“Critics have accused her of being part of a Zionist conspiracy to make Islam look bad. ‘I say, “If I am, where is my paycheck?”‘ Ms. Dadabhoy said drolly.” It’s something we have seen again and again from Islamic supremacists and their Leftist allies: the venomous hatred of Israel, combined with the paranoid certainty that the Zionists must be behind every misfortune.
Also noteworthy in this article is the blandly noted observation that “religious Muslims generally insist on the literal truth of the Quran.” Generally when foes of jihad terror bring up verses like “slay the pagans wherever you find them” (9:5), we’re told that only greasy Islamophobes believe that any Muslims take those verses literally.
“Leaving Islam for Atheism, and Finding a Much-Needed Place Among Peers,” by Mark Oppenheimer, New York Times, May 23, 2014:
ALEXANDRIA, Va. — Women talked about “coming out,” being open with their families, leaving “the closet” at a conference here this month. But the topic was not sexuality. Instead, the women, attending the third Women in Secularism conference were talking about being atheists. Some grew up Catholic, some Jewish, some Protestant — but nearly all described journeys of acknowledging atheism first to themselves, then to loved ones. Going public was a last, often painful, step.
Anyone leaving a close-knit belief-based community risks parental disappointment, rejection by friends and relatives, and charges of self-loathing. The process can be especially difficult and isolating for women who have grown up Muslim, who are sometimes accused of trying to assimilate into a Western culture that despises them.
“It was incredibly painful,” Heina Dadabhoy, 26, said during a discussion called “Women Leaving Religion,” which also featured three former Christians and one formerly observant Jew, the novelist Rebecca Newberger Goldstein. “My entire life, my identity, was being a good Muslim woman.”
Ms. Dadabhoy, a web developer who lives in Orange County, Calif., and who often gives talks about leaving Islam, said the hardest part of the process was opening up to her family.
“The sense they got was where I was turning my back on them,” Ms. Dadabhoy said. Her parents accused her of thinking that she was better than her grandparents and other ancestors. “You think what you have is better than what we have? You think you’re like those white people,” Ms. Dadabhoy recalled them saying.
There are few role models for former Muslims, and although the religion’s history contains some notable skeptics, very few of them are women. Today, Muslim feminists like Irshad Manji and Amina Wadud advocate more liberal attitudes toward women in Islam, but neither has left the faith. And many atheists resist identifying with Ayaan Hirsi Ali, the Somali-American (by way of the Netherlands) whose vehement criticism of Islam is seen, even by many other atheists, as harsh.
One group that seeks to bridge that gap is Ex-Muslims of North America, which had an information table in the exhibition hall. Members of the group, founded last year in Washington and Toronto, recognize that their efforts might seem radical to some, and take precautions when admitting new members. Those interested in joining are interviewed in person before they are told where the next meeting will be held. The group has grown quickly to about a dozen chapters, in cities including Boston, Chicago, Houston, New York and San Francisco.
One of the group’s founders who was at the conference, Sadaf Ali, 23, an Afghan-Canadian, said that she had once been “a fairly practicing Muslim.”
During childhood, she said, “I was always fairly defiant.” As she grew older, she struggled with depression, and she thought that praying more and reading the Quran would help. She became more religious and looked forward to a traditional life. “I thought my life was sort of set out for me: get married, have children,” Ms. Ali said. “I might go to school. I’ll have a very domestic life. That’s what my family did, what my forefathers did.”
But as a university student, her feelings began to change.
“As I started to investigate the religion, I realized I was talking to myself,” Ms. Ali said. “Nobody was listening to me. I had just entered the University of Toronto, and critical thinking was a big part of my studies. I have an art history and writing background, and I realized every verse I had come across” — in the Quran — “was explicitly or implicitly sexist.”
Quickly, her faith crumbled.
“So in 2009, I realized there probably is no God,” she said. “What is so wrong in having a boyfriend, or having premarital sex? What is wrong with wanting to eat and drink water before the sun goes down during Ramadan? What is so wrong with that? I couldn’t handle the cognitive dissonance anymore.”
