In Australia this year some of us are keen to ensure all the traditional Christmas decorations, including Nativity scenes are in place in our cities and malls. We are asking shopping center managers what their policy is.

If any Muslim complains, we will ask them to be TOLERANT OF OUR HISTORY, CUSTOMS AND RELIGION.

If you are in Pitt Street mall, do take in the lovely Nativity scene which has been erected.

Posted by: payingattention at November 12, 2006 12:41 AM

I can't wait until these idiots open a box destined for a Muslim country (why are they giving the enemy ANYTHING is another story) and find a TOY they deem offensive to the peaceful ones. It's astonishing that it hasn't happened yet (aside from "war related items" like action man??).

My suggestion is to send stuffed dogs and piggy banks to the kiddies-maybe one of the screeners will let it pass by mistake. Then we can get the story of horror as a kid finds these things in their shoebox.

On second thought, that might not be a good idea. It could spark "Shoebox Rage" and that poor screener will be subjected to sensitivity training.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 12, 2006 1:11 AM

This charity deal is nice, although I'd prefer it to be restriced to non-Muslim countries. Why should they get something out of Christmas? What do Muslims give Christians during Ramadan other than riots and death threats?

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 12, 2006 1:18 AM

I presume that the coloring books will not have any pictures of people or other living things. Pictures of people are especially verboten according to most dealers in Islamic opinion.

Posted by: Pelayo at November 12, 2006 1:43 AM

islam deserves the gift of death!
(which they crave anyways)

Aint that right Pooper?

"you would kill every member of my mosque"

YEP!

Posted by: Infidel_Dog at November 12, 2006 2:18 AM

Look at the bright side - at least they haven't (yet) substituted the nativity scenes with scenes of Jibreel on one of his many conversations with Mohammed. (I plead not guilty in advance to giving them ideas)

Looks like it will be a particularly cold Winterval this year, with Scrooge probably mocking the 3 ghosts, "Nya nyah nyah nyah nyah...."

Posted by: Infidel Pride at November 12, 2006 3:12 AM

Stories from the Bible, images of Jesus and any other Christian literature are expressly forbidden - in case Muslims are offended.
big damm deal if Muslims are offended by Bible, images of Jesus and any other Christian literature
Christian holiday you can ask Muslims to donate and label the box for Muslim county or is that to hard for you to grasp' Muslims are offended by every thing infidel and are very good t playing the victim they are encouraged to use Taqiyya which means deception in Arabic is the cornerstone of Muslim relations with Kafirs (non-Muslims). Muslims are encouraged to deceive Kafirs all along. The technique Taqiyya was consistently used in warfare by Muslims and it was this which gave them victory over non-Muslims in addition to their schizophrenic savagery

Islam the worlds biggest cult needing founded by a mad robber needing deprogrammers for 1 billon people

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by: islamakapigeaters at November 12, 2006 3:56 AM

Samaritans Purse and Operation Christmas Child took a terrible bashing from the "liberal" PC mafia 2/3 years ago over it's Christian outreach and the words of their American organisor Rev Franklin Graham. Sone of the famous Billy Graham. It looks like they have taken this criticism too much to heart.
As this is a US charity I doubt that their "dhimmi madness" is confined to the UK.

Posted by: Granny Weatherwax at November 12, 2006 4:06 AM

Hey, why not just ban Christianity in the UK? Obviously, that's what they want.

Posted by: EliasAlucard at November 12, 2006 5:24 AM

Chocolate and cake? What's wrong with those? Or is it foodstuffs generally (which would make sense).

Actually, I suspect this is something that makes most Muslims in the UK cringe. I doubt they'd give too hoots about what went into these boxes, just as most don't care about Christmas decorations which some councils don't want to be too Chriatian.

In this instance it's the idiotic PC Left at fault.

Posted by: Celsius at November 12, 2006 6:21 AM

The "charity" Operation Christmas Child seems to me to be a bit of a front, a "Christian" charity which bans references to Christianity?

Seems a little suspicious to me and needs looking into. Remember the Holy Land Foundation, designed to lead people to think it was a Christian charity? Same things going on with this I reckon.

Posted by: IceDragon at November 12, 2006 6:40 AM

I have noticed, on many occasions, a peculiar and hostile defensiveness from British posters when I post material about dhimmitude in Britain. I have even been accused of schadenfreude over Britain's cultural suicide, which charge is as offensive as it is false.

If British dhimmitude offends you, do something about it in Britain. No one wants to see Britain survive and flourish more than I do. But to point out US dhimmitude as if this is some kind of mitigating factor, or as if US dhimmitude and US cultural suicide have not been documented abundantly here, is simply out of focus.

Cordially
Robert Spencer

Posted by: jihadwatch at November 12, 2006 7:06 AM

http://www.samaritanspurse.uk.com/about/board.asp

Actually it makes sense - you are more likely to find youngsters in countries ravaged by war and famine where Muslims are predominant than elsewhere...............but quite why they expect Christmas gifts eludes me

Posted by: Voyager at November 12, 2006 7:11 AM

Hey, why not just ban Christianity in the UK? Obviously, that's what they want.

