, I was quite intrigued by your last post on it.

An Indonesian governor advising women not to wear 'skirts' when getting on the bus, (skirt=flirt.) Imagine the misogyny in this patriarchal society. The governor didn't have a word of condemnation for the men who are usually the rapists, so typical of a brain on Islam.

Hey Robert good work, keep it up.

The other day I was watching a program on BBC titled (British modern Muslims) or something to that effect.

A couple of young girls decided to become Muslims, one of them married a Pakistani, I was so furious about their apparent stupidity (sorry, I can't think of any other fitting noun.) Towards the end of the program, the Pakistani husband of the british girl married another woman from his native land, and the british girl was so confused and angry, I'm not trying to be mischievous, but the girl deserved such a shocker, I LMAO.

This goes to show that Spencer's work here is invaluable, many people are still ignorant of the real Islam. BTW, I remember some regular posters here, someone mentioned Hesperado in a comment above, Cornelius (sp) is also another one that is missing, hope they are all fine. Keep it up.

Islam in Indonesia is always being proclamed moderate, tolerant and permissive.
And Islam in Indonesia "was never spread by the sword".

We don't know much about the spread of Islam in Indonesia, but perhaps the apparent need for Hindus to retreat to Bali should tell us a few things. Also we can take it for granted that Islam as usual denied other religions the rights it claims for itself: children of mixed marriages being brought up as Muslims, Muslim women not marrying non-muslims, the gradual introduction of Islamic laws, the pushing aside of other religions ...who were mere polytheists, the most despised of all creatures.

As for tolerance we need only consider Aceh, the area closest to Arabia and the first to introduce Islam and become islamized: the strict practice of Islam does not promise well for the rest of Indonesia, and is most of all an example of the development experienced by nations and cultures who succumb to Islam.

Hello, all. It's good to be back.

Fani Oktara :

Fani Oktora married (18 years), a young woman who recently graduated from high school on July 16, 2012 last. Four days later he divorced Fani via SMS on the grounds that he was not a virgin anymore.

Brief Biography:
Fani Oktara accept this reality was depressed because all Aceng Fikri allegations about him were not true. Hooded woman said that she would marry the Regent Aceng as promised will be invited Umrah and given money to the cost of home renovation and tuition. Fani was not alone. Recently a girl named Chintya Prada Larasati origin Falkirk, claimed to have married and divorced Aceng via SMS within a few days.

Not a child then

http://www.kucoba.com/2012/12/biodata-fani-oktora-profil-foto.html

I see that, along with all the staunch Anti-Jihadists who are back commenting here, that at leat one Muslim apologist is back, as well.

Gunung Semeru wrote:

Fani Oktora married (18 years), a young woman who recently graduated from high school on July 16, 2012 last. Four days later he divorced Fani via SMS on the grounds that he was not a virgin anymore.
...................................

Well, of course! And little Aisha was—what?—nineteen or twenty when she married the "Prophet"...sarc/off

Why are we expected to trust a source which doesn't even get the girl's *gender* right?

And note that Gunung Semeru has *no* problem with polygamy, summary divorce, and public humiliation.

And why should he? It's all perfectly Islamic...

Of course, so is *child marriage*. But even Gunung Semeru realizes that his is a bridge too far for most decent Infidels. Hence, the need to dissemble...

Hi, Champ. Thanks for that update on Brennan. Well, if he is a Muslim, wow!

Members of a belief system which is spiritually fascist in structure and ideology, as Islam is, should not be in the American government at all, let alone head of the CIA. President Truman issued executive order #9835 in 1947 to inquire into the beliefs of federal employees in order to insure that Communist sympathizers did not exist in the government. Time for another such executive order but, of course, we'll never get it from the present Chief Executive. We'll never get it all as long as Islam is looked upon as a good thing rather than the malevolent, profoundly anti-American religion, doubling as a political ideology, which it is. Much to be done. I hope someday it will be done.

Hope you're well, my friend. Good to see you and others back here at JW.

Graven

Two points,

#1 Not one report but most reports about the young woman says she was 18.

#2 The other point is she was not the only young women to have been fooled by this lecherous creature.

If you read other reports the she married the guy because he promised to take her to mecca, also renovations to her home.

The young woman was cheated, now this of course does happen with christians, buddhists or hindus does it

Wellington wrote, replying to Champ:

Thanks for that update on Brennan. Well, if he is a Muslim, wow!
.......................................

Shocking, isn't it, Wellington? Perhaps he has since lapsed—although we have no concrete proof that this is so. But in any case, his having converted in the first place—and having traveled to Mecca, no less—is *deeply* disturbing.

And this wasn't some situation where some "nice" Muslim roommate got him to recite the Shahada when he was in college, or some such—Brennan was not only a diplomat at the time, but he was dealing with Saudi Arabia—one of the very worst states in Dar-al-Islam. So the chance that Brennan was mesmerized by some plausibly "moderate" enforcement of Islam isn't tenable.

On other matters, I am heartened to see so many staunch Anti-Jihadists again—you, Champ, Dumbledore's Army among many other welcome commenters.

