Tak Bai incident, and of survivors suffering kidney failure.

"The government should make it clear who is responsible for missing people and help those who need urgent kidney treatment," he said.

Posted at December 2, 2004 11:04 AM

SO LET ME GET THIS STREIGHT NOW THEY ARE KILLING PEOPLE FOR THEIR BODY PARTS??

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH,SIGHT,WISDOM, AND COURAGE TO STAY THE COURSE TO VICTORY TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM OPEN THE WORLDS EYES TO THEIR THREAT AMEN

Posted by: Catherine at December 2, 2004 11:37 AM

Afraid so, Catherine. If they aren't killing them immediately, they die of the procedures used to remove the organ. I'm not sure if this is something to blame only on the Islamists, though. There are "business men" on this side of the Pacific who contract for organ donors in Third World countries who aren't always volunteers. The one I'm specifically thinking of, I think was a Vancouver resident. Can't remember what his origins were other than Asian. China probably open this new medical frontier by using the organs of executed convicts, etc. for transplantation.

Posted by: waterdragon52 at December 2, 2004 12:19 PM

If some Muslims in Thailand are resentful of their economic backwardness relative to the busy Buddhists in the rest of Thailand, perhaps the Thai government should not accept, lying down, such nonsense, but begin to point out that the Muslim laziness and lack of initiative are tied to Muslim fatalism, the "Inshallah" attitude toward life that has its charms, for some, but is not exactly conducive to economic activity, least of all the kind favoreed in East Asia.

In Iraq, American soldiers struggling to train Iraqis, or to get them to help out in reconstruction, find that they are remarkably uncooperative. They sit down, they wander off, they pay no attention, they come and go as they please, they smoke and joke and do whatever they feel like it -- while they expect the Americans to do the fighting, and the dying, and the cleaning up, and the "reconstruction" and the this, and the that. It is infuriating, maddening, it fills one -- it fills many soldiers -- with a loathing they will not soon forget.

And it comes from Islam -- and the Biggest Intelligence Failure of All, which was to forget about Islam, and what it does, as a belief-system, to most of its adherents. One has only to look at what the Muslim states, despite being the recipients of 5-6 trillion dollars in completely unearned and unmerited wealth, have made of their countries' economies -- which is to say, nothing. Oil revenues aside, the total economic activity in all of the 22 members of the Arab League equals that of one small Western state, Finland. Take away the oil and gas, and there is no there there. They have had every possibility, over more than 30 years, with huge OPEC receipts, and the greatest transfer of wealth in human history, and yet not a single Muslim oil state has created a trained and able workforce; all remain dependent on foreigners, helplessly so.

Could it be that the economic situation of the Thai Muslims is their own fault? And if they look to their immediate south, to Malaysia, they will see that there, the Muslim Malays long ago instituted a disguised jizya, the Bumiputra system, which forces the much more industrious Chinese and Hindus to support, by taking on as full partners and paying them, Muslim Malays. Is that what the Thai Muslims want? Why should they receive any extra aid at all -- when their economic performance is the result, most likely, of their own belief-system, and that belief-system just happens to be one that is inimical to, dangerous to, the survival of Buddhism -- and always has been, for at least a thousand years.

I have in front of me a tiny volume as I write this. Its title: "A Guide to the Kabul Museum." It was published in Kabul (Franklin Book Programs) in 1964. It shows on the cover a Buddhist head. It is really just a pamphlet, with some illustrations, mostly of the Greco-Buddhist civilization that was destroyed by the Muslim invaders. You can see a few items in the Hadda Room, and the Bamiyan Room, and the Fondukistan Room, and the Begram Room, and the Shotorak Room, and then in the "Room of Islamic Arts." And one wonders, given the Taliban's Islamicaly-inspired destruction of all pre- or non-Islamic art it could get its hands on, what even these pitiful gathered remnants of that past managed to survive their religious vandalism.

Just as in India, where the Muslim invaders destroyed tens of thousands of Buddhist temples and artifacts and helped wipe out Buddhism in India, the Buddhist statuary all over Central Asia was subject to attack by Muslims. And that would happen in Thailand, too, if these southern Muslims were ever to get the upper hand.

