| FrontPageMag.com | By Robert Spencer | By Hugh Fitzgerald | Books | Jihad Watch | Islam 101 | Qur'an Blog | Raymond Ibrahim | Robert Spencer |  |
|
|
|||||||||||
|
|
During the Cold War Russian dissidents would say to visiting foreigners:
"Yes, the Soviet Union is indeed vast. You can go 3,000 miles up and down, and 6,000 miles across. But what happens when you come to the end of those 3,000 miles down? Or those 6,000 miles across? You still can't get out. You still are stuck."
That is Islam. You can't get out. You are not allowed the mental freedom to leave. If Islam did not promote the habit of mental submission, severe limits on artistic expression, hatred of, and war-making upon Infidels, the deliberate infliction of a state of permanent humiliation, degradation, and physical insecurity on Infidels, if it did none of those awful things, but only -- only -- prevented those born into Islam from leaving Islam, that alone would entitle us to see it as a totalitarian and cruel belief-system, and to regard it with permanent wariness and worry.
Some have claimed that this prohibition on leaving has been set aside. Muslim convert Stephen Schwartz, for example, once wrote: “The Ottoman caliphate abolished death sentences for apostasy from Islam more than two centuries ago, but Western media still widely report that all Muslims believe the penalty for apostasy must be death."
This is, however, flatly untrue. In fact, even the so-called Tanzimat Reforms of 1839, which were designed to alleviate the condition of non-Muslims in the Ottoman Empire, were not put in to effect whenever and wherever local officials could get away with dragging their feet. After all, it was only the superior power of the Western world that made the Ottoman rulers even go through the charade of easing up on non-Muslims -- the same kind of charade that can be seen today all over.
Ultimately, there were some changes in the treatment of apostasy, but only limited ones, in a few places. And today it is not only in Saudi Arabia and Sudan and Iran where one can find such a punishment still on the books. Think of the outcry over Abdul Rahman in Afghanistan, and the Qambar case in the 1990s in (choose your adjectives: tiny, pro-Western, grateful-for-its-rescue-by-America) Kuwait.
Schwartz, being a "convert to Islam" (after a bout of Trotsky, and the Summer of Love, and so on), has decided to present himself to the world as an "expert on Islam." That’s a nice title if you can get it, and you can get it if you simply write the sign yourself, and then paste it on your forehead. He can now spout off about Islam and enjoy his self-assigned role as Slayer of Wahhabi Idols.
And don't overlook the money, radix malorum. For the role of "moderate Muslim" is now a virtual ticket to government and foundation grant money, the seed money, the feed money, the keeping-up-appearances money that no one would ever think of throwing the way of the true heroes, those ex-Muslims, the articulate defectors from Islam, such as Ibn Warraq and Ali Sina, who could make scholarly mincemeat of the high-profile converts any time they bothered to notice them. But they have more important things to do.
Ibrahim Hooper, Yvonne Ridley, Adam Gadahn, John Walker Lindh et al, the Western converts to Islam, represent various types of mental disarray. In contrast, the apostates from Islam (not to be confused with the Apostles of Cambridge) represent the sanest, most humorful, interesting people who were born into Islam and mentally fought their way -- or in the Western world, if their parents had exhibited less-than-fervent belief, possibly skirmished their way -- out of the Total Regulation of Life, the Complete Explanation of the Universe, the entire cramped existence. They had the courage to no longer accept the belief-system that was inflicted upon them and their ancestors, those Christians, Jews, Zoroastrians, Hindus, Buddhists, who at some point in that distant past were forced, or in order to no longer have to endure the unendurable, decided to convert to Islam, which has proven itself to be possibly the most powerful retrograde force, as Churchill once described it, in the history of humanity -– one that has stifled so much human potential and brought so much unnecessary woe.
Perhaps they are like those Cambridge Apostles after all.
Posted by Hugh at May 30, 2007 8:59 AM
Print this entry
| Email this entry
| Digg this
| del.icio.us
a few words to the wise...do not convert to Islam...
Posted by: exsgtbrown![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/nav-commenters.gif)
at May 30, 2007 9:10 AM
Kind of like the "Eagles" singing in "Hotel California":
"...You can checkout any time you like,
But you can never leave!..."
at May 30, 2007 9:10 AM
The five times a day prayer and muezzin wailing (Pavlovian stimulus) are very smart schemes for forcing the rebellious to brainwash themselves
Islam is a "soul cage". Re Sting
Posted by: dennisw at May 30, 2007 9:54 AM
Witch-king of Angmar-
...and something about "stabbing it with their steely knives."
Were there a truer Satanic cult...
