I wonder what the response would be if the EU asked for a quid pro quo - as in no more blood libels on Jews from Muslim controlled media.

Posted by: johnb at June 7, 2008 7:40 PM

For God's sake, when will Western leaders tell the Islamic world that if these acts against the West are not controlled, Western retribution on the ENTIRE Islamic world is a CERTAINTY.

Posted by: PMK at June 7, 2008 7:48 PM

Pakistan still at it the continued jihad 1400 years and going. All phases from stealth to violent jihad to law suits and amending laws to undermine the freedom of speech and thought. If they would just look at the state of their affairs is very pitiful and embarrassing. As a matter of fact all Islamic countries really have nothing to boast about. But hey why not boast about their dear ideology of Islam. Islam sucks it has brought misery and suffering to millions and millions of humans. It has succeeded to bringing death and misery.

Posted by: savsiv at June 7, 2008 7:50 PM

How about Pak banning jihad, the teaching and the export of it? No more cartoons.

Posted by: Sounder at June 7, 2008 7:52 PM

They said that the delegation would also tell the EU that if such acts against Islam are not controlled, more attacks on the EU diplomatic missions abroad could not be ruled out.

The West should encourage "such acts against Islam". In this way, we can show the islamic-occupied territories what it means to be civilized, i.e., to actually recognize the rights and dignity of all people.

Posted by: PersonOfTheBook at June 7, 2008 7:58 PM

Muslim reactions to cartoons clearly show the cartoons are truthful, and Muslims really do not want the truth about Islam reaching the ears of those people who are still free to choose and free to speak..and ultimately free to act.

Posted by: pulsar182 at June 7, 2008 7:58 PM

Little Denmark told Islam where to get off so off to big Brother Islam goes form "justice". Hopefully, Big Brother will act as Big Brothers should. Let us Pray he wears not, his Sisters clothes.

Posted by: flowerknife_us at June 7, 2008 8:20 PM

...of blasphemous caricatures of Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him) ...

Did they actually print this? If so, why?

Posted by: witness at June 7, 2008 8:36 PM

Unfortunately, we are witnessing the same kind of intimidation tactics here in the U.S. The radio station in Michigan (or was it Minnesota?) and the public schools in Virgina that had to make concessions to Muslims and have employees and staff go through diversity training. And with the rapid multiplication of mosques on American soil and the strong influence of CAIR we can expect more of the same.

Posted by: JohnnyT at June 7, 2008 8:39 PM

RS-

Come and get me, I'm right here

I thought you were in an "undisclosed location?"

Posted by: dentalque at June 7, 2008 8:53 PM

Mafia tactics.

Posted by: interestinconundrum at June 7, 2008 8:57 PM

The radio station in Michigan (or was it Minnesota?) and the public schools in Virginia that had to make concessions to Muslims and have employees and staff go through diversity training."
-- from a posting above

I would like to know more about the forced "diversity training" imposeed on employees and staff at this radio station and those public schools. Who ordered it? After what hearing? And who objected, or failed to? And at least in the case of the public schools, parents should be informing themselves about Islam, and publicizing what they have learned, and not give an inch. As to those who order this kind of thing for public schools, they can be discharged by school boards, and school boards are elected, or appointed by politicians, and politicians are elected by....voters.

Posted by: Hugh at June 7, 2008 9:07 PM

Stunning how such an inferior part of mankind (i.e., the Muslim world) thinks it can dictate terms to that portion of mankind (i.e., the Western world) which far eclipsed the aforesaid inferior part in virtually every category of human endeavor, not the least being the promotion, protection and expansion of human freedom and true tolerance.

To the Muslim world I say shame on you. Deep shame. You won't allow conversion from your faith to others without holding the death penalty over one's head, yet you expect to be able to preach your religion openly and without hindrance, including no molestation of converts to your faith. You disallow non-believers entrance to your two holiest cities, but think nothing of going where you please in the West. You regularly call Christians and Jews foul things, but get deeply upset when far less in vileness is said about your faith. You're a giant hypocrite. I'm so glad I'm not one of you. I never will be.

Posted by: Wellington at June 7, 2008 9:08 PM

It will be interesting to see how the E.U. reacts to this. Europen nations already put people in jail for hate crimes, including speech that they define as offensive.

