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Hmm. Let's see. They had video of men firing rifles while calling for jihad and shouting "Allahu akbar." They had video of Osama bin Laden and others who couch all their actions in the language of Islamic jihad. One of them said, "I'm doing it in the name of Allah." They were "looking to obtain heavy weaponry."
It was all because the informant pressured them, you see. Yep. Looks like entrapment to me. I'd have done exactly the same things in their situation. Wouldn't you have? If someone came up to me and railed against the United States, helped scout out military installations for attack, offered to introduce me to an arms dealer, and gave me a list of weapons I could procure, including machine guns and rocket-propelled grenades, I'd be waging Islamic jihad in a heartbeat, wouldn't you?
It's hard to believe anyone could take such a scenario seriously, but here it is being seriously offered.
By Geoff Mulvihill for Associated Press, with thanks to Gary:
CHERRY HILL, N.J. — He railed against the United States, helped scout out military installations for attack, offered to introduce his comrades to an arms dealer, and gave them a list of weapons he could procure, including machine guns and rocket-propelled grenades.These were not the actions of a terrorist, but of a paid FBI informant who helped bring down an alleged plot by six Muslim men to massacre U.S. soldiers at New Jersey's Fort Dix.
Those actions have raised questions of whether the government crossed the line and pushed the six men down a path they would not have otherwise followed.
It is an argument — entrapment — that has been made in other terrorism cases, and one that has failed miserably in this post-Sept. 11 era.
One defense attorney on the case, Troy Archie, said that no decision has been made on whether to argue entrapment, but that based on the FBI's own account, "the guys sort of led them on."
Rocco Cipparone, a lawyer for another one of the defendants, said he will take a hard look at "the role of paid informants and how aggressive they were in potentially prodding or moving things along."...
"I never in my wildest dreams imagined what they've been accused of," said Ismail Badat, trustee of the Islamic Center of South Jersey in Palmyra, where the Duka brothers worshipped....
Vincent Henry, director of the Homeland Security Management Institute at Long Island University and a 21-year veteran of the New York Police Department, said he is convinced that the Fort Dix defendants really were capable of pulling off such an attack.
"I'm sure they were," he said. "The arrests were made as they were on their way to purchase the weapons, or at least some of the weapons. They had seemed to plan it out very, very well."
Posted by Robert at May 11, 2007 6:06 AM
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OUTRAGEOUS!!!!!!
If I want to kill someone, and do not hide it - guilty is undercover agent who provided me with the gun!?!?!?!?!?!
I think that main problem here are the people who are too deep now in helping Kosovo Albanians in their cause to leave the sinking ship.
But they aren't doing it for pleasure, or even for the money anymore. Now, I think that they are afraid for their bare lives. Ceku, Taci, Haradinaj, and others Albanian jihadist mongers who invested heavily in US politics and media won't come for refund. They do not operate that way, and US Dhimmis know that.
Posted by: WallsofByzant![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/nav-commenters.gif)
at May 11, 2007 6:33 AM
If these muslims were planning to attack a military installation doesn't that at least leave openthe possibility that they were engaged in espionage and sabotage?
I would prefer that they be designated enemy soldiers and be sent to Gitmo and that the remaining family members be deported. And the muslim community which supported them should be removed to a detention facility, processed, and deported.
at May 11, 2007 7:12 AM
Lawyers for Fort Dix 6 cite entrapment
l would have to agree with the lawyers on the "entrapment" not from the FBI, but the "koran". the cult of islam entraps and warps the mind and it becomes a killing machine when taken in it truest form.
Posted by: ZenaWarriorPrincess at May 11, 2007 8:20 AM
Agree with Walls of Byzant- powerful U.S politicians such as Holbrooke,Lantos & others are
up to their necks in Albanian shit-receiving money from these grateful Kosovars for 'political campaigns.'Doesn't seem to worry
these guys WHERE money came from-drug smuggling,people smuggling,enforced prostitution-all going through Kosovo.
Reckon if Kosovar Lads have to wait or are denied
Kosovo-they will vent their fury upon everything
American in sight.THEN THE SHITE WILL REALLY HIT THE FAN!
at May 11, 2007 8:34 AM
By definition, treason is an act against ones own government/country.
By those who were here illegally, does that put them as treasonous, or make them terrorists? Does it make a difference, or is it just semantics?
Either way, I think the death sentance would be an appropriate punishment.
Leave it to some misguided lawyer or ACLU to cry "Entrapment". Some of their causes make me sick. They don't see what we're up against.
