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Exposing the role that Islamic jihad theology and ideology play in the modern global conflicts

Turkey condemns Armenian Genocide resolution in U.S. Senate

Apr 12, 2014 7:56 am By Robert Spencer

Morgenthau336Here yet again we see the phenomenon that we have seen so many, many times: Islamic supremacists cannot handle the slightest criticism. Nor can they defend their own actions, or take responsibility for them. So instead, they try to shut down their critics forcibly. This condemnation of the Armenian Genocide resolution is another manifestation of the same authoritarian impulse that got Ayaan Hirsi Ali canceled at Brandeis, and that gets so many defenders of freedom canceled everywhere.

The one thing that Islamic supremacists cannot and will not do is have an honest discussion and debate with their foes — they instead just claim victim status and shout down their opponents. Yesterday while waiting in the green room to speak at the Global Faith Institute event on the Muslim Brotherhood in the Heartland in Lincoln, Nebraska, I received some tweets from Joseph Lumbard, a convert to Islam who is Professor and Chair of Islamic and Middle Eastern Studies in the department of Near Eastern and Judaic Studies at Brandeis University. Lumbard accused me repeatedly of being “confused” by facts, whereupon I challenged him to a debate. He readily accepted, saying: “anytime any place. I will dominate you!” I asked him to email me to set up the details of time, place, topic and parameters, but he did not do so; instead, he continued to hurl insults and false charges on Twitter. It became clear that he, too, despite his exalted academic status, was incapable of defending his positions or refuting mine. He preferred, as I wrote later in the exchange, to pretend that we had already debated and that he had won.

This, too, was a manifestation of the same phenomenon we see here. Turkey doesn’t want to debate or discuss what happened at the time of the Armenian Genocide. It doesn’t want to have a “dialogue.” All it wants is to claim that those who tell the truth about the Armenian Genocide are motivated by “hate,” and to bully them into silence.

“Turkey condemns ‘Armenian genocide’ resolution in U.S. Senate,” from Reuters, April 11 (thanks to AINA):

(Reuters) – Turkey condemned on Friday a U.S. Senate committee resolution branding the massacre of Armenians by Ottoman forces during World War One as genocide and warned Congress against taking steps that would harm Turkish-American ties.

The nature and scale of the killings remain highly contentious nearly a century after they took place. Turkey accepts that many Armenians died in partisan fighting beginning in 1915, but denies that up to 1.5 million were killed and that this constituted an act of genocide – a term used by many Western historians and foreign parliaments.

The resolution, adopted by the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations on Thursday, called “to remember and observe the anniversary of the Armenian Genocide on April 24, 2014”.

“The President should work toward an equitable, constructive, stable, and durable Armenian-Turkish relationship that includes the full acknowledgment by … Turkey of the facts about the Armenian Genocide,” the text of the resolution said.

The Turkish Foreign Ministry said the committee had acted beyond its position, competence and responsibility by adopting a “hastily and ineptly prepared” draft resolution.

“We reject this attempt at political exploitation that distorts history and law and we condemn those who led this prejudiced initiative,” the ministry said in a statement.

“TRAGIC EVENTS”

It said Turks and Armenians could reach a “just memory of the tragic 1915 events” and that an earlier proposal from Ankara to set up a joint historical commission remained on the agenda.

Armenia did not take up the Turkish offer because it regards the genocide as an established historic fact and believes Turkey would use such a commission to press its own version of events.

“It is essential that the U.S. Congress engages in efforts aimed at strengthening our historic alliance … instead of damaging Turkish-American bilateral ties,” it added.

Last December, Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu made Turkey’s first high-level visit to Armenia in nearly five years, raising the prospect of a revival in peace efforts between the historical rivals which stalled in 2010.

The legacy of the killings has remained a major obstacle to reviving frozen relations between Turkey and its small former Soviet eastern neighbour.