They've already established the principle that government can curtail speech that is hurtful to ethnic minorities and religious groups, so what argument is left to confront the Pakistani delegation when they arrive with their demands?

These sinister laws are more highly developed in Europe than in the U.S., but they're slowly worming their way into our system of laws also, and as we become more conditioned to them, they'll be sending us to jail for speech before long, and sites like Jihad Watch will someday be a thing of the past.

Posted by: rational at June 7, 2008 9:25 PM

I'm not going to become a Muslim.

I'm not going to become a Dhimmi.

I'm not going to prison for insulting Islam.

I will continue to speak what I believe to be true, regardless of whom it offends.

I have weapons and I will fight with them in my hands if it becomes necessary.

The World of Islam, President Obama, or whoever it is that intends to force me into compliance with Sharia or Dhimmi status will have to come get me. And they will have to kill me.

But they'll know they've been in a fight before it's over.

Posted by: INFIDELATLARGE at June 7, 2008 9:26 PM

"Here we lie (dead) because of our own laws"
from the movie 300

Posted by: Nader at June 7, 2008 9:43 PM

First of all it is not for some Muslim delegation from Pakistan or anywhere to dictate to us what are our inalienable human rights. There is three thousand years of history behind our rule of law and constitutional protection of those rights, of which freedom of speech is fundamental, something these Islamic ignoramuses understand precious little. We, whether EU or anybody, will not to be lectured by ignorant people who represent not a religion, but in their domineering controls are a cult. If they cannot stand criticism or ridicule, which is most often very well deserved, then they should turn attention to their own shortcomings of why such ridicule exists in the first place. The cartoon riots, Pope riots, teddy bear riots, as examples where to start.

Brussels should politely listen to these fools, thank them for coming, and immediately show them the door. Any supremacist Cult of world domination for some make believe god is not to be accorded the same respect as other world religions, especially if they treat non-members of their Cult as if they too must obey them. This is so absurd it makes it laughable. Better to understand and face their threats than to give up one millimeter of freedom to any Cult of Allah. Our freedoms are not up for ransom. Then send them back to their paradise of Allah to reexamine themselves, and why their societies are such a shamble. Their nerve is laughable in the extreme.

Posted by: Battle_of_Tours at June 7, 2008 9:47 PM

If you control your the more unruly segments of your populations, our B-52s and F-117s won't accidently go off course over your country and have little black things fall off them. If you are confused by what we mean, ask Mumar Khaddafi.

What we see fit to print and say within our borders is our business. To illustrate:

Mohammed, the Mohammed, is an Archeretic. Anathema! Anathema! Anathema!*

*The anathema is the harshest sentence the Church imposes. It is the permanent [as in eternal] act of excommunication, is usually imposed by the decision of the synod of bishops or the ecclesiastical council. It banishes him from entering a church, receiving Baptism, the Eucharist and other sacraments or being blessed by a priest. It is usually seen as banishment from heaven and blocking God's mercy in the afterlife too—although God does as He wishes, and He is inclined to mercy.

Posted by: St. David, King of Georgia at June 7, 2008 10:01 PM

"They [members of the Pakistani government] said that a six-member high-level delegation comprising officials from the Ministry of Interior, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Ministry of Law would leave Islamabad on Sunday (today) for the EU headquarters in Brussels, Belgium and explain to the EU leadership the backlash against the blasphemous campaign in the name of freedom of expression.

The delegation, headed by an additional secretary of the Interior Ministry, will meet the leaders of the EU countries in a bid to convince them that the recent attack on the Danish Embassy in Pakistan could be a reaction against the blasphemous campaign, sources said.

They said that the delegation would also tell the EU that if such acts against Islam are not controlled, more attacks on the EU diplomatic missions abroad could not be ruled out."
-- from the article above

The members of the E.U., jointly and severally, should warn the government of Pakistan that if such a delegation even dares to arrive in any member state of the E.U., even dares to utter a syllable of this disgusting nonsense, all of the member states of the E.U. will promptly sever all diplomatic releations -- shutting down embassies, closing consulates, the works -- with Pakistan.

They will start shipping home Pakistani nationals, and they will also, if they can, end all direct air links to Pakistan. Where there are imports of Pakistani products -- aside from jute, and those rugs that are made by the explolited child labor (I have read, but do not know, that that child labor consists in large part of Christians who are condemned to certain trades just as Jews were in Yemen and other Arab countries)-- those imports will end. Finally, there will be an end, and that will be permanent, no matter what happens, to all E.U. aid to Pakistan - and to any Muslim state or entity that dares offer moral support to this kind of demand.

