Even as enflamed Muslims rage out of control, the Interior Minister is meeting and apologizing to the Muslim community leaders. In the article, another politician mentions that more schools, housing...etc. is what is needed to calm the angry crowds and not more law enforcement. I wonder what the average French citizen thinks of all of this? Are they very alarmed over the direction of their country or do they glance at the nightly news, shake their heads and go onto dinner? Will the French vote for more social services to make the Muslim youth feel better about themselves or will they vote for more law enforcement?

Posted by: maryrose at October 31, 2005 12:17 PM

I spent some time in France last month and watching the TV there is instructive. Firstly, because political correctness is alien to French society there is still a discernible 'occidental bent' to news coverage. Immigration stories feature heavily (unlike in the UK where the whole issue is downplayed as much as possible) and there is a rather doom-laiden feel to presentation.

Secondly, there is an almost total absence of minority faces on screen. Black French occasionally crop up as contestants on game shows; there were a few musicians/celebrities in evidence too. As for Maghrebians, I don't think I saw a single one - except for someone promoting a book he had written about, wait for it, the Islamist threat to France.

There may be disaffection and disengagement among British Pakistanis, but I don't think the UK situation approximates to France. From conversations with French people too, my impression is of a country in denial about its Muslim population. It's as though it can't bear to contemplate the reality of its modern face. 'Civil war' doesn't sound an overstatement.

Posted by: Effractor at October 31, 2005 12:48 PM

maryrose, as a Brit living in France I can tell you that the aveerage citizen is very anti-Muslim, or at least those that I talk to are.

Posted by: Daffersd at October 31, 2005 12:55 PM

Has Frace stopped Muslim immigration? Is there illegal immigration going on in large numbers?

Quijybo

Posted by: Quijybo at October 31, 2005 12:59 PM

Memo to the Foreign Legion: bring flash-bangs and lots of shoulder-fired missiles.

Posted by: Mad_Jack at October 31, 2005 1:08 PM

No they have definately not stopped Muslim immigration. And there is illegal immigration in large numbers, however most want to go to Britain as it is easier to work and get social security. In france you have to pay into the system to get cover.

I met some Muslim women on a language course and none of them covered up and to be frank were quite westernized.

Posted by: Daffersd at October 31, 2005 1:08 PM

France's leaders would do well to encourage immigration from Latin America. Plenty of people willing to work hard, take the jobs that the gone-soft children of the natives do not want, and to boot, they are catholics. God bless Latin America - when have you ever heard of "Latino terrorism"?

Quijybo

Posted by: Quijybo at October 31, 2005 1:16 PM

This is barely the beginning.

Future Muslim problems in France will dwarf this news item.

Where is a Charles Martel when you need him ?

Posted by: dgene at October 31, 2005 1:21 PM

Would it be too cruel to call this...an insurgency?

Posted by: Mad_Jack at October 31, 2005 1:45 PM

i propose a two state solution and a roadmap to peace that will end this intifada

Posted by: jimmytheclaw at October 31, 2005 1:59 PM

God bless Latin America - when have you ever heard of "Latino terrorism"?

Uhh...Columbia & Mexico has terrorists through their Drug lords and kidnappers. Plus, they also form ghettos with urban gangs in the U.S.. However, urban ghettos and gangs are better than suicide bomber attacks.

Posted by: helox at October 31, 2005 3:03 PM

Daffersd, yes the French are gloriously politically incorrect compared to the British.
When we were looking to buy a place in France the estate agent warned us off certain towns, with no prompting from us, because of the density of ROPers.

And of course there were riots earlier this year in Perpignan between Roma and Muslims.

http://203.15.102.140/news/worldwatch/worldwatch.php3?choser=2005-06-30#Suspects%20arrested%20in%20Perpignan

Posted by: Silvester at October 31, 2005 3:05 PM

take the jobs that the gone-soft children of the natives do not want,
Not true that no one will take the jobs, just won't work for slave wages like the illegals will.

Posted by: Carolyn2 at October 31, 2005 3:19 PM

In France there are a lot of muslims, but in UK there are the worst muslims of all Europe, in France the half of muslims are non-practicant and they are someone westernized, but of course, 6 million produces problems.
I want a religious answer, but in France the catholic church is destroyed by the left and the same France.
In addition the arabic politic of France has been disastrous.

