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And the creeps are creeping fast. "The creeping coup," by Zaffar Abbas in Dawn, with thanks to Sr. Soph:
ISLAMABAD, March 30: The primary theatre of battle may still be North and South Waziristan, as evidenced by the Pakistani Taliban’s recent bloody assault on the settled town of Tank that borders the tribal areas. But the events of the last few days in Islamabad are more disturbing in some ways, suggesting as they do that creeping Talibanisation is now a reality across the country. Indeed the Lal Masjid brigade, as it has come to be known, has every right to celebrate. Tuesday’s showdown with the police was its second major success of the year. First its women’s wing, comprising hundreds of burqa-clad and baton-wielding students, occupied a children’s library in the federal capital in January.Now both the men’s and women’s wings of this emerging brand of the Pakistani Taliban have started to impose new rules of morality by forcibly shutting down video and music shops in Islamabad, and by abducting women whom they believe are engaged in ‘immoral’ activities.
Situated in an area where the prime minister’s secretariat and seat of power is on one side, and the headquarters of the country’s premier intelligence agency, the ISI, on the other, Lal Masjid and its adjacent Hafsa madressah have not only managed to enforce the Taliban-style system of ‘moral policing’ in matters of ‘vice and virtue’, to date they remain in control of the situation.
But who are these people, and why are the government and the security services finding it so hard to enforce the rule of law? Is it that the government really wants to avoid bloodshed because hundreds, if not thousands, of women are part of this violent brigade? Or is it a reflection of some kind of infighting in the establishment where one faction still has a soft corner for their former Islamist allies?
Probably both.
Posted by Robert at March 31, 2007 9:36 AM
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so they call killing "creeping", l wonder when the creeps will be caught?
Posted by: ZenaWarriorPrincess![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/nav-commenters.gif)
at March 31, 2007 10:06 AM
Indoctrination through promises of basic patriarchal control over everything. There won't be a young girl or boy or woman safe if the Taliban takes over. It will be barbarism at its zenith -- Islam at its very worst.
And then there's the issue of nuclear weapons...
Posted by: Foehammer at March 31, 2007 10:19 AM
Nukes nukes nukes. Moslem nukes in the hands of Moslem Jihadists. This is only one assassination away
Posted by: dennisw at March 31, 2007 10:36 AM
Pakistani bumper sticker:
Allah needs nukes now!
My bumpersticker in response:
Islam delende est.
(Do a CATO THE ELDER search.)
Posted by: profitsbeard at March 31, 2007 11:11 AM
This experiment in Pakistan should watched, adn I expect that it will be allowed to succeed. That way there would be an additional datapoint on the viability of conversion of a seeemingly "moderate muslim" area being overrun by the "tiny minority" of extremists.
It should serve as a lesson for posterity... if we could ever learn.
Posted by: Jsingleton at March 31, 2007 11:15 AM
At lest a talibanized Pakistan would be more straightforard to deal with. None of this "friend and ally" nonsense.
Posted by: JadeDragoness at March 31, 2007 12:22 PM
Since 9/11/2001, the American government has given to Pakistan, a country whose generals created, nurtured, trained, and then sent back into Afghanistan to take over that country, the Taliban (from "talib," or madrasa student, who attended those madrasas set up in Pakistan), $27.5 billion dollars in direct and indirect (inluding cancellation of debts) aid. Pakistan, where the I.S.I. paid for A. Q. Khan, "Dr." A. Q. Khan, to study in Western laboratories (in Holland, in Germany) and steal their nuclear secrets. Which he dutifully did. And while the American government got wind of this, yet it continued to look the other way, for decades of having seen that country as full of ramrod-postured, terry-thomas mustachioed rectitudinous generals, fine fellows all, what with their straight no-nonsense talk (so very different from those left-wing Indians), American generals and those of the John-Foster-Dulles school of geopolitical comprehension, were happy with anyone who was a "bulwark against Communism."
What have we got for that $27.5 billion? What does the Adminstration think it has gotten? What would it tell the public has been bought with that $27.5 billion? Bin Laden? Al-Zawahiri? Both captured or dead? What about the Taliban -- have what remained of them, having fled to Pakistan, been rounded up, or killed?
What did the $27.5 billion buy?
And what will happen to Pakistan -- is there the slightest chance that it will turn out all right, and those weapons the Western world, and especially the United States, allowed it to acquire will not be used, either by Pakistan or another Muslim country, or any number of groups who have sympathizers throughout the Pakistani military, against Infidels -- possibly India, possibly Israel, possibly other places even further from Pakistan.
Any rethinking of anything? Any reconsideration of the past and present folly, so future folly does not follow?
Posted by: Hugh at March 31, 2007 12:27 PM
It is a bit of a misnomer to call it a the Talibanisation of Pakistan as the Taliban movement is ethnic Pashtun which are 40 million people and a huge number of them are in Pakistan.
Pakistan has always been of this pre Islam and Islamic code of conduct.