Armenia accuses the Ottoman authorities at the time of systematically massacring large numbers of Armenians, then deporting many more, including women, children and the elderly and infirm in terrible conditions on so-called death marches.

The issue has long been a source of tension between Turkey and several Western countries, especially the United States and France, both home to large ethnic Armenian diasporas.

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Filed Under: "Islamophobia", Armenian Genocide, claiming victim status, free speech, Jihadist intimidation and thuggery, Turkey, United States Tagged With: featured


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Comments

  1. duh_swami says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 8:23 am

    Early US gov treated native Americans much the same way. But it grew out of that and eventually the gov partly made up for it by allowing , ‘Indian Casino’s’. I know an Native American woman who is a member of a casino operating tribe. She is married with three children. All 5 of the family receive $2000 each every month from the tribe. Or so she told me. I don’t know what they do with all that money, they certainly don’t spend it on a fancy house or car.
    At least the US gov eventually realized a lot of their actions against, ‘Indians’ was unjustified. Not so with the Turks. They are stuck in Islam and only see through the glass of Allah. To make a long story short, what this means is, Mahoundians are always innocent, even when they are not…

    • Arjay says

      Apr 12, 2014 at 12:43 pm

      Hey, everyone. I used to post on the exposing Jihad & Muslim supremacist sites a lot more frequently. Have only done a couple times recently.

      Some may remember, I have mentioned I am a Native American Indian and I have had way too many experiences with Islamist supremacism in my life- no matter where I was living. Even in areas of a very small (at that time) Muslim population I would unfortunately be interacting with Mohammed’s followers.

      Anyway, duh_swami, I know Indian (US version) tribal people who whether through a casino or some other tribal business venture or investment… will receive regular payments. Not always monthly- some end up being quarterly or annually. Also, $2,000 if that was the sum your acquaintance received is a rather high one.

      Of the Indians I know who get such compensation… they joke that they are like a has-been actor who gets residual checks from some sitcom originally airing 20 years ago. In other words the compensation is not that much. A quarterly check for $60 or an annual one for $38.12 isn’t unheard of. Not every tribe has or wants a casino. Others still if they have such a thing- it is sometimes on tribal land (a reservation or nation- which the two are not the same thing) or it can be “owned” by the tribe but many miles (or even states away from tribal land). Some of these casinos are “technically owned” by a tribe but it is “managed” or “run by proxy” by other sources or groups. Translated… what may be “in the name of an Indian people” it really doesn’t benefit them.

      Also, American Indians (or Native Americans)- I really don’t care which term to describe us “collectively”… can and do vote in USA elections and some have been elected to office in local, county, state and national government. We pay taxes. The “Indians don’t pay taxes” only applies in certain situations and not to all Indians. We, Indians also have served in the USA military. There are many patriotic Indians.

      I don’t know if any of you have been to an American Indian cultural event called a pow-wow… which with some tribes are called “big times.” A part of the event is called “Grand Entry” which is very solemn and usually as tribal, state & military branch flags are they are following the US flag. Also, today American Indian military veterans are our “modern warriors” and are greatly respected at pow-wows and many times there are special dances honoring veterans in attendance.

      There are also 500 separate federally recognized American Indian tribes and Alaskan Native villages; plus state recognized tribes and those people who are descended from “historic” or terminated (politically with government) tribes who still exist culturally and maintain their family ties. Plus the “indigenous” Americans contain the Canadian Metis who exist on this side of the border, the Native Hawaiians, Native Samoans (American Samoa territory) and Chamorro (the native people of the USA territory of Guam).

      Many Chamorro people I know are very active in the Guam for US Statehood movement.

      Anyway, we are a somewhat diverse group. However, a new enemy is lurking about. Are Jihad Watch readers aware of the growing interest Islamic states (including Turkey) have in American Indian tribes and reservations and nations? Some Indians are thinking this is fine- others are very alarmed at this trend which seems to be growing.

