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The two images above were taken from this video (thanks to Sparta). At 53 seconds in, the President's watch is still visible on his wrist. At 1:04, it is gone.
It's emblematic of the whole thing, really.
Claude Salhani notes in the Washington Times:
Both the Albanians of Albania as well as the ethnic Albanians of Kosovo realize the United States holds the key to Kosovo's independence from Serbia, much more than Brussels or Moscow.
Indeed. And what will an independent Kosovo be like? Well, from all appearances it will be an Islamic state and a new base for jihad activity in Europe and elsewhere. Yet the President has said that "Kosovo is independent."
Would the man who said "You're either with the terrorists or with us" really abet the creation of such an entity? Check your watch, Mr. President.
UPDATE: The White House says Bush has the watch. From the video above I find this difficult to believe, but the President has surprised us before.
Posted by Robert at June 12, 2007 7:15 AM
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"Let's Rolex!"
Posted by: Shy Guy![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/nav-commenters.gif)
at June 12, 2007 7:45 AM
God, I wish I'd said that.
Posted by: Hugh at June 12, 2007 8:05 AM
...time is a fleeting thing...
Posted by: exsgtbrown at June 12, 2007 8:06 AM
thank you mr. bush for supporting albanian extremism and terror.
My house in athens, greece has been robbed from albanians and they stole my car. a neighboor is handicap and they stole his special made car. I know people abused from albanian immigrants in greece. they are the worst scums inthe world..
furthermore..what about the greek minority in south albania? if they want an independent kossovo, then give us south albanian and give bosnia to serbs.
we had enough with USA, time to turn our backs to usa and support Puti's crusade in the Balkans.
Posted by: chris at June 12, 2007 8:11 AM
Albanian beggars and thieves are well known on the streets and Underground in London. One of the more despicable elements crowding in to UK as a result of the British Labour Parties failed immigration policy.
Posted by: Realist at June 12, 2007 8:25 AM
I remember Bush's bold, rallying speeches after 9/11, a man with a mission.
Now, it appears Bush has a bad case of Amnesia.
Posted by: sounder at June 12, 2007 8:47 AM
Keep it up George. Jimmy Carter wants to be replaced as the worst president in history and it's looking like you are just the man to do it.
Posted by: Sheik er' Bouti at June 12, 2007 8:49 AM
Oh boy , Sheik er' Bouti , did that have me laughing or what.
Posted by: ewha1 at June 12, 2007 8:51 AM
As a solid Republican I think these past couple weeks have finally turned me decidedly against Bush. I will spare all the childish attacks on him like those from the clueless left and its elitist liberals, however with this Kosovo independence speech I think it’s the last straw for me.
Bush is single-handedly destroying the Republican party. From the mishandling of Iraq and the selling out of the Chaldeans and other Christians in Iraq to Harriet Miers to the immigration bill and Kosovo "independence", I think I have had enough.
However as bad as it is, the answer isn’t a Democrat… Let's hope the senate can stand up to him enough until the election and hopefully a republican gets elected. Thats if Bush hasn't damaged the party beyond all return for this election cycle....
I am liking more and more what I hear from Mit Romney.
at June 12, 2007 9:01 AM
Wonder if that watch had a little microchip in it so that it can be tracked? How much information can one fit onto the most minute of microchips these days?
Or, was his security detail really not paying attention?
Posted by: BurkasforHitlery at June 12, 2007 9:16 AM
"Would the man who said "You're either with the terrorists or with us" really abet the creation of such an entity?"
One wouldn't have thought so on 9/12/01 but now it seems obvious. This is the same man who said Islam is a religion of peace. This is the same man who walked hand in hand with the Saudi king, leader of a nation that is a prime financial and ideological sponsor of jihad all over the world.
In his defense, I would say that the Europeans and many Americans have not made fighting terrorism any easier and so it's almost understandable that Bush would resign the game.
Just look at the New York Times and its revelation of the bank transactions, the listening in on conversations of an international nature, etc.
Look at the senators who are determined to throw our borders open to anyone and everyone.
Why should Bush care what happens? No one else does. The people certainly don't or they would have thrown out every elected official who put a stop on all efforts to combat jihad. They would have thrown out every senator who voted for the immigration bill last year and was on the ballot in November. They didn't. They don't care and they think Bush is a bully for caring. They rant and rave about how we're there for the oil.
The world community won't take a stand. How many countries are doing business with Iran? Why should the US take the burden on single-handed? We are not the country we were in 1945. We don't have the financial and political muscle we once had and that is not all bad. It is a reflection of the success of our efforts to rebuild Europe and the result of winning the cold war. Now the people who wanted the power need to take the responsibility. That starts with the EU.
Posted by: PMK at June 12, 2007 9:26 AM
But...Does anyone really know what time it is?
To hell with the watch--I wonder if George has one of those tracking chips?
Posted by: Abscedere at June 12, 2007 9:27 AM
Gee , that's a toughie , burkasforhitlery , what do you think ?
Either , Bush is a complete imbecile and his entourage are no better
OR
it's all part of a cunning plan whereby Bush inadvertently drops his watch so that a seniour member of "Splerch International" picks it up so leading Bush and his daughters - who are in scuba diving gear - into Splerch number one's lair -
inside a huge hollow volcano with a subway system no less
In savage man-to-man fighting , Bush and his two daughters manage to obtain the formula that will save the world from Mr Splerch and his bikini clad autowomen - who speak English with a Slavic accent -
HUURRAH
Okay , so which is the most probable?
Bush the hero or Bush the dumb f*ck?
at June 12, 2007 9:36 AM
I guessing he needs Mexican immigrant to protect him since they will do jobs Americans wont do.
Posted by: KAOSKTRL at June 12, 2007 9:43 AM
On a more serious note, how can the President of the USA so blatantly advocate an illegal change of international borders?!
I know why he does it though, he's trying to give a nice "gift" to the Muslim world to gain their favor. Of course the gift is not his to give.
at June 12, 2007 9:44 AM
"Wonder if that watch had a little microchip in it so that it can be tracked?"
-- from a posting above
An excellent idea. Little Lo-Jacks for everything under the sun. No doubt already in the works, to be fully commercialized within five years. Keys, glasses, cellphone to start with, and then every damn thing you possess.
Let us hope, however, that it does not extend to mandatory implants in all of us so that our every movement may be tracked. Let's still pretend that we humans deserve a right or two we deny the inanimate.
Posted by: Hugh at June 12, 2007 9:52 AM
EU Resumes Jiziyah Payments to ‘Palestinians’
http://sheikyermami.com/2007/06/12/eu-resumes-jiziyah-payments-to-palestinians/
Posted by: sheik yer'mami at June 12, 2007 9:52 AM
ewha1, you're certainly prone to fits of wild speculation. Perhaps, you believe everything you hear,see or read should be taken at face value, as the definitive truth.
If you would ridicule Islam as fervently as some of the others on this board, I might be inclined to think that you are not a coward, hiding behind a keyboard.
We can all relax while the Chicoms, Hugo, Castro and Putin make a grab for most of the available oil on the planet because you are here taking your stand against Dubya and my free speech.
at June 12, 2007 10:05 AM
The microchips have already been tried out on common everyday items such as foodstuffs and personal grooming products.
Why not put these chips in the weapons being given to Al Qaeda? Planes for the Saudis?
Soon, they'll be in identifying cards such as drivers' licenses.
Capturing and releasing terrorist or those suspected to have terrorist connections will yield information about locations and networks.
Posted by: BurkasforHitlery at June 12, 2007 10:10 AM
The microchips have already been tried out on common everyday items such as foodstuffs and personal grooming products.
Why not put these chips in the weapons being given to Al Qaeda? Planes for the Saudis?
Soon, they'll be in identifying cards such as drivers' licenses.
Capturing and releasing terrorist or those suspected to have terrorist connections will yield information about locations and networks.
Posted by: BurkasforHitlery at June 12, 2007 10:11 AM
Never wear a watch with a pin-through-hole band around thieves.
Guess his handlers never told him about little security items like this.
Or he forgot that he is considered a useful idiot/clown by the cynical Albanians.
(An awful lot of further citizens were also grabbing GWB's wrists... is that something cultural, or are there just that many practicing thieves?)
Posted by: profitsbeard at June 12, 2007 10:12 AM
What time is it? Time for some new blood in the white house. I wonder if the pres will notice when they take his head, naw probably not. This has become embarrassing, everyday I get up and ask myself, what has he done today.
