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Hopefully the first of many steps, which should deal with more substantive matters of Islamic teaching, rather than appearances. "Britain takes step toward regulating mosques and imams," by Jane Perlez for the International Herald Tribune:
LONDON: The British government on Thursday took a first step toward regulating Muslim religious leaders and mosques, declaring that imams working in government prisons and hospitals would be required to meet certain criteria, including a good grasp of English.
In addition, the minister of local government and communities, Ruth Kelly, said the government planned to offer financial benefits to mosques that registered as charities and showed themselves willing to take an anti-radical stand.
How do they aim to enforce that?
Speaking at a mosque known as the Muslim Cultural Heritage Center, in Ladbroke Grove, a relatively affluent area of west London, Kelly appeared to take the matter of regulation of Muslim religions affairs into government hands, despite sensitivities in Britain about official interference in religion.
Kelly is leading the Blair government's efforts to win over disaffected Muslims, as Britain struggles to counter radical jihadist ideologies that have taken hold among some Muslim youth.
More than 1.6 million Muslims live in Britain. Since the deadly July 2005 attacks on the London transit system by four suicide bombers of Pakistani origin, the government has tried to supplement its stepped-up security expenditures with softer approaches.
Government-appointed committees with Muslim members were charged with creating programs, but have had limited success.
A national advisory board, led by a Muslim member of the House of Lords, Nazir Ahmed, was asked last year to come up with guidelines for the operation of mosques and the education of their leaders, but has yet to do so.
"There are too few homegrown imams," Kelly said, "and some key institutions - like mosques - need strengthening."
Kelly said she was determined to "isolate and push out a tiny minority who spread hatred and intolerance." The government would do this, she said, by emphasizing the need for Muslim immigrants to be British as well as Muslim.
As an example of government support for moderate Muslims, Kelly said the Bradford Council of Mosques in West Yorkshire was distributing material on the meaning of British citizenship to madrasas, where children are given after-school religious instruction.
"At the heart of this teaching is a message about being proud to be British, proud to be Muslim, about how to live out the values of justice, peace and respect both as a person of faith and as a citizen," she said.
On the question of setting criteria for Muslim religious leaders who work in government institutions, Kelly said her department would start giving them "leadership and communication skills," meaning English language training, according to a department spokesman.
A number of imams in Britain were born in Pakistan, speak limited English and preach in Urdu, making it difficult for the government to know what is going on in some mosques and the prisons.
In order for Muslim preachers to be employed in government hospitals, colleges and prisons, they would have to meet this "framework of standards," she said.
A number of moderate mosques and imams signed an open letter organized by the government in support of Kelly's program. But the Muslim Council of Britain, the best known of several national Muslim groups, declined to sign an open letter organized by Kelly that called for the importance of rebutting the extremist arguments.
"To say to us you're not playing your role can be very demoralizing," said Ibrahim Mogra, chairman of the council's interfaith relations committee.
Posted by Marisol at April 6, 2007 5:16 PM
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Oh another sign up to receive your cut of the jizyah pie program. Im interested in the I dont like the cut of your jib get out program.
Posted by: KAOSKTRL![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/nav-commenters.gif)
at April 6, 2007 5:29 PM
at April 6, 2007 5:49 PM
"To say to us you're not playing your role can be very demoralizing," said Ibrahim Mogra, chairman of the council's interfaith relations committee.
Buck up, lil' Ibbie! Just follow the program and you can have your self-esteem right back.
Posted by: Concerned Citizen at April 6, 2007 5:50 PM
Here's the skinny:
But the Muslim Council of Britain, the best known of several national Muslim groups, declined to sign an open letter organized by Kelly that called for the importance of rebutting the extremist arguments.
Posted by: Ynkedoodl2 at April 6, 2007 5:51 PM
I'm sooo sick of this 'minority' -BS, why hasn't anyone ever come out and questioned this cheap propaganda? We are dealing with mainstream Islam here:
Here is what's happening in Holland:
Posted by: sheik yer'mami at April 6, 2007 6:35 PM
"The British government on Thursday took a first step toward regulating Muslim religious leaders and mosques".
You only fully take a step when your foot hits the floor. This Government is masterly at appearing to take a step, then keeping its foot hovering in mid-air indefinitely.
After 7/7, Tony Blair made noisy public declarations about the rules having changed. Hate preachers would be expelled, Jihad-supporting organisations banned.
Nearly two years on, and - surprise, surprise - not one hate preacher has been kicked out (Omar Bakri ran away of his own accord) and not one extremist group has been banned.
