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Jihad Watch

Exposing the role that Islamic jihad theology and ideology play in the modern global conflicts

ISIS forces Iraqi Christians to pay jizya, tells them to convert to Islam or face the sword

Jun 23, 2014 11:57 am By Robert Spencer

StEliasChaldeanCatholicChurch“They all feared persecution at the hands of the insurgents who had suddenly arrived in their midst because they follow a harsh 7th century interpretation of the Qur’an that demands not only that women mostly stay indoors, but that church bells must never be rung, crosses must never be displayed and Christians must pay a ‘gold tax’ in return for their lives.”

This is not a “harsh 7th century interpretation of the Qur’an.” This is Islamic law to this day: Sharia stipulates that dhimmi Jews and Christians under the “protection” of the Islamic state — are “forbidden to openly display wine or pork, (A: to ring church bells or display crosses,) recite the Torah or Evangel aloud, or make public display of their funerals and feastdays” (‘Umdat al-Salik, o11.5(6)).

And as for the “gold tax” that Christians must pay “in return for their lives,” that is straight from the Qur’an: “Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.” (9:29)

ISIS, moreover, has “launched a reign of terror against Shiites and Christians that has included beheadings and at least three crucifixions.” That, too, is from the Qur’an: “When you meet the unbelievers, strike the necks (47:4); and “Indeed, the penalty for those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and strive upon earth corruption is none but that they be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off from opposite sides or that they be exiled from the land. That is for them a disgrace in this world; and for them in the Hereafter is a great punishment.” (5:33)

“Convert to Islam or face the sword, Iraqi Christians told by Sunni extremists,” by Matthew Fisher, Postmedia News, June 22, 2014:

ANKAWA, Iraq — Convert to Islam or face the sword.

That was the stark message Christians in the Syrian city of Raqqa received last year when ultra-fundamentalist Sunni extremists, proclaiming themselves to be members of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL), seized power and launched a reign of terror against Shiites and Christians that has included beheadings and at least three crucifixions.

Aware of ISIL’s ferocious reputation for murder and mayhem, thousands of Christians who lived in Mosul and the surrounding Nineveh Plain fled in panic when ISIL rebels captured Iraq’s second largest city from government forces on June 10. Many of those who escaped have sought refuge in this Christian enclave in the Kurdish city of Irbil, only an hour’s drive away from Mosul.

“All who are left there now are a few handicapped or sickly Christians,” said a Chaldean Catholic nun wearing a blue habit whose religious community fled Mosul on foot, walking north for four hours on June 10 along with thousands of other Christian and Muslim refugees.

They all feared persecution at the hands of the insurgents who had suddenly arrived in their midst because they follow a harsh 7th century interpretation of the Qur’an that demands not only that women mostly stay indoors, but that church bells must never be rung, crosses must never be displayed and Christians must pay a “gold tax” in return for their lives.

The nun pleaded repeatedly that her name and her order not be disclosed, lest the rebels read her comments on the Internet.

“They’ve taken down every monument in Mosul, whether they depict Iraqi political figures or Catholics,” she said in impeccable French that she polished during a year studying in Montreal.

“They removed a statue of the Virgin Mary but as far as I know they have not destroyed it.”

About 120 parishioners attended Sunday mass at St. Elias Chaldean Catholic Church in Ankawa where Father Shahar gave a homily about the need for reconciliation. “I hope that peace will come again to Syria, to Baghdad, to Mosul and to Iraq,” was the priest’s only reference to the sectarian violence now convulsing the country.

Fear permeated the congregation on a day when ISIL fighters claimed another border town with Syria, making it easier for them to move arms in both direction because they control a large swath of northern Syria where they have been fighting Bashar Assad’s regime.

There have been Christians in Iraq since the 1st century when two disciples of Jesus brought the gospel here. As recently as 2003 Iraq had 1.5 million Christians. But since then there have been more than 70 attacks on churches, several priests have been murdered and the number of Christians has plummeted to less than less than 500,000. This latest spasm of sectarian violence is likely to lead to another mass exodus.

A 72-year-old parishioner, who would only give his name as Dominique, said he had been forced to leave Mosul for Baghdad in 1960 after his father was murdered for being a Christian. When the church he attended in Baghdad was blown up a three years ago, he, his wife and their son sought sanctuary in Irbil’s Christian suburb of Ankawa.