They aren't strong enough !

Posted by: Voyager at November 12, 2006 7:12 AM

I have noticed, on many occasions, a peculiar and hostile defensiveness from British posters when I post material about dhimmitude in Britain. I have even been accused of schadenfreude over Britain's cultural suicide, which charge is as offensive as it is false.

You are correct and it has much to do with strange extrapolations in US media from isolated cases, rather as European media deliberates distorts the United States such that I am reminded of Radio Moscow in the old days of Brezhnev.

The Media distorts and fabricates, but there is also a fear among some persons that were people to reflect on some of the motives they would not be very salutary. Great Britain has very many problems of which its Muslim population is but one, but so few Americans have ever visited areas outside London and The Cotswolds that it makes much comment very bemusing.

The simple fact is that since 1973 the Arabs have had a lot of cash to buy politicians in Europe and the United States; there is no doubt that these problems could have been exorcised in the 1970s had governments not made backroom deals with terrorists. Had Leila Khaled been executed in 1972 and had the US not flirted with various groups in the Middle East, we could have destroyed all these people in the 1950s by retaining MI6 operations in The Middle East and conducting assassinations.

The 1960s gave the ideological backing to Islamic thuggery

Posted by: Voyager at November 12, 2006 7:20 AM

Where is the dividing line? This is poorly thought out. Being a Christian is offensive. Going to church is offensive. Wearing a crucifix is offensive. If Moslem sensitivities take priority the non Moslem is being denied its alienable right to freedom of expression and to freedom of religion. The Moslems who demand this are hypocrites. All the symbols to be banned should be prominent so the Moslem can properly refuse the charitable gift consistent with Moslem conscience,sensibilities and its notion of hallal.

Posted by: David England at November 12, 2006 7:32 AM

We in the west respect the muslim ramadan holiday, which is in Oct. We respect Jewish, Buddist, Hindu, and all others, because one is allowed the freedom to practice their own religion. Come December, it is the celebration of the Christian Holiday of Christmas. Why would that celebration offend Muslims? MUSLIM INTOLERANCE TO OTHER PEOPLE'S FAITH OFFENDS ME TO THE CORE. I've heard about grade schools around Boston, MA that allow you to say anything in holiday celebration except Merry Christmas.
You have a few school board hacks who are projecting their hatred of Christmas on everyone else. Now I see it even more in P.C. UK
You Brits have always shown Balls in the past; don't let these weasils take your country away.

Posted by: juicealot at November 12, 2006 7:51 AM

This Christmas many Christians are sending Christian Christmas cards to the ACLU. Please join us in sending a card with a Christian verse and theme, the words Merry Christmas,etc.

ACLU
125 Broad Street, 18th Floor
New York, NY
10004

Thanks, pvb

Posted by: pvb at November 12, 2006 8:33 AM

Mr Spencer, you are right to point out that the ire of disgruntled British posters should be pointed in the right direction.

If you don't like the fact that your culture is being undermined, then get out and do something about it. It's not Robert Spencer's fault, it's yours. Thank God we have somewhere like this site where these absurdities can be pointed out to us.

I myself am joining a Church because I think that if I boost the numbers of an organisation that will defend my values en masse, the my voice will have a greater chance of being heard.

I would like to see the introduction of a National Islam, which negates Jihad, or a programme of optional conversion - or at least creating a climate where it is safe for British Muslims to convert. I shall be writing to my prospective Tory MP, I shall be writing to David Davis. Because first of all we have to get this Labour governemt, which is a slave to Political Correctness out of power.

Here is another thing you could do: identify the BBC as a proponent of the Political Correctness loonacy. Campaign against it. Write to your MP - no more TV Tax. Take more direct action, stop paying it. Don't buy the idiotic newspapers (that is about all of them). Take action.

Point your friends to this site, get people aware. Let other people know that it is not racist to criticise Islam, and in fact, Islam should be criticised. We should do this now with one big voice before IngSoc (Labour) stop us from doing it at all.

Take action - don't bleat and moan.

Posted by: FREE LEE at November 12, 2006 9:05 AM

Voyager, it's not our fault then, it's the US media?

Well, gosh, I hope that start to report on Cricket and Morris Dancing so that the nasty Jihadists and the Dhimmitude will go away, don't you?

Posted by: FREE LEE at November 12, 2006 9:09 AM

I'll bet it would be hard to find an offended poverty stricken starving child anywhere in the world if he was given chocolate and cake. As far as anything else, it would be the parents that are offended. And they're offended as soon as they wake in the morning.

Posted by: freewoman at November 12, 2006 9:37 AM

It's Sunday, so forgive me for going biblical here, but there is an injunction in Christianity to treat our enemies well: "On the contrary: 'If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head.'" Romans 12:20

The hungry and thirsty for whom these packages are intended, assuming they are earmarked for Muslim countries, are the disposessed noncombatants within those countries.

