Well these are the allies we need in our greatest time of need. But instead they want civilian nuclear deal. I wonder a country that discriminates to all non Muslims, does not allow any human freedom, woman are subjected to second class citizenship. They have all this oil and want civilian nuclear deal? The US has some really great Allies... Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Yemen Ummm.. all in the UMMAH and they hate the US. At least they are our allies no matter what kind of governments they have and no matter how much they want from us. They are our Muslims Allies to fight the Islamic Jihad.

Posted by: savsiv at May 16, 2008 1:59 PM

Bush is holding the Kings right hand with his left hand...Bush is what his right hand possesses.
Uh huh...I wonder how many times it takes the King to wash the filthy kuffir off his hands, after Bush leaves.

Posted by: duh_swami at May 16, 2008 2:08 PM

Can the American government be more stupid? Can someone please tell me why they would do this?

Is it because they fear that Iran will take over Saudi Arabia? In that case, the US could just come in and carpet bomb Iran.

Is it because the Saudis are threatening to tank the American economy since they own many companies in the USA? In that case it is war and the USA should declare it then seize all the Saudi assets.

Don't give totalitarian government's nukes. Make them beholding to the USA for their defense and then use that for leverage to change their behaviour.

Posted by: James Martel at May 16, 2008 2:13 PM

The reason why Bush is visiting SA is now clear. There is another story over at http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080516/pl_afp/mideastusdiplomacybushsaudideals

My first reaction to reading this was to become ill.

Posted by: Eastview at May 16, 2008 2:14 PM

I'm not sure which represents the most unfortunate example in American history of America being aligned with a despicable ally against other despicable regimes for reasons of realpolitik. Is it Stalin's Russia or the present Saudi Arabia? Arguably Pakistan should also be put into this mix. Tough call. I suppose reasonable minds can differ on this one.

Related matter: Both major American political parties (Democrats even more than Republicans) are culpable for the energy situation we face today. We need to drill for oil here at home, build new gas refineries, utilize sound and viable alternatives such as coal and nuclear sources and tell the extremists in the environmental movement that they can stick it where the sun doesn't shine. Oil is a much better source of energy than it is given credit for and pie-in-the-sky alternatives like wind and solar need to be seen for what they are-----marginal sources at best.

Until America no longer needs Middle Eastern oil, any American President will have to suck up to the Saudis from time to time, extremely distasteful as that is, or face economic Armageddon here at home. Right now America is drifting and vulnerable and the political establishment and many environmentalists are deeply culpable for this.

Posted by: Wellington at May 16, 2008 2:16 PM

Pull completely out of the ME. The Saudis will soon beg for help against an ever increasing Iranian threat. Then, for a several hundred billion dollars per year, provide them with US security. Same with Kuwait and all the rest. Turn the jizya upside down. Is that so hard?

Posted by: Sounder at May 16, 2008 2:29 PM

Sounder: Respectuflly I submit to you that your proposal is totally unrealistic. See my previous post for part of the reason why. Another reason is that Israel would understandably and rightly look upon complete American withdrawal from the Middle East as abandonment by the United States. The key is to harm those who hate you without harming yourself and those with you. Your proposal would not accomplish that.

Posted by: Wellington at May 16, 2008 2:37 PM

What a cute couple. Looks like they're walking down the aisle together. Bride could use a shave and a tummy tuck, though.

Posted by: champ at May 16, 2008 2:41 PM

If Kaddafi is entitled to nuclear technology, I suppose the House of Saud demands consistency.

/... politicans, prophets and divines

Posted by: Terp Mole at May 16, 2008 2:44 PM

We will tap our oil, it's a matter of when. Oil is our lifeblood,and it will be for quite some time.

We do not need the "grass is greener" nuclear power, all nuclear plants right now could be replaced with solar and wind power,as well as other sources, and meet our needs. Nuclear is good for bombs, thats it ASAICS.

We all are enviros, every one of us, its just a matter of activity.

We will tap our own oil, and tomorrow is another day lost to our needs and security if we delay any further.

Posted by: Islofob IS-1 at May 16, 2008 2:48 PM

This, I think, is the death knell of the Republican Party's hopes for 2008. I've been hoping against hope that the Bush Whitehouse would wake up with a strident defense of US national interests. I think the world and the US electorate will see this as verifying the flaccidity of Bush's policy. When Obama takes over foreign policy, and the liberal dems control Congress, the Islamists will be greatly encouraged. G-d help us all.