Posted by: tgusa at June 12, 2007 10:29 AM
I was watching his visit to Albania on TV. Oh my God what a circus that was. One amazing political theatre, a contest where albanians were competing who loves Bush more. And stupid American administration gave another slap to all other countries in the region with this visit. It is clear provocation to Belgrade and Athens, as well as Montenegro and Macedonia. I believe that this time State Department and Bush just went to far linking themselfs to albanian terrorists and their jihad agenda in Europe.
And his watch.... well he should be lucky bastard, cos it was just his watch and not his lady Laura for example. I hear Albanians like to trade humans too.
at June 12, 2007 10:54 AM
I was watching his visit to Albania on TV. Oh my God what a circus that was. One amazing political theatre, a contest where albanians were competing who loves Bush more. And stupid American administration gave another slap to all other countries in the region with this visit. It is clear provocation to Belgrade and Athens, as well as Montenegro and Macedonia. I believe that this time State Department and Bush just went to far linking themselfs to albanian terrorists and their jihad agenda in Europe.
And his watch.... well he should be lucky bastard, cos it was just his watch and not his lady Laura for example. I hear Albanians like to trade humans too.
at June 12, 2007 10:54 AM
I was watching his visit to Albania on TV. Oh my God what a circus that was. One amazing political theatre, a contest where albanians were competing who loves Bush more. And stupid American administration gave another slap to all other countries in the region with this visit. It is clear provocation to Belgrade and Athens, as well as Montenegro and Macedonia. I believe that this time State Department and Bush just went to far linking themselfs to albanian terrorists and their jihad agenda in Europe.
And his watch.... well he should be lucky bastard, cos it was just his watch and not his lady Laura for example. I hear Albanians like to trade humans too.
at June 12, 2007 10:55 AM
Too funny.....ironic. How is it that the President of the US who has all the details regarding the terrorism coming from the Albanians, their roll in the madrid and london bombings that came from there....the fact that how many 911 hijackers and other Jihadists fought there in the 90s......how the Albanians have treated the christians and their holy sites there.....and the constent terrorism against the serbs there.....how can the President look at all those things in detail, and continue to push for an independent kosovo, a muslim kosovo knowing it's a trojan horse into Europe? Bush can't be that inept can he? His advisers can't be can they? I just don't get it.....but what I do know is that the US, the West will get what we deserve.....and then maybe then when the attack we suffer is bad enough, maybe, just maybe we will change how things are done...end the PC, end the Jizya payments, end the flooding of hostile immigrants and confront the lefts suicidal and Jihad abetting actions and statements. Maybe...
Charles Martel for President in 08 !
Posted by: Sneakyzionistcrusader at June 12, 2007 11:15 AM
Drudge picked it up
Posted by: KAOSKTRL at June 12, 2007 11:39 AM
Just let them wait for independence a few months more and you will see how "pro-american" they are. Putin knows that and Bushy knows that. That's why he said what he said in Tirana, but also knows that he can't deliver. He was just trying to buy some time.
Albanians in Kosovo already started attacks on UN troops and very soon UN will have to strike back...
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 12, 2007 11:45 AM
"But perhaps the leader of the Western world should have exercised a little more caution and followed the standard advice to travellers in the Balkans to keep an eye on their belongings."
From London Times today on Bush watch heist.
I was shocked to read such words of bigotry in the London Times. To say that one should act differently when visiting there is the same as saying that they act differently from us when they come here?
Isn't it bigotry to say you have to take your watch off there because they will steal it? Isn't it the same bigotry to say they can't come here because they just steak welfare, ER, schooling and other benefits and sometimes kill people or make them afraid to walk the streets at night here conspicuously wearing a watch or otherwise acting Western? All it takes is one little watch being stolen, and everyone thinks its a license to break out bigotry. O tempores, O mores.
George Bush Watch Stolen in Overpopulated Albania
at June 12, 2007 11:47 AM
Here you go, Hugh
http://www.verichipcorp.com/
at June 12, 2007 11:51 AM
One might infer from the above comments that not every one has had one implanted yet. They come in Democrat and Republican flavors, but the vendor promises they work identically.
at June 12, 2007 11:57 AM
It would be bigotry if the chips didn't work the same.
Posted by: Old Atlantic at June 12, 2007 12:00 PM
Looking at the Daily Mail footage from Drudge, looks like his ring went as well. As for Voice's suggestion, I would suggest that they take Laura - she's one cretin who makes her husband look smart.
When one is in such countries, one should wear watches with metal bands. Let's rolex indeed! - good one, Shy Guy!
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 12, 2007 12:24 PM
I wonder if they will put it on eBay (lol)
It will be a real buy for some lucky bidder !!!
Posted by: purplemarbles at June 12, 2007 12:34 PM
If this actually happened, it may be the damned funniest thing I've seen this year.
Posted by: The fanatic at June 12, 2007 12:37 PM
That Dhimmi Idiot probably loses his watch every day... remember, he's the guy that can't even ride a freakin' bicycle without his own personal doctor going with him. Can't understand Islam, can't fly in a warplane without a diaper, can't find Bin Laden, can't find WMDs, can't find his credibility, can't ride a Segway, can't remember whether he snorted coke, can't remember where he was when he was supposed to be serving the in Alabam' Guard. The memory of Reagan, the ethics of Nixon, the grace of Ford, all rolled into into one. The only reason he's in office, the reason he was governor, the reason he owned the Rangers, and the only reason he's ever had anything, is due solely to his last name.
fanorollins@yahoo.com
Posted by: kj at June 12, 2007 12:41 PM
We all know Islam wont just go away. You might consider Albania and Kosovo to be the example of moderate Islam's victory over the kind we are currently fighting. This might be the birth place of reform. Most Kosovars reject the more extreme version as well as Albanians. I would wager, if NATO did pull out of Kosovo, you would see an almost criminal rejection of radicals. I don't think they would put up with that crap.
Posted by: smalltalk at June 12, 2007 12:52 PM
I just can't stop laughing. Did they count his teeth after?
Posted by: SerbInfidel at June 12, 2007 12:56 PM
What time is it!!!
Its losing time!
I have to give it to Georgie.....From the time I started upgrading my computer on Thursday and at last finished today he has done so much...
(1) Went "Green" on us
(2) Got a smack down from Putin
(3) Made a visit to Albania to support a "Greater Albania" and lost his watch
(4) Got a stomach bug
Really! Its amazing the damage one man can do in such a short time. I am still catching up so no doubt I have missed more...
Posted by: greatcometof1577 at June 12, 2007 1:34 PM
President Bush; Trust me on immigration people I’m on the ball, heh heh, heh…now, where the hell did my watch and wallet go? Ted? Harry? Linsay? John? Heh heh, heh.
Posted by: tgusa at June 12, 2007 1:43 PM
WHO is advising Bush? Not Robert or Hugh - that's for sure. And it is my understanding from a former supervisor who was of Serbian descent that the reason the Kosovo province was so ethnic Albanian Muslim was because Tito encouraged their immigration to it so as to dilute the Serbs already there for centuries. Kosovo is an artifical thing.
Posted by: HOV Dummy at June 12, 2007 1:47 PM
During WWII our airmen would nurse a burning aircraft to a point over Serbia where they could bail out. The Serbs would help them, treat their wounds, give them food and shelter. They all knew this, they also knew that they should avoid Albania at any cost as the Albanian Nazis would stick a pitchfork in them. Tito on the other hand would only turn them over to the Soviets where they would never be heard from again. The US out of Serbia, why don’t I hear this from the so called peacenicks? We should be sharing our technology and cooperating militarily with the Serbs not giving away their land. There was genocide going on there but as usual with the islamists they were responsible and as usual they blamed the other guys and the world bought it. Shameful or stupid? I think both.
Posted by: tgusa at June 12, 2007 2:01 PM
HOV Dummy,
That's right. During Tito's Yugoslavia communists have done everything to weaken Serbs and Tito encouraged illegal immigration of Albanians to Kosovo. There was a law forbidding Serb refugees to return to Kosovo after WWII. If you can believe this... In that way, Serbs (from being majority 100 years ago) become 10% of Kosovo population. But there are thousands of Serbian Christian churches and monasteries there witnessing the truth and that's why Albanians are destroying them.
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 12, 2007 2:07 PM
Due to the efforts of Major Richard L. Felman and his friends, President Harry S. Truman, on the recommendation of General Dwight D. Eisenhower, posthumously awarded Mihailović the "Legion of Merit", for the rescue of American Airmen by Chetniks. For the first time in history, this high award and the story of the rescue was classified secret by the State Department so as not to offend the communist government of Yugoslavia.
