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All pre-Islamic material is in the traditional Islamic view so much worthless trash -- manifestations of jahiliyya, the society of unbelievers. By Fredrik Dahl and Reza Derakhshi-Salmasi for Reuters (thanks to all who sent this in):
PASARGADAE, Iran -- For the people protesting against it, a new dam near these sun-drenched ruins may be more than an environmental upheaval: In it they see an affront to the country's pre-Islamic identity.For 2,500 years, the tomb of Cyrus the Great has stood on the plain at Pasargadae, in southern Iran, a simple but dignified monument to a king revered as the founder of the mighty Persian empire. But some fear the dam and reservoir pose a threat to the ancient structure.
They say the project may increase humidity in the arid area near the city of Shiraz, which they believe could damage the limestone mausoleum.
That may seem far-fetched -- officials dismiss it -- but the feud highlights deep cultural fault lines in attitudes toward the Islamic Republic's wealth of pre-Islamic relics.
"This is an illegal project which will harm our historical heritage," said Mohammad Ali Dadkhah, a lawyer campaigning against the Sivand Dam.
He accuses the authorities of not paying enough attention to sites dating from before the Arab Muslim invasion of what is now Iran in the seventh century: "They don't care about pre-Islamic history."
There is no reason, given the stance of Islam toward pre-Islamic history, why anyone should expect that they would care about it.
Posted by Robert at October 6, 2007 7:59 AM
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No, no, no! Don't complain about "preserving pre-Islamic heritage". Complain about the regime's "lack of patriotic feeling". That would give them much more difficulty.
Posted by: sceptico![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/nav-commenters.gif)
at October 6, 2007 9:03 AM
Muslims invaders in Iran are working hard in digging their own grave. How long until the proud persians say "Enough is enough!", and stand up for their pre-islamic culture heritage?
As a side note, King Cyrus played in important role in God's plan for mankind. Jews and Christians see King Cyrus as one of God's chosen vessels in delivering Israel out of the captivity in Babylon.
Posted by: Crusader at October 6, 2007 9:13 AM
Well, given that the accomplishments of pre-Islamic civilization outshine anything since, the tomb of Cyrus must be very, very hurtful to the Religion of Utterly Unwarranted Self-esteem.
Posted by: AnneCrockett at October 6, 2007 9:21 AM
Crusader:
As King Cyrus helped to rebuild the Temple, thereby acknowledging Israel's ownership of the Land, I should think that Mohammadans would prefer to lose that part of their history!
at October 6, 2007 10:09 AM
Islam is against any "history", since the very concept is un-Islamic.
Allah is timeless, and anything which distracts from his irrationality must be destroyed.
It might remind people that we have active brains.
And not just passive receivers for Allah's orders.
Posted by: profitsbeard at October 6, 2007 10:14 AM
From the article:
"After the revolution, one prominent ayatollah branded Cyrus a tyrant, liar and homosexual and even called for the destruction of his tomb as well as that of Persepolis. "Fortunately, cooler heads prevailed," Afshin wrote."
No comment needed.
Posted by: Pelayo at October 6, 2007 10:56 AM
The fact that there is history before Islam is an affront to Islam.
Posted by: tanstaafl at October 6, 2007 11:16 AM
I have been told that many young Iranians wear necklaces, unseen, with a symbol of their Persian heritage, to remind themselves that they are NOT Arab and that they are NOT Muslim. I can only hope that, at some point, those necklaces can be worn for their Arab/ Muslim masters to see and to learn how they really feel. Such a movement might start a revolution for all those many groups throughout the "Islamic" world, who are tired of their heritage and culture and religion being pressed into the dirt by their Muslim overseers.... Islam an an oppressor religion in so many ways and has always been.
Posted by: maryrose at October 6, 2007 11:53 AM
All these artsy types who are going along with the new Islamist fad because they hate the Shrub more than evil incarnate have a big surprise coming on this jahiliyya thing. The recent Egyptian ruling on antiquities suggests Iran, the Taliban, Jewish Temple Waqf, and Saudi Arabia are not alone in wanting to erase the past. If all devout Muslims want to destroy human depictions, pre-Islamic religious relics, and archaeological evidence of past civilizations I'd say the Louvre is heading for hard times.
Posted by: Beagle at October 6, 2007 12:17 PM
I need to throw a wet blanket on this. Any increase in humidity will be miniscule, and will not harm the limestone. It is not being flooded. This a ludicrous debate.
The article indicates that there is more of a threat from human vandalism than there is from weather.
