Qatar opens doors to first church in 14 centuries

NICOSIA, CYPRUS - The first Christian church in the conservative Muslim state of Qatar since the arrival of Islam in the 7th century is to be built on land donated by the reform-minded Emir of Qatar, Sheikh Hamad bin Khalifa al-Thani.

I suppose they have some kindle for starting their fireplaces in winter now.

Posted by: 3rdtimelucky at November 11, 2005 5:45 AM

Clive Handford, the Nicosia-based Anglican Bishop in Cyprus and the Gulf, says: "We are there as guests in a Muslim country and we wish to be sensitive to our hosts ...

Or they will simply kill us. Nuff said.

Posted by: KingTesticle at November 11, 2005 6:28 AM

I'll take this as a positive step. Displaying a large Christian cross on the outside of the building would be a bit too much like the 10x ring on a shooting target.

Posted by: Beagle at November 11, 2005 7:49 AM

"You'd get the same in the conservative Christian world where mosques are built," Handford says.

Might want to consider that before commenting any further, 'holy' man. We're lousy with mosques down here in fundy Christian land. Nobody complains, but I do speed up as I drive by.

Posted by: Beagle at November 11, 2005 7:54 AM

Subject of course to the usual dhimmi codes such as not being taller than a mosque, no outward signs of religion, no bells, no loud prayers, no processions, no resisting when it all gets old for the muslims and the party ends.

"we wish to be sensitive to our hosts..."

What I would give to hear a muslim in the West make the same remark. Can you say "grovel", Bishop? This just drips of dhimmitude.

Should this church become popular with ex-pats working in Qatar, you can expect the muslim mental pressure-cooker to build up over time until, with steam shooting out of their ears, they will cry "Humiliating affront to the Superior Religion!" and we will rerun the same old brutish tapes.

Besides, what would that make the ratio of churches destroyed to churches built in the muslim world? Anyone? My calculator only goes to 6 decimal places.

Posted by: t-ham at November 11, 2005 8:54 AM

Beagle:

I agree with you. This is a positive step. However, your recollection of that particular commandment is incomplete. If I recall correctly, it should go "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor," so I think your reference is a little out of context. "Witness" in this case is persistence in the face of intolerance, even if such commitment is needed over 1400 years or more. When running the good race, we never know whether it's a sprint or a marathon.

For all of the many (perhaps legitimate) misgivings posted here, at least something approaching tolerance is being advanced in a Muslim country. Now, if only the different Christian denominations can get along together in front of their Muslim hosts another step in the right direction will have been taken. A good example may speak louder than words.

Posted by: Chatillon at November 11, 2005 9:31 AM

I think it's pretty cool. First time a church is being built in Qatar in 14 centuries? That's a significant event, even with the restrictions. The foot's in the door, the Christian church has a state-supported presence there. That's a good thing.

Muslims are quite adept at taking baby steps in non-muslim countries, asking and demanding one concession after another, and leveraging those concessions for even greater gains over time. It's a very effective strategy, and I bet Christians can do something similar in Qatar. It requires patience, perseverance, faith, and pragmatism (and some groveling and obsequiousness, no doubt). I'm not being naive about dhimmitude. But you take what you can and go with it.

Posted by: kelley at November 11, 2005 9:34 AM

ASctually, churches of similar nature are officially santioned in some other Middle Eastern Countries. For eg, in the Sultanate of OMan and UAE. Lots of Christian expats from INdia attend service on Fridays!! Of course, the restrictions are there.
There are even small temples in UAE and Oman. Its better than nothing.

Posted by: MohdIs Satan at November 11, 2005 9:56 AM

In particular, the emir, who came to power in 1995, has been very supportive. "Were it not for his agreement, and approval, and generosity, we wouldn't be having a church," says Bishop Handford.

That's true. If you hadn't kissed his butt, you wouldn't be able to practice your religion. What happens tommorrow if he eats a piece of under cooked sheep and changes his mind?

Oh, and remember to have plenty of bandages on hand; the bombers won't aim for the emir, you are their target.