      Many Muslims have told me personally that Australian Aborigines, New Zealand Maori, Canadian First Nations (Indian, Metis & Inuit-Eskimo) as well as myself (and “Indigenous” populations as a whole) are not “Native” to any of the above lands in which we reside. The followers of Islam are actually the only “true” Australians, Canadians, New Zealanders, etcetera.

      Really? If Canadian Eskimos were living in the Yukon before the 7th century and Australian Aborigines were being hunter-gatherers in the Australian outback before the 7th century and when New Zealand Maori landed in their present day home in the 800s-1300s??? AND FOUND NO MUSLIMS THERE… and of course as an American Indian, I don’t remember any Elders telling me stories of chiefs or warriors of the distant past being named “Mohammed”…

      Then WHERE ARE THE MUSLIMS GETTING THIS NOTION FROM? Also, they seem to want any resources, property, mining or fishing rights, etcetera that might have a connection to “native” people.

      The most recent example of this was a short very quiet Alaskan Eskimo girl I know who related to me that Muslims in her Anchorage apartment building kept harassing her with this belief that “Alaska” originally belonged to “Islam.”
      Apparently this Muslim has no concept how Alaska became the 49th state or the Russian colonial era or the many Eskimo and Alaskan Indian villages that existed for generations in America’s last frontier. She also said they were real bullies and hated Jewish people… and didn’t like the very small Jewish population in Anchorage- believing they “controlled the state’s economy and legislature.” No matter how hard this little Eskimo girl tried to tell the Muslims the Jewish people she knew were very nice and THEY DID NOT control Alaska… the Muslims refused to believe her.

      So…. Jewish readers of Jihad Watch… Never Fear! You have a little Eskimo girl standing up against Islamic anti-Semitism in America’s biggest state!

      • voegelinian says

        Apr 12, 2014 at 3:07 pm

        Native peoples such as the various ones you list from various regions all belong in Islamic terms to a category outside the “People of the Book”. Originally, the “People of the Book” were only the Jews, Christians and “Sabians” (whoever the hell they were; they certainly are irrelevant now). Later, Muslims in an incoherently hypocritical demonstration of adaptation that should be forbidden under their own conception as “innovation” (Bida’a) incorporated the Persian Zoroastrians and the Hindus as additional “Peoples of the Book”. However, there remain many so-called pagan or polytheist (whom modern anthropologists like to call “animist”) peoples around the world who would fall outside the traditional Islamic “protection” accorded to these “Peoples of the Book” under the pact of dhimmitude (which isn’t an acceptable “protection” anyway, under the terms of civilization and human rights).

        I.e., if Muslims had their way, they would massacre American Indians without thinking twice, as so much vermin they needed to get out of the way so they could proceed with their conquest unimpeded. (If the American Indians in question were Christian, of course, they would be considered “People of the Book”).

        • Defcon 4 says

          Apr 13, 2014 at 3:04 am

          Zoroastrians have been ruthlessly persecuted in their native homeland: Iranistan. In fact, so much so, that the LARGEST population of Zoroastrians is no longer found in their homeland Iran, but in India.

        • voegelinian says

          Apr 13, 2014 at 10:11 am

          The centuries-long ethnic cleansing by Muslims of both Hindus and Zoroastrians testifies to the tenuousness of the “protection” supposed to be afforded under the dhimma pact. As usual in Islam, loopholes in the letter of the law permit untold viciousness.

  2. mortimer says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 8:32 am

    Ad hominems are not ‘an argument’. Islam is a house of cards. Islam cannot be defended in any way: morally, historically or logically. Muslims know this, admit it to one another, and cravenly avoid debate since they always lose against a well-informed Islamologist. Always.

    Muslim apologists know they have no argument but haven’t the courage to concede that no intellectual support exists for Islam which can only be defended with violence. They haven’t the maturity or courage to face the lack of evidence and leave this Death Cult.

