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The Pope evinces that he knows what the average Muslim -- let alone their ulema -- know. If theology represents the dividing-line between Christians and Muslims, and yet, if theology is eschewed at "inter-faith conferences," never broached, what is achieved?
"Pope Questions Interfaith Dialogue," by Rachel Donadio for the New York Times, November 24:
ROME — In comments on Sunday that could have broad implications in a period of intense religious conflict, Pope Benedict XVI cast doubt on the possibility of interfaith dialogue but called for more discussion of the practical consequences of religious differences.The pope’s comments came in a letter he wrote to Marcello Pera, an Italian center-right politician and scholar whose forthcoming book, “Why We Must Call Ourselves Christian,” argues that Europe should stay true to its Christian roots. A central theme of Benedict’s papacy has been to focus attention on the Christian roots of an increasingly secular Europe.
In quotations from the letter that appeared on Sunday in Corriere della Sera, Italy’s leading daily newspaper, the pope said the book “explained with great clarity” that “an interreligious dialogue in the strict sense of the word is not possible.” In theological terms, added the pope, “a true dialogue is not possible without putting one’s faith in parentheses.”
But Benedict added that “intercultural dialogue which deepens the cultural consequences of basic religious ideas” was important. He called for confronting “in a public forum the cultural consequences of basic religious decisions.”
The Vatican spokesman, the Rev. Federico Lombardi, said the pope’s comments seemed intended to draw interest to Mr. Pera’s book, not to cast doubt on the Vatican’s many continuing interreligious dialogues.
“He has a papacy known for religious dialogue; he went to a mosque, he’s been to synagogues,” Father Lombardi said. “This means that he thinks we can meet and talk to the others and have a positive relationship.”...
Posted by Raymond at November 26, 2008 8:10 PM
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i like this Pope
Posted by: Péguy![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/nav-commenters.gif)
at November 26, 2008 8:32 PM
The Pope is entirely correct in this. So now I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop - the one that (when it hits the ground) sounds like the secular MSM denouncing the Pope and the Church as "intolerant" and "violent" (!).
Posted by: templar at November 26, 2008 8:40 PM
I told y'all this pope was cool. He tried to warn us about Islam back in the 60s. That makes him more of a prophet than Perv Mo, btw.
Posted by: jdamn at November 26, 2008 9:03 PM
What's to talk about???
Posted by: descendantofacrusader at November 26, 2008 9:39 PM
A lone voice in the wilderness.
Posted by: Cornelius at November 26, 2008 10:22 PM
After today's atrocity in Mumbai and another in Cairo over a church I have to say that the Pope is 100 percent correct. Such dialogue is useless-it is like trying to convince an alcoholic to quit drinking when that person has no motivation to quit on his own. Unless Koranists want to change their mindset and be genuine in their desire for peace there never will be any peace with them-it's that simple.
Posted by: Appalled By The World at November 26, 2008 11:14 PM
Benedict is the new Urban.
Posted by: awake at November 26, 2008 11:27 PM
The Pope is correct, but far too subtle and muted in his pronouncements. He's also not a young man, so by the time he dies he will only barely have succeeded in clearing his throat, so to speak. He'd better start being a little clearer in his pronouncements, and a little less opaque and oblique in his condemnation of Islam, otherwise his voice will simply be swamped in the rising din of Islamic "Allahu Akhbars."
Posted by: Eastview at November 26, 2008 11:43 PM
Pray that the Pope may be encouraged by his parishioners - especially his parishioners in places like Pakistan - to openly and fearlessly speak the truth.
Let him speak out plainly on behalf of two of his Catholic flock - Saba and Anila Masih, ages 13 and 10 respectively, seized by Muslim thugs in Pakistan, raped, and forcibly 'converted' to Islam. Anila has, I think been returned to her parents but Saba is still firmly in the clutches of her rapist-'husband', having been terrified (by what manner of threats against her family, one wonders?) into perjuring herself in court and declaring herself to be four years older than the age officially recorded on her official birth certificate - which certificate, conveniently, has been ignored by the Pakistani court, since she is now a 'Muslim' and anything a Muslim says is to be believed, even if the documents - and her Christian parents, and quite possibly the priest who baptised her - deny it.