This is the kind of thing that can now be done, for everyone in Europe can easily share the general outrage. And cutting off aid to Pakistan and other Muslim countries must be done. Let them go to Saudi Araiba. Let them go to the U.A.E., or Kuwait, or those tiny sheikdoms with at most a few hundred thousand natives (they lie about their population, of course, because the real wealth per capita must be hidden, so outrageous is the figure, and the real size of the population is so small as to show at once how easy it would be to seize these places, if one wished to, for all kinds of reasons).

Let this Pakistani behavior be what finally signals an end to all aid, from Infidel nation-states, to the Muslim states -- at the very sam e time that other Muslim states are pilling up trillions, and getting away with economic murderw (a barrel of Saudi crude that costs $1-2 to lift sells for close to $14) and, at the same time, tossing the burden of supporting poorer Muslim states onto the INfidels, who until now have not seen what was wrong with that arrangement, have timidly acquiesced, and displayed the cringing fear of cutting such aid that mimics that of the dhimmi paying his protection money to his Muslim overlords in the classic arrangement according to the Sharia.

Posted by: Hugh at June 7, 2008 10:09 PM

Au contraire! The EU should not receive these officials from Pakistan. Western law is not up for challenge by outside parties. Pakistan is without legal standing where European law is concerned.

This challenge to the EU would never have occurred if Western leadership's first reflex to any challenge were not appeasement.

Posted by: HotSpur at June 7, 2008 10:14 PM

I agree with Hugh. Let's give them a resounding "No." and refuse to hear of this matter again.

So long as we look a little like we might give in, like rude little spoiled children they'll keep badgering us.

If their was ever a case to be patronizing and condescending in diplomacy, this is it. "Yes, we know we hurt your poor fragile feelings. Now be quiet and play outside. Be sure and shut the door."

Posted by: St. David, King of Georgia at June 7, 2008 10:19 PM

These people are dangerous vermin. Stop muslim immigration now. Islam is incompatible with freedom. We need to stop screwing around. It IS a war and a defensive one against the islamic world.

Posted by: Rick at June 7, 2008 10:24 PM

Extreme anti-semitic rant on Pakistani TV - can MemriTV translate this.... (essentially blames US problems for the last few hundred years on Jews...)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPlT1WZnIaQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZavQux4ZQQ&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E9fsFIZ8z8&feature=related

Probably will not be the last time, we hear such bigoted nonsense on Pakistani TV...

Posted by: AJack at June 7, 2008 10:50 PM

"How long will it be before President Obama compels the U.S. to fall into line?"

I'm not so sure Hussein will be President.

Many Dems who would vote for Hillary will not vote for Hussein.

Posted by: darcy at June 7, 2008 11:05 PM

"How long will it be before President Obama compels the U.S. to fall into line?"

I'm not so sure Hussein will be President.

Many Dems who would vote for Hillary will not vote for Hussein.

Posted by: darcy at June 7, 2008 11:05 PM

If you listened to Hillary's speech today, you'd have noticed loud Boos as she asked her people to vote for BHO.

McCain is far enough left to be appealing to many of them.

Posted by: St. David, King of Georgia at June 7, 2008 11:12 PM

"'...of blasphemous caricatures of Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him) ...

Did they actually print this? If so, why?'"

Posted by: witness

Well, it's an Islamabad newspaper, written and published by Muslims; their religion and sharia law requires them to do this whenever Mo's (Piss Be Upon Him) name is mentioned. If they didn't, their offices would probably get blown up.

If the EU capitulates any further to Islamist demands to destroy our cherished Western freedoms of speech and expression, I have a feeling this will be a tipping point for ordinary Europeans.

I'd say tens of thousands of outraged infidels storming EU headquarters, kinda like a 21st-Century version of Bastille, then putting top EU officials on trial for high treason, would be a good starting point. I'm thinking of reclaiming my UK citizenship just so I can be a part of this.

Posted by: angloirishslav at June 7, 2008 11:26 PM

I'm not going to become a Muslim.

"I'm not going to become a Dhimmi.

