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Jihad Watch Board Vice President Hugh Fitzgerald explains why we may end up losing the struggle against the global jihad:
There is nothing inevitable about the defeat of the worldwide Jihad. In fact, if one looks at the emptying out of non-Muslim populations within the last half-century or century, one finds that the non-Muslim population of North Africa, the Middle East, Turkey, and Iran, consisting of Christians and Jews, has gone steadily down. And the non-Muslim population of Pakistan and Bangladesh, consisting mainly of Hindus (and some Sikhs and Christians) has gone steadily down. And the non-Muslim population in Malaysia and Indonesia has gone steadily down. In every case, forced expulsion, steady persecution, mass murder, and even genocide, as in Turkey, has helped to explain such a change.Meanwhile, everywhere in the Lands of the Infidels, millions of Muslims have been allowed to settle. And in India and Lebanon, where they have long been present as a minority, they have been steadily outbreeding the non-Muslims. The percentage of Muslims in the population has steadily, almost it seems inexorably, risen.
If demography is destiny, and if nothing is done to halt Muslim in-migration, and Muslim overbreeding that astounds -- in France the non-Muslims increase by .5% a year, while Muslims increase by 5% per year -- 10 times the rate. In Italy (with a negative birth-rate), in Spain, in England, in Germany, the same kind of results. Anyone can do the simple calculation. It can already be seen that Western politicians, having no sense of their own civilizations or what needs to be retained at all costs, more and more willingly appease Muslim voters. A few years ago a prominent leader of the Socialist Party sent out word to his underlings that they should forget entirely about "the Jews" and Israel, and concentrate entirely on winning the Muslim vote, which can only be won by adopting Muslim demands in foreign policy and meeting Muslim demands for changes in the laws, customs, and manners to be observed within the Infidel land in which they happen to have settled. Much the same kind of cravenness by politicians can be observed in Great Britain, where in local elections, and not only in London with Ken Livingstone, the politicians vie in their desire to appease and please Muslim voters. Those who would like to register their fear and dismay, and their desire to make their country less welcoming to Muslims who do not wish the resident Infidels well, have only the beyond-the-pale (as many of them see it) BNP in England or Le Pen in France. Thus they are without an articulate, respectable figure to lead, to warn, to instruct, and to help rescue those who did nothing to deserve this except to be insufficiently attentive -- for they trusted their own leaders -- to the immutable nature, and menace, of Islam and its adherents, both those who are clearly "immoderate" and those who claim, and for the moment may be, that slippery thing, a "moderate" Muslim.When Rice prates about how Iraq reminds her of Germany and France after the war -- anyone can in a moment think of three or four major ways in which this analogy crumbles into dust -- or stoutly insists that we will "not falter or fail" and lets alliteration do her thinking for her, when Bush prates about "staying the course" and not "cutting and running," and his fan club, among so-called "Conservatives," shrieks with delight, one begins to despair. And among those who should by this time know better, there is still this willingness to utter inanities and illogical remarks about "democracy" in Iraq, without any argument as to why this "democracy" in Iraq could conceivably lead to a better situation for Infidels, when the best thing that could happen as far as Infidels are concerned is the break-up of Iraq and permanent war, cold or hot, between Shi'a and Sunni along the fault line that now runs through Iraq, as well as the creation of a non-Arab Muslim state, Kurdistan, that might inspire other non-Arab Muslims and cause all of them to focus a bit more clearly on Arab supremacist ideology within Islam.
Last week at the Union League in New York, The New Criterion sponsored a small meeting to discuss the islamization of Europe. As it happened, quite by chance, the person who knows most about this subject in the world, Bat Ye'or, was in the vicinity and, at the last minute, took part. But it was clear from reports that there was a widespread inability, in those who attended and of whom more might be expected, to understand the time-frame in which events in Europe are taking place, and how late things are for the Americans (and the Europeans) to come to their senses. Like our rulers, when they go to Europe they live in certain hotels, meet certain people, and are cushioned by their own ignorance of languages (so that, for example, even reading "Le Monde" or "Le Figaro" or the "Corriere della Sera" or "El Pais" is impossible, and information arrives filtered through the English-language press, or television). Thus they are less alarmed than they should be by the islamization of Europe, and continue to believe that Bush and company must know what they are doing in Iraq, and that despite its seeming illogicality, surely something wonderful or at least hopeful will come of it. No it won't. The most hopeful thing that could possibly come of it is not a stable, well-functioning nation-state, its army thoroughly trained to Western standards by American officers (and no doubt that newly-trained "Iraqi" army will be happy to share all its new expertise with armies of other Muslim states -- just what we need, better Muslim armies, with better logistics, equipment, and morale).
