Now wait a minute. We are all supposed to believe, on pain of charges of “Islamophobia,” that no Muslims outside the Islamic State support it. They all know what Obama and Cameron and everyone else has told us — that the Islamic State has nothing, nothing whatsoever, to do with Islam. So why would there be resistance among Muslims in New Zealand to fighting against the false Muslims of the Islamic State?
And why does no one in the mainstream media ever notice this cognitive dissonance?
“Muslim leaders: Don’t send Kiwi SAS troops to battle ISIS,” One News, October 2, 2014 (thanks to The Religion of Peace):
Muslim leaders here are worried a push to send the SAS to fight ISIS-linked terrorists could fuel a backlash among the Muslim community in New Zealand.
Speaking to Radio New Zealand, Wellington’s Kilbirnie mosque’s Secretary of the International Muslim Association of New Zealand, Tahir Nawaz, says supporting the fight in Iraq would be a bad idea.
“We are a very good community here, we are very co-operative,” Mr Nawaz said.
“Once New Zealand troops are sent there, our public attitude could change. At the end of the day there would be people living here whose roots are in the countries where New Zealand would send the troops.”
Tony Green the Secretary of the Federation of the Islamic Association of New Zealand believes more western boots on the ground would further radicalise Muslims in the west.
“That potentially fuels things because the whole martyr kind of scenario that’s been painted by the groups calling themselves IS, that would fan the flames more than anything.”
When asked if he believed a terror plot like the one in Australia could happen in New Zealand, Mr Green said he thought it was unlikely but there were no guarantees.
“I can’t give you an answer to that, but I just pray that’s not the case. I mean we’re watchful, and we try to engage with the wider community. I hope it’s not the case, I seriously do.”
Mr Key has said that he would seek advice on sending SAS troops to Iraq if a request was made by the US for New Zealand to join the conflict.
Angemon says
And? NZ troops would be fighting to liberate Iraq and Syria from ISIS. Shouldn’t Iraqi and Syrians in NZ be in favour of it?
Andy says
soooo the NZ muslims are victims already?
Wellington says
My thoughts exactly, Andy. Self-pity and victim-oriented thinking are intrinsic to Islam, as are many other negatives like killing, misogyny, taqiyya, kitman, control-freak behavior, parasitism and an ungraciousness that has few rivals.
Bettina says
Yep, muslims MUST defend islam at all costs, to make sure that these intrinsic qualities remain intact, pure, and holy — protect and defend it against any human influence whatsoever, to maintain its integrity.
Don McKellar says
The correct move by NZ is indeed to immediately round up their moslems and banish them, much like the legend of St Patrick driving all th snakes from Ireland. They should round them up and ship them all off to the Islamic State where they can live under sharia law like they all dream of anyways. It would be for their own good and for New Zealand’s own good. Everybody wins.
Angemon says
How would they go about deporting native converts? What if someone refused to be deported on the basis of ISIS being un-islamic (or at least not representative of what he claimed islam is)?
Don McKellar says
Politically correct silliness like this are why there are moslems colonizing NZ in the first place. That’s just splitting hairs and obscuring the issue at hand. It’s taquiyya and/or kitman used by moslems and spewed by their leftist useful idiots. Many of the most rabid Islamic supremacists will object to being deported based on your reasons. The reality is that they want a caliphate, they want sharia law, but they don’t see any reason that they shouldn’t be able to enforce it in New Zealand. And new converts don’t view themselves as regular New Zealand citizens anymore. They are the most rapid of moslems, and see New Zealand law as secondary to sharia. New Zealand doesn’t need these people — in fact they are bad for New Zealand’s health (and heads).
Angemon says
Don McKellar posted:
“Politically correct silliness like this are why there are moslems colonizing NZ in the first place.”
I’m inquiring about NZ law and the applicability of your suggestion. How is that “political correct silliness” or the reason muslims are in NZ in the first place?
Look, most of the people who suggest deporting all muslims, like you do, don’t go much further than that, like it seems to be your case. So, how would they go about deporting native converts? What if someone refused to be deported on the basis of ISIS being un-islamic (or at least not representative of what he claimed islam is)?
“That’s just splitting hairs and obscuring the issue at hand.”
I thought the issue at hand was how to apply your suggestion. I’m asking you about how would you deport native citizens to a foreign, internationally unrecognized self-professed state based on their professed beliefs alone. ISIS is sunni. What if a shia muslim says that ISIS doesn’t represent his views?
“It’s taquiyya and/or kitman used by moslems and spewed by their leftist useful idiots.”
What part of asking you about the feasibility of your suggestion is taquiyya and/or kitman?
“Many of the most rabid Islamic supremacists will object to being deported based on your reasons.”
If they’re foreign citizens that’s all they can do – object. But native citizens can’t be deported. They simply can’t.
“The reality is that they want a caliphate, they want sharia law, but they don’t see any reason that they shouldn’t be able to enforce it in New Zealand. And new converts don’t view themselves as regular New Zealand citizens anymore.”
I take it you’re speaking for all NZ converts. Do you know something I don’t regarding what’s going on in their mind? Can you provide evidence that everyone who converts to islam actually knows everything about islam, including the supremacist aspects and the mandate to wage warfare against non-muslims?
Don McKellar says
As for your questions:
1.) CITIZEN NON GRATA
New laws are required. Countries need to create new status for moslems: citizen non grata. Yes, you read it first here. I propose this designation. Such individuals are to be deported to a sharia law based country and are not eligible for a regular passport to return to New Zealand.
2.) Okay. The Shi’ite moslem has a choice to be deported to a shi’ite moslem country, for humanitarian reasons.
3.) A moslem ALWAYS says that something or somebody isn’t Islamic whenever it is convenient for them to say so. The claim that any Islamic state or person or action doesn’t represent their views of Islam is no longer a valid statement. It has been negated by observation of the Islamic texts. The Islamic texts are ALWAYS right, and the correctness of the actions of a person or state claiming to be Islamic can ONLY be judged based on that. Saying otherwise is ALWAYS deception or ignorance.
4.) Sure native converts will be deported. See “Citizen Non Grata” above.