I'm not going to prison for insulting Islam.

I will continue to speak what I believe to be true, regardless of whom it offends.

I have weapons and I will fight with them in my hands if it becomes necessary.

The World of Islam, President Obama, or whoever it is that intends to force me into compliance with Sharia or Dhimmi status will have to come get me. And they will have to kill me.

But they'll know they've been in a fight before it's over.

Posted by: INFIDELATLARGE"

Americans, everything isn't about you!

Why do so many of you Americans post in this manner about things that are happening in Europe? Draconian laws passed in by the EU aren't going to affect you. Obama isn't going to come kicking your door in (what an image!) because of something going on across the pond.

The U.S. is nothing like Europe, and that's America's strength.

Posted by: angloirishslav at June 7, 2008 11:41 PM

I'd say tens of thousands of outraged infidels storming EU headquarters, kinda like a 21st-Century version of Bastille, then putting top EU officials on trial for high treason, would be a good starting point. I'm thinking of reclaiming my UK citizenship just so I can be a part of this.

Posted by: angloirishslav

Yeah! Go for it! It's about time to put those wimpy bureaucrats in their place, and piss on that primitive 7th century Cult of Allah, their ignorant barbarian Founder too. Everyone I know here in the States with few exceptions have had enough, and we'll be with you all the way to 'storm the Bastille' all over again against this primitive Cult of Mohammed. Let's rock'n'roll!!

Posted by: Battle_of_Tours at June 7, 2008 11:54 PM

We demand now for freedom and equality of infidels in all islamic countries. We demand now for freedom and equality of all women in all islamic countries. We demand for the abolition of dhimmi status under sharia law any where sharia is in effect actually or effectively. Down with Dhimmi crow laws in all the cesspool muslim countries!!!! We demand equality under the law! Abolish dhimmi status.

Posted by: David England at June 8, 2008 12:03 AM

We're going to need a whole new breed of politician here in the West before we do what Hugh et al. have suggested above. Gordon Browns and Barack Obamas won't cut it. Not even close. I look forward to such a group of statesmen making their presence known but see few, if any, on the horizon. The Muslim world is counting on them never appearing.

Posted by: Wellington at June 8, 2008 12:47 AM

Usually, the way international relations work, a state or group of states may impose conditions in order for another state to join that group of nations. Some examples are things like the IMF, they offer loans, the cost are things like certain transparencies in how things are done.

For the life of me, I cannot see what thing Pakistan has to offer the west in exchange for the west muzzeling (Muzliming?) a free press.

Posted by: stickman at June 8, 2008 1:07 AM

It doesn't seem surprising that an Islamic country would recommend submission to Islam rather than defiance. This isn't the act of an ally in the "war on terrorism"; Pakistan is cashing in on it.

Posted by: MelM at June 8, 2008 1:07 AM

It is probably good I am not President.
I'd tell them to sit down and shut up or I'll nuke all your shit.
Drinking vodka (Dripping Springs from the Texas Hill country) and gin (Plymouth) while watching United 93 has made a little less than diplomatic.

Posted by: St. David, King of Georgia at June 8, 2008 1:14 AM

Saith Hugh: "I would like to know more about the forced "diversity training" imposeed on employees and staff at this radio station and those public schools. Who ordered it? After what hearing? And who objected, or failed to? And at least in the case of the public schools, parents should be informing themselves about Islam, and publicizing what they have learned, and not give an inch. As to those who order this kind of thing for public schools, they can be discharged by school boards, and school boards are elected, or appointed by politicians, and politicians are elected by....voters."
Story and update on forced assembly of school officals...oops, that didn't sound good...officials.

Michelle Malkin has it
http://michellemalkin.com/2008/06/05/principal-who-okayed-mandatory-cairmuslim-assembly-is-out/

Posted by: Jewel Atkins at June 8, 2008 1:14 AM

I find it absolutely vile and backward that anyone would want to amend the laws on freedom of expression. Muslims have the absolute right to not like cartoons insulting their holy figures--but their merely not liking a certain mode of expression does not mean that mode of expression should be outlawed. By the same token, I find it absolutely vile that many European countries have outlawed the freedom to question the Holocaust (however wrong and stupid such questioning might be.)

