I imagine Mr Bush is a bit more hip to this whole Jihad business that he lets on. His obtuseness--and his references to the RoP, etc.--are much more likely politics than ignorance or kowtowing to the Saudis. If memory serves, even Bat Ye'or noted on a C-SPAN segment that the president was wise to refrain from employing anti-Islam rhetoric, however accurate it may be.

We could be in far worse hands, I think.

***

Anybody see that bit at Fjordman about the US, China and India having sufficient coal stocks and the requisite technology to essentially replace oil? "We choose abandon Arab oil in this decade...not because it is easy, but because it is hard."

Posted by: Mad_Jack at October 6, 2005 11:46 AM

Well, well, a step in the right direction. Perhaps my comment in the prior posting was premature?

Posted by: JohnnyDub at October 6, 2005 11:47 AM

Well, well, a step in the right direction. Perhaps my comment in the prior posting was premature?

Posted by: JohnnyDub at October 6, 2005 11:48 AM

There are actually some big parts of the effective response that W. missed: Picking winning fights. Fighting the enemy, not diverting resources to a war that does not address the problem but rather makes it worse. Reducing reliance on the enemy for critical resources.

For peat sake, at least he is beginning to admit what is really going on. The truth is, we Jihadwatchers are WINNING the war for the hearts and minds of our countrymen and allies!!! Once the power of America is mobilized against the real enemy our victory is assured.

Quijybo

Posted by: Quijybo at October 6, 2005 11:53 AM

Drat the man,

Just when I've given up on him, he pulls something like this.

Now Mr. Bush, about those borders......

Posted by: treehugger at October 6, 2005 12:06 PM

It is good to hear the President defining the aspirations of fundamental Islam. Certainly his reference to a religion of peace is his continuing effort to not totally alienate, or polarize the entire umma.

It is also good to see Karen Hughs confronting Saudi officials about hate materials being placed in America's mosques that are coming from Waahabists which represent the main Islamic base in Saudia Arabia even though that sects promulgator history is a little over 200 years old.

I think the President well understands the Ideology that drives the jihadist engine, and I believe Condoleeza Rice clearly understands this totalitarian ideology as well. Their positions hold them from making total condemnations, but I still don't believe that our leaders are the dhimmis that they sometimes appear to be on the surface at times.

I believe they are evolving slowly but surely.

Posted by: Mackie at October 6, 2005 12:08 PM

It's a start... now to get the media to start getting this out there....

I was becomimg more and more disapointed with W, there seems to be some hope yet....

Posted by: balticwaves at October 6, 2005 12:25 PM

Fighting the enemy, not diverting resources to a war that does not address the problem but rather makes it worse.
After watching the National Geographic "Inside 9-11", I believe that the Iraq war is truly the "honey pot". UBL wanted to get the west bogged down in Afghanistan, but we changed the focal point to Iraq. I think we could fight this war more effectively, I say more airstrikes, less boots on the ground. Our leaders are trying to save muslim lives. I am interested in saving our lives and our troops lives.

Posted by: Carolyn2 at October 6, 2005 12:25 PM

Just when I think Bush has totally wimped out, he does something to surprise me in a positive way, like this speech. He used the terms "islamic fascism" and "radical jihadism" (or some such) enough times that he obviously understands the jihad concept and the problem.

There is a gradual shift in his message. Yes, he does still give lip service to isalm being the ROP. Bush still needs to walk through the political minefield, and avoid offending the peaceful elements (or, rather, the persons who see themselves as peaceful and not supportive of jihad). He did issue a call for the "moderate" types to join him and cooperate in defeating the extremeists. Bush (along with Blair) is trying to establish the conditions so that "moderates" and "radicals" can self-select. I expect him (them) to continue to ask for cooperation, in more and more certain terms. This call for cooperation will raise public expectations of "moderate muslims." If they fail to cooperate, the public in general will be offended by the "moderate" muslims, too.

I think Bush "gets the picture." This was a Major Policy Address.

Posted by: texan at October 6, 2005 12:32 PM

"The fifth element of our strategy in the war on terror is to deny the militants future recruits by replacing hatred and resentment with democracy and hope across the broader Middle East. This is a difficult and long-term project, yet there's no alternative to it." - from the President's speech

..replacing hatred and resentment with democracy and hope? No alternative?

No imagination, more like it.

Posted by: Rebecca JW at October 6, 2005 12:40 PM

"I think we could fight this war more effectively, I say more airstrikes, less boots on the ground. Our leaders are trying to save muslim lives. I am interested in saving our lives and our troops lives."

Could not agree with you more Carolyn2.........we have to stop being PC on this war and start using the technology that the Pentagon spends our tax dollars on.

Save the Police Tactics for when the war is over........and let the air force destroy these rat invested villages.

TR

Posted by: rumoret at October 6, 2005 12:41 PM

Remember, folks, politics has often and fairly been described as the art of doing the possible.

Had Bush attacked Islam vigoursly at the outset, he would have set himself up for all sorts of condemnation and alienated a lot of people unnecessarily.

Now, with Al-Qaeda in Iraq (AQI) issuing such declarations, it becomes that much easier to call a spade a spade.

Posted by: waterdragon52 at October 6, 2005 12:42 PM

Bomb 'em with Pigs.

Posted by: JanuaryMan at October 6, 2005 12:50 PM

This is a good sign, but much more needs to be done, especially here at home, starting with the Council on American Islamic Relations (CAIR), as this appears to be their dream too.

Posted by: DCWatson at October 6, 2005 12:53 PM

Tony Blair made even more direct and accurate comments about the jihadists' goals of a caliphate, about 2 months ago. The nice words are nice, but I don't see policy changes being made in either administration.

Followup question: "Mr. President, roughly what percentage of Muslims worldwide support those goals of a caliphate?"

When I hear a straight-forward and honest answer to that question, I'll get all huggykissy for Bush. When he says "I was wrong, it is not just a few radicals highjacking a peaceful religion", then I'll change my mind.

I agree with Quijybo, know when and where to pick your fights. I think the Saudis' need a few less kisses and handholding in the White House Rose Gardens. We need to be a little less reliant on Islamic oil. And we need to be much more honest about the cause of jihad.

Posted by: special_guest at October 6, 2005 1:06 PM

I commented on his speech at my website. I still think he doesn't get it. Some improvement but still a long way to go.

For example:

....
BUSH: And this work has begun.

