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You'd think the vast majority of decent, law-abiding Muslims (about whom we hear so much, but whom we never see taking action against the jihadists) would be coming up to Lieuwe van Gogh, son of the murdered Theo van Gogh, expressing their sorrow, and offering their condolences. Instead, this. From Rogier Van Bakel's Nobody's Business blog (thanks to JS):
Since the murder of Theo van Gogh, last November, his now 14-year-old son Lieuwe has twice been physically attacked by young Moroccans, or (more likely) Dutch citizens of Moroccan descent. [Link, in Dutch.] Van Gogh's parents said this in an interview on national television.They insisted their grandson had done nothing to provoke the assaults. In one incident, recalled Anneke van Gogh, Theo's mother, "[Lieuwe] was walking the dog in the Watergraafsmeer area of Amsterdam, and they came up to him and said, 'Is your name van Gogh?' Lieuwe said no, of course, but they beat him anyway."
She also recounted how, some time after Theo van Gogh's assassination, a group of Moroccans appeared in the street where he had lived, inquiring about Lieuwe's whereabouts. It was the neighbors' impression that the visitors weren't there to offer condolences, and the police were called — but according to the filmmaker's mother, no one bothered to show up. That would have been in keeping with local officers' alleged non-action after the two beatings Lieuwe received. The cops were called then, too, Anneke van Gogh told the TV interviewer, but they declined to make an appearance.
Recently, Lieuwe was transferred to another class, in another building of his school, after he'd been repeatedly bullied by Muslim pupils. His grandmother said that Lieuwe had had to endure taunts like "Good thing they killed your dad."...
Posted by Robert at July 28, 2005 2:12 PM
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More on Theo Van Gogh's murderer at the link below. Apparently his strict adherence to Islam didn't have that much of a constraining effect his sexual proclivities.
Some bloggers may recall that Bouyeri worked his way out of a fairly decent white collar job he had and onto benefits by not only needing time out for prayers five times a day, but by claiming his religious beliefs prevented him from being able to interact with females in the context of a governmental services office-type job.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=18933
Posted by: waterdragon52![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/nav-commenters.gif)
at July 28, 2005 2:26 PM
This is sick. But then the stain infidelism goes for generations. :-/
Posted by: Ibn Rushd at July 28, 2005 2:32 PM
Ecil man, you're right. This boy's life may very well be in danger, even before any Islamic take-over.
Posted by: Voltaire at July 28, 2005 3:26 PM
You don't want to see my face now. It's a good thing you can't.
This is OUTRAGEOUS!!! Not only do they not regret the killing of the father, they tell their son it was a good thing done!
Those people are gripped by EVIL! Nothing short of EVIL can make people glory in their crime.
No compromise. No tolerance for such vice.
Posted by: Michael Zaretski at July 28, 2005 3:29 PM
Islam is the perfect religion for bullies.
Lieuwe, if you're reading this, son, please listen. Be strong. Be confidant. Get yourself and aluminum baseball bat and a length of lead pipe the same size as the bat. Go somewhere where you can be alone among trees. Take the pipe every couple of days and hit the trees as hard as you can without damaging your wrists. DON'T use the bat; USE THE PIPE.
When you can swing the pipe as hard as you can for ten minutes without tiring out, take a couple of days off and then start carrying the bat with you wherever you go. Get a catcher's mitt too, and carry that with the bat.
The next time ANYONE starts to beat you up, take the catcher's mitt off the bat and... do what comes naturally.
If things get too dangerous for you after that, get yourself into the American Embassy as quick as you can and apply for asylum in America.
Posted by: kj at July 28, 2005 4:04 PM
A pipe won't do this boy much good when the young muslim scrotes are carrying machine pistols (in the news from Holland a few weeks ago) Any chance we can smuggle a nine to this kid so he at least has a fighting chance?
Posted by: Infidel33 at July 28, 2005 4:12 PM
Muslim tormenters --- Please wake up
The issue of Islamic bullying in Western Schools is a subject close to my heart since my own brother was a victim of an Islamic bully. Also, various members of my community who are recent refugees from Islamic terror are forced to enroll their children in schools where they are terrorized by pan-Islamic gangs and sometimes single perpetrators. My own brother, then a legal permanent resident and a son of a tax payer, was terrorized by a Muslim exchange student, twice his size and a martial arts expert to boot, while the school did nothing. The interesting thing is that the darned Muslim bully got a full athletic scholarship to one of the best schools while my brother had to pay his own way in a public university. There is not a more eloquent statement about the state of affairs than this incident... The West, whither deliberately or unconsciously, rewards Muslim thuggery and turns a blind eye to the suffering of innocent, victimized, vulnerable children.
