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Islam is a room with no exit door. But at least she is not being tried as an apostate, an offense which in traditional Sharia law carries a death penalty. "Appeal to delete ‘Islam’ from IC rejected," from The Star, with thanks to Sparta:
PUTRAJAYA: The Court of Appeal dismissed an appeal by a woman who filed an originating summons to delete the word “Islam” from her identity card and claimed she is free to practise the religion of her choice.The majority decision was read by Justice Datuk Gopal Sri Ram who sat with Datuk Abdul Aziz Mohamad and Datuk Arifin Zakaria.
Justice Abdul Aziz and Justice Arifin ruled that the Director-General of the National Registration Department (NRD) was right in not allowing the application brought by Lina Joy, whose original name was Azlina Jailani.
She wanted to delete the word “Islam” from her identity card on the grounds that the syariah court and other Islamic religious authorities did not confirm her renunciation of Islam.
“The NRD acted perfectly, prudently and rationally in a matter of such sensitivity and importance,” said Justice Abdul Aziz....
Justice Datuk Faiza Thambi Chik had held that as Lina was a Malay, she could not renounce Islam.
In his judgment on April 23, 2001, he also refused to decide on Lina’s wish to renounce Islam on the grounds that the issue should be decided by the syariah court....
On Feb 2, 1997, Lina applied to the NRD to change her name on the grounds that she no longer professed Islam and had accepted the Christian faith.
The application was rejected by the NRD on Aug 11, 1997.
Posted by Robert at September 20, 2005 6:53 AM
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Ah the kings of tolerance and a model moderate country and a beacon to the islamic world.
Do they not say they beleive in religous freedom.
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at September 20, 2005 7:32 AM
> ...as Lina was a Malay, she could not renounce Islam.
Oh, the never-ending absurdity - it would be hilarious were it not so tragic. Almost as funny as the 'athletes in chador' story from Iran.
at September 20, 2005 7:39 AM
Lina Joy. She us a brave woman indeed to leave islam in a muslim country.
at September 20, 2005 7:53 AM
But what many people are not aware of is that Elfie has all along been harassing and intimidating these apostates, many of whom have fled overseas to escape the wrath of the Malaysian religious authorities with whom he has apparently been liaising with.
He does this under the pseudonym of ‘Menj’ which is the abbreviation of his name. One Malaysian apostate, at the website mentioned by Shairul Fazleena, complained that Elfie, through cunning and deception, had somehow managed to get her to reveal her true identity.
http://www.malaysiakini.com/letters/32250
at September 20, 2005 8:02 AM
"Islam is a room with no exit door."
-- from the comment above
Just like a lobster-trap, the kind where the hapless lobster enters the "parlor" (as we say here in Prince Edward Island) and if, he after a little rest on the non-existent couch, tries to make his way out the door, finds that it has been locked behind him.
Entry into Islam is made as easy as a poisoned pie. You don't have to study Islam. You don't have to read, you don't even have to know about, every part of the Qur'an. You may not even have heard about the Hadith or the Sira. You may be hazy on Muhammad -- and you are unlikely to hear, in advance, of Asma bint Marwan, the Khaybar Oasis, little Aisha, the killing of the prisoners of the Banu Qurayza, or a good many other significant -- and of course still resonating -- events.
Other religions require some, or even more than some, study. Not Islam. All you must do is recite the Shehada, the single line that is a profession of faith.
And they you are in -- like Flynn.
But then you can't get out. Not without risking ostracism, or even, as everyone from the Kuwaiti Mr. Qambar in Kuwait, to the Christian converts whose cases did not become causes celebres, and who are killed or persecuted in Pakistan, Indonesia, Iran, the Sudan, Saudi Arabia, even "friendly" Egypt, have all learned -- a possible sentence, carried out often by vigilantes, of death. That's what the Shari'a calls for, and why should the Shari'a be ignored?
Come into my parlor. Spider. Fly. You know.
Posted by: Hugh at September 20, 2005 10:28 AM
'...as a Malay'?
What does her nation of origin have to do with being muslim? That's like saying all Americans are automatically Protestant. That all Russians are automatically communist, and the like.
Can those who oppose sites like this, honestly condone thinking like that of Justice Datuk Faiza Thambi Chik?
Posted by: Gary at September 20, 2005 10:41 AM
Gary, Malay is an ethnic community residing in Malay archipelago (Malaysia,Sungapore and Indonesia). Almost all of them are Muslims save a few Hindus from Bali and Christians from Timor. They used to b Hindus/Buddhists until Indian Muslims "reverted" them. In Malaysia a person of Malay or even half-Malay parentage is considered a Muslim.
Posted by: Vikrant_Camberleykar at September 20, 2005 11:12 AM
Give me Liberty or give me death!
Posted by: William The Crusader at September 20, 2005 8:17 PM
Another discrimination made by muslims, it´s so normal!
Posted by: Franze at September 21, 2005 1:11 PM
I'm sick of this disgusting death cult.
Posted by: US_infidel at September 21, 2005 2:44 PM
Wherever this death cult raises its ugly head there is trouble. Right now, Southern Thailand is being plagued by Islamic extremists - in a country which is known for its peaceful Buddhist religion, the Southern enclave is being torn apart by bombs and ethnic cleansing of the Buddhist minority. One village has 26 Buddhist rubber tappers who have to be escorted to work everyday by the army in case they are attacked by Muslims. A week ago, a busful of Buddhist monks were bombed. That's how sick and depraved these people are.
