Just keep it up, everywhere.

Committees of Correspondence, revived for a much more menacing occasion.

Aux armes, citoyens. But not the normal kind of arms. The other kind. The kind that at this point are most effective for self-defense.

Posted by: Hugh at April 5, 2008 1:49 PM

Right on!! Thanks you for defending us against this type of Islamic apologist right up fron and pulling the carpet right out from under him. This what more of us need to do. JihadWatch and other sites as well as books and videos like Robert Spencer's are of a great help.

Posted by: roymiii at April 5, 2008 2:00 PM

Did anyone get any of the exchange on film? What were the questions, specifically? How many participants were in this prepared group? Tell more, give specific tips. Wonderful. Congratulations. Maybe you could take your show on the road...

Posted by: former liberal WF at April 5, 2008 2:01 PM

This is welcome news.

But I'd also be most interested in receiving a follow up regarding repercussions from faculty and/or student groups next week.

Posted by: The Cool Ghoul at April 5, 2008 2:04 PM

Well done.

Its people like you who will make the difference.

Posted by: Daffersd at April 5, 2008 2:07 PM

"Be an informed citizen! Read Jihad Watch!"

Exactly!

Not just so that one knows what lies one is being told, but also so that one can speak up, wherever the opportunity arises, and so that thus others hopefully find the courage to speak up themselves, without fear of being labelled 'racist', for example.

And draw attention to this site, at every opportunity.

Posted by: Calon Lan at April 5, 2008 2:08 PM

While this news seems encouraging, and many thanks to the student and his cohorts for having major cajones, the fact that this muslim wasn't run out of town on a rail indicates to me that the students in attendance still do not get it.

I now believe that this muslim man would kill them all given half the chance. I only wish the writer had been able to press this line of questioning to include:

Am I a kaffir?

Did muhammed have sexual intercourse with a nine-year old girl?

What happens if I refuse to accept Islam and refuse to pay Jizya?

What is a Dhimmi?

What is Taqqiya?

Etc, etc, etc. Hope this student is bright enough to see that he may need a large caliber weapon with a high capacity magazine and possibly some toughening-up with mixed martial arts activities.

Posted by: No More Ham, Ed at April 5, 2008 2:10 PM

Lastly, to borrow from Javier Bardems' character, Anton Chigurh, "What business is it of yours what religion I choose to follow, friendo? Call it.

Posted by: No More Ham, Ed at April 5, 2008 2:16 PM

Reading this was really refreshing to say the least. A very short interlude in this on going education and fight against this barbaric and violent ideology.

Posted by: savsiv at April 5, 2008 2:16 PM

Some months prior to 9/11, I was working as a computer consultant. In a training session with a 3rd party vendor, I noticed that there was a woman from Saudi Arabia in the group. She spoke freely and at length about "what life is really like" in Saudi Arabia, in stark contrast to what "the western media" has to say about it.

I remained silent.

After about two weeks of this, I used a couple Arabic phrases that I learned during my four years of residence in Jubail while working in Saudi. She was not only surprised that I can speak a smattering of Arabic, she went six shades of white when I convinced her that I had, indeed, lived in Saudi for four years. Not too many Americans know what "al-kilab tanbah w'al qa'fila tassir" means in English.

Despite the fact that I never once challenged her remarks (pure "bring your hip waders" taqiyya from the get-go), she never said another word about Saudi.

Arabs/Muslims depend on an uninformed western population in order to BS their way through a head-to-head with westerners. This guy in Cincinnati is an object lesson in "forewarned is forearmed."

JihadWatch.org
DanielPipes.org
Memri.org

Get to know them. Learn them. Don't be just another snivelling ignorant lackey in the fight against global Islamization.

Posted by: Kevin M at April 5, 2008 2:17 PM

Somehow, Hugh, when you say it in French, your exhortation sounds more stirring, more inspiring, more exhilarating--Aux armes!

This is a very good bit of news. I wonder what the Wahabi branch of Islam, Unlimited will do when word returns that the natives are RESTIVE in the chief of Infidel Lands?

Posted by: John C at April 5, 2008 2:42 PM

While I would like to have seen this student ask about sura 9; abrogation; pigs and monkeys; and a few more things -- I want to say THANK YOU SO MUCH for such raw courage!

Look, this law student has got "guts" and that is something that is so lacking in Western society, that I have almost forgotten what it looks like!

Now I remember --- it looks just like this student!

Thank you again, whoever you are, for rekindling in me a faint glimmer of hope that not everyone in American Universities is a complete idiot!

Bless you child! Bless you!

Posted by: witness at April 5, 2008 2:47 PM

Go University of Cincinnati!

"Thanks" to whomever sent this information in!

>>8. And that all these were "moderate" Islamic positions.

Proof that there's no such thing as a "Moderate Muslim" - they are only a Myth.

Posted by: champ at April 5, 2008 2:50 PM

Obstacle#2: The Islamic apologist will claim that this is just Saudi Arabia: we ______ (Palestinians/Pakis/Bangladeshis/Iranians/Iraqi/Syrians/Jordanians/ Egyptians/Somalis/Omani/Malays/...) don't believe in the same thing

Posted by: Infidel Pride at April 5, 2008 2:55 PM

Be concerned thes people want us dead thei religion is for death ours is for life.

