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Suicide bombing? Pah! "UK Memo Recommends Qaradawi Entry Visa: The memo said Qaradawi's view on Palestine and Iraq are not unusual amongst mainstream Muslims." That's true: they're not unusual. Neither was Nazism among Germans. Both are still abhorrent. From IslamOnline, with thanks to Sr. Soph:
CAIRO, September 4, 2005 (IslamOnline.net) – A restricted British memo issued after the London terrorist attacks recommended giving entry visa to renowned Muslim scholar Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi, The Observer revealed on Sunday, September 4."Exclusion ... could turn Muslim opinion further against the UK and encourage some to move to violence against British targets," cautioned the memo, written by Mockbul Ali, the Foreign Communication Office (FCO)'s Islamic issues adviser.
It noted that John Sawers, the Foreign Office's director-general, supported giving the visa to the moderate scholar.
The memo came in response to a request from the Home Office on whether Qaradawi, head of the Dublin-based International Association of Muslim Scholars (IAMS), should be given an entry visa should he seeks one.
Following the attacks, carried out by four British Muslims and claimed by Al-Qaeda, London issued guidelines of "unacceptable behavior" under which it can deport and ban Muslim scholars accused of fomenting, justifying and glorifying acts of terror and violence.
Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, has threatened to take the British government to court if it banned Qaradawi from entering the country under the controversial guidelines.
"I don't think he should be banned. He has opposed all acts of terrorism by Al-Qaeda around the world. He urged Arabs to donate blood after September 11," he underlined.
Qaradawi swiftly condemn the grisly London attacks as running counter to the tents of Islam.
Mainstream
The memo recognized that Qaradawi's views on issues like the Palestinian-Israeli conflict and Iraq reflect the mainstream opinion in the Muslim world.
"We certainly do not agree with Qaradawi's views on Israel and Iraq, but we have to recognize that they are not unusual amongst Muslims.
"Refusing entry on these grounds would also open a Pandora's box in relation to entry clearance for others in the Muslim world," read the document.
The same argument was earlier upheld by Livingstone, who warned against exploiting the new guidelines against the likes of Qaradawi.
"…there will be very few Muslim scholars or leaders that will ever be admitted to Britain because the vast majority of Muslims identify with the struggle of the Palestinian people".
Qaradawi said that resisting the foreign occupation forces in Iraq and the Palestinian territories are a duty for all Muslims.
The venerable scholar, also a trustee of the Oxford University Center for Islamic Studies, repeatedly drew the line between the Israeli occupation and Jews.
"We do not fight Israelis because they are Jews, but because they took our land, killed our children and profaned our holy places," he had said.
Livingstone apologized in July last year to Qaradawi "on behalf of the people of London" for the media fuss that overshadowed his last visit to Britain.
He had criticized the Washington-based Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI), which is led by a former Israeli intelligence officer, for fueling the hatred campaign.
A hatred campaign? What did MEMRI do? It printed what Qaradawi said. And once again doing so has been characterized by jihadist Muslims and their allies as "hatred."
Posted by Robert at September 5, 2005 8:30 AM
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Yet I heard at church yesterday that a young Christian man from abroad has had his application for renewal of his visa, so that he could do a second term working with our youth leader, refused.
He is hard working, respectable, sponsored by a reputable interdenominal organisation, provided with references by the MP and mayor, would continue to lodge with a clergy family, be fed by members of the congregation, would not cost the country a penny (well, he might if he met with an accident I suppose) but would give my neighbourhood a great deal.
I'm cross.
Posted by: Granny Weatherwax![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/nav-commenters.gif)
at September 5, 2005 8:52 AM
"Exclusion ... could turn Muslim opinion further against the UK and encourage some to move to violence against British targets."
This type of erroneous reasoning will grant the jihadists every single thing that they wish for, without having to fire a shot, and reduce us all to dhimmi servitude.
How on earth anybody with even a single functioning neurone could believe this twaddle is completely beyond me.
As has been pointed out many times on this site, nothing could turn Muslim opinion further against the U.K., the U.S, Australia, Canada, Italy, Spain etc. We are - and have been for centuries - all despised infidels and nothing will change that. Fullstop, end of story.
If these idiots at the Foreign Office really want Muslim opinion to be favourable, they will have to either convert, die, or pay the jizya.
If these three courses of action do not appeal, these morons should do the decent thing and resign and allow someone with some balls (metaphorically speaking RebeccaW) to get on with the job of first defining and then protecting Britain's national interests.