    • Diane Harvey says

      Apr 12, 2014 at 8:39 am

      Well stated.

  3. ApolloSpeaks says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 8:42 am

    EVERYONE KNOWS THAT THE ARMENIAN GENOCIDE

    was part of a Rothchild’s plot using bloodthirsty Zionists like Vladimir Jabitinsky and the pro-Zionist Young Turks to subvert the caliphate and de-Islamize Turkey. Don’t believe me? Google “Jews Plotted The Armenian Holocaust | Real Jew News ” for a good Saturday morning laugh.

    • Defcon 4 says

      Apr 12, 2014 at 1:40 pm

      @ApolloSpeaks

      Unbelievable. The scuzzlums are actually trying to pin the blame for the Armenian Genocide on the Jews (aka. “Zionists”). That is, when they admit there was any such genocide at all.

      • PGuud says

        Apr 12, 2014 at 5:14 pm

        “Scapegoat” comes to mind.

        Islam: where freedom ends and slavery begins.

        • Defcon 4 says

          Apr 13, 2014 at 3:07 am

          I like your aphorism. It really summarizes islam in a neatly and concisely.

        • PGuud says

          Apr 13, 2014 at 3:26 pm

          @Defcon 4,

          Thanks.

          Islam: where freedom ends and slavery begins.

    • Johan says

      Apr 13, 2014 at 8:46 am

      Which is exactly why the ADL won’t recognise the Armenian Holocaust. The ADL is in my view the most evil organisation in the whole of the US, worse even than the despicable CAIR.

  4. mortimer says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 8:45 am

    Talat Pasha
    In a conversation with Dr. Mordtmann of the German Embassy in June 1915…
    ‘Turkey is taking advantage of the war in order to thoroughly liquidate (grundlich aufzaumen) its internal foes, i.e., the indigenous Christians, without being thereby disturbed by foreign intervention. What on earth do you want? The question is settled. There are no more Armenians.’

    Prince Abdul Mecid (the Last Caliph)
    Heir-Apparent to the Ottoman Throne, during an interview and later Caliph of Islam from 1922 until 1924…
    “I refer to those awful massacres. They are the greatest stain that has ever disgraced our nation and race. They were entirely the work of Talat and Enver. I heard some days before they began that they were intended. I went to Istanbul and insisted on seeing Enver. I asked him if it was true that they intended to recommence the massacres which had been our shame and disgrace under Abdul Hamid. The only reply I could get from him was: ‘It is decided. It is the program.’”

    Mustafa Arif
    Minister of Interior stated on 13 December 1918…
    “Surely a few Armenians aided and abetted our enemy, and a few Armenian Deputies committed crimes against the Turkish nation… it is incumbent upon a government to pursue the guilty ones. Unfortunately, our wartime leaders, imbued with a spirit of brigandage, carried out the law of deportation in a manner that could surpass the proclivities of the most bloodthirsty bandits. They decided to exterminate the Armenians, and they did exterminate them.’

    Henry Morgenthau, Sr.
    U.S. Ambassador to the Ottoman Empire Ambassador Morgenthau’s Story, 1919
    ‘When the Turkish authorities gave the orders for these deportations, they were merely giving the death warrant to a whole race; they understood this well, and, in their conversations with me, they made no particular attempt to conceal the fact. . . . I am confident that the whole history of the human race contains no such horrible episode as this. The great massacres and persecutions of the past seem almost insignificant when compared to the sufferings of the Armenian race in 1915.’

    Theodore Roosevelt
    May 11, 1918, letter to Cleveland Hoadley Dodge
    ‘. . . the Armenian massacre was the greatest crime of the war, and the failure to act against Turkey is to condone it . . . the failure to deal radically with the Turkish horror means that all talk of guaranteeing the future peace of the world is mischievous nonsense.’