Don't worry, this doesn't constitute a biblical mandate for pacifism!

Posted by: Clive at November 12, 2006 9:59 AM

" "If a box was opened by a Muslim child in a Muslim country they may be offended so we try to avoid religious images." "

Hmm. Well, how do they feel about cartoons?

Prophet Geoff

Posted by: Geoff at November 12, 2006 10:14 AM

"The charity has also banned war-related items such as Action Man-type figures, as well as chocolate and cake."

I guess the giftbox will be completely empty.

Posted by: DrWolffenstein at November 12, 2006 10:33 AM

Sorry, I think it makes sense to not send 'Christian' stuff to children in Moslem countries. If I was at a community function and toys were given out to the kids - I wouldn't want any kinds of mine to get Moslem toys.

What I find disturbing is the ban on chocolate. That is sick.

Posted by: poetcomic1 at November 12, 2006 11:12 AM

When I was in school many, many, many, years ago we were still collecting packages for children in Europe and the Far East. In 1952 the Korean war was still going on. We were not allowed to send food because it would spoil, and military toys were prohibited for obvious reasons. Don't get you shorts in a wad; prohibitions against certain things is not new.

I certainly would not disguise evangilism as charity.

Posted by: Pelayo at November 12, 2006 11:40 AM

I myself am joining a Church

What a strange comment from Free Lee..............any church in particular or just one that needs an extra hanger-on ?

would like to see the introduction of a National Islam

sounds like you should join a mosque then and learn Arabic so you can get an even more Arab Islam.

It is clear that you have zero understanding of Christianity or Islam to make such bizarre statements. There is no "National" Christianity or Judaism either..............

Posted by: Voyager at November 12, 2006 12:54 PM

Fearful of offending Muslims with the wrong kind of gift? The solution is too obvious and simple.

Send them NOTHING.

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at November 12, 2006 1:02 PM

When a country starts to ban christian things it is no longer christian. A country that is no longer Christian , becomes just another cesspool.

Posted by: callmeinfidel at November 12, 2006 2:41 PM

They say "Nature abhors a vacuum", and the gaping hole left by this bizarre and (to me) imponderable lack of self esteem on the part of Westerners for our legendary and completely true GREATNESS is allowing the filth strewn mediocrity of Islam and mindless leftism to fill the void.

Where are the champions of our magnificent heritage? Where are the intellectuals? Where are the true liberals -- the ones who appreciate both everything we have accomplished in our long trudge from the ditch, the ones who recognize how much further we have to go, and who understand that self loathing and cringing efacement are NOT the way to move forward?

Islam creates grotesque deformations in the human heart and mind -- it quashes that which is good in mankind, and caters to the most heinous aspects of our nature.

Surely anyone can observe the deadly effects of this Arab-centric cultural eating machine -- Islam defoliates and lays waste all societies which allow its infection to go unchecked and unchallenged.

It MUST GO.

Posted by: jsla at November 12, 2006 2:49 PM

By saying that Muslims may be offended by Christianity, they are also saying that Muslims are religiously intolerant, which makes them Islamophobes, bigots, racists etc.

Posted by: Jesus Christ Supercop at November 12, 2006 4:25 PM

It's Christmas.

Posted by: Carolyn2 at November 12, 2006 4:27 PM

Dear Mr Spencer

I for one am mightily grateful that you spend so much time and effort, exposing dhimmitude in Britain, partcularly in the ranks of the authorities. I have never thanked you and I do so now. I'm also very grateful to Charles Johnson for doing 'Britain has a Big problem' posts and have thanked him for them. They are invaluable in exposing the ongoing islamification of Britain. However it really needs pointing out, that most of the stories that are on LGF and JW/DW, are garnered from mainline British press such as the Daily Mail, Express, or The Times. These papers have been consistent in exposing the dhimmification of Britain. Hardly a day goes by without such ittems in the British press. What is striking though, and should be a matter of concern to all of us, is that major newspapers in the US, are far more reticent in publishing such items of dhimmification in the US.

Please continue Mr Spencer in your expose, the more the better, as this is one way that people will be informed of the true nature of Islam, and what it means for Britain and the West.

---------------------------------
News update via LGF.

Franklin Graham, president and CEO of Samaritan’s Purse, responds to the UK branch’s apparently unilateral decision to hide their Christian origins.

Recently, a media story from London reported that the Operation Christmas Child organization in the UK was removing Christian or Christmas-themed materials it collects for distribution to needy children around the world. Such a practice is inconsistent with the global mission, policies, and practices of Operation Christmas Child and Samaritan’s Purse, the international Christian relief organization which has conducted the annual Christmas project for the past 13 years.

Franklin Graham, president and CEO of Samaritan’s Purse, immediately reiterated to staff around the world that “Samaritan’s Purse is unashamedly a Christian organization and Operation Christmas Child is a distinctively Christian kid’s project. This project is not merely a Christmas gift distribution project—every shoe box gift is given in the name of Jesus Christ in order that children around the world might know the true meaning of Christmas.”