Posted by: Anthony at September 5, 2005 8:57 AM
If Qaradawi is allowed in to the UK, then all that tough talk by the UK government some weeks ago was just that: tough talk!
If the government is afraid of the fall-out from exclusion of Qaradawi and his ilk, then I'm afraid to say that we shall achieve little or nothing in our fight against the excesses of Islam and Muslims.
This story reminds me of Karen Hughes' worries regarding the popularity of the US in the Muslim world. Now the UK government, it seems, has similar worries. It would appear that our leaders these days are more concerned about being liked than they are about taking the necessary measures to protect the people. What a sad state of affairs!
What is particularly intriguing in all of this is this: Why is Red Ken so determined to protect Muslims? Is he a closet Muslim himself? Or is there something going on behind the scenes which we, the people, don't know about?
Red Ken, only the other day, after the 7/7 attacks in London, stated that he was proud to say that London was am extremely cosmopolitan city. Does he not realise that there are many homosexuals living in that cosmopolitan city; and, further, does he not know what Qaradawi's views on homosexuals are? Am I not right in saying that Qaradawi has stated that homosexuals should be killed?
9/11 has opened up a can of worms for the West. Our leaders, both sides of the Atlantic, have shown us over and over that a.) they don't understand the true nature of the threat that Islam poses, and b.) they don't know how to deal with that threat even if they do, and c.) they do not have the courage to take the necessary steps to deal with the root cause of our problems with jihad: Islam!
It would apear that our politicians are walkng around in a fog of their own making. They need to start doing a spot of clear thinking for a change; moreover, they need to extricate themselves from all those vested interests. Simply put: Too much money is changing hands at the top!
at September 5, 2005 9:09 AM
"Exclusion....turn muslim opinion ... encourage...violence..."
Translation: You've acted like a bully towards us and, well, quite frankly it worked. We'll do whatever you say and cooperate fully, just don't hit me.
As far as "mainstream muslim opinion" re the palestinians, you have to remember that muslims EXCEL at self deception and the hysterical avoidance of messy little things like facts. muslims have done more harm to the palestinians than all the Jews who ever lived could possibly have hoped to accomplish, were they so inclined.
How about a little brutal self-honesty for the "mainstream"?
I'm waaaaaaaaaiting.(yawn)
Posted by: t-ham at September 5, 2005 9:52 AM
New Labour:
Soft on Islamic terrorism.
Soft on Islamic terrorists.
Soft on the causes of Islamic terrorism.
Its always talk with New Labour. They are powerless to act. They have run down British values & peoples in a vain attempt to apologise for the Empire to such an extent that we are now run by wimps who are ashamed of themselves because of a history they can niether control nor have full jurisdiction to apologise for.
They have emboldened our enemies because our enemy - Islam - knows our leaders are weak, flacid & lack the conviction to do what is necessary to thwart them.
I have heard talk - it is only talk, that if he arrives in the UK the gay lobby in the UK are going to try & make a citizens arrest of this despicable 7th century fascist using Human Rights Law....(((HEY! You mean we can actually get that piece of EUrabian legislation to work for us?????)))
I hope it is true - I would love to see Peter Tatchell go up against the Islamic Fascists the same way he went up against Zimbabwean Fascists when he tried to arrest Mugabe.
And what of the openly gay New Labour MPs?
(Even more are closets)
Are they happy that a man welcomed with open arms by Princess Tony Bliar would throw them off the tallest building in their hometown as "a lesson to other male sodomites", given half a chance?
What about the British EU Trade Commissioner Peter "Mandy" Mandelson? I hope he has the good taste not to be in London when Qaradawi arrives - I am sure that Qaradawi & his associates would take great offence at an EU Minister arriving at offical "Islamic" functions with his Brazilian toy boy dancer.
Posted by: albion at September 5, 2005 9:54 AM
Granny,
If he had been a Muslim he would have his visa extended.
Mark,
It all goes back to the short term nature of politicians, in that they are desperate not to be remembered for some catastrophe on their watch.
The stark reality that we are facing, is that in 10 to 20 years time when the Muslim population has become a large but powerful minority, they will flex their muscles which will include killing of indigenoues people in their homes, cities, towns and villages, imposing their warped values on the non-muslim population (they are already starting that). Civil unrest will follow, then war, if it happens now we win, if it happens in 20 years time we lose, they will have more young people as soldiers and will have gained the levers of power from oil money.
