When I read a story like this, where a beautiful and talented woman, loved by her society, is beaten by a man because he has the right to do so, I am not only angered, but am also reminded of my own personal good fortune.

Imagine the horror of Arab manhood when they realize that in an open, free country such as ours, a woman can work; have her own bank account; marry who she wants or, more incredibly, not marry at all; go to school and live alone and make her own decisions if she chooses. She can go out to entertainment, ALONE, she can vote and has a voice in her society with no man controlling her and telling her what she can or cannot do under pain of beating and even murder. Imagine their fear of this form of government seeping into their country! Imagine their fear of losing all of that slave labor and powerless sexual compliance.
But, it's happening in spite of them, thanks to the courage of a woman in the article above. And thanks to the courage and determination of the US government's war on terrorists and radical Islam.

What you describe is not what many Arab women experience in this country, Patricia. Al Baz's experience is also that of many Arab women in this country. Since they don't encourage assimilation, and since they may not have the language skills, many Arab immigrant women are just as oppressed in the U.S. as they are in Saudi Arabia. In places like Detroit, which has high Muslim populations, there are streets where women may not walk unveiled.

you go girl, its about time the world understands sharia law.maybe now countries like canada wont be so quick togive the muslims any control here,or this is what we will have to look forward too.

Patricia, the man didn't have a right to beat his wife, or any other human being.

A "right" is not a permission slip granted by some other person or organization. A "right" is ours by our nature as living human beings.

We are born with rights; they are part of our nature. They cannot be given or granted, they are ours just as our eye color is ours. They cannot be taken away, either--they can only be violated.

A "right" is: The biological mandate of a living organism to preserve its life by acting in accordance with its nature."

The nature of human beings is defined by the fact that we possess the capacity for reason. Therefore, it is our right to act to preserve our lives through the use of reason.

The short version of what a right is goes like this: Your rights stop at my skin.

A short version of the description of behavior guided by reason is: One may not initiate the use of force, or its intellectual equivalent, fraud and deceit, against another human being.

Reason does, however, fully embrace the concept of self-defense (if you look at the definition of "rights" again, you will note that self-defense is a rational response to the violation of rights by the initiation of force or fraud).

Since rights characterize only individual living entities, no organization, group, or non-living entity can possess them.

By understanding this, and by referring when necessary to the short versions of what rights are and what rational behavior involves, its always incredibly easy to judge whether rights have been violated, or whether the behavior of another is fundamentally rational or not.

Far too many people who oppose you will attempt to muddy the waters by trying to convince you that it is "more complicated than that."

It isn't.

As with everything else about Islam, this beating is about POWER and intimidation. Islam seems to be structured to concentrate power in the hands of a few, the clerics. In this case, a certain amount of power and control of the wife is permitted to the husband and her other male relatives, but interested clerics still hold even greater power of wives (and all other women) through Sharia courts.

I can't imagine living with an ideology that turns men against their natural love and protective instincts for their mate like this. It has literally never entered my mind to strike my fiancee, because I can't stand to see her hurt.

Abuse of women may be a global phenomenon, but as far as I'm aware, it's only officially sanctioned and built into "modern" society by Islam.

I think it's tragically funny that Islam forbids alcohol; alcohol brings (to some) reduced inhibitions, sexual abuse, and violence, and yet Muhammad and his followers have managed to match and outdo the crimes of drunkards, all the while remaining bone-dry.

(For the record, I observe a precept not to consume alcohol or other intoxicants, but I can understand the average person's love of drink, and I think that's a lot healthier than going out and sacking a city for kicks.)

cubed, you're a true randian. >

' A "right" is: The biological mandate of a living organism to preserve its life by acting in accordance with its nature." '

Her husband WAS acting in accordance with his nature. After all, since his society let him get away with his conduct for so long, it must have been acceptable behavior.

Anonymous,
"... natural love and protective instincts for their mate ..." I must grudgingly disagree with you. I think these are cultural values one absorbs growing up. The West has long held the values of "women and children first". From what I have seen in Saudi Arabia, it's men, boys, women, then girls in - that order. I think that if the Titanic had had Middle Eastern Muslim passengers, there would have been very few female survivors.

And a lot depends on if your wife IS your mate, or just a baby machine.

jay

Oh, I almost forgot. When they DO catch Mohammed, it'll turn out that the stress of being unemployed made him do it. Just watch.

jay

An unemployed singer? Wait, I get it....he's a waiter at the local goat barbeque......but he's studying to be a vocalist......For what he did to this woman, who appeared to be beautiful before he put his paws on her, he should be stretched in a rack until his joints dislocate.