"General Dragoljub Mihailovich distinguished himself in an outstanding manner as Commander-in-Chief of the Yugoslavian Army Forces and later as Minister of War by organizing and leading important resistance forces against the enemy which occupied Yugoslavia, from December 1941 to December 1944. Through the undaunted efforts of his troops, many United States airmen were rescued and returned safely to friendly control. General Mihailovich and his forces, although lacking adequate supplies, and fighting under extreme hardships, contributed materially to the Allied cause, and were instrumental in obtaining a final Allied victory."
March 29, 1948, Harry S. Truman.
Almost sixty years later, on May 9, 2005, Draža Mihailović's daughter Gordana was presented with a decoration bestowed posthumously on Draža Mihailović by President Truman in 1948, for the assistance provided to the crews of US bombers that were gunned down on the territory under Chetnik control in World War II.
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 12, 2007 2:11 PM
Good enough for him.
Too bad the albanians didn't lift mr. bush's wallet and passport -- better luck next time.
Posted by: witness at June 12, 2007 3:08 PM
How difficult is it for him to get a duplicate watch and pretend nothing was stolen? Huh?
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 12, 2007 3:08 PM
The theory was that after the 2006 elections, Bush would be free to do what is right because his elections were over. But he’s just gone off the deep end.
Everything has been sounding more and more crooked to me. The whole religion of peace thing, the Iraq surge, the promise to build 300 miles of fence when his Administration has already signed a bill to build 800 miles.
This watch incident is funny, but it is troubling in that it appears that the Administration is flat our lying to the Country by denying that it happened. He must not have seen this tape. Something is rotten.
Posted by: pez at June 12, 2007 3:45 PM
Oh....I get it...Its a magic trick!
Impressed anyone? Georgie the Magnificent!
He learned it at the Skull and Bones Club at Yale with John Kerry when they kissed the Skull of Geronimo..
at June 12, 2007 4:01 PM
Officials Deny watch was stolen:
Cheers,
http://doctorbulldog.wordpress.com
Posted by: Doctor Bulldog at June 12, 2007 5:12 PM
they got his wedding ring as well!
Posted by: leonthepigfarmer at June 12, 2007 5:12 PM
"No doubt already in the works, to be fully commercialized within five years."
Yeah. Wal-Mart and the U.S. Defense Dept. already mandates the use of RFID tags.(RadioFrequency ID) (these are tiny chips which can be embedded in a product, which emit radio signals -- for tracking purposes. Using a "reader" you can see where an item is.) The BGN (in Paris) already have two "fully automated SmartStores" -- from the manufacurer to the consumer the products are tracked. (Futurists imagine a kitchen which will have built-in "readers" -- so you buy a can of soup with an RFID tag (replacement of the bar code) and the soup can is tracked...and the cupboards will "remind you" when a re-purchase is needed. The difficulty is getting the chips to turn off.) A prof back in 1998 "chipped" himself. And there are nightclubs in Europe which have "chipped" their VIP clients...(like special "pets", I guess). There's an article here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RFID
at June 12, 2007 5:14 PM
Bush is a moron who cares if his stupid watch got stolen or lost from a crowd because of people like Bush Serbs are about to lose there land in kosovo to albanians muslims thieves.
at June 12, 2007 6:04 PM
why is it that you can applaud the actions of the serbs during the balkans war and the kosovo war yet if one were to mention the BNP on this site we are dragged throuigh the coals?
im not agaisnt the serbs but im just puzzled. (sorry to be off topic but its always troubled me.)
Posted by: leonthepigfarmer at June 12, 2007 7:33 PM
sorry for spelling errors.
Posted by: leonthepigfarmer at June 12, 2007 7:34 PM
leonthepigfarmer,
Because the BNP have been labeled racists. Who is doing the labeling I don’t know and since I don’t believe any of what I hear and little of what I see, I don’t care either. I will applaud the BNP until they show me I shouldn’t. So they can go ahead and try to drag me through the coals it wont change nuthin. Too many lies have been told, now I don’t believe anything I hear especially if it comes from the media. Remember, Reagan was an out of control killer according to world media. Idiots.
at June 12, 2007 8:33 PM
More anti-Albanian racism from people who should know better. And more evidence that this website is deviating from its once noble aims of fighting jihadism and is now degenerating into a forum for race hatred. I have been sickened by the ignorant and ill-informed comments made about Albania and Albanians on this forum. The simplistic and partisan analsysis made by many posters (Albanian = bad, Serb = good) is laughable and contemptible.
And in case you don't know yet, a White House spokesman has confirmed on the BBC that George Bush's watch WAS NOT STOLEN. He placed it in his pocket during the walkabout. But this story just plays on the stereotypical image of the Albanian as a thief and a scoundrel propagated by some Greek and Serb extremists. Sickening.
Albania and Albanians support the war on terror, send troops to Iraq and Afghanistan, give George Bush an enthusiastic warm and genuine welcome, and demonstrate that they are with the United States. And this is the thanks they get?
Can you imagine the reception George Bush would have received in neighbouring Greece? He would have been fire-bombed had he tried to walk around the streets of Athens.
at June 12, 2007 9:26 PM
Northumbrian says...
"He placed it in his pocket during the walkabout."
walkabout = nomadic excursions into the bush made by an Aborigine
God this explains so much.....
at June 12, 2007 9:52 PM
l am thankful the President only has two terms in the US!
Posted by: ZenaWarriorPrincess at June 12, 2007 9:58 PM
And according to Merriam-Webster, the third meaning of "walkabout" is:
3 : a walking tour; especially : one in which a well-known person mingles with the public .
So, with respect, what is your point greatcometof1577?
at June 12, 2007 10:00 PM
The Northumbrian
You are right! I like the Aborigine of Australia and should not compare their serious religious duty to my hapless president and his nomadic excursions into Albania....
Please note I am NOT comparing G.W. to the Aborigine people of Australia. That would be wrong and unfair to the HONEST and RESOURCEFUL Aborigine.
Neither of which apply to G.W.
Posted by: greatcometof1577
at June 12, 2007 10:19 PM
Norhtumbrian, give the man his watch. It's not funny any more! Dubyah is your friend!
at June 12, 2007 10:32 PM
greatcometof1577-
I heard he lost his didgeridoo, too.
Posted by: profitsbeard at June 12, 2007 10:33 PM
In fact the Aborigine way of life is proof that a society can stay static for thousands of years and still be superior to one that was invented many years after like the one that appeared in the 7th century Arabia.
Newer does not always mean better...
If only muslims went on Walkabouts and Dreamtime instead of Jihads and Paradise...
Oh what a better world we would be in...
Lets test the theory...
Aborigine Faith
(1) Walkabout = nomadic excursions into the bush
(2) Dreamtime = the time of creation in the mythology of the Australian aborigines (also where ancestors live depending on def.)
Islamic Faith
(1) Jihad = a holy war waged on behalf of Islam as a religious duty
(2) Paradise = XXX
at June 12, 2007 10:38 PM
Greatcometof1577, but George Bush is the President of an honest and resourceful nation: the United States. He was also visiting an honest and resourceful nation: Albania. A nation that is a friend of the United States and the Free World in the global struggle against the scourge of Islamic extremism.
Lord Byron, another famous visitor to the land of the Eagles, never forgot the hospitality and warmth of the Albanian people; and neither will George Bush.
"Land of Albania! where Iskander rose;
Theme of the young, and beacon of the wise..."
at June 12, 2007 10:40 PM
Can you imagine the reception George Bush would have received in neighbouring Greece? He would have been fire-bombed had he tried to walk around the streets of Athens. Posted by: The NorthumbrianAnd he would have richly deserved it too for the following reasons:
After not reversing the Clinton policy of supporting Kosovo's seccession from Serbia, what else did you expect? But remember one thing - the loyalty of Mohammedans can be rented, but never earned!
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 12, 2007 10:46 PM
They take his watch...
And this is jihad???
Something doesn't add up here.
Posted by: ThinkForYourself at June 12, 2007 10:50 PM
profitsbeard
;)
Naaa...
I feel bad that I have somehow hurt the feelings of some poor Aborigine who might be worried about Jihad too and wonder on this site. After all they will suffer too:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/016875.php#comments
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/016868.php#comments
So to any Aborigine I am sorry....