    Prof. Colin Tatz, Director, Centre for Comparative Genocide Studies
    ‘ The Turkish denial [of the Armenian Genocide] is probably the foremost example of historical perversion. With a mix of academic sophistication and diplomatic thuggery — of which we at Macquarie University have been targets — the Turks have put both memory and history into reverse gear.’
    Stanley Cohen, Professor of Criminology, Hebrew University, Jerusalem
    ‘ The nearest successful example [of collective denial] in the modern era is the 80 years of official denial by successive Turkish governments of the 1915-17 genocide against the Armenians in which 1.5 million people lost their lives. This denial has been sustained by deliberate propaganda, lying and cover-ups, forging documents, suppression of archives, and bribing scholars.’

    • Beth says

      Apr 12, 2014 at 12:06 pm

      Excellent post Mortimer.

  5. miriam rove says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 9:00 am

    I am in south of France attending an event called Mip TV. It is the largest gathering of entertainment companies world wide. While most of what I do is within the US, large numbers of Turkish entertainments companies are here. I approached some of them talking about what is happening to their country and once they knew I was Iranian they opened up. They are terrified of what Erdogan and his band of Islamists are doing. Most of them seem to have no control of this and some of them have already given in. It is a tragedy what is going on in Turkey. It is going backwards and the jihadists will never accept that they murdered 1.5 million Armenians and to be more clear Christians and thus infidels. M

    • Defcon 4 says

      Apr 12, 2014 at 1:58 pm

      @miriam rove

      It wasn’t just Armenian Christians, some million odd Assyrian Christians were slaughtered/enslaved by muslims (Turkish AND Kurdish).

      • voegelinian says

        Apr 12, 2014 at 3:10 pm

        Also Greek Christians.

        • Defcon 4 says

          Apr 13, 2014 at 3:11 am

          I had an Armenian friend whose grandmother’s entire family was wiped out by Turkish islam0nazis. Why did his grandmother live? She was a pretty young thing and taken as a slave by Turkish islam0nazis, who thought themselves morally righteous because they “saved” her.
          She later escaped her Turkish muslime slave-owners, and that is a story I would’ve liked to have heard more about.

      • PGuud says

        Apr 12, 2014 at 5:27 pm

        Why Turks Were Capable of Exterminating Armenians, But Not Jews

        http://asbarez.com/121614/why-turks-were-capable-of-exterminating-armenians-but-not-jews/

        Islam: where freedom ends and slavery begins.

  6. Charli Main says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 9:31 am

    ” who, after all, speaks today of the annihilation of the Armenians ?
    Adolf Hitler, 1939.
    The German extermination of the Jews in Europe, using Death Camps and Death Marches, was copied from and based on the Turkish model used by them in the extermination of Armenian, Greek and Syrian Christians.

    • Jay Boo says

      Apr 12, 2014 at 10:38 am

      I wonder if Hitler’s ancestors came from Turkey.

      • Charli Main says

        Apr 12, 2014 at 11:42 am

        I have read somewhere that Adolf Hitler was in fact the illegitimate son of the Austrian Jewish merchant that his mother worked for.
        When his mother announced that little Adolf was on the way, she was promptly thrown out on to the streets and went on to instil a hatred of Jews in Adolf.
        Given your wide knowledge base, you probably know much more about this ” story” than I do.

        • Jay Boo says

          Apr 12, 2014 at 12:52 pm

          Not a clue and no offence to ‘moderate’ secular Turks intended

          Merely speculating that Hitler’s hatred of Jews might have some connection to the filthy disgusting ideology of the Serpent of Satan false prophet Muhammad.
          I guess that your research completely absolves Islamic ideology of the blame.

        • Charli Main says

          Apr 12, 2014 at 1:26 pm

          My” research” does not exonerate Islamic ideology of anything.
          Like you, I was merely speculating that there was possibly more than one reason for Hitler´s hatred of Jews.
          For all I know, Adolf Hitler may well have been indoctrinated in Islamic ideology, at a local Mosque, in 19th century Austria.