It's a good thing for the lady's husband that this didn't happen in the old South here in the good old U.S. of A.

Mrs Al-Baz would have simply waited until her hubby went to bed, then she would have crowned her with a cast iron skillet.

Many southern husbands were reformed in this fashion- that is, those who survived.

Seriously though, I find it hard to believe this stuff goes on- and is justified by religion.

is there anybody involved in this forum who has any idea about domestic violence and the extent of it. So what is your explanation for the abuse of women in a non-islamic society? Seeing you all seem to indicate that the evil muslim man is the one who perpetrates beating of women then there must be a lot of closet muslims who are just waiting to be 'outed' in the good 'ol USA

If you want to read about what the Koran says about beating women, check out this article:

http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/ArabChristian30907.htm

Yes, bahtoo,

Wife abuse does happen in the U.S. But there's one big difference. It's a criminal problem unjustified by religion. Unlike the Qur'an, the Bible does not contain a section on how and when it is permissible to beat your wife.

And here in the West, we don't need four male witnesses to prove rape.

jay

A husband is not allowed to injure his wife in Islam. The Sunnah is that a man hit his wife with a "miswak" if necessary, and a miswak is a twig used for brushing the teeth. (But actually, the Prophet [peace and blessings be upon him] never hit any of his wives.) You could not have done what is shown in that picture with a miswak for sure.

The stuff about women not voting or driving is also not relevant to this. Women not driving in Saudi is local law, and although it has the support of the religious scholars there, most Muslims outside Saudi have no problem letting women drive. They can drive in the Emirates, Kuwait, every country except Saudi. Saudi is also not a democracy and men cannot vote either.

Muslim men beat and have control over their women because they are cowards, impotent little men, who because they are failures in everything else in life, turn to Muhammad's own fear of women, and subsequent hadiths showing his insecurities, and use this to justify themselves. Muhammad hated women because they were smarter than him. Notice kadja kept him in control. When she died, (or was murdered by Muhammad)He became more of a monster and woman hater, probably because his mother abandoned him, and others abused him.

Yusaf, what revised edition of the koran and hadith are you reading?

Yusuf,
"A husband is not allowed to injure his wife in Islam." OK. We are looking at a figment of our collective imagination.

Your post, combined with this incident, illustrates one of the greatest problems that we have with Islam. We constantly hear, with variations, that "Islam is a just, peaceful, tolerant, scientific religion". Oh, wait. I forgot "respects life". Unfortunately, throughout the world, your actions do not match your words.

jay

Tabari IX:113 “Allah permits you to shut them in separate rooms and to beat them, but not severely. If they abstain, they have the right to food and clothing. Treat women well for they are like domestic animals and they possess nothing themselves. Allah has made the enjoyment of their bodies lawful in his Qur’an.”

Women are a possesion, an unequal parner, a slave of sorts, an instrument for pleasure, and to raise sons.

Qur’an 4:11 “Allah directs you in regard of your Children’s (inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females…. These are settled portions ordained by Allah.”

The koran repeatedly devalues women, it says NOTHING good about women, offers then NOTHING in reward for being a "good muslim". Most of what you hear today is made up and NOT in the koran.

Bukhari:V1B22N28 “The Prophet said: ‘I was shown the Hell Fire and the majority of its dwellers were women who are disbelievers or ungrateful.’ When asked what they were ungrateful for, the Prophet answered, ‘All the favors done for them by their husbands.’”

All a Muslim man has to do is THINK his wife is unfaithfull, and she can be beaten within an inch of her life.

Qur’an 4:43 “Believers, approach not prayers with a mind befogged or intoxicated until you understand what you utter. Nor when you are polluted, until after you have bathed. If you are ill, or on a journey, or come from answering the call of nature, or you have touched a woman, and you find no water, then take for yourselves clean dirt, and rub your faces and hands. Lo! Allah is Benign, Forgiving.”

The Qur’an claims women are unclean and polluted—worse than dirt. Filthy like an animal.

Qur’an 4:15 “If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, take the evidence of four witnesses from amongst you against them; if they testify, confine them to houses until death [by starvation] claims them.”

This is the real reason muslim women wear that black burka, not because it liberates them. It keeps them from being killed.

Bukhari:V3B48N826 “The Prophet said, ‘Isn’t the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?’ The women said, ‘Yes.’ He said, ‘This is because of the deficiency of a woman’s mind.’”

There is nothing but sura after sura degrading women, making them know they are worthless.

Qur’an 24:34 “Force not your slave-girls to whoredom (prostitution) if they desire chastity, that you may seek enjoyment of this life. [And here’s the freedom-to-pimp card:] But if anyone forces them, then after such compulsion, Allah is oft-forgiving.”