Posted by: wannabersc at November 11, 2005 10:13 AM

This means very little. One tiny church, with no visibiility, in tiny Qatar, intendedonly for a handful of foreigners. No doubt those who enter will be watched by Qatari security, and indeed perhaps by vigilant Muslims making sure that none of those born into Islam stops in to see what Christianity is all about. No spire,no cross. Really, for Foreign Infidels Only -- and don't any local Muslims forget it.

It will be somewhat like those Beryozka shops in Soviet Russia that were open, to sell the best goods, but only to foreigners, who had to show their passports, and off-limits to every Soviet citizen. But still, those foreigners could go home impressed with the caviar, the Baltic amber, the matryoshka dolls, the Progress Publishers editions of Folk Songs by the Evenk and other Siberian peoples, and so on.

As used to be said of GUM, the "Gosudarstvenniy Univresal'nij Magazin" or Really Big Department Store (does Macy's tell Gimbel's? Does GUM tell -- Vneshtorg?) on Red Square, where foreigners would naturally go, the Potemkin emporium offered a hollow display of glittering abundance, because everything there was merely for show -- vsyo napokaz.

That's not quite what this Little Church Around the Corner in Qatar is all about, but close. I would not make this cause of relief and celebration that everything is okay, the Dialogue of Civilizations is doing just fine. More likely, a slightly enlightened despot, eager to win easy favor from the Americans, instead of shutting down Al-Jazeera for which he offers a home, has decided by way of an essentially meaningless gesture that will be greeted with well-publicized gratitude, to provide this one small church for foreign Christians -- Anglicans, I take it.

And of course we shall be endlessly hearing all about this in debates with Muslims holding out the prospects for Big Changes So No Need to Worry -- "Why, just the other day in Qatar they opened a church for the first time in 14 centuries. See, things are happening. Don't listen to those grim people who want to cause a rift between civilisations where none really exists."

And so on, and so predictably forth.

Posted by: Hugh at November 11, 2005 11:42 AM

Let's see how long it would stand before it is burned. Then, the emir of course will say "This is the work of extremeists and does not represent Islam"

How about a church is Saudi Arabia?

Posted by: Anti-PC at November 11, 2005 12:38 PM

Mr. Fitzgerald:

What this means is yet to be shown. It may be, as you say, nothing, a statistical blip. Or it may be more. Each of your points is well taken and the presence of one church certainly does not an oasis of Tolerance make. But who can deny that it is better than the closing of a church? Moreover, even if the presence of this church in Qatar, a peninsula on the Arabian Peninsula, is strictly analogous to the GUM department store in Moscow, what was the ultimate effect of that store upon the Muscovites? "Oh goody! We're suckering the running dog capitalists?" or "What's wrong with the place I'm living in when the foreigners have access to something that I can only dream of?"

I personally am more heartened than not by this news, but fully aware that there is or might soon be a big honkin' fly in the ointment. So be it. We'll then work from that point. In the mean time, I'll take what small comfort I can from this news. So much of the news, the various and widespread outrages perpetrated by Islamofascists throughout the world, is such that I frequently feel the need to resist my own feelings of outrage, anger and victimhood. I don't want to be reduced to the same state as my enemies. And when I see the sun briefly shining from behind the clouds, I'll smile but still keep my umbrella with me.

Posted by: Chatillon at November 11, 2005 1:57 PM

Mr. Fitzgerald:

Slightly off-topic, but I'd view it as a courtesy (as would perhaps other posters?) if you could recommend translations of the hadith and sira by name and suggestion potential retail outlets where these volumes might be purchased, provided this doesn't provide you with any conflicts of interests. Many thanks.

Posted by: Chatillon at November 11, 2005 2:05 PM

Chat,

Get them on-line, don't pay for them. They're all available on-line.

Geoff

Posted by: Geoff at November 11, 2005 2:13 PM

For lives of Mohammad, I like best those by non-Muslims, especially Muir's "The Life of Mahomet" which has been reprinted, and is available for about $50. There are other biographies by non-Muslims -- Arthur Jeffrey, Tor Andrae, and Maxine Rondinson -- all in English. I think any edition of the Sira for Muslims will have all the stuff you might think wouldn't be there -- but it's there.

