| FrontPageMag.com | By Robert Spencer | By Hugh Fitzgerald | Books | Dhimmi Watch | Islam 101 | Qur'an Blog | Raymond Ibrahim | Robert Spencer |  |
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Since certain Muslim media are fond of rehashing old history, reminding Muslims of the “atrocities” committed by the hated Crusader—past and present—it seems only logical that we here in the West also remember the past. Today in history, Christendom secured a great victory over Islam—one that is responsible for the very existence of Western civilization.
The year was 715, and one Suleiman had risen to the caliphate. He immediately made it clear that he would be the one Muslim who would fulfill Muhammad’s prophecy that Constantinople would eventually be subsumed into the umma. After spending nearly two years mustering the Muslims and preparing a massive navy, he unleashed the full might of the caliphate: the chroniclers say that 120,000 infantry and cavalry, along with 80,000 seamen, were sent to seal Constantinople’s fate. To further give his “blessing” to this campaign, and evincing how seriously he took it, he appointed his own brother, Maslama, at the head of the land army.
While making their way through that great desolate no-man’s land between the Byzantine and Umayyad empires, where certain Turkic tribes (then mushrikin) frequented the region, the Muslims would often wait till near dawn, and then shout in mass “Allahu Akbar!” (God is greatest), attacking and slaying all in their path. According to the Muslim chronicler al-Tabari, “The inhabitants of the city were filled with terror the likes of which they had never experienced before. All they saw were Muslims in their midst screaming ‘Allahu Akbar!’ Allah planted terror in their hearts…. The men were crucified over the course of 24 km.” (Al-Tabari goes on to explain that they did so, and were successful, in accordance to Koranic verse 3:151: “We shall cast terror into the hearts of infidels!”)
Simultaneously, the Muslim fleets were on their way to the Bosporus. Luckily for Constantinople, Leo III came to power, since it was in part due to his many stratagems that the Muslims were repulsed. (Tabari simply relates that Leo continuously duped Maslama, as if the latter were “a silly plaything of a woman.”)
At any rate, the Byzantine war-ships, which had recently come to utilize a new “secret weapon” commonly known as “fire-water” or “Greek fire,” according to Theophanes, set ablaze almost the entire Muslim fleet. After this Christian victory, the Byzantines settled into their fortified city for the winter, and let the elements have their way with Maslama’s massive land force. According to the chroniclers, this was by far one of the harshest winters; many thousands of Muslims perished of starvation and disease. Says Theophanes: “Some even say they put dead men and their own dung in pans, kneaded this, and ate it. A plague-like disease descended on them, and destroyed a countless throng.” The second sentence verifies the veracity of the first.
The new caliph, Omar II (the ambitious Suleiman had by now died of “indigestion,” apparently after consuming two baskets of eggs and figs, followed by marrow and sugar for dessert) had just assumed the caliphate. After many Muslims had died out on the frontiers (where snow lasted on the earth for 100 days), Omar finally sent reinforcements and supplies. It was by now spring, and the Muslims tried one last effort. The chroniclers relay that some 800 ships were sent from Alexandria and North Africa to the Bosporus, this time on guard against the Greek fire. Maslama had also renewed the siege.
Delivery for Constantinople came from the least expected source—the Egyptian crew of the Alexandrian ships. During the night, they all fled to Constantinople, acclaiming the Christian emperor. Why? Because they were all primarily still Christian—Copts—and, contrary to the many apologetics that suggest the Copts “welcomed” the invading Muslims, as this anecdote clearly reveals, had no great love for Islamic rule. Theophanes says that, as the Copts were fleeing in desertion to the city, “the sea looked entirely made of wood.” Taking advantage of this, Leo released from the citadel once again the fire-ships. Considering the loss of manpower with the Copts’ desertion, the confrontation was more a rout than a battle.
Finally, and due to Leo’s “diplomatic” overtures to the warlike Bulgars, he managed to get this Turkic people to attack Maslama’s already wearied army—killing, according to the chroniclers, 22,000 Muslims. It was over, and, on August 15th, 718, the siege was lifted, and the dejected Muslim army made its way back to Dar al-Islam.
Though many historians have rightly hailed the somewhat contemporary Battle of Tours of 732, where Charles the Hammer repulsed the invading Muslim armies, as one of the most decisive victories for Western civilization, in fact, the Byzantine victory over the Muslims is more important: it had the full backing of the caliphate, and consisted of far greater manpower. Had the Muslims won, and since Byzantium was the bulwark of Europe’s eastern flank, there would have been nothing in their way from turning the whole of Europe into the north-western appendage of Dar al-Islam.
