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"Officers were 'in the process' of giving the order to fire when the Iranians abruptly turned away."
Had the U.S. ship fired, chances are the Iranians would then put the propaganda mill into overdrive, claiming the Great Satan fired on a retreating ship. And they might have a few more "martyrs" to boot-- sacrificing a handful of personnel in a move for domestic and international sympathy, particularly in the Islamic world. An insane act of brinksmanship to be sure, and the question remains: Are they crazy enough to try again? (Well, they were crazy enough to try it once.) "Iranian ships 'harass' U.S. Navy, officials say," by Barbara Starr for CNN:
(CNN) -- The U.S. military reported Monday on a "significant" confrontation involving five Iranian Revolutionary Guard boats that "harrassed and provoked" three U.S. naval ships in international waters over the weekend.
U.S. military officials said the incident occurred Saturday night in the Strait of Hormuz, a narrow shipping channel leading in and out of the Persian Gulf.
The five Iranian ships made "threatening" moves -- in one case coming within 200 yards of a U.S. ship, the U.S. officials said.
In one radio transmission, the Iranians told the U.S. Navy: "I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes," the U.S. military officials told CNN.
When the U.S. ships heard that radio transmission, they manned their gun positions and officers were "in the process" of giving the order to fire when the Iranians abruptly turned away, the U.S. officials said.
No shots were fired and no one was injured in the confrontation.
One of the Iranian ships had been dropping white boxes into the water in front of the U.S. ships, the officials told CNN.
No additional details were immediately available.
In November, the U.S. military reported that Iran's Revolutionary Guard Corps had taken command of that country's naval operations in the Persian Gulf.
Posted by Marisol at January 7, 2008 9:59 AM
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Is it possible the Iranians were trying to stretch the very limits of US Rules of Engagement to test just how much they could get away with (i.e. Captured British sailors last year)
Posted by: Hard Rain![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/nav-commenters.gif)
at January 7, 2008 10:28 AM
Could it be Iran's *secret agenda to drag Bush into a confrontation,war that he can not afford or want now ?
(*Russia,China,Iran,N.Korea,Venezuela,Cuba,Nicauragua and God knows who else)
Just as the U.S. trumpets their successful surge in Iraq and Bush works to destroy Israel by his false peace we have the IRG with an agenda in that explosive region of the world,the Straits of Hormuz.
What are they up to ?
When they say peace and safety ,then sudden destruction as birth pangs on a woman ,and thye shall not escape.
Our enemies see the worn down,worn out ,bankrupt paper tiger and act accordingly.
http://averyheavystone.blogspot.com/
Posted by: rocketman at January 7, 2008 10:30 AM
God bless our Navy. The US Navy has done more for World Peace than any other organization.
Posted by: Ruebacca at January 7, 2008 10:38 AM
Careful With that Ax Eugene. Pink Floyd
at January 7, 2008 11:07 AM
A provocation to set the tone in advance of Bush's trip to the M.E.............?
W, please stay home. The U.S, State DEPT. has set you up for a Bhutto type incident.
WAKE UP!
Posted by: n.a. palm at January 7, 2008 11:19 AM
Keep your powder dry!
Posted by: tanstaafl at January 7, 2008 11:26 AM
Three reasons why the Iranians would like to rachet up tension in the Persian Gulf. 1) Oil Prices; 2) Oil Prices; 3) Oil Prices....
Posted by: teachingmyown at January 7, 2008 11:33 AM
I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes
We remember the British sailors who were kidnapped by the Iranians.
That should have been "I am coming at you. You will...[end-of-transmission]".
Posted by: special_guest at January 7, 2008 11:49 AM
They remind me of the Martians in MARS ATTACKS
As they walk around killing everyone they just keep saying "we come in peace, we come in peace"
Posted by: poetcomic1 at January 7, 2008 11:52 AM
That should have been "I am coming at you. You will...[end-of-transmission]".Posted by: special_guest at January 7, 2008 11:49 AM
at January 7, 2008 11:54 AM
The Bush does not want a war with Iran. Why?
Iraq has a majority Shia. If we go to war, then we will have a possible major uprising in Iraq.
Thus making Bush look bad....
Iraq is like giant weight around our neck. We can't do ANYTHING until we get out.
Posted by: greatcometof1577
at January 7, 2008 12:01 PM
Another missed opportunity...