I should not have compared you or your faith to G.W......shame.....it was offensive and for that I am sorry.
Posted by: greatcometof1577 at June 12, 2007 10:51 PM
Hey everybody it's on ebay! I won't put the link up becuase that would be against Jihadwatch rules I think (???). Just enter Bush and Watch into the search engine on ebay. No it is not me and I did not list it...hey but check it out he does live in Australia hahahahahahahaha. God it must mean something! I need to go get a lotto ticket.
:)
at June 12, 2007 11:02 PM
Infidel Pride, I think you are confused about many things.
Kosovo is not seeking secession from Albania, but from rump Yugoslavia. And if you know anything about the recent history of Albania, you will know that Albania has never ever sought to unite with Kosovo. Even under the nationalistic/Stalinist regime of Enver Hoxha, union with Kosovo was never an issue.
You should also try to see that the current Serb-Albanian problem is not a fight between "Mohammedans" and "infidels". It should be seen in nationalistic terms rather than religious ones.
The national hero of Albania is Skanderberg, a man who led Albania to a brief but heroic revolt against the Ottoman yoke. And as you know, the Ottoman Empire was the last great Islamic superstate. Albanians revere a man who struggled to free them from an Islamic superstate. They have no wish ever to be part of another one. Since the ninteenth century, an oft-repeated slogan has been that the national religion of Albania is Albanianism [not Islam].
Mother Theresa was Albanian.
at June 12, 2007 11:14 PM
(From the previous "Albanian" thread, which for some reason I'm being prevented from posting on).
WallsofByzant, you childish clown, get back to doing your homework and mummy might let you stay up a bit later tonight.
ewha1, I see that you suffer from tourette's syndrome; you have my sympathies.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 12, 2007 11:37 PM
Northumbrian
I mis-typed - I meant to write 'Supporting Kosovo's seccession from Serbia'. Also, whether or not Kosovo wants to unite with Albania once it gets rid of Serbia is a side issue (at least to the Serbs), just as Kashmir uniting with Pakistan or becoming a new independent Islamic state would be irrelevant to Indians.
When you say that an issue is 'nationalistic', that consists of 3 things: language, culture and yes, religion. As these Eastern European countries have thrown off Communism, they are re-discovering their pre-Communist religious roots, and one sees the Eastern Orthodox Church making comebacks in Russia, Serbia, Bulgaria and a host of other countries, while the Catholic church is making its comeback in Poland, Hungary, Slovenia, Croatia, Lithuania, et al. A country returning to its cultural roots after throwing off Communism is a good thing, not bad. However, when Islam is a component of that cultural identity, as it is with Albanians and Bosnian Muslims, it becomes problematic. As a result, I believe that your attacks on posters here for being pro-Serb and anti-Albanian are uncalled for, when they are giving vent to their concerns about the strengthening of Islamic forces in Europe. Ft Dix should be a good illustration as to why.
Also, when Yugoslavia started unraveling in 1992, I used to be anti-Belgrade, and by extension, anti-Serb. I supported the secession of Slovenia and then, when Croatia went to war against Serbia, I supported Croatia, ignoring their WWII record in supporting the Nazis. Since the conflicts looked like Serbs vs everybody else, I supported everybody else on the theory that everybody else can't be wrong. So when the Bosnian war broke out, I did something uncharacteristic of myself, and supported the Muslims.
Once the Bosnian war ended, I watched to see what happened with Macedonia and Montenegro, the two remaining countries in Yugoslavia. But although I was opposed to Serbia and supported the complete disintegration of Yugoslavia, I drew the line on violating Serbia's territorial integrity. Since Clinton's war against Serbia was nothing other than a wag the dog operation, I opposed the US bombbbings (to quote Milosevic) and supported Serbia this time. And when Macedonia and Montenegro broke away, I expected to see the Serbs again going to war against them.
Well, one can then imagine my surprise when I saw that unrest did begin in Macedonia and Montenegro, but not with whom I expected. I expected the Serbs, with their legendary death squads, to crack down on these 2 breakaway republics. Imagine my surprise when the insurgents then happened to be not Serbs, but Albanians. Also, the revelation of Muslim war crimes against the Serbs in Bosnia, as well as the Muslim operations in Sandzac, which is not even in Kosovo, was the last straw. I started apologizing to the Serbs, and I switched.
Incidentally, I'm originally from Calcutta, and Mother Teresa was not a saint. Her organization had the habit of turning down non-Catholic volunteers, even though they serviced everybody. And her opposition to abortion, which out there happens 90% of the time in cases of rape or incest, pretty much demonstrated her as being pro-rape and pro-incest, so I never had much of a respect for her. Not to mention the overpopulation problems that India suffers, particularly metropolitan cities like Calcutta with populations above 10m.
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 13, 2007 12:29 AM
I suspect few Albanians are real Muslims. For one thing, they are so much part of Europe; for another, they were under hard, radically secularizing communism for so long. Stealing Bush's watch seems a symptom of three things:
1. The Albanians, having been under communism, are incredibly poor. They are like Robin Williams' Russian character in the movie Moscow on the Hudson, when he finds himself inside an American supermarket: he has so long been deprived that he freaks out in the presence of so much abundance.
2. The Albanians perhaps love Bush or what they think he symbolizes, and want a piece of him as if it were a religious talisman.
3. The Albanians, having been under communism for a long time, have been made somewhat sharp and corrupt, like many other Eastern Europeans who lived under communism, and who took from it the lesson that nothing is just and that almost everything, including the law, is a matter of connections only, not truth or merit. Such people often think that getting what you can for yourself, your friends, your family, regardless of the law (for which communism instilled contempt), is all one can do. Ironic perhaps that such cynicism should be the lesson of communism, but communism was inherently corrupt and corrupting. There was little real objectivity to its economic and justice systems.
Posted by: traeh at June 13, 2007 12:33 AM
Leonthepigfarmer
I support the BNP. When the Brits stop conflating Sikhs, Jains, Parsis and Hindus with Muslims under the umbrella 'Asian', I'll consider stopping. But until then, no deal.
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 13, 2007 12:45 AM
"Stealing Bush's watch seems a symptom of three things:"
...it was one alleged thief, not an entire nation. And truth be told, we really don't know WHAT happened. Your characterizations are fine, and quite right, I must say, but even if someone did steal the watch, who is to say it was necessarily an Albanian? And I watched that video, and I saw LOTS Of people grabbing at his arm, both before and after the watch was gone. Who is to say that someone didn't just knock it off, incidentally. Such generalizations, while sometimes quite useful, are also sometimes just wrong in certain contexts... And I am still trying to figure out what it has to do with jihad.
And as Bush claims that it was not stolen, I think we know how truthful this man can be (sarcasm), but what to gain from lying about it. I suppose he wouldn't want to embarrass his new best friends!
Cheers.
Will.
Posted by: ThinkForYourself at June 13, 2007 12:50 AM
Will
The funny thing about this is that this is the people who were thanking him for championing the secession of Kosovo from Serbia. And assuming that it was deliberately stolen - a legitimate assumption when one is traveling in that area - it's just that this looks like a really amusing way of thanking him.
And the White House denial that the watch was stolen is something to be expected, since they don't want to embarrass the people of the host country. But for the millions who've seen it on Youtube, it's probably a worthless exercise - who do we believe - Tony Snow, or our own lying eyes?
You also didn't address how his ring would have disappeared.
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 13, 2007 12:57 AM
Infidel Pride, thank you for your thoughtful and thorough response. Interesting to hear that you are from Calcutta. I know that Mother Theresa was no angel, my point being that as an ethnic Albanian from Macedonia she was a Roman Catholic not a Muslim.
The politics of the Balkans is indeed complex and over-wrought, and I do not think that all Serbs are bogey men; however, it is a fact that the worst atrocities in recent times have been carried out by Serb extremists. The cold-blooded murder of 8,000 Muslims at Srbenica was an act of callous barbarity unrivalled in post-war European history. And had the world not been looking in Kosovo, Serbian thuggery would have been similarly applied to solve the "Albanian" problem. I have spent some time in Belgrade, and I know the contempt in which Albanians are held by even some of Serbia's intelligentsia. Fortunately, at the time the world, or at least NATO was looking, and we all know the rest.
I agree that religion usually does have some component of national identity, but the essence of my argument is that Islam is not a significant component of the Albanian national identity. As I have pointed out in the past, Albania has been the only country in the whole of human history where religion was once outlawed completely. From 1967 to the mid 1980's or thereabouts Albania was the world's first atheistic state. If there was even a scintilla of Islamism or Jihadism in the Albanian national pysche, this would not have been possible.