4.) Obviously I do know more about what’s going on in a new convert to Islam’s mind than you do. I read and listen to what they say and watch what they do. Have you tried that? Works great. They’re speaking loud and clear.
Angemon says
Don McKellar posted:
“4.) Sure native converts will be deported. See “Citizen Non Grata” above.”
What if the country where you intend to “deport” a NZ citizen to simply says “Not my citizen, not my problem”? What are you going to do, parachute them, or drop them at the border?
Regarding the rest of your suggestions, none of them accounts for closet muslims and future converts, #2 contradicts #3, and #1 and #4 would need a dictatorship or totalitarian system to be approved. As for #5, if you claim to know what’s in the mind of ALL muslim converts – ALL of them, that’s what I asked you about – then you should give their details to the authorities and explain why they should be kept under tight surveillance.
voegelinian says
Nice to see a breath of fresh air in Jihad Watch comments for a change, in the form of Don McKellar’s fine and sensible responses to the bloody idiot Angemon, whose PC MC bullshit is getting tiresome — “politically correct silliness” indeed! Worse yet, no other Jihad Watcher has seen fit over these last several months to call Angemon on his obtuse bullshit (which seems to come up most when he is alighting like a jackdaw on my comments here and there).
While Don McKellar’s idea of “Citizen Non Grata” is tempting, I still think we don’t need any special or new laws or revisions of old laws, once we (the West) realize that Muslims never really were citizens in the first place — because the Islam they believe in and subscribe to as Muslims inherently precludes the citizenship oaths and loyalty — mainly by being supportive of deadly sedition in the context of a hot war being waged now against us — against any non-Islamic polity) upon which citizenship depends.
Angemon says
voegelinian posted:
“Don McKellar’s fine and sensible responses”
Shouting out “political correctness” and “taquiyya” to reasonable questions, much like muslims shout “bigotry” and “islamophobia” to any inquiry on islam, is your idea of “fine and sensible responses”? Why am I not surprised?
“the bloody idiot Angemon”
Well, well, well, seems like voeg thinks like a run-of-the-mill muslim – as soon as believes he has numerical superiority he comes out in a blaze of flames. Quite the refreshing change from his usual underhand-insulting persona. Careful there voeg – how are you supposed to play victim and whine about the Jihad Watcher meanies when it’s you doing the insulting?
Rob Trueman says
I believe that PC needs to be exposed and, largely, defeated in order to fully expose islam. Unfortunately, this is also how islam thrives-when the society that it is conquering is, itself, waring and fractured. Until and unless we get the leftists sufficiently out of the way (defanged), this won’t end well for freedom and liberty.
Anonymous says
They could always borrow a page from the Spaniards in 1609. Those folks didn’t even bother with people who claimed to have converted out of i-slam and booted the entire lot, lock, stock and barrel.
However, this is all conjecture, nothing will happen, IS will spread and establish itself over Iraq, Syria, portions of Lebanon, then…?
The world is too politically correct to know what to do with an anachronism like the IS.
News coverage will reduce over time; the matter will be dismissed as just the way things are in the middle east. After all, people have accepted Saudi Arabia for what it is, IS is simply an expansionist version of Saudi. So long as it remains within the Middle East and Asia, it will not be looked at seriously (except by folks who live in the affected areas).
I wonder what it would take to jolt the majority in the west into demanding action? Probably nothing.
There are many who continue to be dismissive of i-slam bearing any responsibility; they take especial care to smugly look down upon the islamophobics.
Those who have more than a nagging suspicion that i-slam is the problem mutter under their breaths about the ‘immigrants’ (We don’t want to be hauled up for politically incorrect or ‘racist’ speech now, do we?).
After all, European politicians sold their countries out to the highest bidder while the chattering classes cheered. There was nothing the common man could do to stop it.
I would be happy to see these predictions proven wrong…
Angemon says
Anonymous posted:
“They could always borrow a page from the Spaniards in 1609. Those folks didn’t even bother with people who claimed to have converted out of i-slam and booted the entire lot, lock, stock and barrel.”
They could if they were 17th century Spain (where the inquisition kept converts out of islam under watch) instead of 21st century New Zealand. Unless NZ has more liberal laws than other Western democracy, getting rid of a native born citizen is next to impossible.
Don McKellar says
The new 21st Century reality requires new laws on citizenship for all countries. Political Islam has made this a priority item. The nations of the world can no longer sit back and tolerate those who seek to undermine and destroy their liberal democracies — which is the mandate of Islam, clearly laid out in the Islamic texts, and enacted in thousands of examples. It never had to be like this, but the naive vision of multi-culturalism that has dominated the post 1960’s modern countries of the world has resulted in a massive influx of both a people and a philosphy which seeks to destroy and dominate and is exactly the opposite of multi-cultural. Obviously, the multi-culturists had absolutely no idea whatsoever what Islam entailed and deluded themselves in willful ignorance. This delusion needs to end before things really go downhill. Cut out the cancerous growth from the body before it spreads even more and patient may yet live.
Bettina says
I wish that straddling fences between these muzzies’ versions of taqiyya (we disown all these radicals, but don’t attack them or we’ll get mad) would turn their balls to mush and obliterate all that evil testosterone.
Bettina says
…that evil testosterone that serves as their brain cells.
Gail Griffin says
Hear, hear. So now that muslims have moved into western countries they can dictate that countries policies or they might get nasty.
If they don’t support destroying IS then they are supporting beheadings, ethnic cleansing, crusafictions (or however you spell it). These people do not think in a good way. They support evil.
Jen says
I’m a New Zealander so here are a few of the problems as I see it.
Many NZers , in my opinion, are extremely clueless when it comes to Islam. They do not know much, if anything, about the religion. I would be actually surprised if many people knew who Muhammad even was, let alone what he did. Similarly, they seem largely unaware about the happenings in Europe and America with regard to Muslims and how much trouble this has caused. If they were aware, NZ could nip it in the bud at an earlier stage and avoid the catastrophe. But alas…
I read the recent comments on a news article that came out about ISIS and whether NZ should offer support. You would hope that people who bother to read the news have a better understanding of world events than those who don’t, but…..