Posted by: sheik yer'mami at January 7, 2008 12:02 PM
so true. these interesting little creatures remind me of laboratory rats which have been injected with a cocktail of ego, rage and testosterone so that they now just run around in a little maze yelling "Jihad!" or "Death to America!" every time that they bump into a solid object. it's really rather comical if not a bit tiresome and boring.
personally, wouldn't it be easier if we just dropped a little white box of our own for them to play with? we have much more interesting things to deal with than these creatures.
Posted by: faraway boy at January 7, 2008 12:04 PM
I hope they got it all over film.
Posted by: Borg at January 7, 2008 12:05 PM
Specialguest and shyguy Both of you have written a scenario that would have been much better reading than this.
However we must remember that Islam (assistant to Gordon England DepSecDef) was a Navy officer and now his son is one.
All we can hope for is that none of our boys get hurt if one of our ships looses at this game of gotchya.
You can be assured the orders from above are to Not shoot.
at January 7, 2008 12:18 PM
What they probably won't play after: "I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes..." is the 300-strong 'Gufaw!!!Bwaahhhaaaaa!!!' that the US NAVY sailors made after hearing the threat.
Methinks the only explod'in to be done will be the Iranian navy, or in this case the IRG. After looking at the 'mini-subs' vid that was out, it seems like that would be an easy thing to do for 'em.
-osgo
Posted by: -osgo- at January 7, 2008 12:35 PM
Two can play this game. We own the night (night vision). I would suggest that we track the movements of these idiots and take them out when they least expect it. Deny all plausibility the next day. Or maybe hit them somewhere else without publicity.
Bush should also give notice that any provocative action started by them including incidents like this will be dealt with swiftly. And that a state of war will be considered. I use these terms because, as we all know on the blog, they have declared war the Islamic way by deception.
I agree that 'oil price' and discrediting the presidents trip is probably the reason for these actions. Releasing our reserves or the announcement of it would counter the price spike. If you think about it, anything that happens in this area either started by them or us or the reactions of either party will cause prices to spike so considering economic issues is secondary to the main issue IMHO. This also shows in spades why we should change our energy policy so the enemy can not use this against us. I would like to see, as I posted in the past, us pump the oil in Iraq out and taking it as booty of war and to cover the billions we have spent. The world has blamed us for this anyway so take it. That would quickly counter any price speculation that the enemy is using against us.
We should not react to them we should turn the tables and show the world they are to provocateurs and the bad guys.
Due 33:27
The eternal God is your refuge, and his everlasting arms are under you. He thrusts out the enemy before you; it is he who cries, `Destroy them!'
بسبب 33:27
أبدية الله هو الملجأ الخاص بك ، وابدى صاحب الأسلحة يجري لكم. واعرب عن التوجهات من اصل العدو أمامكم ؛ وهو الذي صرخات ، `بتدميرها!'
at January 7, 2008 12:38 PM
I believe that the US Navy held the moral high ground by not firing. The Iranians turned and fled without a shot fired. I am sure that they wanted to draw fire from the US Navy, to turn international opinion against the US.
Like Arafat, Iran wants to be seen as a "victim" of US aggression. The would-be Iranian martyrs did not get what they desperately wanted.
I am relieved that there was no repeat of the hostage-taking of Royal Marines last year. That incident was a propaganda victory for Dinner Jacket and a great embarassment to the British.
--
CT Yank
at January 7, 2008 12:39 PM
Looks like I'll have to write another letter to our Vice President of Mexico...er...President of the US.
This is unbelievable. All those Iranian craft should be at the bottom by now, survivors waterboarded, and an emergency session at the UN convened, with the radio transmissions as evidence for all to hear.
Feels like our country is sunk.
Posted by: AmericanTiger at January 7, 2008 12:39 PM
I think the U.S. has forgotten how dangerous it is to allow small boats to approach, especially unmarked boats manned by apparent civilians. Gunfire speaks louder than a hailer and the first burst doesn't have to be on target...just close.
Posted by: pismopal at January 7, 2008 1:35 PM
Perhaps the rules of engagement could be tweaked a bit to allow for the US Navy to blow retreating Iranian ships out of the water which have just annoyingly and stupidly provoked our vessels. Generally speaking Islamic radicals desist from further action for a while when force is used against them and are emboldened to more terrorist activity when they are met by Western civilized norms.