-XRDC
Posted by: XRDC at May 30, 2007 9:55 AM
And, speaking of the "the Western converts to Islam [who] represent various types of mental disarray..."
The person who comes to my mind is Ingrid Mattson, the Catholic convert to Islam (also Canadian). She spent ten years "studying" for a "PhD" in Islamic "studies" at the University of Chicago -- she "studied" for 10 years a single line from the Koran, translated as: "A believing slave is better than a non-believing free man."
I guess that about sums up (for me, anyway) the mark of an aberrant mentality...
(On a slightly different topic, Schwartz is now claiming that Islam in Canada is somehow "different" -- it's the "gentler, more pacifist variety, the one in which prime ministers are only threatened with beheadings, as opposed to those Muslims who advocate torture first, suggest conversion, if not, then beheading" -- oh please, such a fatuous notion as "moderate". Such illusions are grasped at by those who are so desperate to find something "nice" to say about Islam and assuage the fears of the Infidels.)
Posted by: J.S. at May 30, 2007 10:23 AM
Some people find a straitjacket cozy.
Like a permanent hug.
Emphasis on permanent.
Posted by: profitsbeard at May 30, 2007 10:48 AM
UMichigan Daily dhimmi think;
War of words
...We must learn to refer to a terrorist as a terrorist and nothing more. As President Bush repeatedly preaches, Islam is a religion of peace. We must cease equating terrorists with members of a peaceful religion, unless we truly want to cause a tenth crusade.
Posted by: Terp Mole at May 30, 2007 10:59 AM
"As President Bush repeatedly preaches, Islam is a religion of peace."
-- from a student newspaper at the University of Michigan
Yes, George Bush. The man who has been right about everything. Now quoted in defense of the proposition that "Islam is a religion of peace." Why? Because CAIR says so. Because Al-Qaradawi says so. Because Sheik Bin Baz used to say so. Because Tariq Ramadan says so. Because Karen Armstrong says so. Because John Esposito says so. Because two dozen former ambassadors to Arab countries, on the take both directly and indirectly, would have us say so. Because Jimmy Carter thinks so -- devoutly, piously, with good wishes for the whole wide world except, perhaps, for those "Zionists" and their supportrs.
Everyone thinks so. And President Bush thinks so. Doesn't that take care of it?
Posted by: Hugh at May 30, 2007 11:04 AM
Retrograde Islam battles to keep the world in Pharasaic Prison Mode:
Colossians 2
16Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. 18Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize. Such a person goes into great detail about what he has seen, and his unspiritual mind puffs him up with idle notions. 19He has lost connection with the Head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.
20Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: 21"Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!"? 22These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings. 23Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self-imposed worship, their false humility and their harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence.
at May 30, 2007 11:05 AM
"Western convert to islam" is a diagnosis. Another word for, or altered state of a maniac criminal, getting an in-advance pardon for whatever they may desire to do to the "others" (in that case the infidels). Allowed to do anything by a society which is deadlocked on the illusion that all religions are equal.
The problem is not that we, as a society, are dangerously reckless. It is how much longer we will act as if the proclaimed illusions are the truth. A handfull of politicians and journalists fill good about themselves, maintaining the PC hydra, penetrating every aspect of our lives and bringing upon the destruction of our civilization. Will we ever get the balls to stop them?
Another illusion, is that we (whoever we might be) can use islam to fight them (whoever they might be). This is the other way to the end of both "us" and "them". islam is not a gun, nor bomb, not even nuke. It is the Ebola that we swallow hoping to infect the other, a wolf in the barn, a toxic gas with no antidote. There is no safe handling of islam. Isolation is the only defence.
There will be a dramatic, inevitable change in our society. Our only choice is between the end of political correct correctness and sharia.
Posted by: Excommie at May 30, 2007 11:11 AM
Let the college senior (and college newspaper editorial board member)explain it all:
"We must learn to refer to a terrorist as a terrorist and nothing more. As President Bush repeatedly preaches, Islam is a religion of peace. We must cease equating terrorists with members of a peaceful religion, unless we truly want to cause a tenth crusade."
Heavens to mergatroid, no tenth crusade! Nine was enough!!!!!
Posted by: Ynkedoodl2 at May 30, 2007 11:16 AM
Hmm. Such anti-Islamic remarks are typical of this site.
Which must be why I keep coming here for my daily fix of healthy, unbiased criticism of what most people still do not recognize for what it is: an evil cult akin to Nazism or even, in extreme Taliban form, to the Khmer Rouge.
When are the rest of us going to wake up and see the reality?