If one mixes in the "scholars" Syed Abul Ala Maududi of Pakistan, Hasan al Banna of Egypt, Muhammad Baqir as-Sadr of Iraq and Dr. Abdullah Azzam of Saudi Arabia, this is the Taliban in their historical fight or jihad against colonialism fostered first against the British and then the Soviet Empire.
Pakistan has always been Taliban, but they only took on the name seekers of knowledge recently.
The scholars have always had this struggle in hating the west as it was dilluting Islam and have blamed a historic leaving it on another culture. This Pashtuni following though has always been Pakistan and is nothing new.
Posted by: Lame Cherry at March 31, 2007 12:45 PM
The Talibanisation predates The Taliban and 911. For all the reasons cited in the past by Hugh: the oil weapon and the money the Saudi choir has used to preach and expand Islam(with those lovely satelites).
Perhaps a better 'turning point' here would be 1979 with Zia, the US Embassy being gutted in Islamabad, and the Mecca revolt and Soviet invasion of Kabul. But as VS Naipul writes about again and again: the Pakistanis realize their country has huge problems, they admit their economy and culture is stagnant, but their solution is always 'more' Islam, not less. In his travelogues throughout Pakistan he runs into sad people who mourn the failures of their life; they all point to the need for 'true' Islamic leaders, and 'more' Islam. This Dawn piece is a very interesting piece. It is telling. And just what was the reaction of the scared Saudi government over the Mecca revolt in 1979? After they killed the revolt, did they liberalize their rule? or did they become 'more' Islamic, seeking more power for the Wahabi establishment? Within Islam it would appear the solution to every failure is more Islam and to seek true 'Islamic' rulers instead of 'false' imposters.
Proof of this could be searched for in a number of interesting ways. How about looking at the budget(inflation adjusted)for US security needs in Islamic countries over the past 100 years. I would suspect you would see a constant, perhaps rising, rise in the money needed for security. On a more subjective level, would it have been 'safe' for a US tourist to walk down the streets in Karachi? say since 1948? Of course not, but would it have been more safe 30 years ago, or 35, or now? How about the Islamic governments decrees against woman, or the amount of Islamic justification in the Koran in Pakistan? Obviously, it was formed as an Islamic state so Koranic justification would have always been there, but has the degree been constantly increasing?
In Pakistan, most of the Christians and other non-Muslims have fled or been killed, so since they really don't have "Nixons" to kick around anymore, they must turn inward towards the "corrupt" "non-Islamic" natures of their rulers and governments. And the solution is just a word away: Islam.
Posted by: biorabbi at March 31, 2007 2:07 PM
Expect to see the moderate middle-classes in Karachi want asylum - which we in the west should deny (it is their mess). We should also pass laws making it illegal to "import" people via arranged marriage.
at March 31, 2007 2:36 PM
A Talebanised Sunni Pakistan with nukes, and shortly, a Shia Iran with nukes..
Hmmm..
Posted by: DP111 at March 31, 2007 6:15 PM
"It will be barbarism at its zenith -- Islam at its very worst.
And then there's the issue of nuclear weapons...
Posted by: Foehammer"
Foehammer I have been thinking that with islam, left is right, right is wrong. According to muslims, uswa hasana al-insan, al kamil is the perfect man to be emulated in all respects. We the JihadWatchers know that uswa hasana was a rapist, mass murderer (Banu Querazah), and a paedophile (Aisha). So according to muslims, it would be islam at its best, not worst. We Infidels have to make our definitions re. the best and the worst of islam.
P.S. Am not arguing with you, just thinking that what is Right for us infidels is haram for muslims simply because we are Kaffirs and we do not emulate uswa hasana.
Posted by: arjun.sevak at April 1, 2007 4:56 AM
As I have said before, a Fundamentalist, Al Qaeda supporting Pakistan with ready made nuclear weapons means just one thing. An almost unthinkable thing. For the third and who knows how many times after, the West will have to use nuclear weapons.
It is somewhat Ironic that Oppenheimer after watching the Trinity test bomb, quoted from a Hindu script, "Now I am become death, destroyer of worlds". The Pakistanis detest their Hindu neighbours, they developed their nukes primarily for use against India.
We certainly don't want the hordes of "refugees" who will want to come here. Let other Islamic nations take them.
At the first news that Pakistan had developed a Nuclear weapon, I told all my mates that one day we would end up having to destroy it (and a lot of them along with it). Some believed me, some did not. They all do now.
But destroy it we must at all costs rather than allow the free gift of usable nukes, with delivery systems to Jihadis.
I would hazard a guess that when the situation in Pakistan destabilises there will be an invisible stealth bomber or two in a holding pattern near the Pakistani missile bases. Flash, bang, Bye Bye.
Posted by: Defender of The Realm at April 1, 2007 6:31 AM
Pakistan is goind to be the epicentre of a new world war (in fact, the world war has already begun, but still not fully out in the open) between Islam and the rest of the world. As for its Talibanisation, it is natural, play with edged tools and you cut your hand one day.
Pakistan should be treated as the shit hole of the world, and should be "cleaned" just as one cleans the sewage tank of the house.
Posted by: proud-hindu at April 2, 2007 10:09 AM
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