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Filed Under: dhimmitude, Islamic State (aka ISIS, ISIL, Daesh), Muslim persecution of Christians Tagged With: featured


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Comments

  1. Jaladhi says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:07 pm

    >”This is not a “harsh 7th century interpretation of the Qur’an.” This is Islamic law to this day: Sharia stipulates that dhimmi Jews and Christians under the “protection” of the Islamic state — are “forbidden to openly display wine or pork, (A: to ring church bells or display crosses,) recite the Torah or Evangel aloud, or make public display of their funerals and feastdays” (‘Umdat al-Salik, o11.5(6)).”

    Exactly!! This is regular Islam followed by all Muslims whether they come out to behead non-Musllims or not!!

    Tell this to our leaders, academia, MSM, and and so many pseudo-experts of Islam(Muslim apologists). Call John Kerry – maybe he can learn some Islam.

    • Jay Boo says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 12:16 pm

      Yes, Islam is unfixable

      • Smaug says

        Jun 23, 2014 at 12:49 pm

        Any religion is fixable.

        • SteveinSC says

          Jun 23, 2014 at 2:20 pm

          Yes, everyone keeps telling us that Islam needs to be reformed. When Catholicism was reformed in the 15th-16th Centuries, the purpose of the Reformation was to return Christianity to its spiritual roots since the Church had become corrupted by its involvement in earthly affairs and the pursuit of earthly power. The thing people in the West need to realize is that the so-called “Muslim Extremists” ARE THE REFORMERS.” They are seeking to return Islam to its spiritual roots since it’s been corrupted by the influence of the Western world. The Western idiots looking for reform need to be careful what they’re asking for, because they are going to get it. And, they will lose their heads as a result. It took the European West from 711 AD (Invasion of Spain) to 1683 (Battle of Vienna) to get the Muslim genie back in it’s bottle the last time the Muslims were in touch with their spiritual roots. Study some History, people!

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 12:10 am

          Smaug wrote:

          Any religion is fixable.
          ………………………..

          Sure—theoretically.

          But do you really believe that the worship of Baal or the sanguinary human sacrifice-based creed of the Aztecs could have been “reformed” into civilized faiths?

          So far, islam has resisted any such “reform” for *almost 1400 years*.

          The only times in history when things have been somewhat less horrific is when Islam has been weak, ignored in parts, or customs mixed in with those of less brutal creeds.

          There’s never been any real reform of Islam itself—in fact, religious bans on reinterpretation such as the “Closing of the Gates of Itijihad” pretty much guarantee than anyone attempting any real reform will be regarded as a “heretic” or “apostate”.

          in fact, since a reform is a return to roots, one can well argue, as SteveinSC does, that the Wahabbis and the Salafists and the “Muslim extremists” *are* the “reformers”.

    • Alarmed Pig Farmer says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 12:49 pm

      forbidden to openly display wine or pork

      Well, yesterday afternoon I was out on my deck openly brandishing bottles of Cote du Rhone and slabs of pork chops. With 3,000 hogs all within shouting distance. Didn’t get my ass kicked like that poor fellow in France, luckily there weren’t any Moslems in the neighborhood.

    • mortimer says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 1:28 pm

      EXTORTION = Normative Islam, rather than an aberration.

  2. Jay Boo says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:14 pm

    Leftist liberals anxious to appear Islam friendly somehow manage to deal with the shame of their cowardice and cognitive dissonance by rationalizing excuses such as ‘they should all just leave and it is their fault for staying’ in order to excuse themselves for willful appeasement to Islam.

    In fact, some of them try to sleaze in such comments here at JW as well.
    But we know them and their intentions for who they are, not what they pretend.

    • Jay Boo says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 12:17 pm

      The above is my pre-emptive strike

    • Alarmed Pig Farmer says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 12:32 pm

      They are dwellers of the Land of Fictive Reality. Once they’re able to sweep the Moslem commotion under the rug, they can return their attention to man-caused global warming. That one really put the global teef’ into the jaws of globo-socialism, their principle project. So many induced mass hallucinations, so little time. Maybe a pre-emptive strike will wake them up.