I stand by belief that many of the attacks here on Albanian and Albanians, especially by some Serb and Greek posters pushing their own nationalistic agendas, not to mention some other posters with a superficial are racist in character and have nothing to do with the struggle against international jihad. I see the ones coming out of the woodwork everytime anything to do with Albania or Albanians is mentioned on this board.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 1:14 AM
Some typos in my last paragraph corrected below:
I stand by belief that many of the attacks here on Albanian and Albanians, especially by some Serb and Greek posters pushing their own nationalistic agendas, not to mention some other posters with a superficial KNOWLDEDGE OF ALBANIA are racist in character and have nothing to do with the struggle against international jihad. I see the SAME ones coming out of the woodwork everytime anything to do with Albania or Albanians is mentioned on this board.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 1:20 AM
"You also didn't address how his ring would have disappeared."
Did his ring disappear? That is news to me. There were a lot of hands flying around, it wouldn't surprise me if it did get swiped. Look, I am not denying that his watch was stolen. But you say:
"The funny thing about this is that this is the people who were thanking him for championing the secession of Kosovo from Serbia."
Wrong. One person took his watch, perhaps one person took his ring (if such a thing did happen). That is one or two people, so we damn the whole crowd for such an incident? ...even if thievery might be commonplace in this particular country.
Haha. Infact, under the travel advisory put out by the US State Department under the Crime section it says this:
"Criminals do not deliberately target U.S. citizens or other foreigners, but criminals seek targets of opportunity and select those who appear to have anything of value. Pick pocketing is widespread; U.S. citizens have reported the theft of their passports by pickpockets."
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1076.html
So is this indicative of the attitudes of the entire crowd there to see him. Probably not. Can it even be said that every one there who was at this particular celebration was there with genuine intentions? Probably not.
And you still didn't answer to me what this has to do with the Jihad. Robert said recently that he avoids putting up stories about Muslims committing violence if there doesn't seem to be a jihad theme to it, but this would seem to have even less a jihad feel to it than some random act of violence that may or may not even be inspired by Islamic ideology, regardless of how the President feels about the Kosovo (which in my mind, is quite despicable).
Posted by: ThinkForYourself at June 13, 2007 1:26 AM
There are no connections between jihad and Albania/Kosovo Albanians? Secular? Right.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/bomb162.htm
http://www.antiwar.com/orig/deliso5.html
Ft. Dix? Keep searching, you'll find they have a penchant for destroying churches as well (real secular). You really think everyone is stupid here.
And second, when someone goes out of their way to give you a part of another country, you don't steal their damn watch. But still, that was really funny.
Posted by: SerbInfidel at June 13, 2007 1:50 AM
I agree with the previous poster: one can have an opinion on what should or shouldn't happen to Kosovo, but the whole point of this thread seems to be to suggest that all Albanians are a bunch of unscrupulous thieves. "Emblematic" is the word that subsumes the fictitious theft of George Bush's watch into a characteristic of the entire Albanian nation.
This story reminds me of the anti-semitic conspiracy-theory nonsense rampant in parts of the Islamic world. Hamas would be up to this sort of trick. Maybe in the next episode of Kiddy's Cartoon Terror Time, they could have a Jew shake Terror-Mouse's hand and steal his watch in the process. I'm sure they could claim the watch was "emblematic" of something.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 1:51 AM
I meant, of course, to say that I agreed (in part) with "Thinkforyourself", and not with "Serbinfidel" who so thoughtlessly popped up in the meantime with more jaundiced Serb anti-Albanianism.
Pass me the "poopascoop".
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 1:56 AM
The Northumbrian
Albania and Albanians support the war on terror, send troops to Iraq and Afghanistan, give George Bush an enthusiastic warm and genuine welcome, and demonstrate that they are with the United States. And this is the thanks they get?
maybe albanians support the war on terror as they like the fact christians are being driven out of iraq thanks to this war, american foreign policy is pro Albanian nationalism and anti Serb what the hell do you expect serbs and greeks to do support the USA and welcome people like bush or clinton who carve out bits of serbia and Cyprus and throw it to the Dogs? I am not pro american and i will never be pro American Goverment unless the USA Goverment stops supporting Turks or Albanians
at June 13, 2007 2:05 AM
From Morgaan Sinclair to Northumbrian
Posted by: plava_legija at June 13, 2007 2:12 AM
"There are no connections between jihad and Albania/Kosovo Albanians? Secular? Right."
Serb Infidel, Now you are doing what Robert Spencer likes to refer to as setting up a strawman to bash him down. I never said there was no connections between jihad and Albania/Kosovo. That is not what I am talking about here, Jihad is not this all consuming thing in the Albanian society. I said to show me what someone stealing his watch has to do with Jihad. As far as I am concerned, the issue of Kosovar independence is one between the Serbs and the Kosovar. I have no opinion on it, it does not concern me.
When the Serbian Official says:
"Serbian Prime Minister Vojislav Kostunica said Monday that his country was "rightfully embittered" by Bush's remarks in support of Kosovan independence made during a brief stopover Sunday in Albania, adding that the United States "has no right to give away Serbia's territory to Albanians," according to a government news release."
I tend to agree. That is why I have called Bush out as despicable for his stance here. "Kosovo is independent." Please. I seem to recall some fire that Royale took in France for her opinions on the independence streak of Quebec. This is a similar sort of thing. Serbia is a sovereign nation, and this is for her to deal with. If they deem the situation appropriate for them to grant Kosovo independence, then so be it. I don't think that is the case, in fact, I have read that they are even so willing to give the Kosovo region a fair amount of political autonomy, but that is not enough. It is never enough.
"And second, when someone goes out of their way to give you a part of another country, you don't steal their damn watch."
And again, what are you talking about? No one is giving Albania part of Serbia. And for all we know the thieves in question could care less about politics and more interested in making a buck. There isn't necessarily a relationship between the two. That is all I am saying.
Cheers.
Will
Posted by: ThinkForYourself at June 13, 2007 2:22 AM
Northumbrian
Are there major racial divisions between Serbs and Albanians? I know that Serbs are Slavs, and Albanians are Illyrians, reasonably different, but for the non European audience here, as far as race goes, they'd all be looked at as Eastern Europeans.
Somehow, your tag of 'racist' doesn't fit. If there were people whose anti-Bosnian-Muslim sentiments were anti-Slav, and covered everything - Russian, Polish, Slovak, Serb, Bulgar, et al, it might. Or alternatively, if they covered all Illyrians, and Albanians, Romanians, Moldavians, et al, that too might have. But picking out the 2 Muslim groups in the region - Albanians and Bosnian Slav Muslims - who have nothing else other than Islam and the Balkans in common - doesn't strike me as racist. You might prefer to rephrase that as bigotry. But on this site, where there is a thin line between criticism of Islam and a universal loathing of Muslims, which a lot of us frequently tread over, negative views on Muslims for being Muslims should hardly surprise anybody. And unlike race, this isn't something difficult to change.
There's also the fact that in Kosovo, several churches have been destroyed, and several Infidels have been persecuted and killed. Those Serbs and Greeks on this board, who are closer to that action and following these stories more frequently than we are deserved to be heard, instead of being offhandedly dismissed as pursuing a nationalistic agenda (Incidentally, I oppose Greece bullying Macedonia for calling itself Macedonia). And if you have contrary evidence that the Serb juggernaut continues, while the poor Albanians in Kosovo are being persecuted, it might be worth your while to show that, rather than just generalize something that many of us may have once held, but have altered based on the evidence.
Also, people do post here simultaneously - quite often, I've posted something and noticed that another post flew in before mine. You might want to either preview your post, or name who you are (dis)agreeing with, instead of attacking the person like SerbInfidel who just happened to hit post a few seconds before you did.
P.S. Plava, there's a world of difference - I don't see Northumbrian spamming this site, although I disagree with him calling us racists.
P.S. Will, you may well be right that the thefts were un-related to Albanian attitudes towards Serbs. I do thank you for clarifying that you oppose the president supporting Kosovo's independence. But when you state 'No one is giving Albania part of Serbia', that's wrong, and precisely the main subject of this thread - Bush's call for Kosovo's independence - more than the theft of his watch, which was an amusing side-note. It would be identical to if he had been visiting Pakistan, and called for Kashmir to become independent.