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 1:43 PM
Where are those "human shields" when you need them? You remember, those self-righteous idiots who went to Iraq to live amongst orphans and prevent the evil Bush and Blair from nuking their orphanage (their lives being so much more important than the Iraqi children, that Bush and Blair wouldn't risk an attack on them).
In the event, Saddam superglued them to the front door of military establishments instead. Oh dear.
Seems we could do with a few now on these USA ships. Will they volunteer?
Posted by: Celsius at January 7, 2008 1:55 PM
When your enemy tells you that they want to kill you - believe them.
International waters - Reckless conduct - explicit threat - WTF? USS Cole anyone? What if they did open fire and sucessfully sank American ship(s)?
If the rules of engagement do not allow for reasonable self defense, it is time to either change the rules, or send our ships well out to sea. The straits offer limited room for maneuver, and virtually no room for error. How would you like to have a family member on board? How would you like to be the Captain of a U.S. vessel? With the current roe, you are damned if you do, and damned if you don't.
Apparently in the last several decades, we have learned very litte, or perhaps the CIC is willing to do a remake of "They Were Expendable."
We are stuck on stupid since the Beiruit Marine Barracks bombing in the Reagan era. The fools in charage are still more concerned about killing a jihadi than in protecting our own forces. If we do not intend to use force, stand down.
at January 7, 2008 1:59 PM
"I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes."
Iran's foreign ministry spokesman downplayed the incident, calling it "ordinary." - from CNN
This is ordinary?
at January 7, 2008 2:01 PM
"I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes."
At least that statement is Islamic. It has the word "explode" in it.
Posted by: Sounder at January 7, 2008 2:07 PM
My Headlines-
Foxnews Breaking News:
Five Iranian warships were all sunk in what appears to be a failed suicide attack en masse...apparently, their explosive-laden suicide crafts were improperly wired, detonating all five prematurely.
No survivors were found, as the shark-infested waters were mysteriously chummed moments before the attack.
Yes, we have now have confirmation...the Iranians were chumming the water with human blood in an attempt to hazard the lives of any surviving American Sailors.
More details as they unfold...
Any one remember the USS Cole?
Posted by: AmericanTiger at January 7, 2008 2:09 PM
Sorry MP...missed your post. I will never forget the USS Cole and her dead and wounded. Long live the USN, and all US Armed Forces!
Posted by: AmericanTiger at January 7, 2008 2:15 PM
They remind me of the Martians in MARS ATTACKS
As they walk around killing everyone they just keep saying "we come in peace, we come in peace"
Posted by: poetcomic1 [TypeKey Profile Page] at January 7, 2008 11:52 AM
---------------------------------------------
SOOOOOOOO True!
This movie represents the today's problems PERFECTLY!
Islam invading...errmm oops... Mars invading earth!
Posted by: Dr.CancerMan at January 7, 2008 2:18 PM
@ rocketman - Are you perhaps a member of Phelps' Westboro Baptist church?? You know, the ones who taunt and denigrate soldiers' families at their sons and daughters funerals? Sounds like you'd make a good member if you're not already!
Posted by: mepeteart at January 7, 2008 2:21 PM
As if not shooting upon the boats is going to change our standing in the region. Its high time the gloves come off, if they want to challenge us on the high seas(or anywhere) then smack them down. We have got to quit thinking that our enemies think along the same lines as us. We see the reluctance to use our power as a virtue, they see it as a weakness.
Posted by: Kevin at January 7, 2008 2:26 PM
CT Yank -
"I believe we hold the high moral ground by not firing...."
Oh, that HIGH moral ground..... Israel keeps trying to find it too. The 'high moral ground' is where you stand when you want to make yourself an easy target.
at January 7, 2008 2:28 PM
I would expect a "Armed Manned Watch" from now on.
200 Yards is a little too close for comfort. Especially when a 50Cal. can easily reach out and touch someone from a Mile away.
The Navy should Publicly declare a Maritime Exclusion Zone around our Ships and then see to its strict adherence.
Posted by: flowerknife_us
at January 7, 2008 2:35 PM
mepeteart: Thanks for your comments about rocketman. I think he hates the United States government as much as he does Islamic terrorism. While I support his right to make almost any statement, his assertions here are so fanatically constructed as to pull down the overall quality of Jihad Watch. If I detested JW and wanted to sully its reputation, I think just about my first course of action would be to simply post rocketman's many comments at this site as ipso facto evidence of extremism pure and simple. It would not be an accurate representation of what is usually posted here, not by a long shot, but those who have a disregard for or detestation of JW would probably not be that concerned with accuracy or ethics. Again, thanks for your post. Oh, by the way, better prepare for a tirade against yourself by rocketman. Chances are pretty good it will be a comin'.