Just a little suggestion. For the education of those of us who wish to learn more from the direct experience of ex-Muslims, how about some book reviews, maybe some comparative analysis by anyone who cares to contribute, of the various works by Ibn Warraq, Nonie Darwish etc.
Personal recommendations should help others choose which to buy and the more sales the better.
Not to detract from the equally valuable and fine work of Mr Spencer (hastily added). In fact it was the politically incorrect guide to Islam that first answered those nagging questions and doubts I once had about Islam, like is it just me that's intolerant for not wanting yet more Muslim immigrants in our cities? (no) are they only mad at us because we hate them? (no) just how many intolerant verses are there versus benign verses, (plenty) and which ones really count; am I looking at the problem through the wrong end of the telescope or not? Having answered some of those questions for me, Mr Spencer has left me with a continuing need to know more about this alarming threat to our world.
On the human cost of Islam for anyone who still hasn't read it,I can recommend 'Infidel' by Ayaan Hirsi Ali, as a very powerful and moving biography. It gripped harder than any fictional thriller and threw a lot of light on life and how it is lived in various parts of East Africa, Saudi Arabia, and then as a refugee in Holland. This book has been unjustly criticised by some Westerners who cannot know much about her experience, but they should be ignored. It is honest and indispensible.
Posted by: StephenA55 at May 30, 2007 11:26 AM
Various claims are being made about the number of Muslims worldwide. Would these numbers drop if the there was no death sentence for conversion? Is it possible that large numbers of Muslims are muslims in name only? Is there any other religion that kills exmembers?
The continuing dialectic that is Western Civilization has long concluded that individuals have a "freedom of conscience" and that forcing someone to believe in something they do not is a violation of their human rights.
The primary differnce between a free society and a slave society is the insistence on personal rights of the individual versus the "right" of tyrants to suspend them. "Is peace so sweet or life so dear as to be traded for chains and slavery? I know not what course others may take, but as for me - Give me liberty or death!"
Posted by: tanstaafl at May 30, 2007 12:17 PM
Godfather; "An offer you cannot refuse."
Posted by: MZ at May 30, 2007 12:24 PM
I was just thinking last night that, for many people, leaving Islam must be like leaving a cult.
There is the fear of punishment, both here and in the hereafter. Since Islam has rules for everything, it could be frightening to have to make your own decisions about everything and to stop following such rigid schedules and restrictions. There is also the likelihood of being shunned by friends, family and community.
I think that many people who leave Islam would rely heavily on support groups like the ones that were formed after Jonestown, etc.
As Hugh Fitzgerald wrote, it is a mental fight. I hope that more and more Muslims will fight to use their ability to reason so they can weigh the facts and analyze the difference between what Islam says and what Islam does.
That's the bottom line for me in regards to any religion, philosophy or political system: not their words but their actions.
Posted by: Josephine at May 30, 2007 12:25 PM
I had a dream about 10 years ago, I found this cottage in the woods and three other men appeared. One was wearing a red cross on his ancient armor front, and another like a knight and the other had crusades army helmet, spear! I offered them Cappacino. They loved the whip cream! We stood and talk why we cross paths?
When I woke'-I never quite understood that dream. Now I have recurrences of it.
at May 30, 2007 12:36 PM
Wasn't it ottoman who showed us Sept 11- this is not true! Ottoman- you WILL CONFORM!
Posted by: MZ at May 30, 2007 12:44 PM
POEM TIME- I wrote this in 1991
DO YOU REMEMBER THE THEN AND NOW
The trees sing
the birds chirp
the sky rumbles the wind blows so
the river runs
I do have a song
that belongs in a world that has
changed so quickly
what changed you
to conform
to watch a battle
in which way,- should you conform
to watch natures beauty drifting away
replaced by human toxi waste
no more songs in the trees or sky
or birds communicating near by
you will be left wondering
WHY
Why me in this rotten world of stone
Nothing to to do to change it Now
The end is near and the End is Now... . . . . .
(inspired by God)
at May 30, 2007 12:59 PM
Why would those who despise Bush and say he's the terrorist NOW conveniently quote him as a source?
Hmmm, I wonder....
Posted by: Miss_Anthrope at May 30, 2007 4:21 PM
..Nonie Drawish..5/30 Seattle P.I.
U.S. women can help Arab feminists
By NONIE DARWISH
GUEST COLUMNIST
..excerpt..;
"...American women TV reporters have taken to wearing head covers in moderate Arab countries that do not enforce Islamic attire. Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi wore a scarf in secular, Baathist Syria. By complying with the practices that radical Muslims force on women even in secular Muslim countries, those American women unknowingly undermine the cause of Arab feminists and can even be seen as lending tacit support to radicals. They need to understand better the culture in which they are operating..."