Not one of them correctly identified that Islam and what it teaches is a problem. The closest anyone came was to say (I’m paraphrasing) “that ISIS were religious fanatics and that this could spread elsewhere if not stopped.” (In other words, it’s not Islam that’s the problem- only the extremists. Not understanding that Islam by its nature is inherently extreme in what it teaches).
Another one: “Most Muslims are peaceful people!!!” — and what has this got to do with anything? When your friendly Muslim neighbours are invited to the prestigious Dar al-Islam, and you are just a dhimmi, what difference will it it make?
People also said things like “Duuuh why doesn’t our Prime Minister have any sense! Why do you think Australia has become a target and not us? It’s because Australia has been more active in supporting anti-terrorist efforts with the other Western countries!!”
Another common one: “This is THEIR war and we should stay out of it! We shouldn’t have to clean up the mess that US/UK created.”
Another one: “It’s because George Bush upset the locals!!!!”
(They are still harping on about Bush and his Weapons of Mass Destruction and what a failure that was. Thus, how terrible an idea it would be to get involved because this TOO will be just as much of a disaster- not understanding again that the threat here is distinct and, yes, Bush was a moron…But what does that have to do with Islam??? ).
Another one: “It’s all about the oil!!!!!” “This is not about terrorism, it’s about greed!!!”
What people do not seem to understand is that New Zealand WILL become a target whether they LIKE IT OR NOT. These jihadists are not basing their decisions on “if you leave us alone, we’ll leave you alone.” Thinking you can negotiate or somehow be given mercy by appeasing them will be NZ’s downfall in coming years.
If more Kiwis had an idea about Islamic doctrine, they would realise that these jihad attacks are part of a wider objective to expand Islam, not merely because of anger towards the West.
NZ is used to living in a cocoon as the place has been virtually free of threats when compared to other countries. It is also geographically isolated so unlike Europe or America, it does not face the same issues in securing its borders. Even the idea that NZ *could* be under threat is a bit of a novelty I think.
At this stage, I think NZ should consider offering even a *small* token of support to the other allies because NZ is like a sitting duck. If they don’t offer “boots on the ground”, then something else small at least. I agree though that immediate action *would* put NZ at greater risk of a terrorist attack in the immediate future. But not acting at all, in my view, is merely delaying what will inevitably happen in NZ anyhow, just as it has in Europe and elsewhere.
Another thing. NZers are permitted to live in Australia without needing any kind of visa at all, the same with Australians coming to NZ. It would not surprise me if potential jihadists decide to use this freedom of movement to evade police. So Australia’s problem *is* NZ’s problem.
I thought about asking Robert Spencer to offer his services to NZSIS (New Zealand Security Intelligence Service). Or maybe even getting them to read some of his books. I hope the intelligence service is not as clueless about Islam as the rest seem to be. I wonder what is written in their training manuals?
Ugh…..
Angemon says
Jen posted:
“I’m a New Zealander so here are a few of the problems as I see it.
Many NZers , in my opinion, are extremely clueless when it comes to Islam. They do not know much, if anything, about the religion. I would be actually surprised if many people knew who Muhammad even was, let alone what he did. Similarly, they seem largely unaware about the happenings in Europe and America with regard to Muslims and how much trouble this has caused. If they were aware, NZ could nip it in the bud at an earlier stage and avoid the catastrophe. But alas…”
That’s pretty much the whole problem worldwide. Islam claims to be an abrahamic religion like Judaism or Christianity, so people assume they’re all the same or extremely similar. If such ignorance weren’t rampant then islam would undoubtedly be treated on a fashion similar to nazism or fascism.
Well, ignorance alone doesn’t account for everything. There are enablers that push the islamic agenda forward, even if they’re not muslims themselves, either out of naiveness, personal gain or the misguided idea that islam and sharia are a good thing – I’m sure that claims like “sharia law ensures there’s no class distinction and is the solution for drug abuse and prostitution” are irresistible in certain political mindsets.
deja vu says
Well said, Jen. Unfortunately our laid-back ‘she’ll be right’ attitude, lately aided and abetted by the long arm of political correctness, will be our undoing. But, thinking of the incident with the Muslim owner of the cafe in Invercargill, Kiwis do rise up in anger when an obvious injustice occurs.
I’m sure the remarks from the Kilbirnie mosque’s Secretary of the International Muslim Association of NZ will not sit well with the majority of Kiwis who don’t like being told what to do by outsiders. As Rob has already pointed out, it is concerning that there’s been nothing in the daily newspapers today about this threat. Do the editors take their orders from APN or Fairfax in Australia, or are they as craven as we’re beginning to believe?
Wellington says
Thanks for that New Zealand perspective, Jen, even though it wasn’t comforting to read. Well, ignorance of Islam is actually worse than Islam. If Western nations en masse knew what Islam is really all about, defeating Islam’s supremacist intentions would be far less difficult. Non-Muslim ignorance of Islam is really Islam’s greatest ally. Sadly, it seems New Zealanders are no exception to the most dangerous ignorance of our age.
zacharias says
hello Jen….I am a Kiwi too…..born in eastern Europe many years ago…..your analysis is spot on and I share your pain…because I kn ow how painful it is to be surrounded by clueless dhimmis on a daily basis…..your point about Australian Trojan horse jihadis freely travelling to NZ is in deed a very very very important one…..greetings….I wish I could know you in person……
dumbledoresarmy says
Jen
Three books you need to get and read, ASAP, are 1/ ex-Muslim now-Christian Sam Solomon’s “Al-Hijra – The Islamic Doctrine of Immigration” (it’s very clear and information-packed, yet quite brief, the busiest politician could skim through it in a day) 2/ Sam Solomon’s “The Mosque and Its Place in Society” and 3/ Australian scholar Rev Dr Mark Durie, “The Third Choice: Islam, Dhimmitude and Freedom”.
Read and reread. Share them around. Recommend them on FB and in newspaper comments sections. They are *not* expensive to buy. Get them for your elected representative. Send copies – especially a copy of “Al Hijra” – to your local Maori chief/ tribal council, with a covering letter saying – “You thought the Pakeha invasion was bad??? The Muslim one is underway and it’s going to be 1000 times worse, unless it’s stopped. Be alert. Be alarmed.”