This has been a "Today in History" moment.
Posted by Raymond at August 15, 2008 2:05 PM
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Istanbul (Not Constantinople) by They Might Be Giants
Istanbul was Constantinople
Now it's Istanbul, not Constantinople
Been a long time gone, Constantinople
Now it's Turkish delight on a moonlit night
Every gal in Constantinople
Lives in Istanbul, not Constantinople
So if you've a date in Constantinople
She'll be waiting in Istanbul
Even old New York was once New Amsterdam
Why they changed it I can't say
People just liked it better that way
So take me back to Constantinople
No, you can't go back to Constantinople
Been a long time gone, Constantinople
Why did Constantinople get the works?
That's nobody's business but the Turks (??? mine)
Istanbul, Istanbul)
Istanbul, Istanbul)
Even old New York was once New Amsterdam
Why they changed it I can't say
People just liked it better that way
Istanbul was Constantinople
Now it's Istanbul, not Constantinople
Been a long time gone, Constantinople
Why did Constantinople get the works?
That's nobody's business but the Turks
So take me back to Constantinople
No, you can't go back to Constantinople
Been a long time gone, Constantinople
Why did Constantinople get the works?
That's nobody's business but the Turks
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at August 15, 2008 2:22 PM
Celebration of this great day at the Casbah, this evening commencing at 1900.
Black tie.
And, Raymond, your money's no good tonight.
Wellington, same reserved table as always.
Posted by: undaunted at August 15, 2008 2:42 PM
Please continue to post historical events or 'on this day back when....'
Posted by: alaskan1000 at August 15, 2008 2:49 PM
it wasn't the time for europe to be destroyed. God used these brave Christian soldiers to secure Wesern civilization.
Saddly, today, eurabian leaders are opening our borders to allow this 7th century religion to flourish in our midst.
Posted by: Crusader at August 15, 2008 3:00 PM
Did God smile in 718, and was He weary or busy in 1453? Who knows, but I suppose it might have been strictly human effort that saved Constantinople the first time.
Can you imagine any venue other than jihadwatch calling attention to this great victory? Can you see PBS or The History Channel airing the fact that within one hundred years of Mohammed's death the forces of Islam, having conquered (not, as it happens, convinced by missionary endeavour to convert) most of the Middle East and North Africa, were carrying their own opus dei (insert here "bloody war") to Constantinople, and that Europeans were required to DEFEND THEMSELVES against Islamic onslaught in order to survive?
Don't wait too long to see it. There is no way to attribute such a massive war effort to "fringe extremists" who were "perverting" the religion of peace.
Posted by: Novalis at August 15, 2008 3:14 PM
Thanks Raymond...
Do you know what kind of fuel made the 'Greek fire', and how they projected it, as in the picture?
Looks like some kind of flamethrower...
Thanks...
at August 15, 2008 3:22 PM
“Some even say they put dead men and their own dung in pans, kneaded this, and ate it. A plague-like disease descended on them, and destroyed a countless throng.”
How do you manage to convince "countless throngs" to consume a meal like that? You would think that the first guy who took the first bite would have shouted, "Do Not Eat This Sh**!" Oh well, no accounting for taste.
Posted by: champ at August 15, 2008 3:41 PM
duh_swami , I was wondering the same thing. All I can find on the subject is it was a mixture that ignited when mixed with water. What was "greek fire"?
Posted by: interestinconundrum at August 15, 2008 3:59 PM
And a couple of hundred years later when the Russians where at the gates of Istanbul, the British saved the muslims a$$es
Posted by: InfidelK9 at August 15, 2008 4:00 PM
Did they have access to magnesium or phosphorus in those days?
Posted by: interestinconundrum at August 15, 2008 4:03 PM
For a description of greek fire, see C.J. Sansom's excellent novel "Dark Fire." In an afterword, Sansom says that the British TV station Channel 4 had a program about a fellow who had supposedly duplicated the recipe, which included crude oil and pine resin. Sort of a precusor to napalm and fuel-air munitions.
Posted by: Papa Whiskey at August 15, 2008 4:45 PM
Phosphorus on the Bosporus for the restofus.