Posted by: Franze at October 31, 2005 3:29 PM

Daffersd, should you come across any pages from www.France-Echos.com or www.occidentalis.com lying abandoned on metro seats, that would be me. I'm glad that I'm not the only JWer in France.

In Paris, I find and overwhelming amount of political correctness when it comes to the joys of multicultiness. And those that don't like multiculture hate anglo saxons too.

I find that no one has any ideas other than those regurgated from what their trendy teacher told them and no one seems to read the papers.

On an intellectual level however, I feel the debate is miles ahead of the UK. Philippe de Villiers, Alexandre del Val, Denis Greslin, Caroline Fourrest, Jack-Henri Leger, Yvan Rioufol, Louis Chagnon, Michel Houllebecq, Maurice G Dantec and many others have far more a grasp of what is going on than anyone in public life in the UK.

I am reading Devant L'Islam by Louis Bertrand. I found this rare 1926 book on ebay. Bertrand is a travel writer who, even in 1926, laments at the fact that the French Public glorify barbarity in the orient to a degree he finds very dangerous. There had been an anti christian pogrom in Alexandria just a few years before and he describes how little the pink skinned British soldiers currently in Egypt seem to have so little understanding of the world around them. This book might as well have been written today and I realize that the passion for self flagellation and the praising of the noble savage is nothing new. It appears to have begun in the romantic period in the late 1800s.

Algeria was a brave new world at that time. The hope of bringing latin civilization to a world that had lost everything that is of quality in humankind since the muslim invasions, is not so different to the american experiment in Iraq today.

But even then, most books written at that time seemed to romanticise the mysterious east. So maybe things aren't so different today.

Posted by: Sebastien at October 31, 2005 6:46 PM

Sebastien writes:
"In Paris, I find and overwhelming amount of political correctness when it comes to the joys of multicultiness. And those that don't like multiculture hate anglo saxons too. "

Unlike many JWers, I think multiculturalism is a good thing, provided that each of the cultures
respects that fundamental principle of reciprocity, embodied in the Golden Rule. This doesn't seem to be the case with Islam. But I
just had a Diwali lunch (I'm not Indian) and I
tell you that if the USA were 30% Hindu I doubt that we'd have Christian/Hindu violence but as
soon as you get enough mohammaans, like 10%,
bang.

"Algeria was a brave new world at that time. The hope of bringing latin civilization to a world that had lost everything that is of quality in humankind since the muslim invasions, is not so different to the american experiment in Iraq today."

A chilling observation.

It is good to see that there are JW readers in France. Spread the word. Best wishes to you and
your countrymen in these troubled times.

Posted by: American at October 31, 2005 7:33 PM

As a politically incorrect Australian citizen I read the comments with interest.

I still think that we need a return to the Crusades and that we should stop the pussyfooting around where Jihadists are concerned.

When I read the report about the riots I felt alarm as I read that the Interior minister was virtually apologising to the leaders of the mosque because of the tear gas bombs. If they only took the same attitude when it came to the desecration of Catholic Churches, Jewish synagogues and other places of worship then we would have true equality.

The answer to this question does not lie in more schools for this people, or anything of this nature. The answer happens to be that anyone arrested for riotous behaviour should be sent back to their country of origin, no further questions asked. Yes, especially if they come from Africa.

Also, I recommend to all of you that you read about the Circumcellions who existed at the time of St. Augustine because they exhibited much of the same "I want to kill myself to be a martyr" style attitude that we see with the jihadists today. We are not doing enough to counter this form of ideology.

Posted by: Maggie4Life at October 31, 2005 8:23 PM

"I am reading Devant L'Islam by Louis Bertrand."
-- from a posting above

Louis Bertrand also wrote the preface, in 1923, to Andre Servier's "The Psychology of the Musulman."

Posted by: Hugh at October 31, 2005 8:30 PM

Latino terrorism - haven't you heard about the MS-13? They are active in DC and LA and everywhere in between. Their favorite pastime seems to be using machetes to cut throats and fingers off. They are from central and south american countries and they are usually illegals. They are targeting the police in DC. -following them home and threatening them and their families.

NO immigration is going to keep the status quo in ANY country. Only indigeous people having at least four children each. Replacement plus some growth. The peace, love and save the world generation was taught that two children was the max by their misguided teachers and now they are paying the price.