Posted by: RickB at May 16, 2008 2:51 PM

Gosh, I sure hope we charge them as much for nuclear energy as they do for petroleum.

Posted by: TheOmegaMan at May 16, 2008 2:55 PM

Wellington, I don't propose we abandon Israel. I should say pull out of the arab ME. The US has no boots on the ground in Israel as far as I know. I say pull out of Islamic lands including Saudi and let them squeal, yet stand strong for Israel. They can then pay highly, enough to more than cover the cost of oil. It seems to me if the Saudis are a lot more fiscally challenged, they will have little money to invest in jihadist schools and mosques all over the globe. You are right on finding alternate sources of energy, in any case.

Posted by: Sounder at May 16, 2008 2:58 PM

Why would a country sitting on oil galore need nuclear power anyway? Something smells.

Posted by: Sounder at May 16, 2008 3:01 PM

Sounder: As much as I would like to tell the Arab world to go to hell, pulling out all American forces in the ME pronto would create at least as many problems as it would solve. Among them would be 1) a huge psychological victory for Islamic radicals who would spin such total American withdrawal as defeat at the hands of Allah and themselves; 2) almost certain slaughter of folks like the Kurds who look to America right now for protection; 3) huge panic in nations like Japan which depend upon the American Navy to guard the Persian Gulf and other adjacent waters to assure regular oil flow to their countries; and 4) the signaling to authoritarian regimes like those in China and Russia that America can be pushed around, thus insuring even more cozying up by these regimes with the truly heinous powers of the earth, ones like North Korea and Iran, never mind the almost certain guarantee that the Saudis would find new provisioning allies in Moscow and Beijing. And I would assert again that the American military leaving the ME would not be good for Israel and it would be seen as such in Israel. We are in agreement, though, that as much energy independence as possible is nothing but a positive for America. Here both Republicans and Democrats have failed their country.

Posted by: Wellington at May 16, 2008 3:36 PM

I'm with Wellington.

Posted by: undaunted at May 16, 2008 3:52 PM

Wellington

"Until America no longer needs Middle Eastern oil, any American President will have to suck up to the Saudis from time to time, extremely distasteful as that is, or face economic Armageddon here at home."

Perhaps it is time to break out our ultimate weapon: Food. The United States is among the kings of food exportation. Here is a list from 2004 of world exporters of food..

http://www.fao.org/es/ess/toptrade/trade.asp?dir=exp&disp=majorcommodity&country=3&ryear=2004

Most of the countries, on the list, are western and friends of the USA (except for Indonesia and Malaysia which both produce oil of palm). For the longest time we have played the game fair, but maybe it is time for the USA and other food exporters to band together and do what OPEC has done…form a cartel. Higher oil prices for us will mean higher food prices for them. If we stopped giving out so much economic aide and handouts to countries like Egypt for example, or stopped giving the Arabians free military protection then maybe they would change their tune. Remember two can play the same game. They think they keep oil prices high, and we stupid American will keep giving them money, weapons, protection and at the same time keep all their Arab brothers well feed all on our dime. This is why Bush is such idiot. He does not use the full force of our economic power to do what is right for America. Bush got the whole Teddy Roosevelt policy backwards. Teddy Roosevelt said: “Speak softly and carry a big stick”, but Bush screams and carries a twig.

Always remember this: If the U.S. economy faces economic armageddon then so does the world. I view it as the 21st century version of MAD. Lets the see the followers of Islam in the Middle East eat without U.S. food or survive without the U.S. military propping up their oil industry, or without U.S. money and aide to keep their economies from tanking. We can live without oil, they cannot live without food.

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at May 16, 2008 4:20 PM

Correction above...

"We can live without THEIR (Arabian) oil."

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at May 16, 2008 4:23 PM

I propose the establishment of the Organization of Food Exporting Countries. If OPEC wants to put the screws to us, the they can be OFEC-ed.

Posted by: eve_anne_gelical at May 16, 2008 4:43 PM

I am so sick of the hand-holding and kissing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How INSULTING. If it's not bad enough that SA is one of the most OPPRESSIVE governments in the world, they also own our asses with their oil. And here goes our President kissing and holding hands with their ring-leader.

Of course, don't forget on his last visit when King Jackass gave Bush a sword as a gift and Bush received it with a sh*t-eating grin. The same kind of sword Muslims used to hack their way through Jewish and Christian lands for 1,000 years!!