Perhaps the Iran hostages debacle will finally prove to American JW regulars that Tony Blair is not the great heroic ally that some in the States believe him to be - strip away the tough posturing and the phoney rhetoric and all you have is a weak and appeasing little man obsessed with his own image and career.
at April 6, 2007 7:21 PM
I have personally met Ruth kelly. She is a very shy woman off camera and comes across as a reserved intellectual.
Speaking at a mosque known at the Muslim Cultural Heritage Center, in Ladbroke Grove, a relatively affluent area of west London.
That centre is my local Mosque. Proof that I am a moderate Muslim haha
Posted by: Abdullah at April 6, 2007 7:26 PM
Quod erat demonstrandum.
Posted by: MarisolJW at April 6, 2007 7:29 PM
the minister of local government and communities
Before the stallion has even left the starting gate, certain defeat.
The minister of local government and communities. Whatever.
Posted by: Alarmed Pig Farmer at April 6, 2007 7:39 PM
Abdullah writes:
"That centre is my local Mosque. Proof that I am a moderate Muslim haha"
Proof that there ain't no such thing as a moderate
Muslim. All Mohammadans, starting from the pedophile
pirate with his sock puppet Allah, are backstabbing
vermin who should be driven out of civilized countries back to the crapistans they come from.
Still, it's a baby step in the right direction.
Posted by: root_cause at April 6, 2007 9:10 PM
OT
we have the "delightful" Yvonne Ridley here for a muslim conference which just happens to coincide with Easter.
This is becoming intolerable.
We all know why we don't like her. She thinks we are 'islamophobes' but in truth we just know what she wants! And what every other muslim wants! That is what we don't like.
at April 6, 2007 9:23 PM
At what point will the UK police force confess they have transgressed into Muslim territory and withdraw back to their stations?
I am truly glad I left that country.
Posted by: The Contrarian at April 6, 2007 10:17 PM
abdullah
"That centre is my local Mosque. Proof that I am a moderate Muslim haha"
really?
ok so when i send that mosque all your posts then will they be ashamed that they have an extremist in their midst?
and when i send all your posts to the local police station in ladbroke grove will they be concerned?
and when i send all your posts to MI5 will they be on to you?
at April 6, 2007 11:51 PM
i think this is how brits will be regulating mosques in the future...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/nottinghamshire/6532317.stm
A Nottingham mosque has been severely damaged in a fire described by a leading imam as "an act of terrorism against Muslims".
Posted by: leonthepigfarmer at April 6, 2007 11:54 PM
I hope the Brits "regulate" them right out of country.
Let them go play their dismal games back in Mecca.
Till something human finally seeps through the dogmatic armor that is Mohammadism.
Posted by: profitsbeard at April 7, 2007 1:38 AM
Abdullah's post above tells us something very, very interesting. Something, which to the best of my knowledge has not been mentioned in the British press.
"Speaking at a mosque known at the Muslim Cultural Heritage Center, in Ladbroke Grove, a relatively affluent area of west London".
Therefore she and the government were being careful to avoid the considerable embarrassment caused to the Home Secretary when he went on a similar trip to an ordinary mosque in a “Muslim Area” and was told to take his infidel a*** out of it.
BTW only fools and liberals believe anything this government says about ANYTHING anyway.
Posted by: Fred at April 7, 2007 6:44 AM
more mosque burning, this time in yemen.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6534433.stm
could this be a new backlash? i abhor violence, but as ozzy says "a symptom of the universe".
Posted by: leonthepigfarmer at April 7, 2007 9:12 AM
Just like all liberal programs, it starts out with alot of headlines(like they are really going to do something) and once the lib media loose interest they let the islamofascists who have been screaming islamophobe takeover the program so they can recruit more jihadifascists to attack the government. Why should this program be any diferent from any other marxist/socialist/liberal/regressive program?
Until the day that all mosques are digitally recorded for audio and video this jihad will continue unfettered.
I wish you Brits all the best but I fear that the vast majority of you have lost the will to be free. Just as the American left is trying to convince us of the same.
GOD BLESS AMERICA!
Posted by: Paratisi at April 7, 2007 11:59 AM
Why doesn't Ms. Kelly and PM Blair teach a few hundred Arab's disenfranchized by Islam the language of URDU or recruit some who know it to enter the mosques and report the truth to the government. Of course this is dangerous, but it could pay extremely well for a fraction of the expense of Ms. Kelly's doomed to fail program....
A lot of good this will do...since the radical Imams will just side step the offer as already indicated by:
"In order for Muslim preachers to be employed in government hospitals, colleges and prisons, they would have to meet this "framework of standards," she said.