Since its beginning in 1993, Operation Christmas Child has collected and distributed more than 46 million shoe box gifts to underprivileged children in some 130 countries. The project requires the help of approximately 150,000 volunteers working in several thousand collection and processing centers in 11 sending countries.

Samaritan’s Purse is working closely with its offices around the world to ensure consistency of practices and implementation of this and all projects it conducts. While certain governments and customs present challenges to this project, Samaritan’s Purse has always provided unconditional aid in concert with its Christian message and purpose. We work in cooperation with local churches and organizations to distribute the shoe box gifts—an estimated 8 million this Christmas—and offer gospel literature to recipient children. This practice will never cease.

Thanks to CJ at LGF.

Clearly something has gone wrong in the message system.

Operation Christmas Child and Samaritan's Purse is doing a great job in difficult circumstances - bringing the message of Jesus to all, including Muslims. As long as the life giving message of Jesus gets through, that is all that matters.

Posted by: DP111 at November 12, 2006 6:36 PM

charity Samaritan's Purse need to close its doors.

Posted by: KAOSKTRL at November 12, 2006 10:22 PM

Thats Franklin Grahams outfit. What an ass

Posted by: KAOSKTRL at November 12, 2006 10:24 PM

KAOSKTRAL,

Amen!

When a charity forgets why it is doing what it does and Who it honors, it no longer needs to be around. Amazing that we are all so afraid of offending an ideology that looks forward to our painful death or enslavement but we have no problem habitually offending the true God Who wants to set us free.

Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at November 12, 2006 10:46 PM

"Everyone therefore who confesses me before men, him I will also confess before my Father who is in heaven.

"But whoever denies me before men, him I will also deny before my Father who is in heaven."

Matthew 10:32-33

Posted by: Provoslavni at November 12, 2006 11:46 PM

Wow, these people are stupid.

Posted by: TheVoiceofTruth at November 13, 2006 1:28 AM

Operation Christmas Child and Samaritan's Purse are well-known. They have brochures in public places everywhere this time of year. When I first heard of them I thought it was kind of a nice idea. Then I discovered (smaller print) that they are an evangelical Christian organization and that much of their so-called development work in Third World countries is proselytizing. Fair enough I guess, but I don't support development or aid organizations that spend their energies on teaching religion, no matter what that religion may be. I did assume from this, however, that all the children who would be getting these Christmas packages would be from Christian families. Why on earth would you be asking people to send "Christmas Packages" to children who don't even celebrate packages? No wonder people were confused. They should just be called "Care Packages" or "Gift Packages", and donors told that these packages are going to children of all faiths, and to follow the guidelines so they don't offend anyone, like it or lump it.

For my part, I have no objection to giving gifts to Muslim children, and respecting the religious traditions of their families when I do. There's an American organization (creatively called "Afghans for Afghans") that solicits and sends donations of hand-knit and crochet items to families and children in Afghanistan, where the winters can be brutally cold. Their donation guidelines include asking donors not to send items with representations of people or animals (which are disapproved of traditionally in Islam, and also in Orthodox Judaism), or any religious or national symbols. There's a group in my hometown that makes and sends kites for children in Afghanistan and Iraq, which follows that same guidelines. I don't think it's so unreasonable. Think about it; if you were a poor Christian child in Europe or North America, how would you feel about receiving a book of Muslim prayer, or a sweater emblazoned with Muslim symbols or national symbols of the donor's country, in an overseas care package (or more to the point, how would your parents feel?)

"Though I speak in tongues of men and angels..."

Charity is about trying to give those who are most in need what they need, without making demands on them or setting absurd conditions. That goes double for children. Children remember acts of kindness by strangers. A gift given in unconditional love to a child in desperate need can help that child grow in love for all humankind, and away from any hateful ideologies he or she may be poisoned with, now or in the future. Maybe it won't, but in charity there are no guarantees. A Christian child my donation helps to innoculate may grow up to become a terrorist too. Should that stop me from giving to save his life now? I don't think so.

Of course the wholesale Muslim-haters on this board would not agree with that, but I'm not writing this for them. They're beyond reason.

Posted by: angloirishslav at November 13, 2006 2:30 AM

This dhimmitude madness has gone on too far.

I, of course, would never try to defaim such a great religion of "peace" and gentleness. I would never think of speaking an ill word about Muhammad or the Koran or Islam lest I recieve one or more fatwas directed at me or my family.

So lest a foul thought enter my mind that doesn't agree with the most radical form of Islamofascist terrorist propaganda, I had better leave any critique about anything whatsoever to do with Islam alone. I now return to my full dhimmi self.

Any more questions?

Posted by: 777denny at November 13, 2006 2:55 AM

Angloirishslav -
:-)

Posted by: Granny Weatherwax at November 13, 2006 3:14 AM

Angloirishslav:

Touching. Uplifting. My eyes are tearing. What you have forgotten, however, is that to a Muslim -- even a child, quickly corrected by its elders if it shows gratitude -- every "gift" from a kafir is not kindness but jizya.

