The Rev. Professor David Thomas is a professor of Christianity and Islam at the University of Birmingham. Here he writes a very strange article. Most of it is a brief and reasonably accurate history of the caliphate, in which he notes that in declaring a caliphate, the Islamic State has “reverted to a model that has been the reality in parts of the Islamic world for most of its history. For nearly 1,400 years the caliph was head of the entire Islamic state. He often wielded unimaginable power, and always great influence. So it would appear that the Islamic State is placing itself firmly within the Islamic tradition. But toward the end of his piece, Thomas refers to the Islamic State’s “twisted interpretations of scriptural teachings,” without giving us any examples, and concludes, again without explanation: “One thing is clear: what they are perpetrating is not Islam.”
Would the Rev. Professor David Thomas care to explain why that is, as “clear” as it doubtless is? He could start by explaining how the Islamic State is misunderstanding and misinterpreting these ten Qur’an verses. If he did this, he’d be performing a great service — he might even prevent more Muslims in the U.K. from joining the Islamic State. But whether he will do that or not, he doesn’t do it in this piece, which is yet another in the steady stream of articles we have seen proclaiming that the Islamic State is un-Islamic without confronting its Islamic case for itself.
“Professor David Thomas: Self-proclaimed caliph has twisted view of Islam,” by David Thomas, Derby Telegraph, September 8, 2014:
The Rev Professor David Thomas, Honorary Canon Theologian of Derby Cathedral, compares the rise of Islamic State with the rise of the caliphs.
THE ultra-radical Islamist group Islamic State (ISIS as was – the Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham [Syria]) has declared that the territory they hold is a caliphate.
In taking this step they have reverted to a model that has been the reality in parts of the Islamic world for most of its history. For nearly 1,400 years the caliph was head of the entire Islamic state. He often wielded unimaginable power, and always great influence.
The Prophet Muhammad died in 632 or thereabouts. According to Islamic tradition, for the last ten years of his life, when he lived in Medina after leaving his native Mecca in 622, he gradually developed a new form of society based on the Qur’an (for Muslims God’s direct utterance and therefore beyond question or criticism) and his own sunna (his customary practice).
In this period he set an example of how the state should be run. The rulers who immediately followed him maintained his model, adhering closely to his teachings. They took the title khalifa, meaning “representative” or “deputy” (in the Qur’an, the first man, Adam, is called khalifat Allah, God’s representative). In later times, this title was often expanded to Khalifat Rasul Allah, “Representative of the Messenger of God”.
The four rulers who immediately succeeded the Prophet as caliph (the Anglicised form of khalifa) are regarded by most Muslims (Shi`a Muslims are the exception) as model rulers and upholders of the Qur’an and Muhammad’s sunna. For this reason they are called the Rightly-Guided Caliphs, and it is their period of rule in seventh-century Medina, together with Muhammad’s rule before them, that is regarded as the golden age of Islam. In declaring a caliphate, Islamic State is attempting to establish rule according to the precedents set at this time.
This early period of the caliphate was more an ideal than a reality. For while the Islamic state was indeed brought into being under them, these four caliphs encountered considerable opposition from outside in the form of Arab tribes who refused to acknowledge them, and from inside in the form of disagreement with policies they pursued, and even threats to their persons (only one of them died in his bed). The most vehement dissent came from the followers of `Ali, who was both Muhammad’s cousin and son-in-law (Muhammad’s own sons died in infancy). He was elected the fourth caliph, though his followers thought he should have succeeded Muhammad directly. They formed the Shi`at `Ali, the Party of `Ali, the start of a movement of dissenters who continued to oppose the norms of government for centuries, and now form the second largest division in Islam after the Sunnis. While Sunnis base authority on the Qur’an and sunna of Muhammad, Shi`as base it on the Qur’an and interpretations given by `Ali and his descendants. Most Shi`as revere a line of 12 of these descendants, whom they regard as inspired by God and call Imams, and against threats from Islamic State thousands of Iraqi Shi`as have rallied to defend the shrines of many of these Imams that are located in Baghdad and southern Iraq.
The institution of the caliphate continued from the seventh century until its abolition in 1924.
The caliph was sometimes an autocratic ruler, and more often a figurehead who symbolised the unity of the Islamic state. His function, whether actual or ideal, was to maintain the Qur’an-based law and the Islamic character of the community.
A perennial question among political theorists concerned the qualifications for the office. Most settled on descent from the Meccan clan to which Muhammad belonged, soundness of mind and body, and diligence in observing the faith.
But there was always disagreement, and rivals regularly rose up to challenge the current ruler.
The new self-proclaimed Isis caliph, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, “Caliph Ibrahim”, could well find himself challenged not only by Shi`as in Iraq and Iran but also by other extremist Sunnis rising up to dispute his credentials.