Although I am saddened by the suffering of native Western children, I hope that this phenomenon would heighten awareness about the long unnoticed suffering of non-Muslim children of immigrants at the hands of Muslim tormentors. It is interesting that if a gay or a black child was beaten up by a band of white kids, the whole world would hear about it, law enforcements and the courts would interfere. Bullying is horrible enough however, when it is the result of an organized conspiracy motivated by the religious intolerance of Muslim parents and religious leaders, it becomes a public issue worthy of the outmost concern.
at July 28, 2005 4:31 PM
The reasons the perpetrators do this are known...
But what in the HELL is wrong with the Dutch - who allow this to continue?!?!?!?!!?
Put your balls back on Dutch. Defend yourselves! It is now ok to do so!
FIGHT BACK NOW!
Posted by: PCKills! at July 28, 2005 4:40 PM
killing, deception, subterfuge, rape, and intimidation, the 5 pillars of islam.
with a religion based on these, which revels in murder, which lauds the sexual abuse and oppression of women(burkhas and hajib is required because muslim men apparently aren't civilized or mentally advanced enough to look at a woman and not rape her. islam KNOWS muslim men are primitive, and deficient, that's why they put the responsibility on the women, charging the men with their own responsibility is like turning the asylum over to the inmates), which holds lies and deception up as admirable and desirable traits,of course the craven gloating over the death of a childs father would be relished. the inhuman ghouls that would mock a grieving child wouldn't think twice about also killing the child after their mental masturbation at his expense.
of course, the scum would be duly outraged if the situation were reversed. the sick, psychotic dichotomy of standards.
this cancer must be eradicated.
muslims, every time you deny the truth, you slap allahs face with the soles of your shoes.
Posted by: t-ham at July 28, 2005 4:45 PM
Lieuwe, what you need to do is palm strike the base of the anterior portion of the neck just below the addams apple. hand turned parallel to the ground thumb abducted from midline. when the strike hits close the hand around the trachea you will feel your fingers touch behind the structure. then step forward through your oppenents space. when he is down if you want you can turn your hand rotating inwards crushing his airway if you like.
Posted by: ethoman at July 28, 2005 4:48 PM
Mr. Zaretski, you've spoken for me as well. I am no admirer of the late Theo van Gogh, but it is utterly wrong for the Islamobullies to go after his young son as well, and then for the Netherlands authorities to ignore the matter. Old Willem van Nassouwe wouldn't have stood for it for a minute, and it's just too bad the Sea Beggars of old are gone.
KJ, you dropped the ball on you advice to young Mr. van Gogh.
Since the Netherlands is probably on the visa waiver program (I haven't heard of too many Dutch people overstaying or trying to beat the immigration queue), young Mijnheer van Gogh ought to get together all the info on his case, take an American vacation, and then, when on US soil (Embassies, contrary to popular opinion, aren't really US territory), walk into the INS and ask for asylum.
Then again, I'm not sure that our present immigration and asylum laws consider the victims of bullying. It's too [depressingly] "normal", especially when it's teen-on-teen.
Posted by: Kepha at July 28, 2005 5:03 PM
Maybe the Dutch authorities took the "Morrocans" for "Marracones"--a long-oppressed group in many countries, hence beloved by the Dutch powers-that-be.
Posted by: Kepha at July 28, 2005 5:04 PM
Now we can't blame all Muslims for the violent acts of a few -- even if they are encouraged everyday at the Mosque to hate the "infidel," to murder, maim, steal, rape and destroy... This would be unfair -- and an indication of your own bigotry and lack of understanding of Islam... This ignorance is the root cause of all the Muslim anger and rage aginst the Islamophobic western socitey -- when the intolerance of Muslims ends, so will much of the motivation which forces them to lash out against us.
WE MUST STOP FORCING THEM TO DO BAD BAD BAD THINGS TO US -- Things such as being a Buddhist, a Christian, or worse, a JOOOOOOOO, are so deeply offensive, if you were a Muslim, you would understand! Then you might also want to murder stab immolate and whatnot to the unbelieving filthy filthy "infidel"
Posted by: jsla at July 28, 2005 5:21 PM
While I'm extremely appalled, I'm not surprised by this. Simply put, these people are subhuman scum.
Posted by: Salami, Salami, Bologna at July 28, 2005 5:22 PM
If the missing American girl in Aruba is any indication of Dutch ineptness, well then, their just inst much hope for these liberals.