And that is why, aside from the flutter of origami birds, no other gestures should be offered. The Thai government, and the Buddhists of Thailand, have nothing to apologize to the Muslims in the south for; it is the Muslims who should think about begging forgiveness for their campaign of terror and murder against innocent civilians in southern Thailand.

Posted by: Hugh at December 2, 2004 2:08 PM

How the protesters died is they were fasting during Ramadan, which makes them weak and dehydrated. Dehydration can lead to kidney and liver failure, etc. Then the Thai-Malay Muslim protesters were shoved into police vans and 78 died in those vans. The same thing happened to Afghan rebels who were transported to jails in sea-land containers in Afghanistan. There is always the possibility that some of the protesters are missing is organ parts were extracted for sale. This is the Far East, you know.

Posted by: markjames at December 2, 2004 3:11 PM

Sorry but think this is a BIRD BRAINED IDEA! Spend more money on troops and fortifying police stations - a 'little bird' tells me the Thais are going to need militant deterrents against Militant Muslim Jihadists. Unlike paper birds, these violent Muslims aren't going to peacefully flutter away, they will be planning how to mutilate, terrorize, kill and drive out remaining Buddhists to claim more territory for their Satanic Allah.

Posted by: Morgane at December 2, 2004 4:10 PM

How it started:

Muslim groups started to assault police stations, killed the policemen there and made off with the weapons. When the police investigated and arrested 6 of the perpetrators, a crowd of 200 muslim supporters gathered threatening to attack the police. This time the police was prepared and they didn't take any shit.

And rightly so. Neither should they take any shit in the future!
The Thais "know their muslims"...

Posted by: Terminator at December 2, 2004 4:21 PM

Posted by: Terminator at December 2, 2004 04:21 PM

This is how it always starts and they attack the liq bars or stores too??

Think La Raza and La mecha?

http://www.lewrockwell.com/lind/lind49.html
War on the Home Front
Focused as we are on Fourth Generation war in Iraq and Afghanistan, it is easy to forget that the phenomenon is vastly larger than any single war or opponent, even Islam. An article in a local Washington paper, The Journal, reminds us that 4GW is also being fought on American soil, by parties that have nothing to do with the armies of the Prophet.
The article, by staff writer Robert Arkell, was titled "Police: MS-13 threatened Maryland officers:"
The notorious E1 Salvadoran gang known as MS-13 has threatened to execute Prince George’s County police officers as tensions continue to escalate between officers and gang members, police said.
MS-13, which stands for Mara Salvatrucha, has increased its presence in Prince George’s County with more than 600 active members…
Some of those MS-13 gang members recently confided to police about carrying out a deadly ambush plan that targeted county police officers…
If members of a gang based on a foreign ethnic identity ambush cops, it is more than a crime: it is an act of war, Fourth Generation war to be precise. Hopefully, it will not happen in Prince George’s County. But it has happened elsewhere in the United States. It is not for nothing that the Los Angeles Sheriff’s Department is a more avid student of 4GW theory than any American military service.
Future historians will find it interesting that at the same time a supposedly conservative President has enmeshed us in Fourth Generation wars abroad, he has opened the flood gates to importing Fourth Generation enemies at home. President Bush’s first act upon reelection was to resurrect his proposal for an amnesty for illegal immigrants. It is a safe bet that MS-13 gang members would be among those who benefit from such an amnesty if Congress were so foolish as to allow it to become law.
As I have said before in these columns, in a Fourth Generation world, invasion by immigration easily can be more dangerous than invasion by a foreign army. At some point, the foreign army will go home. But immigrants stay, and if they do not acculturate, they permanently change the cultural landscape. As the Dutch recently discovered, the changes may go beyond introducing some highly spiced dishes into an otherwise bland cuisine.
If an American President were seriously interested in protecting this country from Fourth Generation threats, aka the "War on Terror," his top priority would be real immigration reform. Real reform means:
• Controlling our borders. Given the magnitude of illegal immigration across our southern frontier, we need to put in place something like the old East-West German border. Anyone trying to cross it unlawfully risks getting shot.
• Immediate deportation of any non-citizen who commits a felony, along with all identifiable family members. That would give immigrant communities an incentive to control their own members who might be criminally inclined. There should be no such things as gangs made up of immigrants.
• A neutral policy of Americanization of all immigrants. As was true for the forefathers of many American citizens, they are welcome to maintain their national language and customs in their homes, but all business in the public square must follow American norms, starting with English-only. Far from hurting immigrants, that policy made it possible for children born in Ukraine ghettoes to join the American middle class.
• Mechanisms to foster Americanization, beginning with the public schools. If we need a model, look at New York City’s superb public schools of 100 years ago.
• Restriction of the rate of immigration so that we do not take in more people than we can Americanize.
These measures, taken together, would do far more to keep Fourth Generation war away from our doorsteps than hundreds of billions of dollars in additional defense spending. If our grandchildren end up cursing us, it will probably be for an open-borders immigration policy that left them a civil war to fight.
December 2, 2004
William Lind