Far from being a symbol of unity in the Islamic world, he could intensify dissension and provoke further bitter fighting. It must be said, however, that he and his followers appear totally indifferent both to criticism from other Muslims who abhor the cruelty Islamic State seems to relish inflicting in their twisted interpretations of scriptural teachings, and also to the US air strikes that have begun to halt their progress.
They show all the characteristics of fanatics, fired by the belief that God wills them to act as they do.
Indifferent to their own safety, they will doubtless continue to pile one sickening atrocity on another until they are halted by force.
One thing is clear: what they are perpetrating is not Islam.
Jovial Joe says
Right fellow JWatchers, we know the drill, using the utmost courtesy at all times, let’s email him a link to this article and kindly ask him to respond: Email d.r.thomas.1@bham.ac.uk
kikorikid says
He is only being critical of IS because IS does not follow
the patterns of “Civilization Jihad” and “Creeping Sharia” as
set forth by the largest Islamist entity, the Muslim Brotherhood”.
IS is violating a long standing “virtue” of Islam, Patience.
Otherwise same-same.
Jovial Joe says
I doubt this clueless idiot even knows what creeping sharia is, or that he’s enabling it with this obfuscatory piece he’s written.
Jovial Joe says
I’ve emailed him this link anyway; we’ll await the cry of ‘Islamophobia’ in his next piece for the Derby Telegraph.
sid-chrome says
What is happening in Syria and Iraq is nothing less than an Islamic inquisition of the world.
Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Me) says
How dare the Christian Kafir David Thomas presume to declare that devout Muslims are not following my excellent example!
Thomas wrote: “One thing is clear: what they [ISIS] are perpetrating is not Islam.”
What! Has this Kafir ever read the Qur’an? Has he ever read the Sirat Rasul Allah (The Life of Muhammad) by Ibn Ishaq? Has he ever read the History by al-Tabari? Has ever studied Islamic Sharia? Has he ever studied the Islamic conquest of any country at all?
O Muslims! Once again we see the arrogance of the Christian Kafirs, who infuriate Allah himself with their countless ways of going astray! They even dare pronounce foolish judgements on devout Muslims, even though they themselves are blasphemers who say that God is a threesome! Every one of them will surely be sent to the blazing Fire for all eternity. Then they will taste the penalty for their arrogance and foolishness!
Beagle says
Dearest Muhammad (Peace Be Upon You),
First up, great to see you alive again.
Could you explain why so much of the Quran is written in such a way that Allah (SAW) is mentioned as an object instead of the voice of the actual narrator? Not that you had anything to do with that, natch.
And Allah Knows Best!
Your brother in Islam, the unclean canine Beagle
Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Me) says
Do you think that Allah could create heaven and Earth and the sun and the moon, but he cannot refer to himself in the third person? Allah’s hands are not bound by rules, foolish Beagle!
gravenimage says
Hilarious stuff, PBUM!
Ayatrollah says
I sent him a email asking him to explain the comment “One thing is clear: what they are perpetrating is not Islam.”
He sent me an email enviting me to come hear him preach.
Jovial Joe says
I got the same. Told him in reply to come face his critics on JWatch instead; he hasn’t responded to that surprisingly.
Keith Brockmeyer says
Here is his “rate my professors” rating info…..dismal! http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/ShowRatings.jsp?tid=1310229
Jovial Joe says
Ha! Look at what one of his students says: ‘he provides no clarity or information on what is needed’; exactly our complaint here!
Chabuco says
“One thing is clear: what they are perpetrating is not Islam”—
Just because you say “One thing is clear” it doesn’t make the “thing” clear. Keep trying to cover the sun with your finger… “reverend”!
Jah says
He’s right. Its not islam, its power and politics. ISIS are shock and awe. The more violent they are the more pure they are. No muslim country supports them including Saudi Arabia! ISIS are a bunch of freaks.
Frank Scarn says
Yet another example of how poorly led are the world RCC members. What exactly did they study, or not learn, in their schools prior to becoming priests?
thomas_h says
What makes you assume the idiot is a Catholic priest? (Not that there are no idiots among the RCC priests)
Champ says
Oh my talk about the height of stupidity! …a useful idiot if ever there was one.
“The Rev. Professor David Thomas is a professor of Christianity and Islam at the University of Birmingham.”
What, he’s a “professor” of islam? Right! …and he obviously hasn’t read the quran. So much for his *expertise*. I feel the need to insert a laugh-out-loud in his honor 😀 😀 …ok, two lol’s.
David Wood, please send him your video …
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/09/video-top-ten-quran-verses-to-help-you-understand-the-islamic-state
Mirren10 says
”What, he’s a “professor” of islam? Right … ”
Dear Champ, what he is is, is a professor of ‘Chrislam’. As you know, I am an agnostic. However, what I see here, is a bastardisation of every true and decent thing Christianity stands for.
