I really wish all these non-Muslims would just leave these cesspools to the turds. Instead of taking in terrorists we should be taking in these people as true refugees from oppression.

Americaningermany makes an excellent point- the West will stupidly be right there after the next quake. I remember seeing on a Hindu site a few months back that we should just let them (Islamaniacs) die the next time something like a tsunami hits a place like Indonesia since it makes no sense to help a monstrosity like Islamania. It sounded awful but now it seems to make sense in light of stories like these.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at October 17, 2006 7:44 AM

When we donate to the countries that have disasters, the money seems to find it's way to building mosques. Why should giving Christians build mosques when their donations were meant for children, the elderly and the poor? We don't need to just give them a handful of money, we need someone there to oversee where the money is going. NO MOSQUES shall be built with our donations. It's ok to rebuild hospitals or orphanages or rebuild infrastructure. It's ok to build soup kitchens. It's NOT ok to build mosques, armies, to restock weapons or build lavish homes for those who think they deserve it.

Posted by: freewoman at October 17, 2006 8:57 AM

Only Indonesia ? Hell , since 9/11 I have been boycotting ALL Muslim products and services . Why should they get a single cent / penny / euro (insert your currency here)
of our money for as long as they are planning or endorsing our murders ? Don't our feeble governments not give them enough of our hard-earned taxes already ?
Anybody else out there doing likewise ? Seriously , I want to know if what I do is common or wherger I am the only one offended by Islam .
( As I said on another thread , please don't mistake all Asian products and businesses as being Muslim . Your local GENUINELY Indian restaurant or corner shop is probably Hindu owned and deserves your continuing patronage . Enquire ! )

Posted by: WeatherPermitting at October 17, 2006 9:49 AM

Watch what will happen though the next time they experience a tsunami. They'll look first to Christian countries to bring in medical supplies, food and water. AND MONEY!.....

My concience is clear , after the tsunami i sent
them sod all.
My only regret is that not enough of them were killed.

Posted by: aladdinsane57 at October 17, 2006 10:40 AM

Islam is a religion of peace
Here is proof from tranquil Indonesia

http://illustratedpig.blogspot.com/2006/02/politically-incorrect-guid_114086343227020120.html

With Islam it is wrong to burn corpses of stone cold dead moslem fighters but moslems have no problems when it comes to burning christians when they are alive

http://illustratedpig.blogspot.com/2006/03/politically-incorrect-guide-to-where-i.html

MOSLEM WOMEN STUDENTS PROTESTING

http://illustratedpig.blogspot.com/2006/03/politically-incorrect-guide-to-where-i_02.html

Posted by: shiva at October 17, 2006 11:39 AM

One big reason Islamania hates the West so much is sheer jealousy. The West has been a success for centuries-people live well and have freedom.
The Christians in these 3rd World basket cases remind these losers of everything they are not and can never be in the beloved ummah so they get revenge via persecution. These idiots build nothing and have nothing but Islam. And Islam knows best,right?

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at October 17, 2006 11:42 AM

The Indonesian Armed Forces run the country and are heavily Islamic. They have already received Ousamah bin Laden's Seal of Good Housekeeping on one of his widely-circulated videos. In fact, it is highly probable that the Indonesian Armed Forces have been infiltrated (or bought) by al-Qaeda. An Indonesian who occasionally posts at this site mentioned that the Indonesian police routinely train domestic and foreign Islamic jihadists with full awareness on the part of the Indonesian government.

In short, the Indonesian government is the cause of this problem.

It may take a lot more than consumer boycotts of Indonesian products to stop this horror.

Posted by: pythagoras at October 17, 2006 4:21 PM

americaningermany:

In all fairness, it should be pointed out to you that Indonesians in general do NOT hate Americans or America! Indonesia may well be 88% Islamic but it is possibly the least typical of any Islamic country (it has a secular constitution for example and the world's largest Buddhist structure, vihara buddha ur)). See below:

A US study polled Indonesians on the street two years ago and much to our surprise over 75% of the Indonesians polled said they LIKED the United States. About 40% of the Indonesian polled actually claimed that they personally were strongly IN FAVOR of President Bush's War on Terrorism. I do not make this up.

US travelers to Muslims areas of Indonesia have been VERY surprised to find that Muslims Indonesians wanted to PARTY with them (and a wonderful time was had by all--even Muslim).

Yes, there now IS a strong jihadist movement there. That is a tragedy that will have to be dealt with harshly. But it does not typify these people. And it is not a given that Indonesians hate us. I personally think there may be hope of getting these people out of the Islamosphere.

Posted by: pythagoras at October 17, 2006 4:35 PM

BOYCOTT all muslim countries!

You mean Boycott goods from all Muslim countries - lets start with oil ;). Don't think there are many takers for that.

To get around this problem, lets take over these countries and get the oil, which would be technically our oil?

Posted by: MusHuntCowboy at October 17, 2006 4:43 PM

pythagoras
A US study polled Indonesians on the street two years ago and much to our surprise over 75% of the Indonesians polled said they LIKED the United States. About 40% of the Indonesian polled actually claimed that they personally were strongly IN FAVOR of President Bush's War on Terrorism. I do not make this up.

Thats when the dollars where pouring for the Tsusami.

pythagoras
US travelers to Muslims areas of Indonesia have been VERY surprised to find that Muslims Indonesians wanted to PARTY with them (and a wonderful time was had by all--even Muslim).

Yeah as long as the US travellers where footing the bill.Most of these travellers never go beyond the tourist,s areas.And most of them do not understand the language,so they are not fully aware of what is going down.

pythagoras
I personally think there may be hope of getting these people out of the Islamosphere.

