now it begins...

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 8, 2006 11:49 AM

To vote and put this guy in office shows me there are some very ignorant voters out there. Robert Spencer has his work cut out for him.

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 8, 2006 11:50 AM

There have been a great many firsts with the 2007 off year elections; First muslim in Congress, first Socialist in the Senate and first woman Speaker of the House.

Posted by: GreatShaitan at November 8, 2006 11:53 AM

I dunno, Arizona made English it's official state language.

"Las personas de habla inglesa no no necesitan aplicarse"

y no benefitos por illegals

Theres always hope =)

Posted by: GreatShaitan at November 8, 2006 12:02 PM

hi americaningermany. I dont blame you its a sad thing. I feel sorry for the people who will have to deal with this guy there.

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 8, 2006 12:02 PM

Needless to say, there is much pride here at this first.

Time for me to go turban shopping now.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 8, 2006 12:07 PM

ANYBODY running in my district would have won by saying they were a Dem. The Muslims picked a perfect place to get their first guy in.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 8, 2006 12:09 PM

ANYBODY running in my district would have won by saying they were a Dem. The Muslims picked a perfect place to get their first guy in.
Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSER

THATS WHAT I THOUGHT! I am in Canada so I wasnt sure. Maaaaaaaan some of those democrats you got downthere are really ignorant of Islam. Not that canada is any better. We have liberals here to make your liberals look like Reaganites!

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 8, 2006 12:21 PM

Does he get Friday's off with pay?
Is there a prayer room available for him?

Posted by: TheOmegaMan at November 8, 2006 12:22 PM

Hopefully the urinals are not facing Mecca.

Posted by: TheOmegaMan at November 8, 2006 12:22 PM

Oh God!Please don't let America go the India way!!

Posted by: Crows&Cows at November 8, 2006 12:24 PM

Settle more Somalis in Minnesota. Also read a large number of muslims from Russia will be settled in Pensylvannia.

Posted by: Crusader at November 8, 2006 12:25 PM

Expose these useful idiots and expel them with extreme prejudice from our government.

Posted by: squire at November 8, 2006 12:27 PM

"he advocated quick U.S. withdrawal from Iraq..."
-- from a posting above

My view exactly. Yet I am not a Muslim, and do not wish Islam well. Does this mean that I am dead wrong in my views, because I appear to agree with Keith Ellison, or he with me? Or is it something else? Is it what one might understand better if we stand back and think what, objectively, would happen if the Americans withdraw.

I think as soon as the Americans withdraw, there will be all kinds of shrill cries in Iraq, coming from both some Sunnis, and some Shi'a, for the Americans not to go. The Sunnis will realize that it is the Americans who are protecting them from the Shi'a militia. Other Sunnis, possibly a majority, will be delighted, for they are convinced that somehow, though outnumbered three-to-one by the Shi'a, they possess the training, the organization, the ruthlessness, the ability to count on Sunni volunteers coming from Syria (70% Sunni, though Shi'a missionaries from Iran have been given free rein by Bashir al-Assad), Egypt, Jordan, and of course the Gulf. And they are relying, too, on equipment and money coming from the Saudis, who similarly supplied Saddam Hussein during his war against Shi'a Iran (why, I even know someone who painted over the markings on the American-supplied Saudi tanks then shipped to Iraq), not to mention the tens of billions that the U.A.E. and Kuwait "loaned" Saddam Husein for his Sunni Arab crusade against "the Persians."

And some of the Shi'a, too, will suddenly be eager to have the Americans stay, for they calculate that they need the American soldiers to stay and fight and die just a little longer --as long as they stick to killing Sunnis. And of course the more training those Shi'a volunteers for what the Americans call the "Iraqi" army and the "Iraqi" police is also valuable. And finally, the longer the Americans stay, the more stuff -- money, projects, and above all military equipment -- are likely to be given to, or fall into the hands of, the Shi'a-dominated Iraqi government. Others, such as Moqtada al-Sadr, never cared for the Americans, and still others, including those disinlined to disarm the militias ("those Americans can't be serious, can they"), may now feel it is time for those heretofore amazingly pliant and gullible Americans (well, no longer the officers and men, but the civilians in Washington whom those officers and men have been taught to unquuestioningly obey) to leave.

And what will happen in the Muslim world? Oh, crowiing, of all kinds. Crowing from somewhere in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Yes, we won, we won, the Americans have had to leave. And that apparently is what some in the Administration are so scared of.

But they need not be. For if they leave, and when they leave, the natural centrifugal forces, whirring away, will cause Sunnis and Shi'a to be unable to compromise, or if they do enter into any kind of compromise, it will immediately be broken by one side, or the other, or both, for it will be impossible for the Sunnis to accept their new status, and impossible for the Shi'a Arabs to share power and money in the way that the Sunnis demand (and if the Americans think that enlarging the pie by giving potentially-rich Iraq even more American -- i.e., Infidel -- money, will bring about that spirit of compromise that is so foreign to, so inimical to, Islam, they are only proving that their ignorance of Islam and the psychology of Muslims is nearly total). And being unable to compromise, they will fight.

And Muslims being Muslims, and Sunni Arabs regarding the land of the most glorious Abbasid Caliphate as important to their own history and their own identity, will never permit the Shi'a, those quasi-Persians, to win Iraq, and will offer their co-religionists every aid. And so will the Shi'a in Iran, which is not the same thing as saying that the Shi'a Arabs will, because they accept such aid -- money, men, materiel -- necessarily wish their own state to be incorporated into a larger Shi'a state ruled from Tehran.

And as the American squandering of resources -- men, money, materiel --is replaced almost overnight by a sitatuion in which the squandering of resources is that of Muslim states and peoples, whose money, men, and materiel are now being used up, the shrill voices expressing delight over "the defeat of America" will grow fainter. And as the conflict reverberates, as for example when the Shi'a in Bahrain, or Kuwait, or Al-Hasa become inspired by the conflict in Iraq to act up, and then to bring down the Sunni Arabs behaving as those Sunni Arabs will, and as the Sunnis in Pakistan attack, as they will, the Shi'a in Pakistan, and as Hezbollah volunteers possibly march off to help fellow Shi'a in Iraq (and seen off at the station -- the one existing in their imaginations -- by delirisouly happy Christians and Druse and even Sunni Muslims), as the unstated American goal becomes, it is clear, no longer that messianic foolishness about making Muslim states happy and prosperous, but rather in now working to exploit the natural fissures -- ethnic and sectarian that are most obvious in, though hardly limited to, Iraq, all sense of triumph over America, of having defeated America, will fade.