A long time ago, I replied to one of your posts, about this repulsive and evil nonsense. I gave, as an example, the ideas exemplified in C.S.Lewis’s series of stories, ‘The Chronicles of Narnia.’ The last story, ‘The Last Battle’ sets out exactly **this** scenario; ie: that a false god has been set up, and that the inhabitants of Narnia are being forced to worship this abomination : the abomination is the foul ‘Tash’. The evil ape conflates the vile, and totally evil ‘Tash’, with the totally good and loving Aslan. The result ? The inhabitants of Narnia are exhorted to worship ‘Tashlan’.
Really, what could be more obvious ?
Champ says
Brava, Mirren10!!! 🙂
Yes, I do recall that comment from, I think, last year. Anyway, I must admit that that’s a great comparison from ‘The Chronicles of Narnia.’ to what we’re seeing here, my dear friend!
And the evil Chrislam movement makes me so angry because the Bible is so clear that Christians are to separate themselves from evildoers: islam & company.
“Do not be misled: ‘Bad company corrupts good character.'” — 1 Corinthians 15:33
And this *very* important verse; which makes it perfectly clear that Christians should not be joined together with evil islam …
“Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?” — 2 Corinthians 6:14
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
More on evil Chrislam here:
http://www.exposingchrislam.com/blog/
Wellington says
Echoing Champ, this man is indeed a useful idiot. Instructive, I might add, how Islam depends on useful idiots like no other major faith even remotely does. This in and of itself is telling and damning.
Champ says
Wellington, thank you, my friend …
Great comment!
gravenimage says
Mirren, Champ, and Wellington, this fool is heavily involved in “Christian/Muslim relations”—but he doesn’t appear to have the slightest idea that for pious Muslims this means Christians being reduced to the status of oppressed and threatened dhimmis.
And this, despite the fact that he became “interested” in Islam while in Sudan—where Muslims have been butchering and enslaving Christians.
What a tool…
Champ says
Great point, Graven! …whatta tool is *right*!
Max Publius says
Islamic State is Saudi Arabia at war
Saudi Arabia is Islamic State at peace
Look at sharia laws in SA and tell me I’m wrong…
kikorikid says
Hey Max, I like it! SA is the most Sharia Compliant “Muslim” country.
ISIS-ISIL-IS rejects other sects because they are not Sharia Compliant
enough.
Max Publius says
Yep, and when Bush holds hand the Saudis and Obama bows to them, they are saying, “Be patient, don’t go overboard, and we’ll deliver our countries to you on a silver plate.”
“Treason doth never prosper, what’s the reason? For if it prosper, none dare call it Treason.”
Andrea Erickson says
The Reverend is an Anglican. “He is a member of NIFCON (http://nifcon.anglicancommunion.org/index.cfm), the Anglican Communion’s network for inter faith relations, and has served as a diocesan inter faith officer.” http://www.derbycathedral.org/news.asp?ID=194
Ibn Sufi al Kitab says
Good find. Another useless Anglican-Protesting-State Church moron. But legions of the same exist sadly, in the Catholic confessing church. My pastor stood up sunday and declared that the Koran was peace, and NOT ONE SINGLE PHRASE, to quote him directly, stated to kill ‘innocents’. Idiot. I am in the process of finding a pastor with a brain.
John Stefan Obeda says
Google: Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod and check their teachings if you want to.
gravenimage says
Thanks, Andrea.
Jaladhi says
Is this guy for real?? On one hand he says what ISIS is doing is consistent with what Muslims have done historically but then he says that it is not Islam. What a stupid Islamic apologists. Muslims love him!!! Looks like UK has already converted to Islam!!
voegelinian says
This flexibly torturous pseudo-argument by Rev. Professor David Thomas reveals him to be a high master of the yogic arts, able to put one foot behind his neck as he holds his head deep up his ass.
mortimer says
You’ve spotted the contortionist contradiction in his article alright!
They are following the ‘perfect’ example of the caliphs who were trained in Islam by Mohammed himself…and yet…they are not practicing Islam.
How can the first four caliphs not be Muslims?
tpellow says
The role of Muslim women in Islamic State-
“BRITISH WOMEN RUNNING SHARIA POLICE FOR ISIS”
http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/09/08/British-Women-Running-Sharia-Police-for-ISIS
jihad3tracker says
A quote near the very end of Thomas’s text : “They show all the characteristics of fanatics, fired by the belief that God wills them to act as they do.”
WELL, EXCUUUUSE ME ! ! ! ISN’T THAT A PERFECT DESCRIPTION OF MUHAMMAD — THE IDEAL MAN — AND HIS FOLLOWERS AT MEDINA — WHEN THEY BEGAN THEIR SLAUGHTER OF INFIDELS ? ? ?
