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A mosque leader in the Pakistani capital Friday threatened interior spiritual struggle against the government of President Pervez Musharraf.
An update on this story. "Muslim Cleric Threatens To Resist Government Action With Jihad," from Deutsche Presse Agentur, with thanks to the Constantinopolitan Irredentist:
A mosque leader in the Pakistani capital Friday threatened jihad and suicide attacks if the government of President Pervez Musharraf used force against the militant students of the madrassas, or Islamic schools, located in his Lal Masjid compound."We don't want a clash. But if a crackdown is the last option for the government, our last option will be to lay down our lives in resisting it to establish Sharia rule in the country," declared Maulana Abdul Aziz in his Friday sermon.
Aziz gave the government one month to eliminate purveyors of what he considers immorality, like music and video shops keepers and prostitutes, or else seminary students would take the task upon themselves and take the alleged evil doers to an Islamic court established by the clerics.
Dinesh D'Souza, call your office. Is Aziz a "traditional Muslim" according to your definition of one? If so, would you recommend that American conservatives ally with him in his jihad against Western immorality, i.e. music and video shops?
Riot police stood close to the mosque but did not obstruct the congregation.Male and females students of the two seminaries have been on the warpath since they occupied a public library adjacent to the Lal Masjid on January 21 to force the government to take back its decision to demolish mosques built illegally on state land in Islamabad.
Emboldened by their success, the Islamic militants in subsequent weeks seized three women alleging that they were running a brothel and took two policemen hostage to secure the release of the vigilantes arrested for the acts.
President Musharraf and government officials have fumed and fretted but not acted against the militants entrenched in Lal Masjid, arguing that use of force against madrassa girls would not be taken well by the Muslim nation.
Civil society organisations, however, staged a protest in Islamabad on Thursday against the rising Islamic militancy and an Islamic scholar, Javed Ahmed Ghamdi, denounced the latest actions of the Lal Masjid as un-Islamic.
Javed Ahmed Ghamdi is the favored cleric of a highly disingenuous Islamic apologist with whom I had a few discussions in the past. Ghamdi's interpretations of Islam are not traditional, and he has been criticized by other Muslim clerics for advocating positions that constitute bid'a, or innovation. As I have pointed out many times, this is what always happens to Islamic reformers: they run afoul of criticism by hardliners, who use the Qur'an, Sunnah, and Islamic jurisprudence to try to convince Muslims that the reformers' version of Islam is inauthentic. I am glad that someone like Ghamdi has influence in Pakistan, but those who assume that he represents mainstream or traditional Islam are sadly mistaken.
Posted by Robert at April 6, 2007 9:03 AM
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"President Musharraf and government officials have fumed and fretted but not acted against the militants entrenched in Lal Masjid,"
....if Mushy afraid the Muslims will attack?.....fool, they have been attacking for a long time....continued non action ensures continued action by the murdering Muslims...
......Hey Mushy...the only way to get rid of cockroaches in your palace it to kill them....
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at April 6, 2007 9:36 AM
Muslims have realized their threats result in action....and the threats made by the rest of the world are but smoke in the wind...
Posted by: exsgtbrown at April 6, 2007 9:40 AM
Sounds like Guardian Angels Islam style. Somebody call Curtis Sliwa.
Posted by: TheOmegaMan at April 6, 2007 9:41 AM
The Pak government is behind closed doors going to cave right in. The vast majority of their gov't and the ISI no doubt agree with him. To properly deal with Pakis, some of the wrtings I made last time might be useful as opposed to expecting the Pakis to take this seriously:
-The interesting thing is, if India and Pakistan would ever just agree to let all the states in India, including kashmir, and all the provinces in pakistan, choose for themselves which country they want to be a part of, India would end up with all its original land plus well over half of pakistan's land. Balochistan, Pak-held kashmir and Sindh would all end up with India.
Granted, it would mean India would end up with new muslim states in the form of balochistan, sindh and PoK, but these are by and large muslims only in the most liberal and nominal sense, and largely pro-indian and pro-american in nature. India would be able to immediately go about de-islamisizing these peoples and making them once again prosperous states, safe for religous minorities, (a prime case being the 1.5 million hindu sindhis still in pakiland and the exiled hindu sindhis). Especially since decades of persecution and massacres have convinced these peoples the idea of "muslim brothers" united as one is just bulls***, a smokescreen used by muslims of a dominant group, i.e. arabs and arabized people like Pak "punjabs" to torture, steal from and kill subjected muslims at will. All while trying to unite them against kuffars to distract them from the problems they cause.
Well, for starters, encouraging them to emphasize their own culture as opposed to the islamic one. Remember, as people who've left islam entirely, like Ibn Warraq and Anwar Shaikh confirm, one reason why muslims are now leaving islam at such high rates is that it does not encourage any respect for cultures and heritages unrelated to islam. That's why Iranians, Turks, Indian Muslims, Malaysian Muslims, and Algerian Amazigh among others are often keen to leave islam entirely in large groups at a time. Moreover, as Hugh has also noted, in Darfur, if Christian Missionaries were properly encouraged there, the amount of converts from islam would be huge. As it is, I've heard a prominent islamic leader, (I forget the exact source), note with fear how several million muslims leave Africa per year, and many of them are probably black muslims in Sudan, Chad, Niger and elsewhere who've had to tolerate mistreatment and all sorts of crap from Islamic Arabists quick to pronounce takfir on them.