The black flag will never rise its the banner of Islam.

NEVER AND i mean NEVER trust these types

Posted by: ramonsan at April 5, 2008 3:02 PM

"What's the best way to kill a homosexual?"

Always a good question for the Sharia apologist on a university campus.

Posted by: Celsius at April 5, 2008 3:06 PM

"This is welcome news.

But I'd also be most interested in receiving a follow up regarding repercussions from faculty and/or student groups next week. "

So would I.

Posted by: Big Luke at April 5, 2008 3:15 PM

I'm a natural born cynic. Sorry to be a killjoy but this story seems to good to be true.

I mean, what happened to taqqiya?

I do hope this story is true, but I would like to see some corroberation. Any story like this (whather for or against your point of view) shoul dbe treated with skepticism, unless it can be verified.

AbuTrevor

Posted by: abuTrevor at April 5, 2008 3:16 PM

Congratulations to the law students who took matters into their own hands to prevent the lecturer from presenting sharia as something compatible with Western thought!

By the way, they've compiled a great list to take along to similar lectures.

Posted by: eve_anne_gelical at April 5, 2008 3:23 PM

The story is heartening, but such stories always seem to carry the same proviso: you can only see them here.

We who read them are grateful for the good work on jihadwatch and dhimmiwatch, but I am always moved to ask: why can't stories like this one be shouted from rooftops? Why are they not reported by mainstream news? How do these essential facts become everyone's knowledge?

"They don't" - might be the last word on the subject. I don't know what to say. But I will continue to read jihadwatch in case I ever find myself in a similar situation. And I recommend it whenever I get the chance.

Posted by: Novalis at April 5, 2008 3:26 PM

Long Live The Glorious Counterjihad! Deus vult!

Posted by: John C at April 5, 2008 3:27 PM

These "interfaith" meetings are just soothing sessions.

Shackling and hoisting conscious animals seems to violate both the humane intent of Islamic slaughter law, and the Prophet's comments on the process of slaughter. Concerning slaughter Muhammad has said:

"When one of you slaughters, let him complete it," meaning that one should sharpen the knife well and feed, water, and soothe the animal before killing it."

108 Ibn Majah; as cited in Al-Qaradawi, 57.

Posted by: interestinconundrum at April 5, 2008 3:45 PM

Priceless. Wonderful. I've had opportunities in the past to do this (including an address by Tariq Ramadan to an all-Muslim audience), but I've fumbled them because I didn't know how to phrase the questions properly. I look forward to learning. And in the meantime, I am delighted and heartened at this occurrence. Thank you to the people who accomplished this; it is a commendable achievement.

Posted by: Funky Child at April 5, 2008 3:47 PM

Novalis;
I posted a letter from a german who lived through the Nazi rise and fall. He succinctly compared it to Islam. I copied everyone in my address book, over 200 people. A lot of them are liberals and I may lose a few friends,but at least one took my advice and forwarded to his friends. If we all send this iformation to our friends with a request to pass it on, the word will get out.

Richard Garnache

Posted by: old fogey at April 5, 2008 3:56 PM

Yay! Bravo! Good going!

Posted by: TS at April 5, 2008 3:59 PM

Sometimes Jihad Watch can be very depressing when we see the tremendous task that we are up against. If we can only have more little rays of sunshine like this, it would be inspiring to the spirit. The fact that it happened in the leftist mind dungeons of American academia makes it all the more refreshing.

Posted by: Briars at April 5, 2008 4:03 PM

Thank you for sharing that and thank you to Jihad Watch for playing your huge part in saving the West.

Posted by: Armoured Passionfruit at April 5, 2008 4:15 PM

Every University campus should have a well informed and knowledgeable group like these students that can spring into action whenever an Islamic appologist is invited to speak to the student body.

Though I support Islamo-Facist awareness week, I think that David Horowitz might want to consider a training program on each campus for student activists interested in forming a full time strike force to confront people like Dr. Abdulkareem Hamad A. Alsaiygh whenever they come acalling.

I would certainly contribute to the cause.

Posted by: rational at April 5, 2008 4:20 PM

One other thing:
Since FITNA many people, especially in Europe, have also watched 'What the West needs to know' (the link is here on jihad watch - if you haven't watched it yet - do it!), and have posted the link repeatedly.,
I hope we're starting see the small beginnings of an avalanche, as more and more knowledge about the truth of Islam is spread.

I'd also like to point out that the view, so prevalent in the secular societies of the West, that all religion is private, or ought to be (a relic of the Enlightenment, this!) is counterproductive, as Islam is not a private religion and never can be.
Agnostics and atheists need to understand, that, unlike Islam, Christians, who stand up against this perverted 'religion', are not aiming to establish a Chrisitan Theocracy.
If we want to oppose Islam on all fronts, all of us, atheists and people of non-Islamic faiths, have to stand together, because Islam looks upon all of us as infidels.

Posted by: Calon Lan at April 5, 2008 4:20 PM

BANED

Posted by: have_mercy at April 5, 2008 4:28 PM

"Sharia Sucks"

....new bumper sticker?

Posted by: champ at April 5, 2008 4:43 PM

My family thought I was becoming some sort of bigot when I started explaining my concerns about Islam. Yet, once I showed them what common Muslim believe, they were horrified.