You could also google “Raymond Ibrahim” and “Taqiyya”, or “Raymond Ibrahim” “Islam” “Deception” and see what comes up in the drag – he is a friend and associate of Mr Spencer’s, a Coptic-background American with fluent Arabic, and he has written a series of excellent articles about Islamic deception.
You can also go to the “Barnabas Fund” website (they have a NZ branch, by the way) and buy copies of their booklets – the three that I recommend are “What is Sharia?”, “Islam and Truth” (title at least in part ironic; includes a discussion of taqiyya, with Islamic sources referenced), and “Is the Muslim Isa the Biblical Jesus?” (conclusion: NO!!). The booklet on sharia…send it to every MP in NZ. The booklet on Jesus and Isa …send it to every clergyperson of your acquaintance; get a sackful (each booklet only costs about a dollar) and give one to every Christian person that you happen to know, for if they read it, it should inoculate them against all manner of sneaky deceptions practised by Muslims who use the “interfaith” network to “groom” Christians for dhimmitude.
Jen says
@KiwiKaffir Yes! This gives me hope. There is sanity among us. I love NZ as it is. My fear is that we will have to watch it go down a one-way road to Islamic hellhole in slow motion. You already know the ending which makes it that much more excruciating. There is barely 1% of the population that are Muslim. Less than that even, and they’re already starting to kick off. Those who resist dhimmitude will be called a “racist.” Many islamists take a long term view of expanding Islam so anyone mentioning how capable our PM is, has forgotten that he’s only been elected for 3 years. What’s 3 years when Islam has been on the quest to expand for over 1000? Also. The naive belief that all politicians do the right thing by the people who voted them in. It’s a very warm and fuzzy concept but a bit silly. I like Key, don’t get me wrong. I think he is an astute man. But there are multiple forces at play in politics. Give and take. I can cite at least one example where Key has said things which I don’t truly believe that *he believes* e.g. overseas investment and the impact on house prices. Anyone can see that while it’s not the *whole* problem of overpriced housing, it is part of the problem. Why did Key say otherwise when he obviously knows better? Diplomacy is part of politics. Issues will become priortised when they are already glaringly obvious to everyone. Islam is not obvious to everyone.
@Zacharias Nice to see your message. I’m glad you see my point of view. Hard to argue with anyone who knows nothing about Islam and looks at you like you’re some nutty conspiracy theorist who is just overreacting. Why do they always bring up stories about friendly Muslims they know? There is an enormous case study called ‘the rest of the world’ which shows that Islamic cruelty looks the same, no matter where it goes. It does not help that we only have one national newspaper so everyone gets their news from the same source. People who read blogs which are critical of mainstream media views are probably more likely to be informed. Mainstream media always has its hands tied behind its back.
@dumbledoresarmy- Thank you!! I’ll have a look at them. I saw your post at the bottom as well and I’ve bookmarked JB Kelly.
Soldiers' Mail says
Exactly so. Round them up and ship them back whence they came. If they are going to prove to be disloyal subversives because the government chooses to fight the evil in their homelands, then send them back to the cesspools they came from forthwith. I would start with the bastard who had the cheek to make the comment.
Charli Main says
Ah shucks !!!!!!
All those ” New Zealand” Muslims are really worried that their Christian NZ brothers might get hurt by all those nasty mis -understanders of Islam, if they are sent to fight in the ” Islamic State”.
All yea of little faith.!!!! See, there really are ” peaceful” ” moderate” ” tolerant ” Muslims.
Bettina says
The threat in their words resounded loud and clear for me, much more than any overall deceit…
dumbledoresarmy says
The moment I read it, I saw the threat.
And nota bene: one of the persons uttering that threat is one “Tony Green”.
With a name like that, he’s *got* to be a convert to Islam, not someone born and bred within the Ummah.
I hope that the NZ equivalent of ASIO is watching him like a hawk.
Converts to Islam, because most enthusiastic, can be the *most* dangerous.
The beheading of Lee Rigby, the beheading of that dear old grannie in London, and the beheading just lately in Oklahoma, were *all* carried out by persons who had *converted* to Islam.
Beagle says
I apologize for those who’ve seen it before. But this thread, like so many threads at Jihad Watch, is a perfect opportunity to link David Wood’s fantastic video on the three basic stages of jihad in Islam. New Zealand Muslims are behaving exactly the way you’d expect stealth jihad Muslims in stage one to act.
I used to have to try to explain this in a paragraph or two, not easy, but now I just do this:
http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2012/01/three-stages-of-jihad.html
The NZ Muslims are both supporting the sword jihad in stage three and acting like aggrieved victims in stage one. It’s not their fault if they become ‘radicalized’ you see. It was the troops wot dun it.
It’s what you’d expect, once you know what to expect.
Jen says
This is a good video. Thanks
Bettina says
Thanks for the link, Beagle. Following it as we speak. I’ve checked out a fantastic book from my library thanks to Mirren. Here’s the title:
“The Closing of the Muslim Mind: How Intellectual Suicide Created the Modern Islamist Crisis.”
Of course the subtitle should’ve read “How intellectual suicide created ALL islamist barbarities over the ages.”
Salah says
Charlie Hebdo…again!
Muhammad: I’m the Prophet, stupid!
ISIL beheader: Shut up, infidel!
http://www.charliehebdo.fr/sommaire.html
Charli Main says
Brilliant !!!!! Well done Salah——-
Bettina says
I went to the cartoon. Great one! Do you find that Charlie Ebdo are as a whole anti-islam or simply counter-jihad?
Ralph says
Genesis 16: 7 The angel of the Lord found Hagar near a spring in the desert; it was the spring that is beside the road to Shur. 8 And he said, “Hagar, slave of Sarai, where have you come from, and where are you going?”
“I’m running away from my mistress Sarai,” she answered.
9 Then the angel of the Lord told her, “Go back to your mistress and submit to her.” 10 The angel added, “I will increase your descendants so much that they will be too numerous to count.”
11 The angel of the Lord also said to her:
“You are now pregnant
and you will give birth to a son.