Hence, the point about Pakistan is , as Indians I've talked about it to confirm, that for the Sindis, Baloch and peoples of PAK-held Kashmir, they have a stronger loyalty to their cultural heritage that is stronger than whatever loyalty they have to islam. Among the Baloch, for example, there are a great many people who though identified as muslims are basically atheist or agonistic. And the borderline genocidal treatment of them by Islamist Pakis has only made their loyalty to their culture over the islamic umma stronger. Peoples like the Baloch, Sindhis and Pak-held kashmiris indeed have appeared to figure out that Islam, or at least, miltant, politicized islam, itself is respnsible for their mistreatment, that Paki "Punjabs" are about as purely and hideously muslim as you can get. Hence, India and America should be looking at these provinces exactly like they should Darfur and Southern Sudan. -
Of course, this is just a start; India much like lmost every non-muslim state, save few excetpions like Ethiopia, China, Kenya and Burma, has to start treating jihad expansionist the way they deserve to be treated. Clearly it is not going to be realistic to expect India or most non-muslim states to ever take such measures as deporting muslim citizens, denying them voting or other basic rights or banning any more muslims from ever coming it. But outlawing madrasssas, any mosques receiving any funding from the middle east and shutting down and declaring as hate speech Al-Jazeerah and all other Arabist networks is, I'd hope, a reasonable start. This of course holds true for both India's current land and any future territory India would ever get from Pakis.
Posted by: maxwell46&2 at April 6, 2007 9:41 AM
I thought Jihad was an inner stuggle. Thats what the apologists say
Posted by: Elric66 at April 6, 2007 9:43 AM
"A mosque leader in the Pakistani capital Friday threatened interior spiritual struggle against the government of President Pervez Musharraf."
Internal, inward, inner spiritual struggle?
There is a coup in Pakistan's future. It will not be pretty. I expect Musharraf to be put on trial as an apostate.
A nuclear armed Islamic fundamentalist country is scary. I presume the nuclear weapons will help in their personal spiritual jihad.
Posted by: Pelayo at April 6, 2007 9:46 AM
I hope our Special Forces are still well-practiced in grabbing nuclear weapons facilities in Pakistan. It's starting to look more and more like Musharraf isn't going to hold things together for too many more years.
Posted by: Foehammer at April 6, 2007 9:46 AM
" Christian Missionaries were properly encouraged there, the amount of converts from islam would be huge"
Islam keeps its followers in line at the point of the gun and the edge of the sword....
Posted by: exsgtbrown at April 6, 2007 9:52 AM
One 4-part solution:
A) Load GPS coordinates of 'cleric'.
B) Predator Drone sent airborne.
C) Hellfire missile launched.
D) Smudge.
Posted by: profitsbeard at April 6, 2007 10:34 AM
profitsbeard you sure know how to give sharia a bad name, heck the pakis just love their sharia..
but l prefer your way, send the pakis faster to their allah moon god.
at April 6, 2007 10:59 AM
Assalamau Laikum all,
Well this is certainly an interesting cross-road for Pak. Clearly the Pak government is hoping that this will go away quietly.
We Ahmadis have been viewing this with quiet satisifaction. At leat SOME of the sunni know how the Ahmdai feel about excluding them out of Islam.
The longer this stays a stalemate...the stronger the Madrasses peoples get. The way I see it:
If the government acts ...then many peoples will die...but also the fundamental nature of the madrasses will also have to change...and may result in internal strife which could spread across Pak judging by 16,000 -20,000 madrasses ...with new ones springing up every day.
If on the other hand Mushi is considering Maulvi's proposals seriously...then one month is not long enough to carry out the proposals....he should ask for more time ...and detail the changes more extensively for a model muslim society...for as they say "Rome was not built in a day".
Posted by: Naseem at April 6, 2007 11:50 AM
These are acts of sedition, anarchy, terrorism and war. All of which are illegal and all of which the Pak Intel can make go away quietly.
Posted by: Lame Cherry at April 6, 2007 11:57 AM
"If the government acts ...then many peoples will die"
...If the government does not act...many people will die....
Posted by: exsgtbrown at April 6, 2007 12:34 PM
When do we EVER hear of something positive involving moslems?
Posted by: Allahfanculo at April 6, 2007 1:27 PM
derka, derka, muhammad jihad, sherpa, sherpa balackava.
at April 6, 2007 2:27 PM
go,go,go,go,go,go,go,go,i'm rootin for the home team,go,go.go.go.
Posted by: OLD SARGE at April 6, 2007 9:15 PM
allahfanculo-
I came across something positive said by a Muslim.
Their historian al-Tabiri noted that his own "prophet" admitted:
"I have imputed sayings to Allah that He never said."
(Later known as the 'satanic' suras, or verses.)
An admitted liar and deceiver.
Their "prophet".
Positively.
Posted by: profitsbeard at April 7, 2007 1:33 AM
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