The Gideon bibles were still in place in my local hospital the last time I was an in-patient.
They were still present last month among the reading material on the waiting room tables of the breast clinic and the oncology department. And I see them being used there, I can tell you, especially among the people waiting to receive chemotherapy.

Posted by: Granny Weatherwax at May 14, 2006 7:56 AM

This very story, right down to the infection excuse, surfaced in England about a year ago. It turned out not to be true.

I wonder if this, too, will turn out to be a bit of a no-piggy-bank story.

Posted by: Interested at May 14, 2006 8:20 AM

Granny:

I thought you were in Britain, not Australia.

Can anyone in Victoria State shed any light on this?

Cordially
Robert Spencer

Posted by: jihadwatch at May 14, 2006 8:21 AM

I am in Britain. I'm sorry I was not clear.
I was not contradicting the story. In the light of attacks on the Gideon bibles by several public bodies, State of Victoria, a Scottish university, the misleading allegation in Leicester mentioned by Interested, I was making the point that where they are available the Gideon Bibles are appreciated and used.

Posted by: Granny Weatherwax at May 14, 2006 8:40 AM

I have no sympathy for an outraged Catholic Church or The Gideons International Australia. How often have we seen Christian groups urging us to celebrate our diversity and welcome muslims into our midst. Now they are beginning to understand what is at stake. The tell us to accept things which offend us because all cultures are equal and they feed us other tosh.

Well guess what? While you have been holding hands with these muslims they have been whispering in the ear of Premier Bracks and other people suggesting that we can't be multicultural if christianity is given an inside run.

Wake up you christian groups. These muslims aren't your friends. They mean to dominate and not be dominated.

Posted by: Salad_In at May 14, 2006 8:54 AM

There's an update to this one:

The Australian: Row over Bibles in hospital

WRT the original post:

Royal Melbourne spokesman Rod Jackson-Smith denied a ban, but said: "We don't (have Bibles in each room) any more. ...

I'd say that Mr. Rod Jackson-Smith is playing semantic games here.

It's easy for him to deny a "ban", because he can (implicitly) take "ban" to mean the hospital's saying to patients, "You cannot bring a bible into this building," which the hospital is obviously not going to say (as yet, anyway).

However, I'd say, ""We don't (have Bibles in each room) any more," amounts to an admission of what his hospital was accused of.

I'm not an Australian. I'm simply analysing the language he's using.

I dare say people could contact Mr. Jackson-Smith and pursue some of these points with him. It might be nice to get some straight answers. Contact details at the bottom of this page:

http://www.wehi.edu.au/news/press/28october2003.html

**********************************

To returnt to the update - this issue has now reached the level of the Queensland Government:

The Australian: Row over Bibles in hospital

THE Queensland Government has denied that Bibles have been banned from hospital bedsides because health bosses fear they offend non-Christians. Deputy Premier Anna Bligh said media reports that the Princess Alexandra and Royal Brisbane and Women's hospitals had stopped Bibles being left by patients' bedsides were wrong.

"If a patient in one of our hospitals wants a Bible there will be one there," Ms Bligh said today.

"Policy and practice in relation to Bibles in our hospitals is unchanged and remains as it has been for many years."

[My emphasis]

I'd say that here we have, again, careful and somewhat deceptive wording.

However, Opposition health spokesman Bruce Flegg says a Christian group which supplies Bibles to hospitals has been turned away from at least one – the Royal Brisbane and Women's.

"Information I had quite a long time previous to this coming public indicated there was an active policy of discouraging the placing of Bibles in hospitals," Dr Flegg said.

"Hospitals are one place where I would encourage the spiritual welfare of people ... because people are under stress when they are sick."

Dr Flegg said he didn't think the presence of Bibles would cause great offence.

"I don't think that you would say we are going to remove all of the Bibles in case there's one or two people of another faith who are offended," he said.

"It's this political correctness isn't it? Let's remove any reference to our Christian heritage.

"Most Queenslanders, myself included, would absolutely reject that.

This is the point, isn't it? That there are definite claims that groups who donate Bibles are being turned away.

I think Bruce Flegg's finanl point is an important one, too: "It's this political correctness isn't it? Let's remove any reference to our Christian heritage."

I'm agnostic myself, but I find I am increasingly wary of people in the West who are going out of their way to push Christianity completely out of public life. In some cases the very same people have found no problem with easing Islam into the vacated public space. If one were suspicious, one might be inclined to put both facts together and see a coherent strategy here. In fact, I suppose that would be going too far - at least in most cases. My guess is that any apparently "planned" outcome is more likely a matter of confused, contradictory, and unexamined assumptions, held by noisy but shallow people.

Be that as it may, see this article:

The ACLU's anti-Religious Hypocrisy.

Sobering reading.

Posted by: Yojimbo at May 14, 2006 9:51 AM

Why is it that the mere presence of a bible is offensive to some?

No one will force you to open it.

No one will force you to read it.

No one will even force you to touch it.

It will not force you to convert to Christianity.

There are millions of books in libraries, and book stores but they will not reach out and bite you if you come to close to them.

So What is it that is so frightening about the bible?

Does it speak to something that some are to afraid to dare hear and dare read?

Posted by: Mackie at May 14, 2006 10:12 AM

Christianity is all about healing -- physical and spiritual. Throughout the New Testament are acts of healing by Jesus and his disciples. Look up sickness, healing, and miracle and you will find lots of positive references. There is none in the Qu'ran.