And then there is the matter of an independent Kurdistan. That too, spells trouble for the Arabs and for the unity of Islam. For Islam has always been a vehicle for Arab imperialism. Anwar Shaikh rightly titled one of his analyses of Islam "The Arab National Religion." An independent Kurdistan (with arrangements made for an enclave for Iraqi Christians, their safety to be guaranteed, on pain of loss of all American support, by the people and government of Kurdistan) will not only unsettle the Kurdsih regions of Iran and Syria (causing migraines in both regimes) but ideally would raise, for non-Arab Muslims everywhere, the promise that they too might throw off Arab domination. Think only of the Berbers in North Africa, and think too of the Berbers in France, who might be turned against the Arabs in the same immigrant population, with useful results not least for the French security services.

The spectacle of internecine warfare not only promises to divide and demoralize the Camp of Islam. No, it will also serve as a Demonstration Project to Infidels. Let them see how, without well-meaning Infidels to bring aid of all kinds, and to keep the peace, and to prevent one side or the other from behaving with their wonted barbarity (just read the reports of the corpses found, murdered by Shi'a or Sunni militias or insurgents or irregulars or, for that matter, by members of regular army and police units), Muslims treat each other.

For time now needs to be bought, and Infidels tutored in the ways of Islam, and there is no better way than to remove the controversial American presence in Iraq that so gets in the way of a clear-sighted view from a distance, a pisgah-sight of Islam, that many Infidels need.

Oh, there'll be much mafeking among Muslims when the Americans leave. It will last a week, maybe a month, maybe two.

But not longer. And if the Administration has any sense, it will, just as soon as the more--in-sorrow withdrawal is first announced and then quickly put into effect (with possibly just a very small force left in Kurdistan, to help protect the Christians or oversee their exodus to Lebanon or possibly the "West Bank" but only as pat of a population exchange with local Muslim Arabs) turn its attention to Western Europe, and checking or disrupting campaigns of Da'wa, changing immigration policies and supporting those in Euorpe who wish to do the same, and engaging in propaganda to demoralize the camp of Islam (hint: Karen Hughes is not the right person for this job; Ali Sina, and Wafa Sultan, and Ibn Warraq, should be consulted at every step on the staffing, and on the lines of information and argument to be disseminated; no more "life in America for Muslims is great" and no more rock music and other wonderful examples of Western decadence that do nothing to win or at least unsettle minds).

So yes, I agree with Keith Ellison that the American forces should leave Iraq forthwith. But not for the same reasons.

Who do you think is right? Do you think an American withdrawal will be a victory for Islam, or do you think an American withdrawal will not only conserve our reserves, preserve or halt the degradation in the quality of our armed forces just in time, and help to divide and demoralize the camp of Islam?

There are those who are indifferent to Islam, but not indifferent to the environment. Such people may have no interest in, or be completely unaware of, both the menace of Jihad and how important it is to reduce the OPEC oil revenues which supply the "money weapon" that is one of the main instruments of Jihad, without which the building and maintaining of mosques and madrasas all over the West, and the vast campaigns of Da'wa, and the employment of armies of Western hirelings to promote or defend Islam and the agenda of Islam, in government, in business, in the media, in the universities, would not be possible. But objectively, in their desire to rescue the world from environmental degradation, they are the allies of all those who are most concerned about the world-wide Jihad, or its local components.

And those who worry about the Jihad, and have concluded that the most important task is to reduce the use of oil and gas, may have little in common with members of some environmental groups, but objectively they will work for the very same goal -- a goal which will be pursued by some to save the natural world, and pursued by others to save, in a sense, the man-made world, or at least the world made somewhat better, somewhat more interesting, by all those names to be found in, say, the Index to Jacques Barzun's "From Dawn to Decadence."

In similar fashion, some of those who want the Americans out of Iraq do so for reasons I deplore and abhor. One such person is Keith Ellison. But the policy in Iraq that he desires is exactly what I desire. For I know what will follow, and I welcome it. He does not know. He, just like many Sunnis in Iraq now convinced they will win, or like those people in the West who are convinced that "of course Iran will just take over" -- doesn't know what societies suffused with Islam are like. No compromise. Victor and vanguished. Until another despot comes along, to rule over this or that segment of what was once, but is unlikely to ever be again, Iraq.

And may both sides win.

Posted by: Hugh at November 8, 2006 12:32 PM

He's an American convert to islam, not a foreign born immigrant muslim. He was rased Catholic and converted so he should have some sense of morals leftover unlike those raised to worship bloodspilling from birth as in Pakistan and the M.E.

I believe he was elected to the House, but I would expect if the trend ever continues into the senate muslims in congress will most certainly make issues out of things like being allowed to leave the floor during a fillibuster for daily prayer. Let's see how people react to that. Then we wll know if all is lost because "give them an inch and they will take a mile"

Posted by: GreatShaitan at November 8, 2006 12:33 PM

WHY Is anybody suprized it was MN??

Not the end of the world BUT

Bort being banned is a really bad sign??

Yes Bort has been banned...

48 pakis dead by an islamic terrorist

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN

PS
Does this mean the democrats are going to fire the Gen.'s in charge in Iraq sence it was their plan?

What is naceys plan anyway does any one know??

Airbus to be bought by Dubi??

Gorgia cuts nat. gas to Europe?? AND now they are saying that it will be the coldest winter what will Al Gore do the Europeans put him in charge of climet control??

And I hear that snails are eating the sugar cane?

AHH but the people went for the golden calf well we know how that turned out!!

http://www.beecy.net/frank/

Posted by: Catherine at November 8, 2006 12:34 PM

Assalamau Laikum AIG,

Hi ho, Hi ho ....it's off to congress we go,
waving that green flag..and with oil in toe,
Koran in one hand and Hadith in t'other,
Hi ho, Hi ho it's off to congress we goooooo...

