said that the West and the Jews are conspiring against Muslims YA RIGHT AND THE MOON IS MADE OF GRSEEEN CHEASE and Islam on a big scale, and are using different strategies to impose a Western system on Muslim nations
AND ITS POT KETTLE BLACK

Posted by: ISLAMSNOTFORME at July 17, 2008 12:02 PM

Welcome to the reality of our so called ally. Hey as far as I can tell it is time to go after those Taliban in NW frontier. If the Pakis cannot control that area what the hell are they going to do if NATO forces enter. It is a lawless region and Pakistan technically has no control. To me if they the Muslims fought one another such as Sunni vs Shia I would be happy. However the thing is Pakistan will continue to harbor Jihadis and train Western Muslims to return and cause havoc in their respective host countries.

Posted by: savsiv at July 17, 2008 12:10 PM

However the thing is Pakistan will continue to harbor Jihadis and train Western Muslims to return and cause havoc in their respective host countries.Posted by: savsiv

Cut off foreign aid to muslim countries and eliminate muslim immegration from muslim countries.

Let them kill each other.

Posted by: walterc at July 17, 2008 12:36 PM

Thirty billion dollars later, and it is finally dawning on everyone, or almost everyone, that Pakistan is not our ally, and can never be, though we can here and there force, but not buy, collaboration, of a very temporary and half-hearted kind.

When I wrote above "almost everyone" I was thinking of the terminally idiotic editorial board of The New Duranty Times, that today endorses as a splendid idea Senator Lugar's propsal to triple economic aid to Pakistan to $7.5 billion a year, because, the Times's editorialist devoutly hopes or think he knows, this will help Pakistan's "democracy" to develop and bring all kinds of benefits, carefully unspecified, to the American donors. Well, let's see. How have we done with the tens of billions we gave to Pakistan before 9/11/2001, when the Pakistani military was one of the most favored causes of the American military? What about all that aid sent, with the help of nice Pakistan and even nicer Saudi Arabia, to the brave muhajidin of Afghanistan, bravely fighting the Infidels of the Soviet Union -- are you quite sure that was the most intelligent use of American resources? And in the same years, wasn't the I.S.I., Pakistan's military intelligence, using some of that American money to fund the special project of one Dr. A. Q. Khan, which project ended in the "Islamic bomb" and in attempts to spread that bomb-making knowhow from North Korea to Iran, nuclear proliferation made possible in large part by a multi-year grant from the United States Government Foundation.

And what about the $30 billion, in economic aid and military aid and in cancellation of previous debts, sent over the past almost-seven years, to reward Pakistan, to tighten that alliance with Pakistan throwing still more money down the drain of vain hopes of changing Muslim minds by making their own countries more prosperous, thus rescuing them yet again from having to recognize the consequences, in economic and political terms, of the inshallah-fatalism that helps to explain the lack of outrage over despotism in Muslim lands, and the lack -- despite trillions in oil revenues, and hundreds of billions in Infidel aid over many decades -- to develop anything like modern or advanced economies.

The more we "help" Pakistan and other Muslim states, with these tens and hundreds of billions, the greater the transfer of wealth, that is,from Infidel states to Muslim states, the greater the amounts avaialable to them for the Money Weapon (and that includes the Money Weapon of Saudi Arabia and other rich Arabs, who are apparerntly relieved of any responsibility of paying for Pakistan, Egypt, Jordan, "the Palestinians" because it is we, the Infidels, who owe it to them, in classic Jizyah-extorting style). The more money we give to Pakistan in a vain attempt to pursue the will-o'-the-wisp of creating, in a country of primitive adherents of a primitive and malevolent Total Belief-System, somethning like a responsive and decent polity, the longer we delay doing what we should do to protect ourselves, and the fewer the resources we have to do it.

For we want Pakistan not to be resuced from the consequences of Islam, but forced to endure those consequences, so that at least some of its people will, as Ataturk did in Turkey, start to make the connection -- the essential connection that we all must make -- between the political, economic, social, intellectual, and moral failures of Muslim polities and peoples, and Islam itself.

That is why any further transfer of Infidel wealth to any Muslim states or peoples is not merely not wise, but the very opposite of wisdom. It is folly. Intolerable, absolute folly.