The “Reverend Professor” seems unable to connect those. W.P.V. (Western Privilege Guilt) once again puts up a mental block in front of actually accepting Islam’s pathological nature.
Ralph says
This Guy(Reverend) need to read Genesis 16: 7 through Genesis 16: 19 and see just what God’s Angel said that the Muslim’s will be and that happens to be their Destiny.
tpellow says
Dhimmi Thomas is scared of offending Muslims and so presents a subservient, contradictory, very misguided version of the Islamic, Islamic State.
Tradewinds says
“One thing is clear: what they are perpetrating is not Islam.”
What is wrong with these people?!!
It’s like they’re afflicted with “DoNotTellTheTruthAboutIslam- itis.
I think the above should be entered into medical books as a bona fide illness afflicting people in the early 21st century. Cure? None discovered so far.
Mirren10 says
”THE ultra-radical Islamist group Islamic State ”
This is yet another example of the inability and non-comprehension of the left, and islamo-apologists
Words have **meanings**. The word ‘radical’, means ”getting to the root”. Hence, the term ‘islamist’, means one who is getting to the **root** of islam.
And what is the **root** of islam ? Why, violence, murder, hatred and torture.
Greyhound Fancier says
They won’t admit that Islam has been militant and triumphalist since Big Mo had his Medina period. Only when Muslims were too poor to make much trouble were others free of their violence.
Even in the face of centuries of beheading of children, women stoned, homosexuals hanged, honor killings, female genital mutilation, and amputations of hands, feet, and fingertips, some can call it the “religion of peace”. Mental gymnastics!!
rev g says
Wow. So the Islamic State is reverting to a previous style of islamic state that isn’t really islamic? So I guess they had islam wrong for centuries, and still do?
Someone really needs to fill them in on their mistake.
Kepha says
Interesting that the British Islamochristian David Thomas admits that violence and killing have characterized most of Islamic history even when he wishfully declares that it isn’t real Islam.
Thomas represents the end result of the “mainstream” so-called “Protestant” churches of the North Atlantic world jettisoning the foundational beliefs of their religion in the vain hope that becoming “up to date” will attract more people, rather than present the ridiculous spectacle of their doing all the running they can to remain a respectful five paces behind their cultured despisers. Where are the CofE clerics proclaiming the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ; recognizing the falsehood of Muhammad and his message; and calling for the conversion of post-Christians, whether Muslim or materialist?
If God did indeed become flesh and dwell among us, working redemption by both his active and passive obedience, then Islam is a superfluous message. The violence and futility it engenders is to be expected, since it is devoid of spiritual power to remake the sinful heart of man.
Beagle says
Watered-down Christianity embracing Islam is superfluous in today’s world. Simply call yourself “multicultural” and “spiritual” or “Unitarian” (a true ‘pure’ _boring_ and politically leftist monotheism) and be done with it. The popular and growing Christian churches are more rigorous in their faith and do not shy from hot-button topics like opposing abortion or opposing Islam.
I’m a secular skeptic about many things. But I embrace Christian history and values, having studied it in college and lived in a post-Christian home. I do identify with Christianity culturally and when the Lebanonization hits critical mass, I know which side I’m on.
Chrislam annoys ME no end. I can only imagine what a doctrinal nitpicking Christian must think about today’s church. I can see the church lady now “Can you say, SATAN?!”
Can’t say I would blame her in this case.
Kepha says
I myself grew up in a theologically liberal, heading-for-post-Christian home myself before I became a 1970’s Jesus Freak. 🙂 I guess I’m the sort who thinks that the values won’t stick without the faith.
Charli Main says
Sad how devout Christians are frequently denigrated by their “Christian” neighbours——-Jesus freaks—–Bible thumpers——Sky pilots and others too foul to mention.
Can you imagine the fate of Muslims publicly abusing Islam and other Muslims. ??????
Jovial Joe says
Sad? Far from it; it’s our ability to laugh and poke fun at each other which distinguishes us from the Islamic savages.
Beagle says
I agree, they won’t over time. Post-Christian may not be the most accurate description for what I was trying to say. Of course it’s complicated in every family, but mine takes it to eleven.
Kepha says
Charli Main:
Jesus Freak–I gladly and thankfully own that title. It’s what they called us back in the Sillier ‘Seventies when many of us were effectually called and went on to walk with the Lord for the rest of our lives. Sure, I became a traditional Calvinist rather than a Pentecostal, but the devotion to Jesus Christ as he is presented in the Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments remains.
“fundamentalist”–Yes, I’ll own that title, too. I accept the fundamentals concerning the person and work of Christ and the nature of Holy Scripture. Sure, the “fundamentals” were just the bare foundations of a once more complete theology, and I hold to much more than five or six “fundamentals”, but those fundamentals remain very much a part of how I see God, man, and the world.