Good job in exposing that moderate Islam is itself a horrific belief system.

The truth is our best weapon. Get these guys to come clean with what they believe and most liberals and most Westerners will begin to ask why we allow them in our countries.

Posted by: James Martel at April 5, 2008 5:07 PM

I concur with 'former liberal WF'.

In future any such intellectual SWAT team such as this Cincinnati law student describes, should include a person or persons recording the interchange - even if it's just someone with secretarial training taking it all down in shorthand.

That way the exchange can be gone over afterwards, missed catches and suchlike can be identified, and technique improved for next time.

Furthermore, a transcript could be posted at sites like this, for encouragement and inspiration but also for comment and analysis.

We have got to see what works on the ground and what doesn't.

The challenge in the intellectual arena will be to keep one's cool and uphold the honor of the Free West, without inadvertently conforming to the dhimmi pattern whereby Muslims expect us to defer, speak respectfully, etc., while they are free to insult and use spiritual violence.

People like this Cincinnati student would profit from going over videos and transcripts of Mr Spencer's debates with Muslims - and perhaps even also checking out Fr Zakaria Botros in action, if transcripts of some of his presentations can be obtained.

Both are good examples of how to avoid speaking like a dhimmi, while also refusing to dirty one's hands with the deceptions and violences of much Muslim rhetoric.

kevin m - what DOES "al-kilab tanbah w'al qa'fila tassir" in fact mean in English? Do please share - If it is suitable for a PG-rated comments floor like this, that is.

Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at April 5, 2008 5:13 PM

Fantastic story, I enjoy reading about success against Islam.

Its just like when they say, "we cannot lie or steal our religion forbids this."

What they really mean is we cannot lie or steal from other Mulims, everyone else is fair game. This is how they get away with rape, murder..etc. If only more people could see this religion for what it really is.

Posted by: Isamisevil at April 5, 2008 5:25 PM

Echoing AbuTrevor:

Robert,

Do you have any independent verification of this event?

So far, I have found only that a website for the "CENTER FOR ISLAMIC CONTEMPORARY STUDIES AND DIALOGUE OF CIVILIZATIONS - CICSDC" at the Al-Imam Muhammad Ibn Saud University exists

http://www.imamu.edu.sa/cicsdc/ObjectiveE.htm

I cannot confirm the faculty member ("Dean") position, or that such a guest lecture of this type occurred on the University of Cincinnati campus.

All of my Google search combinations lead only to this JihadWatch thread and its various reproductions.

I hope it's true. (I'd really like to have the video/audio/transcript).

Posted by: Concerned Citizen at April 5, 2008 5:28 PM

Outstanding!

A battle won with the weapon of truth - supplied by JW/DW.

Many more to go, until the ultimate goal of establishing a global ban (except for the arabian desert) of islam.

Posted by: TINBH at April 5, 2008 5:28 PM

That kid and his or her pals are going to be dynamite litigators.

>>Both are good examples of how to avoid speaking like a dhimmi, while also refusing to dirty one's hands with the deceptions and violences of much Muslim rhetoric

There's a blog called "citizenwarrior," I think, that also has some excellent points about gentle verbal resistance and persuasion.

Posted by: Marwan'sDaughter at April 5, 2008 5:31 PM

Sounds like these JWers are on the right track. Note for future reference: get it on video or audio. There are now very simple and tiny handheld devices that will permit high quality audio recordings of the sort needed. You can even purchase tiny add-on mics that will turn your ipod into a simple but powerful recorder (Disclaimer: I have no relationship to Apple Corp. Not an endorsement.)

Perhaps a new pull-down section can be added, to larger media files obtained by JW'ers documenting Jihad-related events in North America and Europe, or perhaps a sympathetic site like LGF, Atlast Shrugs, TROP or MEMRI might open up a streaming or torrent audio-video archival service for this purpose.

Posted by: Archimedes2 at April 5, 2008 6:02 PM

And yet the battle is far from won, and in fact, we are playing catch up. Look at this story from yesterday:

he Downward Spiral of Case Western Reserve University

Note: The following article was written by Case Western ZOA President Caleb Posner, and does not necessarily reflect the views of our national organization, or any other group, unless otherwise noted.

In September, I started a campus chapter of the Zionist Organization of America because I was concerned with the situation at Case Western Reserve University. There were Jewish groups to be certain, but none were politically inclined, regardless of how legitimate the cause for outrage was. So, after attending a lecture by Walt and Mearsheimer designed to promote their re-framing of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion as a legitimate and scholarly work, and seeing that I was virtually alone in my condemnation of their lies, I assumed the burden of organizing a pro-Israel, or at least pro-truth group on campus. A few weeks later, cause for protest arose after a campus student group decided to fund raise for an organization seemingly linked to Middle Eastern terror organizations. Knowing that mounting a successful protest would require some outside assistance, I began the search for a partner organization. And, within moments of calling, the ZOA became exactly that. Their willingness to help, their resource generosity, and the experience that they were able to provide made that protest highly successful. In all, we turned away upwards of three dozen would-be supporters of the event being protested.