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 2:46 PM
Thanks Wellington, I don't post much but when I see someone constantly running down our country, after awhile it just gets to be too much for me. I'm sure you're right that I'm gonna' 'get it' from rocketman, but hey, at least he's not a jihadi, right??
Posted by: mepeteart at January 7, 2008 2:57 PM
...i will wager the Iranians never found the two attack submarines lurking nearby.....The USN was tracking the Iranians from the moment they hit open water.....no doubt, some attack jets were also flying closeby......If you want to become a martyr...then by all means....head straight for the next ship you can find...
....Not many accuse the Muslim thugs of actually being intelligent....
Posted by: exsgtbrown at January 7, 2008 3:00 PM
Old monkey face Armani Dinnerjacket is up to his old tricks again. Maybe the U.S. should send him a radio message along the lines of:-
"This is the good old U.S of A, we are launching nuclear missiles at Tehran, you will explode in oh, lets say three minutes."
What is so hilarious is that if they were trying to provoke an incident they would get little support when the U.S. Navy published the radio transcript.
What a little turd this man is. If he isn't kidnapping British Navy personnel he is trying to create an incident with the U.S.
I think he must be suffering from "boat envy" because the U.S. has bigger ones than he does. Still, I have always said he is a little prick.
He is very lucky that we are a more enlightened civilisation, not stuck in a medieval mind set. He better hope things stay that way, though I suspect they won't for too much longer.
Maybe it's time we started playing by his rules.
at January 7, 2008 3:06 PM
this navy thing, and the two hornets jets that just crashed over there -no reason given for that crash, plus the levee break in nevada -not owed to rodent work or at least not the typical rodents that run on four feets, without any sort of serious explaination form media tells me this is all owed to terroist work. no one discusses it though, let pretend is dont exist and maybe it will all go away....i have learned to read in between the lines on all mishaps now...
Posted by: zionist122 at January 7, 2008 3:13 PM
ROCKETMAN, your attempt to portray yourself as an extremist christian in order to make jihadwatch look like a "hate site" is laughable.
I especially liked your line :-
"You misquote scripture as we ,the U.S. is no longer blessed or seeks God as our refuge."
Straight out of the jihad disinformation manual.
It always amazes me the lengths some muslims will go to in order to pretend they are victims of fundamentalist Christians, in order to justify their own islamofascist agenda.
Are you Naseem by any chance?
Posted by: DaveMate at January 7, 2008 3:24 PM
I wonder who was in the boxes?
Posted by: Dar al-harb at January 7, 2008 3:26 PM
@ rocketman - Are you perhaps a member of Phelps' Westboro Baptist church?? You know, the ones who taunt and denigrate soldiers' families at their sons and daughters funerals?
When the truth bother's you just demonize the messenger.
So you associate me with someone I have nothing to do with.
The truth is that america I grew up in and served has become perverted and full of lawless criminals they can't keep in jail.
The system is broke and our children are vtaught perversion at an early age by the corrupt deviant state.
There's some things seriously wrong with this nation from the top down and unlike you blind ones who love to live in denial and delusion I sound the alarm.
I've learned when those who call what I say hate ,it is they who hate the truth.
Another example of Bush's Amerika police state land of the no longer free which I am sure you would love to cover up and hate me with your Phelp's hatred for bringing to the light of day.
Nearly a dozen members of a police SWAT team in western Colorado punched a hole in the front door and invaded a family's home with guns drawn, demanding that an 11-year-old boy who had had an accidental fall accompany them to the hospital, on the order of Garfield County Magistrate Lain Leoniak.
The boy's parents and siblings were thrown to the floor at gunpoint and the parents were handcuffed in the weekend assault, and the boy's father told WND it was all because a paramedic was upset the family preferred to care for their son themselves.
http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=59566
at January 7, 2008 3:31 PM
Hunh???????????
Posted by: mepeteart at January 7, 2008 3:47 PM
Hunh?????????
