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No comment. "Documentary explores gay Muslims' lives in 'Love,'" by David Wiegand, for the San Francisco Chronicle, August 23:
The men and women who tell their stories, sometimes tearfully, in Parvez Sharma's documentary "A Jihad for Love" have one thing in common: They all continue to believe in the tenets of Islam, regardless of having to hide their personal lives or, worse, escape their homelands because their religion considers their way of life a sin sometimes punishable by death.Where does one start? "Jihad for Love"? So, from meaning holy war to "inner struggle" to advocating homosexuality -- has any word been so tampered with in the last couple of decades? Of course, Muslims know what jihad is; so do we. As for "believing in the tenets of Islam" and being homosexual at the same time: shouldn't such people stone themselves? Seems the logical conclusion when putting those two aspects together.
The only mention of homosexuality in the Quran has to do with Sodom and Gomorrah. Other writings known as the Hadith, a kind of Apocrypha of pronouncements said to have come from Muhammad, are cited to enforce the idea that homosexuality is a sin.Why bother explaining the policies of various countries? The question is simply, What does Islam have to say about homosexuality? Basically, that those who engage in that sort of thing are to be stoned. For "specifics," Minhaj al-Muslim ("the way of the Muslim") recommends that “Gay people should be thrown head first off high buildings and if not killed on hitting the ground, they should be then stoned to death."That said, the official and popular attitudes toward homosexuality vary from country to country in the Islamic world. Turkey, for example, is a largely Islamic country but has no laws outlawing sexual relations between people of the same sex. In Iran and Egypt, homosexuality is specifically outlawed and the punishment can be extreme.
Sharma's film begins with a look at Muhsin Hendricks, an Islamic scholar who fought his homosexual feelings as a young man, married in the hope of sublimating his true nature, and eventually concluded that he had to find a way to live with being both a believer in Islam and a gay man. He believes that since Allah created him as he is, and because scriptural references condemn homosexual rape and not homosexuality per se, he is living a religious life as a gay Muslim.
Better get Al Azhar's opinion on all this before proceeding any further.
Posted by Raymond at August 23, 2008 10:32 AM
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Those Muslims who concentrate on merely one aspect of Islam -- the treatment of women, say, or the treatment of homosexuals -- but who otherwise have no quarrel with Islam, in other words find nothing else wrong with this Total Belief-System, and its division of the world between Believers and Infidels, do not exactly inspire trust or sympathy. If they cannot see that it is the Islamic inculcating of hatred toward Infidels that matters most, that represents the essence of Islam, than -- however just their own particular grievances, they are not, cannot be, trusted to side with Infidels and certainly not be given much credence, or faith put in their ability to somehhow change or reform -- pace the flamboyant henna-haired self-promoting Brave Young Reformer (she now has obtained a well-paid gig at NYU -- the ability of these people to operate on their own behalf never fails to impress) Irshad Manji -- Islam, Islam, Islam.
Posted by: Hugh
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at August 23, 2008 11:43 AM
It's what can you expect of anything coming out of San Francisco, and The Chronical, sometimes called the 'comical'.
'They all continue to believe in the tenets of Islam'...Raymond is right, they should all stone themselves, and if they live in S.F. getting stoned is what they probably have been doing.
Of course getting stoned in Iran as a muslim gay, and a gay muslim getting stoned in S.F, is way different, and a no brainer for the intelligent muslim gay person.
It was said that LSD stopped the Viet Nam war, now I wonder if getting stoned S.F. style, will stop Islam.
If there was more dope smoking among muslims, would there be less jihad? I don't know, but I don't see much jihad coming out of S.F...
at August 23, 2008 11:44 AM
Well, it is true that even the crack of Dawn had to be careful when Mohammed was on the prowl.................
If these Muslim gays are smart, they won't hang around any walls.
Posted by: tanstaafl at August 23, 2008 11:54 AM
"If there was more dope smoking among muslims, would there be less jihad? I don't know, but I don't see much jihad coming out of S.F..."