Sooooooooooooooo fed up.

Posted by: Madame Vengier at May 16, 2008 4:50 PM

I am so sick of the hand-holding and kissing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How INSULTING. If it's not bad enough that SA is one of the most OPPRESSIVE governments in the world, they also own our asses with their oil. And here goes our President kissing and holding hands with their ring-leader.

Of course, don't forget on his last visit when King Jackass gave Bush a sword as a gift and Bush received it with a sh*t-eating grin. The same kind of sword Muslims used to hack their way through Jewish and Christian lands for 1,000 years!!

Sooooooooooooooo fed up.

Posted by: Madame Vengier at May 16, 2008 4:50 PM

greatcometof1577: Interesting idea but you're going to have to factor into the equation the not to be underestimated difficulty of overcoming the inherent decency and ethical norms of Western Civilization, absent in so many non-Western societies that do not prize the worth and dignity of the individual as the West does, which would very likely prevent the use of food as a bargaining chip. Just as we now face having our own freedoms undermined by those who would use our freedoms to eventually eliminate them, so do we also face our generosity being an instrument of our own destruction. But as you indicated, perhaps a certain ruthlessness might be in order. After all, we are up against quite the beast.

Posted by: Wellington at May 16, 2008 4:51 PM

Washington D.C. politicians need to have their jobs tied to the cost of oil.

If oil goes to $150.00 a barrel they should lose their jobs.

And we can negotiate this, if they don't lose their jobs then they lose benefits and retirement for life from their serving in office.

Will someone in Washington D.C. draw a line in the sand on developing our resources or will it take citizens?

Posted by: alaskan1000 at May 16, 2008 4:58 PM

What the right hand possesses...

Posted by: a10billr at May 16, 2008 4:59 PM

"The White House said Washington and Riyadh were also to sign an agreement on nuclear cooperation that would clear the way for Saudi Arabia to receive enriched uranium for its reactors, without the need to master the fuel nuclear cycle itself as Iran has done."

For more see:

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5hvx6I_y9so8CykQ5XB3RNj5fU34A

Dam, this makes me feel sorry for Iran! At least they had to pay for the North Koreans to help them with their nuclear program! Bush just gives the Arabians the stuff for free!

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at May 16, 2008 5:19 PM

Bush is simply excalating the demise of the free world - in western parlance.

While slowly recovering from viewing Farewell Israel - Bush, Iran and the Revolt of Islam
it is obvious that western ignorance of islam will surely seal the coffin of liberty as we know it.

Ignorance is far from bliss - its suicidal on a scale of Huntington's proportions.

Posted by: miira at May 16, 2008 5:23 PM

Let's face it folks, the OPECers are good for ONE thing: supplying oil. Western technology found it and figured out how to get it from the ground to the consumer. The US is good at (at least) TWO things: producing an abundance of food and having the most technological, efficient military in the world. We need oil, the "Sow-oodies" need food (LOTS of it) and a way to keep their "lil' accident of geology" (and their WEALTH) safe from their "arab brothers". Why are WE kissing THEIR butts? Betcha we can last longer, not driving, than the OPECers can last, not eating!!! OFEC NOW!!! Embargoes on non-cooperating countries!
And about the "humanitarian concerns": They certainly can't cry "poverty", so any famine would be of their own making! (Kinda like the "humanitarian crisis" in Gaza! Where DID all those hundreds of millions of our tax dollars go, Dubya???)

Posted by: NamFrank at May 16, 2008 5:28 PM

I feel to use the EFF word here, Robert. I am starting to seriously lose control. I might have to go over to LGF and post what I'm thinking, here.

Posted by: Jewel Atkins at May 16, 2008 5:39 PM

Wellington

Those norms will change....I trust the Muslims will change them for us by their actions. It is only a matter of time.

Did we feed Japan in WWII? Germany? Nope.

Like I said, It is time for a real war. In real wars, you don't keep giving the enemy economic handouts, continue to trade with them, produce food for them, and most of all having pictures taken with them holding hands together. They are using their oil as a weapon against us now, when will we use our weapons? If not food, then withdraw our military support, or withdraw economic aid, etc. We have plenty of options....but at least use one of them to pressure them. Instead, the Arabians yell dance, and Bush prances about like some harem girl.

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at May 16, 2008 5:49 PM

Putting aside my negative opinions of SA..I would like to ask why they should go to a lot of effort to provide oil to help us when we won't do that for ourselves? This insanity never ends. Is it asking too much that we be allowed to exploit( use) our own resources???