Hi ho, Hi ho it's from congress we,ve come,
Bearded fellows are we, tented womens are we,
Good news we bring hither and thither,
Allah's in the house, along with sharia n Mo(SAW),
Hi ho, Hi ho it's from congress we cooooommme.

AIG, In the name of most merciful Allah SWT

"welcome to the 1st day of the ISA"

Posted by: Naseem at November 8, 2006 12:36 PM

Have you noticed his campaing signs ?

http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2006/POLITICS/11/08/muslim.elect/story.ellison.wed.ap.jpg

Green - the color of Islam.

Posted by: Sanwin at November 8, 2006 12:39 PM

Sorry, I voted against him...

...but unfortunately ISLAMISFORLOSERS is correct.

Given the political and racial the makeup of the 5th District and the dishonest apologists at the hyper-partisan Star Tribune (aka the Star & Sickle aka the Red Star) it was pretty much a given that he'd win.

He could've campaigned wearing a turban while shouting "Death to Israel, Allah Akbar" and still would've gotten the Star Tribune endorsement and won.

Sorry America, go ahead and be disgusted with us now. And here I thought the days of befuddlement over Minnesota politics was over after Jesse Ventura was no longer governor. At least Jesse was entertaining if only a mediocre governor.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at November 8, 2006 12:50 PM

What? No sympathy for me? I'm not that unmentionable troll you know. Sheesh!

Anyway, I'm thinking Ellison probably will be more leftist and less Muslim (at least initially).
That means more of the same old crap in this district that his predecessor did so well-making the locals' lives less comfy with more taxes and spending.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 8, 2006 12:56 PM

Yes, Naseem...one deadbeat mohammedan convert is elected and now the flag of islam will fly over the white house. There is not a hope in hell (christian or mohammedan) that there will ever be an ISA. Unfortunately the bankrupt religion of pieces is in it's dying throes, even with it's overwhelming demographics. The dying throes are painful for mohammedans, and in this day of communication and intercontinental travel, unfortunately the pains are being spread to others. But seriously...you've sounded lucid in the past, but your little wet dream fantasy is so out of the realm of reality that you really just come off as silly.
Silly.
Good luck to you, though...maybe another 'revert' will get elected sometime in the future and you can pass out some candy to your neighbours.
Hate to say it, but the hammer will fall soon, and there won't be a prayer rug big enough for the loonies to hide under like roaches when it happens.
But continue your wet dream...perhaps one day you'll graduate beyond this ph-ALLAH-cy (dung be upon him) and be welcomed into the 21st century.

Posted by: anathema at November 8, 2006 12:58 PM

A muslim's first loyalty is to the ummah, not the nation-state. This snake should not be trusted at all.

Posted by: squire at November 8, 2006 1:03 PM

ISLAMSFORLOSERS-

When I wrote that you were "unfortunately correct" it wasn't a dig at you, but dismay at the fact that you were correct in that Ellison was a shoe-in depite his obvious unsuitability for office as you suggested.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at November 8, 2006 1:06 PM

Folks, let's not get too carried away with Ellison's victory. His winning in this district doesn't mean a flood of his ilk getting into Congress everywhere else. It just means there are a lot of robots in this district who slavishly vote for one party regardless of who they put on the ballot. Ellison will probably be one of those careerist hacks who'll spend the rest of his life in Washington (thanks to the robots) but this doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things-even if some wish it were so. Just try not to let this sort of thing happen to you.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 8, 2006 1:06 PM

I read about htis- Holy Cow! I swear we in America are out to destroy ourselves! and when it happens everyone will be standing around with dumb looks on our faces saying 'what happened?" Well duh- the writing has been on the wall for quite some time now, but we've apparently all got cataracts! We're going to PC oursevles to death- just like Europe and France have done!

Christian news and commentary at: sacredscoop.com ...

Posted by: CottShop at November 8, 2006 1:07 PM

Hollowpoint-

I thought so. I'm just teasing a bit. I consider most of the posters here as part of my own ummah.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 8, 2006 1:11 PM

I'm fairly certain you are allowed to shoot fifth columnists as spies, especially if they infiltrate the highest of institutions

and this guy certainly fulfills the criteria as one of those

now anybody want to lone me a gun?

Posted by: Taranus at November 8, 2006 1:12 PM

Ahh but Naseem,

You forget one important factor: your god has never existed. Oh-so scary atheists like me easily defeat said "god" in a public forum. Between rational philosphy and scientific proofs, Allah doesn't stand a chance. Of course the same could be said regarding all gods but I don't see Christians or Jews wantonly inciting biblical hatred of non-believers. It's a faith or fact thing sweetie - you wouldn't understand.

In defense of our modern world and peaceful beliefs, Keith Ellisons every move will be watched through the scope of rational discourse. I highly doubt he's trouble but he does soften up dhimmi tendencies just the same. We will see in time.

Being a registered Minnesota voter myself, one wrong move and people like me will be on this mans tail like a hive of killer bees. Now that he's in office - we can call him and his favorite imam to the mat. This official can now be heckled 24/7 if he screws up.

Nothing has begun darling Naseem, this is simply another test of our constitution.

By the way - how's your hubby feeling these days? Allah being kind to your family or is he still an absent landlord?

Posted by: Quantum Infidel at November 8, 2006 1:13 PM

THATS WHAT I THOUGHT! I am in Canada so I wasnt sure. Maaaaaaaan some of those democrats you got downthere are really ignorant of Islam. Not that canada is any better. We have liberals here to make your liberals look like Reaganites!

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 8, 2006 12:21 PM

Oh God-Canada must be Communist!

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 8, 2006 1:13 PM

Ameriki indfidel dogs have elected to undergo a change.

So how come no one here is rioting, nor burning embassies nor taking hostages in the land of the Great Satan?

Donald Rumsfeld, an American, stepped down. Why can't muslim leaders do that?

Could it be we are more civilized? Or could it be because we are not influenced bt 1400 yyears of muslim culture?

Posted by: GreatShaitan at November 8, 2006 1:14 PM

and so it starts....Rumsfeld is no more!
fantastic...he is an incompetent bully, and has been responsible for a poorly executed war.

Posted by: protectalbion at November 8, 2006 1:18 PM

And this is just the beginning.