Many Muslim scholars have already publicly condemned terrorism, often citing Chapter 5, Verse 32 of the Koran, which states that killing an innocent human being is like killing all humanity, and saving the life of one person is like saving all of humanity.....

[Don't make me laugh at your complete ignorance. Here is an excellent analysis of 5:32 I picked up on the web. God, your researchers who wrote this speech did NO homework.

Let us start with the most cynical piece of “Islam is a religion of Peace” drivel which the Islamophiles regularly try to seduce children and the child-minded: The verse that they claim means that Islam condemns without reservation the taking of innocent human life, regardless of religion or other considerations:

“… whoever kills a soul is like one who has killed the whole of mankind; and whoever saves a life is like one who saves the lives of all mankind.”

That’s from Surah (chapter) 5, ayat (verse) 32, and isn’t it a nice, pink, cuddly fluffy liberal rabbit of a sentiment? Maybe, but it is also a deliberate misquotation designed to mislead. Mr Blair, once again, is lying. For the Devil or, in this case, the true word of Allah, is concealed in the missing detail. The real version of Surah 5. 32 is:

“… whoever kills a soul, not in retaliation for a soul or corruption in the land, is like one who has killed the whole of mankind; and whoever saves a life is like one who saves the lives of all mankind.”

Analysis

So the truth is that this oft-misquoted verse doesn’t compel Muslims not to kill, but explicitly allows – arguably commands - them to kill, for two different reasons which between them offer a vast amount of scope for those who want to justify murder:

First, “in retaliation for a soul”. Put yourself for one moment in the shoes of a Muslim who regards (as vast numbers of them, including senior members of the MCB, do) Blair’s illegal invasion of Iraq, and the mass slaughter of civilians that has gone with it, as murder. Straight away, blowing up the Number 30 bus is “justified” according to the very Koranic verse that the lie-mongers in the media are using to convince us that the London Massacre was “unIslamic.”

Second, “or corruption in the land”. Again, it is instantly clear to anyone with any knowledge of the Koran and the Hadiths that all sorts of things that go on in Britain (and, on account of Britain’s influence overseas, elsewhere, including the Middle East) that can easily be taken by angry Muslims to be “corruption in the land.” All of a sudden, bombs are “justifiable”.]

John Sobieski, PI
The Pedestrian Infidel Blog

Posted by: John Sobieski at October 6, 2005 1:06 PM

Bush's speech writers got close to having him tell the American public the truth about Islam. Close but no cigar. It was encouraging to hear a bit of a harder line on Islam coming from the white house.

Posted by: f.g. at October 6, 2005 1:20 PM

It was a good speech. He could have done without quoting the Quran though.

Nice to read Mad Jack and the rest of you give the man his due.

Posted by: Cornelius at October 6, 2005 1:22 PM

I'll say this about the speech: it was a good start.

Now when do the sanctions on Saudi Arabia start?

*********************************************

And as for "The fifth element of our strategy in the war on terror is to deny the militants future recruits by replacing hatred and resentment with democracy and hope across the broader Middle East..."

What kind of "hope" comes into Iraq with democracy? The hopes of the Shi'ites to at last take over Iraq as they took over Iran. The hopes of the mullahs to enact yet another paradise where Sharia is the law of the land.

And is Dub so dense as to really believe that there are no recruits for the militants in the democracies of Indonesia, Bangladesh, Thailand, Malaysia, the Philippines...?

***********************************************

Cornelius, you'll find my response to your anti-ACLU spin, and much of your excuses for Reagan, back at the DW Culture War By Proxy article comments page.

Posted by: kj at October 6, 2005 1:35 PM

Islam could be a smoking ruin on the dustbin of history, and kj would still be blaming Bush for something.

Posted by: Gary at October 6, 2005 1:47 PM

Ya-hoo for Bush, but one can't help but detect a certain, shall we say, inconsistency here. Bush makes this bold and welcome pronouncement (welcome to those opposing the jihad, that is); meanwhile, he sends Karen "Innocents Abroad" Hughes for a "look-see" to improve America's brand image in the Arab World.

Posted by: scaramouoche at October 6, 2005 1:53 PM

Bush has to attempt to befriend the "moderate" muslims, regardless if the religion itself is militaristic and barbaric. As there are converts to Islam, there will be converts away from Islam. Is it possible to have a reformation within Islam? The U.S. certainly has the military power to wipe our enemies off the planet, but is that the right thing to do? Is not an attempt to befriend, liberate minds, at least save a few souls before we condemn them to obliteration? If reformation is possible, should not that be our goal? How will we know if it is possible if there is no attempt? Afghanistan and Iraq are the non-Islam shot across the bow - and geostrategically, the U.S. can now reach any middle east country without Turkey, Saudi Arabian, Uzbekistanian permission. If we cannot reform them, now they are within reach.

Posted by: Furius George at October 6, 2005 2:23 PM

Furius George: Re that "reformation". Lots of luck befriending and liberating those who believe they've been given God's final, perfect--and thus unamendable--revelation. It's impossible to reform totalitarianism, in either its secular OR religious guise.

Posted by: scaramouoche at October 6, 2005 2:39 PM

These are similar comments to those made by Blair after the London bombings.

Fortunately one can have more faith in Bush than in Blair.

But then why are the bastard Saudis still given cachet in Washington, with the Archprince of Darkness, Prince Turki leading the deception ?

Posted by: dgene at October 6, 2005 2:57 PM

GWOT - Major Strategic Foreign Policy Speech Just Delivered By President Bush

DITTO! See this comment I just posted over at Roger L. Simon's:

*****

Damn straight PJ!

See this post I just sent around. I took the liberty of excerpting some of the high points here.

A MUST READ . . .

*****

GWOT - Major Strategic Foreign Policy Speech Just Delivered By President Bush
Washington, D.C.

President Bush swings from the hips today and delivers barn burner speech calling a, "shovel a shovel." He clearly announces for once the GWOT is a war of ideologies. For the first time he identifies we are at war with an ideology some have called, ". . . evil Islamic radicalism; others, militant Jihadism; still others, Islamo-fascism."

This is the speech the Blogos has been waiting to hear for a long time. Much of what was said is old news to us but the American people are still clueless because of the lack of reporting of the real issues by the MSM.

The Blogos needs to spread President Bush's words far and wide to ever corner of the earth so that the enemy clearly knows we will not shrink from the battle and its days are numbered!