Sorry pythagoras I personally think there is no hope from what I see every day,and I travel around daily in Indonesian rural areas.I witness daily how most of the children finish ordianary school at lunch-time,soas to go to islamic studies for 3-4 hours in the afternoons

pythagoras the rest of your comments about the armed forces and goverment I agree with fully.

Terrorists have absolutely no problem moving around Indonesia including Bali as many police and military officers support what they do,it alleged many within the Indonesian Government also support them.

In addition, police on so-called terrorist duty at ports are known to accept small bribes to wave vehicles through without inspection. When you look at how many people the Indonesian military (which is not a true military force but one of domestic suppression and abuse) have murdered, it makes the Indonesian terrorist group "JI" which Indonesia refuses to outlaw) look like angels.

http://www.balibs.org/boycott.html

Posted by: shiva at October 18, 2006 1:22 AM

Mushuntcowboy

You want us to "take over" the oil producing countries? Do you mean as in Iraq? Please!

My wife was admiring furniture in a local shop and when I saw the "Made in Indonesia" tag I walked her outside and we will never go back.
Boycott ME oil?? Would that I could.

Posted by: pismopal at October 18, 2006 5:08 AM

Just a thought...

The central region of the island of Java is, in effect, one gigantic super-volcano just waiting to happen. If the worst were to happen, there would simply be no more Java. Krakatoa, eat your heart out...

An increasing number of Westerners are becoming seriously disillusioned with the political shenanigans in Indonesia, especially when it comes to dealing with known terrorists and their parent organisations. Bali, for example, is now suffering a perpetual absence of real tourist dollars. Once bitten twice shy never rang more true than in this once lovely tourist resort. Tourists (aka foreigners aka infidels) don't forget.

Tensions between Australia and Indonesia are on the rise, as they ought to be. The political psyche of the 2 countries couldn't be further apart. My real concern is that Australia, or any other Western country for that matter, offer concessions to this increasingly Islamofascist country without any real hope of reciprocity. Java is for Jizyah, or so it would seem...

Posted by: maranatha50 at October 18, 2006 5:46 AM

I don't know whether this is the right thread, but I want to say this anyway. We are in a religious war. The secularists don't understand what is going on and do more harm than good by their analyses and proposals. The Christians of the still free West must 1) be ready for death, 2) speak out -- name good and evil, and 3) evangelize muslims.
There is a God in Heaven who will see to that the good wins in the end.

Posted by: salmon at October 18, 2006 5:20 PM

americaningermany: I assure you I am NOT being fooled. I doubt you read my entire post. You read a few lines, decided I was wrong and posted--I do that myself.

Now to reply to your question "Why is Indonesia Islamic"???

Indonesia is Islamic because like everywhere else Muslims went they imposed Islam on the hapless population by brute force and maintained the pressure on the local people over the centuries. Indonesians were likely invaded by Arabs arriving from the Indian subcontinent in the late 900s and lacked the military strength to repel them. The great Hindu-Buddhist Kingdoms of Java fell to the invaders and were replaced by that global scourge, Islam. A tragedy for the world.

Very rarely does anyone Islamize because they choose this ideology (I also think Indonesians had more sense than to do that). Robert Spencer has addressed the point of forced Islamization in his books many times. Present-day Muslims islamized mainly in order to stay alive.

You should know that by now.

Indonesia does not have shariat law for example.And Indonesians do NOT WANT shariat either and have repeatedly resisted its being imposed on them. That is one possible sign of hope (scant). Indonesia has a secular constitution which the Indonesian Armed Forces have ignored since day one. That is probably how Indonesia is being sucked into global jihad by the middle East.

Many parts of Indonesia are in fact nominally islamic and largely disregard islamic doctrines in favor of traditional cultural beliefs that are unrelated to Islam.

Jakarta, Indonesia's capital, lies on Java's north coastal plain which was Arabized many centuries ago and contains the largest concentration of strongly-Islamized peoples in the archipelago. The further from Jakarta and Java's northern coast you travel in Indonesia the less pervasive Islam generally becomes. Yes, I know there are many exceptions to this. But there are still plenty of hill folks in various parts of the archipelago who practice shifting cultivation and ignore Islam. I have seen this first hand (I have been in remote areas of the archipelago where NO one talked to me about Islam and I suspect no one wanted to either).

Islam probably has Indonesia in its grasp by keeping the people there living in fear. This phenomena is more noticeable here than anywhere else in the Muslim world. Indonesia's indigenous and semi-indigenous cultures are also more resistant to Islam than mnost other areas in the Islamosphere as well.

But of course, I know all about the jihad movement in Indonesia as well. It is a tragedy and will have to be dealt with harshly.

Posted by: pythagoras at October 19, 2006 2:44 PM

SHIVA-

Your assertion that only paying western tourists receive hospitable treatment from Indonesians may be the usual case but I know from first hand experiences there that this is not always so.

I have experienced very hospitable treatment from Indonesians when I was there without having been asked to pay a dime. I have NO reason to lie by the way.

Some years back, in a rural, Islamic area of Indonesia a young shopkeeper made a breakfast for me--I had not asked her to, and she refused money. She was genuinely happy to do that (imprmptu).

I can think of other times where similar things happened. So I disagree with you for that reason.

Possibly this depends on where in Indonesia one travels. The further away from Jakartq and Java's Arabized northern coastal plain one travels the less pervasive Islam tends to become, I think.

Posted by: pythagoras at October 19, 2006 2:59 PM