        • Jay Boo says

          Apr 12, 2014 at 2:01 pm

          Agreed
          BTW
          I should have noted that the first comment was excellent.

        • voegelinian says

          Apr 12, 2014 at 3:15 pm

          As far as I know, no reputable scholar maintains that Hitler had Jewish ancestry. What scholars do need to research, however, is the obvious affinity Hitler had with Islam — his obvious interest and erudition in its history and tenets; his profound admiration for it, already seen in the 1920s. A megalomaniac and obsessive fanatic like Hitler didn’t dabble in things casually.

          For example, an Indian Muslim activist named al-Mashriqi met with Hitler more than once in the 1920s. In al-Mashriqi’s own account of his meeting with Hitler in 1926:

          “I was astounded when he [Hitler] told me that he knew about my [book about Islamic Jihad titled] Tazkirah. The news flabbergasted me. . . I found him very congenial and piercing. He discussed Islamic Jihad with me in details.”

          For more, see:

          http://hesperado.blogspot.com/2008/10/hitler-and-islam_28.html

  7. RG says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 10:46 am

    “….Joseph Lumbard, a convert to Islam who is Professor and Chair of Islamic and Middle Eastern Studies in the department of Near Eastern and Judaic Studies at Brandeis University”.

    Yeah, so after reading what we did about Ayaan Hirsi Ali, how did we all know that Brandeis’ faculty and staff have been infiltrated and compromised and un-Americanized????

    What’s really a totally hilarious zombie-fest here is that Lumbard (born and bred in America by American parents and teachers) now calls himself THE AUTHORITY on Middle Eastern Studies. But of course he knows more than all of the 1400 years of islamic “scholars” who went before him–ALL OF WHOM HAVE LIED THROUGH THEIR TEETH TO DEFEND ISLAM!

    There’s no one stupider than some upstart nut-job who thinks he can defend the guy who’s just tried to KILL him!!!!!

    • Huck Folder says

      Apr 16, 2014 at 11:25 pm

      Signatories to the “Hate Ayaan Hirsi Ali” letter to Prof. Frederick Lawrence, Brandeis University. Is he a coward, or did it take that long to get to him?

      45 Joseph Lumbard, NEJS, IMES, HOID, PRS

      JOSEPH LUMBARD

      Joseph Lumbard, assistant professor of classical Islam, researches Islamic intellectual traditions with an emphasis on Sufism and Islamic philosophy. He is the editor of “Islam, Fundamentalism, and the Betrayal of Tradition” (World Wisdom, 2004), a collection of essays that examines the religious, political and historical factors that have led to the rise of Islamic fundamentalism.

      Joseph Lumbard, Lown 209, (781) 736-2971, lumbard@brandeis.edu

  8. pongidae rex says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 11:18 am

    When Muslims form the majority in Europe, which is a mathematical certainty if current immigration-driven demographic trends continue, you can expect yet another genocide in Europe. The next genocide will be against the descendents of Europeans who threw open the floodgates to mass Muslim immigration. To believe the outcome of a mass Muslim invasion into a non-Muslim region will be ‘different this time’ than the universal historical pattern is to believe that Islam and human beings have fundamantally changed. They have not. Just as in 1914, Europe is marching once more into a slaughterhouse. Europeans must be the stupidest people on earth. Each generation seems determined to destroy the next.

  9. Arjay says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 1:19 pm

    Every so often when there is some act of Islamic terrorism (that is actually mentioned as being Islamic in origin)… I know people who will state that “its a good thing Muslims were never involved in the World Wars” or “What if Islam starts a World War.”

    Well, they are shocked when I tell people that Muslims ACTUALLY DID PARTICIPATE IN BOTH WORLD WARS IN MAJOR WAYS.

    This article on the Armenian Genocide is a perfect example.