Posted by: americaningermany at November 8, 2006 12:22 PM

Well, not necessarily. Ellison sprang from very fertile soil here. If the rest of the US starts to wake up (and maybe Ellison will unintenionally function as the alarm clock) this sort of thing won't be repeated too often. There will always be pockets of stupidity like this district no matter what but the country at large can neutralize them by keeping on sending the right people to Congress. We just need to cultivate some good politicians that know right from wrong. It won't be easy but it must be done.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 8, 2006 1:20 PM

Ellison's election is grim news for the USA. I'm ashamed of the voters in Minnesota for being so incredibly short-sighted and ill-informed and utterly irresponsible.

Posted by: Foehammer at November 8, 2006 1:23 PM

What guarantee is there that when America withdraws from Iraq, we’ll stay in Kurdistan? I truly wish we would, and that we’d support and defend an independent Kurdistan with a semi- or fully autonomous enclave for Assyrians. But I have a sinking feeling that the anti-Iraq-war Democrats will insist on a full withdrawal from all of Iraq and will throw the Kurds and Assyrians to the wolves, as has always seemed to happen in history. If they understood Islam the way us JW readers do, there would be a chance, but not with the lack of knowledge our politicos, both sides of the aisle have. The desire to have a Kurdistani and/or Assyrian enclave is good, but may not happen. What are the ramifications of a complete withdrawal from Iraq, including Kurdistan? Would this be good or bad for infidels?

Posted by: JeffS at November 8, 2006 1:29 PM

Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but, isn't this guy a member of the 'nation of islam' run by 'calypto louie' rather than a 'real muslim'?

Posted by: xqqme at November 8, 2006 1:35 PM

Since his religion forbids him to make friends with Christians and Jews, I wonder how bi-partisan he'll be, and exactly whose views he will represent.

Posted by: Sansantiago at November 8, 2006 1:35 PM

Naseem -

You must be working up quite a sweat dancing around your hut in that outdated-burqa of yours while you root for the LOSING team, Islam. But I did find your poem/song VERY amusing. You are such a hoot!

Posted by: champ at November 8, 2006 1:39 PM

Settle more Somalis in Minnesota. Also read a large number of muslims from Russia will be settled in Pensylvannia.
Posted by: Crusader

What news source is this from? Why do we need Russian moslems. seems the Russians don;t want them.. Russia is bigger than the USA they need to keep them or send them to cesspool-landia. let the umma-umma take them instead of the Amrican taxpayers.

PS. Maybe we should offer Minnesotaa to the Canadians in exchange for a less liberal province of theirs.

Posted by: germaninamerica at November 8, 2006 1:42 PM

News from Belgium:

Belgium to set up Imam school

Ummah News Links

Posted by: ummahnewslinks at November 8, 2006 1:51 PM

I'm sure that Tim Russert will ask him:

What makes you, a moderate Muslim, right and Usama bin Laden wrong?

And Sean Hannity will certainly query:

Those jihadists are perverting a great religion, right Mr. Ellsion?

And Larry King will ask:

Are you really a Muslim? You don't look Arabic.

And....

And won't Tim, and Sean, and Larry, and all the others be surprised when Mr. Ellison demands that he swear his oath of office on a copy of the Qur'an.

Of course, by then it will be too late; and only the beginning.

Posted by: PRCS at November 8, 2006 1:57 PM

Hugh ,your prognosis does make sense. The "crowing" part..well, we have to ignore. Or taking our cues from muslims, play *war weary victim* part..and judiciously halting aid in any form.

Incidentally, there has been a suicide bomber attack on pak army camp leaving some dead. Obviously, the victims were allegedly doing simple "callisthenics".

Posted by: Crows&Cows at November 8, 2006 1:59 PM

I guess the voters have expressed their wishes and now in the spirit of democracy we need to work with the new member of congress...this is a good opportunity for an American Muslim politician...

Posted by: sikhy at November 8, 2006 2:04 PM

Ellison has said he will insist on the Koran beeing used for him to be sworn into congress...
Jihadwatchers, we know what is written in this "book", all the suras,etc...
If this man insists on the Koran being used, than he glass-clear commits high treason !!
The constitution simply does not allow the content of certain Koran statements !
So, please, instead of catching a defeatist twinge here on the blog, there should be already a force forming to attack this mans plans from the High Court angle.
Americans, wake up !, do not let this happen !!
Certain suras of the Koran preach a 100% opposing content to the spirit of the American Constitution.. make a case of treason against him!

Posted by: cosmicAvenger at November 8, 2006 2:10 PM

Naseem, where are you? I'd like to send you a Honeybaked ham for the holidays.....And a bottle of Jack....

Posted by: DCWatson at November 8, 2006 2:12 PM

I really hope Keith Ellison and all the rest of this death-cult get really familiar with the term "raisin head" from thier own prophet. Maybe then they will understand why nobody else likes them. Next time the race card gets played, rember the raisin heads.

Posted by: squire at November 8, 2006 2:14 PM

LOL,

Kiss him good bye Naseem, because when Congress is done with him he'll be a godless a**hole like the rest of them.

Posted by: atheling at November 8, 2006 2:15 PM

If in the next election this guy loses will it then
be cause for jihad - once a Muslim owns territory - the seat in Congress - it can never be occupied by a non-Muslim?
...
Do we know his opinions on jihad ?
...
(Will Capitol police have explosive-sniffing dogs nuzzle him each time he enters the chamber?:))
...
His election is a consequence of Bush's infamous claim that Islam is a religion of peace - apparently the voters of this man's district believed the President and saw no danger in electing a potential mujahideen...
...
Ol' George bought himself a Muslim Democrat in Congress...brilliant...

Posted by: sonnyboy at November 8, 2006 2:16 PM

Naseem can't kiss him hello or goodbye....In Naseem's culture, that would get her/him/it 100 lashes with a metal stick, and possibly a public hanging......

What Ellison should be called on the carpet for are the meeting(s) he's had with the rotten eggs at CAIR.

Perhaps a few (thousand) e-mails or phone calls to him asking him why he's met with CAIR would give him an opportunity to clear this matter up.

General Questions
Call: 612.522.4416

http://www.keithellison.org/

Posted by: DCWatson at November 8, 2006 2:21 PM

While many posters here express their concerns about the notion of Muslim domination of the West, the American economy, which has accepted such a notion as part of life, is very resilient. The stock market keeps going up, climbing the "wall of worry." In fact, a major bull market is beginning in front of our eyes.