Beagle says
It’s like Obama, when you hear the word “clear” expect anything else.
Of course the copious-Quran-quoting ISLAMIC State led by a PhD in Islamic studies knows nothing about Islam. Clearly.
Michael Copeland says
What is the non-twisted interpretation of “kill”, in “Kill the unbelievers wherever you find them” (Koran 9:5)?
Beagle says
Clearly, the Quran means for one to kill the unbelievers with kindness, or perhaps a really rough pillow fight. Clear?
Alice says
What are these people (collectively) smoking? Jesus scourged the money-changers in the Temple.
mortimer says
Dr. David Thomas’ conclusion is unfounded opinion. Sharia law clearly states that the caliph makes jihad against peaceful infidels:
Reliance of the Traveller (Sharia law manual)-
O9.8: The Objectives of Jihad
The caliph (o25) makes war upon Jews, Christians, and Zoroastrians (N: provided he has first invited them to enter Islam in faith and practice, and if they will not, then invited them to enter the social order of Islam by paying the non-Muslim poll tax (jizya, def: o11.4) -which is the significance of their paying it, not the money itself-while remaining in their ancestral religions) (O: and the war continues) until they become Muslim or else pay the non-Muslim poll tax (O: in accordance with the word of Allah Most High,
“Fight those who do not believe in Allah and the Last Day and who forbid not what Allah and His messenger have forbidden-who do not practice the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book-until they pay the poll tax out of hand and are humbled” (Koran 9.29),
O9.9
The caliph fights all other peoples until they become Muslim (O: because they are not a people with a Book, nor honored as such, and are not permitted to settle with paying the poll tax (jizya) )
Furthermore, Sheikh Abdullah Azzam states: “…Where the Kuffar [infidels] ARE NOT GATHERING to fight the Muslims, the fighting becomes Fard Kifaya [religious obligation on Muslim society] with the MINIMUM requirement of appointing believers to guard borders, and the sending of an army AT LEAST ONCE A YEAR TO TERRORISE THE ENEMIES OF ALLAH. It is a duty of the Imam (Caliph) to assemble and SEND OUT AN ARMY UNIT INTO THE LAND OF WAR (DAR AL HARB) once or twice every year. Moreover, it is the responsibility of the Muslim population to assist him, and if he does not send an army he is in sin.”
Why is David Thomas hiding the facts about the caliph’s role?
Bezelel says
I would like to see the term Fundamentalist used in place of radical. I cringe every time that term is used to describe radical Christians because Christian Fundamentalist are not causing trouble. Jihadis are practicing fundamental islam. Is that clear?
mortimer says
“Foundational” Islam or Islam of the Pioneers (Salafi).
Bezelel says
Not to argue the merits of Foundational as proper but the word Fundamentalist already has a worm hole through the Libtards thick skulls as it is their favorite word to describe Christians who dont compromise virtue to appease the PC mentality. The Westboro church are not fundamentalists but to argue the point with a libtard is pointless. IMHO to label jihadists as fundamentalists would be a turning point in the PC mindset.
mortimer says
Perhaps Dr. Thomas could explain the favorite general of the FIRST CALIPH Abu Bakr! His name? Khalid ibn al Walid.
He wrote to the Persian emperor in 633, the year after Mohammed died:
“Submit to Islam and be safe. Or agree to the payment of the Jizya, and you and your people will be under our protection, else you will have only yourself to blame for the consequences, for I bring the men who DESIRE DEATH as ardently as you desire life.”
Khalid ibn al Walid’s career was one of bloody slaughter, enslavement, plunder and rape. Most Muslims venerate him today and even name mosques after him. This is not Islam?
Give us a break, Dr. Thomas!
fair_dinkum says
“The Rev. Professor David Thomas is a professor of Christianity and Islam at the University of Birmingham.” says..
“what they are perpetrating is not islam” ?
—————————————————————————–
what’s more islamic than a caliphate? with all that it entails (beheading, torture, terrorism, slavery, rape, stoning, manipulation, destruction of minorities and other victims, sexual and other abuses of women and children, slaughter of other moslem denominations [maybe the only good to come out of it all] )
he really should get on a plane and rush to tell the IS leaders that they have it wrong!
this ‘professor’ is a stooge and a dickhead.
somehistory says
When relating what this guy said to a family member, she replied, “It’s like the wife walking in on her husband in the bed with another woman and he says, “It’s not what it looks like.””
He may have been unfaithful all of his married life, but unfaithful is not what he is or stands for.
When someone (and I refuse to call any human “reverend”) claims to be Christian but says things like this guy, trying to help islam wiggle out of its barbarity, cruelty, evil teachings and actions, he is no help to those who wish to know the “truth” Jesus spoke of, nor to even leave islam for a chance to learn the truth. He is one of those who make others question the validity of the teachings of Christ rather than want to learn what they are.