\..WoW..maybe there is hope for Robert and Hugh in the MSM if a lib rag like the P.I. prints Nonie Darwish..
..more..
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/317680_arabfems30.html
Posted by: Madduck at May 30, 2007 5:08 PM
Hugh, I couln not have said it better myself.
Posted by: callmeinfidel at May 30, 2007 5:28 PM
That dream I had of the three crusaders, I remember a piece more. They asked me to help them save the world!
Posted by: MZ at May 30, 2007 7:19 PM
Hugh mentioned the Qambar case (of apostasy) in Kuwait. Interestingly, Kuwait is not mentioned, in any of the articles I've read, as one of the countries that gives the death penalty for apostasy. Nevertheless, in reality, they do prosecute for the death penalty in specific cases of apostasy, as the Qambar case proved. Thus once again we must distinguish between Islamic policy as it is actually implemented, and what Muslims and the army of Islamic apologists who dominate the subject say about those policies.
Here's some background:
Qambar's apostasy
http://www.smi.uib.no/pao/longva.html
[excerpt]
“Following the practice established by tradition, according to which the community must try to win back the apostate before punishing him/her, a group of learned men met several times with Qambar for the purpose of reconverting him. By January 1996, when it became clear that he would not give in to this amicable approach and recant his decision, popular anger began rising against Qambar. In the National Assembly an islamist deputy called for legal actions to be taken against the convert. Not long after, an islamist lawyer sued Qambar for apostasy. To the court, the plaintiff said that he hoped the lawsuit would make the accused 'regret and reverse his decision or else be officially declared an apostate and bear the consequences'. Meanwhile, the home of the convert was vandalized, he was entirely barred from seeing his children, and when his father passed away, he was forbidden from receiving his share of the inheritance. Gradually, the number of people suing Qambar for apostasy grew. At the same time, he found no lawyers willing to defend him. In May 1996 the judge in the shi'a lower court issued a ruling that officially declared Qambar an apostate and recommended that the death penalty be pronounced against him. Qambar appealed against the apostasy ruling. His appeal was to be reviewed in September 1996. One month before that date, the authorities issued Qambar a passport and he left Kuwait for the USA. What happened in the following months, I don't know because my fieldwork for that year had come to an end and I had to leave for Norway. But when I returned to Kuwait for a brief visit in November 1997, I learnt that Qambar had reconverted to Islam and was now back in the country. I had the opportunity to observe the Kuwaitis' reactions to the conversion, discuss the event with Muslim friends and informants from various walks of life, and speak with the convert himself. What struck me most was the unanimity of the condemnations. Everywhere in the Middle East these days opinions differ widely on the relationship between religion, public life and politics - with 'liberals' and 'islamists' being the two contending categories at each extreme of the continuum. Kuwait is no exception. On this particular occasion, however, I found a surprisingly strong consensus across the liberal/islamist divide. Practically everyone agreed that Qambar's conversion was a serious crime and as is the case with all crimes, it had to be punished. They also agreed that depriving him of all his civil rights was an adequate punishment. The only topic which gave rise to some disagreement and a subdued sense of unease within some circles was the question of the death penalty. Those who opposed it based their position on the Qur'anic verse (2:257) that says 'no compulsion is there in religion'. But more often than not, the same verse was quoted in front of me to show that precisely because Islam is such a tolerant religion, there are no possible excuses for apostasy. Mostly for this reason, apostates are traditionally considered insane unless there is irrefutable evidence that they were in their right mind when they apostated. This explains why some people in Kuwait, when they did not want to see Qambar condemned to death, argued that the man was insane, and called him a 'lunatic', 'a case for pyschiatry'. These statements may sound derisive to us, but ultimately, their purpose was to save Qambar's neck: since he was mad, he could not be held accountable for his actions and therefore should not be killed.”Posted by: Khaybar Oasis
at May 30, 2007 9:00 PM
Well, you must be insane if you want to leave Islam..........
Posted by: tanstaafl at May 31, 2007 8:44 AM
Well, you must be insane if you want to leave Islam..........
Posted by: tanstaafl at May 31, 2007 8:45 AM
Comments are turned off and archived for this entry.
(Note: The Comments section is provided in the interests of free speech only. It is mostly unmoderated, but comments that are off-topic, offensive, slanderous, or otherwise annoying stand a chance of being deleted. The fact that any comment remains on the site IN NO WAY constitutes an endorsement by Jihad Watch or Dhimmi Watch, or by Robert Spencer or any other Jihad Watch or Dhimmi Watch writer, of any view expressed, fact alleged, or link provided in that comment.)