Who do I listen now? I listen to the stock market which is the best future-predictor.

As a speculator, I see this bull market will likely last into 2008 when we have a new US president. At that time, the majority of Americans will be so positive about the economy and most of the hard-core infidel posters here today will be so tired of posting their angry comments. If these things happen, some real, dreadful conflict between Muslims and infidels will be around the corner. For example, our Vietnam-veteran poster Naris' worst nightmare could come true -– the Iran war.

Meanwhile it pays to be a contrarian who goes with the flow of the stock market, and beefs up one's financial security for retirement. The boys who cry wolves will have a chance to see the wolves, but not now.

Posted by: kung fu fighter at November 8, 2006 2:22 PM

"So yes, I agree with Keith Ellison that the American forces should leave Iraq forthwith. But not for the same reasons. "

Hugh, I agree, and I think this whole election has shown that Americans are sick of Iraq, yes, but not *why* they are sick of it. Is it really because of those poor Iraqis? Or just because they don't want to waste more American lives and resources on Iraq?

Pres Bush could see this as a good opportunity: stand back with 'my hands are tied', let the Dems hastily retreat (for the wrong reasons), and then have them to blame for the ensuing civil war. They will withdraw, pump millions into Iraq (feed the crocodile, feed the crocodile) and still be unable to stop the muslim vs muslim violence.

And how do you think the next US election will go? When the muslim world continues with violent attacks, and it dawns on the public that feeding the crocodile hasn't worked? Especially if meanwhile the Dems get in some of the legislation they really want, so their voters have less motivation.

Then, voters will want a strong defence against islamist attacks, not more appeasement.

Posted by: Lili at November 8, 2006 2:28 PM

DC Watson,

Very good idea on the e-mails. But after sending them to CAIR, how about we keep a vigilant eye on Minnestosa politics and when something goes on, we insight the people of Minnesota to contact their other reps. Brigitte Gabriel says it only takes 50 e-mails, calls or letters to scare a congressman or senator into action. ONLY FIFTY! Who up above said they were registered in Minnesota? Maybe they could be in charge of letting us know when Ellison tries to do something and we can let the good times roll.

If the Muslims move better under cover of darkness, which indeed has let them get as far as they've gotten, lets flood them with light, relentlessly, all day and night, in every nook and cranny. As long as we still have our freedom of speech let's thwart them at every turn: Some Muslima wants her picture taken in a hijab. BOOM! No way baby! They try to pass a hate speech/crime law in Minnesota to let them move around with impunity and trap us. POW! We get the word out and have the people storm their reps offices with messages. They want to prevent Americans, FOR ANY REASON, from driving in their taxis at the Minneapolis Airport. SHUT THEM DOWN AND PUT THEM OUT OF BUSINESS. Contract with another taxi company or set up a huge boycott with everyday citizens with mini vans acting as surrogate drivers or setting up a driving co-op. Also, don't buy products from Muslim merchants. Don't buy their gas, don't shop in their stores, don't let them do your dry cleaning. And tell them why you aren't going there anymore. Tell them that because "moderate" Muslims will not stand up for this country, we native born Americans will not do business with their people.

We can use this site to organize a grassroots resistance that will make the Nazi resistance during WWII look like a kids game. Who is with me?

Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at November 8, 2006 2:56 PM

Do n't know why you guys are so upset.

Muslim politicians have there uses!

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30100-13551200,00.html

"On the face of it, they were beyond reach. Until the local Asian MP stepped in. Mohammed Sarwar travelled to Pakistan and helped to broker a one-off extradition deal. The three were soon picked up by police locally."

...and Justice was done.

Posted by: raz at November 8, 2006 3:53 PM

Assalamau Laikum all,

Ofcourse a lot of peoples are (trying) to downplay the significance of this ....but not me. Now, there is only direction...upwards and onwards and the distant objective is the ISA.

9/11 was only a handful years ago. The fact that a muslim has been chosen in such a short period after.... to me this speaks volumes of the ignorance of the Amerike.

But ofcourse you know this in the depths of your heart....you are just putting on a brave face.

He will be sworn in the Koran...another 1st...and pray tell how many other 1st items will this man introduce.

Well I don't know...but the Amerkie has spoken ...and the Amerkie will find out ....best of British (as they say in Pak)!

Posted by: Naseem at November 8, 2006 4:20 PM

Now that Hezbollah had been empowered by the Democratic gains, today they have called on attacks against Americans.

Is Keith Ellison going to condemn Hezbollah? say anything? Be American? Or will his silence as a double agent be deafening?

Posted by: alaskan1000 at November 8, 2006 4:37 PM

Why are Farrakhans disciples not considered true muslims the majority of the time bu mohhamedeans but now you count them as one of your own because they win a political seat in Ameriki?

By the way, your muslim hero Ellison is pro choice and leans to the left, no so sure he is true believer.

No ones putting on a brave face, probably just trying to hold back a laugh at the fool on the hill.

Posted by: GreatShaitan at November 8, 2006 4:43 PM

G´day Nassem, old Paki chick,
9/11 only was a handful of years ago..., thats right.
Thats why you people should eventually learn to view the problem also thru your enemies eyes. Soon there will be no time left to do that, as the whole middle east and south east will be shredded in one large battlefield...
did you see the pics of the city of Dresden in 1945?, that conflict did cost some 60mio. lives, the coming one (on your turf) will be mightier and fiercer, definitely costing even more lives... and only because you did not learn to communicate, but believed that only you were right with your philosophie on life (certain little Austrian taught the same to the Germans in the 1930s), and that you had to expand your belief to other territories in order to make your belief a world rule. You moslems are only 1,3bio. people... there are over 4bio. who are not! And soon you will have breached the final limit to make sure the rest of the world raises against you.... It will be an allmighty slaughter, but just before you think you have succeeded you will be wiped off the face of this planet... You started it, you will have to carry the consequences !... so do break into a festive spirit at present, believing you are succeeding, but you are very unwise to have only this very unbalanced point of view, as the satan under the name allah will never keep his word and burn you in his hellfire when he is finally defeated... poor souls you are, but it will be the only way, you choose it.