    During WW Two there were the “Axis Powers” but during WW One the “bad guys” were the “Central Powers.” They were Germany, Austrio-Hungary and the Ottoman Empire (WHICH WAS ISLAMIC TURKEY’S EMPIRE). Turkey would not embrace secularism until the war was over, its empire dismantled and this was in 1922.

    Yes, one of the 3 Central Powers against the Allies during the First World War was an ISLAMIC STATE. It was this Islamic state- an EMPIRE actually that sided against the allies of Great Britain, Australia, Canada, France, Russia and the USA amongst other allied nations.

    The Australians spilled blood in horrific numbers fighting the Turks during WW One. By the way… it has been nearly a century since those battles- and a thank you goes out to any of Jihad Watch’s Australian readers. Your nation’s sacrifices have not been forgotten.

    It was this MEMBER of the BIG THREE Central Powers- Turkey, an Islamic state that committed the horrific genocide of Armenians in World War One.(and lesser extent Greeks and Assyrians at different times).

    Then WWII. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem was a personal friend of Hitler’s and lived a high lifestyle in Berlin. He was responsible in helping bringing about the death of 350,000-400,000 Jews during the Holocaust (almost all women and children). He visited a concentration camp and had plans to help organize the Final Solution in the Middle-East and British Mandate Palestine if the Germans ever were able to conquer those regions. This was one of thee most prominent Muslim leaders/religious clerics of his day.

    Then there were the puppet states- the Muslim ones that were propped up during WWII by the Nazis. Bosnia and Croatia, and the Muslim minority in Serbia were BRUTAL. The Muslims swelled the ranks of the local SS Units. They gleefully participated in mass extermination of Jews.

    They beat to death homosexuals in the streets, raped Eastern Orthodox and Catholic Nuns, burned down or closed synagogues and churches (whether Eastern Orthodox, Roman Catholic or from the small representation of Protestant denominations. Ethnic groups were persecuted, women’s rights were restricted and the Muslims were turning these regions into hellholes as they rapidly and rabidly (with a “b”) became Nazi vassal states.

    So, think about… two world wars and Muslims and Islam played a HUGE part in the mayhem, destruction, suffering and genocide that happened during those difficult times. So, Muslims and World War One, Muslims and World War Two…

    Are we going to see Muslims causing or being super involved IN THEIR THIRD WORLD WAR?

    • Defcon 4 says

      Apr 12, 2014 at 2:04 pm

      “Turkey would not embrace secularism until the war was over, its empire dismantled and this was in 1922.”

      Tell that to the najjis kaffir who used to live in the 40% of Cyprus now run by and for islam0nazis. Or the najjis kaffir victims of the Istanbul pogrom.

      • Arjay says

        Apr 12, 2014 at 2:27 pm

        @DefCon4 I’m aware of the Turkish government’s illegal occupation of Northern Cyprus and the horrors experienced by Greek Cypriots who flee to the south. My reference was that The Ottoman Empire was part of the Central Powers that were the belligerents in WW One.

        They lost. The Ottoman Empire based in Istanbul (which was actually the Islamists conquering Judeo-Christian Constantinople) was dismantled. The Caliphate was declared void… and this happened beginning in 1918 when the war ended… to secularism being established in 1922. Even with secularism- Islamist supremacism still reared its head in Turkey- as you mentioned with Cyprus and the Istanbul riots.

        However, my comments dealt with WWI and WWII, just as this Armenian Genocide article was about events taking place during WW I.

        • Defcon 4 says

          Apr 13, 2014 at 3:17 am

          “Secular” Turkey never took responsibility for their genocide of some 2.5 million Assyrian and Armenian Christians, much less paid reparations. No one was held responsible for this genocide — except extra-judicially, by Armenians (and G-d bless them for doing so).