Ron

(HT PJ at Roger L. Simon)

RLS Link

Posted by: Ron Wrght at October 6, 2005 3:05 PM

But, Bush fails to see, like so many, many others, that the aims of establishing the Caliphate and the domination of Sharia law, and the call to jihad, are not extremist views in Islam. In Islamic Iraq democracy will not be the 'tree' that grows but a stick used by Shia Muslims to gain control. Democracy, the idea that the will of the people legislate and govern themselves, is utterly contradicted in Islam; but the idea of using Infidel gifts, Infidel ideas, Infidel mistakes, to advance the cause of Islam is as old as Islam itself.

Bush succeeds in identifying a few aspects of the ideology we are fighting, but he seems not to realized just how prevalent and powerful that ideology is.

Posted by: JTF at October 6, 2005 3:20 PM

KJ,

My response is on the same thread.

Posted by: Cornelius at October 6, 2005 3:20 PM

Cornelius:

I think kj was just as certain of a Kerry victory over Bush as he is that the only possible outcome in Iraq is another Islamic republic in the same mold as Iran. This is, of course, a possibility, but it's not necessarily what will happen. And, whatever the outcome, no matter how hard we wish it to be one way or another, only a rather poor excuse for a human being would want kj's prediction to come true, especially if it's only to be able to crow about having been right all along.

The pendulum has certainly swung hard toward radical Islam, but it could swing back as Muslims tire of the bloodshed and the thought of being consigned to the lives of their 7th century ancestors. Islam may be the most reactionary and deeply ingrained totalitarian ideology of all time, but this is the day and age of the internet and satellite dishes. And while the Arab street claims to despise all things western, they also, similtaneously hanker for many things western.

And before anyone goes talking about only Arabs or Muslims could possibly be so nutty as to hold two such disparate thoughts simultaneously, I would refer them to Sam Harris's "End of Faith", where the author himself talks about visiting Paris and not wanting to be hotelled anywhere near the American embassy. However, on finding the only available rooms were in a hotel near the embassy, he and his fiance chose a room overlooking the embassy because it was so serene and scenic.

Posted by: waterdragon52 at October 6, 2005 3:41 PM

The real reason behind Iraq. God told Bush to do it. When God tells you to do something , you had better do it. Bush confirms this with the line, "And by God I'm gonna do it".

Bush said this:Monday 24 October), Abu Mazen, Palestinian Prime Minister, and Nabil Shaath, his Foreign Minister, describe their first meeting with President Bush in June 2003.
Nabil Shaath says: "President Bush said to all of us: 'I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, "George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan." And I did, and then God would tell me, "George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq …" And I did. And now, again, I feel God's words coming to me, "Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East." And by God I'm gonna do it.'"

He also said this:According to Abbas, immediately thereafter Bush said: "God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them."

I told you Bush works in strange and mysterious ways. He gets his marching orders directly from God. God tells him to invade various countrys , and he does it. God says to strike those men down, so he does it. Knowing that Bush has this on-going dialog with God makes me feel better about everything...How about you?...maybe Allah knows best afterall...

Posted by: duh_swami at October 6, 2005 3:41 PM

Some call this evil Islamic radicalism; others, militant Jihadism; still others, Islamo-fascism. Whatever it's called, this ideology is very different from the religion of Islam.
How pray tell, is this not islam?

Posted by: Carolyn2 at October 6, 2005 3:42 PM

"Against such an enemy, there's only one effective response: We never back down, never give in and never accept anything less than complete victory..."
-- from Bush's speech, as quoted in the article above

What is "complete victory"? The phrase has no meaning here. Or rather, it has meaning only for those who think that Islam itself is not the problem, but a finite and non-reproducible number of "extremists" who believe in some strange offshoot of Islam -- "Islamofascism" was it? But the numbers are not finite if by "finite" we mean easily calculable, for there are tens of millions (at least) of supporters of active Jihad, and hundreds of millions who, as Believers, are required to, and do, passively support Jihad. There are ways to spread Islam that are far more effective, and do not attract the same attention, as bombs on buses and planes smashing into buildings. Demographic conquest proceeds through the exploitation of Western societies, its superior medical care (more Muslim babies born safely, one after the other after the other after the other after the other and son on), of Western generosity (many of the Muslims in Western Europe are on the Infidel-paid dole), of Western tolerance (the open conduct of Da'wa in such supposedly monitored environments as prisons), and of Western civi rights (used at every turn to protect those who would, if they could, create a society in which Infidels would have no rights save those temporarily permitted them, as dhimmis, by their "protectors" the then-dominant Muslims).

There is no such thing as "complete victory." There is only a struggle without end, a struggle to contain and limit and constrain the power, the aggression, of Islam and of Muslims in both Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Harb.. Bush invoked the Cold War against Communism. He seems not to have realized that it was a Cold War, only here and there punctuated by a few hot wars, and those both inconclusive and in one case, self-defeating. There was no "complete victory" either in the Korean War, or in the Vietnam War -- which, in fact, ended in a clear diplomatic defeat, as engineered by that shallow realpolitiker, Henry Kissinger.

What did Soviet Communism in? It was not one war, or one man, even if that man was called
Pope John Paul II" or "Ronald Reagan" or "George Marshall." It was not Winston Churchill's use of the phrase "Iron Curtain" in 1946 at a MIssouri college, nor the British help in suppressing the Greek Communist rebellion in the 1950s, nor the Berlin Airlift, mor the Marshall Plan, nor the creation of NATO, nor the aid to rebuild Japan, nor the American help to Taiwain (quondam Formosa) over Quemoy and Matsu, nor the spy networks run by the C.I.A., nor the help given to the Forest Brotherhood in Lithuania, nor Radio Free Europe, nor Radio Liberty, nor the capture of Rudolf Abel, nor the development of the H-bomb by Edward Teller and others, nor the education of a gneeration of Westerners by those who knew Soviet Communism, such as Adam Ulam, Richard Pipes, Helene d'Encausse Carrere, Alain Besancon, Hugh Seton-Watson, nor the founding of the Alexander Herzen Foundation in Amsterdam, nor the funding by the C.I.A. of Editions de la Seine, nor the offices that debriefed Russian Jews at Ostia Antica, nor the C.I.A. offices that helped provide subventions for Bibles published in Russian in Belgium, nor the archives established at the Hoover Institution, nor the publishing of the memoirs of Count Witte, or Kerensky, or Joseph Hessen, nor .... -- fill it in yourself. It was all of these things, and more that can never be told about, including deeds of derring-do (a Russian general at the bottom of a lake) that would amaze and startle.