  3. john spielman says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:17 pm

    I ‘m certain Keith Ellison and John Esposito are over joyed with the sucess of the ISIS(ISIL) especially now that pure Islam and sharia law is now being established in the region. I only wish they could have their citizenship revoked for treason against the US and then would be deported to this new crapistan to live out their fithly religion there, not here!

  4. Alarmed Pig Farmer says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:24 pm

    I see that ex-Prime Tony, or Tone, as I like to call him, has published a piece in the Financial Times in which he noted, “the region’s problems are the result of deep-seated issues that, with the removal of those regimes, have now come to the surface. ” Hey, Tone, why the plural with the deep-seated issue? He went on to write that “Its origin lies in the toxic mix of bad politics and bad religion that is not confined to Iraq or Syria but is spread across not just the Middle East but also the world.”

    The man gone from toting a Holy Ko-Ran with him on the sidewalks of London to declaiming bad religion. There’s plenty of bad politics to go around, but there is only one Islam, and thank goodness for that.

    As to the global thing, one must question the mass importing that’s been underway since the 80s.

  5. Charli Main says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:27 pm

    ” Qurán that demands, not only that, women mostly stay indoors but that church bells must never be rung, crosses must never be displayed ”
    Sharia in Iraq ???? This sounds a lot like downtown London and Birmingham.

  6. John C. Barile says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:32 pm

    Just imagine what would happen if Irbil and the rest of Kurdistan fell to ISIS? Can anyone say “blood bath”? WHAT ever happened to this administration’s self-righteous claptrap about a “duty to protect” in the face of genocide and mass killings??

  7. Jay Boo says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:33 pm

    Where is Muslim Brotherhood friendly Qatar based Al Jazeera.
    They are backing up their terrorist friendly pseudo-journalists criminals
    and instigating internet “outrage” over their convictions for crimes against Egypt.

    http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/freeajstaff-jailing-journalists-triggers-internet-outrage-n138301

  8. Jay Boo says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:34 pm

    Hello
    Al Jazeera
    Is anybody home?

  9. AnneM says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:38 pm

    My advice to the Iraqi Christians is: GET OUT OF IRAQ NOW!

    • Rezali Mehil says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 5:19 pm

      Iraqi Christians is: GET OUT OF IRAQ NOW!….. and go where?

      This would have happened in powerful Constantinople all those years ago. And it could be moving globally …. can you imagine if those mormon wankers playing with their snakes in salt lake city …if they were asked to move on?

      Well I hope not …ISIS is not my Islam, regardless of whatever you say here.

      Islam must spread…but I want to see a salt and pepper effect in the community….every community in America.

      More Later….

      Rezali

      • gravenimage says

        Jun 23, 2014 at 9:16 pm

        The repulsive Rezali Mehil wrote:

        Iraqi Christians is: GET OUT OF IRAQ NOW!….. and go where?

        This would have happened in powerful Constantinople all those years ago. And it could be moving globally …. can you imagine if those mormon wankers playing with their snakes in salt lake city …if they were asked to move on?
        ……………………………………

        Muslims always whine that Infidels are supposedly “misunderstanding Islam”—and yet it is fine if Mohammedans evince the most astonishing ignorance of other faiths—Mormons do not “play with snakes” (presumably this is a reference to the fringe-sect practice of snake handling).

        And if sufficient numbers of her foul coreligionists ever *do* reach Salt Lake City, they are not going to ask Mormons or any other Christians to “move on”—instead, they will exploit, threaten, and murder them just like in Iraq.

        More:

        Well I hope not …ISIS is not my Islam, regardless of whatever you say here.
        ……………………………………

        Well, she’d prefer it was the Shi’ites and not the Sunnis taking over, but that’s as far as it goes.

        When she says “ISIS is not my Islam”, she is not condemning their savagery, but just their sect.

        Certainly, she would have no problem with the imposition of Shari’ah and dhimmitude, as here—her only regret is that the Sunnis are victimizing her fellow Shia along with the filthy Infidels.

        More:

        Islam must spread…but I want to see a salt and pepper effect in the community….every community in America.
        ……………………………………

        “Salt and pepper effect”—in other words, she wants Muslims to infiltrate to such an extent that when they make the final push for Shari’ah that we will be unable to fight back. *Ugh*.