Posted by: Bar at July 28, 2005 5:40 PM
Bar "thinks": Dum-dee-dum... livin' la vida loca, hey! Livin' la vida loca, hey! Hey! Helloooo. What's this? A mention of Holland... hmmm...Holland.... Dutch.... LIBERAL! YES! This looks like a good place to insert a little partisan crap about liberalism... here goes...
(Spew)
***********************************
Yes, Bar, there certainly inst much hope for these liberals. But don't worry. If Nancy Grace can get away from the mansions Scott, Laci, and Connor Peterson bought her, she'll get RIGHT on that case!
****************************************
The partisan, when he is engaged in a dispute, cares nothing about the rights of the question, but is anxious only to convince his hearers of his own assertions.
PLATO*
* Bar, you can read about him in one of those history books, philosophy books, or encyclopedias, be careful: the liberals wrote them!
at July 28, 2005 6:02 PM
The mentality of these yahoos is reminiscent of a pack of coyotes stalking an injured doe.
The yips attract more of their ilk which only increases the bravado of the gang. That pack being driven by an innate desire to sate their incessant hunger.
The difference between the coyote pack and the troglodyte tribe known as the Ummah is the former serves a benefit to nature and eventually to all of humanity while the latter is a parasitic malady hobbling the advancement of mankind.
Posted by: Skeet Street at July 28, 2005 6:21 PM
I agree with the general sentiment expressed here that we should be alert.
That does not mean however that if there is some newsitem that might suggest the very worst that we should indulge in how horrible things are and are going to be.
When you hear later that the first newsitem was wrong you can decide that you believed the first one and dismiss the second one. Take your pick. I would suggest to gather more information and suggest actions other then "kill them".
Here is a third news item in Dutch. I will translate it for you. Other Dutch visitors can comment on my translation.
"Gijs van de Westelaken zei donderdag namens de familie Van Gogh het te betreuren dat "één zinnetje in een interview zo'n grote affaire is geworden". "Misschien hadden de grootouders van Lieuwe het wat subtieler moeten verwoorden, maar die mensen zijn ook niet gewend om in de media te verschijnen", aldus Van de Westelaken.
Hij zegt dat er wel degelijk twee incidenten zijn geweest. Kort na de moord op Theo is Lieuwe tijdens het uitlaten van de hond mishandeld door een paar jongens en hield daar blauwe plekken aan over. Hij durfde dat pas later aan zijn moeder te vertellen. "Er is ook geen aangifte van gedaan", vertelt Van de Westelaken.
Pistool
Het tweede incident betreft twee jongens die met een pistool, of iets wat leek op een pistool, aan buurtbewoners vroegen waar Van Gogh woonde. De buurtbewoners belden de politie, maar de jongens waren al gevlogen. Twee weken later zagen bewoners de jongens weer in de buurt. Een politiewagen werd halverwege teruggeroepen, omdat leidinggevenden vonden dat er een arrestatieteam naar toe moest. Bij aankomst waren de jongens wederom al weg, aldus Van de Westelaken.
De familie Van Gogh is niet boos op de politie, zegt Van de Westelaken. Ze betreuren het alleen dat alles zo is opgeblazen en willen graag met rust gelaten. "
(source: http://www.nu.nl/news.jsp?n=565828&c=14&rss)
My translation
The family’s spokesperson van Westelaken declared it was sad that “this one little sentence in this interview became such a big issue”. “Maybe the grandparents should have used more subtle words, but these folks are not used to appear in the media”.
He says there have been two incidents. It was shortly after the murder. While walking the dog the boys was attacked and got bruises from it. He did not dare to tell his mother. This incident was not reported to the police either.
On the second incident there were two boys with a pistol or something that looked like a pistol who asked people in the neigborhood where van Gogh lived. These people called the police, but these boys were gone already. Two weeks later the people in the neigborhood saw the boys again. The police was warned. A policecar was called back because police autorities decided a special arrestteam had to go in. When this team arrived the boys were gone again.
The family van Gogh is not angry with the police. The dislike the fact that things were growing out of proportion and want to be left in peace”
To me it looks very strange the first incident was not reported to the police. Apparently the grandparent and mother had their doubts on the story too. This idea is confirmed in the last sentence.
PS: of course I do not blame the boy if he made things up. You can not ask him to behave 100% cool and rational.
PPS: the parents of van Gogh are not little frightened old folks. Incidentally the father has worked for the Dutch intelligence.
at July 28, 2005 6:35 PM
I mentioned in a JW posting that the movie Short "Submission" will be screened in Toronto Canada on Aug 12th and the link below can provide the 411 on tickets and the times for various parts of the NO SHARIA meetings for the public.