Posted by: Jewel Atkins at August 15, 2008 4:49 PM
Maybe if Europe gets another "Little Ice Age", the new army of the Caliph will go home?
Posted by: tanstaafl at August 15, 2008 5:14 PM
Thx, Raymond.
Since r_not put out the words, here's a youtube of the old song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJXip6g_ZaQ
at August 15, 2008 5:17 PM
Raymond
thanks for that. An inspiring story, but also very instructive.
A round of toasts to Leo III, to the Bulgarians, and to the Copts, in honour of those Coptic sailors whose going over to the Byzantine side appears to have been a major factor in saving the day for free Christendom. (Whenever and wherever there is a Coptic demonstration to protest modern-day Muslim abuse of Copts in Egypt, all Jihadwatchers who can get there, should be there with bells on and placards waving - it appears that we owe them).
Ladies and gentlemen: if our own generals refuse to study these ancient battles, *we* must; and especially if we have in our acquaintance politicians, diplomats, soldiers, police officers, and other persons who are likely to find themselves on the jihad frontline sooner or later, we must share what we learn.
The victories are important. Carefully examined, they show us what our ancestors, our predecessors in the Great War of Self-Defence Against the Jihad, did *right*.
What worked?
Kafir solidarity - the Coptic sailors whom the Muslims were using, refused to be janissaries one second longer and bolted when they got the chance.
Leo persuaded the non-Muslim (and at that time non-christian?) Bulgars to attack the Muslims.
Superior kafir smarts and technology, judiciously employed.
Knowing when to go on the offensive and when to hunker down and let the terrain fight for you. (I was interested to observe the Greeks' use of General Winter, 1000 years before Russia had occasion to employ him).
Careful examination of the known details of the Tours battle, the Siege of Malta, the battle of Lepanto, the holding of Vienna in 1529 and the victory at Vienna in 1683, to name a few, should also be instructive. More recently, Israel's winning campaigns in 1948, 1956 and 1967, and their successful defence against all odds in 1973, should be studied carefully by all kafir who are currently facing jihad - by Filipino generals, say, and by Indian generals, and Thai generals.
Hulegu Khan's campaign against, and annihilation of, the Assassins should be dug out of the history books and contemplated.
Indian posters - Sikhs, Rajputs,and others - please feel free, on appropriate dates, to share here your ancestors' significant victories, not just for celebration, but for careful examination to determine principles that may apply elsewhere.
We also need to find out more about how the Ethiopians managed to hold out. (A defensible position helped, obviously).
Today we have two things. One: we know what worked for kafir, in the case of the various victories, and as we ferret about in those dusty history books, we can find out more.
But - two - we also, now, much better than ever before, know *why* certain stratagems and actions worked, thanks to people like Raymond, and Mr Spencer, and Dr Bostom, and Bat Yeor, and many others, including those who have diligently translated Muslim books, who have shown us the enemy's modus operandi, his 'playbook' - to which, for the most part, being quite brainwashed, he slavishly adheres. Indeed: once one grasps 'how they think' - Treaty of Hudaybiyya, hudna, taqiyya and kitman, infiltration, 'split the camp', and the rest of it - their actions become almost boringly predictable in every theatre of the Third Jihad.
All we knowledgeable citizens have to do - and that's a big ask, but it has to be done, we cannot afford to stop trying - is to transfer those two complementary bodies of knowledge (how and why Muslims attack non-Muslims, and what has been historically demonstrated as the best way to defeat them) into the heads of our diplomats, politicians, and military and religious leaders.
Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at August 15, 2008 5:31 PM
Enlightening.
What might be of even greater value would be something that extends this piece to its logical conclusion: A well-researched voluminous text (perhaps in 4 volumes or so), written in a captivating lord-of-the-rings storytelling style by a couple of kick-butt great writers, and meticulously documented in footnotes and references -- but not interfering with the readability of the text -- that starts from Mohammed himself and ends with an account of current events in the 21st century. It should be written dispassionately (in the academic sense) but with rich texture and compelling, realistically portrayed characters. Although technically a work of fiction, it should be 95% fact, and 5% additional dialogue and artistic flair, just enough to make it hard to put down, but in no way deviatiing from historical facts.
This monumental work should cover all 14 centuries hitting on all major events of the Jihad, and making clear the continuous narrative that puts today's world in it's correct context. A minimum of sermonizing and a maximum of storytelling.
Perhaps, for the sake of accuracy, in addition to unobtrusive footnoting of documentable items, a slight font-change could signal "creative" bits such as invented dialogue.