Posted by: ibrahimX at June 8, 2008 1:49 AM

"The U.S. is nothing like Europe and that's America's strength."
-angloirishslav

True,but Europe is the canary in the coal mine when it comes to that same declaration of war and need for subjugation(utilized in the US as a hand-in hand vehicle for legal and cultural destabilization by the Marxist elites)upon the lifestyles,liberties and very lives of non-muslims, in various lands,whether they acknowledge it or not. What John Quincy Adams called:"undistinguishing and exterminating war,as a part of his religion,against the rest of mankind."

Posted by: We need G.C. Scott at June 8, 2008 3:31 AM

On the 1st of June Geert Wilders gave an absolutely brilliant speech in the Danish Parliament.

I think he was channelling Oriana Fallaci.

I don't know how the Danish MPs reacted.

Does anybody know?

But maybe, just maybe, he was able to stir up Holger Dansker.

In which case Pakistan may get short shrift from the Danes, at least. (Maybe the last thing some wannabe jihadi assassin sees in this life will be the beady eyes of elderly Danish cartoonist Kurt Westergaard, and the muzzle of a double-barrelled shotgun).

It's more than time to re-post a classical quote, unearthed and posted by Our Hugh ages ago, that deserves to be on the front pages of every European newspaper, and plastered up on doorways and gateposts all over Brussells when the Pakistan delegation arrives.

From Pierre-Augustin Caron de Beaumarchais' 1784 stage comedy Marriage of Figaro (adapted by Mozart for the great opera), from the famous Freedom of Speech monologue in Act V, Scene 3:

"I cobble together a verse comedy about the customs of the harem, assuming that, as a Spanish writer, I can say what I like about Mohammed without drawing hostile fire.

"Next thing, some envoy from God knows where turns up and complains that in my play I have offended the Ottoman empire, Persia, a large slice of the Indian peninsula, the whole of Egypt, and the kingdoms of Barca {Ethiopia}, Tripoli, Tunisi, Algeria, and Morocco.

"And so my play sinks without trace, all to placate a bunch of Muslim princes, not one of whom, as far as I know, can read but who beat the living daylights out of us and say we are 'Christian dogs.' Since they can't stop a man thinking, they take it out on his hide instead..."

Which non-dhimmi European actor will give us a fiery recitation of that speech? Maybe it can be presented on Youtube.

Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at June 8, 2008 4:24 AM

Hi guys,

I know that you are not big fans of empiricism, despite--of course!--your undying commitment to Western values such as scientific rationality and tolerance. But here is an article, for those who have Galileo's courage to examine inconvenient truths, that will contextualize Pakistan's recent declaration:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/mcclatchy/20080607/wl_mcclatchy/2960690;_ylt=Ao0YMvou3SJ03UpJJWxKL32s0NUE

"Embattled, U.S.-backed Pakistani Pres. Pervez Musharraf Saturday warned Barack Obama that if he wins the White House, he'd have to change his policies towards Pakistan... Musharraf said that the Democratic contender had based his statements on "incomplete information, which will always be wrong""

That was General Pervez Musharraf, a delightful fellow who operates by his mentor Zia al-Haq's model of statecraft: covertly support radical Islamists, then try to earn brownie points from the U.S. by publicly and brutally squashing a very small portion of them. He's about to be forced out by the moderate PPP and PML-Q coalition, which was actually democratically elected, and does not hand seats to the radical Jihadi MMA on a silver platter (imagine that!).

So, he's doing a number of things to try and remain relevant. The first is his little performance, as is described in the article. The second is wonderful declarations from the Interior MInistry--yep, that's right! Army lackeys, best known until now for fabricating the cause of Benazir Bhutto's death! They're baaack!

Oh, by the way...Obama has actually not been soft on the Taliban. It was he who called Musharraf's bluff nine months ago by threatening to bomb the Taliban if Musharraf didn't act (which he won't), while Bush and McCain still thought Musharraf was our buddy. But it's interesting, because in spite of Obama's hardline rhetoric, he was all but endorsed by Benazir Bhutto (who died for Pakistani democracy), and the average Pakistani would be quite happy to see him win.

Which he will, of course, because the free ride is over. This is Obama's low point and McCain's high point, and they're roughly even. Even if McCain manages to peel away a sizable portion of Clinton supporters, he's not going to get close to 50%. There's also the issue of debates, which will be a different kind of ride for McCain. Alright, I'll stop there, I don't want to overload anyone here with Western empiricism...