For the next three years, Ms. Ali thought of herself as an agnostic. She stopped practicing Islam. She still had Muslim friends, and her brother married into a religious Muslim family. Slowly, younger friends and relatives figured things out. “They didn’t seem to care that I wasn’t Muslim,” Ms. Ali said. “But I didn’t go around telling my parents.”
Eventually, her parents heard.
“They were incredibly upset, as they believe in an eternal hell,” Ms. Ali said. “They are O.K. with me for the most part being irreligious,” she added. “But we don’t talk much about it anymore, and that’s fine.”
The members of Ex-Muslims are adamant that they respect others’ right to practice Islam. The group’s motto is “No Bigotry and No Apologism,” and text on its website is inclusive: “We understand that Muslims come in all varieties, and we do not and will not partake in erasing the diversity within the world’s Muslims.”
But they are equally adamant that it is still too difficult for Muslims inclined to atheism to follow their thinking where it may lead. Whereas skeptical Christians or Jews can take refuge in reformist wings of their tradition, religious Muslims generally insist on the literal truth of the Quran.
“I would say it’s maybe 0.1 percent who are willing to challenge the foundations of the faith,” said Nas Ishmael, another founder of the Ex-Muslims group who attended the conference.
So those who do challenge the foundations can feel isolated. According to Ms. Ali and her colleagues in Ex-Muslims of North America, they frequently hear from others, who say, “I thought I was the only one.”
When Ms. Dadabhoy “came out” to her parents, “it didn’t go so well,” she said. “They reacted the way they knew how, which was to freak out. They had never heard of anybody leaving Islam. We were raised with the idea you can’t leave, that nobody can leave. Leaving Islam was something somebody incredibly deranged would do. Or if forced at sword point or gunpoint.”
Critics have accused her of being part of a Zionist conspiracy to make Islam look bad. “I say, ‘If I am, where is my paycheck?’ ” Ms. Dadabhoy said drolly….
IQ al Rassooli says
Based upon my 30+ years of studying the subjects of Islam, I KNOW how difficult it is to throw away the shackles of 1400 years of INDOCTRINATION!
As usual, Muslims cannot ever face Facts & Reality nor use Logic regarding their CULT belief system. This is WHY they BLAME all their self inflicted misfortunes on Western Imperialists, Zionists, Jews, Christians, Hindus etc but NEVER themselves!
Muhammad’s Quran does NOT allow for MODERATION. Jihad and only Jihadi Muslims are PERFECT Muslims. So called ‘moderate Muslims’ are a FIGMENT of the imagination of utterly stupid Western leaders in Politics Academia Clergy & Media.
When one studies – dispassionately and fairly – Muhammad’s Quran & Hadith the only conclusion one would come to is that Muhammad, his Quran, His Sunna & Sharia are Hatemongering Racist Warmongering Duplicitous Intolerant Misogynist Disloyal and hence totally Ungodly
Humans should NOT be judged as to whether or NOT they believe in a Creator but in the way they treat each other with MUTUAL respect and tolerance
IQ al Rassooli
Kafir & Proud!
Jeff says
Thank you for all the work you do in exposing the hypocrisy, nonsense, and lies found in Islam. I continue to listen to your “Idiot’s Guide to Islam” on youtube.
PRCS says
I disagree.
Althought there is no “moderate” islam, there ARE “moderate” Muslims. Maybe even most of the world’s Muslims can be called moderate; if the label means not fully compliant.
Assuming that literate Muslims KNOW the amputation of a fellow human being’s hand(s) for theft is one of Allah’s very own commands, is their failure to fully comply not an act of moderation?
Similar to Catholics who DO use artificial birth control methods despite the Church’s teachings.
Unfortunately, the idea of “moderate” Muslims sets up the false notion that Muslims intent on full compliance are “extremists”. They’re literalists, of course, as the article notes:
“religious Muslims generally insist on the literal truth of the Quran”.