By the way Bill Gates is starting another new initiative to "save people" from illness in Africa. In a place that already cannot feed itself the population explosion should have drastic consequences for future generations. Especially in countries that don't even have the wheel. When families are hugh and they all survive it causes massive problems. Look at the middle east. Current technology allows large families to survive which would normally only have had a few live to adulthood. Balance requires that if most survive then families need to be smaller. The west understood that but has overdone it by only having one or two children instead of four. The middle east must export its children or it will explode.

Stop immigration completely. Let them explode.

Posted by: Borg at October 31, 2005 8:46 PM

Good point about Multiculturalism American.

Too many Americans forget (especially those of Jewish and non Anglo origin) that it was multiculturalism and later political correctness, that gave them room to breathe and achieve in America.

Racists and NAZI's also hate PC and Multiculturalism.

The anti Jihad crowd should use it's critical reasoning skills, where they still exist, and clearly define exactly what they mean by multiculturalism and politically correct, elsewise they wind up negating themselves.

As regards France. I saw sometime ago, a short documentary from Deutsche Welle (DW) TV, which anyone who has Dishnetwork or DirectTV can watch,
about the problems Muslims cause in Europe.

The report said that the French Gendarme will not enter a Muslim enclave (out of fear) and that
Muslim women have organized demonstrations in Paris protesting the abuse of women by Muslim men, but the French Government will not listen to their voice.. They act as if they are afraid of Islam.. and after reading Eurabia (Bat Ye'or) I think I know why..it's about oil dependency, profits to be made in Muslim markets.

Lenin nailed it "Capitalists will sell the rope to hang themselves"

Posted by: Nariz at October 31, 2005 9:06 PM

Nariz - a while ago an ex Australian Policeman from around Sydney wrote a report in some magazine (the magazine, which I cannot remember the name of, sold out this particular edition - maybe some other Australian posters know what I'm talking about) where he used the problems in France to illustrate his point about Islam, he wrote his article around the time of the Islamic gang rapes in Sydney.

The ex copper stated one case in France where the police had to arrest 5 men on terrorism charges. To do it they took 1500 armed men, including armoured vehicles - for five men!! The writer concluded that the French took so many not because they were afraid of the mad terrorist Muslims, but rather the whole neigbourhood.

The French are pissing on Charles Martel's grave, his memory, and his legacy.

Posted by: 3rdtimelucky at October 31, 2005 10:02 PM

Just go into "the zone" and start breaking heads.

Posted by: DavidE at October 31, 2005 10:38 PM

Here is a good link...good song too
http://www.mosquewatch.com/
7777c2

Posted by: Carolyn2 at October 31, 2005 11:01 PM

Clichy-sous-Bois is a Paris suburb with a population of around 28,000 and the home of the first "Beurger King Muslim". 50 percent of the population is under 25 and a quarter are unemployed....
As we know, this has all happened because Jacques Chirac hates black people.

http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/archives/002884.html

Posted by: leavingtheleft at November 1, 2005 12:21 AM

In this year of 2090, City of Faris is overcrowded and inefficient government has done nothing for the citizens. Faris is an Arabic word, meaning horseman or a knight. Twenty years ago, at the beginning of Islamic movement, suicide bombers used to ride horses and blow themselves up in the middle of the crowd. To honor those brave souls, it was decided that the name of this city would be changed to Faris.

http://www.faithfreedom.org/oped/SherKhan40829.htm

Posted by: leavingtheleft at November 1, 2005 12:23 AM

The Fall of France?

Via Little Green Footballs, the International Herald Tribune reports on an amazing quote from the French Interior Minister:

Sarkozy says that violence in French suburbs is a daily fact of life.

Since the start of the year, 9,000 police cars have been stoned and, each night, 20 to 40 cars are torched, Sarkozy said in an interview last week with the newspaper Le Monde.
http://aggressiveconservative.blogspot.com/2005/10/fall-of-france.html

Posted by: leavingtheleft at November 1, 2005 12:36 AM

Let's not forget there's a riot in Denmark too...

“Rosenhøj Mall has several nights in a row been the scene of the worst riots in Århus for years. “This area belongs to us”, the youths proclaim. Sunday evening saw a new arson attack.
…
We are tired of what we see happening with our prophet. We are tired of Jyllands-Posten. I know it isnt you, but we wont accept what Jyllands-Posten has done to the prophet”, he says aggressively, and the others nod approvingly.”