Ishaq:469 “The Apostle said, ‘Every wailing woman lies except those who wept for Sa’d.’”

Tabari VIII:62/Ishaq:496 “Ali said, ‘Prophet, women are plentiful. You can get a replacement, easily changing one for another.’”

Tied of the old hag? trade her in, or kill her, acuse her of adultry, have her stoned to death, and go get a new one. They are plentiful after all.

Ishaq:496 “Ask the slave girl; she will tell you the truth.’ So the Apostle called Burayra to ask her. Ali got up and gave her a violent beating first, saying, ‘Tell the Apostle the truth.’”

Muhammad never beat a woman? Sure, not with his own hand, but he took pleasure in having others do it for him. I'm sure he did as well, but those haddith somehow, "dissapeared" didn't they. I'm sure that amoung the 5,000 or so that aren't in the mainstream islamic books, there are plenty that show Muhammads violance toward women. After all, most haddith are put their to show Muhammad in the best light possible.

Tabari VIII:187 “The [sixty-two-year old] Messenger of Allah married Mulaykah. She was young and beautiful. One of the Prophet’s wives came to her and said, ‘Are you not ashamed to marry a man who killed your father during the day he conquered Mecca?” She therefore took refuge from him.”

Muhammad often took women who's husbands he had killed the very same day, and often forced to witness.

There is much more where this came from, so don't tell me that the koran says to beat them with a tooth brush. That is only one disputed hadith amoung many more that say otherwize

SHAKIR [5]: Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in their sleeping places and BEAT THEM; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.

Beating them with a twig? hardly,it doesn't mention a twig, and "beating" is suggestive of more than "tapping" them with a twig.

Here is the reference for the background of 4:34.

"A women complained to Muhammad that her husband slapped her on the face, (which was still marked by the slap). At first the prophet said to her: "Get even with him", but then added: "Wait until I think about it". Later on, Allah supposedly revealed 4:34 to Muhammad, after which the prophet said: "We wanted one thing but Allah wanted another, and what Allah wanted is best". [To beat your wife is best.]

The above quote comes from Razi's "At-Tafsir al-Kabir" on 4:34 (Quoted in “Beyond the Veil [7]. Razi is one of the greatest Muslim scholars.

Isn't it conveinent that "allah" always seemed to be at the beck and call when Muhammad needed him? Or do you think "allah" is just muhammads alter-ego? Remember, earlier in Muhammads fake prophet carreer, "Allah" never came to him at his beck and call.

AISHA – MUHAMMAD’S WIFE

Being Muhammad’s wife had many great advantages. However, even Aisha and Hafsah (two of Muhammad’s wives) were physically disciplined. Note that in each case when Aisha was struck she was married to Muhammad and she was probably younger than 16 years old.

SAHIH MUSLIM Book 004, #2127:

…When it was my turn for Allah's Messenger to spend the night with me, he turned his side, put on his mantle and took off his shoes and placed them near his feet, and spread the corner of his shawl on his bed and then lay down till he thought that I had gone to sleep. He took hold of his mantle slowly and put on the shoes slowly, and opened the door and went out and then closed it lightly. I covered my head, put on my veil and tightened my waist wrapper, and then went out following his steps till he reached Baqi'. He stood there and he stood for a long time. He then lifted his hands three times, and then returned and I also returned. He hastened his steps and I also hastened my steps. He ran and I too ran. He came (to the house) and I also came (to the house). I, however, preceded him and I entered (the house), and as I lay down in the bed, he (the Holy Prophet) entered the (house), and said: Why is it, O 'Aisha, that you are out of breath? I said: There is nothing. He said: Tell me or the Subtle and the Aware would inform me. I said: Messenger of Allah, may my father and mother be ransom for you, and then I told him (the whole story). He said: Was it the darkness (of your shadow) that I saw in front of me? I said: Yes. He struck me on the chest which caused me pain, and then said: Did you think that Allah and His Apostle would deal unjustly with you?…

COMMENT:
In this Hadith Muhammad chest-slapped Aisha and “caused her pain”. In my opinion, this action is not “wife beating” in the strictest sense. However, it shows that a woman can be struck under the certain circumstances. Muhammad’s ego was challenged, and he was probably frightened by seeing her shadow late at night, so, in his anger, he struck Aisha.