Islamic Terrorists protecting Herr Bush during visit to his newest Islamic terrorist state he is working so hard to create.
exerpt:
The Brigades members said they were speaking as members of Fatah's security forces and not as part of the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, but they acknowledged they serve in the Brigades. They said during Bush's visit they will function only as Fatah security officers and will work to protect Bush.
The Brigades members who double as Fatah officers told WND "hundreds" of other members of their terror group who double as Fatah security officers are set to participate in protecting Bush.
"The president [Bush] is a guest of Fatah and we will do everything to protect him," said one Brigades member.
One Israeli security official familiar with the Brigades deployment during Bush's visit said Israel was not concerned about threats from Fatah forces while the U.S. president travels to Ramallah.
"Brigades members who double as Fatah forces have countless times participated in the protection of American and foreign leaders. Unfortunately, the state of Fatah forces is fully saturated with the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades. The Brigades may fire at Israel but while they serve in the Fatah forces they will be loyal to Abbas and will protect Bush," said the security official.
The Brigades is listed as a terror organization by the U.S. State Department. The group took credit along with the Islamic Jihad terror organization for every suicide bombing in Israel between 2005 and 2006, and is responsible for thousands of shootings and rocket firings. Statistically, the Al Aqsa Brigades perpetuated more terrorism from the West Bank than Hamas, according to the Israeli Defense Forces.
Hundreds of Brigades members, including the group's well-known chiefs, serve openly in Fatah's Force 17 presidential guard units and the Palestinian Preventative Security Services; thousands of Force 17 and Preventative officers are slated to secure Ramallah during Bush's visit there.
Among other Brigades leaders slated to secure Ramallah during Bush's visit is Abu Haiphin, chief of Force 17 in Ramallah who doubles as a senior Brigades member
http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=59565
Posted by: rocketman at January 7, 2008 3:55 PM
postings by rocketman:
...Islamic Terrorists protecting Herr Bush during visit to his newest Islamic terrorist state he is working so hard to create...
And my personal favorite by rocketman:
...Sadly ,that verse no longer holds on a nation
which has rejected God's blessing and embraced the perverse ,the wicked and the sodomite,even accepting them into the military....
Whoops, I think someone needs to call the asylum and tell them to come get their inmate.
Although I support everyone's right to express themselves, doesn't this guy go just a little too far over the top for JW/DW?? You can just about be assured that some of his posts will be used to smear JW/DW, if they haven't been already.
Posted by: mepeteart at January 7, 2008 4:12 PM
I think a lot are missing the real point here. IRGC gun boats got within 200 yards of the 3 ships. This is a reflection and a poor one at that on the Rules of Engagement. The boats were discerned and tracked long before they got within the 200 yards. It just took that long to get permission to engage. It is just a sad fact of life in our PC way of doing things to go from warning yellow, weapons tight to warning red, weapons free in such a long time, especially in a potentially hot area such as the Straits of Hormuz. Vessels displaying such hostile intent should have been engaged long before they got within 200 yards. This is insane.
Posted by: Caratacus at January 7, 2008 4:14 PM
Rocketman is right, maybe a little dramatic but who cares, the truth is the truth.
The only thing I would say is that its not just the US. All western nations, Canada, Britain, France, Germany, Australia even Israel (who should know better) are morally bankrupt. Our societies are decadent beyond extreme that is undeniable and our leaders are more concerned with being politically correct than protecting and leading, working for the people.
Don't smear him, listen to him, ask him questions, he certain doesn't sound like an Islamic apologist, and why should he be satisfied with the marxists running things?
Don't be so quick to cast stones.
Posted by: Sneakyzionistcrusader at January 7, 2008 4:21 PM
When the terrorist promise to protect Bush, we can believe them can't we?
Personally Rocketman, I don't care too much for spontaneous religious rhetoric here on JW/DW, unless it is done with some connection to Jihad. Talking about how God is going to punish us all sounds Islamic, but some Christians also indulge themselves with dooms day stuff. I see threatening others with God, as being obnoxious and a display of supremecism. Possibly you do not mean to be perceived this way, but if you want to be taken seriously, maybe you should lighten up on that stuff, just a little. Please take this as friendly advice. :)
I read the article about the swat team, in Colorado.