Posted by: Marwan'sDaughter at November 13, 2006 4:14 AM

angloirishslav posted: Of course the wholesale Muslim-haters on this board would not agree with that, but I'm not writing this for them. They're beyond reason.

Have you ever wondered why people on this site hate Islam and its tenets, (BTW, J and D Watchers do not hate Muslims but the tenets of Islam that would enslave all).

Before you start castigating all and sundry as beyond reason, I would suggest you acquire a passing acquiantance with Islam and its history, and the calamitous effect it has had on those nations it has conquered.

Posted by: DP111 at November 13, 2006 6:21 AM

Each of us, in our own little way, can make a difference. I plan to greet every friend and neighbour, every clerk in every shop, and maybe even perfect strangers, with a hearty "Merry Christmas !" this year. No more Happy Holidays, no more Season's Greetings, no more Holiday Trees ! Our political correctness will be the death of us.

Posted by: ImNoDhimmi at November 13, 2006 8:49 AM

ImNoDhimmi,

Merry Christmas to you, my friend! I made the same determination myself last year and as I was out running around on Christmas Eve doing last minute errands, everyone I greeted with "Merry Christmas" greeted me back in kind, and there was a real connection made that day with my fellow man. I could feel their goodwill and wish for my happiness, and they could feel mine for them. It was very moving and I won't ever forget it.

And as DP111 said above, we do not hate Muslims. In fact, this past year as I've prepared to fight for my country's protection and for my beliefs and traditions I've really come to understand how tragic the belief in Islam is, not just for those of us who are threatened by it's oppression but by those poor souls who live in it's slavery everyday. Imagine, with our mistake prone humanity, if someone's daughter came home pregnant and instead of crying your eyes out at the situtation and seeking to comfort and counsel her, you had to plan her murder for the reinstatement of the family's honor. Instead of getting her some medical care you had to decide which one of your sons were going to do the deed or whether you and her sisters were going to hold here down while it was done, or whether you'd plan it for when she was coming around the corner on some quiet street downtown. The differences in what family means to Muslims, (even as they spread the taqqiyah that family is everything,) and most of the rest of us, who value the safe haven, protection, support and love that we create in out families, no matter how flawed they may be, needs to be considered very carefully. Because not standing up and fighting against Islam is a betrayal of our own families. We cannot afford to let that belief system invade our culture and become the norm, precisely because it is so destructive to Muslims around the world and because we don't want it happening to us. It has nothing to do with hatred; it has everything to do with self preservation and the common good. If it looks like there is hatred though you'll have to excuse us. People get a little pissy when their civilization is being threatened with annihilation.

The next time someone tells you in their best I-heard-it-on-TV-so-it-must-be-true version of "Islam is a religion of peace", ask them how they feel about parents marrying their teenaged daughters off to 60 year old men. Ask them how they feel about honor killing of a daughter because her brothers didn't like some guy she was dating. Ask them how they would feel if their husband of, say, ten or fifteen years decided to bring another "wife" into their home and she had absolutely no say about it. We need to take what we learn here and disseminate it. The people you tell may say you're nuts, they may have a little short circuit meltdown at the thought that they may have to do something about it, but it will plant the seed. And when they start to see more and more evidence of this, and we continue to send them articles that back up our claims, they will not be able to deny it and they will be forced to take a stand, either for their own dhimmi-ization or for the side that stands up against tyranny.

Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at November 13, 2006 9:47 AM

I would make a suggestion to this and all christian charities:

The world is filled with places that want and need christian charity. Give to those places first. Muslim places are not the only places which have need. Take care of Africa, South America, Asia first... then worry about the pan-Islamic world.

In other words - put the limited Christian charitable resources to best use where these resources might be appreciated most.

Posted by: A_Plague_on_Both_Houses at November 13, 2006 9:57 AM

Hi,

Our church participates in Operation Christmas Child and has for years. The Bible says to go and make disciples of every nation, and that is what OCC is trying to do. When the boxes are delivered, someone speaks to the children in their own language, telling them about the love of Christ. The children also receive a booklet in their own language, again, telling them about Christ. Many people who pack boxes also pray over them and pray for the children who will receive them, and for their families.

The point of all this is to try to rescue these children from a life of not knowing Christ. With all the indoctrination most Muslim children receive against Christians, having someone go and show them love helps to counter that.

Chocolate is banned because it melts in many of the countries the boxes are delivered to. It woudn't be much fun to find in your box a stuffed bear covered in melted Hershey bar!

Please do a little investigating before condemning an entire mission project. The point of these watches is to be informed, to receive a viewpoint different from what is fed to us in the national media. That doesn't mean we don't have to think about what we receive from this site and weigh it against what we know to be Truth: God's Word.

Posted by: 20knotgirl at November 13, 2006 9:59 AM

While this issue is of some concern to me the comments here reveal a significant level of misunderstanding of what lies behind it; I feel I must say a few things on behalf of this charity.