Posted by: Hugh at July 17, 2008 1:13 PM

Overflight rights and truck routes are pretty expensive.

We could save a few bucks and make new routes over and threw Iran.

A 6 Billion investment would clear a lot of roadway.

Posted by: flowerknife_us at July 17, 2008 2:44 PM

Muslims ending association with the West? There is a God afterall.

Posted by: Stephen Gash SIOE England at July 17, 2008 4:18 PM

Quarantine all states that desire Islamic Law. No one can be allowed to leave Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, etc. for anything. People will be allowed to go in, but like they say on a Disney ride: you can check in but you can't check out.
The man with the "childhood angers" would be forced to remain in Pakistan/Afghanistan.

Posted by: PMK at July 17, 2008 6:34 PM

They don't want anything to do with the West?

Fine. Take them precisely at their word. *We* don't want anything to do with them, either.

End of relationship.

We buy nothing from them (Pakistan has no oil, anyway), and whatever else they make is either the product of slave labour, or substandard because of Islam's infinite capacity to destroy initiative, creativity and stick-to-it-iveness.

We sell nothing. We most certainly give nothing.

No more jizya - oops, 'aid', not one cent - especially not the military variety. All military equipment currently in the country under western auspices gets removed when westerners leave.

All military and financial aid previously given to Pakistan, will be redirected to India and Thailand and the Philippines, to assist them in squashing the jihad insurgencies.

All western embassies pack up and leave. All Pakistani embassies and business establishments in western countries are politely but firmly told to pack their bags: all communication henceforth will be strictly formal and conducted at arms' length.

All Pakistanis currently resident in, but not citizens of, non-Muslims countries, get sent home on a one-way ticket - unless they can be shown to have genuinely apostasised. Anyone who pretends to have apostasised and is found not to have done so, gets booted.

It is firmly and clearly impressed upon Pakistan that all non-Muslims - Christians, Hindus, etc - must be completely free to leave as and when they wish, and must not be mistreated in any way; if they *are* mistreated (as, for example, by Muslim kidnappings and rapes of little Christian or Hindu girls) Pakistani-origin Muslim persons currently possessing citizenship in Western countries will be stripped of citizenship and sent 'home' to Pakistan, and mosques will be shut down. (Other suitable punishments could doubtless be devised: such as the seizing of illiquid assets owned by wealthy Pakistani jihad-enablers, within Western countries. A bunch of jihadis shoot a christian pastor? attack a Hindu temple? - ooops, a rich Zamindar's swiss bank account just got shut down).

Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, and apostates such as Ali Sina and Ibn Warraq will be sponsored in a 24/7 flooding of Pakistan with high-quality truthful presentations accurately criticising Islam and presenting alternative belief systems. Praise the Lord for satellite TV and for radio.

Wouldn't that be nice? It would save a lot of money; and since the Muslims simply would not be able to resist bullying the remnant non-Muslims inside Pakistan (if any such chose to remain), every time they did so, the Muslim population in the Lands of the Kafir would be inexorably reduced.

Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at July 18, 2008 3:24 AM

I reported this conference at the New English Review back on the 13th. of this month. Follow the link:

http://www.newenglishreview.org/blog_display.cfm/blog_id/15885

to see my take on this - which, is, incidentally, I would assume, near enough exactly the same as Mr. Spencer's would be.

Posted by: JMJ at July 18, 2008 9:50 PM

I should not have written that. Mr. Spencer is his own man and I have absolutely no knowledge of what his take might be other than that which he wrote in the headline article, above.

My apologies to all who read here for seeming to attempt to put my words in his mouth. That was wrong of me and it only dawned upon me that my post might be misconstrued in that way after I had clicked the 'post' button on the page.

I linked my reporting of this idiotic conference to some other stuff which you will see if you follow the link in my previous post and I have absolutely no way of knowing whether or not Mr. Spencer might agree with me or not.

I did not mean to mislead nor to imply that Mr. Spencer, or JW/DW, supports my take on this conference nor that they might support anything else which I said in that post over at the NER. Please accept my apologies.

Posted by: JMJ at July 18, 2008 10:05 PM