Once the regime was overturned, once Saddam himself was captured and his sons and associates killed or captured, and the country scoured for major weapons, and weapons projects permanently disrupted, and weapons depots blown up where appropriate, the war was won. The Sunnis had been deposed; the Shi'a were now tasting power and would not ever again relinquish it. At that point it was time to leave. It has been time to leave for at least a year. The longer we stay, the more expertly we train Muslim Arabs, whether Shi'a or Sunni, the more men and money we so obviously squander, the more morale in the army will go down -- not among all the troops, but the more thoughtful of them, the ones least inclined to parrot the line from above. The more we stay, the fewer civilians will enlist in the Reserves and the National Guard, and standards for enlistment will go down – and have already. The longer we stay, the more people will heed the siren-song of those who think there is nothing about Islam to worry about and that we should leave Iraq, but for all the wrong reasons, and that we certainly should not exploit the natural fissures within Islam -- because there is nothing wrong with Islam (when everything is wrong with Islam).
And so, while our attention and money and men and materiel and morale are monomaniacally focused on, and squandered in, Iraq, the very years in which Western Europe could still be saved, the years in which other, better leaders could help its people come to their senses about Islam, and could be supported in this by a muscular United States with all of its resources, time is wasted, and much else is wasted as well. The inertia in Iraq, the stubborn refusal to comprehend the irrelevance of this pseudo-"democracy" to the more important task of constaining, containing, dividing, and demoralizing the forces of Islam, maddens. Clocks tick, and eventually, demography becomes destiny.
Posted by Robert at October 24, 2005 12:03 PM
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Malaysia without the Chinese is a basket case. The Arab countries without oil revenue are all like Yemen, poor and helpless. If...IF...we can ever get rid of oil dependency, the Moslem world is screwed.
And...numbers are not destiny. There are a lot of Chinese but they will never rule the world (too isolated; too many internal contradictions; bad demographics).
Victory is not foregone, but it is likely. Especially, as the Moslems continue to reveal their true nature, ignoring it will be harder and harder. Eventually, even Europe might move toward some sort of explusion. In the Netherlands, what other goal are they going towards? (as an example).
My prediction: Eventually, Iran will lob a nuclear-tipped missle at Israel. Hit or miss, Israel will destroy Iran and precipitate some sort of end game.
Posted by: Seymour Paine![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/nav-commenters.gif)
at October 24, 2005 12:57 PM
Perhaps the smartest commentary on the strategy Islam should follow to world conquest was Hugh Fitzgerald's observation that they should back off of the Jihad war and simply wait to breed themselves into Worldwide Sharia.
I think that's true, given Islam's insidious alignment with the Marxist impulses that rule the West.
Moslem victory over the East (India, China, Japan, Korea, Vietnam, etc.) is less certain now than swallowing up the West, which is pretty much fait accompli, at least insofar as the demographic table is now set in the Western Hemisphere.
However, Moslems are their own worst enemy. Indeed, Moslems are everybody's worst enemy, cuz that's what these "people" do.
But I caution that all predictions must incorporate the event of the Big One, such as the Shiite nuke missile striking Israel, or the Wahhabi seeding of America with weaponized smallpox virions.
After that happens, and it will, forced return of Moslems back to the sand boxes from which they sprang is feasible.
We must begin laying the intellectual groundwork now for Moslem Expulsion then.
Not a pretty picture, but it's the brightest future we can look to, thank to the Moslems themsevles.
Posted by: Shaughn at October 24, 2005 1:13 PM
Hi... I'm in Mumbai for the first time in abt 4 years.. I'm at Haji Ali... FULL STOP. Anyways as for Hugh, you're right we're losing this war and theres no way we can prevent that from happening. Years on when entire world has been converted into Dar-ul-Islam... few remaining kafir historians would look back and see how Mr.Spencer and Mr.Fitzgerald were right.... and how foolish was the world was to remain oblivious to comming destruction... We're sleepwalking towards a global civil war. India is going to be hardest hit... 150 million Muslims coupled with 800 million cowards... i envision rivers of blood here. In last 10 days 3 North Indian towns have been gripped by Muslim rioting... lastest one being Agra where a Hindu shopkeeper was lynched for daring to stop a female Muslim shoflifter as usual Hindu businesses get hit... curfew is imposed. Funnily the report from Times of (Islamic) India (print edition) reads as:
Communal violence griped Agra when members of members of one community stoned businesses of members of other community... gah ... you'd be left wondering whether Hindus were fighting Buddhists.
at October 24, 2005 1:40 PM
Egads, Vikrant, they're more politically correct than the BBC. Why are Robert Spencer, Bat Ye'or, Ali Sina, and Andrew Bostom being ignored by this Administration? Ignorance, intentional blocking by those surrounding and advising the 'elite' of the Administration, fear of violating the canons of multiculturalism? Washington, we have a problem. Something is seriously wrong.