From duh swami above.
Hashish at one time made Muslims into 'Hashishin' from which the word 'assassin' derived. There is more to it than that, perhaps Hugh can explain it better.
Large parts of Africa, from Yemen to Somalia, all the way to Djibouti most of the population is constantly doped up on khat, which a Somali muslim leader demands to be legally imported into Australia, because otherwise his flock 'could be tempted to use harder drugs' and even resort to crime etc. etc.
Posted by: sheik yer'mami at August 23, 2008 12:41 PM
The ONLY Muslim refugees that should ever be admitted to any Western country, apart from converts to non-Muslim religions and others who have definitively renounced Islam, are those who can demonstrate that they are at risk of death or grave physical harm for having agitated for liberal constitutional democracy in opposition to Islam. A simple claim of persecution over what is merely one's own personal spin on Islam should never even be considered.
Posted by: templar at August 23, 2008 1:04 PM
sheik yer'mami:
Everything I've looked at online so far would seem to indicate that Khat is no more or less harmful than alchohol and caffeine, and that, as with these drugs, its a question of using it moderately and sensibly. If you can find something indicating otherwise I remain open-minded about this, but I really don't think that the Somali-Australian spokesman you mentioned is making an unreasonable request. If that was the worst thing we had to deal with in association with Muslim immigration to the West, we wouldn't need sites like Jihad Watch.
http://www.sidamaconcern.com/articles/abraham.htm
http://www.geocities.com/forceps1974/khat.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khat
http://apt.rcpsych.org/cgi/content/full/9/6/456
Posted by: templar at August 23, 2008 1:46 PM
sheik yer'mami
By the way, the other day I was trying to view your website about another matter and all I could get was this message:
"This Domain (sheikyermami.com) Has Been Disabled
For information on restoring your account please call customer service as soon as possible
"When/If you call our support help line, please have your site name ready."
The same thing is going on today.
Posted by: templar at August 23, 2008 1:56 PM
Templar,
I was about to ask that.
What happened to your site, sheik yer'mami?
Posted by: Crusader at August 23, 2008 2:42 PM
I believe a person is born gay. People are not born muslim. Those gays and lesbians who claim to be gay and still follow the "religion" of islam are lying to themselves, one way or another.
Posted by: ImNoDhimmi at August 23, 2008 2:59 PM
Homosexuals are persecuted throughout the islamic world. In the UK, we have islamic leaders who openly call for their death.
Whenever I mentioned this to my liberal, or gay friends, the stock response was homosexuality is also condemned in the Bible (thus showing their in depth knowledge of all things Christian and islamic).
I really don't bother arguing with them any more. I'm sure others have the same response as I've had.
Posted by: Celsius at August 23, 2008 4:36 PM
Not that it matters much, but my own belief is that the only person who is dangerous, sexually, is the one who won't take "NO" for an answer.
Odd that Mohammedans will criticize destroy tall buildings in other countries, as they are unable to build many of those in theirs. I suppose they're just as happy to stone all "sinners". Why bother with tossing homosexuals off tall buildings, when so much hands-on gratification can be had by stoning them?
Posted by: Abscedere at August 23, 2008 5:49 PM
"For "specifics," Minhaj al-Muslim ("the way of the Muslim") recommends "
Is there a good hadith on this?
Posted by: DenverRodeo at August 23, 2008 6:44 PM
Hugh:
Of all your brilliant commentary, this is probably the best, as off-handed as it is.
The total belief system (mohammed-worship) has so infected the consciousness of even those who have some ability of independent thinking, it distorts their ability to think, detrimentally.
Add to that, the Western creatures who have not the faintest, the least iota, knowledge about mohammed worship - - zero - - but who (colored ribbon society as we are) feel a suffusion of righteousness in condemning any questioning of islam.
Human beings should love and respect each other. Period.