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 13, 2007 2:36 AM
Greek Gurl, your claim that Albanians are happy to send troops to Iraq to drive out Christians is puerile nonsense; and you know it.
I can also see from your anti-American rant that you are a typical leftist Greek dhimmi. The sort that has a pathological hatred of the United States, and enjoys going on a fire-bombing rampage against the American embassy in Athens. You have more in common with Bin Laden than you care to imagine.
By the way, last time I was in Athens, a hotelier pointed to some Albanian money stuck on the bar wall and then whispered to me as if telling me some awful secret that "all Albanians were peasant types". You probably also think the same. I notice also in your post that you implied that Albanians (and Turks) were "Dogs" [your capitalization].
Woof, woof.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 2:48 AM
Leonthepigfarmer,
What actions? For example, in every single media these days you can read Serbian forces "had killed some 10,000 Albanian civilians". And you know what? This is a lie. Official UNMIK report is total of 2,108 dead of all nationalities including soldiers, NATO bomb victims etc. Don't believe everything you read in media. They forgot to mention more than 200,000 Serbs and other non-abanians killed and expelled from Kosovo by KLA terrorists *after* NATO aggression...
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 13, 2007 2:48 AM
I agree that religion usually does have some component of national identity, but the essence of my argument is that Islam is not a significant component of the Albanian national identity. As I have pointed out in the past, Albania has been the only country in the whole of human history where religion was once outlawed completely. From 1967 to the mid 1980's or thereabouts Albania was the world's first atheistic state. If there was even a scintilla of Islamism or Jihadism in the Albanian national pysche, this would not have been possible.I disagree with you here. All Communist countries in the world were de-facto Athiest states - the Soviet Union, the Warsaw Pact countries, North Korea, et al. There was nothing special about 'officially' being athiest. But now, religion is seeing a resurgence in these countries - just look at Russia. Just because a country was solidly athiest for 70+ years doesn't mean that it'll necessarily remain that way. Russia has been re-embracing the Eastern Orthodoxy, Mongolia has been reverting to Mahayana Buddhism, and a whole host of former Communist countries have been changing.
You could make the argument that there are several levels of fanaticism, and that it's arguable whether the Albanians and Bosnians are as lethal as, say, the Chechens, or the Kyrghyz (not to mention what's going on in Turkey). I think Kazakhstan has so far been doing a good job in demonstrating that Muslims can co-exist with non-Muslims, but I suspect that the fact that Russians are 47% of their population has a big deal to do with it. Although Uzbekistan brutally supresses Islamic movements, with Uzbeks lionizing the Jihadi conqueror Tamerlane, I doubt that that country will remain secular if it ever goes democratic. Some of the developments in Turkestan may demonstrate that you can be right - just look at Shia Azerbaijan, which prefers Turkey to Iran, and Sunni Tajikistan, which prefers Iran to Turkey. In both these cases, language trumps religion.
At any rate, go easy on the name-calling - a time will come when you'll really need to do it.
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 13, 2007 2:54 AM
Mohammed the Albanian[who calls himself 'The Northumbrian'-typical taqiyya!]
TV3 did a careful series of freeze frames-result
clearly showed WATCH & WEDDING RING DISAPPEARING
FROM IDIOT BUSH'S ARM IN THE CROWD-THERE WAS NO PUTTING THEM IN HIS POCKET!!
So you are telling 'porky pies' LIES as shifty eyed Tony Snow does trying to convince the world
these items weren't STOLEN by adoring Albanians.
Ha,ha-what a hoot! Georgie Boy is in good company
with thieving thugs,pimps & people traffickers since he
wants to steal Serbian Land to win some cheap
popularity with Muzzies.
How about giving them Texas-it's much larger and is the birthplace of this cretinous Prez whom Albanians are prepared to worship-for a while until there are future demands for George Dhimmi.Wait until the bouquets are replaced by
grenades...
at June 13, 2007 3:04 AM
I prefer moving the Crawford rance, and with it, Cindy Sheahan's property next to it, to Albania. Send both Bush and Sheahan there. Maybe they can get a villa right over the Adriatic.
Posted by: Infidel Pride at June 13, 2007 3:09 AM
Infidel Pride, not all communist countries where atheistical to the same extent as the People's Socialist Republic of Albania. Even North Korea allowed (allows) a small Christian community to flourish (you might recall Billy Graham's visit to the DPRK), but in Albania atheism meant atheism one hundred percent. Mosques and churches became youth centres or museums of atheism (Marx's famous dictum that religion was the opium of the people would adorn each entrance), and all mullahs and priests were either shot or sent to concentration camps. Possession of either a Koran or a Bible meant life imprisonment or a death sentence. Even Ceacescu's Romania wasn't even remotely as severe as the Albania of Enver Hoxha and Mehmet Shehu.
There are racial differences between Serbs and Albanians, and there is no similarity between the Slavic languages of Eastern Europe and Albanian. Linguistically, Albanian is in a group of its own, as is the Basque language. The uniqueness of the Albanian language may in fact suggest that Albanians, like the Basques, are amongst some of the oldest inhabitants of Europe. But I don't wish to romanticise the issue with irrelevancies. The main thing is that they are all human beings, no better and no worse than each other.
Morgane, you'd be more tuthful if you called yourself "Moron"; and, save your jejune doggerel for your teenage friends.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 3:18 AM
Sorry, I mean to say "were atheistical" and not "where (sic) atheistical" in my previous post.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 3:27 AM
Sorry, I meant to say "were atheistical" and not "where (sic) atheistical" in my previous post.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 3:28 AM
@ nortumbrian
Can you imagine the reception George Bush would have received in neighbouring Greece? He would have been fire-bombed had he tried to walk around the streets of Athens.
hey..chill out mate...can you imagine of the thousand greeks that died from british-american atrocities, such as the Dekevriana in 1944, people were sent to exile or even died for their belief or for just been democrats, and finally the junta and its consequences for greece such as what happened in cyprus? all those things were supported from USA. None in greece wanted junta or ot intervene in cyprus.
However, USA never apologised, Clinton did it in 1999 but the day after he left the state department took back his apologies.
It is very nice making comments miles away from the balkans, but i am telling ya. come over here, to live in athens, for hundred of years we did not have any problems but now we have! It is not racist but everyone in greece, even other immigrants have something bad to say for albanians. Many albanians are ok but there are other who are a nightmare. and you know...few weeks ago some albanians were caught in usa for planning a terror attack, some others were caught in montenegro for terror attacks...what's going on?
If G.B. wants to come in athens, he wont have any problem. In case that u dont know it..his father comes every year in greece for holidays, he was here a week ago for holidays.
regarding bullying with fyrom, i agree, macedonia is not a big issue for greece but albania is...after kosovo is the turn of fyrom and who knows who's next. however greece has given military assitance to macedonia, so bullying is only for political - voting prestige! under the table there is lot of coperation betweeb greece and fyrom.
so if u want to create a caliphate in the balkans..support USA, we turn our backs and we look to Putin, russia is recovering..
regarding albanian's help....ok 30 soldiers.....thats not enough mate.
at June 13, 2007 3:29 AM
OK, Nortumbrian!!!
Enough is enough!!!
Same ol' sh*t is comming from you Albanians.
Mother Teresa, secularists, Skenderbeg, US loving people...
Mother Teresa is minority among Albanian national corpus. You Albanians are predominantly muslim.
Albanians are secular to the extend of communist dictatorship forced secularism. But you all are returning to the roots once forgotten.
Skenderbeg was half-Serb Christian champion, his family crest was (Serbian) WHITE, not (Albanian) BLACK two-headed eagle, he was fighting alongside Serbian Christian army against Turks. However, after his death, Albanians turned to be worst servants of Otoman empire in the Balkans, unmatched in their cruelty. They widely accepted Islam. Why do you think that ALL (!!!) neighbouring nations hate you so much? Maybe because they remember, hmmm?
In WW1 and WW2 Albanians were against all of their neighbours. Again. Part of the holocaust machine. Albanians were and are tools of big and mighty always when they had the chance to kill Christians in Balkans. Albanians NEVER cared whether they are allying with nazis, imperialists, democrats, Turks... Only goal is total obliteration of everyone else around them. So Serbs were trying to force you out from their holy land. Most sane people would!!! Who are you trying to persuade with those stupid lies? Yourselves or us? We here know a little bit more than that.
Albanians love US only because US is, in their ignorance, or simply because some higher interests, known only to some shady policymakers, helping Albanian jihad across the Balkans against Ortodox Christians.