And finally, over time, the Soviet Communists realized that their own system, on its own terms, had failed. They had not produced that wonderful society. They were losing ground. They were backward. They were backward not because they had too little Communism but too much. They were backward because the kind of economy they had made the possession of private property, a right which turns out to be connected to the possibility, when it can be accumulated within certain limits supplied either by custom (good taste, good sense) or by law (high marginal tax rates, high estate taxes), turns out to be not only good but necessary.

Bush cannot say, because he does not see, the need to do the same thing with Islam -- to create the conditions, or at least do nothing to prevent the conditions from being created, that will expose, to Muslims themselves, the bleak truth: that the political, economic, social, and intellectual failures of Islam are directly attirbutable to the tenets, the attitudes, and the atmospherics of Islam itself. It limits artistic expression. It limits free and skeptical inquiry without which real science is impossible. It limits the potential of all those -- non-Muslims and women -- in Islamic societies who are constantly under threat of being limited or suppressed, should they get too uppity. Islam encourages, and must encourage, the unequal treatment of Muslims and Infidels. It encourages Musllims not to associate with, and certainly not to befriend, Jews or Christians, and much less the despised Hindus, Buddhists, and others. Islam encourages the practice of deception -- "war is deception" said Muhammad, and aggression, and malevolence, in the end, toward Infidels because they are Infidels. There is no getting around this, and no way to tamper with the texts.

Either more and more of the Western world, convinced that it must do everything to appease Muslims, will gradually succumb, like the frog in the pot of slowly-heated water (until it finally is turned up, by degrees, to the temperature at which the water, and the frog, both boil),or it will not. If Infidels educate themselves, and see things clearly, they will come to understand why appeasement -- letting Turkey, the member of a Muslim Club (the O.I.C.), blackmail Western leaders with indignant noises about Europe being a "Christian Club" (which is an absurd characterization of the E.U.), sending still more Western aid -- jizya, which the Infidel givers are afraid to stop -- to any Arab or Muslim state that happens not to be oil-rich; ignoring the Jihad against Israel and siding with those who wish, through slow Jihad or fast Jihad, to see it disappear, by acceding to all sorts of Muslim demands for Western accommodation, all over Europe and North America, to Muslim needs, whether it be the banning of pigs, from toys to stories read in school, to dispensing with certain authors (e.g., Voltaire) and certain topics (the Jews in Europe, the Crusades, the Holocaust, Zionism itself and the founding of Israel), and by limiting wherever possible the outward and visilbe signs of Christianity, from Gideon Bibles in motels to St. George's Cross on the flag of England.

It is probably too late for Bush, so obstinately insistent on his Iraq venture, on "staying" this absurd "course," to understand that this Light Unto the Muslim Nations project is a colossal misallocation of resources, of men, money, materiel, and damaging to the morale that needs to be preserved at a high level, among both the military and civilians, if the defense against a world-wide, aggressive, multifarious, cunning and very large group, with new recruits, from among the targeted for Da'wa -- the psychically and economically marginal -- is to proceed in the same way, with the same understanding, confidence, and relentlessness, as was the Cold War.

His inability to be flexible, to adapt, to show that he now realizes that Iraq and the so-called "Iraqi people" are different in their responses to the United States, and to what was so confidently expected, becasuse of Islam, and because of the particular history of sectarian and ethnic divisions within this "Iraq," is disturbing. It is not admirable. It is costing lives and money. He should be opposed, for the right, not the wrong reasons.

And what could be better than to leave Iraq, without those who had formerly screamed precisely for that being unable to raise their voices in protest, even if they have the glimmer of a realization that what would then happen would lead to the very divisions and demoralization of Muslims that those screamers for Peace! Peace! of course would prefer to avoid (for under those screams is a sympathy for any force that opposes Amerika, and today the vehicle of choice against that Amerika and Kapitalism is, bien entendu, Islam).

Yesterday's man, is Bush. Let's hope that among those waiting in various wings, whether labelled Republicans or Democrats, there are those more cunning and adaptable, and grounded in both the nature of Islam and the fissures within it, who will, therefore, not waste another minute trying to build an "Iraqi" army for a non-existent "Iraq."

It can happen. Individuals, and countries, and even whole civilizations, can come to their senses.

Or they can fall.

It is a matter of timing.

Posted by: Hugh at October 6, 2005 3:45 PM

The long awaited reformation in Islam started on the 11th of September 2001. Just like Martin Luther nailing 95 points on a Wittenburg Church asking for catholicism to return to its sacred sources, 911 was a call to arms to muslims from Bangor to Bali to return to the true sources of their religion.

Posted by: Sebastien at October 6, 2005 3:50 PM

Sebastien--That's not a reformation. That's the Muslim version of Back to the Future.

Posted by: scaramouoche at October 6, 2005 4:02 PM

God would tell me, "George,...

I wonder what form this communique took. A dream, vision, disembodied voice, postcard, or did Cheney just walk into the oval office one morning and start speaking in tongues while Rumsfeld interpreted? Or was it a vague impression, feeling, or did he just “feel lead”, so to speak? Or perhaps George channeled the All-Mighty himself.

According to him, “God” told him personally to do these things. I think obeying the commands of a invisible and intangible being you think is talking to you from another plane of existence is grounds for impeachment on psychological grounds. No matter what you call the entity. Your god, Sam, or whatever. Or it should be.

Good grief! What are the voices in his head going to tell him to do next?

I wish it would be something like "Get your house in order", "Physician, heal thyself", "What you do unto the least of these you do unto me", or something else a bit more constructive than what he has been communicating so far to his buddy George.

Pardon me, but I don't think nuclear arsenals should be in the hands of people who hear voices and then follow their direction against the advise of their human military advisors. Just because it has something to do with what he is calling his religion is no excuse. Who rules in America? The People or the voices inside of the president's head? The Constitution or mystical messages from on high?

Saying he is personally governed by a set of principles and morals (Christian teaching) is quite different than saying he is being guided by mystical communication (Voices, impressions, or other direction from the spirit world or God). That's a big difference folks.

Posted by: f.g. at October 6, 2005 4:23 PM

"I think the President well understands the Ideology that drives the jihadist engine, and I believe Condoleeza Rice clearly understands this totalitarian ideology as well" posted by Mackie

Would any of those who agree with this sentiment kindly explain why this week, Condoleeza Rice, acting on behalf of America, exerted pressure on various European Governments (Austria being one) to allow Turkey into the European Union?

Anyone who "understands" Islam knows that it is a political threat, not just to Europe, but to the entire West. Those who think that Turkey should be admitted into Europe as a "bridge between civilizations" must be either completely ignorant of the texts and the tenets of Islam, or a fool.