Hugh, why don't you recommend some tactics to remove the scales from our Senators' and Representatives' eyes. Would sending them select books be effective? I was thinking of sending The Legacy of Jihad to my Senators. Would you consider that ineffective? I'm going to do Legacy or some other book with them anyway with a nice cover letter. It's about $25 a pop per Senator and a little of my time. I am also going to get a lot more involved in my local Republican party and make sure there is some voice about Islam's danger at the local level.
at October 24, 2005 2:02 PM
The highly-touted (and inflated) number of Muslims took big hits in the tsunami and two earthquakes (Bam, Pakistan). Is it down to a billion, or has the exponential reproduction kept up?
Posted by: Beagle at October 24, 2005 2:35 PM
"i envision rivers of blood here."
-- posted by Vikrant_Camberleykar
It's the Moghuls all over again (75 million Hindus dead). Not that the Jihad war has ever really stopped in the subcontinent. At least Europe had some respite.
Posted by: Shaughn at October 24, 2005 2:53 PM
"Hugh, why don't you recommend some tactics to remove the scales from our Senators' and Representatives' eyes. Would sending them select books be effective?"
-- posted by Sobieski
Nobody reads books, especially reporters and politicians, who are too busy golfing and presenting awards to one another.
The only way to break the logjam is through advertising directly to the people. If the people rise up and threaten to cashier politicians unless they quit pursuing mass suicide, nothing good will ever happen.
Just my prediction, but as I said this ain't a nation of grad students. So let's drop the seminar agenda and get commercial here.
Posted by: Shaughn at October 24, 2005 3:00 PM
"Nobody reads books..."
-- from a posting above
Not true. Many of those posting at this website have learned a great deal about Islam from books. The less willing-to-belief-the-absurd members of MESA Nostra, members only because it is the only organization for professional advancment and mutual backscratching open to them, may well find their heads whirling from what the great scholars of Islam, collected in "The Legacy of Jihad," have to tell them -- quite a different tone, and a different level of scholarship altogether, from the coffee-table pap of lean, mean, jogging John Esposito.
Aides to Congressmen read. Captains and Majors and Colonels read, with less frequency probably as they rise to the top. But some do read, or read around in, books.
Douglas Feith may now find the time to read books as he did not during the last four years. Richard Perle may read. Even Donald Rumsfeld, one suspects, now and again reads. Does Rice, does Bush? Probably not. Too busy with position papers and briefing papers, and summaries of China's view of North Korea in two, or perhaps three, pages.
But others do. Some of them will rise high. Help educate them now.
Posted by: Hugh at October 24, 2005 3:16 PM
The wives and sex-slaves of Eurabian muslim men would not continue to produce litters of 12 or 13 if the infidel hosts were no longer willing to feed, clothe, and house them, not to mention the welfare payments, the "unemployable" payments, and other forms of entitlement. Ending the Eurabian welfare state will make Europe less attractive to those who are determined to undermine and conquer it.
Posted by: Infidel33 at October 24, 2005 3:20 PM
My view, long held, is that we need to have a separation from the islamic world. As a start one needs to take them at their own words and agree wholeheartedly that there is indeed a dar ul islam and a dar ul harb, and for the good of humanity, infidels and muslims alike, it is better to live apart in respective dars.
It is a sad fact that muslim presence anywhere leads to discomfort of other already established communities. Soon the established community will leave or forced out by Jihad by mob violence, and yet another region becomes dar ul islam.
Muslim nations, left to their own devices, unable to export their excess population, an ever deteriorating infrastructure, increasing poverty and diminishing military power, will have no alternative but to reform islam. And even if they do not, they will not be a menace to the safety and security of the rest of the world, for the simple reason that they will not have access to harvest infidel lives.
Harsh as this is, it is the most humane way to progress. What frightens me is that we are moving towards a new world war that is quite unlike previous world wars. This world war will be a civil war ie a global civil war - the very worst type imaginable. Else we are looking forward to a Three Conjecture scenario leading to deaths on an unprecedented scale.