        • AnneM says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 9:09 am

          In other words, have those Eastern Christians head west for their safety.

      • cutbulla says

        Jun 24, 2014 at 1:56 am

        If all non muslims apply jazia or gold tax to muslims living in non muslim countries;they will stop harassing minorities.

  10. AnneM says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 12:54 pm

    I have a quick question. Thank-you ahead for the response.

    Why does Islam oppose bells and bell ringing?

    And despite what one Mr. Obama says, the screaming that is the “call to prayer” is the most SOUR sound one can hear while bells are sweeter in sound.

    • Uri says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 1:32 pm

      There were bells in the sky
      But MO never heard them ringing
      No, he never heard them at all
      Just Lucifer’s call.

      • AnneM says

        Jun 23, 2014 at 1:42 pm

        Or maybe bells are a way to scare demons away!

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 9:26 pm

      AnneM wrote:

      I have a quick question. Thank-you ahead for the response.

      Why does Islam oppose bells and bell ringing?
      …………………………….

      Anne, it’s because bell-ringing is a “public manifestation” of Christian faith—and *no* such are allowed in Dar-al-islam. It is the same with the display of crosses or religious statuary.

      And it is not just Christianity—Islam doesn’t allow the open exhibition of *any* non-Muslim faith.

      More:

      Or maybe bells are a way to scare demons away!
      …………………………….

      Actually, there *is* a European folk tradition that demons and evil fairies *hate* the sound of church bells, and that it drives them away.

      I have long thought this seems especially apt when it comes to the reaction of pious Mohammedans…

      • AnneM says

        Jun 24, 2014 at 9:12 am

        Also bells serve to drown out any of the screaming insanity that comes from this so-called call to prayer.

        • voegelinian says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 11:37 am

          On a more practical level, bells were used, beginning during the early medieval period, by Christians who had the misfortune of living in lands ravaged by Muslims specifically and literally as warning bells to alert the community of an impending Mohammedan terror raid (razzia).

          One should never put anything past Muslims: it’s possible that the prohibition of bells was not only as gravenimage notes (as a prohibition on the free public expression of Christianity), but also as a way to render Christians defenseless (just as the same Pact of Umar prohibitions stipulate that non-Muslims are not to be allowed weapons of any kind (shades of Hitler outlawing guns and Obama calling for same…)).

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 5:13 pm

          That’s a good point, Voegelinian—you’re probably right.

          Certainly, Muslims regularly raided the coasts for slaves and booty—in Sicily, southern Italy, southern France, Greece, and the Balkans—but even as far north *as Ireland*.

          A famous cry in Italy is “Mamma, li Turchi!”—or, “Mama, the Turks (i.e., Muslims) are coming!”

      • dumbledoresarmy says

        Jun 28, 2014 at 4:42 am

        Here’s one hadith about bells

        Muslim 24:5279
 – Abu Huraira reported Allah’s Messenger as saying: The bell is the musical instrument of the Satan.

        In Sahih Muslim, a canonical hadith collection
 Book 024, Number 5277:
        Abu Huraira reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Angels do not accompany the travellers who have with them a dog and a bell.

        Now, given that in western Christendom at least, demons are driven off by the sound of church bells (who remembers this happening in the concluding sequence of Disney’s original “Fantasia”?), what does *that* suggest about Islamic “angels”??

  11. Champ says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 1:15 pm

    I = ISLAM
    S = SAVAGE
    I = ISLAM
    S = SLAVE

    SAVAGES AND SLAVES: the evil fruit of islam!

    • mariam rove says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 1:33 pm

      you said that right…m

  12. ploome says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 2:12 pm

    meanwhile, reading Melanie Phillips

    ….According to Nicholson, there were claims at this year’s CatC conference that the “first naqba” was in 587 B.C.E. when “Palestinians” were “exiled to Babylon,” and the “first intifada” was in 70 C.E. when Titus destroyed the Temple. But, of course, it was the Jews who were exiled from the land of Israel in those years. He says he also heard claims that the Jews of today were really all Khazars, and that it was morally and theologically wrong to say Israel was a Jewish state.