That goes for Straw, Blair, Chiraq, Rice and Bush. The first is a fool; the jury is still deciding on the others.

Posted by: Amicus at October 6, 2005 5:04 PM

Well we invade countries and forcibly spread democracy...... aren't we the same??

Posted by: Athird at October 6, 2005 5:12 PM

Well, I listened to his speech and I almost fell off the sofa. After I read about the hate speech bill that was passed in the House last week without one mention in the mainstream news media, and an alarming article about Bush's recent efforts to expedite the militarization of the U.N.,(http://www.thenewamerican.com/artman/publish/article_2334.shtml), I was asking myself if he is a real Manchurian Candidate, or perhaps like his father, a major player in the NWO stratagem. I'm still undecided but today he actually connected Islam and terrorism, which is a first as far as I know. That was encouraging but he is still negligent in many other areas.

The first place GWB should worry about protecting is AMERICA. He can wage all the foreign wars he wants but until he secures our borders, we are sitting ducks for terrorist attacks. Isn't it about time for the annual traitors dinner at the White House, or does that come at the end of Ramadan?

Posted by: Susanp at October 6, 2005 5:23 PM

An Administration that offers more and more jizya to Egypt and the "Palestinians," that puts as much pressure on European countries as it can to force them to lessen their opposition to the entry of Turkey into the E.U., that does everything possible to discourage the Kurds (Condoleeza Rice has done this repeatedly) from dreaming about, or seeking, independence, that keeps prating about a "two-state solution" without realizing that the only difference between the various "Palestinians" who represent the shock troops of the endless Jihad against the Infidel state of Israel are those who want to accomplish by open warfare the goal of eliminating Israel (Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic JIhad) and those who want to do so through diplomatic means and smiles and wiles -- the supporters of Fast Jihad and the supporters of Slow Jihad, who give no sign of understanding what Iraq presents, by way of an opportunity, to deepen and widen fissures within Islam along the fault lines of Arab/non-Arab and Sunni/Shi'a, which fault lines will cause others to widen and deepen elsewhere in Dar al-Islam, an Administration that cannot come with anything like the energy policy necesary to diminish OPEC and especially Saudi oil revenues, that will not publicly investigate the series of American ambassadors and intelligence agents who became Saudi hirelings, directly or indirectly (for both Democrats and Republicans are invovled), or who received monies in other ways (such as inflated lecture fees for giving speeches on our "staunch ally" Saudi Arabia), an Administration that persists in adding adjectives or suffixes -- "radical Islam," "extremist Islam," "Islamofascism" -- well, that Administration simply may still be judged ineffective and silly until proven otherwise.

This speech is not that otherwise.

Posted by: Hugh at October 6, 2005 5:37 PM

The more GWB shoots off his mouth about Islam, the more the MSM, CAIR and Dems will come to the rescue. Moving the popular opinion in the wrong direction and therefore weakening the WOT.Like an episode of "Yes, Minister", what the pols say in public is of little consequence. I believe even the Dems are a lot more suspicious of the ROP than they ever would admit on TV. You can argue against the Iraq war if you want , but Saddam had to go and the Colalition shouldn't be embarrassed of that. In the meantime, There hasn't been a major attack on US soil since 9/11. This may be a coincidence, or maybe the jihad has been refocused to the ME.

Posted by: kevin at October 6, 2005 5:38 PM

Oh C'mon people lighten up a bit will ya. I have just had a hard hot day of fasting (that's no food, or water for the whole day until sundown).

The 1st few days are the hardest as you are not so used to it and I never wear a black burka on the 1st few days as black absorbs heat and makes you sweat more and Ramadan is harder.

Ofcourse now my friend always wears black...she says it makes her feel closer to Allah ta'ala (swt). What can I say..she has guts.

During Ramadan you don't even walk about the town with a bottle of water or such like...not if you know what is good for you ...and that is Allah ofcourse.

When the sun has gone down ....you let yourself down gently...eat & drink slowly...not gobbling your food...that's bad for the next day.

Yes, there is something unique about Ramadan.

GW put his message 2day....but it's the wrong time ...people are fasting and faithing (now there's a new word for you) and what does the infedel do....he starts analysing....yet again.

Peace bros....it's Ramadan..a time for rejoicing....lighten up.

Allah Hafiz

Posted by: Naseem at October 6, 2005 5:53 PM

This is a first, as far as I know. But it should not end there. The enemy has to be identified: Islam! Their means of winning: Jihad! Turkey should not be allowed to accede to the EU. Never! President Bush must tell it like it is: Moderate Muslms are a figment of the imagination! We must fight a real war: a war against Islam. Not a 'war against terrorism'. The real war should be against Islam and its followers!

Posted by: Mark at October 6, 2005 6:14 PM

This is a first, as far as I know. But it should not end there. The enemy has to be identified: Islam! Their means of winning: Jihad! Turkey should not be allowed to accede to the EU. Never! President Bush must tell it like it is: Moderate Muslms are a figment of the imagination! We must fight a real war: a war against Islam. Not a 'war against terrorism'. The real war should be against Islam and its followers!

Posted by: Mark at October 6, 2005 6:15 PM

from Spain to Indonesia," Bush said.

Now that is interesting. Is GWB acknowleging binLaden's claim to Andalucia?

Sebastien:

You are correct in stating (ironically), that a Reformation of islam is straight back to 7th century Arabia.

Posted by: DP111 at October 6, 2005 6:36 PM

While the politicians continue to ignore and not speak the truth about Islam, the blood of all murdered infidels is on THEIR hands.

As are the souls of those who convert to Islam (as is happening at an alaming rate in the West) of those infidel sheep who, with the help of our lying politicians espose "Islam is Peace", and sadly they believe it.

The Nazi's were not defeated by allowing massive immigration of "peaceful" Nazi's (and there were many)into the Allies' countries. Nor were they defeated by grovelling from the Left of politics. In fact this only gave the Nazi's more steam, its what encouraged Hitler to take one country after another, right up until his fateful move on Poland. The end result? Massive carnage and bloodshed.

Saying "Islam is Peace" will result in the same, just on a much greater scale than any could imagine. Time to nip the problem in the bud now, for it will be worse later. If we do it now, yes many in the Islamic world will suffer, probably die. But what is the alternative? Many infidels (you and me and our kids) dying later, or worse, being subjugated to Islam.