Beth says
@somehistory
Great Post.
I’m with you – I refuse to call anyone on earth “Reverend”
somehistory says
Thank you, Beth.
Bezelel says
Maybe I should but I dont refuse to call them Reverend or Pastor or Rabbi or any other title one has strived to achieve, except imam and will listen to them and maybe gain some useful insight they learned from their efforts. What I refuse to do is esteem their position as more important than my own. Not when a personal relationship with the Creator is the object of the effort. When killing Jews is considered a form of worship, That is to say it improves ones relationship with God, Then that source of information is a poisoned well.
Experts at spotting counterfeit money dont waste time studying counterfeits. They have detailed intimate knowledge of the real thing.
Jay Boo says
somehistory
I don’t believe this guy’s (motive) is trying to help Islam wiggle out of its barbarity, cruelty, evil teachings and actions or else he would not have written the other stuff.
It appears to be a transition where his intelligence overthinks itself under the watchful eye of cowardly political correctness to issue a self-serving defense using a well-tailored qualifier.
His words are so classic that they have probably been daisy-chained, cut and pasted plagiarized from other spineless academics in whole.
“One thing is clear: what they [ISIS] are perpetrating is not Islam.”
Jay Boo says
Note: I should have put the quote at top
gravenimage says
Agreed, Jay Boo—he is likely lying to himself as much as he is lying to us.
somehistory says
In any case, he is not being honest since he can see that islam began with what is is doing now and has done through the years and in the places where they have been unrestrained by others with more power/will to stop or diminish it.
Making up stuff in order for islam not be seen for what it is for whatever *motive* he has is still wrong on so many levels. Giving them cover, so to speak, for them to continue on with their stealth jihad until enough territory…almost wrote terroritory…has been gained so they can openly be everywhere like is is now is the same as conspiring with them. It makes him guilty of whatever they do. And if he is doing it only to *save* himself, it won’t work for that either.
Jay Boo says
Reply to somehistory and gravenimage
Agreed
Jihad watch thankfully lays it all out so that when we meet characters like this we know very well of their games.
Bezelel says
Exposing the invented religion as fake to people that believe they are all fake is a challenge. If showed a $100 dollar bill to someone that has Ben Franklin wearing a mustache and they didn’t care? Big deal dude, It’s paper with stuff printed on it. So you try to explain the real thing to them and you’re accused of being a right wing, proselytizing, fundamentalist, islamaphobe, racist, xenophobe. It goes downhill from there.
Bill says
Academia and the left are literally destroying western civilization. Their insane opinions and policies and now their complicity with Islam are apocalyptic.
ebonystone says
“One thing is clear: what they are perpetrating is not Islam.”
Well then Professor, what is Islam? Enlighten us; tell us just exactly what Islam is, and how whatever it is is not what the ISIL caliphate is promoting.
bobm says
He speaketh well aye; but in the close he doeth little else but covereth his butt with the husks of the prodigal.
Beth says
The koran calls the Son of God an abomination and denies the Father and the Son:
Koran: 009.030 – 037.151 – 037.152 – 019.088 – 019.089
1Jo 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
That so-called professor can call himself a Christian until blue in the face – but in the end – these facts posted here will condemn him. Because The Word was given to this world – he is left without excuse.
Sean UK says
Muhammad’s new form of society: convert, pay tax or die. The religion of peace is the religion of death. Islam is Islam.
One thing is clear: professors ain’t what they used to be.
Angemon says
Not islam? Oh, please, I don’t see him challenging the islamic basis and orthodoxy by which the IS claims legitimacy. Even if he was right, that would still leave the IS offering life as it has been lived in the islamic empires throughout history – why would any devout muslim pass on living under sharia law?
Those other muslims don’t challenge the islamic basis and orthodoxy by which the IS claims legitimacy, they just put up puff pieces saying how un-islamic the islamic state is to lull kuffar into complacency. That, and ISIS members regard those other muslims as hypocrites – someone who claims to be a muslim but willingly lives an un-islamic lifestyle for personal benefit.
R Cole says
The problem is that these jihadist keep ‘not perpetrating’ Islam in a fairly consistent manner all around the world.
In fact it is virtually ditto – the historic accounts of the sub-continent Islamic invasions – when Muslims attempted to bring Hindi and Buddhist lands under Islamic rule. The mass murder of captive males far exceeded Isis actions!
A credit to the west that it has taken a more honest view of its history – yet for Islam we offer to cleanse its history – and to deliver a propagandized version – in order to claim Islam has existed peaceably until the few 911 radicals came along.
This approach clearly has not worked.
By covering up Islamic atrocities [historic and present day] and their supporting verses/doctrine – we disarm our own side.