First, Samaritan's Purse is not an Islamist front organization, nor does it bow to pressure to "water down" it's message. It is a Christian organization whose work is done *in the name of Christ*; this is not hidden or disguised at all. Some on this site may not like this aspect of Samaritan's Purse, but it is worth noting, because such an organization cannot be construed as sitting in the Islamists' laps.

The CEO and chair of the board is Franklin Graham, son of Billy Graham and himself a major Christian evangelist. Franklin was recently in our town for a 4 day "Festival" -- his equivalent of his father's "Billy Graham Crusades" -- in a stadium here.

Wherever he goes he is dogged by Islamists who make wild accusations that he is an Islamophobe because of his repeated public comments about the Islamist agenda and elements in the Islamic faith he describes as "evil" (though, like the pope, he also says that there are many good things to be found in Islam, and professes respect for many Islamic people.. His message here was uncompromising, and he faced down the accusations of the Islamists in his radio and newspaper interviews without flinching.

(If anyone is interested, I understand that over 1000 people made decisions to follow Christ...)

Charities like Samaritan's Purse do not distinguish among the needy according to race or creed. They go to the poorest of the poor and provide them with the necessities of life.

It may help to know where the name comes from: The Parable of the Good Samaritan. In this parable of Jesus, the "Good Samaritan" is the fellow who comes to the rescue of a hapless travellor waylaid by bandits, after some nice religious people had passed by and left him to his fate.

That the hero of the story is a Samaritan is critical; the Samaritans were the religious "other" to his audience. Samaritans were regarded by the Jews of the day as infidels, worse than unbelievers, and to be shunned at all cost. The thrust of the story is that loving one's neighbor -- particularly relief to the needy -- must transcent lines of religion and creed; it will, and should, violate our social norms.

Samaritan's Purse has this name for an obvious reason -- they embrace the principle endorsed by Jesus in this parable. So assistance is provided to those in need regardless of their background or affiliation.

Now consider the consequences of this principle in practical, 21st centuray terms. Many, perhaps most, of the people in direst need live in countries that are either majority muslim or ruled by nominally Islamic governments. Many of these countries are either closed to evangelical organizations or heavily persecute evangelicals or anyone seen to be associating or collaborating with them.

What are the options to an evangelical group like Samaritan's Purse?

(1) Forget these destitute people ... they are beyond our reach.

For various reasons this is not an option (I'm trying to avoid getting theological here...)

(2) Collect the money and relief resources, and hand it over to the government agencies there to distribute.

Yeah, right. This is actually done in some places by some charities...the results are mixed, but I think it is established to be not the wisest route.

(3) Clandestine distribution of goods behind the government's back, or in defiance of the government's orders.

Sometimes this is the only option. But it can place the workers, and those being helped, in serious jeopardy. Acting in good faith to the governments is a much better route, even when it is tyrants with whom one is cooperating -- the goal is to help the needy, not to accomplish strategic political or religious goals.

(4) Find a way to work through, or even with, the government and system of the country, to get help to the destitute.

For the most part, the fourth option is chosen, although there are christian agencies who opt for (3), particularly in countries that are completely closed to outside christian workers. There is a long list of missionaries who have lost their lives trying this sort of thing.

Some of you might be saying, "wait a minute, these are evangelical organizations -- aren't they just preaching the gospel and using relief as an excuse to get in?" I don't know if this should be dignified with a response -- it is a famous tu quoque argument of islamists when they are criticized for trying to "Islamize" the west. The short answer is NO. Indeed these organizations do exist to spread the gospel, but with a few exceptions, providing the needy with the basics of life in the name of Christ *embodies* the gospel. They say one cannot hear the gospel when it is drowned out by one's stomach. Some preach the gospel by their words; others by their lives. It is all evangelism.

In order to gain legitimacy to distribute food and emergency items in such countries, most major christian relief agencies have policies against their staff overtly proselytizing in countries that forbid this. I know World Vision has such a policy, and I believe Samaritan's Purse does too. Further, true christian charity does not hinge upon one's acceptance of the gospel. Nor is it used as a vehicle for something else, such as proselytization. Ideally a christian charity should come into a village of destitute people, leave these people with their needs met, and without any other changes to them except that they will have now experienced the life-changing power of the gospel in action. Generally speaking, many people reached by these programs eventually decide to become christians. But not because of door-knocking, preaching or pressure tactics.

There is some controversy over to what extent one must strip all "Christian content" from one's giving to the needy in such countries. This story appears to indicate that some within Samaritan's Purse have gone to an extreme in this regard -- farther than I am personally comfortable with. But I seriously doubt that this is because they feel intimidated by the islamists; it is because they are very serious about coming to serve the needy without a religious agenda onboard.

If only our Islamist friends had the same approach in North America. Be careful what you are asking for, if you think that Christian Groups should carpet-bomb Islamic countries with religious propaganda. It cuts both ways, except some Islamist groups have a much broader notion of what ...ahem... "propaganda" ... might include in attempts to islamize the west.