Separation leaves hope for the future for everybody. Islam will collapse quite quickly in historic terms if it is unable to expand (that is after all its main reason), and thus release the 1 billion souls in its enslavement.
Politically impossible at the moment? - Yes. Yet precedents are there in recent history, where exchanges of populations were considered the only way to secure a reasonably peaceful outcome.
at October 24, 2005 3:41 PM
Islam, like materialistic positivism, is a lie of the Old Deluder, and will one day fall on the ash-heap of history. The conflict now looming between Islam and the post-Christian West tells me that God is both just and has a sense of humor. The West made it clear it would not have Christ ruling over it; sat back to proudly savor its secular triumph, and now must wake up to find a swarm of Islamic fire ants crawling up its pants legs.
Now that I've heard erstwhile radical feminists say that perhaps we'll have to curtail our liberties to accommodate Islam, I'm sure Western Europe and North America will one day raise their collective hinies five times daily at the azzan; but by then, the Holy Spirit will have Christianized the Far East and sub-Saharan Africa, and will have risen up hundreds of Martels, Cids, and Sobieskis in those quarters.
Posted by: Kepha at October 24, 2005 3:43 PM
I suggest we all make networks for survival WITH LIKE-MINDED PEOPLE. As for my Muslim neighbors? I don't trust a single one of them.
Muslims commit crimes under the cover of the burqa then have the gall to kill the shop owner for daring to reproach the holy thief. Despicable.
White man's guilt is going to kill us all..
Posted by: Kemaste at October 24, 2005 4:15 PM
This article has a Churchhill ring to it, more so than the many others Hugh as written on this same topic. He seems to come closer and closer to a prophetic tone, unfortunately.
Inspiration and depression can co-exist, for me at least.
Posted by: JTF at October 24, 2005 5:34 PM
My disagreement with Hugh over Iraq is well-known. But laying it aside for a moment, one can understand Hugh's premise that our treasure and energies would be better spent on more constructive pursuits such as developing alternative sources of energy.
But how does European policy come into play vis-a-vis the USA? Outside of counseling them about the dangers of Muslim immigration, what can we do? Particularly if our warnings fall on deaf ears.
Posted by: Cornelius at October 24, 2005 5:44 PM
Seymour Paine writes;
If...IF...we can ever get rid of oil dependency, the Moslem world is screwed.
As far as the readers of this website are concerned, including S. Paine, the only “screwedness” relevant to our concerns should be the one which “screws up” the ability of the “Moslem world” to carry on the process of islamization of the West. And that ability has little, or nothing, to do with our dependency on Moslem oil.
The essence of Islam’s strategy for conquering the West is demographic, rather than military conquest. Or Gentle Jihad, if you like.
Massive transfer of Moslems, that vehicle of true jihad, into the heart of Europe is not a result of some explicit agreement, or assumed understanding, reached between the West and the Moslem world whereby the West must accept, for example, 2 .5 Moslem, with every oil barrel it buys.
Europe doesn’t buy oil from Turkey, Pakistan, Egypt, Morocco, Somalia, Jordan, or, so called, “Palestine”, yet these precisely are the countries - not Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Indonesia or the Emirates - that flood Europe with their Moslems.
Allowing, promoting, encouraging Moslem invasion of Europe is result of a conscious policy of the European ruling and intellectual elites, who recognize in Islam an historical ally in their quest to abolish the Christian West and replacing it with the Multi Kulti fantasy. The true fuel that feeds that process is not oil, but a mad ideology of our own elites.
We may end our dependance on oil from day to day, but it will not stop the deadly Gentle Jihad. That Jihad can only be defeated after we stop our dependence on our treacherous elites.
at October 24, 2005 6:09 PM
Infidel33 posted: Ending the Eurabian welfare state will make Europe less attractive to those who are determined to undermine and conquer it.
It is too late now. Besides the Mu'min have a great capacity for suffering in the cause of allah. They will continue to have hosts of children and be poor, as it is requirement of their faith.
In many Asian and African countries, there is no social security, yet muslims will continue to have large numbers of children. They will even face starvation rather then quit their practices. In anycase, in Europe, our conscience will never allow them to starve on the streets.
Posted by: DP111 at October 24, 2005 6:23 PM
And I present the other side of the "coin"
Iraq and the Democratization of the Middle East
by Michael Rubin
from La Rivoluzione Democratica Contro Il Terrorismo
October 14, 2005
http://www.meforum.org/article/780
at October 24, 2005 8:53 PM
Shaughn Says
"I think that's true, given Islam's insidious alignment with the Marxist impulses that rule the West."