IQ al Rassooli says
With all due respect Bull Crap!
Where do you find those ‘moderate’ Muslims?
In my country Iraq?
Hamas? Hezbullah? Yemen? Libya? Syria? Afghanistan? Pakistan? Kashmir? Saudia? Qatar?
Just because they do not strap bombs and shoot people does NOT make them moderate since they actually agree with and support the Jihadis (the most PERFECT Muslims) with finance, intelligence and Taqiyyah!
The most persecuted people on Earth today are CHRISTIANS by your ‘moderate’ Muslims!
It is impossible to get through the warped mind set of so called liberals who are more than happy to TOLERATE Intolerant Islam
IQ al Rassooli
Kafir & Proud!
Charli Main says
Absolutely spot on assessment of the Muslim mind set.
There are no moderate/peaceful/tolerant Muslims, just Muslims that are currently not engaging in Jihad.
Just because a snake doesn´t bite you, doesn´t make it a moderate/peaceful/tolerant snake. Its still a snake——
PRCS says
Negative.
Tell me where EVERY Muslim is fully compliant, and wants to be.
Did you miss the thankfully short lived “American Muslim” program?
Tell me where EVERY Muslim woman believes in wife beating.
Tell me where EVERY Muslim is willing to amputate a thief’s hands; particularly the amputee.
Tell me where Islam tells any Muslim man, woman, or child to strap on a bomb and shoot people.
Bull Crap right back at you.
While the Qur’an does not allow for moderation, you note that “Jihad and only Jihadi Muslims are PERFECT Muslims.”
By that logic, there must be quite a few imperfect Muslims. No?
From what I read, the most persecuted people on earth are those not fully compliant Muslims.
And I hope you’re not assuming that I’m a liberal.
Mulakush says
IQ al Rassooli,
I hope that you are safe! Muslims are supposed to have killed you by now.
IQ al Rassooli says
Mulakush
They are trying BUT by the grace of God I am destined to have my Live TV interview on Prime Time in the USA!
Muslims cannot defend their indefensible CULT belief system hence MUST slaughter ALL those who reveal the FACTS just as their depraved mentor Muhammad did 1400 years ago
Thanlk you for your concern
IQ al Rassooli
Kafir & Proud!
Uri says
I know a passel of Jewish atheists. Some of my best friends are Jewish atheists. They do all the official duties – synagogue attendance thrice yearly – Passover with family etc – but it’s a cultural thing; they would never ever apostatize. That’s considered infidelity.
gravenimage says
Uri wrote:
I know a passel of Jewish atheists. Some of my best friends are Jewish atheists. They do all the official duties – synagogue attendance thrice yearly – Passover with family etc – but it’s a cultural thing; they would never ever apostatize. That’s considered infidelity.
…………………………….
Uri, I also know quite a few Jewish atheists, who still observe religious occasions with friends and family for cultural reasons. I know a number of Christians who do the same—some families know they are atheist, others do not.
But the fact is that there are plenty of Christian—*and* Jewish—atheists who have left the faith completely, and do not observe any religious rites or holidays whatsoever.
In some cases, their families are upset—but in *no* instances are they in any danger.
It is different with Islam, where there is the death penalty for apostasy—and where there is no Shari’ah state, the family or “community” is often all too happy to carry out the sentence.
You don’t find anything like this with Jews or Christians.
jewdog says
At http://www.faithfreedom.org, a website run by Muslim apostates, you can read more stories like this. The site’s cool master, Ali Sina, has a lot of fascinating arguments as he handles queries from Muslims.
Jaladhi says
What these Muslims are complaining about – Islam doesn’t anybody to discredit Islam. Islam does discredit itself without any kaffir’s help when it spews out hate against us and teaches its followers to kill us. Don’t Muslims know that?? Morons as usual!!