Albanian cause is nationalist in its core, but jihad is handy technology discovered long time ago an perfectly used whenever possible. There is so much evidence about Albanian jihad in Balkans troughout the history, that it is just pointles to discus about it.
Mark my words, boy:
YOU ALBANIANS WILL FAIL AGAIN!!!
at June 13, 2007 4:09 AM
Er, Wally of Byzantium (I have this mental picture of you as Crusty the Clown from the Simpsons and also hear his voice when I read your post), how can you be so sure that I am Albanian? Maybe, I just have a soft spot for Albania, but I can see from the piffle you spout in your post you don't have a similar soft spot. This is because you're a common-or-garden bigot, possibly raised in a milieu where Serb mythology and national victomhood was inculcated in your thick skull from early childhood.
Not much point in even trying to begin to argue with someone who is capable of saying something like "the only goal [of Albanians] is the total obliteration of everyone around them". Now, no one could say anything like that of the Serbs, could they Arkan? I mean Crusty, I mean Wally.
at June 13, 2007 4:50 AM
EliasAlucrad, I do not take any pride, vicarious or otherwise, in the enforced atheism of communist Albania. It was wrong; evil in fact. Enver Hoxha and Mehmet Shehu were monsters. My point was that Islam can not have been as deeply rooted in the Albanian national psyche, as some here would have us believe, for enforced atheism to have succeeded for so long in Albania. We all know that fear of death is no obstacle to Islamic fanaticism. Albanians on the whole are not Islamic fanatics. A small fraction of Albanians are Islamic fanatics, but then so are a small fraction of Thais and indeed Britons. In fact, the fraction of the population that are Islamic fanatics in Britain is probably greater than in Albania.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 5:00 AM
"I am not pro american and i will never be pro American Goverment unless the USA Goverment stops supporting Turks or Albanians"
You are right to be enraged against the U.S., Greek Gurl, I served in Kosovo & the Albanians were a cut throat, Orthodox Church and Monastary burning bunch....
Some of us in the U.S. have got a clue & are telling our fellow Americans what a crime our actions in the Balkans were, don't give up on us, we infidels need to stick together, or Constantinople gets repeated.
at June 13, 2007 6:27 AM
Greeks are not against the US, not even Serbs. Did you see any Serb in America (and there are many) talking against the US, let alone killing people? No. Our only action in the US were peaceful protests, like NBA player Vlade Divac wearing t-shirts "Stop Bombing".
During 1999 NATO bombing, captured American soldiers were released with this message from our Foreign Ministry: "We did not consider three American soldiers as enemies, rather as the victims of war and militarism"
Try to bomb Albanians for three months and you will see who is pro-american...
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 13, 2007 7:23 AM
And just as an illustration, the same day US soldiers were released:
"A NATO warplane accidentally hit a bus crossing a bridge near Luzane north of Pristina, an alliance statement said.
Yugoslavia's state-run media and witnesses had reported that a NATO missile struck a civilian bus Saturday on a bridge north of Kosovo's capital Pristina, killing at least 34 people.
NATO said it regrets striking the civilians."
http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/europe/9905/02/captured.soldiers.01
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 13, 2007 7:27 AM
Northumbrian,
At the risk of eliciting Morgaan Sinclair Syndrome on this blog again over the Yugoslav Muslims I will tell you that the British or anyone that is loyal to their agenda are the very last that should be giving lectures to anyone in Europe about nationalism and human rights.
I understand that the English fear nationalism because it led to the dissolution of their empire and may yet lead to the dissolution to the U.K.
However, the British were the ones attacking Israeli forces in Northern Galilee in the 1947-48 Israeli War of Independence out of bases in Cyprus and helping the Muslims by killing Jews.
Worldwide Jewry will never forget that.
Your country continues to give aid and comfort even now to Muslim/nationalist agendas ranging from Palestine to Cyprus to Yugoslavia.
I do not know why the United States tolerates your country's behavior given you are impotent now and unnecessary to U.S. interests in the evolving world.
Nationalists booted your country out of British North America and led to the formation of the great nation of the United States of America.
I can understand why you people do not like nationalism but why are you in bed with Muslims and are so anti-Semitic?
Your country is not to be trusted.
at June 13, 2007 7:31 AM
So I'm Crusty the Clown...
And you "maybe ... have a soft spot for Albania"...
SHAMELESS!
Arkan, you say? That criminal is dead, while Albanian terrorists are in POWER in Kosovo! Cheku, Haradinaj and Tachi. Freedom fighters? Yeah right! '90s are over, face it, your lies just won't make it this time.
Serbian victimhood? That's just outrageous! Comming from a person who is supporting Albanians in Kosovo!!! ON THIS VERY SITE!!!
HOW MANY INOCENT SERBS HAVE BEEN KILLED, HOW MANY ANCIENT MONESTARIES HAVE BEEN DESTROYED?!?!?!
HOW MANY GREEKS, GYPSIES AND OTHERS?!?!?!
HOW MANY ALBANIAN CHRISTIANS AND LOYALISTS?!?!?!?!
ALBANIA HAS HISTORY OF JIHAD STRETCHING HUNDERDS OF YEARS!!!
Albanians started populating Kosovo on large scale in last 60 years, during Tito's communist dictatorship. He wanted Albania as 7th republic within Yugoslavia, so when Hoja rejected his plan, he imported Albanians in Kosovo. Serbs were clear absolute majority before WW2. And now there are 10% Serbs.
MUST BE BECAUSE OF ALL THAT LOVE THEY RECEIVED FROM MUSLIM ALBANIANS!!!
WHERE IS THE DIFERENCE BETWEEN INDIA, INDONESIA, PALESTINE, ETHIOPIA CYPRUS OR SERBIA??? And other muslim dominated flashpoints around the globe? Albanian nationalism? NOT LIKELY!!!
Only diference is that Albanians have one of top 3 mafias in the world, with Kosovo as homebase. BUT!!! Money can't beat the truth, it can only buy some more time...
Posted by: WallsofByzant at June 13, 2007 7:54 AM
"Serb mythology" says that we have stopped Jihad against Europe five centuries ago in battle of Kosovo. And Lazar will stop it again, even he is not so good in public relations. Honest people are never good in pr...
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 13, 2007 8:14 AM
It's time for Greek diplomacy and lobby (negreponte and others) to wake up and veto any decision of recognising Serbia. Greece can use its veto within NATO and EU and Russia in UN, just to show who's the boss in the balkans. I am afraid that soon we ll see a third balkan war, this time it will be christians and others vs islamists.
Just in case..find who funded KLA terrorists and how albanians used a policy of terror for 20 years in order to drive non-albanian and non-muslims out of kosovo.
Posted by: chris at June 13, 2007 8:42 AM
ThinkForYourself, there are no "Kosovar" (but I'm guessing you already know that). That is a dhimmi crowd recent invention (building another nation on land that isn't theirs). Kosovo Albanians are non-indigenous to Kosovo. There are numerous Serb and Turk censuses that show that going back a couple of hundred years. They were a minority less than 100 years ago. They got to be a majority trough terror, murder, uncontrolled immigration and ethnic cleansing. They WILL NOT have it like that. Dubyah, Clinton and the rest of the scum can't help them.
Posted by: SerbInfidel at June 13, 2007 11:56 AM
"But when you state 'No one is giving Albania part of Serbia', that's wrong, and precisely the main subject of this thread - Bush's call for Kosovo's independence - more than the theft of his watch, which was an amusing side-note. It would be identical to if he had been visiting Pakistan, and called for Kashmir to become independent."
Infidel Pride, that is a valid explanation. I imagine I draw a distinction between Albanians in Albania and Albanians in the Kosovo region, which Serb Infidel tells me is an incorrect thing to do. While there may not be a historic precedent for the "Kosovar" they are there now. That doesn't mean they are deserving of their own country, but they must be dealt with. As I said before, that is not something for the President of the United States of America (which is some other entitry that there is no historical precedent for!) to decide, but the Sovereign Republic of Serbia.
I will admit I am fairly igonorant of the region, and all its complexities. But I am planning a trip to Croatia next spring as part of a vacation to Europe along the North Sea to Adriatic Axis, so I am very interested in learning about the Slavic peoples and that part of world.
But I digress.
Kosovo is Independent. In a pigs eye Mr. President!!! If you want to say that why don't you go and tell the Turks that Kurdistan is independent too, you damn hypocrite!