from la raza??

Los Angeles, Alta California

Estimada Raza de Aztlan and Beyond:
Greetings from the Revolutionary Council and Provisional Government of Aztlan! La Voz de Aztlan has provided this column for the dissemination of important information concerning our struggle for self-determination. We invite you to visit this web page from time to time to read communiques issued by the Council as a whole or by the individual Ministers of the Provisional Government. The communiques, among other things, will outline La Raza's positions on issues affecting the political and economic liberation of Aztlan. The positions published here do not necessarily reflect those of the publisher, editors or staff writers of La Voz de Aztlan.
Hasta La Victoria Siempre,
Cuauhtli
Minister of Information
Nation of Aztlan

Ministry of Foreign Affairs
October 18, 2000
On the Palestinian-Jewish Issue
La Raza's struggle for the land and for political and economic self-determination is not different from the struggle of the Palestinian people in Zionist Israel. We live in Aztlan under Anglo domination as the Palestinians live under Jewish domination. La Raza as well as the Palestinians lost the land through military aggression and both people now live in segregated regions within the larger nation. The Palestinian people as well as La Raza provide the hard labor necessary to prop up the national economies. Both Raza children and Palestinian children are victims of educational discrimination. The Palestinians as well as La Raza are considered people of color. So who should we side with in the present struggle in the Middle East? Will it be with the Jewish Zionists or with Islam? It is no secret that the United States as a whole is siding with the Jews, but should we? It is also no secret that the Jewish Lobby in America now also dominate large parts of the U.S federal government. It is estimated that over 32% of the Clinton Administration is of Jewish descent. Many are top level Federal Officials and includes the Secretary of Defense as well as the Secretary of State. In fact, the Department of State is now pretty much entirely Jewish. Most of the foreign Ambassadors are Jewish. This trend was begun by Henry Kissinger who is a Jew. This is very surprising considering that Jews only make about 2% of the total US population. Making these statements is not anti-semitic. It is stating facts. We do not hate Jews. We respect the contributions that many Jews have made to world culture. However, we reject Zionist racist Jews like the war criminal Ariel Sharon and appeal to all good Jews to do the same.
Israel can now be considered to be the 51st state. U.S. taxpayers are now sending over 8 billion dollars each year in economic and military aid. The sophisticated military weaponry being utilized against defenseless Palestinians are gifts from Uncle Sam. In fact, Israel now has nuclear and biological weapons, thanks to the United States. Why is the US providing so much to Israel? Well the selection of Joseph Lieberman as Vice Presidential running mate for Al Gore should give a clue.
Another clue should be provided by how the Israeli Army atrocities unfolded in the US media. At first, none of the Palestinian children murders were being covered by ABC, NBC or CBS. Not until the French and Italian media started broadcasting pictures of dead Palestinian children was the US media forced to cover some of the Israeli atrocities. Politicians, including Hillary Clinton running for US Senate in New York need a friendly media to be able to win elections.
La Raza is a victim of the same political and economic forces that are oppressing the Palestinian people and other people of color around the world. We must awaken to this fact and understand the hidden strategies and tactics being utilized to subjugate our people in order to devise effective counter-measures to neutralize them.
Tezcatlipoca
Minister of Foreign Affairs
Nation of Aztlan

some thing to think about??