The Western creatures who get that all wrong, out of pure ignorance, pom pom hatred and suffering.
Posted by: Moonzoo at August 23, 2008 7:01 PM
Glad you're finally catching up with queer muslim issues, Ray. The film's been out for several months. This was the first article about it from gay.com, back in April. It's written by the film's director. Do check out the "Related Articles" link. (warning: underwear ads, sometimes):
http://www.gay.com/news/article.html?coll=news_articles&sernum=2008/04/24/1&page=1
This is a more typical gay.com article about queer muslims in Europe. Again, follow all links:
http://www.gay.com/news/article.html?2007/09/11/4
This is a link to a gay muslim e-mag:
http://huriyahmag.com/summer/index.htm
This is from a Iranian Queer group:
Want more? Just ask.
Happy trails!
Long live apostacy!
Posted by: skevin at August 23, 2008 7:03 PM
I just tried to post something with links to gay.com & other sites concerned with queer muslim issues. I got the "first message" response, even though I've posted here now and again for over a year. Censorship for not towing the party line?
Posted by: skevin at August 23, 2008 7:07 PM
Bear with us, folks!
The sheik yer'mami site will be back shortly, sorry for the inconvenience.
Posted by: sheik yer'mami at August 23, 2008 7:47 PM
Skevin-- no. A certain number of links can flag a comment in the system and we have to take a look.
It's there now.
Posted by: MarisolJW at August 23, 2008 7:51 PM
A "Jihad for Love" indeed! I can see that the term "jihad" is starting to outlive its usefulness. Now it's the sexually-perverted further perverting the terminology of the spiritually perverted. The meaning has morphed from "onslaught on the infidels, to kill and loot them" to "inner spiritual struggle" to "exterior sensuality." Coming soon: Teenage Mutant Jihadist Turtles.
Posted by: ebonystone at August 23, 2008 9:13 PM
"A Jihad for Love" -- sounds like the title of a soppy new movie. The plot revolves around the struggle for acceptance by two young gay lovers in a small intolerant Christian town in the American Midwest. They succeed only when they rescue, at great danger to themselves, a little girl who has fallen through the ice on a frozen pond. Choice of endings: one of them dies in the attempt; or he doesn't, but only after a serious struggle with pneumonia.
Or "A Jihad for Love" -- a retitled and reworked "Jewel of Medina" by Sherry Jones. In this one, Aisha is kidnapped by a rival caravan robber and his gang, and Mohammed lays waste all Arabia in his efforts to rescue her.
at August 23, 2008 9:29 PM
It wasn't the SF Chronicle, it was Philly.com. Well, these Gay Muslims make the Log Cabin Republicans look totally self serving in comparison
Posted by: Dumbo at August 23, 2008 10:09 PM
Raymond wrote:
'As for "believing in the tenets of Islam" and being homosexual at the same time: shouldn't such people stone themselves? Seems the logical conclusion when putting those two aspects together.'
Ha! Can't be said any better, bravo.
Posted by: Bosch Fawstin at August 24, 2008 1:29 AM
And you wonder why more gay folk don't post here.
Better get these six legs hoppin' to a hidey hole.
Posted by: skevin at August 24, 2008 1:47 AM
"when-o-when are the people of this world going to stomp on this insect? ERADICATE IT ONCE AND FOR ALL."
I assume this comment is directed at islam, and not homosexuality?
Posted by: ImNoDhimmi at August 25, 2008 7:37 AM
These gay Muslim guys will just have to learn to 'jihad for' something that is taught by the Kuran. One thing's for certain: there's absolutely NO love in the Kuran; nor is there any room for love in it (gay or otherwise). None whatsoever.
Posted by: pythagoras at August 25, 2008 1:01 PM
Name one openly gay Muslim who's ever committed a terrorist attack or an honor killing. (Closet cases like Adam the American don't count.)
Posted by: skevin at August 25, 2008 9:45 PM
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