At this point the politicans has a chance to pre-empt this by applying policies that deal with Islam, but this will cause civil unrest because the Muslims will not accept such restrictions, so we would have riots in London, Bolton, Bradford etc. But they won't because civil disorder is a real problem when is comes to economic activity. So they do nothing and store up the troubles for the future.
Failure to do something now results in a much greater backlash in the future, which will make the Holocaust look like a walk in the park, and if we act much later than the result will be the ending of freedom and democracy in Europe under the yoke of Islam.
I am quite certain now that the immigration in the West has been facilitated by these Islamic centres of jurisprudence, I think that there has been a push to develop Muslim minorities across the world, its interesting but if you start going through first and second world nations you see a pattern of Muslim minorities.
Finally what is a moderate Muslim, all our politicians seem to be trying to work that out, well I think that our brain dead politicians see it as someone who does not kill to bring about a worldwide Islamic state.
For me it is someone who actively fights against the jihadic nature of Islam, the question is where are they, they are very few and far between.
I do not care what the intolerant feel about us and our socities, I have nothing to learn from these people, I don't want their respect because I have no respect whatsoever for Islam. There are some people in Muslim countries that do have my respect as human beings, but the majority are just sheep for the wolves.
And finally as a Brit, did other Brits feel the same intense hatred watching that video of the Leeds bomber that I did, I found my reaction rather scary...
Posted by: Daffersd at September 5, 2005 10:09 AM
Everytime I start feeling truly sorry for us here in America, what with "Mommy" Karen Hughes prattling on and our all Hat and no Cattle President, I just have to take a gander across the pond to feel a whole lot better.
Maggie Thatcher wouldn't have stood for it, that's for sure.
Posted by: Rebecca JW at September 5, 2005 10:12 AM
The fact is that Tatchell and three of his associates, some of whom are from gay and lesbian Muslim dissident groups have had very serious death threats for their opposition to Qaradawi from Islamists, yet Ken thinks Qaradawi's rights are greater than those of British citizens like Tatchell.
Posted by: londongirl at September 5, 2005 10:30 AM
Peter Tatchell also made it very clear that the Left are wrong in their pandering to the Islamofacists in a piece following the 7/7 atrocity.
Posted by: Daffersd at September 5, 2005 10:34 AM
"Exclusion ... could turn Muslim opinion further against the UK and encourage some to move to violence against British targets," cautioned the memo, written by Mockbul Ali, the Foreign Communication Office (FCO)'s Islamic issues adviser.."
The "Islamic issues adviser" named Mockbul Ali? You can get all the Islamic issues advising you need out of the pages of C. Snouck Hurgronje, who advised the government of the Dutch East Indies on dealing with Muslims. And even Bernard Lewis will explain that appeasement (which Westerners sometimes dignify as "compromise" or as "respect for the opinions of others") never works with Muslims. The psychology is not that of Western man. This has to be understood, once and for all, by Infidels. Appeasement does not work but is regarded as a sign of weakness.
It is not surprising that one "Mockbul Ali" would direct attention away from Islam itself and what is contained in Qur'an, Hadith, and Sira, and yet again hope to convince British Infidels that it is what they do, how they behave, that matters. It doesn't. They are Infidels. That's it. They can appease, and appease, and appease, and lose, and lose, and lose, and be subject to more, and more, and more, demands, or they can stop, study Islam, think clearly, and cease to appease altogether, and work to divide and demoralize the forces of Islam, and to contain the power of Islam, and diminish the presence of Believers behind enemy lines.
That is the choice. The only choice.
Posted by: Hugh at September 5, 2005 12:18 PM
Unbelievable. All the tough talk about expelling and refusing entry to the elements displaying 'unacceptable behaviour' was nothing but a hollow sham designed to calm down the population that is gradually waking up to the Islamist threat. Although it is a bit too early to jump to conclusions — after all, it is just a memo recommending one course of action which the authorities aren't obliged to pursue — the fact that the British government has not yet expelled a single influential militant cleric doesn't inspire much optimism.
Besides, I don't think Tony Blair would like to be taken to the court by Red Ken, who promised to do so if al-Qaradawi is denied an entry to the UK. (read more here: http://www.acage.org/news/?day=09012005&id=0010 )
-----------------------------
dolphin, CAGE co-founder.
http://www.acage.org
at September 5, 2005 12:30 PM
If homosexuals wish to practice defenestration, by all means I am in favor of it, though I won't partake of it myself. If gay and lesbian Londoners wish to toss Red Ken out of office, yes, I do approve, in a mild-mannered and law-abiding way. (Oh, this is a stretch.)