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH,WISDOM,SIGHT AND COURAGE TO STAY TO COURSE TO VICTORY TO DEFEET ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM OPEN THE WOLDS EYES TO THEIR THREAT AMEN

GOD BLESS THOSE WHO ARE UN PC HELP THEM TO BE OUR DAVIDS OF OUR TIME BECAUSE WE ARE UP AGAINST GOLITH AMEN

Posted by: Catherine at December 2, 2004 7:57 PM

WHO KNOWS WHAT IDOL WAS THE FIRST DESTOYED WHEN MOHAMMED CONQUERED MECCA?

Posted by: KAOSKTRL at December 2, 2004 10:34 PM

Somehow the vision of origami falling from the sky in an attempt to appease an aggressor sends the crooning of John Lennon through my mind. Hey, perhaps that is a clue to the organ transplantation speculation. Some modern-day Dr. Frankenstein has transplanted Lennon's brain into the cranium of Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra

Posted by: ted at December 2, 2004 11:52 PM

Giving origami banknote birds to islamists so they will stop their jihad?

Hmmm...is smoking marijauna/LCD during cabinet meetings a common thing in Thailand?

Posted by: obl r us at December 2, 2004 11:53 PM

Thaksin's suggestion shows how desperate the Thai are to preserve social peace. Whether they will succeed or not is another matter.

The person who wished for spells on the paper birds shows exactly how "rational" and "humane" Buddhist culture is--it is pervaded at all levels by sorcery, fortune-telling, and magic. It is also very prone to loving revenge. My guess is that southern Thailand is in for a long, rocky ride.

Posted by: Kepha1 at December 3, 2004 12:49 AM

I think too many 'Thai sticks' and not enough
'Thai stick-to-it-ive-ness' leads to loopy notions like this.

RE: TED- John Lennon donated bullet proof vests to the New York City police department, but never thought the world was a dangerous enough place for an artist or musician to need one. Fatally naive.

Fate is a motherf*cker who likes such cute jokes.
(A shame Theo Van Gogh didn't heed this twist.)

The only origami that makes sense are
paper dunce hats for all of the followers of The Prophet (tws.) in Asia.

Don't they realize that they are the dupes of an alien cult that invaded their soil a millenia ago?

Kepha1-

The Buddhism practiced by the average Thai devotee ( i.e. "spells") is about as close to what Sid G. originally taught ("You are the result of what you think." / "Wake up.") as a moonflower is to the Moon.

People always like to embellish to the point that the 'ship vanishes under the barnacles'. Worse, the Buddhists are always too fatalistic and passive in the face of agression, having reabsorbed the Hindu notion of reincarnation to the detriment of this incarnation.

There's an old Hollywood movie called "Thunder in the East" that I heartily recommend giving a glance.

About just such a spineless "we must bow to the will of earthly oppressors, since we know better than they do, and we shall be rewarded in the next life for suffering their bad karma here and now..."

The ending is worth the wait. Check it out!

Posted by: profitsbeard at December 3, 2004 3:07 AM

Profitsbeard: About Buddhism in Thailand, most of what passes for "Buiddhism" in the West is a rarified construct of late 19th and early 20th century acadmic malcontnets who oh-so-desperately wanted a "rational religion" somewhere, somehow. I'll take the account of the Thai or Sri Lankan Sangha about what Theravada Buddhism is or of Taiwanese monks on what Mahayana (including Ch'an) is over Alan Watts or any other Westerner. My guess is that the chain of tradition linking the practice of present-day Buddhist populations to Ananda and Sakyamuni is about as good a chain as you can get.

Don't get me wrong. I like the Thai people a lot, and wish that kingdom well. Certainly I'm dismayed by the Muslim separatists acting up. However, I accept Thai and other Buddhist peoples the same way I accept Muslims, Jews, Marxists, positivists, Hindus, etc., and my own Christian co-religionists: fallen children of Adam the First who show their paternity all too clearly.