Posted by: 3rdtimelucky at October 6, 2005 6:48 PM

Waterdragon,

Harris' book is an ass-kick isn't it? He even makes a very compelling argument to justify torture. When I started that chapter, my first instinct was to prepare to be repelled. I read it with complete skepticism.

By the time I finished, though not convinced, I had to seriously consider the validity of my arguments against his logic.

The Chapters about Medeival Christianity were blood-curdling...and he certainly has no illusions about Islam.

Great book!

Posted by: Cornelius at October 6, 2005 6:56 PM

GWB:

"Some call this evil Islamic radicalism; others, militant Jihadism; still others, Islamo-fascism. Whatever it's called, this ideology is very different from the religion of Islam..."

How would he know that 'this ideology is very different from the religion of Islam?"' Who tells him these things, Grover Norquist or Condi? Or is he getting his information from the "ask the Imam..." website?

Something to crack you up:

http://www.cafepress.com/shop/rice/browse/store/aaronscase/789410

Posted by: sheik yer'mami at October 6, 2005 7:26 PM

Treehugger
OH yea of little Faith??

October 6, 2005
http://www.beecy.net/frank/

Bird Flue Could it be Israel that saves?? What Could be the cure or restance?? Look in the Bible the answer is there to use salt?? What do most Asian diets lack BUT, the proper salt. They have weak systems in their children because the salt does not have the proper Iodine leavels look under the laws in the old testament and the one thing that is told to the Israelis is to put salt on the food and where does their sault come from but the dead sea with all it’s healing powers? But what lives in the dead sea??

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4313210.stm
Wednesday, 5 October 2005
First gay 'marriage' in Pakistan
A gay couple have become the first to get "married" in Pakistan, according to reports from the region.
Malik Waris Khan, a prominent local politician and former federal minister, confirmed to AFP that the marriage had taken place.
"I checked the report with people in Tirah Valley and they confirmed it," he said.
Although it remains a taboo subject, homosexuality is relatively common in Pakistan, says the BBC's correspondent Aamer Ahmed Khan in Islamabad.

AHHH SO THIS IS WHAT NASSEEM IS WORRIED ABOUT NEW BOY IN THE HOUSE??

GUESS THIS IS WHY THEY SPREAD OF AIDS IS RAMPARD IN AISA AND MULSUM COUNTRIES??

WHEN YOU MAKE THE DISRESPECT OF WOMEN THIS IS WHAT YOU GET??

SHORT SKIRTS ON WOMEN WORTH FIGHTING FOR!!!

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2005/10/6/141329.shtml
Fire Guts TV's 'Batman' Mansion
NOW TELL ME THIS AINT A ISLAMIC TERRORIST ACT??

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO STAY THE COURSE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN

PS
REMEMBER WHAT HER SAID??
Something where are the voices in the mulsum world against this evil??

I see it as the sounds of silence is showing where the heart lays??

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/10/20051006-3.html

The images and experience of September the 11th are unique for Americans. Yet the evil of that morning has reappeared on other days, in other places -- in Mombasa, and Casablanca, and Riyadh, and Jakarta, and Istanbul, and Madrid, and Beslan, and Taba, and Netanya, and Baghdad, and elsewhere. In the past few months, we've seen a new terror offensive with attacks on London, and Sharm el-Sheikh, and a deadly bombing in Bali once again. All these separate images of destruction and suffering that we see on the news can seem like random and isolated acts of madness; innocent men and women and children have died simply because they boarded the wrong train, or worked in the wrong building, or checked into the wrong hotel. Yet while the killers choose their victims indiscriminately, their attacks serve a clear and focused ideology, a set of beliefs and goals that are evil, but not insane

I LIKE THE EVIL THING??

Third, the militants believe that controlling one country will rally the Muslim masses, enabling them to overthrow all moderate governments in the region, and establish a radical Islamic empire that spans from Spain to Indonesia. With greater economic and military and political power, the terrorists would be able to advance their stated agenda: to develop weapons of mass destruction, to destroy Israel, to intimidate Europe, to assault the American people, and to blackmail our government into isolation.

Some might be tempted to dismiss these goals as fanatical or extreme. Well, they are fanatical and extreme -- and they should not be dismissed. Our enemy is utterly committed. As Zarqawi has vowed, "We will either achieve victory over the human race or we will pass to the eternal life." And the civilized world knows very well that other fanatics in history, from Hitler to Stalin to Pol Pot, consumed whole nations in war and genocide before leaving the stage of history. Evil men, obsessed with ambition and unburdened by conscience, must be taken very seriously -- and we must stop them before their crimes can multiply.

Defeating the militant network is difficult, because it thrives, like a parasite, on the suffering and frustration of others. The radicals exploit local conflicts to build a culture of victimization, in which someone else is always to blame and violence is always the solution. They exploit resentful and disillusioned young men and women, recruiting them through radical mosques as the pawns of terror. And they exploit modern technology to multiply their destructive power. Instead of attending faraway training camps, recruits can now access online training libraries to learn how to build a roadside bomb, or fire a rocket-propelled grenade -- and this further spreads the threat of violence, even within peaceful democratic societies.

THE BUG THING IS GREAT!!!
I'D SAY HE GETS IT!!

The influence of Islamic radicalism is also magnified by helpers and enablers. They have been sheltered by authoritarian regimes, allies of convenience like Syria and Iran, that share the goal of hurting America and moderate Muslim governments, and use terrorist propaganda to blame their own failures on the West and America, and on the Jews. These radicals depend on front operations, such as corrupted charities, which direct money to terrorist activity. They're strengthened by those who aggressively fund the spread of radical, intolerant versions of Islam in unstable parts of the world. The militants are aided, as well, by elements of the Arab news media that incite hatred and anti-Semitism, that feed conspiracy theories and speak of a so-called American "war on Islam" -- with seldom a word about American action to protect Muslims in Afghanistan, and Bosnia, Somalia, Kosovo, Kuwait, and Iraq.

Some have also argued that extremism has been strengthened by the actions of our coalition in Iraq, claiming that our presence in that country has somehow caused or triggered the rage of radicals. I would remind them that we were not in Iraq on September the 11th, 2001 -- and al Qaeda attacked us anyway. The hatred of the radicals existed before Iraq was an issue, and it will exist after Iraq is no longer an excuse. The government of Russia did not support Operation Iraqi Freedom, and yet the militants killed more than 180 Russian schoolchildren in Beslan.