This story would be one chapter of such a series, perhaps in volume 3. The whole would be an enormous project, on par or beyond the challenge of biblical translation. I envision a team of 5 or 6 scholars like Spencer, Coughlin, Bostom and Furnish providing the scholarly meat and potatoes and perhaps two wordsmiths who specialize in historical fiction and have proven their worth (no suggestion here that Spencer, Furnish or Bostom couldn't do this, it's just that there is a difference between historical fiction and historical scholarship, on the writing end of things. Strictly speaking this is not fiction, but this is the style one would shoot for). Alternately one might pick a historical writer who specializes in the storytelling style, such as Giles Milton.
It would be called "The Great Jihad".
at August 15, 2008 5:43 PM
Then came along the fateful day May 29, 1453 and the Byzantine (Roman) Empire ended in a crushing defeat of the Byzantines at Constantinople.
An interesting thing I note, not long after that in the coming decades there was a serious scramble by Europeans to flee the continent and find some place new...some new world.
Where did they flee to?
America.
at August 15, 2008 6:00 PM
The key ingredient to Greek Fire, posited on a TV show about ancient inventions, was a flammable petroleum found in the region. Using a very dangerous looking mechanism the modern reinventors put a wooden ship to flame in a matter of seconds. Looked nearly as impressive as a flame thrower from the Pacific Theater in WWII. The keys are pumping it and keeping it lit without burning yourself or your own ship to a crisp.
Posted by: Beagle at August 15, 2008 6:01 PM
This is good reminder of the sacrifice made by past generations, for Western civilisation to come about.
The Knights of St John, in the defence of Malta, made a similar sacrifice, and against great odds, that was crucial to the survival of Europe. The Knights, numbering some 600, along with a militia of 9000, and outgunned by several orders, defeated some 40,000 well-trained and fanatical Mohammedans, thus ensuring that Soleiman could not use Malta to attack the soft underbelly of Europe. If Malta had fallen, so would Italy, and the Renaissance would never have occurred. The siege lasted from May 24 to Sept 8, 1565.
A fascinating and highly readable book on this most gruesome siege - The Siege by Ernle Bradford.
at August 15, 2008 6:04 PM
I think we need to start marking these anniversaries more often. Show them we're not at all ashamed of our history, not to mention our past resistance to Islam. Plus it's a good way to draw attention to historical truth. It's too bad the Western elite class are ostriches with their heads in the sand. You want an effective way to fight the mujahedeen? The next time we launch an offensive in Afghanistan or Iraq launch it on the 7th of October or the 2nd of September. Go on Al-Jazeera or Al-Beeb and unashamedly tell the Ummah what happened centuries before hand on those days. Of course to do so would be "culturally insensitive", so it will never happen.
That's too bad because there are several dates to celebrate:
The Battle of Poitiers (11th of October, 732)*
Breaking of the Siege of Vienna (14th, October 1529)
The Battle of Lepanto (7th of October, 1571)
The Battle of Khotyn (9th of October, 1621)
The Battle of Vienna (12th of September, 1683)
The Battle of Navarino (20th of October, 1827)
The Battle of Omdurman (2nd of September, 1898)
The Battle of Beersheba (31st of October, 1917)
Fall of Jerusalem (9th of December, 1917)
*I wouldn't say that that was the exact date of the battle. I'm going on Victor Davis Hanson's written account of the battle in "Why The West Has Won".
That's just off the top of my head. The criteria is pretty straightforward; any historical instance involving the defeat of an expansionist or oppressive Islamic army is a day with remembering. Since the ostriches are useless to the cause, it'd be nice to see more posts like the above on Jihad Watch in the future. If for nothing else, overall morale. I'd like to think that, in the future, more dates will be added to the list above. Perhaps a day in September or October marking the fall of the Islamic Republic of Iran. Something along those lines, but don't hold your breath.
On a side note, isn't it funny how most of the above battles all took place in September or October? And who says the mujahedeen aren't consistent?
Posted by: TheDiggler at August 15, 2008 6:29 PM
Robert and Raymond,
A most interesting and instructive post. So are the comments above. Although I have read about these sieges in the fascinating book "Jihad" by Paul Fregosi, and enjoy reading about them again, and again. I need to be reminded so I can more easily and readily remind others when the opportunity presents among family and friends.
I hope you will consider writing about these significant historic events of The Great Jihad on a regular basis here at JW.