    Nicholson was distressed by the reaction of the conference participants to these absurdities. “You look around and you see well-meaning Americans nodding along,” he said. “They don’t know what did happen in history, they don’t know what it means so they just go along with it.” When someone linked terrorism with either Yasir Arafat or Israel’s security barrier, people started booing.

    What so deeply alarms close observers such as Nicholson and Van Zile is the insidious, mind-bending manipulation of this approach and the bizarre and poisonous beliefs that are being swallowed as a result. Prejudice against the Jews, a negation of Jewish suffering, and the demonization of Israel are carefully disguised by a mantra of peace’n’love. This, the idealistic, naive, and ignorant CatC participants are told, is what Christianity is all about.

    Hand in hand with Christian Palestinianism has come the steady Islamization of the Church. Increasingly ignoring its Jewish roots, the Church has reached out instead to Islam. In a paper published in 2007, Margaret Brearley, a British scholar of interfaith relations and former adviser to the archbishop of Canterbury, wrote that Anglicanism as a whole seemed to be gradually uprooting itself from its Judaic heritage. It was no longer normative for Anglican clergy to know Hebrew, and, if clergy studied another religion at theological college, it was now more likely to be Islam than Judaism……

    http://www.commentarymagazine.com/article/jesus-was-a-palestinian-the-return-of-christian-anti-semitism/

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 11:01 pm

      Ploome cited:

      He says he also heard claims that the Jews of today were really all Khazars, and that it was morally and theologically wrong to say Israel was a Jewish state.
      ……………………………

      Thanks for that, Ploome.

      The irony is that the “Khazar” myth* was concocted by a European Jew who had hoped—in vain, obviously—that it might save his people if he could seem to plausibly claim that European Jews had no links to historical Jewry at all. We all know how well *that* worked out…

      And now his wonky theory—which he probably didn’t actually subscribe to himself—is being used against Israel. *Ugh*.

      *The Khazars did exist—they were a small tribe from central Asia whose chieftain may have rather eccentrically convert to Judaism sometime during the Dark Ages—evidence for this is spotty, contradictory, and some of it may have been fabricated.

      Whatever the truth of this, though, the idea that modern Ashkenazi Jews descend from this central Asian tribe is pure bunk.

  13. ploome says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 2:14 pm

    The Church, she wrote, had taken major steps to affirm Islam as a fellow “Abrahamic faith.” The most important of these initiatives was a Christian-Muslim seminar called Building Bridges, convened by the archbishop of Canterbury in January 2002. The proceedings of the inaugural meeting stressed “the shared journey of Christians and Muslims” and the “importance of deepening our dialogue and understanding,” especially following 9/11. Papers presented by some Muslim and Christian scholars suggested equivalence, even unity, between Islam and Christianity. Bishop Kenneth Cragg, for example, stated that the “Magnificat and Allahu akbar are the sure doxologies with which our two faiths begin” and that “in the mystery of our created human trust…two faiths are one,” while Professor David Kerr explained radical Islam “as a form of liberation theology.” Brearley wrote: “The rapprochement of Anglicanism and Islam has encouraged a process in which any critique of Islamic nationalism or Islamism is either extremely muted or completely absent.”

    The essential problem, says Canon Andrew White, is the lack of will in the church to face the difference between Judaism and Islam. “They don’t want to recognize that their faith comes from Judaism,” he said. “They talk instead of the ‘children of Abraham’ as if we are all in it together. The reality is, however, that although Islam and Judaism have a lot in common in terms of customs, they are as far apart as Christianity is from heathenism.”

    • eib says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 3:09 pm

      I have no desire to build a bridge to hell.
      Any interfaith dialogue with Islam is essentially a bridge to hell.

    • eib says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 3:11 pm

      The scriptures are unambiguous on these two points.
      1. Salvation comes from the Jews, all that has not been grafted onto the root of Judaism must be hacked off and burned.
      2. Beware of false prophets, judge who they are by “their fruits.”
      Christian efforts to unify the root faiths of Judaism and Christianity with the Arab foreign faith, Islam, will fail for the reasons stated above; they fly in the face of scripture and tradition alike, they defy history.

  14. Henry says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 2:46 pm

    And ‘our’ President stands shoulder to shoulder with them.