Jerry says
I have known, for close to fifty years
an Atheist woman who is often accused
by her Christian clleagues and acquaintances
of being a better Christian than they are.
gravenimage says
I wouldn’t consider that an “accusation”, Jerry—whether your friend practices formal Christianity or not, this is meant as a compliment!
gravenimage says
Ex-Muslim atheist accused of being part of Zionist conspiracy to discredit Islam
…………………………..
Of course—I mean. why would anyone actually want to leave such a lovely faith as islam? sarc/off
Bravo to Ms. Dadabhoy!
From the article:
Instead, the women, attending the third Women in Secularism conference were talking about being atheists. Some grew up Catholic, some Jewish, some Protestant — but nearly all described journeys of acknowledging atheism first to themselves, then to loved ones. Going public was a last, often painful, step.
Anyone leaving a close-knit belief-based community risks parental disappointment, rejection by friends and relatives, and charges of self-loathing. The process can be especially difficult and isolating for women who have grown up Muslim, who are sometimes accused of trying to assimilate into a Western culture that despises them…
…………………………..
Good grief—as though the hardest thing about leaving Islam were “Islamiphobia”. Also, look at what a closed loop *that* creates—no one can leave the horrific creed of Islam, because Infidels don’t always have the rosiest view of it, despite all the whitewash and Taqiyya…
But the most disingenuous part of this article is what *really* makes becoming an ex-Muslim a lot different from becoming an ex-Jew or an ex-Catholic—that Islam has the death penalty for apostates, and that even in the free West many families will carry out that penalty in the form of “Honor Killings”.
*That* is why it takes so much courage to leave Islam…
Bezelel says
Seems like an imaginary Berlin Wall that follows everywhere they go.
Salah says
When Muslims leave Islam (video)
http://crossmuslims.blogspot.ca/2014/01/egyptian-muslims-tear-up-quran.html
Raymond Hietapakka says
Joooo-on-the-Brain Disease should be classified as a verifiable MENTAL ILLNESS.
IQ al Rassooli says
PRCS
One does not have to be a Liberal to be out of touch with Facts & Reality and or in DENIAL!
Every Muslim cleric and every single Muslim mass murderer proclaim their deeds in the Name of Allah, Quran, Sharia & Islam and you a total Quran ignoramus person CONTRADICT them because you know presumably better!
The same with Obama, Cameron and most our clueless and spineless leaders.
The Fort Hood mass murderer slaughtered unarmed Americans while shouting “Allahu Akbar” repeatedly was because of ‘work place violence’
The two Black Muslims who butchered an unarmed British soldier while quoting verses of the Quran and shouting “Allahu Akbar” are NOT Extremists, Militants or Radicals. They are Muslims!
So far you are the only one out of tune with reality and am not going to waste any further time answering your asinine comments
IQ al Rassooli
Fafir & Proud!
PRCS says
“It is impossible to get through the warped mind set of so called liberals who are more than happy to TOLERATE Intolerant Islam”
You did say that.
So, which is it.
Your arguments are irrational, unfocused, and inconsistent.
There is no moderate Islam, but there ARE moderate Muslims.
I gave you examples.
St. Michael Defend Us says
Are “laxity” and “moderation” the same thing?
voegelinian says
They are not exactly the same, but they have the same function: to erect a certainty about a mass of putatively harmless Muslims — a certainty we do not have, and which would be reckless for us to indulge in, in a deadly game of Muslim Roulette.
Not only is it a deadly game we play this way, it is pointless — unless your ethical narcissism matters that much to you that you are willing to gamble the lives of your loved ones and fellow citizens on being a person good enough to trust Muslims.
The “lax” Muslim, the “moderate” Muslim, the “MINO” (Muslim In Name Only), the Muslim Ignorant Of Their Own Islam, the Muslim Scared To Come Out of the Apostasy Closet — all of these have the same function: to help us play Muslim Roulette so that we can stroke our ethical ego and not fret about being a bad person who would discriminate against poor Brown People.
PRCS says
Yes.
Lax: not sufficiently strict, severe, or careful.
The word Muslim means EVERY Muslim; man, woman, and child.