      • voegelinian says

        Apr 12, 2014 at 3:27 pm

        The “secularism” Turkey “embraced” in the aftermath of WWI was also the result of an internal revolution and coup d’etat by a Muslim apparently influenced by Western Enlightenment ideas, Ataturk. Once in power, he did do a few things to constrain the influence of Islam in Turkey (e.g., banning the veil in public; or having the government monitor mosques and censor any Friday sermons to weed out the subversion typical of such; etc.). Ataturk was the prototype of the phenomenon we saw pop up elsewhere in the 20th century in various parts of the Muslim world: the Tin Pot Dictator who would in varying degrees try to constrain and tame the natural Islamic beast within his nation, in exchange for a relationship” with the dominant geopolitical powers (at first Great Britain and Europe; increasingly as the 20th century unfolded, America). Other typical examples of this type — the Father and Son Shahs of Iran; the Bourguiba dynastry of Tunisia; the King Mohammed dynasty of Morocco; the so-called “nationalist” Nasser and then Sadat, then Mubarrak. This type was not monolithic: they manifested varying degrees of cooperation with the West and varying degrees of willingness to constrain Islam. At one end of this spectrum was Ataturk, at the other end the whackjobs Khaddafi and Saddam; somewhere in between, perhaps, Assad père; and so forth.

  10. Guy Macher says

    Apr 12, 2014 at 4:49 pm

    I’ve spoken with survivors of the genocide. I know it happened and so do all Turks, but being Muslim they lie about it.

    • Defcon 4 says

      Apr 13, 2014 at 3:18 am

      I’ve had a Turkish muslime try and tell me the Armenian Genocide was a defensive reaction by Turkish scuzzlums to acts of Armenian aggression. He also denied the Istanbul pogrom.

  11. Alan says

    Apr 13, 2014 at 3:06 am

    Interesting. Wonder what the real solution to the world’s muslim problem is? Seems like the west and the rest of the worls’s non-muslim population is incapable of truly winning once and for all against this scourge of humankind…I always like to think of what our world would look like if it was a world without Islam. Better I am sure.

  12. Reality Check says

    Apr 13, 2014 at 5:52 am

    “… and warned Congress against taking steps that would harm Turkish-American ties.”

    Turkish-American ties? Who cares? And since when is Turkey so important as to make good ties with her important?

  13. dumbledoresarmy says

    May 10, 2014 at 4:21 am

    The Turkish Muslims have been playing this game of threatening and trying to silence anyone who tells the truth about what Turkish – and Kurdish, and Arab – Muslims did to at least a million Armenian, Assyrian and Greek Christians, between the 1890s and 1923, for years and years and years.

    One particularly egregious way in which they have done this is by effectively preventing Hollywood from doing a decent rendition of the Franz Werfel’s epic book, “The Forty Days of Musa Dargh”, which was published in the early 1930s, and tells the story of a group of Armenians who fought back against their tormentors, and who were – miraculously – assisted and rescued by a courageous French naval captain.

    Here’s the story of Turkish Muslim attempts to kill all attempts to make it into a film (and one may also note that they attempted to stifle publication of the book, in the first place).

    http://www.newenglishreview.org/blog_direct_link.cfm/blog_id/43425

    Friday, 10 August 2012
    The Turkish Lobby Played a Long Game – And Won

    http://www.algemeiner.com/2012/08/10/the-turkish-lobby-played-a-long-game-–-and-won/

    And they have their shills and Genocide Deniers, pushing their barrow for them. Here’s an account of one, who visited Australia last year:

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-15/armenian-genocide-denier-to-speak-at-parliament-house/5095656

    “Armenian genocide denier Justin McCarthy to speak at Parliament House”

    “…Turkey has long denied the charge and only recently pledged to ban the entire New South Wales Parliament from Gallipoli ceremonies after they unanimously passed a motion recognising the genocide…”.

    Every time *anybody* listens to the Armenians and believes them, the Turkish Muslims scream with rage, deny the fact of Muslim mass-murder of non-Muslims in Muslim-majority Turkey 1890s-1923, and try to bully them into backing down.

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