Posted by: cosmicAvenger at November 8, 2006 4:43 PM

Hey Naseem,

Ever hear of a little thing called Pearl Harbor? You didn't study our history before you spoke. Be careful about what you wish for. When the Democrats vote to end the war and our guys come home, they will be watching your every move, because they saw you in action, up close and personal. They will be able to keep an eye on what you're doing here. They have stories, lots and lots of stories. And Robert will continue posting stories, about how you live and how you kill. And we're all telling everyone, all the stories about you and yours and what you think and how it's different from the way we think. And people are waking up and we're not going to stop telling everyone about you; relentless, persistent application of the facts.

I talked to a new lady in my industry yesterday about this and at first she was incredulous, when I told her how your prophet screwed a little kid after he "married" her. But then she mentioned something about one of the guys who founded the Nation of Islam in the 1960's. This guy's last name was Mohhammad, I don't remember the first name, who was a friend of Malcolm X and she said it came to light that he had impregnated several junior high school aged girls and when I told her about your prophet and Aisha the light bulb started to come on. When I told her that the Ayatollah Khomieni reduced the marriagable age for girls to 9 years after he took over when the Shah was ousted in 1979 and that he himself married a ten year old girl when he was twenty-eight, she really started to believe me. I told her about your taqqiya and the 1) convert, 2) pay the tax and submit or 3) be killed scenario that you guys adore so much and then she told me about a woman who she knew in California who told her that a young girl who was a friend of their family had married a non-Muslim guy and her brother killed her...in California! And we don't live anywhere near California, but we know about this incident.

Oh yeah, we're listening Naseem, Naseema, Naseems & bros. and we're hearing you. I don't buy for one minute that you're a Muslim woman. You keep talking though, because everytime you brag about it you steel my resolve and the resolve of everyone here. And we're watching you and we're learning from your moves. And you won't know what we're doing behind the scenes to undermine you, like you've done to us. We can put up with a lot but when you push us too far...be especially careful if you try and pull some crap like they've been pulling in France, because sometimes Americans go nuts and take out their frustration on anyone who resembles the enemy who just happens to be driving by. Think "Rodney King Riots".

Well, enough for now. 'Hope I haven't given you the drizzles. Have a great evening!

Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at November 8, 2006 5:01 PM

Nasperm said: "9/11 was only a handful years ago. The fact that a muslim has been chosen in such a short period after.... to me this speaks volumes of the ignorance of the Amerike."

Lets read that last part again shall we..

"to me this speaks volumes of the ignorance of the Amerike."

So even a moslem thinks it's ignorant for Americans to vote in a moslem.
Could it be because those voting Americans are ignorant of the true islam and the threat it poses?
Somebody needs to study up on thier taqqiya, you're showing your poker hand for all to see Nasperm!

Posted by: Infidel_Dog at November 8, 2006 5:03 PM

Considering the now public knowledge of the average intelligence of the voters of the 5th District of Minnesota, I will no longer tolerate hillbilly, redneck, or other similar jokes. My District re-elected its Conservative Republican Representative by a huge margin. I will drop a blivet down the chimney of anybody who so much as suggests that the denizens of Appalachia are less intelligent than any Midwesterner. Jeff Foxworthy, kiss my . . .

Posted by: Pelayo at November 8, 2006 5:04 PM

Interesting he chooses to be a democrat...

Democrats, the future party of islam??? I bet more muslim dems are on the way... But I guess thats okay since bush is the bad guy....

Posted by: adobe at November 8, 2006 5:18 PM

Naseem, where are you? I'd like to send you a Honeybaked ham for the holidays.....And a bottle of Jack....

Posted by: DCWatson at November 8, 2006 02:12 PM

ROTFL ROTFL!!!

Gold Star for you today!!

Part of the American Tribe

Posted by: Catherine at November 8, 2006 5:40 PM

I hear that the conservative congressman from the second district of Tennessee won with 78 percent of the vote. The conservative congressman from the first district won with 61 percent. I'm going to move. There is hope out there.

Also, the third district re-elected their conservative congressman. East Tennessee is apparently the place to be.

Posted by: Pelayo at November 8, 2006 5:47 PM

"Does he get Friday's off with pay?
Is there a prayer room available for him?" Posted by TheOmegaMan

I think we all should watch the proceedings of this new Congress veeeery closely. Will the Mohammedan member complain about the invocation conducted by a Christian minister? If he does, what will be the Dhimmicratic Party's response? This guy is dangerous, as are damn near all Mohammedan converts.

Also this guy will have a staff full of CAIR operatives.

Posted by: Pelayo at November 8, 2006 5:56 PM

Folks, don't feed the troll/s Naseem.

"Some Muslima wants her picture taken in a hijab. BOOM! No way baby!" Isabella, do you mean the face veil? I understand that is called the niqab, and the hijab is just the head covering.

Posted by: Lili at November 8, 2006 6:21 PM

He will be sworn in the Koran...another 1st...and pray tell how many other 1st items will this man introduce.

Well I don't know...but the Amerkie has spoken ...and the Amerkie will find out ....best of British (as they say in Pak)!

Posted by: Naseem [TypeKey Profile Page] at November 8, 2006 04:20 PM

Spoken like a true Mohammedan.....Or is it Moslem?

Posted by: DCWatson at November 8, 2006 6:41 PM

Ellison was interviewed on CBC Radio's "As It Happens" program this evening. He confirmed that he will swear on the Koran.

I'll have to read more about him. If he is Nation of Islam, that confuses me, because I thought "real" Muslims didn't recognize them as legit. If so, then CAIR has another agenda for supporting him (gasp! shock!).

Posted by: Josephine at November 8, 2006 7:41 PM

No surprise here:

UN and OIC Considering Joint Relief Operations

Ummah News Links

Posted by: ummahnewslinks at November 8, 2006 8:25 PM

I too heard that Ellison is a member of the Nation of Islam (NOI). They believe in Allah (Arabic for God) but the difference is as follows ... they believe that W. D. FARD (Walid Farad - formerly Wallace Dodd Ford) is Allah incarnate. The Islamic Council of Rome has issued a fatwa against Louis Farrakhan and the NOI. Go figure!