As time went on, the need for further protest not only continued, but increased with alarming frequency. Speakers who lied about Israel were being brought in regularly by the Hallinan Project, a local chapter of the radical Students For Justice in Palestine arose, and anti-Semitic graffiti covered the Spirit Wall. In response to every such event, we did our best to organize a strong response, focusing primarily on dispelling the false statements being made about Israel. Suffice to say, this was not enough. We realized that to become a more important voice on campus, hosting events of our own would be critical. Thus, with the start of the second semester, so began the quest to obtain USG recognition. Thankfully, this was granted to us days ago, and we are working hard to deliver thought provoking programming for the rest of the month, as well as for the next academic year.

It seemed momentarily as though the situation was getting better, and that with some hard work, the ZOA could severely reduce the problems this school’s Jewish community faced. However, this turned out be a grossly inaccurate evaluation of the situation. This semester, a Jewish student was violently assaulted based solely on his religious and ethnic heritage. There was no report filed, because the student in question lacked faith in an administration who was unwilling to condemn speakers like Alice Rothchild and Alison Weir, and who did nothing in response to the anti-Semitic vandalism earlier in the year. And every effort has been made to match the rhetoric with the violence in its offensiveness. From posters accusing Israel of being a terrorist nation, to guest speakers alleging that Zionists and Nazis collaborated during the Shoah, it looked like the situation had hit rock bottom.

And yet, in this past week, our institution has sunk to a new low. Palestine Awareness Week, the hallmark event of Israel hatred, was announced as coming to Case. In just a couple of weeks, we can expect an onslaught of the most vile and pernicious lies ever uttered about Israel, carefully concealed anti-Semitism, and the legitimization of terrorism. In short, by hosting this event, Case Western Reserve University has joined an elite circle of campuses most hostile to Jewish students. Were the administration willing to decry such practices, it would be less alarming. But just days ago, I spoke with President Snyder, who expressed no willingness to condemn the hateful campaign waged against Israel that has made campus hostile to Jewish students. And, even the university newspaper has caved to pressure, cutting my column in response to complaints I made about campus anti-Semitism. Of course, the editor tried to justify this by claiming there were factual inaccuracies in my article. But, as I explained to her, she was mistaken on both counts, and I am more than willing to prove it publicly.

My latest article engendered a lot of hated among those who are either loyal to the professor discussed throughout it, or who have distaste for Israel and the Jewish community. According to my editor, I was never in class with Alice Bach. This is untrue. I was enrolled in Ethnic Studies 251, a class of hers, at the start of the Fall semester. But, I removed myself from it during the drop/add period because it became immediately clear the sort of treatment that Israel would be given. And of course nowhere in my article did I claim anything longer than that. The second thing she claims, is that I was wrong in calling Alice Bach the faculty advisor for the SJP. That may well be, but I was going on Bach’s own words. Following the Alice Rothchild lecture, I and other members of the Case Western ZOA approached her and asked her to sponsor our organization. She declined, citing among other things, her status as the faculty advisor to the SJP. So, either she lied to us, or they have changed advisors exceptionally recently. But two other members of our executive board can attest to the claim I made in my article.

Outside of those points, there were no errors she could locate to condemn me for. Instead, she noted the heavy volume of critical responses. Naturally, a subject as sensitive as this arouses the passions of many. But who writes in to comment on how good or right a piece is? Not anybody that I know. And certainly, it wouldn’t make for interesting reading, so I doubt such material would have been printed even if submitted. While I received compliments from current and former students who read the paper, she was not privy to that information, as it ought to be irrelevant, in the same way that complaints are. The fact is, she caved into external pressure, and tried to justify her decision by citing supposed factual errors, which unfortunately for her were 100% correct as printed. By cutting the only column that ever stood in defense of Israel (since I started here at least), due to writing about anti-Semitism, the editor has only helped to contribute to the climate of intolerance that has now become a core part of campus identity.

The closing down of this major means of support for Israel is all the more alarming when put in context. Being newly recognized, our local chapter is essentially devoid of funding. We cannot afford to put on the same sort of flashy presentations that the opposition uses to draw in those who are uneducated about the Middle East. The lack of opportunity to voice our concerns due to lack of funding is made all the worse when you consider how many thousands of dollars the other side has been given to promote their message. Our school has not stood up for academic freedom, honest discussion, or balance, but for the unfettered presentation of bullshit.

Where Case will be by this time next year is anybody’s guess. But looking at the current situation, where every pro-Israel voice gets silenced, and every anti-Israel advocate is given a podium and an audience, the future looks bleak. The opposition seeks to silence us because they know we are right, and that if we were given equal voice, their support would readily dissipate. So they make every effort to quite us down. But we at the Case Western ZOA will not stand for this. Instead, we will do whatever is within our legal ability to counter this unfortunate reality and make a positive change for the school’s Jewish minority, and for others who prefer tolerance to hatred.

Having said all of this, we welcome any help, thoughts, or inquiries. Our email address casewesternzoa[at]gmail[dot]com

Posted by: mgoldberg at April 5, 2008 6:11 PM

Jihad Comes to Wall Street

"Sharia finance" does exactly what it promises, financing the spread of sharia — and terror.