As for the Hadith, properly Ahadith in the plural but usage now permits one to use "Hadith" as the plural, and I prefer it -- just fits English better, there is Al Ahadith Al Sahiha (Al Albani), which is a compendium of all the authoritative, good, true and trustworthy, or "Sahih" collections, of which those by al-Bukhari and Muslim (the name of the compiler, are held to be the best, the most authoritative.

But these collections are very expensive. And buying some propaganda that consists of 40 entirely unrepresentative hadith (or ahadith) is worse that worthless -- it's misleading.

You can find this stuff on line. That's one of the few things about the Internet worth having.

You might, just for fun, ask the Saudi Embassy or someone for a free compilation of the Ahadith. Perhaps they'll think you are a likely candidate for adult-onset Islam, and want to help you in your Spiritual Search. They've got the money. See what they'll send you. And read around in it slowly so you don't go crazy; it will make you crazy.

There are so many "answering Islam" sites that post so much of this that I wonder why you want to buy a book. The Internet has all this stuff, sometimes very nicely arranged by topic: Infidels, Women, Warfare, and so on.

Posted by: Hugh at November 11, 2005 2:26 PM

From the horse's mouth - The Church Times last month. http://www.churchtimes.co.uk/churchtimes/website/pages.nsf/httppublicpages/95F7DBAF6CD1CFD680257099004AA10A

Like Chatillon above I too "am more heartened than not by this news." But it's not built yet, much less consecrated.

Posted by: Granny Weatherwax at November 11, 2005 4:20 PM

Obviously, Qatar isn't the only or first Muslim country allowing this.

I'd like to know the complete breakdown of Muslim countries re:

1) that allow Christian churches, Jewish synagogues, temples of other religions (all or any combination)

2) that don't allow any of the aforementioned

3) that include dhimmitude limitations on this allowance (and which limitations do they include)

4) the statistics concerning extra-governmental repression and violence of church & temple members (lynch mobs, riots, jihadist attacks, communal pressure, etc.)

Posted by: Dr. Pepper at November 11, 2005 4:46 PM

the church is nothing more than a way to lure more......... soon to be victums, to their society.

Posted by: samUwell at November 11, 2005 4:47 PM

"Muslims are quite adept at taking baby steps in non-muslim countries, asking and demanding one concession after another, and leveraging those concessions for even greater gains over time. It's a very effective strategy, and I bet Christians can do something similar in Qatar. "

Bless you for your hopefulness and your optimism... but I wouldn't jump to any completely unsubstantiated and unprecedented conclusions! Certainly not yet....!

Let's see if Christians are capable of survivingin Muslim lands if they dare to manifest the arrogance and truculence we see regularly from the Muslim triumphalists in the West -- Only the misguided television evangelists manifest a similar pious arrogance that's seen in the Western Muslim -- I highly doubt ANY Christian will be seen making similar demands in ANY Muslim land ANY time in the near or far future -- but you're welcom to your hopes and dreams.

I respect this endeavor, but there is such a wide gulf between how I see this and how you you see it, I can hardly credit the discrepancy...!

I hope they don't get decapitated, but I think they will be! I hope they aren't terrorized but I KNOW they will be... I hope if it happens, that it won't be with such viciousness, and with such regularity that they pack up and abandon their church... That, to me is all I think we can realistically hope for from Muslims -- We have witnessed the face of Islam now and short of pretending otherwise, I can't harbor the hope you display.

When Westerners are so giddy at the thought of ONE SINGLE CHURCH in the ENTIRE REGION -- it does more to fill my heart with despair than many of the things the Muslims are seen to be doing -- Will we never learn?

Posted by: jsla at November 11, 2005 5:17 PM

(Qattar doesn't just give a home to Al Jazeera -- The Emir OWNS Al Jazeera, by the way...)

Posted by: jsla at November 11, 2005 5:20 PM

It isn´t true, before from this anglican church, a catholic church is built.

Posted by: Franze at November 11, 2005 6:00 PM

could this be a islamic constatine?

Posted by: jimmytheclaw at November 12, 2005 12:57 AM

Well it isn't a Buhddist Temple in Medina, nor a Catholic Cathedral in Mecca... yet.... but it is a start.

For anyone looking for the Hadith online here is the address:

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/

there are other sites but this one is fairly good.

Posted by: Sheik Canuck (swt) at November 12, 2005 2:36 PM