Gunung Semeru wrote:

#1 Not one report but most reports about the young woman says she was 18.
....................................

I'm more apt to trust the reporting of the Daily Mail than of some publication that gets the girl's *gender* wrong. And this is not a casual detail—they specifically note that sixteen is the legal age of marriage in Indonesia.

Moreover, marrying underaged girls is *rife* in Muslim Indonesia, and all on Islamic grounds:

"Indonesia's largest Muslim organization rules in favor of underage marriages"

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/03/indonesias-largest-muslim-organization-rules-in-favor-of-underage-marriages.html

More:

#2 The other point is she was not the only young women to have been fooled by this lecherous creature.

If you read other reports the she married the guy because he promised to take her to mecca, also renovations to her home.

The young woman was cheated, now this of course does happen with christians, buddhists or hindus does it
....................................

Note that Gunung Semeru takes a case that is Islamic in all its details—polygamy, summary divorce, divorce on the basis of the girl (allegedly) not being a virgin, a broken promise to take her on Hajj—and tries to make it some generic issue of a "lecherous creature".

But then, that has always been Gunung Semeru's tack—to either deny that there is any problem at all, or else to imply that the problem has nothing to do with Islam.

What crap.

And Aceng Fikri is not some anonymous creep—he is chief of Garut district in West Java—a high-ranking, prestigious position. If anyone should be expected to know Islam, after clergy it's a man such as Aceng Fikri.

Graven gripes

"Of course, so is *child marriage*. But even Gunung Semeru realizes that his is a bridge too far for most decent Infidels."

How is this article to do with "child marriage"

Here is the story

President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono demanded on Thursday that swift action be taken against Garut, West Java, Regent Aceng Fikri, saying that the latter’s brief marriage to a teenage girl was indecent and an infringement of women’s rights.

“Don’t take this matter lightly. I want this problem handled swiftly and comprehensively but there is no need to be emotional,” Yudhoyono said in his opening remarks at Thursday’s Cabinet meeting.

The President said that Aceng had committed a serious breach of ethics and norms. Yudhoyono said that he was waiting for Home Minister Gamawan Fauzi to give him the latest update on the government investigation into Aceng.

He said that if any action was to be taken against Aceng, it would be to uphold the rights of women.

“Whatever action is taken, it has to take into account the sense of fairness toward women,” he said.

Aceng recently made headlines after a teenage girl, identified only as FO alleged that the regent had divorced her via text message only four days after they had married. Aceng was reportedly still married to Nurrohimah, with whom he has three children, when he decided to take FO as his new wife.

He then went on national television explaining his reason for the divorce, claiming that the bride had not been a virgin. He also made an ill-advised comment on why he took back his dowry.

“I spent almost Rp 250 million [US$ 26,065] to sleep with her for one night. Even sleeping with a celebrity would not have cost me that much,” he said.

The instant marriage has become the butt of a nationwide joke, with people making fun of his given name, which means “erection” in traditional Javanese slang.

Meanwhile in Garut FO, has made a move that could spare the disgraced regent from a lawsuit. The girl, who recently turned 18, decided to make peace with Aceng after a meeting between him and her family at Al Fadilah 2 Islamic boarding school in Limbangan, Garut, late on Wednesday, said FO’s family member Ayi Rohimat.

“I have called the lawyer [to drop the lawsuit],” she said. “Let bygones be bygones.”

The regent apologized to FO and guaranteed to fulfill the promises he had made to her prior to the wedding, said the facilitator of the meeting, Asep Maher. Aceng had promised to take FO and her family on an umroh (minor haj pilgrimage) before the marriage in addition to enrolling her in a midwifery course.

Previously, FO had filed a report against Aceng with the National Police on Tuesday on multiple charges, including falsifying his marital status, fraud and defamation. The regent had reportedly told FO that he had already divorced Nurrohimah when he proposed to the girl.

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2012/12/07/yudhoyono-wants-swift-action-against-regent-aceng.html

Notice the young woman is 18

Gunung,

Mr Spencer depends on the press and online news articles for the correctness of the information he puts up here.
That the teenager/young woman/child by closer inspection is variously described as 16, 17 or 18 does not invalidate the rest of his post, if anything you seem to agree with him in condemning Aceng's behavior.

Gunung,

Mr Spencer depends on the press and online news articles for the correctness of the information he puts up here.
That the teenager/young woman/child by closer inspection is variously described as 16, 17 or 18 does not invalidate the rest of his post, if anything you seem to agree with him in condemning Aceng's behavior.

Gunung,

Mr Spencer depends on the press and online news articles for the correctness of the information he puts up here.
That the girl/teenager/young woman by closer inspection is seen variously described as being 16, 17 or 18 years old - a child compared to Aceng - does not invalidate the rest of Mr Spencer's post, and if anything you seem to agree with Mr Spencer's description of Aceng.

Oh, no! I have a problem with polygamy, Talaq divorce, 40-year-old men marrying teenagers and divorcing them after using them for one night, making this a non-consensual "temporary marriage".