LOL, you self defined right wingers just can't let go of a bone can you. "Marxist impulses that rule the west".
Where, when, who, how... last I looked it was money that ruled the west, and the money belongs to the corporatists, the capitalists and they plough millions of it into politics, especially the RNC.
therefore by your lights the RNC is Marxist.
And by the way, it is the eye on the bottom line, Wall Street, the Dax, stockholders share, profits that accounts for the accommodations made towards Islam, you see Muslim countries have billions of people, which represent markets, which represents profits, which means shareholder value and they also have oil.
Posted by: Nariz at October 24, 2005 10:34 PM
Many years ago, when I first began to befriend a number of Arab Muslims, I couldn't help but notice what extaordinarily large families they all seemed to have. Another friend (non-Muslim), who I generally regarded as an idiot, remarked what other reason could they possibly have except world domination? Back then I wrote it off as crackpot conspiracy nut talk, but in retrospect...
Posted by: spect8or at October 24, 2005 11:00 PM
Dear Hugh
I agree completely with your article, I am one conservative who has seen the light in reference to Iraq. Your arguments ring true!
I also agree that the BNP and Le Pen hurt the efforts of those that would resist and " make their country less welcoming to Muslims".
I live in New York, and wish I could have attended the meeting at the Union League, I so admire and respect Bat Ye'or (have read many of her books) It would have been great to hear her talk.
How can I find out about future events?
I read El Pais every other day and the level of Dihimmitude is appalling.
I very much believe that, as you do, that reading is important that it can change opinions and have continued my informal spreading of the truth by giving away PIG books.
I am content with this, while I prepare and ready to offer greater help in the future.
Vikrant_Camberleykar, I have spoken to my Indian friends and gave one a copy of PIG and I feel that am among some Indians there is a little awakening, My question for them and for everyone, is it too late?
Posted by: El Cid at October 25, 2005 12:12 AM
Thomas: You have a good point. I was somewhat overstating things about the money; and your point about population is very relevant.
I have stated here and many times in the past that the first thing we in the civilized world should do is rid ourselves of Moslems in our presence.
Posted by: Seymour Paine at October 25, 2005 12:13 AM
I've been a passenger on the Hugh Fitzgerald for a while now; but I think I'm ready to jump ship -- not to a different fleet or navy (I'll still be a proud sailor of his line), but just from this particular ship to one headed not so inexorably by this particular compass that tends to simplify the sociological complexity of Islam: to the Alexandre Del Valle:
When Del Valle was asked: "Is an Islam “à la française” not just an illusion? A legal construction to finance the Muslim cult? What's our interest in supporting this cult?
Del Valle replied: "Things are more complex than that. For, one must be a realist: Islam is a French reality, a European reality, a multifarious reality which involves our fellow citizens with whom one cannot but compromise. To deny this sociological evolution would produce perverse effects worse than we already have. What poses the problem, I say to you, is radical Islam whose objective is to endanger integration and to distill in the Muslim neighborhoods an insurrectionist spirit and "victim culture", a self-identity of rupture, at once totalitarian and radical, which constitutes one of the worst dangers for the integrity of the Republic and one of the objectives of the Islamists in the purview of their strategy to conquer Europe through the means of the immigrant pool of Muslims, the premier patsies for obscurantism and communautarisme. [Translation note: "communautarisme is a movement of thought which makes the community (whether ethnic, religious, cultural, social, political, mystical, etc.) into a value as important, if not more important, than the universal values of liberty and equality, often in reaction against liberalism and individualism" -- http://atheisme.free.fr/Religion/Communautarisme.htm]
"Graver still is not merely the fact of financially supporting the cults, for if regional collectives finance the institutions of formation of Imams who happen to be impeccably Republican ["Republican" in the French sense] (guided by the Imam Bencheikh of Marseille or the Sufi Sheikh Bentounès or even Leila Babès of the periodical Islam de France, etc.), sincerely respectful of French and Western values and customs, one could at least in this sense encourage integration.
"The problem resides in the fact that in the name of "positive discrimination" -- more and more praised, and not only by the president of my party, the UMP -- there are anti-Republican subversive Islamists who become financed, then the Islamo-fundamentalists dominate the representation of "official" Islam, both in the Muslim world and in France and throughout Europe, which I have shown in my book «Le totalitarisme islamiste à l’assaut des démocraties» (2003)."