Posted by: pismopal at May 16, 2008 5:59 PM

Pismopal, loverly moniker, by the way. Maybe the Saudis who are our good friends and allies, would like to come to America and help us extract our oil for us, since we are to ignorant to do it ourselves.

Posted by: Jewel Atkins at May 16, 2008 6:04 PM

Its high time for the US to drill for their oil off their own shores and within their country. heck if Canada can find oil so can the US. also a way to barter the OE shieks of arabia for oil, is to offer oil in exchange of our grains. they need to eat, so we (West) can exchange our food to their oil.

Posted by: ZenaWarriorPrincess at May 16, 2008 6:15 PM

One would think that the defense of Saudi Oil opens the door to Saudi Facilities and air space.

The Nuclear offer would need to be delivered by a different President.

Think Air Force assets and PAC-3 emplacements.

Think of who we are defending them from.

Think of who we are really defending.

Posted by: flowerknife_us at May 16, 2008 6:17 PM

Jewel Atkins

Thank you...I think the Saudis might be able to give us some lessons in how to act in one's own best interests..a lost art in this country it seems.

Posted by: pismopal at May 16, 2008 6:23 PM

Jewel Atkins

Thank you...I think the Saudis might be able to give us some lessons in how to act in one's own best interests..a lost art in this country it seems.

Posted by: pismopal at May 16, 2008 6:24 PM

I think I'm going to be sick.

Posted by: HotSpur at May 16, 2008 6:39 PM

Don't worry, be happy, soon some old guy tinkering in his garage will save the world. This is being done as I type. Youtube has numerous video's of exactly that. I am building a hydrogen fuel cell gas
augmenter myself. I had to send off for some stuff, the guts, but I have three shells constructed waiting for UPS...other people are way ahead of me, but I am rapidly catching up...

Posted by: duh_swami at May 16, 2008 6:55 PM

greatcometof1577: Again sympathetic to much of what you say, but I would defend the President to some extent this way: Bush may have knowledge to the effect that were he not to make nicey-nicey with the Saudis (and a more disgusting sight short of another Pope kissing the Koran would be hard to imagine) they would DECREASE oil production and one way or another get their fellow OPEC buddies to do the same. The resulting economic consequences need not be explained I am sure.

Again, as long as America and other free nations are dependent on Middle Eastern oil, what Bush has done will be repeated (I guarantee it) by any American President, from either party, into the indefinite future. In fact, a case could be made that Bush has resisted Saudi pressure more than a President McCain, Clinton or Obama would. We are vulnerable until we need nothing, nothing at all, from the lesser and unenlightened portion of the earth.

Posted by: Wellington at May 16, 2008 7:48 PM

duh_swami, i believe you're right. For a long time Spencer has urged a new 'Manhattan project' and i've been closely following one in particular over the last two years.

While still wrestling with a huge degree of cognitive dissonance as to what i appear to be looking at, and while i can't pretend to understand it, something... unexpected may be about to happen.

Before this year is out, the world will be presented with a technology that'll make crude worth less than sand. We're talking months...

"something wonderful..."

Posted by: indigo at May 16, 2008 8:45 PM

Wellington

"Bush may have knowledge to the effect that were he not to make nicey-nicey with the Saudis (and a more disgusting sight short of another Pope kissing the Koran would be hard to imagine) they would DECREASE oil production and one way or another get their fellow OPEC buddies to do the same. The resulting economic consequences need not be explained I am sure."

So? And? Hell for all the times I have been called a "cut and runner" for wanting out of Iraq it amazes me how people could be so scared of the Arabians and OPEC. They can't even get oil out of the ground without us. They can't defend themselves or their oil fields from western militaries. They can't feed themselves without outside help.

The day an American president takes a hard stand against the Arabians will be the first day we start to win this war....despite the short-term economic consequences. All it takes is a U.S. President realizing we are in the position of power. Whatever they can do to us...we can do 10 times worse. No more protection, No more food, No more pumping your oil, No more U.S. Navy keeping the oil lanes safe...etc.

I know what you will say...if we don't do it someone else will...

If the Chinese want to build a massive navy (that will kill their economy, navies are expensive things) and guard the Persian Gulf for next 100 years they are welcome to it. Let the muslim world find out how the Chinese resolve such issues...let the Chinese find out what it is like to have play around with the Muslim world. It will be a multicultural experience for all!