In fact Mohammed admitted that he couldn't perform miracles -- only God could. See Surah 29:50 Islam isn't into healing -- but followers do amputate hands and feet, and they do stone people to death.

Meanwhile, Muslims in countries where Christian missionaries can operate actually go to Christian missionaries when they are sick because they know that healing is possible in Christianity.

The Bible is very appropriate in hospitals because it contains a positive message of healing. If Muslims so wish, let them put the Qu'ran there, too, so people can see how utterly devoid of hope that book is.

Posted by: Chris at May 14, 2006 11:29 AM

The Bible is very appropriate in hospitals because it contains a positive message of healing.

I'm living proof of that.

Posted by: Granny Weatherwax at May 14, 2006 11:33 AM

"Majority rules."

Not if you've got some Muslims in your country.

Posted by: Foehammer at May 14, 2006 12:35 PM

Salad_In,
My conversion to Christianity came about from reading the New Testament. It says there is only ONE way to the Father. I take your point about all this interfaith 'tosh', but I think you have to differentiate between those who live the Faith and those who are just career Christians and Sunday attenders. The former being the minority. In my experience the Gideons in the UK are also of the former. I don't know what approach they have in other, more hostile countries. Perhaps someone else knows out there?

Posted by: western infidel at May 14, 2006 3:20 PM

Mackie said :

"So What is it that is so frightening about the bible? Does it speak to something that some are to afraid to dare hear and dare read?"

Well, to a Muslim, yes. It presents the Jesus I believe exists, rather than the Muslim version of Jesus (Isa). Muslims claim that Jesus is a prophet, but not the Son of God. Reading about Jesus might cause them to question their faith or at least wonder why the Jesus of the New Testament doesn't agree with the Isa of the Koran.

Posted by: non-redneck at May 14, 2006 6:27 PM

Is it a coincidence that after all these years people have decided you can catch germs from bibles? Or is it the local mo community?

(didn't know you could catch cancer like this or fall pregnant!!)

As noted before no one forces you to read a Gideon's bible in a hospital or a motel room.

There are about 200,000 muslims in Australia, about half that number of Jews. The rest would mainly have a Christian background although I am sure there are some Sihks and Buddhists etc, religiously tolerant people. (Don't have the figures.

Little by little,,inch by inch they wre getting things their way.

Posted by: Gramfan at May 15, 2006 2:49 AM

Guys,
there is a journalist at this paper called Andrew Bolt. The link to his columns is on the left side under "opinion".

He has a forum and writes a few coloumns a week.
His email addy is there also.
I have contributed, and emailed him.
He is the ONLY person here who has any sense!
I have noticed some posters from outside Australia. I know the muslim problem upsets him a lot. However I write to him to give him support.

Have a look and by all means email/ post on the forum. He deserves help with his almost solitary efforts!
Thank you.

Posted by: Gramfan at May 15, 2006 2:56 AM

www.heraldsun.news.com.au
sorry the lin didn't work in above post.

Posted by: Gramfan at May 15, 2006 2:58 AM

I find the constant building of new mosques which look totally out of place in the UK offensive. Why are they not pulled down? My friend who lives in australia finds the idea of the removal of bibles offensive - even though he is not a christian - so if this story is true how does he register his offense?

Wake up world.

Posted by: DaveMate at May 15, 2006 5:04 AM

Yet more on this:

http://www.cathnews.com/news/605/85.php

There's a direct quote relating to the claim about germs there:

In Brisbane, the Sunday Mail reports that the Royal Brisbane and Women's and Princess Alexandra hospitals are among the first to stop the Gideons testaments being left in patients' bedside tables.

Staff said the Bibles were no longer in keeping with the "multicultural approach to chaplaincy", while some claimed the Bibles were removed because they were a source of infection.

Hospital spokeswoman Tanya Lobegeier said: "If someone has a cold or anything and uses the Bible their germs could be passed on to the next person who reads it.

"No one wants to go in the drawer to clean a Bible after every single person leaves."

It's somewhat suspicious that sources are giving two different reasons. So what is it? Multiculturalism? Infection? Or both?

Dave - perhaps your mate in Australia could contact the Queensland Government, since the matter has been discussed there and commented on (largely denied) by the Deputy Premier of Queensland. (See here.)

Here are contact details for the Queensland Government:

http://www.qld.gov.au/contact_us/

Posted by: Yojimbo at May 15, 2006 6:18 AM

Bibles have been banned from hospital bedsides in the the UK as well. Crosses have also come under attack, in crematoriums for instance, as have other symbols such as Christmas lights and decorations. I think much of this is down to a general attack against Christianity by politically correct or Trotskyist local councillors (who of course hate all things Christian).
As to the Bible, and it being a largely Jewish book, I wonder if banning Bibles is an indirect - even unconscious - attack against the Jewish people. Hitler banned Bibles. Piles of them were burned on German streets.
If the Bible is such a frightening book, then it must contain some fundamental truth so shocking and overwhelming that it might well be worth a second glance and even a read between the lines. Don't let them stop you from reading it.

Sarah.

Posted by: Virgo at May 15, 2006 8:41 AM

When you stick a frog into boiling water it jumps out. When you stick it into a pot of cold water and set it on the range the frog is at first fine; but as the water slowly cooks, the frog will not jump out. The frog dies.

"Progressive" dhimmitude.

Posted by: DesertDawgN29 at May 18, 2006 1:23 PM