  15. TH says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 7:37 pm

    I read in a Cathoic website of Church news that a Swiss born monk who has lived mnay years in Iraq stated that Christians are in a positionto mediate between the Islamic facitons. It ssems that this monk has no clue about Islam nor has he learnt anything about it despite his many years in Iraq. Difficult to imagine such naivité.

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 23, 2014 at 11:54 pm

      Good God—what naive fools. Thanks for that, TH

  16. Smart guy says

    Jun 23, 2014 at 10:34 pm

    The roots of Chrisianity was Judaism. Was is past tense. God poured out his Holy Spirit on Christianity at Pentecost. Judaism became apostate and therefore became rejected. Jesus and the Essenes prophecied the destruction of Jerusalem and said that when you see Jerusalem surrounded your deliverance is getting near. Islam like Freemasonary is deliberately inspired apostacy.
    The primative mind sees brute force as might is right. Well in the beginning brute force might be the winner, but as time passes no-one wants to live under a bunch of bullies. Unfortunately, the Pagan doctrine of “Might is Right” is written on the walls of the Veterans of foreign wars.
    When the Reformation of Christianity came the Catholic church believed in the “Might is Right” philosophy, but as time passed less and less people would support such a primative philosphy. Freedom of religion has become the winner.
    So has the Pope become a Protestant? because he now supports religious freedom. In the beginning all progressive movements are small such as say the abolitionists of slavery, but like the “Mustard Seed” they grow. Paganism chose violence to crush Chrisianity, but in the end lost.
    If we as a species are to evolve rule by violence and deception have to become part of the past. So in the end either Moslems abandon Islam or Moslems will have to be exterminated. The Neanderthals became extinct, if we are to evolve Islam also has to become extinct. The cowardice of the lefty loonies is anti-evolutionary and such cowardice supports backwardness.

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 24, 2014 at 12:17 am

      I’m sorry—your ranting about Jews being apostates is not helpful. And we are not threatening Muslims with “extermination”—instead, that is *exactly* what these threatened Christians are facing in Iraq and Syria.

      • Smart Guy says

        Jun 24, 2014 at 1:24 am

        Ah! so you must be either a backward Muslim or a looney Liberal.
        Looney liberals like Quakers believe in gentle persuasion, that by example and conduct they can persuade the “cavemen’ not to behead them for their beliefs.
        Well back in the old days under the “Holy Roman” Empire people were burned at the stake for refusing to believe in “Transubstansiation” that is that the bread and wine at mass turns into the real blood and flesh of Jesus. Well for your information Christmas was outlawed in England in 1637 but burning people at the stake wasn’t outlawed until 1667. As you can see people were burned at the stake for their beliefs not their conduct.
        If we threaten the Muslim with extermination this is going to anger them so that they will declare Holy War against us then so much the better. The extermination of such a religion is necessary so that we can evolve. The Koran and Mohammed calls for the extermination of unbelievers so it is either us or them. Anyone who supports Islam has no compassion and such people have no place in our solar system or our Galaxy.

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 7:47 am

          Smart Guy said the following:
          He began with a teaser: “Judaism became apostate ”
          and
          He ended with:
          “So in the end either Moslems abandon Islam or Moslems will have to be exterminated. ”

          Not so smart

        • voegelinian says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 11:41 am

          Another plant. So many plants and trolls lately, JW comments is beginning to resemble a gnome-filled garden.

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 5:55 pm

          “Smart Guy” has posted some pretty dodgy stuff in the past—but he’s gone right over the edge this time.

          He’s either a frothing-at-the-mouth nutcase or a troll—it barely matters which.

    • Jon Woods says

      Jun 24, 2014 at 12:31 am

      “Reformed Christianity,” that’s a good one. Which of the thousands of Protestant churches are you referring to? It’s the Catholic Church that saved Europe from Islam.

