With the Freedom House Report on incitement in mosques all across America, it is difficult to believe that the ACLU, CAIR and others can even get traction on this issue.

The word "chutzpah" comes to mind here.

Posted by: Charles Martel at September 17, 2005 9:06 AM

"...an affront to the values and principles that make America a great country..."

No, he is BATTLING affronts to the values and principles that make America a great country.

"..we expect far more from our elected officials.."

Me too, but it's a start.

"your remarks have failed us"

Not me.

Posted by: t-ham at September 17, 2005 9:10 AM

Islamic terrorism and masjids(mosques) are two faces of the same coin. If mosques are not preaching terrorism, why muslims are afraid of watch?

Posted by: iqbal at September 17, 2005 9:42 AM

The authorities shouldn't announce such things to the public, they should just go ahead and do it. Because now that the muslims know their mosques are about to be wiretapped, they will find other places where they can congregate and coordinate jihad activities.

Posted by: US_infidel at September 17, 2005 10:07 AM

The authorities do a lot of things without telling us so you don't have to worry about that. The thing is I don't understand why they would want to live here. I don't serve them in my store or give them enough respect to talk to them on the street anymore. We should send them back and stop travel between the middle east and North America forever. Then we can live in peace. Well we can they can't. They've been killing each other for thousands of years and will never stop. Thats none of our business never the less.

Posted by: orsty at September 17, 2005 10:18 AM

The first thing to do is stop all inbound Muslim immigration. So easy to do, so politically incorrect.

Posted by: John Sobieski at September 17, 2005 10:56 AM

The letter says,

"your desire to wiretap mosques is an affront to the values and principles that make America a great country"

No it isn't. Romney raises the issue in the public domain for debate and possible legislative or executive action. And there is no suggestion that executive or police action should be taken outside the limits of existing legislation.

I suppose this is supposed to be a 'philosophical point'. But, that is absurd. The reason the proposal is raised is precisely because the values and principles of our country are under attack and require defence and the attack, which includes commitments to deliver WMD to American cities, comes of Islamic groups motivated by the ideology of jihad, the glorification of martyrdom, the political objective of establishing Sharia law in Islamic lands and beyond.

Mr. Romney is not associated with an ideology, a belief system, whose adherents who blow up airliners, blow up commuter trains; Mr. Romney is not a member of a religion whose adherents have caused the United States and other countries to spend hundreds of billions of dollars to defend the lives of citizens in sporting complexes, mall, ships, or anyplace where large numbers congegrate.

No, Mr. Romney has simply raised a valid point that deserves to be heard in our democratic society for the defense of that society. But, what about Muslims and Muslims groups who do hold a belief system, an ideology in common with others who threaten the lives of Americans, who have cost American taxpayers billions. Do American Muslims and Muslim groups denounce all aspects of the ideology that motivates and justifies the violence against the United States? What about the objectives of Sharia law, the religious obligation to wage jihad against those who attack or oppose Islam and the related obligation of da'wa, the objective of establishing Sharia law in Muslim lands, and inevitably in all lands, lands that belong to Allah, lands whose law must accord with the law of Allah, lands whose only legitimate political system must accord with that law.

What about these beliefs, these principles, these values that motivate Islamic groups and individuals to attack the United States in countless ways, in the courts, with lawsuits and threats of lawsuits to silence criticism and freedom of speech, including obvious threats of violence that inevitably succeed in weakening America, either through indiscriminate murder, loss of life and destruction or by billions of tax money wasted on trying to detect and stop murderers before they strike.

No, Mr. Romney is not a concern to our values, our principles, our society, our political system. But, others cannot say the same.

Posted by: JTF at September 17, 2005 12:14 PM

He will forgive this very soon, american politics are very similar to european, very coward.

Posted by: Franze at September 17, 2005 2:21 PM

A MESSAGE TO THE ACLU:

So, you guys truly believe that you are protecting America by condemning Romney for the suggestion he made to wiretap mosques?

Now, I am sure you good folks will remember that our national constitution states that "all men are created equal" and have the "right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." Right?

And, now the so-called 'religion' of Islam arrives in America. I ask you, have any of you actually READ Islam's "Glorious Koran?" Even parts of it??
(I don't see how you guys could have).

