Will they ever learn? Or maybe it's a trick...

"We are convinced that in order to establish a Palestinian state we must withdraw from additional territories, [so the will send even more rockets our way so we can then retaliate more fully...]"

Posted by: sadatoin at May 12, 2007 7:44 PM

"I believe I represent most Israelis and I can confirm that Gaza is not the last move. [...]"

Um, sorry, no, Tzipi, you don't. Most Israeli Jews, in this year 2007, are in complete disagreement with you, and not only do they not wish to withdraw from any more territories, they want the "Palestinian Authority" (oxymoron) destroyed and its leaders dead. We've had just about enough of those Land For Nothing deals, thank you.

Posted by: ZionistYoungster at May 12, 2007 7:54 PM

The UN set up a Palestinian state in 47. Thay rejected it. Why is it our problem 60 years later?

Posted by: Ruebacca at May 12, 2007 7:59 PM

It is also a matter of whether certain territories or areas can be defended or are 'worthwhile' defending.

This is not an argument coming from me, it is something often heard in Israel, from young and old Israeli's alike, who somehow seem to think that it is them who 'have to give' something to the Arabs, even without getting anything in return.

Posted by: sheik yer'mami at May 12, 2007 8:16 PM

[...]they want the "Palestinian Authority" (oxymoron) destroyed and its leaders dead. We've had just about enough of those Land For Nothing deals, thank you.
Posted by: ZionistYoungster

I am of your opiniom ZionistYoungster. How much longer till your next election? Assuming you're Israeli of course.

I am waiting for Netanyahu to come in.

Problem is.. there are so many nice Liberals in Israel too..

All these touchy-feely lefty-goody-good-people who want to keep on giving and giving and giving.

Sometimes hard lessons have to be learned. The moslemas have forgotten the lessons we taought them in the Crusades and the lessons Israel taught them in the earlier wars after 1949.

Maybe we Westerners need to remember these lessons as well.

Posted by: Allahfanculo at May 12, 2007 9:13 PM

Tzipi Livni is proof that brains don't always go with physical beauty (yeah, I know I'm being sexist). There was a time in the past that Israel had a policy never to negotiate with terrorists. Now they think they can bribe the jihadists to act civilized. Israel should just look at what happened to the once large Christian-Palestinian community and realize that is their fate tommorow if they continue this foolish policy.

It is past time for Israeli leaders to stop acting like Europeans and start acting like Middle-Easterners. Yes, establish a Palestinian state in Judea and Samaria, but for the real Palestinian, not for the Arabs. The ONLY real Palestinians are indigenous Christians, Jews, and Samaritans. The Muslims are just Arab invaders and occupiers. A two-state solution will destroy Israel while a three state solution guarantees future security. A Jewish Israel (with its substantial Christian minority in the Galil) and a Christian Palestine (with a large Jewish minority) will live in peace with each other. The Muslims should be expelled to their own state in Jordan.

Posted by: Provoslavni at May 13, 2007 12:34 AM

Here we go again! Such lies! Minister of who what?

Posted by: MZ at May 13, 2007 12:49 AM

The only thing you get by feeding a crocodile is a BIGGER crocodile.

Posted by: profitsbeard at May 13, 2007 1:14 AM

Prime Minister Livni? Have we gone crazy?, by former Likud Knesset minister Uzi Landau.

The Tzipi Project, by Emanuel Winston.

Can someone please help save us from ourselves? Much appreciated.

Posted by: Shy Guy at May 13, 2007 1:39 AM

"We are convinced that in order to establish a Palestinian state we must withdraw from additional territories," the minister added".

What exactly is Gaza then? Besides, since when is it up to Israel to establish a palestinian state?
From what we see in Gaza does it make any sense whatsoever to expand upon THAT mess?

Will the last Israeli please turn off the lights?

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at May 13, 2007 2:24 AM

Will the last Israeli please turn off the lights?

Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at May 13, 2007 02:24 AM

Posted by: Shy Guy at May 13, 2007 3:11 AM

Israel's in a difficult position.

Its too easy for the Eurabian left & MSM to portray them as an occupying force while they remain in the Left bank.