      • Smart Guy says

        Jun 24, 2014 at 4:53 am

        The Crusades were fought before the Reformation started and Britain
        defeated Sudan which was ruled by the Mahdi for 15 years in about 1890 by Lord Kitchener. A political candidate was arrested for Quoting Churchill’s writtings who was a soldier in that campaign. Britain ruled Palestine and that is when they came up with the Idea to give it to the Jews so that they would stop supporting Germany during the 1st World War known as the Balfour Document.
        The Patron Saint of England is Saint George who was a Crusader that fought on the Island of Malta. And he wasnt even English he was a Turk. And England although Protestant still has Saint George as it’s patron Saint.
        1n 1588 Spain, under the orders of the Pope tried to conquer England for the Catholic church the Spainish navy was defeated. Their flag ship was named Saint Peter. There s no way that Saint Peter would have approved of using his name or the other 12 on a navy intent on killing Protestants.
        The IRA is Catholic no Protestant has ever joined the IRA. The flag of the 26 counties of Ireland is in three colors Green White and Orange. Green represents the nationalist color of Ireland “The Emeraled Island” Orange is the color of Protestantism “William of Orange” a Dutchman. White is the color of peace and represents the peace between the two aspects of Ireland.
        One of the front lines between Islam and Christianity is Somalia and Kenya.
        Kenya has the highest percent of Quakers more than England or America. A call by their government has gone out to arm the civilian population it remains to be seen how many Quakers decide to arm themselves. During the Maw Maw when blacks were killing whites in Kenya the British government decided to arm the whites, so Kenya has a history of arming the civilians.

        • Mirren10 says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 6:12 am

          What, no ranting about Freemasons, and Peter Pan’s goaty legs and hooved feet ? 🙂

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 8:00 am

          TROLL ALERT

          @Smart Guy
          Get lost
          Keep your RACIST baiting comments to yourself (ISLAM ENABLER)
          You extrapolate like ISMAIL to seed your bait
          From Jews to IRA and Catholic & Protestants

          You then use RACE like White homeland to instigate and discredit the JW website

          This article is about
          ISIS forces Iraqi Christians to pay jizya, tells them to convert to Islam or face the sword

          Whenever Islam’s stink gets too public clever trolls try to sneak in

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 8:34 am

          @Smart Guy
          Don’t bother with an attempt to redefine your convoluted interweaving of history with troll bait.

        • eib says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 8:53 am

          I don’t mind some historical leaping around, but I really hate it when the argument-thread makes no sense and no readily-visible connection exists between the histories.
          Only a fool sees connections between the crusades, the River War, and St. George.
          You know only what you want to know about the Crusades.

        • John C. Barile says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 10:05 am

          Go away. You don’t impress us. This forum is not about you at all, Smart Guy. Learn or leave.

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 24, 2014 at 6:35 pm

          “Smart Guy” wrote, amid reams of other blather:

          Britain ruled Palestine and that is when they came up with the Idea to give it to the Jews so that they would stop supporting Germany during the 1st World War known as the Balfour Document.

          The Patron Saint of England is Saint George who was a Crusader that fought on the Island of Malta. And he wasnt even English he was a Turk. And England although Protestant still has Saint George as it’s (sic) patron Saint…
          …………………………………

          Well, I *could* pick through the myriad historical errors in the above, but why even bother?

      • gravenimage says

        Jun 24, 2014 at 10:15 pm

        Jon Woods wrote:

        “Reformed Christianity,” that’s a good one. Which of the thousands of Protestant churches are you referring to? It’s the Catholic Church that saved Europe from Islam.
        ………………………….

        Jon, there have certainly been many brave Catholics who have stood against Islam.

        But it’s also true that the primary nations that pushed back the Barbary pirates and made the Mediterranean safe for shipping for the first time *in centuries* was spearheaded by the United States, a primarily Protestant nation with no official religion; and then by Britain, whose official faith is the Protestant Church of England; and then France, a nation officially atheist and with a population of both Catholics and Protestants.

        And earlier, there were Protestants as well as Catholics defending the Gates of Vienna.

        So Protestants *have* fought Islam.

        And today, unfortunately, both Catholicism and most of the Protestant denominations are riddled wit willful ignorance about the threat of Islam.

    • eib says

      Jun 24, 2014 at 8:49 am

      The catechism is clear.
      Every prophecy, law and tradition in ancient Israel is still active, even fulfilled, in Christianity.
      Judaism is the root.
      All “monotheism” that is not grafted onto it is profane.
      Islam is profane. It is a bastard faith and culture, a contemptible law, a destructive, violent people.
      Period.