Over the years these extremists have used a litany of excuses for violence -- the Israeli presence on the West Bank, or the U.S. military presence in Saudi Arabia, or the defeat of the Taliban, or the Crusades of a thousand years ago. In fact, we're not facing a set of grievances that can be soothed and addressed. We're facing a radical ideology with inalterable objectives: to enslave whole nations and intimidate the world. No act of ours invited the rage of the killers -- and no concession, bribe, or act of appeasement would change or limit their plans for murder.

On the contrary: They target nations whose behavior they believe they can change through violence. Against such an enemy, there is only one effective response: We will never back down, never give in, and never accept anything less than complete victory. (Applause.)

The murderous ideology of the Islamic radicals is the great challenge of our new century. Yet, in many ways, this fight resembles the struggle against communism in the last century. Like the ideology of communism, Islamic radicalism is elitist, led by a self-appointed vanguard that presumes to speak for the Muslim masses. Bin Laden says his own role is to tell Muslims, quote, "what is good for them and what is not." And what this man who grew up in wealth and privilege considers good for poor Muslims is that they become killers and suicide bombers. He assures them that his -- that this is the road to paradise -- though he never offers to go along for the ride.

READ THE WHOLE THING FOR YOURSELF!!!

PLAIN AND SIMPLE!!!

Posted by: Catherine at October 6, 2005 8:19 PM

I certainly hope that this is the sound of distant thunder like the thunderstorms we experience in the Southern Plains. There often is a rumble in the distance before we see anything unless one is on high enough ground to see far away. I liken all of us "kafir" at JW/DW to those on high ground. Whether it be politics or ignorance that the administration doesn't go as far as we in declaring the evil wickedness that is Mohamedanism to be such a threat to all of us; I am heartened that we hear what we've heard today from Georgie Boy's lips. [I suppose playing kissy face with the prince left a bad taste in his mouth and he was pushed to investigate!?]
Now if only we can get him to speak true Texan about it all. He's a poor imitator of any of the 5 regional accents of Texas. I guess that comes from being raised by eastern yankees. I do wonder if he could come up with a true texanism or two to describe any of it. Somebody want to try for him?

Posted by: Mr. Christian at October 6, 2005 8:21 PM

"allies of convenience like Syria and Iran, that share the goal of hurting America and moderate Muslim governments..."
-- from the speech given by Bush

Syria is very different from Iran. The rulers of the Islamic Republic of Iran are not entirely rational, and will do whatever they can do to destroy Infidels. The rulers of Syria, on the other hand, simply want to keep their heads and maintain their rule, and since they constitute only 12% of the population, must be careful of arousing the "real" Muslims in Syria -- the same ones who killed 82 Alawite recruits in 1980 at a graduate ceremony at a military academy, and who conducted other attacks until Hafez al-Assad, in his inimitable way, levelled an entire city.

Why would Syria stop Sunni Muslims from crossing the boarder? That would only endanger the Alawites, and they must be seen to be doing their part against the Infidels -- if they dared to close down the border, then it would go hard with them. It is only if the Americans start bombing Syrian airports (as they should have long ago) that they may find that in Alawite calculations, perhaps it is worth the risk of alienating local "real" Muslims by more forcefully patrolling the border, for otherwise Syria will be left with no army or air force to speak of -- and that too would not be good for the rulng Alawites.

It is typical of Bush to sloppily link the two, and to fail to discern what it is that motivates the Syrian rulers who are fearful. Like his father, Bashir must rely on various palace guards, of Alawites, of Armenians, and of other Christians who know that without the Alawites, they too are goners. That is why Syria's ability to wage war outside its borders can cheerfully be destroyed, but a few guns and jeeps and even a few tanks should be left, so that they can continue to control, those Alawites, the restless "real" Muslims. Or didn't the Adminstration know how the "real" Muslims regard those Miriam-worshippers? If they didn't, they should learn.

The rulers of Syria and Iran do not wish to "hurt... moderate Muslim governments." The Syrian ruling class wishes only to stay in power, to get its loot, to not be overthrown and then, of course, killed. The Iranian government is not against "moderate Muslim governments" but against those who, as Sunnis, treat the Iranians as infidels. And among those governments is that of Saudi Arabia -- and even President Bush would not, at this point, describe Saudi Arabia as a "moderate Muslim government." Pretend-moderation has little to do with it.

Things need to be kept straight.

Posted by: Hugh at October 6, 2005 9:14 PM

Re: the Hollywood thread, kj: you still get me completely wrong, as you always will- and you still Lie.

Posted by: Gary at October 6, 2005 9:19 PM

Hugh,

Saddam's truck convoy of ill-gotten booty and possibly WMD's went to Syria. But I agree they're not on the same level an Iran.

Posted by: kevin at October 6, 2005 9:31 PM

Athird:

"Well we invade countries and forcibly spread democracy...... aren't we the same??"

Well, Athird, if you don't believe that democracy is better than the alternatives, that the rule of law is better than the rule of the gun, that the Universal should stay in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, then what do you believe in? If you are cultural relativist and believe that people should be free to maintain their own cultural practices, no matter how barbaric, then we will have to agree to disagree. I believe Western culture is superior to any culture thus far produced and will not apologize for the West's ending of slavery, cannibalism, suttee, and other barbaric practices whereever they existed, including in Western countries themselves.

What you are using is the logical fallacy of Tu Qoque:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2003-43,GGLD:en&q=tu+quoque&spell=1

Tu quoque. This is the famous "you too" fallacy. It occurs if you argue that an
action is acceptable because your opponent has performed it.

Posted by: Mentat at October 6, 2005 9:45 PM

"allies of convenience like Syria and Iran, that share the goal of hurting America and moderate Muslim governments..."
-- from the speech given by Bush.
__________________________________________

God Bless ya George, but I’m of the dour opinion that the West (what’s ideologically left of it) is in a tug-o-war with destiny. It’s only a matter of time before the psychotic malcontents lob the big one at Tel-Aviv. Then all the dissecting of Islamic nuances will cease.

Posted by: Thumper at October 6, 2005 10:44 PM

Robert says:

"For the first time that I know of, the President has spoken openly about the jihadists' dream of establishing the caliphate."

Itai says:

For the first time that I know of, (W)ahabbster has spoken openly quoting chapter and verse from the koran. (Naturally the quote is a JEWISH concept, stolen, again, by the satanic cult of death.)

(W)ahabbster still lauds pisslam, sticking carefully to to his saudi/CAIR/wahabbi script of tiny-minority-of-extremeists-who've-hijacked a [quote] "noble" religion.