It’s hard to imagine that a Muslim women think wife beating is a good thing, or that a Muslim about to have a hand amputated for theft thinks amputation is a good thing, or that a Muslim woman would think her little brother can tell her what to do/not to do.
I know that Muslims (all Muslims) are supposed to follow the Qur’an and Sunnah–to the letter–but, in truth, how many really do so in their daily life?
Consider the public floggings of two Muslims who had skipped a prayer or two–by fellow Muslims (posted here at JW a few days ago).
I would say the two “floggees” had been lax.
But with greater consequences than for a Presbyterian who misses Sunday service.
PRCS says
Understanding the concept of lax, “moderate”, Muslims is important and the West needs to get its collective head around that phrase–and what it means–as it is in common usage.
They need to be told, and ultimately accept, that the Qur’an says what it says (don’t bother confusing them right off the bat with the Sunna) and that its every word is applicable to every Muslim, everywhere; including the amputation of people’s hands, stoning, etc.
Once they grasp that, they need to understand that, like the followers of other religions, “moderate” Muslims are not fully compliant with Islam’s teachings, and ultimately, that those Muslims who are attmpting to do so are not “radical” Muslims or Muslim “extremists”, that they have not been “radicalized” and are not the followers of “radical” Islam but are, instead, literalists; true believers following written, Orthodox Islam; amputations and all.
They have to have a reference point from which to analyze the issue, but are currently bombarded by the notion that jihadists are driven by a never defined, non-existent “radical” Islam.
PRCS says
You know that’s accurate, right, Hesp?
St. Michael Defend Us says
If a Christian (or Jew) becomes sufficiently lax, at some point they must be honest with themselves and admit that they really ARE NOT a Christian.
For an extreme example, a murdering rapist who is a thief, and does not wish to “repent” or “mend their ways” has to admit, at some point, at least to themselves, that they are NOT a Christian (or Jew). They don’t have to announce it to the rest of us, because we can tell already, it is pretty obvious.
If a muslim person DOES NOT WANT to wage jihad, does not want to kill Jews and Christians and burn churches, does not want to stone and amputate, and indeed DOES NOT do these things, at some point they have to be honest with themselves, and admit that they ARE NOT a muslim. Telling themselves, and the rest of us, that they are “moderate” muslims is-what?
It lulls non-muslims into a false sense of hope and peace.
PRCS says
For Muslims in the U.S., the risk of death for apostasy is minimal. Not non-existent, but surely minimal.
It is almost a given that Pakistani Muslims who have had “that conversation” with themselves are unlikely to state that they are “moderates”, to apostacize, or to leave Pakistan.
The American public needs to realize that “moderate” Muslims are, whether for circumstance or personal choice, not fully compliant with the Qur’an.
And like Catholics who use birth control methods, “moderate Muslims” undoubtedly do think of themselves as Muslims. If THEY call themselves Muslims, then that’s what they are.
1. In order for our friends and neighbors to really understand the issue, let them use the phrases “not fully compliant” and “moderate” interchangeably. That’s harmless, for now, and gives them a point of referrence.
2. From that, they need to acknowledge that full compliance is not the domain of “radical” Islam and “radical Muslims”/”Muslim extremists”, but rather of truly devout Muslims in accordance with the Qur’an, as it’s written.
Same Qur’an, different levels of compliance.
I imagine that most Afghan wives are “not fully compliant/moderate” Muslims, as its difficult to imagine they agree with Allah’s wife beating directive. Unfortunately for them, after having “that conversation”, they can’t leave. And if they voiced their opposition to it, well, I’m sure they’d be beaten.
There ARE many “moderate” Muslims.
bodhiden says
Good for these Muslim women who came out as humanists, atheist, agnostics,etc. humanism is an excellent alternative for anyone coming out of religion. I left traditional religion some years ago. You might say that I had a “religious” experience that led me to agnosticism. These Muslim women must be congratulated! It was a lot easier for me then for them.