You shall name him Ishmael,[a]
for the Lord has heard of your misery.
12 He will be a wild donkey of a man;
his hand will be against everyone
and everyone’s hand against him,
and he will live in hostility
toward[b] all his brothers.”
GOD gave the Stupid Wild Donkeys a Destiny and they have followed it to a TEE for Hundred of Years.
deja vu says
Something like 4,500 years in reality. The pagan tribes of the Old Testament fought among themselves continually, and always hated the Israelites because Jacob had been given the birthright through Abraham’s legitimate son Isaac and not Esau, the son of the illegitimate Ishmael.The Edomites, direct descendants of Esau, were particularly hostile to them. What’s changed?
It is interesting to note that, at the time of his trial, Jesus refused to answer Herod, an Edomite (from what is now Saudi Arabia). He did, however, answer Pontius Pilate, the Roman governor of Judea. The silence of Jesus speaks volumes.
mariam rove says
some times I wish I was dreaming about all these and I wake up and everything is happily ever after!!! But day in and day out Islam is a living nightmare. M
Liam1304 says
We had a Somali New Zealander apprehended in Australia as he was on his way to join the IS a while ago. Came to NZ as a boy of 8 and is now 23 trying to get to the Islamic State to help kill babies, er – liberate Iraq from the oppressors I mean.
How did he come to misunderstand the peaceful teachings of Islam?
I declare, this is the most incomprehensible religion in the history of the planet – even guys with PhDs in Islamic studies like al-Baghdadi don’t know appear to know the first thing about it!
Rajivi says
A Muslim cleric’s sermon during the Friday prayers:
http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/4532.htm
Bettina says
Thanks for the link, Rajivi. The short sermon blows your mind, so chockfull is it of paranoid delusions and blind hatred.
How can any sane person contemplate the idea that America and Israel are in league with Iran to further its nuclear program ???
Among their other amazing attributes, it’s evident that arabs are not afraid of ridicule. Their already brainwashed masses just keep soaking up the insanity offered by silver-tongued imams and other politicos.
How utterly bizarre — and deadly dangerous!
Walter Sieruk says
Foremost, one Muslim just day send me a yahoo.com message that he likes ISIS. Furthermore, on the subject of the thugs of ISIS with their evil and mad mindset and sending missile strikes on them. It’s of some interest to to the Bible reads The hearts of men are full of evil and there is madness in the hearts while they live , and afterwards they join the dead. ‘ Ecclesiastes 9:3. First, this evil and madness is the way of thinking that describes the fiends of ISIS. Second, could it be that some of the airstrikes on the ISIS thugs can make some of them “join the dead.” ? Moreover, the villains of ISIS are so very cruel and violent that the curse that is found in the Bible might be on them. For Psalm 140:11. reads “may disaster hunt down men of violence.” there again , could it be the airstrikes might be some of the disaster that has and will “hunt down” some of the ISIS terrorists. ? [N.I.V]
Rajivi says
“… At the end of the day there would be people living here whose roots are in the countries where New Zealand would send the troops.”
Why can’t those worrying abt their roots, go to the roots and live there?
A traitor gang, which ever country they may be living in, that bites the hand that feeds them.
bobm says
..Deport them.. cleans your nation; these MUSLIMS are charter Jihadis.. they will morph in Fact ..when the orders are given.. like a virus ; it will manifest ..if you say no .. they will attack you .. so get them out.
Undaunted says
“boots on the ground…” Again, I read that stupid phrase. I guess it’s considered hip.
To me, it’s an insult to every soldier who ever went out to kill the enemy and break his stuff. These men are not pieces of footwear dropped onto some plain or into some forest.
Historically, when honoring them mattered, we called them “troops in the field” or “men in the field” even if there were some women in the group. And that is what they are: men in the field. Men and women brave and committed enough to our well-being and survival that they offer themselves up for deployment to fields of battle, places where people kill and die, knowing they might not come back.
Men in the field. Troops in the field. Get it right.
duh_swami says
I get the same kind of inner reaction when people call our men and women in the field, ‘kids’. They are not ‘kids’…
Undaunted says
Yeah, what you said, swami.
Bettina says
You’re absolutely correct! This “boots on the ground” is a trite euphemism for the real think: soldiers who spill their blood in battle. Please share your distaste with Fox and CNN by going to:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/2010/10/14/contact-us/ where you find a list email addresses for ALL the anchors, and
http://www.cnn.com/feedback/show/?s=cnnpolitics where a contact form is ready for your input.
mortimer says
THREATS? RIOTS? MURDERS OF MUSLIM VERSUS MUSLIM?
“Muslim leaders here are worried a push to send the SAS to fight ISIS-linked terrorists could fuel a BACKLASH among the Muslim community in New Zealand.”
HOW MANY ‘FAKE’ MUSLIMS ARE THERE?
mortimer says
Bottom line: it is a crime against Allah to resist the jihad.
…but Saudis are doing it to!
I guess the Saudis are also kafirs.
Rob says
“We are a very good community here, we are very co-operative,” Mr Nawaz said.
They are not fake Muslims, they are fake New Zealanders!
deja vu says
Well said, Rob.
Given that Muslims are given encouragement (even a mandate) to lie through their teeth when swearing on oath for the purpose of gaining citizenship in ‘infidel’ nations, I agree with Don McKellar that it is time for a complete revision of our laws. Re-enacting the law of sedition in NZ, will enable the stripping of citizenship and deportation of those who fall foul of it. We need laws fit for our times. Banning imported imams would be a good first step, as would finding non-Islamic markets for our meat and dairy products.
Unfortunately, a refugee is granted citizenship the moment they set foot in NZ. I’m not a lawyer but assume this is in line with UN requirements. I (and many others) would like to see a moratorium on taking refugees from Islamic nations, and replacing them with Christians who are being persecuted in huge numbers. Nations should be free to fill their refugee quota from compatible people groups. Imagine the uproar from the lefty luvvies were this to happen. But they did not do so well in our recent election, so maybe this is the time to act to protect our heritage and give honour to those who fought and died so that we could be free.
Rob says
Three definitions of ‘treason’.
1.
the offense of acting to overthrow one’s government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
2.
a violation of allegiance to one’s sovereign or to one’s state.
