Shiite Vs Sunni. Good.

Posted by: leavingtheleft at October 30, 2005 8:03 AM

More evidence of how aggrievance -- or, more properly put, victimism -- lies at the heart of Islam.

When vengeance goes back 20 years, and gets as personal as an anonymous airplane pilot, you know you've got something special.

Reminds me of how Russian fighter pilots insisted that the serial numbers be removed from their airframes before flying sorties into Chechnya, for fear of a Chechens coming back to kill the pilot's great-grandson 60 years hence to avenge great grandad's crime against Islam.

Also note the absence of Arabism here. Persians and Caucasians both operating long-term Islamic vengeance now programs.

What they don't have in common genetically they have in common as co-religionists.

Posted by: Chaz MarteL 732 at October 30, 2005 8:14 AM

"Which proves the point that the Muslim world ( all 1 billion men, women and child) is not monolithic...Differences of opinion, mindset and action exist within itself."
-- from a posting above

Yes and No. There are differences to be exploited -- ethnic and sectarian differences. From our point of view, the Shi'a settling of scores with Sunni pilots is not to be deplored, nor would similar attacks, say on Iranian pilots of not the Tabatabai ancien-regime, but rather of the Islamic Republic of Iran school, be a matter to deplore.

And anything that can divide Islam, for example by merely noting the reasons why non-Arab Muslims have every right to resent, and resist, the arabization, the cultural and linguistic imperialism, for which Islam, islamization, is inevitably a vehicle -- should also be welcomed.

In that sense "Islam is not a monolith" and divisions within it can be exploited. But however different may be Tunisia or Turkey from Iran and the Sudan and Saudi Arabia, when it comes to strictness of adherence to the Shari'a, to the hudud (criminal punishment) or to limits on women's freedom, there is no essential difference in the attitudes toward all Infidels by all Believers. That can only be modified by limiting Islam itself. Infidels should not be fooled by that phrase "Islam is not monolithic." The relative, and possibly only temporary, mildness toward Infidels that one might see, for example, in Tunisian or Turkish schoolbooks and societies, as compared to that of Saudi Arabia or Iran, is not so much a difference in the kind of Islam, but rather in the way in which Islam has been deliberately limited or constrained by a succession of rulers in both Tunisia (Bourguiba and his Destour Party) and Turkey (Ataturk and those who remained largely loyal to his imposed limits on Islam).

Criminal punishment, the treatment of women -- whatever variants there are in these, they are meaningless when it comes to the Big and Uncompromising Division which runs through all of Islam: that between Believer and Infidel.

Posted by: Hugh at October 30, 2005 9:03 AM

Chaz Martel 732, not only is there this story of serial numbers nbeing removed from the airframes of Russian planes, lest the great grandsons being murdered by Chechens for what their great grandfathers did decades earlier, but we know of Bin Laden making references to the Reconquista which was completed over 513 years ago, in his war against Spain. In Islam, there seems to be no such thing as anything being time-served. Any perceived injustice against Muslims, no matter how trivial, must be avenged, no matter how many decades or centuries pass after the event.

Posted by: Spirit Of 1683 at October 30, 2005 1:29 PM

"we know of Bin Laden making references to the Reconquista which was completed over 513 years ago, in his war against Spain."
-- posted by Spirit Of 1683

So then, Islam not only asserts absolute moral authority over present time and place, it makes a further assertion over generational time.

Naturally, and in keeping with the Koran and Sunnah, such assertion of moral authority is that of revenge murder.

I understand how often the word is overused, but would it be off-subject to post a definition here?

PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH

fascism
n

A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.

PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH

The only looseness of fit that I can see here is "centralization of authority under a dictator."

Right now, Islam is a loosely coupled quiltwork of several such authorities.

So let me observe here that Islam is a form of male pattern fascism.

Posted by: Chaz MarteL 732 at October 30, 2005 6:07 PM

Revenge murders...

Just read a reference to the Quran's timeless requirement of payback in "Onward Muslim Soldiers" during a break at work tonight.

Posted by: t-ham at October 31, 2005 12:27 AM