Posted by: secular4ever at November 8, 2006 8:37 PM

I too heard that Ellison is a member of the Nation of Islam .... BIG DIFFERENCE between NOI and regular Sunni/Shiite/Wahabbist Islam. NOI believes that a man named Wallace Dodd Ford (later named Walid Farrad) is Allah (Arabic for God). He was a convicted con man and racketeer. Did his time at San Quentin and turned up in the ghettos of Detroit at about the time of the Great Depression. Because of his ambiguous, outward ethnic appearance he was able to convince poverty-stricken, devout Blacks that he was their "savior" from Mecca. He was really the product of an English woman thought to have been of Russian descent and a gentleman from the South Pacific (Borneo/New Guineau/New Zealand???).

Posted by: secular4ever at November 8, 2006 8:45 PM

This hour's Jawdropper:

HEZBOLLAH JUDGE ELECTED in MICHIGAN!

Care to venture in which city? Which city has the 2nd largest mosque in America?

http://www.debbieschlussel.com/archives/2006/11/hezbollah_judge.html

Posted by: Malinois at November 8, 2006 8:47 PM

I believe Ellison may have been asssociated with Nation of Islam in the past but denounced it quite some time ago.

He also gathered support in this election from a Minnesota newspiece publication "The American Jewish World" For what that is worth.

"Have you noticed his campaing signs ?

http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2006/POLITICS/11/08/muslim.elect/story.ellison.wed.ap.jpg

Green - the color of Islam."

Yes, but Mr. Ellison would not be the first to use green campaign signs in Minnesota as well. Green campaign signs for Democratic Senator Paul Wellstone were quite common when he was alive and running for Senate, and he was Jewish. They like Green up there, I guess! Something to do with the environment maybe.

Posted by: ThinkForYourself at November 8, 2006 9:00 PM

Lili,

I stand corrected. I mean the entire face covering thingey. Honestly, I'm getting tired of trying to keep all the Arabic names straight. I was at a department store earlier today and I heard no less than three Arabic names announced over the loud speaker, looking for more cashiers, I guess, over about a half an hour period. The lady who rang me up was very pleasant and had her hair very covered by the hijab (just the scarf).

I get irritated seeing so much of this in my little part of suburbia. But then, I didn't have any make-up on and she didn't bitch about that.

Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at November 8, 2006 9:06 PM

To all non-Muslim deists, forgive me for my Epicurean leanings but war is war, I'm more concerned with preserving modern/western civilization than I am preserving the feelings of even well meaning believers in god.

[rant on]

Naseem and all visiting Muslims,

Is Allah willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then Allah is not all powerful.
Is Allah able, but not willing?
Then Allah is malevolent and evil.
Is Allah both able and willing?
Then where does evil come from?
Is Allah neither able nor willing?
Then why worship Allah at all?

Let's reduce this to the heart of the matter: Allah is as silly as a 747 airliner self-assembling during a hurricane. Improbable, illogical Santa Clause nonsense. This myth insults my intelligence, it is an ancient and obsolete explanation of reality that is blatantly false.

Since you consider Allah to be all-powerful and all-good lord of worlds, why is there no infinite universe of life with no suffering...and no evil? I could be a better god than "Allah". If I were empowered, I would easily decide to create a perfect universe of endlessly joyful life without death and personal extinction. What's stopping Allah from truly reigning over an eternal universe right now? Is Allah off on some all important errand with better things to do then attend to his beloved creation?

Nothing when tsunamis come, nothing when earthquakes hit, nothing when plagues came, nothing when a sexually repressed "shahid" murders in the name of your improbable creator. No testament of any "all powerful Allah" ever in history. So far "Allah" has done zip, zilch, nadda. Never mind how Allah should be ripping out Mr. Spencers spine, splitting his brains in two, putting it all back together and doing it all over again...that always makes me giggle. Zeus had lighting bolts but Allah? Not even static shock. Prove me wrong and I'll fly to Pakistan and offer you my head...I hear they're experts with that kind of hilal butchery.

Alas Naseem, evil and suffering exist and are incompatible with the existence of "the supreme lord of all worlds". Allah, so far, is utterly useless when it comes to preserving happiness, peace or even life itself. Allah gets an "F" for false.

For the sake of and in defense of those who seek universal peace, I submit that Allah does not exist, is not all-powerful or is not benevolent...Allah is completely unworthy of regard, notice or worship.

I'll tolerate Congressman Ellison pledging his loyalties where he may on any book he chooses if his personal constitution is committed to progress for all in this nation regardless of his religion. The moment anything smells of Islamic bias, he and his belief system fair game in the court of law.

Congressman Ellison most certainly would not want to face down a very public theological battle with hostile free thinkers now that he's in the public eye. Sowing seeds of doubt regarding the god of Islam is akin to poisoning the fundamentalist well and crippling Islams imaginary power. Only by way of respect for others beliefs is Islam insulated from wholesale extinction - keep that in mind.

Congressman Ellison will do well to not make Islam and it's prophets imaginary friend anymore of a soft target than "Allah" already is. We only need not take Islam seriously the way we do not take belief in the Easter Bunny or Tooth Fairy seriously. Where then would the power of the Ummah be when none outside of it are willing to respect Islams already preposterous beliefs?

[rant off]

Posted by: Quantum Infidel at November 8, 2006 9:13 PM

I staunchly maintain that Islam is institutionalized murder and all who aid and abet it are aiding and abetting institutionalized murder.

Human life counts for more than religious freedoms in America, especially whern the one in question here (Islam) may not really be a religion anyway but a sinister totalitarian ideology that practices premeditated murder to advance its own cause.

This is on the Democrats. They should have known better. May God help them.

Posted by: pythagoras at November 8, 2006 9:18 PM

Settle more Somalis in Minnesota. Also read a large number of muslims from Russia will be settled in Pensylvannia.
--- posted by Crusader

Dunno about the ones from Russia, Crusader, but I just got reliable word yesterday here in Minnesota that a deal behind the scenes deal was just cut, due to the recent "sufferings" of "innocent victim Moslems" due to the Sharia takeover in Mogadishu, that 10,000 more Somalis are now schedulted to be shipped into the Twin Cities.