3.
the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.
Numbers 2 and 3 are pretty close.
Jen says
@ deja vu
Look at this NZ Herald story from 1999… What happened to those refugees that were causing problems back in 1999? Did they straighten themselves in the end?
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=14951
It doesn’t seem like it judging by this one comment I found on a blog from presumably a Hamilton resident. Around May/June 2014:
“If you want to see the impact of crazy Islamic immigrants on a community visit Hamilton East with their small but very “active”, Somali community. Massively high burglary rate, sexual assaults on the street, P labs and everyone else trying to move out. They make the Mongrol mob look positively civilised. Have it on good authority the Hamilton Feds have had a gutsful of them but the PC brigade prevents public finger pointing at the antics of this specific ethnic group even though everyone else who lives in Hamilton East knows who the problem group is.”
I’ve never heard NZ Herald report on this?
somehistory says
Threat:”our public attitude could change.”“We are a very good community here, we are very co-operative,” “That potentially fuels things because the whole martyr kind of scenario that’s been painted by the groups calling themselves IS, that would fan the flames more than anything.”
And where do their lofty titles originate? Who bestows these titles?
Wellington’s Kilbirnie mosque’s Secretary of the International Muslim Association of New Zealand
Secretary of the Federation of the Islamic Association of New Zealand
***********************************************************************
“Mr Key has said that he would seek advice on sending SAS troops to Iraq if a request was made by the US for New Zealand to join the conflict.”
Who is “Mr Key” and from whom will he seek advice?
deja vu says
Mr Key is the Prime Minister of New Zealand and has just won an election with an increased majority. He is no fool, and you can rest assured that these agitators are being kept under surveillance. We are a very small nation of only 4 million and nothing can be kept under wraps for long.
Historically, most Muslims in NZ were from Fiji or India and there were no problems at all. It is only with the influx of ‘refugees’ and others from the ME and the horn of Africa that problems have arisen. We now have those who are speaking with a forked tongue, which is a comparatively new development. It won’t go unnoticed.
somehistory says
Thanks for the information. I thought that might be the case.
Rob says
Mr Key is also Jewish by descent from his mother.
Key’s mother narrowly escaped Germany prior to WW2 and arrived in the UK as a teenager.
She married Mr Key senior who was a Spanish Civil War vet and they later moved to NZ.
voegelinian says
“Historically, most Muslims in NZ were from Fiji or India and there were no problems at all.”
Yes, we all know how harmless Indian Muslims are…
voegelinian says
Could there be some other circumstantial reasons why there were “no problems at all” back in the old days in NZ when only Muslims from Fiji and India were there? Or are we obliged to assume, as deja vu assumes without any evidence, to give Muslims the benefit of the doubt if they don’t come from certain regions? I invite deja vu to try to speculate as to why there were “no problems at all” “historically” in NZ with the Muslims from Fiji and India — speculate without giving Muslims the benefit of the doubt. Try it, it’s not that hard!
ECAW says
Jeez – that’s about the least veiled veiled threat I’ve ever heard!
No Fear says
i.e. “If you fight against Islamism there could be more Islamists as a consequence so don’t do it”
How disengenious.
Sickendbyjihadjohnnies says
Re: kiwi mussies… Sounds like a veiled threat to me..”we’re behaving now..no beheadings here or flag burnings or anti Israeli demonstrations, BUT DONT PISS US OFF BY GETTING RID IF THE SAVAGE MURDERING ISIS MUSLIMS” that what that asswipe seems to be saying! It’s in new Zealand’s effort as well to rid the planet of this scum since they too have the traitorous Muslim population in their island!!! I just cannot believe the audacity!
Beagle says
Just got a news alert. Another Brit beheaded by IS allegedly.
Rob says
I’ve sent an email to the newsdesk of the Dominion Post which is the Wellington NZ daily. Kilbirnie, where the mosque is, is a suburb of Wellington.
I’ve asked the editors why they aren’t all over this effrontery.
Having said that, the only instance of terrorism in NZ was the bombing of the Rainbow Warrior by French special forces.
Demigration is the only option for the West in dealing with Muslims.
deja vu says
Excellent, Rob. The Dom Post is owned by Fairfax, and perfectly reflects the lefty/arty airheads of Wellington. I’ve written to various MPs in the past but, after a long delay, have only had the usual pro-forma replies.
In addition to the Rainbow Warrior, we did have a spate of Jewish cemetary vandalism a while back, which coincided with agitation from the Marxist pro-Palestinian rent-a-rabble crowd. And all went quiet when the group of Afghan men were caught in Hamilton with a photocopied flight manual and a map of Lucas Heights. There’s certainly no room for complacency but if they try anything the average Kiwi joker will show what he’s really made of.
Let us know if your email is answered!
Rob says
Of course I’ll post if I get a reply.
But if its editorial approach in the past is anything to go by, I doubt there’ll be a reaction.
After the Boston bombing there was an editorial which largely ‘warned’ the US against any kind of anti-Muslim backlash.
To its credit the Dominion Post published my letter and I was later contacted in person by a high-ranking US official who thanked me for my effort.
Here’s the letter text:
‘Your editorial ‘Balance needed in fight against terrorism’ (20 April 2013) shakes a portentous finger against the possibility of violent reaction (‘paranoia and prejudice’), by Americans in the wake of the bombings.
For 2011, the FBI reported that 80 percent of religiously motivated hate crimes in the US, were against Jews and 8.4 percent against Muslims. Against this background, the powder keg of anti-Islamic violence seems remote.
It is totally impertinent for a newspaper at this distance, to advise Americans how to behave. Could we have instead, an editorial commending them for their forbearance in the face of grievous acts by people whom they welcomed to their shores. People who have repaid the welcome in blood and shattered flesh’.
How hollow the idea that NZ ‘welcomed to its shores’ the people now making threats from the Kilbirnie mosque.
SallyA says
Let’s forget about global allies and submit to IS, send all military troops to West Africa to fight Ebola, keep letting the Ebola-infected West Africans (Muslim and otherwise) into our country, savor our male loved ones going to Allah’s heaven after Ebola kills them (and submit with defeatist decorum to whatever we’re told happens to the females “hereafter” when they’re non-virgins), and enjoy the Obama-led global transformation to being slaves of the global oligarchs who now include petrodollar Muslims.