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at May 16, 2008 10:39 PM

Caution: BDS alert

As infuriating as it is for the saudis to give us the middle finger, I've gotta say I enjoy seeing bush completely humiliated, once again. Only trouble is, he might be too stupid to even realize it. Of course, his aides won't point this out to him. They've seen what happens to people who cross the Decider: Rep. Tancredo, Border Patrol Agents Ramos & Compean, and Stephen Coughlin.

Oh, and did you hear about the personal sacrifice bush made out of respect for the American soldiers who have died in the Iraq War? He gave up golf. I kid you not.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/feedarticle/7515712

Posted by: sheik yer booty at May 16, 2008 11:13 PM

One thing into this mix seems to come up.
As we have just seen in Burma, there are Huntas and totalitarian Govs. that could care less if 10,000 or 100,000 or even a million of their starving countrymen die.
One Saudi Prince just spent $500 million for a jet. $350 mill for the jet and $150 mill for the interior. Do you think he would lie awake at nite (at 40,000 feet)over a few thousand starving to death.

P.S. I agree with most of the postings so far.
Indigo posted something I have heard also as a prophetic utterance.

Posted by: guide inside at May 16, 2008 11:59 PM

greatcometof1577: Hard stand against the Arabians? All for it but not before we are weaned off Middle Eastern oil because otherwise whatever problems we have now will dim by comparison to what would ensue if America and her chief allies were way short of petroleum reserves, irrespective of what Saudis and other Arabs would suffer. It would be chaos and there would be nothing easy or short-term about it. In hurting your enemy (and the Saudis are indeed our enemy) you should be very careful not to also hurt yourself, especially irreparably.

As for the Chinese guarding the sea lanes of the world, that is a scenario fraught with dire implications. The great power must be the most decent of powers (and as close to omnipresent as possible) or otherwise tyranny will have the advantage. Be careful what you wish for. You might get it.

Posted by: Wellington at May 17, 2008 12:15 AM

Here comes the Bribe, all dressed in white!

Posted by: champ at May 17, 2008 12:26 AM

Oil Numbers:

The US refines approximately 5 billion barrels of oil each year. This number is growing slowly.

The Strategic Reserve contains around 700 million barrels of oil. This is less than two months worth of oil.

Our offshore oil reserves, currently prohibited from exploitation are estimated to be 68 billion barrels. This is just over one decade worth of oil at current rates. It could last decades if used wisely.

In comparison the Brazilian oil find that prompted BusinessWeek to pronounce Brazil “The New Oil Superpower”, is estimated to be 5-8 billion barrels, or one years’ domestic supply. They are getting ready to sell their oil for paper money.

Conclusion:

The best thing to do with our offshore reserves is nothing. That oil will be priceless in two decades. Let the Saudis sell their oil for our dollars. That is a good trade.

Posted by: pez at May 17, 2008 12:44 AM

Saudi Arabia is largely empty, and the "Rub al-khali" ("The empty quarter") is emptier still.

And frickin hot. I mean so hot a raw chicken wrapped in tin foil will be fully and safely cooked if just left out in the sun for 8 hours.

Having more money than sense or need for it, why the Saudis can't cover 100 sq miles of the empty quarter with photovoltaic cells or solar-stirling engine farms for all the energy their 22M people need and enough to sell their neighbors, I cannot say.

Nukes for civie power in SA is a ploy and a sham. They need it about as much Bill Gates needs a $10 loan until next friday.

Posted by: A Simple Sinner at May 17, 2008 2:03 AM

"Having more money than sense or need for it, why the Saudis can't cover 100 sq miles of the empty quarter with photo voltaic cells or solar-stirling engine farms for all the energy their 22M people need and enough to sell their neighbors, I cannot say.

Nukes for civil power in SA is a ploy and a sham. They need it about as much Bill Gates needs a $10 loan until next Friday."

If that's technologically possible, it makes Bushes decision to give the Saudis access to nuclear capability more than just foolish.

Posted by: Big Luke at May 17, 2008 6:35 AM

Before this year is out, the world will be presented with a technology that'll make crude worth less than sand. We're talking months...
"something wonderful..."
Posted by: indigo

Well, I doubt that will come from my tinkering, but if I can get one, I will back engineer it and make clones for family and friends. There are lots of rumors (some factual) about inventors of 'wonderful things' disappearing, or dying mysteriously, and their works going with them.
The way around that is to not try and make a jillion bucks, make the plans public and for free right away. Once a 'wonderful idea' is out in the public, the greedies have few options to stop it, and no reason to eliminate you and your idea...There are a lot of gangsters in cement shoes at the bottom of the East river...some inventors are down there with them...