Without the factual or historic backing – anyone making the association of with Islam/ and its scriptures – is under the threat of being labeled a racist and the fictional term Islamophobe – by Muslims, many of whom have an invested interest in bringing about the same laws that the terrorists want. Just the moderates imagine without the violence – but by simply silencing the opposition.
Ex. Take Reza Aslan a favorite on TV interviews – had his non-Muslim Ultra-Left-wing buddy/associate – call for changes to the US Constitution – that would give Islam special protection. Which everybody knows is the last line of defence against – the implementation of theocratic shari’a laws. All done in the name of anti-racism. And the same changes that hardline and other Islamic groups are calling for.
So much effort is being put into supporting the so-called moderate Muslim – that we are creating a dreamland – that in actually fact has no basis in reality – not even in the Islamic world – but are leaving our own position vulnerable.
Many Muslim believe it is their duty to create an Islamic state wherever they live – that the US should be made one, that the UK and Europe should be made Islamic.
:: ::
Remember Wilder’s Fitna video:- Dutch Muslims [and far-Leftwingers] tried to have him prosecuted for what is in light of today’s ISIS videos pale in comparison. Shown to be prophetic — where people wrongly assumed that if they killed the messenger – that the radical Islam featured in the film would go away with it.
Wrong, wrong, wrong , wrong – wrong!!
gravenimage says
R Cole wrote:
The problem is that these jihadist keep ‘not perpetrating’ Islam in a fairly consistent manner all around the world…
…………………………
*So* true.
Ha Meshuga says
Remember he is based in Birmingham so he is surrounded by muslims and jihadis…he may well be ensuring that his head remains fixed to the rest of his body by paying lip service….
either way he is in denial and disconnected from reality…..
duh_swami says
At what church does this priest give sermons on Sunday?
Does he pray to YHVH, Allah or a weird hybrid?
Is a priest without a pulpit really a ‘priest’? Shades of Jackson and Sharpton. In the US you can give yourself any religious title you want. And you don’t need anyone’s permission to found your own church.
This Reverend must go to the same church as the Rev John Kerry.
Tradewinds says
John F Kerry (don’t forget the F!) – the expert on Islam. Who knew???!
Tradewinds says
Oops! Wrong article! Well, the same applies to this doofus who has the gall to call himself an “academic” and “reverend.”
Mannie says
No, that’s John Effing Kerry! 🙂
Mannie says
A distinction without a difference.
mortimer says
His conclusion contradicts EVERYTHING he wrote above it. A more logical conclusion to the article would be this: “Caliph Abu Bakr al Baghdadi is meticulously and self-consciously perpetrating foundational Islam.”
Ibn Sufi al Kitab says
I sent idiot boy the following email. Just listed 10 verses of Jihad and intolerance etc. I doubt he has read one of them.
===
After 20 years of studying Islam, I can assure you it is anti-Christian. I assume that the Anglican Church which is pro-Islam and anti-Western civilisation can explain the 1600 Suras which call for Jihad and violence against non-Moslems, or less-than-pious-enough-Moslems. 10 such Suras are given below – I will look forward to your reply explaining why they do not mean a cult of war against Christians or less than pious Muhammadans. I will post the replies if they are coherent on a few sites. There is plenty of compulsion within the Meccan moon cult. If you can prove otherwise, than please do.
Thank you.
3:32
48:29
4:24
5:33
9:5
9:29
9:73
9:111
47:35
2:106 [this is the abrogation verse, which means that killing for Allah as given in the most important chapters of 9, 5, 4, and 2 supersede previous verses].
====
Leo the Isaurian says
Ibn Ishaq’s “Sirat Rasul Allah,” several hadith, al-Tabari, and other sources record the fate of the Banu Qurayza: the six hundred (or more) captive men were put in a trench and beheaded, and the women and children became slaves. How does the treatment of the Yazidi by ISIS differ from the treatment of the Banu Qurayza by Muhammad himself?
http://wikiislam.net/wiki/The_Genocide_of_Banu_Qurayza
http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Banu_Qurayza
This incident is just part of the “excellent example” Allah gave the Muslims with Prophet Muhammad. Perhaps David Thomas would like to declare that this incident was “not Islam” – but Islam itself has never rejected thus example or ceased to follow it, and that why the history of Islam includes so many massacres.
bobm says
Amen Beth…1 John2:22…………………………….”extremist” is just a descriptor for the teeth of the beast… working through the spirit of fear.
John says
Is his unshaven quasi-beard a token to his leanings?
gravenimage says
UK prof: Islamic State has “reverted to a model that has been the reality in parts of the Islamic world for most of its history,” but “what they are perpetrating is not Islam”
…………………………….
How common *is this*? Even when some dhimmi tool like the Rev. Professor David Thomas stumbles across some home truths about Islam, the experience alarms them so much that they immediately have to backpedal and hysterically assert that this, of course, has “nothing to do with Islam”.