Let him tell the ummah that unless and until Saba is returned to her parents unharmed, and unless and until it is clear that no further harm will be done to the Masih family, period, no Muslim ambassador or interfaith snake oil salesman will be permitted within spitting distance of the Vatican.
If, before his death, he can write us an encyclical that brings to bear all his considerable intellectual resources in a no-holds-barred demolition job on Islam, on Jihad and Sharia, then he will leave behind a suitable arsenal for the next incumbent.
Please, Your Holiness: you gave an interview to Oriana Fallaci, and you met with, and baptised, Magdi Cristiano Allam; it is high time that you issued Vatican invitations to 1. a certain lapsed Catholic of the Netherlands, one Geert Wilders 2. a certain practising Greek Melkite Catholic and scholar of Islam, one Robert Spencer, and 3. a little Jewish lady named Bat Yeor, historian of the unutterable sufferings endured by Jews and also by Christians under centuries of Muslim despotism and cruelty.
Posted by: dumbledoresarmy at November 27, 2008 1:08 AM
He already gave us a "no-holds-barred demolition job" on the suicide of the West when it began, back in the late 60s in 'Without Roots.' He's been big on interfaith for a long time, too, just not with Islam. He wrote 'Many Religions, One Covenant' about the bond between Jews and Christians over Abraham, Jerusalem, etc. Europe needs to listen to this man. He and Geert Wilders are their best hope.
Posted by: jdamn at November 27, 2008 2:03 AM
"I told y'all this pope was cool. He tried to warn us about Islam back in the 60s. That makes him more of a prophet than Perv Mo, btw.
Posted by: jdamn [TypeKey Profile Page] at November 26, 2008 9:03 PM"
"He already gave us a "no-holds-barred demolition job" on the suicide of the West when it began, back in the late 60s in 'Without Roots.' He's been big on interfaith for a long time, too, just not with Islam. He wrote 'Many Religions, One Covenant' about the bond between Jews and Christians over Abraham, Jerusalem, etc. Europe needs to listen to this man. He and Geert Wilders are their best hope.
Posted by: jdamn [TypeKey Profile Page] at November 27, 2008 2:03 AM"
Yet his master JPII, didn't listen.
www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com
Posted by: Columnist at November 27, 2008 7:07 AM
But will the OIC allow the Pope to use words like "sharia" or "Islam" in his interfaith dialogue? Or would any criticism of the Ummah be considered intolerant hate speech?
Per UN debate: http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/023641.php
Really, what's there to talk about? The inequalities and violent misrepresentations in the "religion of peace"? Or would they examine point by point how this Islam is not a religion but a supremacist cult of world domination by the most deceitful, coercive, violent barbaric ideology on Earth? Can the Pope's delegates ask how Mohammet came up with the name Allah from the Arabian moon-god Al-Illah, for example? Can they discuss freedom of speech in setting where it is forbidden? How is that possible? Or will the delegates of the Ummah simply lecture the Pope about how Christians got their beliefs all wrong? This "dialogue" is already dead on arrival.
Posted by: Battle_of_Tours at November 27, 2008 11:42 AM
Sorry if I offend any Catholic faithful here, but the Pope appears to be suffering from the disease many intellectuals suffer from, a sort of self-absorption in the infinitely complicated doctrines of his belief system, which, together with a very long and weighty precedent-laden history, tends to induce paralysis at times when action is needed. Benedict doesn't have that much time left on this earth, and from what I can see his efforts toward "interfaith dialog" are misdirected and wasted. His namby-pamby statements to the Muslims are little more than PC feel good pap, completely void of impact or effect. I sincerely hope the next Pope is a much younger man of an activist bent who will help organize the two-three billion Christians of the world, including the Evangelicals and Pentecostals and various and sundry other Protestant and Orthodox strains, in throwing down the gauntlet to the Muslims.