If homosexuals wish to demonstrate against the pandering to Islamic fascists, I'll march with them in support of their particular cause, not because I look good in heels, but because homosexuals have a right to life that would end with the rise of Red Ken's friends taking power, as they are gradually doing now.
Human rights apply to all people. There can't be any exceptions. If homosexuals are under attack by Moslems and Red Ken, then I will march with homosexuals to fight back against the fascist state. I mean that I will actually get out on the street. I'll write about it later, but I will be on the street protesting.
This Thursday, Sept. 8, 2005 there will be rallies across Canada and parts of Europe in support of women's right and against the imposition of sharia in Canada. I'll be there. We have to throw sharia out of the West.
If you want to break through the barrier of inaction you can start perhaps by lending your presence to these rallies against sharia in Canada. If we lose in Canada today we will lose in Sweden tomorrow. If we can throw sharia out of Canada today maybe we can throw Red Ken out of office tomorrow ('in a nice way,' he types with jaws clenched.) It can be up to you, friend. Your boots on the pavement could make a difference.
For rally details, please turn to the link below:
http://nodhimmitude.blogspot.com
Posted by: sonofwalker at September 5, 2005 12:32 PM
Melanie Phillips has a must-read post on the subject. It seems some in the British FO--those of a Jew-hating, Arabist bent--have a curious way of fighting terror.
http://www.melaniephillips.com/diary/archives/001403.html
Posted by: scaramouoche at September 5, 2005 12:32 PM
Tony Blair is full of hot air, he's all talk and no action.
I agree with Terminator that RedKen is on the take - after all, it's a legitimate use of zakat. Either that or he has been threatened. These are age-old Islamic tactics to silence dissent and push their agenda.
IMHO Daniel Pipes is wrong: Terrorism does pay.
at September 5, 2005 1:00 PM
I've also had problems getting out of the dhimmitude site also, and not just today.
I am going to call the London contact this evening to get times etc. for the London protest against Sharia. Hope to make it. Are placards mandatory at demos? ('Cause I don't have one!)
at September 5, 2005 1:04 PM
Ah! I'll copy out everything I can and post it here. I don't have any idea what's wrong.
Posted by: sonofwalker at September 5, 2005 1:32 PM
I don't know what the problem is with the site. Sorry for any trouble i's causing. The bare details are below. I'll get back with more as I can.
Toronto: Queen's Park, Ontario Legislature, (time, 12–2 Pm)
Contact: Homa Arjomand, 416-737-9500
Ottawa: Parliament, (time, 12-2 PM)
Contact: Soheila Bayani (soheila_d@hotmail.com)
Vancouver: 800 Hornby (in front of Family Court) downtown
Contact: Zari Asli, 604-727-8986
Victoria: Parliament
Contact: Abass Mohammdadi (vicc22@hotmail.com
Montreal: devant le complex Guy Favreau Bd Rene Levesque O Montreal
Date: September 8th , time: 12 – 1 PM
organisee par L,Association des Femmes Iraniennes de Montreal
Appuyee par : La Federation des Femmes du Quebec.
Contact: Elahe Machouf, elahem@sympatico.ca
Waterloo: 100 Rittenhouse Dr. Kitchener (time, 7-9 PM)
Contact: Heidy Schmidt, heha@porchlight.ca at 518-291-5480
England: London , Canadian High Commission, 38 Grosvenor Street , ( Bond Street Tube)
Contact: Sohaila Sharifi at 447719111738,
Germany: Dusseldorf In front of Canadian Consulate
Contact: Mina Ahadi, at 4917775692413, minaAhadi@aol.com
Sweden: Stockholm, In front of Canadian Embassy,
Contact: Mahin Alipour at 0046707777313,
mahin_alipour@yahoo.se
Sweden: Gutenberg: Brunnsparken K1
Contact: Shahla Nori at 0046737262622, shahla.n@bredband.net
Holland: Canadian Embassy, Sophialaan 7, 2514 JPS-Gravenhage, ( DENHAAG)
Contact: Sorosh Ebrahimi, at 0031-(0) 61324331, soroshebi@yahoo.com
France: Canadian Embassy, 35 avenue Montaigne 75008, Paris
Contact: Michèle Vianès, at 06 10 39 94 87, michelevianes@chello.fr
www.nosharia.com
homa wpi@rogers.com
Posted by: sonofwalker at September 5, 2005 1:37 PM
Britain, it need hardly be said, is allegedly in the forefront of the fight against Islamic extremism. Now we can see that its own Foreign Office is acting as a kind of appeasement fifth column in the very heart of government. Melanie Phillips, September 5, 2005
It is extremely depressing for the British who think to know that our country is going down the dhimmitubes like this! Only sixty years ago, things were so much different. Then there was Churchill - a man, a real man, a real man with courage, real courage! A real man who could lead his people to victory.