Posted by: Pelayo at October 6, 2007 2:35 PM
Sencit,
Oh yeah, clearly King Cyrus was part of the Great Universal Zionist Conspiracy to Defame Islam And the Arabs.
at October 6, 2007 3:13 PM
When monuments of Ancient Egypt were submerged by flooding caused by the Aswan Dam, it was not the government of Egypt, or any rich Muslim state, that resuced those monuments, but Western taxpayers. That is the reason the Temple of Dendur ended up at the Metropolitan -- as a "gift from the government of Egypt" as a token, way back in 1965, of its "gratitude." And when the Turks built a dam at Zeugma a few years ago, and began to use it in about October-November 2000 (a friend of mine rushed there in June to see what was going to be forever underwater) and the artifacts of classical antiquity were to be submerged, it was not the government of Turkey that did anything to rescue them, but rather the American foundation set up by David Packard, that did so, saving what could be saved, and placing those mosaics, the ones chosen for rescue, in a museum nearby at Gaziantep.
Even if the fear of permanent damage may be exaggerated -- and I have no idea what is actually going on, or on what basis some in Iran worry --a fear based on widespread Muslim indifference to, and hostility towards, the pre-Islamic or non-Islamic past. That fear, whether justified or not in this case (depending on whether humidiity can indeed cause limestone to crumble), is itself telling, for it is prompted, we know, by that indifference, and that hostiity. See the Bamiyan Buddhas, and a thousand years of destruction in Central Asia and Hindustan. See the Hindu temple pulled down in Kuala Lumpur. See the massive destruction of Jewish artifacts from the time of David, at and within the Temple Mount. See the destruction of Christian churches all over the Middle East, North Africa, and Byzantium, or where the churches themselves are not destroyed, the vandalism, the ripping off of crosses and chipping off of frescoed figures, in such places as Hagia Sophia. It's nothing personal. It's just what Islam commands, or where it does not command, what the attitudes that arise out of the texts and tenets naturally lead to.
at October 6, 2007 4:47 PM
Islamic history beings with "Allah" and ends with "conquered".
A two sentence concept.
There rest is humanity's achievement is irrelevant and disposable.
The only rest the Sphinx is still standing (minus ITS nose) is that the Mohammedans didn't have dynamite.
And by the time they did, the infidels were watching.
Posted by: profitsbeard at October 6, 2007 6:04 PM
errata-
"The only reason the Sphinx is still standing..."
Posted by: profitsbeard at October 6, 2007 6:06 PM
The question is: Are there enough Iranian Persians who value their Persian heritage over the imposed and false Islamic heritage to cause trouble if the importance of Cyrus is destroyed? If there is an attempt to remove Cyrus as an historical figure, will it be enough to destablize the TIC's regime? What would happen if the ayatollahs ordered its destruction as was attempted just after Khomeninny came into power. (I am not going to sweat one drop over the correct spelling.)
How would Americans react if Mount Vernon were razed to make way for a highway bypass?
Posted by: Pelayo
at October 6, 2007 7:38 PM
Hugh, I cant agree more to your comment.
I would say, we understand that muslim goverment in general in regards to their views towards pre islamic buildings or anything not islamic.
How do we make them stop? Should we continue to pay them or to a foundation for a lost cause? or should we collectively issue a threat.
History states that we become the enemy when we defeat it or be the enemy to defeat it.
at October 6, 2007 10:02 PM
OT but verry dhimmi
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8S40HA00&show_article=1
This is madness. If anyone doubts the allegience of Saudi Arabia, read this.
Posted by: TexasInfidel at October 6, 2007 10:33 PM
It could be worse-the Taliban could be hanging around the place.
Posted by: ISLAMSFORLOSERS at October 6, 2007 11:21 PM
Saudi launch Official Fatwa website
Islamofascist Saudi Arabia launch fatwa website
at October 7, 2007 12:15 AM
What makes you think that Iranians value their ancient Persian heritage more then their Islamic one?
And what would make Iranians different from Egyptians, Pakistanis, and all the other peoples that were conquered by Islamic armies?
Posted by: GuitarBob at October 7, 2007 12:20 AM
"What makes you think that Iranians value their ancient Persian heritage more then their Islamic one?"
Hey G-Bob, I asked a question nothing and more nothing less. I do not know if Iranians value their ancient Persian heritage more then their Islamic one.
Read it again:
Are there enough Iranian Persians who value their Persian heritage over the imposed and false Islamic heritage to cause trouble if the importance of Cyrus is destroyed?
I cannot fathom how you thought that I had any opinion based on the questions in my posting.
Posted by: Pelayo at October 7, 2007 1:53 AM
Pelayo I was responding to Crusader's remarks, and if it wasn't so late, and if i wasn't so tired I would have quoted him to avoid confusion.
I tend to be forgetful when it's 12 am, and can't sleep.
Still is there anything special about the Iranians that would make them more protective of their history then any other Muslims? and that's a general question directed at anyone who cares to answer it.
Posted by: GuitarBob at October 7, 2007 12:36 PM
Iranian students call president "dictator" during scuffle
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071008/ts_nm/iran_students_ahmadinejad_dc_4
Sounds like Ahmadinejad is more popular at Columbia University, NYC, USA than he is at Tehran University. Let's see how well the Iranian President recognizes the "free speech" rights of the Tehran student protesters. How many years in jail for them?
at October 8, 2007 12:35 PM
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