Posted by: duh_swami at May 17, 2008 8:31 AM

Drill here, develop a nuclear based power grid, work on alternatives. What doesn't Washington get? I say start putting our elected representatives and non elected bureacrats in touch with their constituencies by making them live as we do. No subsidized anything for these ninnies until they get the message.

Posted by: lonewolf at May 17, 2008 9:37 AM

Wellington

(1) We will not change our energy policy until we have a fall out with the Arabians. I am an American and we never do the right thing until we are forced to do it. See Pearl Harbor, See Fort Sumter (hell the whole 1850s), etc.

(2) After the fall out with our Arabian masters then maybe we can take prudent steps to gain energy independence. We could also just take the Arabian oil fields for ourselves. The point is Americans never get mean until they lack "green". The economic consequences will not be as bad for U.S. as for other nations. Most of our oil is not dependent on the Arabians. We have plenty of resources we can use in an emergency like coal conversion to oil for example.

(3) The Arabians will not go that far because the consequences for them would be the end of their civilization. No food, no American protection, no aid, would mean riots, an Iranian invasion, a Sunni counter-jihad against the Iranians and all sorts of other wonderful things which will seriously hamper the world wide jihad. The Arabian oil trade is the economic engine of Jihad against us. It will be wrecked if we leave.

(4) You misunderstand me. I just want our navy out of the Persian Gulf. I did not say we are getting rid of our Navy. If the Chinese want to spend billions upon billions of dollars to build a navy to protect the oil lanes in the Persian Gulf then go for it. If the Europeans want to do that…go for it. It is not the United States job to protect the worlds Arabian oil fix. We never get credit for it and it is costing us more money then it is worth. In truth, The Chinese won’t do that. They are not that stupid. They are not going spend the next 100 years fighting around in that hell hole.

In conclusion: If we Americans are serious about defeating the jihad against us then we must make a sacrifice at some point. We can make it sooner and accept some economic consequences, or we can make it later and face worse problems like the possible loss of Europe due to Islamic immigration (funded by the Arabian oil trade), major jihadist attacks using nukes (funded by the Arabian oil trade), the loss of freedoms (buying off our leaders with money from the Arabian oil trade) and still face all those same economic problems.

Posted by: greatcometof1577 at May 17, 2008 9:56 AM

greatcometof1577: Your first point reminded me of what Winston Churchill, who deeply admired America which he called The Great Republic, said. You may already know it. He observed that America always does the right thing after exhausting every other possibility. Can't argue too much with this assessment.

Like you I don't mind standing up to the Arab world and reading them the riot act. If there's a more dysfunctional, self-pitying major people on the planet I don't know who they are. But I don't think most Americans, affluent, comfortable and secure as they are, are prepared for what will come when we do. I also believe that it is in our own interests to take into account that what you propose would indeed have an effect on other countries, Japan again comes foremost to mind because it has the second largest economy on earth and depends heavily on Middle Eastern oil. One place where we do differ is that I would definitely keep the United States Navy in the Persian Gulf as long as a lot of tankers are coming in and out of there.

Sadly, your last point about Americans needing to be serious about defeating jihad just isn't a reality. I, like you, wish it were, but we're still too comfortable. We need more discomfort which is not self-imposed before most Americans will really rally behind this. Also, the Far Left in this country will present an additional obstacle that will have to be overcome because it hates what America is and has been and is even possessed of self-loathing (in short, those on the Far Left are deeply confused human beings). An American President who understands all this will, with Lincolnesque skill, have to steer the country in a direction even before most know where we're headed. Anyway, good going back and forth like this with you. My best to you and yours.

Posted by: Wellington at May 17, 2008 2:19 PM

We should have first let Saddam over-run and destroy the Saudis then destroyed him.

A real win-win.

The only nukes they should ever see are those coming in from the sky.

Posted by: profitsbeard at May 17, 2008 6:49 PM

We should have first let Saddam over-run and destroy the Saudis then destroyed him.

A real win-win.

The only nukes they should ever see are those coming in from the sky.

Posted by: profitsbeard at May 17, 2008 6:53 PM

Not sorry for the double posting, just sorry it never happened.

Posted by: profitsbeard at May 17, 2008 7:00 PM