Posted by: tkl at May 11, 2007 8:37 AM
ZenaWarriorPrincess
Agree totally with you.
But seeing that the reference is to the worlds number 1 murder manual (koran) wouldn't it be more aptly be termed enCRAPment.
at May 11, 2007 8:39 AM
Muslims continue to drive a wedge between Islam and the real world....
Posted by: exsgtbrown at May 11, 2007 9:12 AM
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/nation/4793890.html
05/10/2007
Informants scrutinized in Fort Dix case
Attorney Henry Klingeman unsuccessfully argued that government agents had entrapped London merchant Hemant Lakhani, convicted in New Jersey in 2005. Lakhani was caught in a sting trying to arrange the sale of at least 50 shoulder-fired missiles for shooting down American airliners. He is serving a 47-year prison sentence.
GREAT STORY READ THE WHOLE THING!!
http://www.marklevinshow.com/
ANOTHER GREAT SIGHT TO IPOD OR STREAM!!!
at May 11, 2007 9:14 AM
As much as I dislike "COINTELPRO" entrapment operations - I have to ask the question:
If some guy came to my house and offered me plans and guns to go and shoot some Americans - would I go if I was encouraged to do so?
The answer is NO
As my mum would to say to me as a child - when I used the excuse that "the other boys told me to do it" - she would say - "would you put your head in the gas oven if the "other boys" told you to do it?"
What did I learn from my mum? a sense of responsibility for my own actions with no excuses ..
Posted by: drk at May 11, 2007 9:23 AM
Lawyers will be the death of this nation.
I know many lawyers and mix with them socially at charity dinners, sit with them at table on cruises and have more than enough in my neighborhood.
There are not many I like or trust. I have a good friend who is an identical twin. He works for a living and his own company in the construction trades. His brother is a lawyer. When I first met my friend I couldn't tell him and his brother apart physically... but there's a world of difference when you talk to each of them. I don't like the lawyer brother, but consider the tradesman brother one of the best people I know.
There's a lesson in there somewhere.
Lawyers weaken the nation. Many politicians are lawyers and I think it matters.
I have sworn on the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man. Thomas Jefferson
at May 11, 2007 10:09 AM
Zena Warrior Princess - kudos to your entrapment post. You're right on the money.
Posted by: A_Plague_on_Both_Houses at May 11, 2007 10:10 AM
Offhand these would be Jihadis seem to be morons. That's what the awful Keith Olbermann called them as he denigrated the FBI's hard work. But it does seem to me they were spurred onward by the government informant. But we shall see.
In one of the Osama Bin Laden books I read, he comes right out and says one third of all foreign Muslims who flocked to Afghanistan training camps were idiots adrift in life...AKA losers
These three illegal alien Albanian Muslim brothers had 53 traffic tickets between them. Stupid stupid stupid and probably drugs and drink. A friend had a place in the Hamptons (Long Island, NY) he rented to an Albanian family. Before he knew it there where 14 Albanians living there. They were shiftless like gypsies. Happened seven years ago
Posted by: dennisw at May 11, 2007 10:36 AM
The bottom line of all of this is WHAT the hell are all these Albanians and Turks and Jordanians and SOWdi BArbarians doing in our Western countries?
What do we need them for?
What?
Posted by: Allahfanculo at May 11, 2007 11:00 AM
"The Kelbeh set me up!" -'Elvis' Duka
Posted by: kafir_kelbeh at May 11, 2007 11:46 AM
Freedom: "But seeing that the reference is to the worlds number 1 murder manual (koran) wouldn't it be more aptly be termed enCRAPment."
Now, let's just hope they keep stepping in it.
Posted by: kafir_kelbeh at May 11, 2007 12:04 PM
Entrapment?
Were they or their families threatened in any way if they refused to go along?
Did they think they were just making a movie?
This American's response to the Fort Dix Six:
YOU COULD HAVE SAID NO!
Posted by: PMK at May 11, 2007 12:16 PM
dennisw: "Offhand these would be Jihadis seem to be morons. That's what the awful Keith Olbermann called them as he denigrated the FBI's hard work."
Does that make Oldermann a Dhimmimoron?
Posted by: kafir_kelbeh at May 11, 2007 12:39 PM
dennisw - Do you by any chance have the source for that line in Osama Bin Laden book?
"one third of all foreign Muslims who flocked to Afghanistan training camps were idiots adrift in life"
Thanks
Posted by: pvb at May 11, 2007 12:48 PM
The bottom line of all of this is WHAT the hell are all these Albanians and Turks and Jordanians and SOWdi BArbarians doing in our Western countries?