Del Valle speaks about "Islamophobia":
"As far as Islamophobia -- along with the president of the movement of which I am secretary general and co-founder in the context of the UMP, la Droite Libre, Rachid Kaci, and with the Union of Secular Muslims, and with my liberal Muslim friends Kaveh Mohseini or Mezri Haddad -- I fight against it. But when the legitimate fight against Islamophobia and racism is used by the MRAP (a movement allied to the Communist party which supports the Islamists of [Tariq] Ramadan and the veiled rebel girls of the French schools, is used by the Islamists of the UOIF (the Muslim Brotherhood), is used by the FNMF and the World Islamic League (a Wahhabi Saudi Islam), in order to soil the reputation of investigators fighting against radical Islam, one feels to be swimming in absurdity: Since when are adepts of Communist ideologies or Salafist totalitarians able to give lesson in morality?"
http://www.libertyvox.com/une.php#
at October 25, 2005 12:39 AM
"A few years ago a prominent leader of the Socialist Party sent out word to his underlings that they should forget entirely about "the Jews" and Israel, and concentrate entirely on winning the Muslim vote, which can only be won by adopting Muslim demands in foreign policy and meeting Muslim demands for changes in the laws, customs, and manners to be observed within the Infidel land in which they happen to have settled."
From the article of Hugh Fitzgeral
Which Socialist Party? From France?
What is the source and which leader? Because it will be very welcome for me to use it.
at October 25, 2005 3:39 AM
"Not true. Many of those posting at this website have learned a great deal about Islam from books."
-- posted by Hugh
The writer's hyperbolic statement that "nobody reads books" means to ask what good does it do to fashion a few hundred people into Islamo-experts.
Are we here for personal self-improvement, or to seek a way to avert global disaster?
If it's the latter, it's time now for mass marketing. To effect policy means capturing the minds of over 50% of the infidel population. That means somehow reaching hundreds of millions, or more.
We need a Budweiser marketing campaign on Islam. All it has to do in order to stop the juggernaut is to expose the Islam-ignorant to the basic features of this awful thing, which if exposed fpr what it is will un-sell itself in a big hurry.
Islam is so sickening that a 101 apprisement will make possible public policy only dreamed of in here now.
Right now, the only mass marketing I can see is being done by the Moslems, and that's a damned shame.
Posted by: Chaz MarteL 732 at October 25, 2005 7:26 AM
... Jihad can only be defeated after we stop our dependence on our treacherous elites. thomas.h
Yes, isn't it amazing that our élites are helping this thing along? And isn't it amazing, too, that people are lying down and playing dead - just letting it all be done? Was it Confucious who said: When about to be raped, lie back and enjoy it?
The British, in particular, are so docile; it really is hard to fathom.
Posted by: Mark at October 25, 2005 7:29 AM
Victory is indeed not inevitable. Especially the way the West is dealing with this problem. It is a chilling thought that each and every country in which Islam has put down roots, it has eventually taken over! Egypt comes to mind, as does Syria, to name only a couple of countries. Why are our leaders so arrogant that they think it will be different here in Western Europe and there in the States?
Posted by: Mark at October 25, 2005 7:34 AM
Chaz MarteL 732 "fashion a few hundred people into Islamo-experts"
So true! Each of us with the help of the academics experts such as Hugh, Robert and the anti-Jihad vanguard (Bat Ye'or, and so many brave and talented people) must become Islamo-experts and ambassadors to spread the word and affect as many policy makers as possible.
Yes yes! we need a " Budweiser marketing campaign on Islam.", more like a sophisticated and persuasive campaign that uses image and copy to point out what dihimmitude would mean for our individual freedoms, civil liberties, and religious rights.
We need a "We are the world campaign" that uses posters. ads , leaflets, bumperstickers and maybe even video to carefully debunk the myth of Islamic tolerance and the nature of the struggle against Islam.
We need to create as many organizations and fundraisers as possible, in as many countires as possible, to harness the energy of all those how are awaken to this danger , all over the world and want join the fight.
If we don't do this ,then yes victory will not be inevitable!
We can win this if we try!
Posted by: El Cid at October 25, 2005 9:51 AM
"... campaign that uses image and copy to point out what dihimmitude would mean for our individual freedoms, civil liberties, and religious rights."
-- posted by El Cid
I'd go even more basic than that.