Posted by: Shlomo_Michael at June 8, 2008 4:50 AM

The only thing that is exploding right now is in the PAk,so the Danes can keep up their freedom of expression. the pak is the weak one, and should be shown the door and tell them on their way out to become civilized before they show their faces!

Posted by: ZenaWarriorPrincess at June 8, 2008 5:45 AM

Follow SIOE's campaign and send Motoons to Pakistani emabassies.

The more bombs they blast the more 'toons they'll see.

Posted by: Stephen Gash SIOE England at June 8, 2008 6:08 AM

http://www.historyofjihad.org/

history of jihad

i take exception to a couple quotes on this site otherwise it is very thorough.

Posted by: CrusadoRob at June 8, 2008 6:08 AM

“…Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him)…”

It’s nauseating that a western newspaper would print this about an obvious prophet imposter & pedophile warlord whose followers- at his directive - tried their best to violently conquer Europe & the known world. It’s worse than printing “rest in peace” after every mention of Adolph Hitler. The western media is so mindless & spineless, and the Muslims love it!

Posted by: FM at June 8, 2008 8:38 AM

The U.S. is nothing like Europe, and that's America's strength.
Posted by: angloirishslav

Yes, and the struggle is to keep it that way...

Posted by: duh_swami at June 8, 2008 8:59 AM

Nothing new here. This is typical Muslim behaviour since 700 AD. Read for example Sita Ram Goel's "Freedom of Expression" for more examples.

Posted by: dee at June 8, 2008 9:59 AM

Obama has no authority to outlaw blasphemy, a/k/a Islam-bashing, a/k/a standing up for freedom. If he tried, the Supreme Court would strike it down. If the Supreme Court did not strike it down, a constitutional amendment restoring our First Amendment protection (or re-exposing Islam to blasphemy) would probably whip its way through 3/4 of state legislatures.

Face it, Republicans; Bush is as subservient to Islam as any Democrat. Look at his intimate relations with the house of Saud. Look at his decision to let the whole Bin Laden family leave the U.S. right after 9/11 while rounding up anonymous Muslims for show. Look at his meager reaction to the first Danish cartoon crisis. He was the one who called Islam a "religion of peace" (check the White House speech archive if you don't believe me). Until we stop depending on Islamic oil to fuel our suburban, SUV, mega-store, obesity lifestyle, we're going to keep trying to take over Muslim countries to grab their oil and oil profits while bending over backward to soothe their precious religious sensibilities.

Posted by: sceptico at June 8, 2008 10:37 AM

The U.S. is nothing like Europe, and that's America's strength.

angloirishslav,
Why aren't EU members getting as upset at "what is happening across the pond"? The pond isn't that big anymore. We are unable to do anything about what is happening in Europe. We are watching events unfold and preparing for the future, a future that will include an Islamized Europe unless you all decide to get busy and drop the multiculturalism and colonial guilt.
Why don't YOU care? We care for myriad reasons.
Since you say we Americans think it's all about us (not true) then here's a very self-centered reason:

America Alone Cannot Win This Fight

Are you with us, or do you also think, like many Europeans, that America is the greatest threat to world peace?

Posted by: PMK at June 8, 2008 10:41 AM

Ibrahim X: I agree with you. I think Truth holds its own in a free marketplace of ideas, and I hate tyranny. Thank GOD for the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

Posted by: John C at June 8, 2008 11:06 AM

Schlomo, you are anything but objective. Besides, Obama is not a man of his word.

Posted by: John C at June 8, 2008 11:09 AM

"Oh, by the way...Obama has actually not been soft on the Taliban. It was he who called Musharraf's bluff nine months ago by threatening to bomb the Taliban "

Posted by: Shlomo_Michael

oh, by the way, Obama was posturing for votes, and he is a flip flopper in the grandest John Kerry fashion..

Posted by: pulsar182 at June 8, 2008 11:54 AM

Hi guys,
I know that you are not big fans of empiricism, despite--of course!--your undying commitment to Western values such as scientific rationality and tolerance. - Posted by: Shlomo_Michael

You are free to express your opinion Micheal, but don't claim it rational reason or empiricism.

Responding to a question about Obama, who's advocated shifting America's military focus from Iraq to Afghanistan and Pakistan , Musharraf said that the Democratic contender had based his statements on "incomplete information, which will always be wrong".