This type of police behavior has become more common since Waco.
at January 7, 2008 4:34 PM
sneakyzionistcrusader: Yes, the truth is the truth but rocketman thinks President Bush is establishing an Orwellian police state here in America. This is absurd on its face and you know or should know that such a claim is about as far from the truth as one can get. The very fact that rocketman can post his nonsense openly is partially dispositive of just how ludicrous his claims are respecting Bush's establishment of a police state.
And have many Americans ceased to realize that with freedom comes responsibility? Damn right. But that doesn't translate into Armageddon coming soon to a neighborhood near you. People need to get a grip and realize that things are ordinarily neither as good as they seem nor as bad as they seem.
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 4:37 PM
Caratacus: In agreement with you that rules of engagement need to be changed somewhat to favor the good guys more than they seem to now. After all, barbarians should be treated like barbarians.
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 4:42 PM
CT Yankee,
The Cole also had the moral high ground and nineteen sailors died. Better to kill two guys in a little raft who had disregarded all rules. But no. We can't hurt the little guy. We can't be seen as some Goliath killing little David.
Iranians told the U.S. Navy: "I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes".
This is a hostile act. If our military is not allowed to defend itself until the other side explodes a weapon then we had best get out of there. Not because we can't defeat these ninnies but because the world won't let us. Our soldiers, sailors and marines deserve better. The moral high ground belongs to would-be martyrs. That's not the role we should expect our soldiers to play.
Anyone who is worried about the flow of oil through the Persian Gulf can do something about it. China, Japan, India? Aramco? Exxon? BP?
Posted by: PMK at January 7, 2008 4:51 PM
Time to break out the LRAD, keeds. Just refine the beam a little, take aim, and aim right for the head of the guy holding the bomb. Then, crank the Celine Dion and send him to his lord.
Posted by: Jauhara Al-Kafirah at January 7, 2008 4:57 PM
Wellington...years ago I did a local radio show (with a fairly large audience) about various conspiracies, governmental, and otherwise.
People would send me all kinds of literature from political intrigue, to UFO stuff.
The one lesson I learned out of all that, was that 'not all conspiracy theories are theories, some of them are actualities'. Out of the over a hundred or so 'serious' theories I have been exposed to, if even one is 'actual', we could be in big trouble, or already are.
I don't know if Bush is guilty of anything illegal.
I don't know if he is really selling us out to the Saudi's and the NWO or not, but I do know that some of his actions are suspicious, and while I don't condemn him (yet), I don't trust him either.
Of course, I don't trust any politician, I got my paranoia up about them by the time I was 15...
Have a good evening...
at January 7, 2008 4:57 PM
sneakyzionistcrusader: Yes, the truth is the truth but rocketman thinks President Bush is establishing an Orwellian police state here in America.
Damn right !
I've got a picture of a Moslem TSA agent wearing head covering, frisking a white catholic nun at an airport in the U.S.
WHAT THE HELL DO YOU CALL THAT SPIN MASTER ?
It's people like you who make good loyal patriotic servants to totalarian dictatorships.
Your patriotic loyalty is a great asset to the new Reich now forming.
Never question anything.
Your blind faith is remarkable and was in vogue during the first fatherland security movement.
Of course the drive eventually came to silence all opposition to the other great leader.
Lenin had a name for those useful idiots, useful idiots.
at January 7, 2008 5:04 PM
"I read the article about the swat team, in Colorado.
This type of police behavior has become more common since Waco."
Yes ,but wasn't white bread messiah George supposed to save us from all this and not pump it up a few notches ?
Everywhere I've been I've found the die hard brown shirts for George who want to burn all my books for speaking only the truth about their glorious, innocent as the driven snow Fhurer who loves to hold hand's with Saudi King's and steal's land from infidles to reward Islamic terrorists.
Many of the brain's cleansed of all logic and common sense stil refuse to connect the dots.
It might awaken them to the reality that their political messiah is a devil in cheap sheeps skin.
at January 7, 2008 5:11 PM
Allowing these speedboats to within a few hundred metres seems crazy.