Posted by: USorThem at August 15, 2008 6:29 PM
I don't know if anyone else has said this, so my apologies if I am repeating. But is this where the phrase "eat s**t and die" comes from?lol
Posted by: Kevin at August 15, 2008 7:05 PM
Thanks Beagle. The Bible spoke of pitch used in the building of the ark. So we can assume pitch or tar was found in those parts. Maybe a flowing oil well or two.
Posted by: interestinconundrum at August 15, 2008 7:19 PM
More recently in history, today marks The 6th Anniversary of the Murder of Sister Cecelia Moshi Hanna... Who here even heard of her before?
at August 15, 2008 7:39 PM
FREE CONSTANTINOPLE!!!
600 years of occupation is enough!
*sigh*
I miss the ole' Imperium Romana...
at August 15, 2008 8:29 PM
Thank you, Raymond.
Posted by: Moonzoo at August 15, 2008 9:14 PM
Thanks for the link http://theblackcordelias.wordpress.com/
Christians don't get much press win they are murdered do they?
at August 15, 2008 9:46 PM
It appears we have yet another gloating, boasting, sneering Mohammedan Boggart wannabe-Dementor on board, making faces rather like the murderous thug Rabadash in C S Lewis's "the Horse and His Boy" .
He'd like to pretend that the Europeans, from 1453 on, were 'on the run'.
Shall I remind us all of what happened in the 15th and 16th century? - The Muslims were systematically whupped and removed from the lands they had stolen, and ruined, in Spain.
(To head off any taqiyya-and-tu quoque*now* I will let any new posters know that the King of Spain has publicly offered an apology to the Jews who also got thrown out - for *they* were innocent victims, peaceful people who had suffered from Muslim imperialist occupation just as badly as the Christian Spaniards alongside them. Meanwhile, very rightly, the King of Spain has *refused* any kind of apology to the murderous Mohammedans; since the Muslims' evil deeds in Spain, their arrogance, cruelty, greed and despotism, and frequent acts of mass murder of defenceless Christians and Jews, called for the severest punishment).
Yes, Constantinople fell: but Jan Sobieski and his Winged Hussars kicked Mohammedan a$$ good and proper outside Vienna in 1683 and then the Greeks, the Bulgarians, Serbs and Romanians slowly but steadily rolled back the Abomination of Desolation which is the 'empire of Islam' aka the Ummah, the world's longest running Organised Crime Family and Human Sacrifice Cult disguised as a religion, which creates nothing, builds nothing, fixes nothing, and specialises in civil war, mass murder, oppression of women, gang rape and mass enslavement, not to mention nonsense and lies.
I commend to new readers C S Forester's little book "The Barbary Pirates" which relates how the newborn American republic got to work on the Mohammedan pirates of the North African coast.
Yes, some Europeans went to America. And here is one of America's greatest sons, a lifelong campaigner against slavery, offering an assessment of the contrasts between Christianity and Mohammedanism, as quoted in Andrew Bostom's essay on John Quincy Adams, entitled "John Quincy Adams Knew Jihad":
http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=F3F5C99B-338A-4BC1-A4B2-585EFE643619
"And he [Jesus] declared, that the enjoyment of felicity in the world hereafter, would be reward of the practice of benevolence here.
"His whole law was resolvable into the precept of love; peace on earth – good will toward man, was the early object of his mission; and the authoritative demonstration of the immortality of man, was that, which constituted the more than earthly tribute of glory to God in the highest…
"The first conquest of the religion of Jesus, was over the unsocial passions of his disciples. It elevated the standard of the human character in the scale of existence…On the Christian system of morals, man is an immortal spirit, confined for a short space of time, in an earthly tabernacle.
"Kindness to his fellow mortals embraces the whole compass of his duties upon earth, and the whole promise of happiness to his spirit hereafter.
THE ESSENCE OF THIS DOCTRINE IS, TO EXALT THE SPIRITUAL OVER THE BRUTAL PART OF HIS [man's] NATURE." (Adam's capital letters)….[from pp. 267-268 of the original document]
“In the seventh century of the Christian era, a wandering Arab of the lineage of Hagar [i.e., Mohammad] the Egyptian, combining the powers of transcendent genius, with the preternatural energy of a fanatic, and the fraudulent spirit of an impostor, proclaimed himself as a messenger from Heaven, and spread desolation and delusion over an extensive portion of the earth.