Keith Brockmeyer says
If it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck, it’s a duck!
Islofob IS-1 says
The pastor / professor is following a twisted version of Christianty, his radical views are not Christian.
“The thief comes to kill, steal, and destroy.”
Rick Wannall says
I wrote to him. Looks like a common reply of the variety “I will send you off to look at tons of source material if you want to understand what I’m talking about variety.” Disappointing, to say the least, though not surprising. His reply is below.
My email to him:
From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: 09 September 2014 14:46
To: David Thomas
Subject: “what they are perpetrating is not Islam” – a difference of opinion
There is an article at the link shown below that strongly asserts that you opine, without support, that what ISIS et al are “perpetrating” is not Islam. The author, Robert Spencer, disagrees strongly. Many of us would be interested in your reply, in which you might outline the sources for your observation. Certainly many Muslims seems to abhor the violence, but ISIS do seem to be following injunctions in the Qur’an. If you can show otherwise, you would certainly generate tremendous interest.
The article can be found here:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/09/uk-prof-islamic-state-has-reverted-to-a-model-that-has-been-the-reality-in-parts-of-the-islamic-world-for-most-of-its-history-but-what-they-are-perpetrating-is-not-islam
Rick Wannall
Houston, TX
From: David Thomas
Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 10:49 AM
To: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: “what they are perpetrating is not Islam” – a difference of opinion
Thanks for this, but I do not intend to get involved in a long correspondence with people (maybe not including you) whose only concern would be to show that whatever I had to say would be wrong. If you are really interested, then it may be good to consult what is said by various Muslim scholars about the conditions governing legitimate jihad. This may go some way to show why in the eyes of many Muslims what ISIS is doing contravenes Islamic principles.
Yours,
David Thomas
Professor of Christianity and Islam
Tradewinds says
“This may go some way to show why in the eyes of many Muslims what ISIS is doing contravenes Islamic principles.”
Huh? Is this guy nuts? No wonder the Mohammedans are taking over his country!
rev g says
In the eyes of many Catholics, birth control is not a bad thing. That does not mean that birth control is ok with Catholicism’s tenets.
Even if “many” muslims wanted to coexist peacefully with their non-muslim neighbors, that does not make such arrangements in accordance with Islamic principles. Islam is not about popular opinion. ISIS strictly adheres to Islamic principles. This “prof” is propagandizing.
KEH says
I now have to wonder if this guy is anything to do with this organisation ??
http://www.cpexposed.com/
wolfgang says
I wrote to this ‘ gentleman ‘ above…….I will put his reply here , it says enough I think , he accuses me of sarcasm, that was not my intention, I asked him to explain his position which he could not and I presume he has a fixed position, like most academics, he does not answer several question’s I asked how it was that ISIS is NOT acting according to the Qur’an and therefore engaging in murderous and vile acts ?
———————————————————————————————————-
Published on Sep 7, 2014 by Youtuber: Acts17Apologetics David Woods. His website: http://www.answeringmuslims.com Jihadists fighting for ISIS (the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria) claim that they are…
” I am not sure what point you are asking me to answer, or why you think sarcasm will serve any purpose. Please check through your email and let me know exactly what you would like me to address ”
Yours,
David Thomas
Professor of Christianity and Islam
Nadir Dinshaw Professor of Inter Religious Relations
School of Philosophy, Theology and Religion
University of Birmingham
———————————————————————————————————-I will attempt to engage this man in a dialogue, however he has not or is not interested in seeing David Woods YT clip, stay tuned !
Bezelel says
I will stay tuned, and wish you all the best.
voegelinian says
“Professor of Christianity and Islam
Nadir Dinshaw Professor of Inter Religious Relations
School of Philosophy, Theology and Religion
University of Birmingham”
Nadir Dinshaw, born in Karachi, Pakistan, converted to Catholicism (the UK papers on his obituary say he converted from “Parseeism”, a curiously antiquarian locution for Zoroastrianism), with a grandmother who was Zoroastrian. Given that he founded a “Chair” at a mainstream university that produces such asinine academics as Prof. Thomas, it is safe to say that Prof. Dinshaw cultivated a lifelong quasi-dhimmitude that found a comfortably cozy fit in an increasingly PC MC academe. I.e., how on earth could an intelligent and erudite Zoroastrian Persian born and raised in the Islamic hellhole of Karachi not understand lucidly the pernicious danger of Islam, and not cultivate that as best he could as Chair of a department, such that asses like Prof. Thomas are not encouraged to pursue their pap?
sidney penny says
The Rev. Professor David Thomas is a professor of Christianity and Islam at the University of Birmingham.
Obviously you can become a professor without studying logic.
His premise does not support his conclusion.