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Gee, Mr. Hooper, can you please explain to me how someone could die in an inner spiritual struggle?
By Paul Mulvey for AAP, with thanks to Jeffrey Imm:
ONE of nine suspects in Australia's largest alleged terrorist conspiracy told his mother he was about to enter paradise, a Sydney court was told today.The committal hearing for the nine Sydney men was told that Mazen Touma had told his mother "Allah's satisfaction is more important than yours".
Crown prosecutor Wendy Abraham QC told Penrith Local Court that Mr Touma had allegedly told a friend his mother had disapproved of his plan to die in a jihad.
"He said jihad was an obligation for every Muslim and that he did not need her permission," Ms Abraham told the court.
"It is alleged he said his mother should be patient because tomorrow her children would be in paradise.
"He spoke of Allah giving him a paradise for martyrdom."
Qur'an 9:111 guarantees Paradise to those who "kill and are killed" for Allah.
Posted by Robert at March 6, 2007 9:02 AM
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Do you think a ton of moderate Muslims will step forward and refute the teachings which basically formed the young man's plans?Will they cleave themselves from those inciteful, archaic texts that are incompatible with the civilized world?I will bet my life the answer to these questions is...NO.
Posted by: HawkWatcher![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/nav-commenters.gif)
at March 6, 2007 9:21 AM
Do you think a ton of moderate Muslims...Of course not. Don't you realise that the best course of action against the jihadists in their midst is silence and inaction? Don't you realise that all across the western world, right now, are moderate muslims waging jihad against the jihadists by, errr, doing and saying nothing?
Any day now, the moderates campaign of inaction and silence will show the mujahideen the error of their interpretation of the world's most beautiful most peaceful religion.
at March 6, 2007 9:45 AM
What is the sura concerning the guarantee of a martyr's family (77 members?) making it to paradise as a result of the martyr's act?
Or is that just a (t)urban legend?
-XRDC
at March 6, 2007 11:05 AM
Who is Mr. Hooper?
Posted by: Kevin D. at March 6, 2007 12:42 PM
It's time we stopped describing as martyrs anyone who deliberately commits violence for the express purpose of dying. That isn't martyrdom. It's suicide.
Isn't suicide expressly forbidden in the Koran? That means they died apostates, right? (Just kidding!)
Back to business:
Martyr
1. A person who chooses to suffer death rather than renounce his religion (Who asked any of these people to renounce their religion or face death? They're the ones who do that to others.)
2. A person who is put to death or endures great suffering on behalf of any belief, principle or cause (No one put them to death. No one imposed suffering. Most were living comfortable lives and freely practicing their faith before deciding they wanted to kill people.)
3. A person who undergoes severe or constant suffering. (See number 2)
Posted by: PMK at March 6, 2007 12:54 PM
Let Oz help the terrorist carry out their quest. There are allot of great white sharks who enjoy eating things. Drop them out of a helo on the Barrier Reef....will send them pronto to "paradise".
Isn't the new democracy all about giving Muslims what they want? Let Oz give it to them.
Posted by: Lame Cherry at March 6, 2007 12:55 PM
PMK-
Good point. My use was loose if that. Suicider is sufficient.
-XRDC
Posted by: XRDC at March 6, 2007 1:05 PM
Who is Mr. Hooper?
Posted by: Kevin D. at March 6, 2007 12:42 PM
Kevin,
If this is a serious question, I'll respond that I believe Robert was referring to Ibrahim Hooper of CAIR. The link below will provide some info on him.
Regards.
at March 6, 2007 1:35 PM
Yes, it was a serious question. Thanks for your answer.
Posted by: Kevin D. at March 6, 2007 3:08 PM
Regarding Doug Hooper, watch the Showtime series "Sleeper Cell" (available at amazon.com) http://www.sho.com/site/sleepercell/home.do
and you will see that the American white convert is the most radical of the cell. I am told that this is the way it is in real life.
at March 6, 2007 5:13 PM
Qur'an 9:111 guarantees Paradise to those who "kill and are killed" for Allah.
++++++++++++++++++++
how many will be sent to allah's so called paradise before this is over????????????
Posted by: The Texican at March 6, 2007 5:26 PM
s_sgt7,
I think that's the whole point. We have a definition of "martyr" which these actions do not meet. We should not bastardize our own language in the name of political correctness. If we must use the word in the context of Muslim violence (hey, that's what it is) it should always be in quotes.
Whatever these killers are doing, it doesn't meet OUR definition of martyrdom and we shouldn't feel obligated to use that word. "Suicide bomber" or suicider (thanks, XRDC) or just plain killer works fine for me. It's simple and it clearly defines what they did. What's so bad about truth? Using their warped definition of a martyr only diminishes its use in any other context.
They have their own definitions of peace and freedom and they don't feel obliged to use ours in their societies and they don't feel compelled to modify their actions to be in accord with our values. Why are we traveling this one-way street?
Posted by: PMK at March 6, 2007 7:14 PM
I believe that it was Granny Weatherwax who first noted the contradiction in terms in describing suicide bombers as matyrs because of the resonance of nobility that the word has in Western minds. There is nothing noble about suicide bombing. In fact, it is downright cowardly. Very few would be bombers are willing to go and fight on a battlefield against Coalition soldiers. Suicide bomber = coward.
Posted by: toothy at March 6, 2007 7:44 PM
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