Souce: Viking Observer Blog

Find my commentary here:
Paris Riots (and in Denmark too): Is Europe Burning?

Posted by: strategyunit.blogsome.com at November 1, 2005 4:15 AM

Not to mention what happened in Birmingham, UK a couple of weeks ago when the real nature of Islamic racism and hatred towards anyone who isn't like them was revealed. These people are incapable of getting on with anyone, even with other ethnic minorities. Muslims were quoted as saying that Afro-Caribbeans have a "dirty gene" and are thieves, morally and socially deficient. Not satisfied with harassing and slandering the white indigenous population, they've now started on other ethnic minorities. The whole of Europe will be the scene of a violent conflagration but, unfortunately, our politicians can only whimper and roll over and cave in to yet more Islamic demands.

Posted by: londongirl at November 1, 2005 4:52 AM

"Lenin nailed it "Capitalists will sell the rope to hang themselves." "
-- posted by Nariz

But Nariz, these are socialists selling the rope.

PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH

"I think I know why..it's about oil dependency, profits to be made in Muslim markets."
-- posted by Nariz

You're right. A study should be done to determine whether a nation -- going beyond the profits of an individual or a corporation -- has ever profited by its dealings with Islam.

Posted by: Chaz MarteL 732 at November 1, 2005 10:26 AM

Did you notice this at Small Dead Animals?
http://www.phoneformuslims.com/

Posted by: Carolyn2 at November 1, 2005 11:40 AM

nariz:

the original concept of multiculturalism -- that you could keep your culture in your new home while being an integral part of the community was a healthy and valid one in North America. What it has warped into is the polar opposite -- little enclaves of Saudi Arabia, Algeria, Iran and other radical Islamic states established in Europe, Oz and North America, seeking a separate legal code.

The "celebration of ethnic diversity" of the latter 40 years of the last century was meant to foster integration not separation.

Posted by: waterdragon52 at November 1, 2005 12:17 PM

Interesting, this is why I think multi culti b.s. hasn't had as damaging an effect here in Canada and the US as it has in Europe, as we are much younger nations. That said, we're still in trouble here in fortress North America.

Posted by: The_Mountie at November 1, 2005 12:21 PM

Nariz:
Your lefty programs, like political correctness and multiculturalism is what is killing us.
Not to make judgements, champion your own culture, one's beliefs, and be silent when a great evil is attacking us, is stupidity, which is the left.
You left out your third great lefty program - appeasement.

Posted by: dgene at November 1, 2005 1:00 PM

Hi Sebastian, I will keep a look out for them, all the best. Daffersd

Posted by: Daffersd at November 1, 2005 4:49 PM

This latest development in Paris convinces me all the more firmly that the (deadly) 1992 Los Angeles riots that erupted allegedly over Rodney King's mistreatment at the hands of the LAPD were actually orchestrated by mosques in LA with possible connections to Ousamah bin Looney Tunes and the al-Qaeda terrorist network.

Posted by: pythagoras at November 1, 2005 8:19 PM

Another source of fuel toi the fire is going to be the slow but steady movement of the global economic center to India and China.

Europe and the United States have already lost heavy industry and are increasing loosing precision manufacturing / technological competiveness as well.(in all but the most esoteric technologies)

This is going to mean a smaller economic pie to divide. Add ethnic / religous tensions and the situation is going to get very volatile. Not only must "multi culturalism" that leads to multiple distinct societies must be stopped, but many "free" trade policies need to be revised as well.

Posted by: 2Talk at November 2, 2005 4:42 PM

London Girl;
You are great. Are you single? Seriously though -I agree with you completely. Especially about the feckless, limp-wristed politicians (and media) which are so paralyzed by their fear of being labeled "insensitive" or even worse "racist" that they will allow their countries and societies to be destroyed by the Islamic Nazism which is spreading like a plague.

Posted by: Fecklar at November 4, 2005 11:39 AM

Paris riots are an obvious consequence of immigration
open door policies so popular these days. No Europeans have asked for it but our beloved politicians always know better, millions have been let through, without keeping in mind that most are coming from countries where the Divine message is the only one they submit to, with that mind set they don't integrate, so the local population is forced to pay for their welfare but doesn't want to have anything to do with them.
The french have to be admired for keeping France and the secular state first, democracy is freedom who doesn't like it can always go somewhere else!

Posted by: weisswolfen at November 5, 2005 5:13 PM