How could you not know that the Qur'an, Islam's sourcebook states-- and I quote-- "and when the sacred months have passed, slay the infidels everywhere they are found, besiege them, prepare for them every stratagem of warfare, tax them upon their conversion." The passage means exactly what it says right here. And they have been acting on it for 13 centuries. Where have you been???

What this passage states is that Muslims are free to MASSACRE non-muslims at will--YOU MORONS!!!!!! You are helping them to endanger the physical safety of our countrymen.

Don't you think that putting this Koranic command into practice is a topic of discussion at US mosques? No? Well that's funny...they discuss it at mosques everywhere else around the world. You didn't know that? That's no excuse.

Thanks to you they are being given a free pass to do this on our territory. What do you think of that??????????? I already know what you think of me.

This Koranic passage I quoted negates the entire US Constitution! Everything you claim you are defending-

And even worse, it is a criminal offense by our nation's legal codes. This Koranic passage constitutes CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT MULTIPLE HOMICIDES!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It is DISCRIMINATORY FOR THE ACLU TO protect the Islamic faith and ask special treatment for it. YOU ARE GIVING Muslims the right to commit murder on US soil and at everyone else's expense.

The second half of that Koranic passage, the part about "tax them if they convert" THAT refers to enslavement of non-Muslims by means of assigning them a second-class citizenship and taxing them without representation.

That is unconstitutional as well.

Either the UCLA is (woefully)ignorant of Islamic ideology and the US constitution or else it is a treasonous organization and should be prosecuted. Neither is anything to be proud of.

Posted by: pythagoras at September 17, 2005 2:28 PM

The French have ALL Mosques under surveillance. Since these are the places where you are most likely to find incitement, terrorism, sedition and treason being preached.As Gov Romney said it makes no sense to monitor the local 4H Club when we know exactly where most of the terrorism recruitment and incitement occurs.

Gov Romney appeared on O'Reilly and said he would make no apologies for loving America and wanting to protect American citizens.O'Reilly said many agree with Gov Romney about the Mosques it's just that Romney has been the first person to say these things publically.I wonder how long it will be before people notice how much it costs to allow Muslims to roam freely in Western societies. The increased costs in security that are not associated with any other group.

Posted by: Roxane at September 17, 2005 5:23 PM

One of the defining features of the fascist mind is the hatred of post-feudal life. The nostalgic longing for the ideal rural Romance is still alive and well among the anarchists, the Greens, the Communists, the Nazis, the Trotskyites, the lot of them of all Counter-Enlightenment persuasions. Industrial development, indeed, personal industry is hated. Today's neo-feudalists all long for the Golden Age of utopian pre-capitalist collectivism, determinism, and blame. Nothing has changed in the past 104 years since McKinley was shot at Buffalo, N.Y.:

[District attorney PenneyThomas:] I am convinced, if I never was before, that there is such a thing as a national heart, and that that great national heart is broken and it will take God's own time and God's own way to heal it, such a great calamity has been brought about.

Brought by what? By this instrument [[pointing to the defendant] Leon Czolgosz, who assassinated President William McKinley,] of an awful class of people who have come to our shores, a class of people that must be taught, that should be taught and shall be taught that it is entirely foreign to our laws, to our institutions and to the laws and institutions that evolved such a man as William McKinley that they have no place upon our shores, that if they cannot conform to our laws and our institutions, they they must go hence and keep forever from us; that they will not be permitted to come here, to stay here to educate themselves into the notion that they can take the life of any individual irrespective of consequences.
Eric Rauchway, Murdering McKinley. New York: Hill and Wang. 2003. p.50.

And the arguments are hardly different today from those of the defence of Czolgosz, that he was a product of his environment, poverty, mis-education, disrespect for his personal worth, & c. Staggering.

Posted by: sonofwalker at September 17, 2005 6:44 PM

Excuse my typos, please: Thomas Penney, D.A.

Posted by: sonofwalker at September 17, 2005 6:49 PM

Gov. Romney may backtrack, if all he gets is critical emails from muslims and their symapthisers.

Now is the time to send him supportive emails, appreciating his candour and courage at a time when the nation, or for that matter Western civilisation, is in peril.