... But the Muslim Council of Britain, the best known of several national Muslim groups, declined to sign an open letter organized by Kelly that called for the importance of rebutting the extremist arguments."
at April 7, 2007 1:29 PM
'...could this be a new backlash? i abhor violence, but as ozzy says "a symptom of the universe".'
Leon,
Perhaps what goes around is finally coming around.
Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at April 7, 2007 4:30 PM
“Perhaps the Iran hostages debacle will finally prove to American JW regulars that Tony Blair is not the great heroic ally that some in the States believe him to be - strip away the tough posturing and the phoney rhetoric and all you have is a weak and appeasing little man obsessed with his own image and career.”
Nevertheless, he sent British troops to Afghanistan and Iraq almost alone amongst the Western powers, and against considerable opposition at home. So how does one view that? Tony Blair is reviled at home for being a warmonger and by many “American JW regulars” as being a dhimmi. Very strange.
at April 7, 2007 6:28 PM
TB walks a very fine line, socialism right wing conservatism. but the good news is he was voted in the last time, that shows the british public do support this war agaisnt islam.
don't worry america, our next prime minister after the labour party, will be very pro-british and extremely anti-islamic.
we are in for some good times in the UK, i'd advise all patriotic british ex-pats to book your flights back for the next general elections. we are gonna need "boots" on the ground!
Posted by: leonthepigfarmer at April 8, 2007 12:29 AM
Thank you lpf and do not take to heart any of the comments here bashing this or that UK policy or what the sailors should have done or whatever. This American feels this vicerally. Your blood is our blood. Your foe is our foe. Your fight is our fight. Same with Aussies, Kiwis, Canucks etc.
nabi ZK
Posted by: zonie kafir at April 8, 2007 2:41 AM
Zonie, I couldn't agree with you more.
Posted by: Isabellathecrusader at April 8, 2007 5:11 AM
"Tony Blair is reviled at home for being a warmonger and by many “American JW regulars” as being a dhimmi. Very strange."
I posted the message you are referring to. I am British, not American, but I still regard Tony Blair as a dhimmi. One only has to look at the difference between his phoney hardline rhetoric and the reality of his (non) action since 7/7.
Not only has he failed to carry out the promised crackdown on extremists, but he has offered Muslims a type of semi-Sharia censorship with the preposterous Religious Hatred Bill, reneged on his pledge to outlaw forced marriages, permitted unlimited immigration with virtually open borders, and still persists with the "tiny minority of extremists" line, even though MI5 admits it is keeping tabs on around 200 separate terror cells.
Still, I suppose we should be grateful. Prior to 7/7, anyone daring to mention Islamic extremism was screamingly denounced by Blair and his party as "racist".
at April 8, 2007 8:16 AM
Leon tpf wrote:
“don't worry america, our next prime minister after the labour party, will be very pro-british and extremely anti-islamic.
we are in for some good times in the UK, i'd advise all patriotic british ex-pats to book your flights back for the next general elections. we are gonna need "boots" on the ground!”
I wish I could share your optimism, Leon. Realistically, though, the next non-Labour PM will be David Cameron, and he doesn’t look “very pro-british and extremely anti-islamic” to me. But the Tories would at least probably be less dhimmi than the Labour Party, and they do have some people who seem to have seen the light, especially Michael Gove -- see his excellent book “Celsius 7/7” (the title is a nice swipe at Michael Moore) and, to a lesser extent, David Davis.
P.S. Liked your recent postings sticking up for us beleaguered Brits!
at April 8, 2007 8:25 AM
“I posted the message you are referring to. I am British, not American, but I still regard Tony Blair as a dhimmi. One only has to look at the difference between his phoney hardline rhetoric and the reality of his (non) action since 7/7.”
Was sending troops to Afghanistan and Iraq “phoney hardline rhetoric”? No it wasn’t, it was the “reality of his action”. I would agree, though, that on the domestic front the Labour Party has been lamentably unrobust about the domestic Islamic threat, and Tony Blair must take responsibility for that, as he has evidently not made the right connection between foreign and domestic policy, or, if he has, he has failed to persuade his party of it.
at April 8, 2007 8:33 AM
Oh Dear, abdullah (Honest Abe) really cracks me up!
"That centre is my local Mosque. Proof that I am a moderate Muslim haha"
If you are a moderate....stop! I wont go any further. Sarcasm is wasted on a brain-dead troll!
Which comedy club are you appearing at next weekend?
at April 8, 2007 12:51 PM
"Kelly said she was determined to "isolate and push out a tiny minority who spread hatred and intolerance." The government would do this, she said, by emphasizing the need for Muslim immigrants to be British as well as Muslim."
....proof, Ms Kelly does not understand the severity of the situation....
at April 9, 2007 9:19 AM
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