Yay. We’ll enjoy the Islamic peace of not having to think about anything except how to avoid the Muslim lash or public stoning pit. (Sarc off.)
mortimer says
This mullah’s comments about THREATS FROM MUSLIMS raise the question of WHY IN THE WORLD would a sane populace want MUSLIMS coming to their countries!
If Muslims have so many VIOLENT people in their midst who support WORLD CONQUEST!!!
What are the violent JIHAD ENTHUSIASTS DOING IN NEW ZEALAND? And WHY don’t these people get offered a ONE-WAY TICKET to jihad-land?
Angemon says
mortimer posted:
“This mullah’s comments about THREATS FROM MUSLIMS raise the question of WHY IN THE WORLD would a sane populace want MUSLIMS coming to their countries!”
Politicians make the decisions, not the populace, sane or otherwise.
pumbar says
Apparently it’s “cultural enrichment”, not something I’ve ever encountered or experienced from moHAMheadans.
deja vu says
Angemon, as I understand it, the reality is that democratically elected governments have to comply with decisions made by the UN and other international bodies to which they are signatories. If the populace don’t like it, too bad. It’s a done deal. They can vote against the government at the next election, but it’s a brave party leader who will decide to opt out of the nation’s so-called international obligations without a mandate from the electorate. That consensus is hard to come by, especially with a subject like our intake of immigrants and refugees from Islamic nations.
Christine Godinet says
As a NZer I can tell you that our Muslim population, which is around 43,000 – we have a population of around 4 million – are for the most part peaceful – (so far).
We have had one trouble maker who came in under a false name and caused some trouble for a mosque and was arrested.
The leaders of the mosque separated themselves from him and his teachings. He was not a member of the mosque.
We also have had a couple of honour killings, but as NZ is not use to this type of thing, people don’t really dwell on it or associate it much with Islam.
Hindu’s have also committed honour killings.
The perpetrators are always arrested and imprisoned. Sharia law is never mentioned and has no place in NZ – yet, and our PM, John Key would not allow this either.
If a noticeable amount of trouble was caused by Muslims, NZers would call for immigrants and their families to be expelled and those born in NZ to be arrested.
John Key cancelled passports immediately of any that were suspected to be traveling out of the country to aid ISIS, and none have returned so far – although one, who burned his passport while in Syria is asking to return.
NZer’s are saying NO – leave him over there.
We will see what happens.
Most Muslims here are free to wear what they want, (the Islamic federation states this), so burqa’s etc are not required or encouraged.
If you ask them what they value in NZ – they will tell you – freedom and peace.
They have come from worn torn countries.
Most of the ones that seem to want to go and commit acts of terror appear to be those that have converted.
Let’s hope it remains like this and that the police deal quickly and properly with trouble makers.
We have no muslims in parliament or in any form of national leadership in NZ.
One of the things NZers are becoming very annoyed about is the fact that so many products here are halal certified.
The suppliers pay for this certification which for simply states that their products contain no meat or gelatine products, (why they can’t just put this on their labels – who knows). The cost of this certification is then passed on to the buyer, (which are mostly non-muslim), and much of the money paid for the certification goes back to the middle east.
We are extremely unhappy that not only are we supporting a religion we don’t want to support – but we could inadvertently be supporting terror.
Most of these products are not shown to be halal certified – it’s a marketing decision not to show this – hmmmm wonder why?
deja vu says
Christine Godinet: ‘One of the things NZers are becoming very annoyed about is the fact that so many products here are halal certified.’
This has long been a source of aggravation for me, too.
I deeply resent the imposition of halal killing chains in New Zealand without public consultation. At the time I contacted the SPCA who sent me a comprehensive report they’d presented as a submission against it, but to no avail. The demand that Islamic butchers be employed from overseas was met and our killing chains had to be moved to face Mecca. I find the intoned dedication to allah over each animal repellent.
I also contacted Fonterra about their use of halal gelatine in yoghurt, and got a chilly response to the effect that they export dairy products to Muslim countries and shouldn’t be expected to have a different product for the home market. Of course, halal meatworks supply the raw material for gelatine, so it isn’t surprising.
Expediency always wins the day, and we have to sell our products somewhere, but this compliance has come at a great cost to our autonomy (perhaps unforeseen at the time) and I fear it will only get worse unless we can build other markets without delay.
Tommo says
New Zealand can sell its produce where it likes but if it is Halal certified then it should carry a label to that effect. All NZ lamb imported into the UK is Halal and unlabelled. Non-Muslims are therefore at a disadvantage and denied the choice to buy or not. NZ meat producers say there is no difference in the product to that supplied historically. We say – well if there is no difference why hide the the fact that your meat now complies with Muslim certifying bodies? Is it because you fear consumers might switch to meat from animals humanely killed? All Halal food carries a premium which is paid to Muslim certifying companies. Does anyone know where their profits go?
bicky says
They are only 43,000 . that is why they appear peaceful , If cross 5 % they will no longer be peaceful, they will become forceful.Muslims from the Indian Subcontinent are no different from the ones from ME. Just look at the political climate in Pakistan and Bnagladesh where muslims are > than 99 %.
Just see how they treat the non muslims there.
Christians, Hindus , Sikhs are raped/enslaved/ slaughtered on a daily basis.
Too bad, the kiwis are ignorant about what is happening in the world.
I have been to NZ, it is a great place with warm people, hope to see it always like that
Jen says
I tend to agree with Bicky on this. It is the small numbers that are giving the appearance of peacefulness.
You can see this by looking elsewhere in the world. The issues in Europe didn’t immediately come to light all at once. When the Islamic population grew, so did the problems. NZ has a small population also. Through sustained Islamic immigration, it would not take long for them to become a sizable minority (of the total population), thereby giving them greater influence than they do at the moment. At this point, you will begin to see more arrogant comments and calls for Sharia…
In the Philippines, the Muslims cause plenty of problems, even in spite of being the minority in a largely Catholic country- and it’s a nightmare.