By Alex Alexiev

4 April 2008: If you’ve seen Geert Wilders’s film Fitna, you may not have noticed a single headline amongst all the bombings, beheadings, and earnest expressions of Islam’s eventual world domination: Halal-fund: investments for Muslims. But the investment vehicles referenced are an essential part of radical Islam’s efforts to insinuate itself into Western societies in order to destroy them from within.

EXCERPT: Sharia is a reactionary-to-the-core medieval Islamic doctrine that claims control over every aspect of every Muslim’s life. It imposes such “ethical” mandates on Muslims as the obligation to discriminate against women and non-Muslims; to kill homosexuals, adulterers, and apostates; to establish and maintain Muslim rule around the world; and to carry out violent offensive jihad against infidels. Notably, for those Muslims who cannot engage in physical jihad using force of arms, sharia requires that they support jihad financially. This is what sharia finance is all about.

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=ZjBhMTM5MTlmN2YzNzE0MmFkOTg2OGYxNWM2MGNiNTQ

Posted by: witness at April 5, 2008 6:22 PM

Yes! Yes!

Just ask the right questions. The the reason these apologist exist is because our media never asks the right questions. In order to do that you must first have some knowledge of Islam etc.

The first question will lead to the second...etc...Lawyers are good at that.

Just let the apologist hang themselves. Don't call them names, but bring out the "devil" in them.

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at April 5, 2008 6:30 PM

>>The the reason these apologist exist is because our media never asks the right questions. In order to do that you must first have some knowledge of Islam etc. --posted above.

Exactly. That's what Truth sites such as JW/DW are for!

Posted by: darcy at April 5, 2008 6:37 PM

"he had lost a vast majority of the audience"
Keep an eye on those he failed to loose

Posted by: haramfidel at April 5, 2008 6:37 PM

Well, there are also Muslims in Bosnia, Albania, Kosovo. These Muslims could be classified as moderates (in the ordinary meaning of the word). They go to mosque few times a year, rarely pray and drink alcohol, women are not veiled and rarely read Quran. But they do have more traditional view on gender roles and they don't eat pork.

Basically they are mostly atheists, but they are still cultural Muslims.

Posted by: johnsawyer at April 5, 2008 6:38 PM

If the audience could be swayed, that is a significant achievement.

Posted by: Pelayo at April 5, 2008 6:58 PM

johnsawyer

"Basically they are mostly atheists, but they are still cultural Muslims."

The problem is that many cultural Germans and Japanese fought to defend Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan. I have a bad feeling many of these cultural muslims will side with the jihadist when push comes to shove.

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at April 5, 2008 7:12 PM

There is a Christian church in Saudi. Go to Daniel Pipes' site, scroll down, and you'll see a picture.

http://www.danielpipes.org/

Posted by: Cinder at April 5, 2008 7:21 PM

Cinder:

No, that one is in Qatar.

Cordially
Robert Spencer

Posted by: jihadwatch at April 5, 2008 7:25 PM

Charles Wesley's hymn, 'For the Mahometans':

'The smoke of the infernal cave,
Which half of Christendom oe'rspread,
Disperse, thou heavenly Light, and save,
The souls by that Imposter led;
That Arab-chief, as Satan bold,
Who quite destroyed thy Asian fold,
O might the blood of sprinkling cry,
For those who spurn the sprinkled blood!

Assert, Thy glorious Deity
Stretch out Thine arm, Thy Triune God!
The Unitarian fiend expel
And chase his doctrine back to hell!'

Bernard Manning, Fellow and Bursar of Jesus College, Cambridge, wrote in his book, (1942) The Hymns of Wesley and Watts, that 'Wesley has given a vivid and true picture of the devastation wrought in the Christian East by Islam'.

Posted by: devorgilla at April 5, 2008 7:37 PM

This comment is a reply to poster mgoldberg, of Case Western Reserve University.
I feel your outrage, and know that the fight you have chosen to wage in defense of Jews, Israel, and Western Civilization is becoming progressively more difficult. I would suggest that you and other like-minded Jewish students organize, and attempt to inform the parents and alumni of Case Western as to what is going on, recommending the cutting off of all funding and endowments unless and until there is a sea change in the school's attitude. Furthermore, I would suggest, respectfully, that you and all those who believe as you do attempt to transfer out of Case Western into other schools less hostile to Jewish students. If this sounds like defeatism, it's not, because a mass exodus of Jewish students will make the school look bad, as would be appropriate. Finish your education, prosper, and prepare to fight anew once you have done so. Do not let the fight against the growing evil of antisemitism exhaust you and undermine your ability to pursue a career. Not now. Remember what a hudna is to Muslims - it is, in effect, a temporary withdrawal until such time as one's strength is sufficient to resume a battle, and be victorious. Good luck. You, and all of us, are going to need it.

Parenthetically, I am aware of the same trend at the formerly great Vassar College, which broadcasts anti-Israel and antisemitic propaganda every Wednesday afternoon on its locally heard, Poughkeepsie-based radio station. The perpetrator is a Marxist and a rabid hater of Israel, who spews the usual, predictable canards about Israel's apartheid and aggressive nature, etc. Vassar offers no programs with opposing viewpoints. I have attempted to get local Jewish groups to organize in protest, but my efforts have up until now been unsuccessful.