What was your point? That Hyssein Obama would be your choice for US president? How is that even rationally relavent to this discussion? Musharraf's "incomplete information" is a convenient out, not an inconvenient truth. What does this have to do with the Pakistani delegation to Brussels, in your 'scientifically rational' opinion? Whether or not Hussein Obama can garner enough votes to become president has nothing to do with the First Amendment, freedom of speech, and separation of 'religion and state', and sure as hell no Allah Cult delegation is going to dictate terms to us on the matter. Checks and balances checks the president too. If this was a Pak delegation to address possible future military action against Pakistan, then your point might be more valid, but that's not what this is about. This Pak delegation wants to make us suspend freedom of speech. Your 'empiricism' fails the test.

Posted by: Battle_of_Tours at June 8, 2008 12:08 PM

"Obama has no authority to outlaw blasphemy, a/k/a Islam-bashing, a/k/a standing up for freedom. If he tried, the Supreme Court would strike it down".
Posted by:

Sorry, sceptico, but the Supreme court allowed Hate crime laws to stand, and hate crime laws are the things blasphemy laws are made of.

Now that we've been conditioned to accept that the state can punish us for what we think or say about protected classes of people, blaspheme laws are only a few short steps away.

They won't call them "blaspheme laws", they'll continue to call them "hate crime laws", but the effects will be exactly the same. If you express a thought deemed offensive to Muslims, you'll be charged with spreading hate, and you'll be prosecuted for your crime.

If you have any doubts about what's comming, take a long hard look at Canada and Europe.

Don't look to the Supreme court to protect you from anything.

No, Obama has no authority to outlaw blasphemy, but then he doesn't have too. He has a Congress more than willing to go down that road, and a supreme court more than willing to say it's OKAY.

Posted by: rational at June 8, 2008 2:20 PM

We had better pray for a McCain victory in November. BHO is too big a gamble; he is a Pandora's Box, which we cannot afford at this time---can NEVER afford, at ANY time. The Republican Party needs some remedial courses on leadership and conservative governance.

God Bless and Save America!

Posted by: Rick at June 8, 2008 4:48 PM

Freedom means the right to mock the beliefs of all those who are considered irrational.

If the Mohammedans cannot handle laughter they should return to Mecca with a staight face.

Posted by: profitsbeard at June 8, 2008 5:20 PM

TYPO_

"straight" face.

(Or strait-jacket. )

Posted by: profitsbeard at June 8, 2008 5:25 PM

Totally agree with the sentiments but still waiting for verification about the delegation coming to Europe to accept western surrender.

Posted by: wotthefiqh at June 9, 2008 10:45 AM

The non-Muslim world needs to call a spade a spade here. Islam is NOT a religion, it is rather a fascist ideology masquerading itself as a religion. Once the non-Muslim understands that, then the Western world can justifiably take serious action to kick Islam's collective arse.

Political correctness is FIRMLY entrenched in academia, in government (especially that stupid, no-good, useless US State Department) and in Europe overall.

Screw Islam. Make Mecca and Medina into Disneylands.

Posted by: Thomas Carney at June 9, 2008 11:13 AM

-translated-
In Mecca there were 360 gods.
These gods, did no harm to muhamad.
And even then, Muhamad destroyed these gods and even more the God of Christians, Jews and the atheists.
The paquistanese that time did any harm to muhamad.
Still, the Pakistanis not escaped the misery of islam.
Therefore, no benefit to limit the expression of truth, remain silent or even bring in political correctness.

The same is better grasp Allah directly and firmly by the horns.
alá know, like, thanks, and no longer has any evil.
It is holy medicine.

Posted by: ctz at June 9, 2008 9:19 PM

The trouble with what Pakistan is asking for is that they may get what they want. The EU member countries (states) wouldn’t even have the time to peruse any law proposed let alone have any loyalty to freedom of speech principals. What with the backdoor politics of the unelected dictators exemplified by the proposed Lisbon Treaty - Hitler would have been proud. Of course the new Nazis party of Europe (Islam) will soon have a stranglehold on the EU.

And as they have done previously Europe will fall to the new dictators this time in their sleep. A distasteful but certainly an imminent doom.

Posted by: Will at June 12, 2008 7:52 PM