Advertise to Joe Six Pack that Mohammed ordered murders, even of women. That he penetrated a 9-year old girl. That he stole hard-earned wealth from innocent Jewish farmers. That he conducted a behead-fest mass murder. That he dealt heavily in sex slavery. That his alleged God calls for extermination of Christians and world domination.
That'd about do it. I guarantee that in-migration of Moslems to the USA would slow or stop within a year.
Posted by: Chaz MarteL 732 at October 25, 2005 10:09 AM
Nariz: "Where, when, who, how... last I looked it was money that ruled the west, and the money belongs to the corporatists, the capitalists and they plough millions of it into politics, especially the RNC.
therefore by your lights the RNC is Marxist."
There is far more to "the west" than the United States, Nariz, including the welfare states of Scandanavia and the Lowland nations of Europe, Canada, etc. Even the "capitalistic" RNC is unwilling to more than think about maybe slowing the growth of the American welfare state, let alone moving to a capitalistic libertarian ethos -- they talk a good game, but results... eh, not so much.
"A few years ago a prominent leader of the Socialist Party sent out word to his underlings that they should forget entirely about "the Jews" and Israel, and concentrate entirely on winning the Muslim vote, which can only be won by adopting Muslim demands in foreign policy and meeting Muslim demands for changes in the laws, customs, and manners to be observed within the Infidel land in which they happen to have settled."
From the article of Hugh Fitzgeral
Wally Klomp: "Which Socialist Party? From France? What is the source and which leader? Because it will be very welcome for me to use it."
It was French and search MSNBC, which is where I remmeber reading the above.
Posted by: Cthulhu at October 25, 2005 10:51 AM
"I live in New York, and wish I could have attended the meeting at the Union League, I so admire and respect Bat Ye'or (have read many of her books) It would have been great to hear her talk.
How can I find out about future events?"
-- from a posting by El Cid Campeador above
This was a meeting, sponsored by The New Criterion, not open to the public (I'm part of the public, and I didn't know about it). Bat Ye'or was not a scheduled speaker, but a serendipitous and last-minute invitee, who happened to run into one of the participants before the meeting started.
I doubt that Eric Ormsby, who depicted S. D. Goitein with pninian touches, and who, as long as he stays away from Islam (and trying to block publication of certain books about Islam), is perfectly acceptable, came down from Montreal to attend.
Attendance at all these things is mostly a matter of being able to tell yourself that you were in the numinous presence of someone whom you admire. In the Stravinsky-Craft diaries, somewhere Vera Stravinskaya notes that her husband was given a lot of money to appear somewhere. And Craft, the sly ventriloquist, reports her as saying: "Well, $25,000 is a lot to pay to be in someone's numinous presence. But Igor is a lot of numen."
Given a choice between all the bother, tout le fatras, of attending any of these earnest affairs, with the to-and-fro cab, and the requirement that one listen to all sorts of people of varying levels of discernment and knowledge -- the good, the bad, and the silly -- only very occasionally is it worth it. Perhaps this was one of those occasions, for The New Criterion is the best magazine since Encounter and The Human World. But I doubt it. If you live in New York, and have a choice between going out to hear B.Y. not alone, but with a dozen other speakers, none of them conceivably as well-informed about Europe and its islamization as she is, then I'd recommend staying home and reading, reading, reading. On the other hand, if she's on the program alone, or diluted only by one or two others on that subject, that would be a different matter.
What would Avvakum tell us to do if he were alive today? Lisez, lisez, lisez derechef.
Posted by: Hugh at October 25, 2005 10:53 AM
Chaz, "That he penetrated a 9-year old girl. That he stole hard-earned wealth from innocent Jewish farmers. That he conducted a behead-fest mass murder. That he dealt heavily in sex slavery. That his alleged God calls for extermination of Christians and world domination."
This is all true, and much of it can be confirmed through Mo's biographers and the actual words of the Qur' an, but unless someone like Mel Gibson does a movie about it, it is a truth that is best served in small doses, because in this case truth is really stranger the fiction!
Posted by: El Cid at October 25, 2005 11:06 AM
Thank you Hugh,
I agree that... read... read... is probably best.
I have natural admiration for those that can write well, alas... I confess that my admiration stems from my desires to express myself with a fraction of the skill that most of the posters on this site exhibit.
In a past life as an advertising art director, I had the pleasure to work with a varied collection of copy writers and always admired the way they could find amazing combinations of very clear and communicative works.
Being a visual person, I always thought that a picture is a thousand words, but through experience I have also discovered that the reverse is also true.
In any case, English being my second language I find the effort to put word to paper just that more daunting.