If Iran already has a small nuke, a speedboat might make an excellent delivery system; especially if Iran can lull the U.S. to accept these demonstrations as "normal" while they wait for a nice fat target fleet, and especially in confined waters such as the Straight of Hormuz.
at January 7, 2008 5:43 PM
For every time a SWAT team acts in an unethical or illegal manner, one could find twenty or thirty or forty times that other SWAT teams follow things by the book. Perfection from anyone or any group is not realistic. Look at all the folks worldwide who point a finger at the US military and castigate it completely because a few soldiers here and there do things contrary to the extremely high standards set by the finest military on earth. As for conspiracy theories, very, very few ever prove to be true. Almost all are developed by people with way too much time on their hands. But here's one conspiracy theory that is true: 19 Arab Muslim monsters conspired to perpetrate the horrible events that took place in America on September 11, 2001. And while not all Arabs were terrorists on that fateful day, it should never be forgotten that on 9/11 all the terrorists were Arab.
Oh, rocketman, I've seen that picutre of a Muslim woman frisking a Catholic nun at an airport. Yeah, pretty damn idiotic, I'll grant you that. But this does not constitute evidence that America will be done in by Muslims within half a century. Individual acts of stupidity should not be looked upon as evidence that all hope is lost. I think it will take many, many years to defeat Islamic radicalism and we will do some bone-headed things from time to time, just as we have done in virtually every other effort we have made to keep America strong and free.
As for Bush being some kind of dictator in disguise or even someone who has broken the law, I consider such talk without substance. Bush has broken no laws. None. I write this as a lawyer who knows the law pretty well. This doesn't mean Bush has done everything right or anything like that. I have many disagreements with the President, but he has committed no impeachable offenses, as George McGovern ridiculously argued in a Washington Post column the other day. I consider him a fine man in an almost impossible job who has kept us safe here at home and who has taken an enormous risk, one that might very well fail, by his decision not just to continue killing the snakes that come out of the Middle Eastern swamp, but to drain the damn swamp as well. Still touch and go on this one. If Islam proves as rotten as I've come to think it is, then Bush's noble initiative, what Fuad Ajami has called "the foreigner's gift," may be indicative of American idealism gone awry. But if at least some Muslims can let their humanity triumph over their religion, then such a split in the Islamic world would be beneficial to all except those who are rotten throughout. If this be useful idiot material, rocketman, then put me down as a useful idiot. You have a nice day.
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 5:51 PM
Wellington: We are on the same glide path as the UK...Just higher in altitude.
Posted by: solomonpal at January 7, 2008 6:40 PM
solomonpal: I'm not nearly as pessimistic as you are. We will take losses and do stupid things from time to time in this war we're in against a portion (eventually all?) of the Islamic world, but freedom has a way of triumphing in the end over all kinds of tyrannies, including, I strongly believe, Islamic tyranny.
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 6:57 PM
They should've sunk the bastards. I-RAN, (Not E-Ron) has pushed enough, and it has to be dealt with accordingly. Sinking one of these I-RANian row boats would have sent a more concise message to these stains.
Posted by: Prickzilla at January 7, 2008 7:18 PM
Wellington,Lawyer
Now I understand
Navy Lacks Plan to Defend Against `Sizzler' Missile
By Tony Capaccio
March 23 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. Navy, after nearly six years of warnings from Pentagon testers, still lacks a plan for defending aircraft carriers against a supersonic Russian-built missile, according to current and former officials and Defense Department documents.
The missile, known in the West as the ``Sizzler,'' has been deployed by China and may be purchased by Iran. Deputy Secretary of Defense Gordon England has given the Navy until April 29 to explain how it will counter the missile, according to a Pentagon budget document.
The Defense Department's weapons-testing office judges the threat so serious that its director, Charles McQueary, warned the Pentagon's chief weapons-buyer in a memo that he would move to stall production of multibillion-dollar ship and missile programs until the issue was addressed.
``This is a carrier-destroying weapon,'' said Orville Hanson, who evaluated weapons systems for 38 years with the Navy. ``That's its purpose.''
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601070&sid=a5LkaU0wj714&refer=home
at January 7, 2008 8:03 PM
rocketman: What's your point?
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 8:10 PM
posted by rocketman:
Wellington,Lawyer
Now I understand
Oops, now we need to add lawyers to the list of conspirators in rocketman's mind. So far we have sodomists, swat teams, 'Herr' Bush, Amerika (the deviant state)...have I missed any rocketman? Oh, probably me too, right?
at January 7, 2008 8:12 PM
Since my comment was what started rocketman, I feel I should add to what I first said just to clear the air so the thread does not get hijacked as it appears that it already has.
I was saying that we (USofA) or better yet the western world should stand up to these midgets and tell them enough is enough.