Posted by: Eastview at November 27, 2008 2:09 PM
I disagree, Eastview. The Pope is great at communicating with the masses. He gets it, and he gets us, far more than any European elected official with the exception of Geert Wilders. That's why his books are so accessible to non-Catholics like me. That's why Oriana Fallaci, an atheist ("thank God!") said that he was the only person whom she felt she could talk to about anything of import. This is good, because he is the Pope, and therefore it is simply more difficult to demonize him like it is a politician. He feels, as he always has, that Islam is simply not tolerable and that any dialogue will be therefore be taqiyya-laden and self-serving of Islam's, but nobody else's, interests. He has also stood up for Israel far more than any European politician with teh exception of Geert Wilders. I say give him a platform and listen to him, because he has always had the right idea and unerring foresight, and we would all be in better shape if we had been listening to him when he started addressing us 40 years ago.
Posted by: jdamn at November 27, 2008 4:46 PM
"The Pope is correct, but far too subtle and muted in his pronouncements."
Yep, I agree. But people here will tell you, the Pope can't be any more forceful, because then Muslims will start killing Christians around the world (meaning MORE, since they're already killing them anyway). I guess that's one of the main reasons why nobody is doing much of anything about Muslims. So how long do we keep tiptoeing for fear of Muslims? When is enough enough?
Posted by: DenverRodeo at November 27, 2008 5:12 PM
I hear you jdamn, and I do know that B16 "gets it" more than is generally appreciated, but in spite of this he still has not succeeded in breaking through to most Westerners beyond a few who take the time to follow his activities. He has a global platform from which to speak to several billion people - after all, he is the Pope! - but I just don't see him effectively making use of this beyond issuing a few bland encyclicals that require extensive discussion to figure out just what it is he's talking about. Now, that may entertain Catholics, but to the vast majority of humanity these are abstract musings that really don't do much to address pressing issues of the kind we daily discuss here. He could be doing a lot more. Forget the interfaith dialog nonsense.
I'd like to hear Benedict thundering forth from the pulpit as an activist Pope. Let him directly take on the Ayatollahs and Mullahs, al-Sistani and al-Sadr and all the rest. He wouldn't even have to involve himself in theological distractions like the trinity or the virgin birth or what not, simply confine himself to the Islamic trampling of universal human rights. Let him speak about the differences between Christianity and Islam. He could do this without even referring to the Bible or the Qur'an or the Sunna (or the Bagavad Gita). The Muslims will rage, but so what? We've come to expect that, but what we've been waiting for is a leader who will stand up and speak elementary truth that every decent human knows to be true.
Posted by: Eastview at November 27, 2008 5:27 PM
I agree, Eastview. That would be awesome if he actually spoke his mind and took more of an activist position. But I think that the Pope's decrying interfaith dialogue has semi-far-reaching implications, at least insomuch as interfaith dialogue has any implications. I just hope the Evangelicals and the Jews are listening. I will be.
Posted by: jdamn at November 27, 2008 6:25 PM
"I just hope the Evangelicals and the Jews are listening. I will be."
Posted by: jdamn
I do too, and so will I. But he could abandon speaking soto voce and crank up the volume a little just to make sure they do. ;-)
Posted by: Eastview at November 27, 2008 6:44 PM
Forte voce all the way, Eastview. I hear you. But he better make sure there are no more nuns in Somalia first.
Posted by: jdamn at November 28, 2008 12:47 PM
Yet his master JPII, didn't listen.
No, he only did things like contribute to the end of communism in Europe and in Poland especially. He converted Poland into a solid Catholic nation. He also revewed the faith among a whole generation of young Catholics all over the world. Hence the term John Paul generation.
Posted by: adobe at November 28, 2008 12:58 PM
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