What do we need them for?
What?
Posted by: Allahfanculo
Let's see now....
1. to add to our diversity?
2. to make us stronger?
3. to make up for all the harm (?) we did to them and their countries by defending ourselves?
4. (the best) to do the jobs Americans won't do!
It's almost like having to commit suicide just to prove you're not afraid to die.
Posted by: PMK at May 11, 2007 12:49 PM
drk:
"What did I learn from my mum? a sense of responsibility for my own actions with no excuses .."
I agree 100% but the problem in America is NOBODY is taught responsibility for their own actions anymore and I suspect Europe is the same it is always the fault of somebody else,IE: Govt, parents, colonialism etc etc etc... its a free ticket for SOME not all (some of us cant use these excuses)to do what our dark and carnal nature would push us to do.
As far as the lawyers who will represent these scum can they realy sleep at night knowing they are representing and lying for our enemies.(rhetorical I know they can)These are the same people who build enough wealth through their corrupt nature to enter politics and represent us!So when I hear people say we need to elect people who will get the job done I want to laugh and cry because they dont exist.Yes there are a few who kinda get it but none with any potential to lead us REALY get it
at May 11, 2007 12:51 PM
The ones who are not U.S. citizens should be given the same rapid justice meted out to the Nazi saboteurs who sneaked ashore during WWII. IF any are here legally, they need to be tried for trreason. Any family members here illegally need to be arrested today.
Posted by: MP at May 11, 2007 1:01 PM
If 'entrapment' is what it takes to stop the jihadists from committing mass homicide, by all means ENTRAP THEM ALL!
Posted by: pythagoras at May 11, 2007 1:17 PM
I think what you mean to say is this:
"Until these gentlemen are tried in a court of law and found guilty, it's not my place to specualte whether they are guilty or not."
Otherwise you would be like that "traitor" John Murtha who "libeled" our brave Marines at Haditha before all the facts were known.
Thanks.
Posted by: Robert at May 11, 2007 2:29 PM
How is that really the same? Traitors libel/slander those who are in support of the gov't, through actions or words...even when they disagree with said gov't.
Libeling/slandering a bunch of whiners trying to kill us & our freedoms isn't anything more than libel/slander...in fact, their statements many times CAN be construed as treason.
See the dif?
Posted by: kafir_kelbeh at May 11, 2007 3:19 PM
kafir,
Was your response to my post?
If so, I'm not sure I'm following your reasoning.
If not, I apologize for this post.
at May 11, 2007 3:54 PM
It was...
My reasoning is thus:
The target of the slander is given different weight legally...and in the eyes of people during times of war.
I know you're trying to focus on the rights on the individual...got that, all for it.
We're just not able to view things as generously right now...can't afford it from a survival perspective.
Make sense?
Posted by: kafir_kelbeh at May 11, 2007 4:36 PM
in fact, their statements many times CAN be construed as treason.
I mean the whiners' statements, not ours.
Maybe that's what you were asking about...
Posted by: kafir_kelbeh at May 11, 2007 4:37 PM
My concern in all of this is: what is going to happen to the person running the video shop? Seems to me, he is now a target, more than likely by 'moderate' muslims.
Posted by: Gary at May 11, 2007 4:52 PM
pvb
I wish I could renumber which book. It might have been Josef Bodansky's about Bin Laden. http://www.amazon.com/Bin-Laden-Man-Declared-America/dp/0761535810
But more likely it was a book a by a Swiss-French author about Jihadist Islam. Not just about Bin Laden. Cannot remember the author's name but he also slammed Israel in the book which I didn't like. But still a good book over all
Bin Laden definitely was critical of some of the Arab Muslims and others who came to his Afghanistan training camps. He definitely said one third of them were idiots who had failed in other things who went there because they had nothing better to do and it was an adventure. Bin Laden wouldn't kick them out though. He tried to set improve them
Posted by: dennisw at May 11, 2007 7:03 PM
at May 11, 2007 10:52 PM
I don't suppose any of you have considered the fact that these bozos were actually being egged on by the FBI informant to go beyond their limited intent. It's nice to know that our own guys are working to escalate the situation rather than just shut it down - could there be a need for hyped-up "jihadist" activity, perfectly timed to bolster a deeply troubled Bush Admin? Experience shows us that YES, this administration IS capable of such nefarious shenanigans, dangerously used and abused for their own political self-interest.
Posted by: kimberlyrae at May 14, 2007 11:30 AM
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