It is of some educational value to compare Islamic and Christian (and Jewish/ Buddhist etc.) charities. Check out Samaritan's Purse at Charity Navigator,

http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=4423

where you'll see it has a 4 star rating. Also look up your favourite charities and see how they compare. Another rating organization pays more attention to compliance to certain standards that guarantee that organizations like this do not engage in clandestine activities or deceive their donors as to how money is beiing used. At Give.org

http://charityreports.give.org/Public/Report.aspx?CharityID=281

you'll see that Samaritan's Purse complies with 8 of the 20 "Standards for Charity Accountability". But only 3 of these are shown not to be met; 8 of the standards are not evaluated for lack of information, and one is not effective. Still, this is enough information to suggest that, although it is a 4-star charity, the organization has a ways to go to full accountability and transparency.

Compare World Vision, that also has a 4-star rating and meets all 20 of the Standards at Givel.org.

Interestingly, there is only one obviously Islamic Charity rated at Give.Org, "Islamic Relief", which comes off about the same as Samaritan's Purse, although nowhere near most of the Christian and Jewish Charities: It is does not meet 5 of the standards, but in terms of available data, it does meet 12 of them.

I wonder how CAIR would fare?

Islamic Relief is also a 4-star charity at Charity Navigator. There are a few other organizations rated there that may be islamic in nature: I've been able to identify only about 20 (there are hundreds of Jewish and Christian agencies rated at both sites; I think most Islamic charities are reluctant to divulge the information needed for these ratings). Most of these are ranked low. The radical islamist organization MAS, for example, rates only two stars.

Interestingly, MEF, run by Daniel Pipes, appears in my search, and he ranks only ONE star (C'mon David ... it's all about accountability...)! But remember, the star rating is about how efficiently the money raised is used in actually carrying out the mission of the organization; the Give.org benchmarks are more about accountability and transparency.

It has occurred to me that we should be encouraging Islamic agencies to meet the accountability standards. I, for one, would vote for CAIR and CAIR-CAN opening their books for public scrutiny. And muslims should be encouraged to shun agencies that refuse to be accountable in this way. It is a first step...

Posted by: Archimedes2 at November 13, 2006 2:31 PM

American,

Saw, did, whatever. We know where you are coming from, girlfriend.

One wonders what takes place to remove the humanity chip from Muslims. We know that it is a Muslim trait to kill a female family member who has dishonored the family. That is not a Buddist or Catholic trait. We know that Mohammad advocated severing of hands and feet as a punishment for certain crimes. Again, not okay in other religions. He said it wasn't okay to have sex with married women unless they were captives, which I guess means its okay to have sex with married women? Jesus was anti-sex outside of marriage for ANY reason. So how come we westerners got the humanity chip and the Muslims didn't? Could it be that many US and European westerners were brought up under the Christian religion that says you're not allowed to do nasty things to other people and if you do there will be consequences, so we have a little bit of self restraint going for us, even if we blow through it and end up doing something that isn't very nice sometimes? And we end up doing that in spite of what our religion teaches. (And this goes for present Atheists and Agnostics too because many of them were brought up in the Christian religion and some of it stuck.)

But the Muslims do it as a requirement of their religion. It is no different than the ancient Aztecs or Maobites or any other religion that sacrifices human beings to it's god(s). The only difference between those religions and Islam is that they did it in a big ceremony on an altar. In Islam, any lightpost, checkpoint or open air market will do.

Islam: lite on ceremony so consequently, easy on the pocketbook. One question though? What DO they do with all that blood and all those bodies?

Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at November 13, 2006 5:07 PM

Why would a Moslem expect a Christmas gift?

Posted by: MP at November 13, 2006 5:09 PM

I don't know if anyone else has mentioned this but the booklet that comes with the shoebox says not to put in anything of a religious, political or racist nature in order for the gift to get past the customs inspection of the destination country. The booklet goes on to say that a simple tract of the Christmas story or something similar will be placed in it just before the gift is given, thereby circumventing over-zealous customs agents but still delivering a gift with a real message of love. My family and I have filled a shoebox each Christmas for the last three years and the effect on my young children has been profound as they realise the good life they enjoy is unknown to children living in poverty in various parts of the developing world. Please don't let this story put you off donating. We have heard some really beautiful first hand accounts of the joy of these little ones on receiving their gifts. Love is not part of Islam but if we let ourselves hate in return and our hearts are hardened towards children, we have become like them.

Posted by: toothy at November 13, 2006 6:29 PM

Archimedes2/

"First, Samaritan's Purse is not an Islamist front organization, nor does it bow to pressure to "water down" it's message. It is a Christian organization whose work is done *in the name of Christ*; this is not hidden or disguised at all. Some on this site may not like this aspect of Samaritan's Purse, but it is worth noting, because such an organization cannot be construed as sitting in the Islamists' laps."

Would you like to try checking up on the published accounts of this 'charity' then do the maths. Then, if you feel able, check up on how they get things into islamic countries. Then check up on the distribution system.