"Adopting from the sublime conception of the Mosaic law, the doctrine of one omnipotent God; he connected indissolubly with it, the audacious falsehood, that he was himself his prophet and apostle.
"Adopting from the new Revelation of Jesus, the faith and hope of immortal life, and of future retribution, he humbled it to the dust by adapting all the rewards and sanctions of his religion to the gratification of the sexual passion.
"He poisoned the sources of human felicity at the fountain, by degrading the condition of the female sex, and the allowance of polygamy;
"and he declared undistinguishing and exterminating war, as a part of his religion, against all the rest of mankind.
" THE ESSENCE OF HIS DOCTRINE WAS VIOLENCE AND LUST: TO EXALT THE BRUTAL OVER THE SPIRITUAL PART OF HUMAN NATURE (Adam's capital letters)….
:Between these two religions, thus contrasted in their characters, a war of twelve hundred years has already raged. The war is yet flagrant…
"While the merciless and dissolute dogmas of the false prophet shall furnish motives to human action, there can never be peace upon earth, and good will towards men.” [p. 269]
A little later on Adams, a humane, civilised and learned man, offered this sound piece of advice, that should be borne in mind by all kafir who have to defend themselves against jihad in all its forms:
“As the essential principle of his {Mohammed's] faith is the subjugation of others by the sword; it is only by force, that his false doctrines can be dispelled, and his power annihilated."
Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at August 15, 2008 9:54 PM
July 25, 1139: The Battle of Ourique. Legend has it that soon to be King of Portugal, Alphonse, prayed as most generals did the night before a major battle with the Moors. It was said that Jesus appeared to Alphonse and told him that he would be victorious over superior Muslim forces.
Indeed, the next morning Alphonse and his army slayed the generals of five Muslim legions (the five shields are part of the Portuguese flag today)and drove the Muslim occupiers from Portuguese land.
March 15, 1147-At the urging of the Pope, Flemish, French and English Crusaders are told to abandon their plans to go to the Holy Land and to help Alphonse liberate Lisbon. (The Pope's logic was: Why go to the Holy Land to fight invading Muslims when you could achieve the same purpose in Portugal.) After laying siege to Lisbon they finally defeated the Muslims on this date.
Martin Moniz-During this time, this Portuguese Crusader was responsible for liberating St. George's castle from the Moors. While the Muslims tried to close the doors of the castle to the invading Crusaders, Moniz wedged his body between the doors and was crushed but not before allowing the Crusaders to gain entrance to the castle and eventually defeat the Muslim occupiers. Legend has it that before Moniz died, he was able to slay three Moorish soldiers. Today a square is named after him in Lisbon but I doubt many Portuguese really know why.
All in all, Alphonse campaign recaptured 11 Portuguese castles from the Moors. Today seven of those castles are also represented on the flag of Portugal. I wonder how many Portuguese school children know the historic significance of those shields and castles and the sacrifices their ancestors made?
Posted by: Briars at August 15, 2008 10:03 PM
Posted by: Moonzoo at August 15, 2008 9:14 PM
I second, an excellent post this is.
at August 15, 2008 11:51 PM
Thanks to all who commented. Yes, I have been thinking about doing a "today in history" series for JW. If anyone can send me a link or comprehensive list of the most decisive battles -- and especially their dates -- that would be appreciated: editor@raymondibrahim.com
Posted by: Raymond at August 16, 2008 12:09 AM
While making their way through that great desolate no-man’s land between the Byzantine and Umayyad empires, where certain Turkic tribes (then mushrikin) frequented the region, the Muslims would often wait till near dawn, and then shout in mass “Allahu Akbar!” (God is greatest), attacking and slaying all in their path.
..................................
There's a historical precedent for this--it was Mohammed's practice to waken before dawn and gather his raiders outside a city. If they heard the Muslim call to prayer, they stayed their hand. If they did not, the raiders would descend on the place, shreiking "Allahu Akbar!"
I suppose catching the inhabitants half asleep and with their pants down--so to speak--didn't hurt either. In other words, theyonly considered Infidels fair game.
Abdullah Mikail wrote:
An interesting thing I note, not long after that in the coming decades there was a serious scramble by Europeans to flee the continent and find some place new...some new world.
Where did they flee to?
America.
......................................
You can take your revisionist history elsewhere. Trying to frame voyages of discovery as Europeans fleeing the continent is ludicrous, and won't wash here.