      • eib says

        Jun 24, 2014 at 9:15 pm

        Quote:
        The Patron Saint of England is Saint George who was a Crusader that fought on the Island of Malta. And he wasnt even English he was a Turk.
        end

        A lie.
        Saint George was a Roman, born in Roman Palestine, long before there were any Turks in the region, and long before the Turks had any power whatsoever.
        He served in the army of Diocletian.
        I figured you were lying.
        Just had to do some looking about.
        Islam is profane.
        And lies often spill from profane lips.
        The Turk is the Turk– he is a barbarian, committed to genocide.
        We do not forget Constantinople.
        We do not forget Otranto.
        We do not forget Famagusta.
        The Turk will pay for all of this– IN SPADES!

  17. Mirren10 says

    Jun 24, 2014 at 6:58 pm

    graven said:

    ”Well, I *could* pick through the myriad historical errors in the above, but why even bother ?” 🙂

    Me, I think ‘smart guy’ (oh boy) is definitely deranged. A few weeks ago, he was blathering about Freemasons, and then said (apropos of nothing even remotely germane to his nutty blatherings) that the statue of Peter Pan in ‘Hyde Park’ ( actually in Kensington Gardens) had legs and hooves like a goat !

  18. Smart Guy says

    Jun 24, 2014 at 8:54 pm

    People who hate the truth can only engage in personal attacks.
    They are obviously losers.

  19. markmoros says

    Jun 25, 2014 at 1:53 am

    islam is the worst religion a terrorist belief ever built by human not by allah.. muhammad wass a fake prophet…

  20. dumbledoresarmy says

    Jun 28, 2014 at 5:11 am

    Given the mohammedan silencing of church bells – which has happened in Iraq, and which Hamas has imposed in Gaza, and which Muslims in parts of England manipulate local noise regulations to impose upon *English parish churches* that have cheerfully rung their bells for *centuries* – it’s about time that, within the west, and in many places beyond it, such priests, pastors and ministers as *are* informed about Islam – and there are some – struck back.

    I would suggest that every Islamoinformed Catholic, Lutheran and Anglican priest should start ringing the Angelus bell, daily, just for starters. The affirmation of the Incarnation – a Christian doctrine which is anathema to Muslims.

    On top of that, islamoinformed clergy of *all* denominations should revive a custom instituted in the 14th century by an otherwise unremarkable Pope, and start ringing the so-called “Turkish bell”. Discussed in this article on the angelus:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angelus

    “The Angelus is not identical to the “Turkish bell” ordered by Pope Calixtus III (1455–58) in 1456 [that is, three years after the Fall of Constantinople to the Muslim hordes – dda], who asked for a long midday bell ringing and prayer for protection against the Turkish invasions [that is: the MUSLIM invasions – dda] of his time.

    See also “Siege of Belgrade”
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noon_bell#Noon_Bell

    “In his 1956 Apostolic Letter Dum Maerenti Animo about the [Communist – dda] persecution of the Catholic church in Eastern Europe and China, Pope Pius XII recalls the 500th anniversary of the “Turkish bell”, a prayer crusade ordered by his predecessors against what they considered to be [sic: what they *knew* to be – dda] dangers from the East. He again asks the faithful throughout the World, to pray for the persecuted Church in the East during the mid-day Angelus.”

    Only today this second ringing of bells at noon (rung after the midday angelus, if the church is Catholic, Anglican or Lutheran), should be called the “Life and freedom bell”, and rung in defiance of the Jihad. Clergy so doing should inform their flocks that at midday, at the time when they know the bell is being rung in their parish church, then wherever they happen to be they should pause and briefly pray, with all their hearts, for 1/ the defeat of the Jihad 2/ the relief and deliverance of *all* non-Muslims (whether Christian or non-Christian) who are currently being attacked, abused, oppressed and killed by Muslims and 3/ the conversion of Muslims to Christ.

    I wonder whether Rev Dr Mark Durie – who is a parish priest – rings the Angelus, or the “Turkish” bell? I think I might ask him.

    It would be an excellent practice to encourage in our western clergy, among such as have woken up to what former frequent contributor here, Hugh Fitzgerald, calls ‘the meaning and menace of Islam”.

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