SAHIH MUSLIM Book 009, #3506:

Jabir b. 'Abdullah reported: Abu Bakr came and sought permission to see Allah's Messenger. He found people sitting at his door and none amongst them had been granted permission, but it was granted to Abu Bakr and he went in. Then came 'Umar and he sought permission and it was granted to him, and he found Allah's Apostle sitting sad and silent with his wives around him. He (Hadrat 'Umar) said: I would say something which would make the Holy Prophet laugh, so he said: Messenger of Allah, I wish you had seen (the treatment meted out to) the daughter of Kharija when she asked me some money, and I got up and slapped her on her neck. Allah's Messenger laughed and said: They are around me as you see, asking for extra money. Abu Bakr then got up went to 'Aisha and slapped her on the neck, and 'Umar stood up before Hafsa and slapped her saying: You ask Allah's Messenger which he does not possess. They said: By Allah, we do not ask Allah's Messenger for anything he does not possess….

COMMENT
The context in this Hadith was that Muhammad had been very upset for his wives. He almost divorced them all. While he was upset, his closest friends came to cheer him up. Umar mentioned that he had slapped his wife because she wanted more money than he felt he could give her. Muhammad laughed when he heard about her being slapped. Then he pointed out his wives’ demands for more money. As a result, both fathers slapped their respective daughters. So in this case Muhammad didn’t strike his wives, but he had others do it for him, making him just as culpable.

SAHIH BUKHARI VOL. 8 #828

Narrated Aisha: Abu Bakr came to towards me and struck me violently with his fist and said, "You have detained the people because of your necklace." But I remained motionless as if I was dead lest I should awake Allah's Apostle although that hit was very painful.

COMMENT:
The context for this Hadith is that Muhammad delayed breaking of camp to search for Aisha’s necklace. This made things hard for his followers because there was not much water. In his anger, Abu Bakr, Aisha’s father, struck her violently with his fist. Muhammad was asleep next to her, with his head resting on her legs or side. While this is not “wife beating”, it illustrates the degraded position of Muslim women.

SAHIH BUKHARI Vol. 7, #132

"Narrated Zam'a, "The prophet said, "None of you should flog his wife as he flogs a slave and then have sexual intercourse with her in the last part of the day."""

Here, Muhammad does not forbid wife beating, rather, he didn't want them severely beaten as Muslim's slaves could be beaten.

These Hadith give us glimpses of early Islamic life. They show us how women were thought of, and how they were treated. Later Islamic scholars were able to draw from these stories and develop an Islamic system of life. Women were the losers in this. But, what the scholars, and Muslim leaders did was accurate, based upon the Hadith. If wives were beaten with Muhammad’s approval, then that practice should continue today. Muslim women today are placed in the same position that Rifaa’s wife and the slapped women are placed in: submit or be physically punished.

Nathan, we are not allowed to beat slaves. In fact, if a Muslim hits his slave around the face or causes him any visible injury, the slave is freed automatically. By the way, I have heard the hadith you refer to and it refers to a male camel, not a slave.

So, Yusuf . . . do you, uh, own any slaves yourself?

Best
RS

It is interesting to note that, in the face of being presented with sahih hadiths that indisputably point out the degraded treatment of women by Muhammad and the oh-so-holy Sahaba, the only comment Yusuf has is to say that one of the hadiths is incorrect.

There are lots more hadiths like this in the books of the Sunnah, Yusuf; these are only the tip of the iceberg.

I am amazed at the outlandish lying that goes on in this site. The Islam conjured up here is not recognizabe to me.

For instance..
>>...Muhammad's own fear of women, and subsequent hadiths showing his insecurities, and use this to justify themselves. Muhammad hated women because they were smarter than him. Notice kadja kept him in control>When she died, (or was murdered by Muhammad)>He became more of a monster and woman hater, probably because his mother abandoned him, and others abused him.<<
**"The best husband is one who is kindest to his wife". That doesn't sound like a man who hated women! His mother passed away when P. Muhammad was only 6 years old, unless you consider death abandonment? No other history reveals he was abused.

Desperate people look so foolish.

Let try it again. Sentences were deleted when Post was hit.

For instance..
>>...Muhammad's own fear of women, and subsequent hadiths showing his insecurities, and use this to justify themselves. Muhammad hated women because they were smarter than him. Notice kadja kept him in control
**This pious woman asked P. Muhammad to marry her, not the other way around. She was in her 40, while he in his 20s. Why did she ask him to be her husband? Because he was incredibly honest and kind. They were married for over 20 years.

>>When she died, (or was murdered by Muhammad)...
**Is this how low you have gone to support your hatred?

>>He became more of a monster and woman hater, probably because his mother abandoned him, and others abused him.
**His mom died when he was only 6 years old. That is not abandonment. No history reveals abuse towards him.

This pious woman Khadija asked this man to marry her, not the other way around, because of his incredible honesty and trustworthiness. They were together for over 20 years. She died a natural death. Hope that clears things up.