A ferry now runs from Rochester N.Y. to Toronto harbour where a Subway Station is near by to loop up to the Station near the Hall used for the event.
at July 28, 2005 7:41 PM
Absolutely nauseating.
One is reminded of the beheading of the American Paul Johnson in Saudi Arabia, and the incident where a Saudi woman wrote a letter to his wife on the internet, jeering at his death.
Posted by: kafira at July 28, 2005 8:51 PM
Where is King "Tolerance"? Is it OK for muslims to beat a 14 year old boy because Christians burned crosses in black peoples' yards? Let's hear it KT.
Posted by: Carolyn2 at July 28, 2005 10:05 PM
If you want to know what's wrong with the Dutch, read Frans Shrinkendick's comment above... we should be alert.. I would suggest you gather more information... the grandparent and mother had their doubts on the story too.. of course I do not blame the boy if he made things up... You're pathetic.
Holland is dying a cowards death.
Posted by: moondoggy at July 28, 2005 10:25 PM
Kj
The price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men.
Plato
at July 28, 2005 11:49 PM
Where are the darned big native Dutch kids? Why do not they gang up to protect the child of national hero and an international martyr? They are so proud that they all the tallest people… I guess as they physically grew taller, other appendages shrank to microscopic sizes… A wonder that they are able to bread at all, which also explains why are their women are looking elsewhere.
Posted by: have_mercy at July 28, 2005 11:52 PM
I am sorry to say, if the kid stays in the Netherlands, he is doomed to suffer from life-long psychiatric issues… But, what can he do? He is invariably stuck in a chicken coop with foxes all around. He cannot ask for asylum in the USA because the Dutch government does not officially persecute him. The best that he could hope for is that his legal guardian moves him to a rural area where he might salvage what is left of his childhood.
at July 28, 2005 11:53 PM
If Lieuwe ever needs a place to flee to in the U.S., he's welcome to stay, and apply for asylum, at my house. (The government would not dare try to deport him.)
Ik spreek Hollands, en mijn vrouw is oorspronkelijk een Nederlandse meisje.
I'd even be willing to teach him some essential judo during his residence, plus how to use a variety of self-defense devices that make a satisfying bang (if he is ever bothered by people who prefer to fight armed and dirty).
He can contact me through Mr. Spencer, should he ever come across this site and want to get the hell out of Dodge (als wij zeggen hier in Amerika).
Franz Groenendijk-
What I got from the Dutch item, reading between the lines, was that the grandparents were trying to downplay the reports in order to protect their grandchild. Not denying any of it, but attempting to 'cool off' the journalists, in order to keep future reporters from stupidly reminding extremist Muslims in the Netherlands that Van Gogh even had a son. And getting any ideas about what should be done to him.
Kepha-
If you didn't like Theo Van Gogh, you would have hated Socrates. (I hear the religious extremists in ancient Greece killed him, too. For the same reason. Mocking their gods.)
You don't really think that anyone in their right mind could ever construe this as a case of "teen on teen" bullying, do you? (And miss the international/cultural/murderous/symbolic/terrorist/jihadist implications?) You must be kidding.
Posted by: profitsbeard at July 29, 2005 1:03 AM
That's it, no more of this "good guy" charade! Just as the Soviets fought the Nazis, we need to fight the islamic evil with another kind of evil! Eurofascism, rise!
Posted by: A.G.Frederick III at July 29, 2005 2:49 AM
Keep this in mind, all of you when dealing with Islamo-Nazis:
Here is a statement from the Ayatollah Khomeini. Do you think that this statement, from a leading Shi’a theologian, misstates Islamic theology, and is simply one man’s view, or do you think that it correctly expresses a view that can be easily derived from a reading of Qur’an and the hadith contained, for example, in the “sahih” collections of Bukhari and Muslim?
“Islam makes it incumbent on all adult males, provided they are not disabled and incapacitated, to prepare themselves for the conquest of [other] countries so that the writ of Islam is obeyed in every country in the world.
But those who study Islamic Holy War will understand why Islam wants to conquer the whole world….Those who know nothing of Islam pretend that Islam counsels against war. Those [who say this] are witless. Islam says: Kill all the unbelievers just as they would kill you all! Does this mean that Muslims should sit back until they are devoured by [the unbelievers]? Islam says: Kill them [the non-Muslims], put them to the sword and scatter [their armies[. Does this mean sitting back until [non-Muslims] overcome us? Islam says: Kill in the service of Allah those who may want to kill you! Does this mean that we sould surrender to the enemy? Islam says: Whatever good there is exists thanks to the sword and in the shadow of the sword! People cannot be made obedient except with the sword! The sword is the key to Paradise, which can be opened only for Holy Warriors! There are hundreds of other [Koranic] verses and Hadiths [sayings of the Porphet] urging Muslims to value war and to fight. Does all that mean that Islam is a religion that prevents men from waging war? I spit upon those foolish souls who make such a claim.”
at July 29, 2005 7:15 AM
Don't wait for KT's response. He has none. A fine upstanding "middle-of-the-road" (Shiite), he only cares about threads in which he thinks he can counter-argue to islam's benefit.