Posted by: commonsense at April 5, 2008 7:43 PM

I wrote this last night in response to a Rabbi's foolish call for Jews to engage in interfaith dialogue with Muslims on the website of a Jewish newspaper. He cites the Saudi King's invitation to dialogue as the third such overture from Muslims leaders in recent months. I think it fits--and will do more good--here:

The reason that Jewish-Christian dialogue has been so successful is that Jews and Christians share many of the same values. Where there has been Christian anti-Semitism, Jews could appeal to Christians to act more “Christian.” This is similar to blacks during the civil rights movement pushing whites to live up to the values stated in the Declaration of Independence and the US Constitution.

Ultimately Christians can’t obey the command to love their neighbor if they tolerate hatred toward the Jew next door. Americans couldn’t declare all men to be equal while denying that equality to men with black skin.

Unfortunately, interfaith dialogue will not result in changes to Muslim attitudes toward Jews. There is no basis within Islamic values for treating the infidel, whether Jewish or Christian, with respect, dignity and equality.

While Christians are implored to love their neighbor and Americans to treat all men equally under the law, Islam demands its followers fight the Infidels until the whole world submits to the supremacy of Islam. The most important act for any Muslim male is participating in Jihad. Only someone killed fighting for Allah is guaranteed a place in heaven. Sharia law codifies both gender and religious apartheid.

So then, why does someone like King Abdullah seek interfaith dialogue? He fears that many in the West are learning about Islam and the societies of the Middle East, discovering the hatred taught in Saudi-sponsored Western mosques and becoming more aware of bigotry and incitement to violence found in the media and scholastic text books in Arab countries.

The Saudis certainly don’t want to lose access to American universities, doctors and financial investments. They also know that by sponsoring interfaith dialogue, Western governments will be less likely to take the necessary defensive measures to prevent the continuing spread of Islam throughout the bilad al-kuffar at a time when said dialogue brings hopes of better relations.

What better way for the Gulf Arabs to portray moderation than in reaching out to Jews. They know that there are many Jews, so eager to be loved and accepted, who will jump at the opportunity to meet the Saudis despite not the slightest shred of evidence of sincerity. Then those same Jews tell their fellow Americans, including Jews in newspapers like this, what wonderful progress is possible in solving Middle East conflicts and reducing Muslim anti-Semitism. Heck, some Rabbis and newspaper editors, so thrilled to be indulged by despotic Saudi bigots, might even explain the “Arab narrative” to other Westerners, including all the wonderful things the Saudis are supposedly doing to modernize their country, promote moderation and give women more rights.

Meanwhile, the Saudis and other Muslims will keep right on teaching their children not to take Christians and Jews as friends, honoring suicide bombers and funding hate literature for mosques around the world. They will continue to publish and broadcast genocidal anti-Semitic material in their media. King Abdullah’s government will still fund Muslim student groups on US college campuses to demonize Israel and advocacy groups such as CAIR that continue to defend the Islamists and slander Israel.

And then the Saudis will back off from the dialogue after it serves its public relations purpose, but before the Muslim masses accuse them of apostasy, without any positive gains for the Jews. Nothing will change, except that the charade will have caused the US, Western Europe and Israel to let down their guard a little more, not based on Saudi/Arab actions, but because of a few false promises and a few pleasing (but untrue) platitudes about the peaceful nature of Islam.

In the event this dialogue ever takes place, you can come back and read this comment. Things will not turn out any other way.

One more thing: let’s say the Saudis were genuinely interested in showing a little more respect for Judaism. Should we really be running to embrace a society that executes gays, treats women as less than fully human, cuts off limbs from people who steal a loaf of bread, stones to death women who have the misfortune of being raped or accused of adultery. shows no generosity toward its poorer Arab brothers who live in countries without oil and treats its foreign workers, particularly the non-Muslim ones, as little more than slaves?

Posted by: 4infidels at April 5, 2008 8:09 PM

johnsawyer

http://youtube.com/watch?v=hYYbCq6tg5c

Posted by: LazarOfSerbia at April 5, 2008 8:22 PM

This comment is a reply to poster mgoldberg, of Case Western Reserve University.

I am not a student or aumnus of Case Western Reserve.
I was merely posting information from a website that was reporting the events, and in relation to the optomistic tone of this post about the denouement of the Saudi Speaker, and the fact that we all, are playing a game of catch up now.... the Case Western issue is common now, and neither rare nor insignificant.

And ceding any university, or college is I believe, erroneous.
They represent parts of counties, states, and as such, the ideas of informing the public, as the video 'Fitna' accomplishes, and other such blunt, truthful, and frank revelations will do much to reveal what is behind all this deceit, and worse.....

the works of Robert Spencer, Hugh Fitzgerald are hopefully beginning to make the ripples in the water that need to grow
and spread wider and further, before real progress can be made.

Posted by: mgoldberg at April 5, 2008 8:40 PM

It amazes me how “moderate” Islamic scholars pretend to have some sort of high enlightenment to convey to us ignorant infidels out of the Koran & Islamic tradition. A little critical interrogation and they come off with all the credibility of a neo-Nazi trying to impress us with Hitler’s Mein Kampf.

It’s as if Islam first attacks a person’s moral balance and then progresses to a brain hollowing out akin to a prion infection.