To add a little note about one of the other comments about Islam and where the Muslims originate from: The internet provides a very convenient platform for dawah which can reach a Muslim audience, regardless of which country they come from. Younger Muslims in particular are probably even more likely to turn to the internet to gain knowledge/interpretations about their religion- so geography could be even less important. The problem is not so much where they originate from, it’s the religion that’s the problem. I do not think that it matters whether they come from India or whether they come from Iran, for instance. The common thread is that, regardless of which sect of Islam they belong to, the Qur’an and hadiths are the the core of Islamic teachings. It is impossible to get away from that.
Being from war torn countries also doesn’t preclude them from violence. If anything, it is just as equally likely to harden their attitude. For example- this is an old article from 1999 about (mainly Muslim) refugees who moved to Hamilton. The article mentions they were from war-ravaged countries. “The youths sometimes threaten people and don’t realise it’s wrong” http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=14951
For any New Zealanders who haven’t seen this video- this is one from Luton in the UK. Just a small sample of what could happen here. This is their reaction after a woman was arrested (husband was involved in setting off a bomb). Notice the perfect British accents as they yell “British police go to hell.” They don’t give a damn about the country they were born in. *Sigh*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nP0XTvuRycY
Just my thoughts.
Jen says
@Christine Godinet
dumbledoresarmy says
There are two significant cultural components in New Zealand/ Aotearoa, the Land of the Long White Cloud.
One is Scots.
The other is Maori, the people descended from Polynesian blue-water deep-ocean sailors who reached the place – first human arrival, ever – in the early Middle Ages (European time-frame).
*Both* have fearsome warrior traditions and music to suit.
Here are some visual and auditory suggestions as to the sort of reply the New Zealand resistance should give to the sinister mohammedthugs.
Maori Haka or war -dance, traditional style.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-lrE2JcO44
Maori haka on the international sports field, performed by both Maori and Pakeha:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Gbj_ig09WQ
And, ramped up to the nth degree and flying, Maori/ NZ haka or war-dance, cultural fusion style, performed by NZ soldiers (both Maori and Pakeha) in Afghanistan as an act of defiance toward those Mohammedthugs who had murdered Kiwi soldiers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVSJK1jMxPI
Turn up the sound to LOUD.
Feel the chills go down your spine.
Kuffar can beat mohammedan rage boy anytime, once they put their minds to it.
(Now, just imagine throwing a lot of skirling Scots bagpipes into the mix as well, plus the drums…).
voegelinian says
Saudi Arabian Nikah Dance (Celebrating the Conquest of a Bride):
pumbar says
Bloody Nora. The hours must fly by!
Barry of here and there says
#1 Internment Camp
#2 Forced repatriation
paddy says
To ALL muslims in New Zealand and elsewhere in the free world, the message is simple….FUCK YOU!
Tommo says
New Zealand is embarking on it’s own multicultural experiment even though proven in the UK to be of no benefit to the country or its people. Thousands of Indians, Chinese, Koreans and Thai nationals are being accepted as immigrants there and welcomed as only the naive Kiwis are expected to do.
“We are a very good community here, we are very co-operative,” Mr Nawaz said. So far that is true but there is an underlying threat that as Muslim numbers increase they will become violent and become more demanding. As it is they get government funding for mosque building and Islamic schools, have taken over the meat industry 90% of which is now Halal only, infiltrated the Maori rights campaign and established themselves in every city across the country. Not a bad start for a minority group occupying just 1% of the population.
dumbledoresarmy says
A very astute observer and brilliant scholar of middle Eastern history and affairs was …a New Zealander.
One J. B. Kelly.
Here’s one account of Kelly’s career.
http://www.newenglishreview.org/blog_direct_link.cfm/blog_id/53852
Monday, 5 May 2014
Neglected Prophet: J.B. Kelly
And at this link y ou should find a full transcript of one of Kelly’s most important essays, entitled “Of Valuable Oil and Worthless Policies”.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/07/jb-kelly-of-valuable-oil-worthless-policies
J.B. Kelly: Of Valuable Oil & Worthless Policies
And when you’ve read the article – and copied it to your hard disk, to be printed off, and sent to the NZ Foreign Affairs minister and his Shadow – then scroll down and read such comments as were made by “Hugh”, namely, the formidably erudite “Hugh Fitzgerald” who used to post here a lot once upon a time, and contributed major articles, before hiving off to create his own counter-jihad website, the “New English Review” (which is well worth bookmarking). Be warned though – the same thread contains many postings by one “David Xavier” who slyly attacks Hugh, and Kelly also, and is dangerous, and not to be given credence.
If you’re a New Zealander with a bit of time to spare, say, a retiree, or a mum at home: why not try to track down Kelly’s books, and read them? You’ll then be waay ahead most of the “experts” who purport to brief your government on matters middle-eastern…
dumbledoresarmy says
That should have been “…waaay ahead OF most of the “experts”…”.
abad says
What NZ should be doing is deporting every Muslim on their soil to Iraq and tell them to never come back…..
Tommo says
Why Iraq? Few if any Muslim immigrants to New Zealand came from there. Going on immigration figures they more than likely are coming from Somalia, India, Pakistan and a few from Thailand. But I take your point that they should be deported, which of course is never going to happen.
What Kiwis need to do is to stop the flow of Muslim and all third world immigration which will eventually change the demographic make up of your country beyond all recognition. Start lobbying parliament consistently and intelligently and support those MPs that are against large scale immigration. You can beat it but you must be organised.
Alan Ireland says
“Not being able to understand Islam fully, the West considers it as defiant in its refusal to conform to [the West’s] values and practices. Into the 1990s Islam will be seen as the main counterforce to Western civilisation. An opinion is already taking shape of Islam as the major enemy after the collapse of communism. There are signs that some of the free floating hostility directed against communism over the last decades will move towards Islam.” — Akbar Ahmed, Guardian Weekly, July 15, 1990
And after Islam, there will be the Russians and Chinese again. That’s why we have the Ukraine crisis, which was engineered by the US, and Obama’s “pivot to Asia”. As Orwell foresaw, the world will be consumed by endless war.