As such, he daren't touch this kind of political topic with a 10-foot virgin.
Like his wife, maybe.
Geoff
Posted by: Geoff at July 29, 2005 10:19 AM
To the spermologue Profitsbeard, if you really knew Socrates, you'd know that his only answer to the assertion that the tyrant is the happiest of men is that we face a judgment after death. It's in his dialogue _Gorgias_, in which he discusses this question with a whippersnapper named Callicles. This is one reason why Plato was popular with a wide range of Christian thinkers from the Greek Fathers down to Huldreich Zwingli.
Betcha don't even know where the Greek word _spermologos_ appears in the corpus of that language's literature, my dear would-be Socratic.
at July 29, 2005 10:35 AM
Kepha, keep yourself together: you are a rock in itself, having, from what I can tell, no need to throw any. The beating up we read about above should be the topic of our concern here, not beating up our friends learning about Socrates.
My guess is that you're refering to St. Paul rather than Demosthenes, but as funny as I might find the contast, who else would? I refered to KJ as Thersites some time ago, a superior allusion, one I think you'd probably enjoy. But I'm not a nice guy for all that. You seem to be, and I'd like to keep thinking so.
I'd like to invite you to write at my wonderful blog, Kepha, but we don't have anything in common. Profitsbeard, on the other hand, is a likely contributor.
Best to both. Dag.
http://nodhimmitude.blogspot.com
Posted by: sonofwalker at July 29, 2005 2:43 PM
=================================================
"I'd find some Dutch rednecks, pay them handsomely, provide weapons, tell them the real money comes after the job is done, and then move away and wait for the headlines. And if you can't find a patriotic Dutchman, I bet there are other nationalities in the eastern parts of Europe or in Russia who'd make some Morroccan scum go bye bye."
=================================================
"The difference between the coyote pack and the troglodyte tribe known as the Ummah is the former serves a benefit to nature and eventually to all of humanity while the latter is a parasitic malady hobbling the advancement of mankind."
=================================================
"That's it, no more of this "good guy" charade! Just as the Soviets fought the Nazis, we need to fight the islamic evil with another kind of evil! Eurofascism, rise!"
=================================================
Posted by: ia786 at July 29, 2005 3:07 PM
Sheesh, Dag/Sonofwalker. I'm impressed. There are people here who think me nasty, although I like to think of myself as a nice guy. Kudos on knowing Aramit.
Posted by: Kepha at July 29, 2005 5:14 PM
Kepha-
Going off on an arcana rant while avoiding the point[s] (-was Theo Van Gogh not a "gadfly" in the Socratic tradition? -did they not both die for the same crime? wouldn't the old stonemason have been as 'unpleasant' to you for the same reasons? and, isn't it immaterial to the discussion at hand?) seems somewhat inane.
P.S.-
What 'collection of small lively points'- AKA 'trivia' , as in spermologer,- are you talking about? And is this the place to 'go off' -at a pissing-contest level of philosophical minutae- in the current of a discussion about the threatened injury- or worse- to the son of a (mostly unwitting and certainly unwilling) neo-classical defender of Western freedom? One who gave his life for it?...- To wave Platonic dialogue diversions, 'gorgeous' as they may be ...in the proper context... strikes me as a nerve hit that wasn't aimed at.
I've read Heraclitus to Plotinus, Patanjali to Milarepa, and don't need to distract from the vital subject, here, with the vituperative or vanitas. Being a Skeptic, I find Plato to be the father of fascism as much as the irrational core of the Church Fathers' later intellectually illegimate 'philosophizing', and much prefer Socrates in his own voice (when he manages to get through the distorting and contorting censorship of his discipline... as in 'The Trial', which at least has a second source in Xenophon). Although his sense of humor (asking for a rooster to be sacrificed, after his death, in a symbolic taunt to the judges, saying, in essence "the illness is over") is often buried with him.
Worry more about Lieuwe Van Gogh and less about your ego (a fine old classical word). Gnothi seaton, back at ya.
Posted by: profitsbeard at July 30, 2005 1:35 AM
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