Gunung Semru has no problem with any of these fine Islamic behaviors, and considers anyone who does to be "griping"...

Sorry: either nothing happened when I posted or my "session had expired". I even restarted the computer in order to make quite certain before I reposted.

gravenimage,

oooohhh, you "have a problem with polygamy, Talaq divorce, 40-year-old men marrying teenagers and divorcing them after using them for one night, making this a non-consensual "temporary marriage"."

You must be one of them there "islamophobes" we are instructed about. Very bad. Now, don't ever let it happen again!

:-)

17-18 years old is hardly a child.

Gunung,

"17-18 years old is hardly a child." Nor is 16 in the eyes of many people. Even when compared to a 40 year old husband.

Gunung, you are belaboring this as if it invalidates the rest of mr Spencer's post.

Gunung,

You claim: "Not one report but most reports about the young woman says she was 18."

The reports I've seen say she was 17 at the time the marriage took place.

I haven't seen any reports that say she was 18 during the marriage. The marriage was reportedly last summer and lasted only 4 days from the time of the ceremony to the time of divorce notification. She is reportedly 18 now, but--and you seem to be either ignoring this point or are deliberately trying to obfuscate the issue--that's not relevant to the objection.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/indonesia-official-fired-divorcing-teenager-18545273

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/05/world/asia/indonesia-text-divorce

http://www.thejakartaglobe.com/politics/sby-to-sign-garut-district-head-acengs-dismissal-letter/572389

etc...


Steffen Larsen wrote:

You must be one of them there "islamophobes" we are instructed about. Very bad. Now, don't ever let it happen again!
......................................

Bwahahahahaha! Great to see your comments, Steffen!

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What they’re saying about Robert Spencer
“My comrade-in-arms, my pal, my buddy.”
Oriana Fallaci

“Robert Spencer incarnates intellectual courage when, all over the world, governments, intellectuals, churches, universities and media crawl under a hegemonic Universal Caliphate’s New Order. His achievement in the battle for the survival of free speech and dignity of man will remain as a fundamental monument to the love of, and the self-sacrifice for, liberty.”
Bat Ye’or

“Robert Spencer is indefatigable. He is keeping up the good fight long after many have already given up. I do not know what we would do without him. I appreciate all the intelligence and courage it takes to keep going despite the appeasement of the West.”
Ibn Warraq

“America's most informed, fearless, and compelling voice on modern jihadism.”
Andrew C. McCarthy, Senior Fellow at National Review Institute

“Robert Spencer is the leading voice of scholarship and reason in a world gone mad. If the West is to be saved, we will owe Robert Spencer an incalculable debt.”
Pamela Geller, Atlas Shrugs

"The consummate Islam critic and expert." — Bruce Bawer

“Over the years, we have become friends, and I have received his assistance on several pieces of legislation I proposed.”
Former Congressman Tom Tancredo

“Few people are capable of applying scholarship, analytical reasoning, and objectivity to their topic -- while simultaneously being readable and witty -- as can Robert Spencer.”
Raymond Ibrahim

“A national treasure...The acclaimed scholar of Islam.”
Frank Gaffney, Center for Security Policy

“I am indeed honored to call him my friend.”
Brad Thor, novelist

“A top American analyst of Islam....A serious scholar...I learn from him.”
Daniel Pipes

“A brilliant scholar and writer.”
Douglas Murray

"One of my best teachers."
Ashraf Ramelah, Voice of the Copts

“Thank God there’s at least one man with balls left in the West.”
Kathy Shaidle, Five Feet of Fury

“I read people like [Mark Steyn] and Bob Spencer and the rest of them, and I say, ‘Boortz, you’re pretending you’re an author. These people really are. They really write some entertaining, some standup stuff.’”
Neal Boortz

“Robert Spencer is the Stephen King of Jihad.”
Chris Gaubatz, Muslim Mafia

“Armed with facts and fearlessness, Spencer stands up for Western civilization.”
Michelle Malkin

“Widely read in conservative foreign policy circles.”
New York Times

“Widely read in many quarters in Washington.”
Washington Post

“A canny operative who likely has the inside track on the State Department’s Middle East affairs desk should the tea party win the White House.”
New York Magazine

“A hero of the American right.”
Karen Armstrong

"The leading anti-Islamic intellectual in the United States....The go-to Islam expert for the right wing."
Salon Magazine

“Robert Spencer is an Edward Said turned upside down.”
Stephen Suleyman Schwartz

“One of the nation's most notorious Islamophobes.”
Hamas-linked CAIR

"Geller and Spencer are probably the most important propagandizing Islamophobes in the world. These people's voices speak very loudly — not just here in the United States but overseas."
Heidi Beirach, Southern Poverty Law Center

“Satanic ignoramus.”
Khaleel Mohammed

“The Likud anti-Christ.”
Dar al-Hayat newspaper (Saudi Arabia)

“Zionist Crusader, missionary of hate, counter-Islam consultant.”
Al-Qaeda’s Adam Gadahn, “Azzam the American”



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