Posted by: FM at April 5, 2008 9:17 PM

Bravo, Bravissimo

Those students deserve a medal. We should also start a campaign to inform the legislators and to ask them to stand against terrorism instead of running scared from it >
Look what happened at the Tennessee legislature when one lady testifying against the abuse and the corruption in the judicial system of Shelby county mentioned the word TERRORISM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oA0C7_3lwe0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49PLqdECp60

Posted by: Tartine at April 5, 2008 9:27 PM

Bravo to the students at University of Cincinnati.
All is not lost.

Posted by: duh_swami at April 5, 2008 9:30 PM

Kevin M.
"al-kilab tanbah w'al qa'fila tassir"--- Indeed.

I.e., "Dogs bark, but the caravan goes on."

Posted by: have_mercy at April 5, 2008 9:55 PM

in looking at this guy's resume it would appear he really has no doctorate at all except in utter bull sht as that is what sharia law is

Posted by: crusader at April 5, 2008 10:23 PM

4infidels,

Excellent post!

One more benefit to Muslims that such a conference would have, is that it would confer on Islam and its Prophet a respectability they does not now enjoy.

By attending such a conference, Jewish and Christian delegates would be giving Islam de facto recognition as an Abrahamic faith, and Mohammed de facto recognition as the last in a line of Judeo/ Christian Prophets. And don't believe for a moment that such a conference won't be constructed in such a way as to stear all delegates into giving such recognition.

I don't doubt for a moment that there are legions of misguided Christian and Jewish leaders that wouldn't hesitate to worship in a Mosque as proof of their goodwill towards Muslims.

I think that's what the King is really after, recognition and respectability, and that's what no believer should ever give him.

Posted by: rational at April 6, 2008 12:22 AM

An occurrence like this is wonderful and proof yet again that one of the greatest tools in exposing Islam for the totalitarian and anti-humanitarian ideology which it is in spades is Islam itself. Yes, sometimes Muslims obfuscate and confuse the uninformed (or complicit) dhimmi, but yet at other times, like this one, they leave no doubt about the hideousness of Mohammed's creed. I'm encouraged. Truth is often elusive but it's also resilient.

Posted by: Wellington at April 6, 2008 12:30 AM

Mgoldberg,

I read your comments with interest as I'm familiar with CWRU.I'm curious as to who the students are who are supporting the "Palestinian" cause. Are these "international" students or local people? As I'm aware that "Case" is a very expensive school that most Ohio residents can not afford to attend.If Antisemitism and hatred are being tolerated at CWRU and this attack on freedom is being sponsored by "international" students, it could be a good idea to contact one of the local news I-teams to investigate the situation. The bad publicity would be enough to shame CWRU into dealing the "Palestinian" problem on campus. I would also suggest that your organization sponsor the next Islamo-fascism awareness week on campus.

Congrats also to the students who exposed the Sharia apologist at the University of Cincinnati.Islam and Sharia can not stand exposure as most people are appalled and disgusted when they find out what Islam really stands for.

Posted by: Roxane at April 6, 2008 1:34 AM

It is nice to see that a little knowledge can cause a large fire to occur, it only takes a spark to bring froth the light. As more lights come together a hugh fire of knowledge will spread. At least that's what I hope. First time commenting long time lurker.

Posted by: jj1980 at April 6, 2008 2:02 AM

The hideousness of our position in America viz. Islam is reflected in the fact that this Muslim Nazi is "teaching" at one of our top universities.

Go back 60-70 years to the era of WW2 -- is it conceivabe in the wildest rantings of a lunatic that in the midst of that conflict, Nazi Germans and supremacist Japanese fascists would be lecturing and studying and "teaching" at an American university?

Now compound matters by imagining thousand more of these mortal disgusting enemies "teaching" at not one, but at hundreds of American universities, then compound it again by adding tens of thousands more attending those universities as "students" freely practicing and propagandizing Nazism and supremacist Japanese imperialism, then compound matters again by these tens of thousands of Naxis and fascists joined by millions more living freely and practicing freely their vile warlike ideology in the midst of that war -- imagine all of this, and then picture us as we sit idly by in the midst of that greatest of World Wars, and compound it a final time by seeing us as glibly incurious, mortally confused, complacent, and stupid, and sympathetic to boot -- imagine ALLl of this and you've barely begun to grasp the heinousness and insidiousness and insanity of our current predicament.

Posted by: jsla at April 6, 2008 3:56 AM

Born April 1, huh, perfect day for a fool to be born.

Posted by: champ at April 6, 2008 4:01 AM

heyyyy old fogey pls can you paste it here so I can have a copy of the letter from the german who survived through nazism, I already have lost nearly all my aussie friends and overseas ones as they refuse to listen and do not want to know me they say that I am a hater and they dont want to hear anything about islam

Posted by: Reverend_Kelly_Kuffir at April 6, 2008 5:29 AM

heyyyy old fogey pls can you paste it here so I can have a copy of the letter from the german who survived through nazism, I already have lost nearly all my aussie friends and overseas ones as they refuse to listen and do not want to know me they say that I am a hater and they dont want to hear anything about islam'

ps hpw dpo I get to download what the west needs to know, I dont know how to do this so my computer keeps a copy for my own use and to show my kids

Posted by: Reverend_Kelly_Kuffir at April 6, 2008 5:31 AM

The further information shows that this speaker was unacquainted with Western audiences and Western ways, and so had not had time to perfect his taqiyya-and-tu-quoque (compare Tariq Ramadan). He spoke, that is, more or less the truth, when asked about certain tenets of Islam (e.g. the death penalty for apostates). He hadn't yet been schooled in the wiles-and-smiles Academy of Interfaith Outreach.