Here's how the deal works: The local Lutheran Synod (forget which one is based here) is able to receive a serivce fee of about $5,000 per Somali haid. 5 grand x 10,000 = a $50 million dollar take.

In the hard scrabble early days, the poor Lutherans were paid only a meagre $2,500 per Hmong.

Whatever the in-ship bonus per haid, Protestant and Catholic and Jewish residents of MN must foot this new in-ship bill. The original Somalis won't have to pay cuz they are in the IRS' negative tax income slot. So the in-place Somalis will get paid by the Infidel citizens for having their Jihadi brethern shipped in to be able to go onto the dole, a rich dole up here in socialist MN.

610 * 623 * 732 * 1066 * 1215 * 1453 * 1492 * 1683 * 1928 * 1938 * 1948 * 1996 * 2001

$40K + $10K = a 25% increase in Moslem diversity financial cost to MN. The incremental tax burden will certainly be big to taxpayers in Marxist Minnesota, but the tax payers are allowed no visibility into that effect cuz to be able to see the tab would be "racist."

We're flying blind. There is no public oversight over legal immigration, which seems to be intent on Islamization of America. Who made the 10K more Somali Moslem decision? Based on what data? Based on what law? What about competing Hindus, Irish, French, English, Scandis who are now desperate to escape EUrabia? What about Hindus desperate to escape the subcontinent before their home regions are swallowed up by Moslems by the hand of the permanent (Marxist) governments in these places?

It's as if Iraq Jacques has a hand in this. But I think not. The common thread in this story is that MN is Marist, the Dept. of State is Marxist, the INS is Marxist, so we're in the same boat as French citizens abused under the watch of "Iraq Jacques."

The question is not who wins the who's the best Marxist prize; the question is who wins the you-gotta-pay-for-your-new-Moslem-neighbors prize.

Go figure.

Posted by: Alarmed Pig Farmer at November 8, 2006 9:28 PM

Ellison is just the start...
the below link refers to an article at IslamOnline.net instructing muslims that the best way to forward their views and principles is to get involved in the political process.... some exerpts;

http://www.islamonline.net/english/Politics/2000/1/Article4.shtml

...Muslims speaking out, showing up in numbers and being involved in the political process will enable our vote to be sought-after by political nominees. We will then be taken seriously, and considered a vital consituency by candidates of all political parties; thus, requiring them to address issues of great concern to our community. American Muslims are increasing in numbers; hence, we stand to make an increasingly significant difference in the outcome of elections.

...As Muslims, we must take advantage of our rights, and become involved - as members of school boards, in mayoral offices, on city councils, and running for government positions and offices - while maintaining our duties and obligations to Islam. Imagine the great status this will bring to us, and the great message we can send to others!

...When we as Muslims adhere to our faith and are mindful of our duties and obligations to Allah, we reflect an ideal and model behavior.

...As non-Muslims become more informed about us, they will undoubtedly become more open-minded and sympathetic to our needs, instead of being leery about our motives and behavior. This is a wonderful way to influence the general public in its outlook of Muslims and Islam in general.

...Our concerns need to be directed to political candidates and officeholders to be addressed, so that we as Muslims can determine who is most committed to the welfare of our community.

...Muslims can slowly change the way Americans view, and Insha'Allah, reverse the downward direction in which this country is going.

...We can impact how children are being left to fend for themselves, as both their parents pursue the "American dream," which emphasizes material gains over the the family.

...Insha'Allah, we can impact discrimination, and the lack of accommodation for religious attire and practices, in the work place that pose great concerns for Muslims and hinder our ability to practice Islam.

...Insha'Allah, we can impact discrimination, and the lack of accommodation for religious attire and practices, in the work place that pose great concerns for Muslims and hinder our ability to practice Islam.

BEWARE OF THE "MODERATE" MUSLIM.

Posted by: Gotham at November 9, 2006 1:29 AM

I'm sorry.....this was the statement that got to me the most.

Insha'Allah, we can challenge the principle of the "separation of church and state," which has stigmatized the whole notion of being religious and devout. Look at where it has taken this country.

http://www.islamonline.net/english/Politics/2000/1/Article4.shtml

BEWARE THE "MODERATE" MUSLIM

Posted by: Gotham at November 9, 2006 1:33 AM

americaningermany:

I feel the way you do too. I tried my best when I voted and for the past few weeks had a feeling it would not be a good election.

There's more about Ellison under "Cair's Congressman" over at- http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com

:(

Posted by: pigtails not veils at November 9, 2006 6:51 AM

Folks, give it 2 years, after all the investagations, the threats of impeachment, and the rebuilding/retooling of the GOP party so it can bring in its great major comback its "A game" because you will see one great big throw-up on the national level of these Dems that got voted in. Also the so-called "blue dog" Dems, tiring after being under the thumb of the SOTH will rebel in due time and join up with the GOP.

Posted by: bigcatgirl13106 at November 9, 2006 6:54 AM

Oh my my...just think of all the muslim males and probably jihadist scurrying IN and OUT of the Capitol. I wonder if the other Senators will be worried. All the covered women and males. Mmmmmm...mm.

Not good.

Posted by: freewoman at November 9, 2006 7:54 AM

I’m glad I didn’t vote and used the time to take my family out for some joyous shopping as I said before. There is no surprise from the outcome of the mid-term election. There is little we can do to change the "bearish" trend in American politics. At least, I can speak no evil of America in which I have realized the "American dream."

Most of my professional friends didn’t vote either. They all told me basically the same thing : Think for yourself, your family, your professional and your retirement saving/investment now.

Nothing is more certain in life than death and tax in America.

Posted by: kung fu fighter at November 9, 2006 9:37 AM

AIG said: "Wonder what lovely Hilary has to say about the threats of Hamas?
She'll won't blame Hamas, that's for sure."

With Hillary's track record, she will most likly say she has distant Hamas ancestry and she is "1/32 muslim."

Posted by: GreatShaitan at November 9, 2006 10:42 AM

Today a Muslim congressman. Tomorrow a Muslim president?

Posted by: Mark Alexander at November 9, 2006 11:31 AM

"Only by way of respect for others beliefs is Islam insulated from wholesale extinction - keep that in mind."
Quantum Infidel

Tolerance works both ways. Don't give me a reason.

Posted by: xqqme at November 9, 2006 3:04 PM