Posted by: londongirl at September 21, 2005 6:47 PM
I have been lurking here for a while and I am quite glad that there are sites like this that try to provide a one stop depository of news and information regarding religious persecution. I must however caution against falling into the same trap of the fanatical elements whom this site seeks to create awareness about.
It would not be too difficult to be objective and not fan racial & religious stereotypes while still highlighting abuses done in the name of faith. To do otherwise would be akin to a pot callinig a kettle black.
Just let me add my 2 cents to some of the comments made here :
".. an offense which in traditional Sharia law carries a death penalty"
This is not necessarily true. Granted that the most popular interpretation of Syariah forbids conversion out of Islam but this interpretation is not accepted universally. There are still places where one can legally convert out of Islam, although societal pressures may be tough. Even in Malaysia, strictly speaking, there is no restriction against converting out of Islam but there are lots of obstacles one has to overcome, both institutional and societal.
In fact, there is an unwritten consensus that if you leave Islam but remain relatively quiet about it, you will be ok.
My perspective of the Lina Joy case is this, I believe the court made this decision to avoid having to overturn an existing precedent whereby the civil courts can decide on a Muslim person's faith.
This is a tricky legal issue in Malaysia. Constitutionally, to be considered a Malay, one has to practice the Muslim faith, the Malay culture and speak the Malay language as a mother tongue. This is clearly within the jurisdiction of the civil courts. Nonetheless, conversion out of Islam is, at least based on past judicial precedent, within the jurisdiction of the Syariah courts.
Lina Joy attempted to invoke the provisions for the freedom of religion within the Constitution and convince the civil court to make a decision. Unfortunately, as we know now, it failed. One will have to wait and see if the civil courts will dare take up the challenge to put this provision of the Constitution under their jurisdiction again, as it was in the past.
Vikrant said in his comment :
"Malay is an ethnic community residing in Malay archipelago (Malaysia,Sungapore and Indonesia). Almost all of them are Muslims save a few Hindus from Bali and Christians from Timor. They used to b Hindus/Buddhists until Indian Muslims "reverted" them. In Malaysia a person of Malay or even half-Malay parentage is considered a Muslim."
Not exactly. Filipinos are also considered Malay by ethnicity and a large majority of them are Christians. There are also large Christian minorities in Indonesia from the Malay races, ie. Bataks of Sumatra, the Celebes islanders from Sulawesi, quite a few Javanese, et al. Don't forget, up to 9% of Indonesians are Christians and a majority of these are from the Malay races.
As I mentioned above, there are certain criterias to be considered Malay. So, if one practices the Malay culture and speaks the Malay language but don't practice Islam, either by choice or by birth, legally speaking the person is not considered a Malay, even if he or she may be of that ethnicity. So it is not a case of being Muslim because one is a Malay but the other way around.
Even then, there are tens of thousands of Christians in Malaysia from the Malay ethnicity (I think the Assemblies of God, Malaysia did a survey about a decade back) and many of them practice the Christian faith legally.
I hope I have not been too wordy but I honestly believe that unless we are able to keep to the facts and contextualise the various reports, we would be equally guilty of the sensationalism that we sometimes accuse others of and dilute the integrity of our message.
at September 23, 2005 6:02 AM
When a Bumiputra is
no longer a Bumiputra
(Editor: Contribution of a discussion on racial assimiliation in Malaysia just received.)
Did it ever occur to anyone that a bumiputra in Malaysia can actually lose his or her preferential status?
There are many cases in existence, increasing as the years wear on. The fault lies with the overzealous bureaucrats, mostly the Malay and Muslim ones.
When a Non-Muslim female bumiputra (Kadazan, Iban, Dayak etc)marries a non-Malay. As an example an ‘Orang Asli’ lady marrying a Chinese man. The offspring is normally declared a Chinese as is the norm, following the race of
the husband. The poor child loses his/her status as a bumiputra.
There are many such instances especially in the Malaysian Armed forces. Indian and Chinese soldiers marrying Iban and Kadazan ladies experience the same dilemma.
The Muslims do not experience this. A Malay lady marrying any race, of course a non-bumiputra, automatically the offspring is declared a Malay , thus the child becomes a bumiputra.
Whereas the Non-Muslim and the Bumiputra can't have their children declared as Bumiputras. This happens even if a request is made to have them declared as a Kadazan or a Iban, this request is normally rejected.
Why the double standards ? The National Registration Department is primarily responsible for perpetuating this gross injustice and selective racism.
Can't a child of mixed parentage be declared a Bumiputra, on the basis of the Bumiputra parent or should they convert to Islam to be declared Bumiputra.
Better yet, will the PM unfurl the ‘nationalistic flag’ and declare these children of mixed parentage, as ‘kaum pendatang’ and will he then decide the Christian Kadazans and Ibans of Sabah and Sarawak are no longer Bumiputra.
Hidup Malaysia ...indeed !
Eric Mudasi
Dec 2, 2002
http://www.littlespeck.com/letters/2002.html#bumi
at September 23, 2005 7:32 AM
8/4/2004: Malaysian PM Weeps for Christians
A weeping Malaysian Prime Minister told the World Council of Churches yesterday that Muslims worldwide are deeply afraid Christians are waging a war against Islam.
Muslims worldwide fear Christians are waging a “war against Islam,” Malaysia’s leader said yesterday, blaming the campaign against terror on increased tensions between the religions.
In an emotional speech to the World Council of Churches, Prime Minister Abdullah Ahmad Badawi said the events that followed the September 11, 2001 attacks in America, including the US-led invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan, “have all taken religious undertones”. [And what about the religious OVERTONES of September 11?—ed.]
http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=11995
Posted by: leavingtheleft at September 23, 2005 7:47 AM
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