But so many others have.

Posted by: Hugh at April 6, 2008 7:28 AM

Skunk Busters, Something every Campus needs more of.

Posted by: flowerknife_us at April 6, 2008 7:48 AM

greatcometof1577: I have a bad feeling many of these cultural muslims will side with the jihadist when push comes to shove.

LazarOfSerbia: http://youtube.com/watch?v=hYYbCq6tg5c

I remembered reading once a wiki article about Al-Qaeda. Here it is (it's been edited now, though)

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Al-Qaeda&oldid=37712816

Radical Arab veterans of the war against the Soviets in Afghanistan seized on Bosnia as a new opportunity to "defend Islam". Besieged on two fronts and seemingly abandoned by the West, the Bosnian regime was willing to accept any help it could get, military or financial, including that of a number of Islamic organisations, of which al-Qaeda was one.

Several close associates of Osama bin Laden (most notably, Saudi Khalid bin Udah bin Muhammad al-Harbi, alias Abu Sulaiman al-Makki) joined the conflict in Bosnia, but while al-Qaeda might initially have seen Bosnia as a possible bridgehead enabling the radicalisation of European Muslims for operations against other European states and America, Bosnian Muslims had been secularised for generations and their interest in fighting was largely limited to securing the survival of their nascent state.

The "Bosnian Mujahidin" (comprising largely Arab veterans of the Afghan war and not necessarily members of al-Qaeda) thus operated as a largely autonomous force within central Bosnia. While their bravery in the fray initially attracted a small number of native Bosnians to join them, their brutality and a rising number of atrocites committed against civilians came to appall many native Bosnians and repelled new recruits. At the same time, their vigorous attempts to Islamicize the local population with rules on appropriate dress and behaviour were widely resented and largely went unheeded. In his book Al-Qaida’s Jihad in Europe: the Afghan-Bosnian network, Evan Kohlmann sums up: ‘In spite of vigorous efforts to ‘Islamicise’ the nominally Muslim Bosnian populace, the locals could not be convinced to abandon pork, alcohol, or public displays of affection. Bosnian women persistently refused to wear the hijab or follow the other mandates for female behaviour prescribed by extreme fundamentalist Islam.’

-------------
But there are now some "vehabije" (wahhabis), that is Saudi educated and funded preachers, preaching the more extreme brand of Islam in Bosnia. It is not well received and people are generally horrified by it. And yes, most people accept it because of money, not because of love of Allah.

Regarding the comments by posters above: that youtube video is more than ten years old (and jihadists were disenchanted by Bosnian islam), while today you see a big majority of Bosnian Muslims trying to distance themselves from "vehabije".

Posted by: johnsawyer at April 6, 2008 8:31 AM

Kudos to the questioners.

As all the imams say:

"Our greatest fear is an informed citizenry."

Posted by: profitsbeard at April 6, 2008 12:49 PM

Congratulations to these students! They should indeed seriously consider a road show. Very seriously.

In the meantime, please check out Exodus From Darkness at http://www.ministryblue.com/exodus.html

This guy was a Muslim and a terrorist. He travels the world exposing the truth about Islam. Please book him for your church, school or college. People are astounded at what he shares. As we know here at JW, many have no idea - absolutely no idea!

Rev Kuffir - just ask your family and friends "Have you performed due diligence?" It's as simple as that when people don't want to listen to what we are up against. They owe it to themselves and their children to do their homework.

Ms Pig - Australia

Posted by: PorkyPig at April 7, 2008 1:01 AM

Still we wonder...
... how the muslims believe these things: Stoning, Death for apostasy, etc..

They are devout believers, not in a god whose nature is knowable, constrained by His love for man, but a different god. A god who, in their words, cannot be categorized in man's mind and so not understood by man's power to select truth. Thus, the Muslim only knows His will and so can only obey irregardless of reason.

Posted by: Robin Starveling at April 7, 2008 2:42 PM

TO: dumbledoresarmy

"al-kilab tanbah w'al qa'fila tassir" is an old Arabic proverb, meaning "The dogs may bark, but the caravan moves on."

Its meaning suggests that although critics and the low-minded voice their opposition, we should be mindful to continue with the work we know to be correct.

Rise above petty criticisms.

It should be employed carefully, as Arabs are prone to take offense if it is used in a manner that suggests that it is they (the Arabs) who are dogs if you use it after an Arab criticises you for something.

Example: "You should never offend Islam or criticize the prophet Mohammed."

Then you use it. They assume you believe them to be dogs.

And as we all know, dogs are loyal and intelligent.

Rabies, if you look it up in an English-to-Arab dictionary, reads: "The disease of dogs."

This is why salukis are the only dogs Arabs will tolerate. They do not slaver like most dogs.

I was going to study Arabic while I was in Saudi, but I gave up, since I saw no point in being lied to in two languages.

Posted by: Kevin M at April 7, 2008 8:06 PM