I mean I practically live with the spell check on.
Se la vie!
Posted by: El Cid at October 25, 2005 11:24 AM
Thank you Hugh,
I agree that... read... read... is probably best.
I have natural admiration for those that can write well, alas... I confess that my admiration stems from my desires to express myself with a fraction of the skill that most of the posters on this site exhibit.
In a past life as an advertising art director, I had the pleasure to work with a varied collection of copy writers and always admired the way they could find amazing combinations of very clear and communicative works.
Being a visual person, I always thought that a picture is a thousand words, but through experience I have also discovered that the reverse is also true.
In any case, English being my second language I find the effort to put word to paper just that more daunting.
I mean I practically live with the spell check on.
Se la vie!
Posted by: El Cid at October 25, 2005 11:24 AM
"... it is a truth that is best served in small doses, because in this case truth is really stranger the fiction!"
-- posted by El Cid
Point well taken. Perhaps the biggest single problem confronting anti-Dhimmitude intellectuals is, as you imply, that Islam is so awful and so surreal that if you dare recite some facts about it you come off like some nut-bag, and thereby lose all credibility.
These Moslems have their deal wired tight. Reel tight [sic].
at October 25, 2005 11:59 AM
Read and relate. Adapt your material to your audience. We will never have a "Budweiser Moment" except in the sense that we could relay our information while imbibing a Bud or a similar libation with friends...
Use your creativity.
Posted by: epg at October 25, 2005 3:23 PM
In regards to the treachery of our elites in allowing a veritable wave of Muslim immigrants into our lands, I came across a gem when re-reading Jean Larteguy's book "The Last Command, also published under the name The Centurions” Some of you guys might have seen the movie starring the late, great Anthony Quinn. It’s about the French-Algerian war.
Anyway, when the aristocratic para officer Major Jacques de Glatigny meets Aisha, the comely, Moorish, FNL terrorist in an Algiers cafe, they hit it off right away because they both recognize they are, in their own words, "big tent people"
Culturally they are compatible, she is western educated, Francophone and a Muslim (for identification purposes only) These are the type of Muslims our elites mix with, so I believe they are honest when they claim that "Islam means peace" and genuinely believe that Muslims can be integrated within our societies. The threat of the growing Muslim demographic looks far less alarming from the vantage point of Notting Hill or the 7eme or 16eme Arrondissement of Paris. They never see or have to deal with the Muslim lumpenproletariat from the mosque and mill towns of the northern England or the banlieue of large French cities.
In the novel, I was drawn to a tactic, some of the French paras used against the FLN. After the Algerian fellaghas captured several French troops and slit their throats then hacked off the Gauls privates and stuffed them in the corpses mouths. The French began dispatching captured FLN terrorists tout suit by slitting their throats and making sure the bodies were always discovered facing Rome. A nice touch, no? Perhaps our men could adopt this tactic in Anbar province. I know it wouldn’t make us any more loved in the dar-al-islam but I would sure get some short-term sadistic pleasure from it.
at October 25, 2005 4:06 PM
Great post, spenderd!
I have often stated that Muslims already accuse us of every conceivable calumny anywhy, (and many inconceivable calumnies as well...) why don't we start accommodating them? How much worse could their excoriations become? How much more hatred could they gin up against us than they already have? A little dose of that which they spew against us might go a long way towards clamming up their poisonous pie-holes - (felafel-hole just isn't quite as mellifluous somehow...)
at October 25, 2005 8:48 PM
to wally klomp
You're looking for the name Pascal Boniface. He is an ideologue of the French Socialist party. He issued a position paper a few years ago which, as described above, called for the party to go wholeheartedly for the Muslim vote, and the Jews could go to hell. This was cynical and too clever by half. Because after allowing Muslim thugs in France to harass Jews, burn synagogues [Leila Shahid, the PLO spokeswoman in Paris, encouraged this Judeophobic activity on French TV], beat Jews and even murder two or three Jews [maybe one or two of these was murdered after the election; I'm not sure], the Socialist candidate --Jospin-- lost the election for president of the republic. Ironically, Jospin was somewhat sympathetic to Israel but was not in full control of his own government, and further, he was in "cohabitation" with Jacques Chirac, the incumbent president, who had a certain influence over the govt under the Fifth republic's peculiar system.
Anyhow, people like Boniface who are slimy and cynical opportunists, are extremely dangerous. Because you can't play games with the jihad mentality --and they are certainly not going to stop with Jews.
at October 27, 2005 5:50 PM
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