My quote of the scriptures was, in this case, only meant to cheer and encourage. As for God's judgment I will leave that to Him and I think it's presumptuous for anyone to assume his place to judge. The first context of the verse is Israel, but in a extended version it fits us more that it fits the enemy, who is the aggressor.
Rocketman, clearly has an ax to grind. I don't think that is the subject of this thread or of this site.
I heard or read somewhere that when, men assume the position of judgment they are in territory that they are ill equipped to do correctly. The only man that comes to mind that was willing to judge a nation was Daniel and he acknowledged his own sin with the nation.
Dan 9:5
we have sinned, committed iniquity, acted wickedly and rebelled, even turning aside from Your commandments and ordinances.
دان 9:5
لقد اخطأ ، وارتكب الظلم ، وتصرفت بطريقة شريرة وتمرد ، حتى تحول جانبا من الوصايا والاوامر الخاصة بك
at January 7, 2008 10:08 PM
However they're armed, it's insane that we allow these barbarians to come that close to our shipping without converting them into driftwood. Small fast attack boats haven't historically been very ineffective in fighting real warships. However, if your sailors manning the guns have their hands tied by some absolutely BS politically correct rules of engagement, that creats an entirely different sort of environment-one that dramatically favors the enemy, especially an enemy who doesn't give a damn if they live to fight another day.
The solution is easy: kill the bastards. They're being tracked and warned at distance. When they come within range of our ships they should be blown out of the water. It's a simple plan. It's worked in the past, it'll work now.
at January 7, 2008 10:32 PM
livefreeordie!: Agree with you. Blow the Islamic bastards out of the water next time. As Winston Churchill knew only too well, it is imperative that the barbarian fear the civilized more than the other way around. And who is more barbaric than the zealots running Iran today, along with their clueless followers like the lemmings in these boats? Make them fear us. Kill them next time. Besides, they're leading useless lives anyway.
Posted by: Wellington at January 7, 2008 10:44 PM
Wellington: I am with you... destroy the bastards but don't underestimate them...after all look what happened in Iraq post invasion. I also stipulated we are at a higher altitude than UK so there is room to deviate but what we have going for us now paints the picture bleak. That part about freedom triumphs is pie in the sky. History and even a cursory examination of current world conditions suggests freedom does not always triumph. It does not materialize from thin air.
Posted by: solomonpal at January 7, 2008 11:38 PM
Not suprising, Iran looking to pick a fight, knowing that it is dealing with a superpower.
Posted by: bigcatgirl13106 at January 8, 2008 7:04 AM
solomonpal: Thanks for your response. Yes, destroy Islamic radicals and forget negotiating anything with them. When I said freedom always triumphs, I should have added the qualifier "for the Anglo-Saxon world." I just don't see the English-speaking world ever allowing freedom to die, especially to such a retrograde phenomenon like Islam. I even have more hope for the mother country, England, than many others do, although I readily admit that she's in a good bit of trouble.
Radical Muslims are digging their own grave just by being themselves and people will take only so much and no more. Two big obstacles here, though, are PC politicians and media folk. Both need to be marginalized and replaced with far more realistic individuals and that could take some time. One thing's for sure and that is defeating Islamic nutjobs and their supporters is going to be a long fight. My best to you and yours.
Posted by: Wellington at January 8, 2008 12:49 PM
DaveMate, mepeteart, Wellington, etc.,
I believe George W. Bush has done much to harm Israel's security. I do not believe Bush cares one iota about innocent Jewish lives; not Jewish men, women or children. There are many who believe Bush has turned against Israel. Some call Bush an enemy of Israel. I would not argue the point. Perhaps you consider this extreme. I consider that Bush has done and is doing to Israel and to the land of Israel extreme and hostile.
Steve
Posted by: monk at January 8, 2008 5:38 PM
Correction: I consider what Mr. Bush has done and is doing to Israel and to the land of Israel extreme and hostile. He has become my enemy if you will. Bush has turned America and American foreign policy decidedly against the Jews in Israel. He has appeased our jihadist enemies at Israel's expense. This is unforgivable.
Posted by: monk at January 8, 2008 5:42 PM
He is very lucky that we are a more enlightened civilisation, not stuck in a medieval mind set. He better hope things stay that way, though I suspect they won't for too much longer.
Thats what pisses him off so much is we play our game , not his
Posted by: OLD SARGE at January 8, 2008 8:24 PM
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