And no, I don't mean the sanitised versions, the pap, put out by the 'charity' itself, I mean in the real world.

Far too many so-called Christian charities are deeply offensive to real Christians because of their underhand practises, their open collusions with the barbaric islamic horde and their lack of accountability (and accounts!).

Dominic.

Posted by: necessitasnonhabetlegem at November 13, 2006 9:56 PM

Far too many so-called Christian charities are deeply offensive to real Christians
~ posted above

New Galatians 5:14
For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: "You shall love your neighbor* as yourself."

* = does not apply to Muslims, Gays, Minorities or anyone of your particular preference.

“Real” Christians indeed.

Posted by: Bar at November 14, 2006 12:25 PM

"New Galatians 5:14
For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: "You shall love your neighbor* as yourself."

* = does not apply to Muslims, Gays, Minorities or anyone of your particular preference.

“Real” Christians indeed.

Posted by: Bar"

Jesus told the parable of the Good Samaritan as a response to the demand from a religious leader (in the context of the above command) to "define 'neighbour.'"

Your neighbour is anyone in need.

Jesus did not say anything about making exceptions to this rule based on race, religion, gender, sexual preference, fashion sense, or any other, lesser concerns.

Posted by: angloirishslav at November 14, 2006 11:59 PM

Bar thats not true usually I am the one to prevent my secular nonreligious friends from beating gay protesters here at U of T. And Im a Christian. I dont see Christians killing gays and demanding them convert but I see alot of Islamists doing that. Are there like even any gay people AT ALL in the middle east (I mean living ones).

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 17, 2006 12:12 PM

Christian charities give the MOST yearly to people around the world who need it yes to nonchristians too, look it the Joyce Meyer and James Robison ministries they have dug thousands of wells in africa. I dont see "secular humanists and gays r us" doing that? Why is that? No but those groups will collect millions for aids research. As for loving your neighbour as your self. I read the original Greek there are many loves in Greek language and that one AGAPE means LOVE holy and truthful (ie telling people the truth). Does my eye offend your fist? That I tell you a truth about homosexuality?
Besides Christians dont want to force homosexuals to be banned they just dont want them in their churches. homosexuality according to the American Psychological Association was a mental disease until scientists from that group VOTED it out. I didnt know you could come to a scientific truth by VOTING on it! As for it being a genetic defect well so is downssyndrome but I dont see anyone saying thats fine? Anyway this isnt a middle eastern country where they would NOT let gay people live in peace (Rosie and Elton youd be dead in Arabia and you know), so before you pour on the hate speech against religions that dont accept homosexuality as a normal sexual expression (relgions like Chrisitianity, Judaism, Sikhism etc) think about the lovely alternative you have in ISLAM. Im sure the Islamic fundamentalists are sooooo much more understanding than those pesky christian fundamentalists!

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 17, 2006 12:20 PM

http://www.narth.com/index.html

A bunch of scientists are fighting for the right to give therapy to homosexuals who WANT to become straight (nooo nobody is forcing them they are bugging psychologists who dont want to treat them for fear of uspsetting the PC polics so some other psychologists and psychiatrists who want to help those who want to change formed the above group).
NOBODY is telling gays to change in the group okay?
Please dont accuse me as they accuse Robert Spencer of "Black Zionist Arts"

---
anyway enough of that: gays, secular, Christians whatever you must all realize if ISLAM takes over its ALL a moot point. Gay people kiss San Fransisco goodbye: a series of giant mosques will replace all the gay clubs.
Christians kiss freedom of religion goodbye (how dare you pray to Jesus)
Atheists kiss your asses goodbye (how dare you dont submit to ALLAH)
jews --jews well I dont even want to tell you what they have planned for YOU my kosher loving friends.
hindus,buddists etc you are worth 1/8 th of an Arab muslim in Shaira laws eyes (or whatever the fraction is) welcome to slavery forever.
Americans, Europeans etc kiss your democracy goodbye.

Is this what we want? Instead of going at our myriad of differences we all need to realize its a moot point if violent jihad takes over in the free world.

Heres a blast from the past:

Nonsense. Islam provides a guide to humanity in everything that they do. We are shown, by God we believe, through Islam what is right and what is wrong and we act according to the guidance. When people, knowingly or unknowingly, act against the guidance of Islam is when injustice and tyranny become widespread.
Posted by: Shukri [TypeKey Profile Page] at April 11, 2005 10:20 AM

My dear Shukri,

Please explain the difference between "a totalitarian ideology that aims to control the religious, social and political life of mankind in all its aspects" and "a guide to humanity in everything that they do."

Please also explain why "injustice and tyranny" are so widespread in places where Islamic law is followed most scrupulously, e.g. Saudi Arabia and Iran.

Cordially,
Robert Spencer
Posted by: jihadwatch [TypeKey Profile Page] at April 11, 2005 11:00 AM

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/005695.php

Posted by: THE ALLIES SHALL WIN at November 17, 2006 12:31 PM