Nothing new, borders open, saudis happy, filthy arab muslim Jew-killing terrorists well on the way to palestine and finally Jerusalem, all our local terror mosques at or near capacity, government incompetent and corrupt, fbi covering up OK (again)... TWA 800, OKC, AA 587, LAX/El al, OK, and tomorrow...

Enjoy the nuke.

Posted by: Itai at October 6, 2005 10:46 PM

"Against such an enemy, there's only one effective response:" nuke Mecca, nuke Medina.

Posted by: Bohemond_1069 at October 6, 2005 11:07 PM

Hey Itai, link to the White House and volunteer your services as W's speech writer. I can hear the global gasp as George fires off a few "Pisslams." POTUS may leave a bit to be desired, but just imagine life under Kerry, Dean, or Kusinich.

Posted by: Thumper at October 6, 2005 11:08 PM

While Bush has uttered the most insufficient of criticisms against the primative, terrorist ideology of islam, it is still at least something. As lame as it may be, it is something. May it kindle into an inferno of candid, outspoken denunciations of islam by leaders throughout the world.

BTW, Naseem is having trouble fasting in her black burka? This woeful woman has so many more troubles than her burka color it's hard to know where to begin. I pray she isn't killed or tortured by the animals of islam, and that she does not herself hurt or kill any innocent kafirs in the name of that ghastly, barbaric ideology she's following.

Madzionist

Posted by: Madzionist at October 7, 2005 1:08 AM

While Bush has uttered the most insufficient of criticisms against the primative, terrorist ideology of islam, it is still at least something. As lame as it may be, it is something. May it kindle into an inferno of candid, outspoken denunciations of islam by leaders throughout the world.

BTW, Naseem is having trouble fasting in her black burka? This woeful woman has so many more troubles than her burka color it's hard to know where to begin. I pray she isn't killed or tortured by the animals of islam, and that she does not herself hurt or kill any innocent kafirs in the name of that ghastly, barbaric ideology she's following.

Madzionist

Posted by: Madzionist at October 7, 2005 1:08 AM

hey guys......has anybody investigated into whether GW has been looking at jihadwatch website,....who knows.....he might actually be sneaking into the oval office at like say....2am....to ....u know....sneak in a few sights at the postings.....when all the dhimmis have gone to bed.....there's gotta be something that made GW say these things......either he is seeing those invasion visons again which i hope, or maybe this texan even knows more about Islam than we do....afterall he is surrounded by dick chenney....

Posted by: jihadbuster at October 7, 2005 2:34 AM

Susanp,
I never heard about any Anti-Hate Speech bill.
Can anyone tell me about it?

Posted by: lonely_soul at October 7, 2005 5:14 AM

Cornelieus:

I'm just at the chapter on torture and it's been difficult. His is far from a blanket permission, but he's right. How can we accept the collaterol deaths of thousands of unarmed civilians to rid the world of the likes of Saddam, yet have any qualms about taking the likes of a Khalid Sheik Mohammed and subjecting him to torture if we had good and probable cause to believe he had something to tell us and was likely to do so. It isn't the moral equivalent of what Saddam did to his political opponents for simply opposing his regime. It's about saving lives by the untold thousands.

Having had a brother whose life was pretty much ruined by periods of addiction to heroin and cocaine, I don't agree with him re: decriminalizing/legalizing opiates and other highly addictive drugs, but yes, it's been a kick-ass read so far.

Posted by: waterdragon52 at October 7, 2005 9:08 AM

.has anybody investigated into whether GW has been looking at jihadwatch

That's a laugh. If he won't read the paper he certainly isn't going to read anything on the Internet. I'm sure his advisors do and I would be surprised if someone in the White House doesn't keep up with JW/DW but who knows?

Posted by: f.g. at October 7, 2005 10:30 AM

Waterdragon,

I'm with you on the hard drug issue (marjuana should have been legalized years ago). It would be the height of irresponsibility to make highly addictive drugs accessible and affordable to the general population. Just look at the trail of ruined lives because of oxycontin...reponsible, middle class citizens with no criminal history resorting to burglarizing pharmacies to get their fix.

I have conservative buddies who I can't budge on this issue. They use the argument of personal responsibility. I can't seem to get through that a coke high (if smoked or injected) is so fucking intense - an orgasm times 20 - that all perspective goes immediately out the window.

Sorry about your brother. I lost a sister to an overdose.

Posted by: Cornelius at October 7, 2005 10:44 AM

Islam is heroin.

-MZ

Posted by: Madzionist at October 7, 2005 10:55 AM

Did anyone catch this line in the speech:

"These extremists distort the idea of jihad into a call for terrorist murder against Christians and Jews and Hindus. . ."

Distort the idea of Jihad?

Are we now not only to consider Islam the Religion of Peace, but Jihad the Holy War of Peace?

Posted by: montfort at October 7, 2005 2:22 PM

f.g. said "I'm sure [GWB] advisors do and I would be surprised if someone in the White House doesn't keep up with JW/DW but who knows?"

His advisors, the ones who have never read a line from the Qur'an (except the phony "Killing one person is the same as killing mankind" blathering misquote) are the world's foremost experts on Islam. They do not need to come here and listen to people who have actually read passages from the Qur'an, to learn that Islam is a peaceful religion, that it has a long history of happy co-existence with other religions, that Mohammad was spreading a message of love throughout the Middle East.

Why would they come here? There are too many annoying Qur'an quotes, too many references to the Hadith. George likes 'em to keep their briefings simple: RoP, RoP, RoP, ...

Posted by: special_guest at October 7, 2005 6:18 PM

Pres. Bush's comments don't surprise me.

Our government is not as ignorant as many think
and one has to walk a fine line with Islamic Terrorism.

The government cannot reveal all it's secret's to the enemy.

But I said it before and I'll say it again,
we are in Iraq because of Saudia Arabia.

Posted by: learjet0450 at October 7, 2005 9:59 PM

“Special Guest” said, “...that Mohammad was spreading a message of love throughout the Middle East.”
_____________________

Love? But of course, the same “love” that takes an elementary school hostage, tortures the teachers and cuts the throats of any child that cries from a lack of food and water. Yup, I can feel the “love” demonstrated in the malignant Qu’ranic verses that mandates butchering unbelievers. Qur’an 9:5 “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them..” Feel the love yet? I do agree however, that Islam is a “religion of piece” – a piece here, a piece there, suicide bombers leave pieces everywhere.

Posted by: Thumper at October 7, 2005 11:11 PM