Also write to the Globe, asking them why is it so unreasonable to monitor mosques, when even Turkey and other half-sensible muslim nations do so. Ask them to explain their position, and what their response is going to be when yet another mosque imam is jailed for taking part in the jihad.

Write anon deliberately to the Globe, and explain in a sad tone, that even in the USA, it is not judicious to criticise any aspect of islam publicly, as freedom of expression without fear, has been destroyed.

Posted by: DP111 at September 17, 2005 7:02 PM

DP111:

You make a good point. France has yet to have suffered a major terrorist incident, yet it has taken action against Muslim clerics inciting hatred and imposed education standards on them as well. And how would the French authorities know which ones are trouble-makers? By monitoring what goes on in the mosques, I'd have to guess.

Posted by: waterdragon52 at September 17, 2005 9:09 PM

Romney for Prez in 2008!

Tancredo for VP!

Posted by: Cornelius at September 18, 2005 12:03 AM

Romney has refused to back down. His aide Eric Fehrnstrom has again made this clear. He has no intention of apologizing to local Muslims, for his is a security matter. He might add, or his aide might add, that some Muslim countries monitor their own mosques. And so does France, and Italy. Mosques are kept under surveillance from the outside in Great Britian and Germany, and possibly elsewhere as well. Clearly there is a problem.

If The Boston Globe wishes to insist that this proposal is irrational or unacceptable then its dwindling audience will dwindle further. Good.

Posted by: Hugh at September 18, 2005 12:14 AM

Tancredo made the "nuke Mecca" comments a while ago,and CAIR was prompt in putting the pressure on him and demanding retractions and appologies...
Tancredo,however never budged.
Romney made now the very brave and logical recommendation about monitoring the mosques and he now is jpressured by the barking mad dogs at CAIR and ACLU.
So far he didn`t fold.
Let`s show these two brave men our support and admiration!!!
I would give my vote to a Tancredo/Romney ticket in 08.

Posted by: adela at September 18, 2005 12:51 AM

bravo Mr spencer......that means the word is getting out. am a medical student in in san diego, and I do my own part of getting the message out by leaving the jihad watch web page on the desktop each time I use the library computer.....the other day, I decided to sit around and watch some one use that computer.....amazingly, this girl from my class....got on the computer and started looking at the website....the greatest part of the story is that she spent almost an an hour and half looking at the page and I could notice the concern she had on her face when she left the library......u might never know how much u have exposed us and others to this threat, but this is the least I can do as a way of getting out the message considering my time constraint....to every other person that posts here.......do not fret......this is America, and we always win.......good thing with the direction the supreme court id headed, at least I expect that John Roberts wants his two kids to grow up in an unislamic america.....
keep up the good work....

Posted by: jihadbuster at September 18, 2005 1:40 AM

bravo Mr spencer......that means the word is getting out. am a medical student in in san diego, and I do my own part of getting the message out by leaving the jihad watch web page on the desktop each time I use the library computer.....the other day, I decided to sit around and watch some one use that computer.....amazingly, this girl from my class....got on the computer and started looking at the website....the greatest part of the story is that she spent almost an an hour and half looking at the page and I could notice the concern she had on her face when she left the library......u might never know how much u have exposed us and others to this threat, but this is the least I can do as a way of getting out the message considering my time constraint....to every other person that posts here.......do not fret......this is America, and we always win.......good thing with the direction the supreme court id headed, at least I expect that John Roberts wants his two kids to grow up in an unislamic america.....
keep up the good work....

Posted by: jihadbuster at September 18, 2005 1:40 AM

The ACLU was started to protect & preserve the civil rights of the Citizens of the USA and protect our freedoms, guaranteed by the bill of rights. It is not there to cater to a minority that has crept into this country by dubious means and now wants to take over.
This Muslim minority continue to afflict the Non-muslim populace of the USA. The Muslims at every opportunity have extracted by fair or foul means what "they want" and the non-muslims over the past few years have (reconcilied) given in to this unendurably, arrogant, evil & hostile community.
Eventually it will be too late for decisive action, short of deporting all Muslims from the USA.
It is hard to imagine that when the US government and concerned citizens begin to respond to Islamic terror, that one of the most difficult battles to overcome is the legal landmines laid by organizations like CAIR and the liberals like the ACLU on behalf of the Islamists.
The left-wing supports the muslims because they share their anti-Americanism.
The extreme, ultra right-wing is allied with the muslims because of their anti-Semitism.
Therefore all decent Americans should wake up to this peril within our midst in the 21st century and act cohesively to defeat their evil plans.