Remember that Sharon had already started planning for a unilateral withdrawl behind the wall because he'd recognised that continuing presence in the West Bank wasn't helping Israel, either tactically or strategically.

I think they'll withdraw in the next year or so and apply exponential retaliatory action to any attacks but not linger (having learnt that lesson with Hezbollah & Lebanon).

Iran & the rest of the Islamic world is going to have to decide whether they really want Arabia & Persia turned into an atomic wasteland or not. I know the current president of Iran has talked about them being able to 'lose' a few cities, but do the people, military and clergy really want that? If they do, then they should keep on the course they're pursuing, because I can't see any outcome other than Mutually Assured Destruction.

Posted by: veil416 at May 13, 2007 4:34 AM

One last Livni link:

Another Tack: No elevator for Tzipi, by the ever-brilliant Sarah Honig.

Posted by: Shy Guy at May 13, 2007 5:23 AM

When are the Israelis going to wake up and listen to Bat Ye'or?

Ashkenazis, I'm guessing, knew little of Islam - and appear to have not learned very much in 50 years. The Jekyll and Hyde duality of Muslim culture, the smiler with the knife under the cloak, is mind-bending, because it is so utterly different from the transparency and consistency fostered by Biblical scripture (Jesus was entirely Jewish in his disgust for hypocrisy).

The Oriental Jews were blinded/ conditioned by centuries of dhimmitude (sort of like an abused wife or child - they had been abused so long they had internalised the 'roll over' mentality) - I get the sense from bat ye'or that she only really realized how bad it had actually been from her people in Egypt, when she got outside of it and got some detachment. It seems most Oriental Jews in Israel haven't followed bat ye'or's path - waking up to the abuse and also waking up to the need to name it and resist it.

If this analysis is wrong, Israeli readers please feel free to call me on it - I'm just wondering...

G-d bless you, Israel. G-d help you. May the Lord of Hosts be a wall of fire round about you and may He be the glory in your midst. Psalm 46. Psalm 130.

Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at May 13, 2007 6:52 AM

Correction to above: 'how bad it had actually been FOR her people in [Muslim] Egypt'...

Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at May 13, 2007 6:53 AM

This, rather than the last move, should be the last straw. Israel, under Olmert, has become a laughing stock in the Middle East. It is, line by line, crafting its own death warrant. Olmert should go andf go now. He has outlived his usefulness - that is, if he ever had any usefulness. Of course, he was useful to some - namely Nasrallah, but Israel is desperately in need of a strongman who won't yield another inch, and will stand up to the terrorists and their appeasers and supporters amongst the useful idiots in the West

Posted by: Spirit Of 1683 at May 13, 2007 9:01 AM

Folks, Tsipi is a moron, a certified birdbrain [her very name, Tsipora, means bird]. She really is stupid. But for a fool, she has too much ambition. What has to be done is to keep up telling the ugly truth about her. I think that Sarah Honig's column [see link above] was too kind. The so-called Left, better called the "anti-national camp," was looking to her as a replacement for Olmert. But she has made such a fool out of herself lately that many of the "left" have decided she doesn't fit the bill.

On the other hand, she is not the only one to say that there can't be a "palestinian state" without further Israeli withdrawals. Now, the question is, Do we need a new Arab state based on a fake, newly invented people??? No we don't. Despite all the foolish claims of the State Dept and the Europeacemongers, a "palestinian state" would increase the likelihood of war. Stop the fake notion of a "palestinian state"!!!

Posted by: Eliyahu at May 13, 2007 11:07 AM

Well, I reckon Israel should withdraw to a plot of land even smaller than the postage stamp they now occupy...what a travesty this occupation of dar al-Islam by JOOOOOOOS is.

Yes, they should withdraw to a plot of a couple of acres, piled ten high, balanced in a great Jewish pyramid of Zionist oppression, each and every one with a Star of David pinned to their coat.

Then, well, I'll leave it to the reader's imagination what happens next ;)

Seriously Israel, screw world opinion.
Evict the Muslims, every last one, evem the good "moderate" Muslims and bulldoze a fifty mile wide exclusion zone around Israel, and tell the Arabs, and especially the rest of the bloody world to go to hell.

Posted by: Mike_W at May 14, 2007 6:22 AM