What we have today are excuses for the male species: little men, too little ever to be considered men of stature, who are sadly in charge of running the show. From what Melanie Phillips says, and I am sure she's right (she always has her finger well on the pulse), it is even more depressing that we have some acting in the F.O. "as a kind of appeasement fifth column".
From my own experience in the Middle East, there is but ONE way to deal with Muslims: From a position of strength. The last thing one should ever do with them is show any weakness. With Muslims you tell them how things are going to be! There is absolutely no other effective way. Give a Muslim an inch, and he'll come back to take the other mile!
We are living through tough times; and tough times require tough action. Mild-mannered actions and weak decisions will only get us further entrenched into the quagmire!
Soft, weak, ineffectual politicians make soft, weak, ineffectual policies. The other side - Islam - is made of sterner stuff. There is nothing soft or weak or ineffectual about Muslims. They're out to win this war of cultures; and win they surely will if we go on appeasing them like this!
It's high time that we, the electorate, demanded some tough action at the top.
at September 5, 2005 2:30 PM
We can't blame our troubles on the government.
The time for voter passivity is over. It's past time to take individual action. One thing we can do is protest against sharia in Canada.
I've posted as much detail as I can so far, and it seems we're having trouble getting it out to the public. Hey, why let that confuse the issue? Send it out on your own to your friends that we can assemble in protest against sharia laws anywhere in the Western world.
If we make it to the streets in protest on Thursday in support of others's organized protest we can do the same ourselves later.
If we can organize ourselves to go to a demonstration, we can demonstrate on our own. And if we can do that we can form a political party of Spencerites and make some real change in this world. It's time for people to stand up and physically be counted. Take that first step and you might find yourself in a whole new world, a brave new world of breath-taking beauty.
Regarding computer problems, we get this news from above:
Have brought up your website and it is running fine using Opera 8.01 and Firefox 1.0.6 - the website does suck up a lot of horsepower hitting CPU 99% for up to 10 seconds.
A lesser computer than yours and mine could appear to hang (lock up) if the computer is marginal (400-800 MHz).
I cannot tell if it is your website or blogspot in general producing the drain.
I have seen similar events on large websites like Linux Today and have never heard of anybody diagnosing a particular problem.
***
We can't let small problems stop us. Email your friends to get them to demonstrate against fascist Islam in the West.
See you on Thursday.
at September 5, 2005 2:53 PM
Daffersd
I have believed for a long time that civil unrest will happen on a grand scale throughout the Western world, because of the muslim population. It has happened everywhere and the West is not going to be an exception.
What political leaders are doing now is to postpone the problem and hope it will go away. It will not. We will have to do tne dieing and the fighting, while the politicos are lodged safely in the country with tight security, and fat pensions provided by us.
What we are going to have in the future is not a world war but a global civil war. That is, war within nation states rather then between nations. A civil war is far worse then a "normal" war and when it is global, the mind boggles at the catastrophe in store for the future.
at September 5, 2005 4:08 PM
DP111: I concur!
Posted by: Mark at September 5, 2005 5:19 PM
"…there will be very few Muslim scholars or leaders that will ever be admitted to Britain because the vast majority of Muslims identify with the struggle of the Palestinian people".
Yes please!
Just after the 7/7 outrage there were reports that some Muslims were thinking of leaving Britain because they felt unwelcome. Has anybody heard of one actually leaving yet?
Posted by: Aardvark at September 5, 2005 6:12 PM
DP111,
Our leaders have failed us and continue to fail us.
I see it coming, it is something that we can only stop by taking on Islam now, but they won't.
Posted by: Daffersd at September 6, 2005 2:40 AM
"Just after the 7/7 outrage there were reports that some Muslims were thinking of leaving Britain because they felt unwelcome. Has anybody heard of one actually leaving yet?"
-- from a posting above
Of course not.
But of interest was the absence of any cries of "Please stay."
Rather, unstated but obvious, was another sentiment, expressed in that old line:
"Yes, but you don't go."
Posted by: Hugh at September 6, 2005 10:17 AM
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