Posted by: faqi at September 18, 2005 2:37 AM

As a California resident, with the understanding that Governor Romney has national political aspirations, I sent him a nice positive email in support of his suggestion.

But mine is only one.

Posted by: PRCS at September 18, 2005 8:18 AM

faqi:

Yesterday, I watched the world premiere of Scorcese's movie about Bob Dylan's early years as a performer (1961 - 1965), and there was a lot of archival footage dealing with the black civil rights struggle of the days. (Such memories it evoked for me as I was a Canadian gradeschool girl back then.)

The issues of those days bear absolutely no relation or resemblence to the causes the ACLU espouses today. I guess, in the ACLU's minds -- with the elimination of racial segregation and the emergence of a black middle and upper class -- they needed another reason for being -- a very poor one as it turns out.

Posted by: waterdragon52 at September 18, 2005 11:56 AM

"keep up the good work....

Posted by: jihadbuster"

It sounds like it is you who are keeping up the good work. That leaving-the-computer on at www.jihadwatch.org is a good idea; leaving a little note with a list of websites here and there and everywhere also helps.

It is remarkable that one has to behave in some ways like members of a Resistance organziation during the Nazi occupation. Le reseau Gallia, le reseau Lutece, le reseau.... Well, here we are - having to almost under-the-radar spread the message, tell others about the websites, tell others about the books -- Spencer or Bat Ye'or or Ibn Warraq or Andrew Bostom -- that will help to enlighten them.

Amazing, when you think about it? And what does that tell you about the state of the Western world, and the quality of its ruling classes, today?

Pass it on. Quietly.

Mum's the word.

Posted by: Hugh at September 18, 2005 6:08 PM

News Releases
Friday, September 16, 2005
CAIR Critical of Gov’s Call to Wiretap Mosques

CAIR Critical of Gov’s Call to Wiretap Mosques

David A. Fahrenthold, Washington Post, 9/16/05
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/09/15/AR2005091502090.html

BOSTON, Sept. 15 -- Civil liberties and Muslim groups criticized Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney on Thursday for suggesting that authorities should spend more time monitoring mosques and their attendees, possibly with wiretaps.

The comments came during a speech on domestic preparedness that Romney (R) gave Wednesday at the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank in Washington.

Romney, said to be considering a run for president in 2008, used the speech to offer suggestions for beefing up domestic intelligence-gathering, saying that too much effort is spent protecting buildings and too little on surveillance that might detect an attack in the planning stages.

After asking whether students from "terrorist-sponsored countries" should be tracked more closely in the United States, Romney asked: "How about people who are in settings -- mosques, for instance -- that may be teaching doctrines of hate and terror?

"Are we monitoring that?" Romney continued, according to a video posted on the foundation's Web site. "Are we wiretapping? Are we following what's going on? Are we seeing who's coming in, who's coming out?"

In a telephone interview Thursday, Romney said he was not calling for a loosening of the rules governing when and how the government can conduct surveillance. But he defended his focus on mosques as potential surveillance targets, saying that attacks by Islamic terrorists in the United States, London and elsewhere justify a particular focus on Muslim places of worship.

Authorities "should be watching what's being taught in a mosque more closely than what's being taught at the local 4-H Club," Romney said.

After Romney's speech was reported on the front page of Thursday's Boston Globe, groups in Boston and Washington expressed alarm, seeing in his speech a call for blanket surveillance of mosques and Muslims.

"It's irresponsible for the top elected official in any state to suggest blanket wiretapping of houses of worship," said Ibrahim Hooper, spokesman for the Washington-based Council on American-Islamic Relations. (MORE)

********Well, Doogie, that all depends on whether or not the worshipping being done is to a belief that preaches the death and destruction of Westerners, fool.************

Posted by: DCWatson at September 19, 2005 9:53 AM