Posted by: Kepha1 at December 3, 2004 4:32 AM

My daughter in law happens to be a Thai lawyer,she is from the south of Thialand,she and her family are staunch Buddist,they like many other thias are very unhappy about the monks,due to a lot of skams,and the arrogance of a few monks,but they do not see this is a good enough reason for the monks to be killed.If the muslims in the south[a small part of the south] are making problems for the rest of Thailand then it is up to the Thias to sort out this problem them selves,Thaksim their president was voted in with a fair election,if the Thias do not like the way the muslim in the south are being treated,they can use the ballot box.The Thias work hard and play hard and body who knows a little Thia history will know Thias always fight hard to protect themselves.Roberts comments above where pretty close
Some-thing to think about Indonesia [islam] has a much greater land mass than Thailand [Buddist],yet Indonesia has to import rice from Thailand.
The Thias are a pretty peaceful people until provoked and this is one more peaceful approach amongst many that they are making only to be rebuffed,one more time.The paper bird gesture is already doomed to fail,according to the Muslims.
So it should be made very very clear to the muslim that if they;-
Fuck with the Thia police
The Thia may truck with them

Posted by: shiva at December 3, 2004 5:24 AM

My daughter in law happens to be a Thai lawyer,she is from the south of Thialand,she and her family are staunch Buddist,they like many other thias are very unhappy about the monks,due to a lot of skams,and the arrogance of a few monks,but they do not see this is a good enough reason for the monks to be killed.If the muslims in the south[a small part of the south] are making problems for the rest of Thailand then it is up to the Thias to sort out this problem them selves,Thaksim their president was voted in with a fair election,if the Thias do not like the way the muslim in the south are being treated,they can use the ballot box.The Thias work hard and play hard and body who knows a little Thia history will know Thias always fight hard to protect themselves.Roberts comments above where pretty close
Some-thing to think about Indonesia [islam] has a much greater land mass than Thailand [Buddist],yet Indonesia has to import rice from Thailand.
The Thias are a pretty peaceful people until provoked and this is one more peaceful approach amongst many that they are making only to be rebuffed,one more time.The paper bird gesture is already doomed to fail,according to the Muslims.
So it should be made very very clear to the muslims that if they;-
Fuck with the Thia police Thia police may truck with them

Posted by: shiva at December 3, 2004 5:26 AM

I hope they're dropping matches with the birds.

Posted by: 3812Michelle at December 3, 2004 7:48 PM

Kepha1-

The oldest Buddhist ideas, cleared of the cultural decorations -which are all meaningless, anyway, according to the core tenet of Sid G.- say simply:

"Wake up." *

This request is all that Buddhism essentially is.

If you "awaken" from the animal sleep of nature, and the primate unconscious, the rest may follow. Science, Psychology, Philosphy, Art, Critical Thinking, an end to cultural/tribal/religious arrogance.

The simple "slap in the mental face" or "soul smelling salts" of the raw, two word insight of those like Sid G. (there were many throughout history) is all anyone needs.

Nietzsche distilled it down to one word.

"Or?"

I like the rootidea, the "awaken and behold", but not the giant 'kudzu vines' of the later 'trappings' (sic), with all oof the silly exegesis, doctrines, sects, costumes, incense, afterlifes, beforelifes, hells, 'transmissions', ad nauseam, that choke the world. All born through peoples' wishes for comfortable appearances and soothing customs.

(Alan Watts, and similar popularizers, liked the non-monotheistic aspect of Buddhism, and its art, as well as the pageantry- and his book on the erotic temples of India is quite nice- but
I prefer someone a little more substantial, like Edmund Husserl. An intuiter of a Western 'zen', without the need for temples, monks, hierarchies, etc. His "Cartesian Meditations" is worth a read, too. He was abandoned by his "Sein und Zeit" student Heidegger to the Nazis. )

(* 'buddha"= "awakened (suchness)"

Posted by: profitsbeard at December 3, 2004 11:34 PM

WHO KNOWS WHAT IDOL WAS THE FIRST DESTOYED WHEN MOHAMMED CONQUERED MECCA?

Posted by: KAOSKTRL at December 2, 2004 10:34 PM

easy a DOVE!!

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and ALL who Fight with her give them Strength,Sight,Wisdom, and Courage to stay the course to Victory[FREEDOM] to Destroy ALL Islamic Terrorist and ALL who Support them Amen

Posted by: Catherine at December 5, 2004 7:14 PM