Posted by: gravenimage at August 16, 2008 12:30 AM
To the list of dates to celebrate, I would add:
The Liberation of Jerusalem, June 7, 1967
Posted by: billposer at August 16, 2008 1:09 AM
The Siege of Vienna is coming up on the 12th September, celebrating victory against the muslims in 1683.
Posted by: Voltaire at August 16, 2008 2:53 AM
Lets not forget a rather different 9/11, back on 11th September 1565 when the Knights of St John under Jean Parisol de la Valette finally defeated the Turks on Malta.
Posted by: Spirit Of 1683 at August 16, 2008 4:06 AM
I cannot believe I forgot to list the 7th of June. That's one of the best dates to celebrate.
Posted by: TheDiggler at August 16, 2008 4:07 AM
Another date to celebrate in history is July 22, 1456, where Janos Hunyadi defeated the Turks at Nandorfehervar (Belgrade).
Posted by: Spirit Of 1683 at August 16, 2008 4:21 AM
Muslims brag that Islam is the fastest growing religion...says to be a billion...which I have always doubted. There is no concrete evidence.
What is the world population? Est. last year is: 6,602,224,175
Okay, we have over 5 billion non Muslims. Ermmm, I can't see that islam as powerful, really.
In any case, never give up the fight. Keep on keeping on.
They can fool some of the people some of the time,
but they can't fool all the people all the time.
Wondering...how many have left islam?
Posted by: herself at August 16, 2008 10:54 AM
Then came along the fateful day May 29, 1453 and the Byzantine (Roman) Empire ended in a crushing defeat of the Byzantines at Constantinople.
An interesting thing I note, not long after that in the coming decades there was a serious scramble by Europeans to flee the continent and find some place new...some new world.
Where did they flee to?
America.
Posted by: Abdullah Mikail
The real impetus for finding the New World came from a desire by Europeans to bypass the oppressive Muslim presence in the Mediterranean and other trade routes to the East. European shipping and trade were constantly harassed by the Mohammetans so needed a way around them. They thought they could reach India by sailing west, which is how America came on the map. The rest of it, spreading out and colonizing the new continent was the byproduct. Nobody was 'fleeing' Europe, and a couple of centuries later Islam was soundly defeated at the Gates of Vienna. Europe evolved into a super civilization, at all levels from literature to the arts to science, and Islam remained an ignorant backwater until today. Oil is all they have, which we discovered and found useful, while Muslims collect the 'rent' at gouging prices. Now our petrodollars are coming back to haunt us with Islamic Jihad, with its Sharia ambitions of overthrowing our freedoms and constitutional governments based on post-Enlightenment principles of liberty, equality, and human rights. Islam is left inexorably behind, to never catch up. Islam is historically dead ended.
Understand that it is good to fear Islamic Jihadic Sharia, because this puts us on alert; but it is better to be disgusted by this regressive primitive ideology, because that will push it back into oblivion. We don't flee from fear, we push back from disgust.
Posted by: Battle_of_Tours at August 16, 2008 11:20 AM
Mahhh friends...Have we forgotten a day so hideous in the Muslim World that it has its own TITLE??!! "A day that will live in infamy until Allah allows us to blot it out...!!"
May 15, 1948. "al-Naqba"--"THE CATASTROPHE!!"
The re-creation of the State of Israel, on the historical land of Israel...The unification of Jerusalem was just a little follow-up after the outrageous shock of seeing Jewish refugees stand up to and crush swaggering Muslim armies.
They still haven't got over it. To the Muslims, it is not much different from a county full of sheep suddenly seeing the flocks chase the farmers off the lands, and declare a free Sheep Republic. Equally unthinkable for Jews to conquer Muslims on the battlefield. Unthinkable and unnatural.
al-Naqbah. Add it to the list!
Posted by: JewishOdysseus at August 17, 2008 1:07 AM
Constantinople was the center of Christianity before it became the Vatican in Rome. In 715 they destroyed the Muslims. They should have gone after them and finished them in Dar Al Islam a.k.a. Dal Al Suicide Bombing. Having failed to finish them then, they eventually returned in 1453 and defeated the Constantinople Christians and killed most of them and converted it to Istanbul, an Islamic city. Why were they bent on killing the Christians and Islamizing their city? Because they hated Christians then and they still hate Christians today. They are aiming at doing the same thin to the United States of America.
Posted by: American at August 18, 2008 12:04 PM
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