Posted by: ThinkForYourself at June 13, 2007 1:11 PM
The norththumbrian posted
I can also see from your anti-American rant that you are a typical leftist Greek dhimmi. The sort that has a pathological hatred of the United States, and enjoys going on a fire-bombing rampage against the American embassy in Athens. You have more in common with Bin Laden than you care to imagine.
I am not a dhimmi I hate islam to much to be a dhimmi and I am not a leftis either yes i am Anti American as the American goverment is supporting Turkey and letting them get away with occupaying my familys homes and also USA bombed and killed Serbs for albanians I have every right to be Anti American and regarding that bombing of a American embassy in Athens nobody died but what about when american bombed Serbia lots of serbs died.
Posted by: Greek Gurl at June 13, 2007 2:04 PM
Northumbrian posted
I notice also in your post that you implied that Albanians (and Turks) were "Dogs" [your capitalization].
Woof, woof.
Yes sorry about that I didnt mean to insults dogs because dogs are suppose to be a mans best freind they dont steal your home or rape women and kill innocents
at June 13, 2007 2:06 PM
If it wasn't for Tony Blair's insistence Clinton would not have bombed the Christians in Eastern Europe 1999 or 1995-6.
The British want to spread Londonistan to Europe it seems.
For them there is such a thing as "moderate" Muslims e.g. Bosnians and Albanians. For the British these are some of the finest human beings on earth and the rest are just bad nationalists.
Like I wrote before. Jews still remember the British stab in the back 1947-48 in Mandate Palestine and Sherry Blair's anti-Semitism.
But in 1947-48 the Jews too in Palestine were Jewish “Nationalists” (aka Zionists or terrorists) for the British and all nationalists are bad for this colonial-minded(still) nation.
The British only dance around because we let them.
I do not trust them as allies. They are a two-faced nation, always have been, always will be.
Their whole society is flawed and half of the entries on this blog it seems are about their failed state.
at June 13, 2007 3:22 PM
purplemarbles:
"The northumbrian" is albanian not British, he is just using the old muslim trick of claiming the territory of another country by using it as his identity: just as arabs who are calling themselves "palestinians", albanians who are calling themselves "kosovars", muslims in bosnia who calling themselves "bosniaks" etc. (Soon the thugs in Parisian ghettos will probably call themselves as "Parisians" and will claim that the French in Paris are an occupying power that opresses muslims.) "The northumbrian" has also been on one of CAIRs propaganda lessons, since he is using their favorite "racist" slur against opponents of jihad. Unfortunately for him albanians are famous all over Europe for their drug-dealing, slave brothels and gang rapes.
Also don't confuse the british people with blair, no european nation deserves to lose their homeland to muslims. And the british did a lot of good during WWII, some of the things they did in India and do you think it would have been possible for Israel to be created if Arabs had full control of the land after WWI instead of the British?
Posted by: European Crusader at June 13, 2007 3:58 PM
EuropeanCrusader,
If people are using crypsis to post then it is impossible to answer anyone.
It is true the British helped the Jews( Balfour Declaration , Mandate etc ) and the Jews know that.
However, things have got out of hand since then. Whether this is being done for the votes of 4 million "British" Muslims I do not know. However, I predict that unless they fix what is happening inside Britain, that country will soon start exporting Islamic terror too.
Time will tell if they are willing to do what needs to be done.
at June 13, 2007 4:20 PM
Purplemarbles, are you loosing your marbles? How on earth can you accuse me of being anti-semitic? I am extremely pro-Israeli and have nothing but the utmost respect for the Jewish people. This thread is beginning to resemble an argument in a mad house.
Incidentally, I am English not Albanian.
Posted by: The Northumbrian at June 13, 2007 9:43 PM
From LazarofSerbia - from way up the thread
"Putin knows that and Bushy knows that. That's why he said what he said in Tirana, but also knows that he can't deliver. He was just trying to buy some time.
Albanians in Kosovo already started attacks on UN troops and very soon UN will have to strike back..."
So true, lazar.
And so we get the blustered bullying of America and NATO: It's a typical reaction to people - the Serbs - who are simply standing up for themselves. The bully's confused and can't quite understand why he's not getting his way, and so throws a giant tantrum - witness the US on Kosovo etc.
Laughable really.
So Bush's watch got stolen.
He got off lightly when compared with the Isreali doctors who the Kosovo Albanian refugees tried to rape in 99.
Or the Pristina Jewish population who were torched out of their homes in 99.
With all this violence against Jewish people maybe we shouldn't be all that surprised that the Wahabbis have been so successful in building mosques in Kosovo - often on the remains of torched Serb churches.
Nor should we be surprised when a large proportion of the KLA are either Neo Nazis or Islamists.
Abu "aha mateys" Hamza recruited 100s of Muajideen for the glorious Greater Albanian cause in 99 - Abu himslef spoke of this as did Pakistan's prezident Musharraf
Posted by: ewha1 at June 14, 2007 12:01 AM
The God fearin' good ole Southern boys hit the nail on the head again:
http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=146
In the ICTY trial against Slobo - for the Kosovo part of the indictment- the prosecution
a) called 124 witnesses.
b) Some witnesses testified that they'd been tortured to speak against Slobo
c) Some witnesses perjured themselves - Jeremy Ashdown - though he contends that it was simply a case of an SBS soldier being unable to use a compass , read a simple map or know which country he was in that is to blame for his hilariously awful testimony
d) Others contradicted earlier testimony by other prosecution witnesses. Contradicted their own preivous statements they'd made to the ICTY. In fact their earlier statements contradicted with otherICTY statements they'd made. They also contradicted their own earlier testimony......oh bla di oh bla da la la la
e) Slobo banged them about , toughed them up and then chucked 'em out of court with dignity not intact. And what's more , he had a public telephone, very limited cross examination time and little or no time to read the documents which in many cases hadn't even been translated into Serbian.
So , even with an incredibly biased legal system , our resident Serbophobes refuse - point blank- to talk about any of these 124 witnesses.
Not a single one
Which is all a mite strange don'tcha fink
Posted by: ewha1 at June 14, 2007 2:13 AM
From EliasAlucard
"Greek Gurl is right. Not only the Serbs are losing their country because of Bush, Christian Assyrians in Iraq are being slaughtered to death in another Assyrian genocide by muslims, because of a war Bush started, and he's completely ignoring the Assyrians.Thanks a lot, Bush, "hero" of Albania."
True , true , true.
He's got 100,000 plus soldiers in Iraq and when told that the Infidels of Iraq are getting wiped out , he.....wait for it......goes to the Vatican and has a chat with the Pope about it. Over a nice cup of coffee.
Heaven forbid the Yanks troops should protect non Muslim Iraqis.
What are you ? Some kind of Islamophobe?
As I've already said, the Islamists definitely have a mole or two in the White House.
Posted by: ewha1 at June 14, 2007 2:26 AM
Bad news...
http://byzantinesacredart.com/blog/2007/06/ethnic-cleansing.html
Head of the Coordination Center for Kosovo-Metohija Vuko Antonijevic said on Wednesday that an attack on Vukosava Ivanovic, a 75-year-old Serb who lives in Pristina was clearly ethnically motivated.
An 18-year-old Albanian from Kosovo-Metohija province attacked a lone, helpless Serbian woman Tuesday as she was entering her house, savagely beating her without provocation and braking her nose. Elderly Vukosava was taken to the Pristina Emergency Center for medical help.
“This is a classical ethnically motivated attack at the 50 or 60 Serbs who remained in Pristina out of the 40,000 who lived there before,” Antonijevic said, adding that an increasing number of such provocations can be expected.
“Encouraged by statements of US President that Kosovo-Metohija will be independent, it seems that Kosovo Albanian separatists wish to expel the last Serbs from Kosovo-Metohija and cleanse the area of them completely,” Head of the Center said.
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 14, 2007 3:21 AM
Yeah Ewha1,
I thought that Slobo would be the last person to defend the truth, but life is funny sometimes. Being himself evil man, he looks like a saint compared to his prosecutors.
Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at June 14, 2007 3:31 AM
Yup, the KLA: tough guys all of 'em
An 18 year old kicks the crap out of a Serb grannie.
Yup , tough guys all of 'em
Well done Dubya: they don't really need much of an excuse to set about 70 year old Serb women but you certainly gave 'em one:
Long live a Greater Albania
Grannies getting the shit kicked out of 'em: Jews being torched out of their homes: Wahabbi's making inroads int
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