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Exposing the role that Islamic jihad theology and ideology play in the modern global conflicts

UK officials can’t stop battle-hardened jihadis from returning from Islamic State

Nov 28, 2014 11:32 am By Robert Spencer

david-cameron-faithFoes of jihad terror — Pamela Geller and I — are not allowed to enter Britain. But the British authorities cannot figure out how to bar jihad terrorists from returning from the Islamic State. More absurdity as Britain gallops toward ruin: “Battle-Hardened Terrorists Will Return to The UK, And There is Nothing we Can do About it,” by Oliver Lane, Breitbart, November 27, 2014:

A senior government legal adviser has rubbished the Prime Minister’s plans to prevent terror suspects who travelled to the Islamic State from returning, saying they were not fully formed, and will never materialise as promised.

David Anderson QC, who was selected by the Home Office to scrutinise all counter terror law, used his privilege to savage the attempt made to ban terrorists from re-entering the country after fighting abroad, calling the proposed measures “an announcement waiting for a policy”. Mr Anderson told parliamentarians: “What we now have is a power that although entitled exclusion orders, or temporary exclusion orders, I think in reality it is much closer to managed return or controlled return”.

The PM had promised in September to prevent British passport holders who went abroad from being able to return to the UK, following a similar pledge made by Australian PM Tony Abbott. This now appears to be far from reality, as it seems in almost all cases returning terrorists will be merely required to attend ‘de-radicalisation courses’ and keep in touch with the police, reports the Daily Mail.

Remarkably, despite recent comments by a British member of parliament that there have been as many as 2,000 British citizens who went to fight for the Islamic State, the Government believes it will only confiscate something in the region of 50 passports from returning fighters a year.

The revelation will be embarrassing for David Cameron, who had sought to assure Britain they would be protected from battle-hardened, radicalised jihadists returning to the UK. Although the plans were questioned by lawyers from their outset, the government decided to push on with them….

The objection to refusing to allow jihadis to return from the Islamic State is that this renders them stateless, which is against international law. Solution: Declare war on the Islamic State (as it has declared war on Britain), and declare that anyone who travels there to join it is guilty of treason.

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Filed Under: Featured, United Kingdom, Useful idiots, willful ignorance Tagged With: Britain, David Anderson, David Cameron, ISIS, Islamic State


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Comments

  1. Jay Boo says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 11:35 am

    Who am I to say?
    Is their Islamic tradition real or fake?
    All people must learn to coexist and live in peace.
    Go ahead, pray five times and freely preach.
    Is not the call to prayer like a songbird singing a holy song?
    Proselytize about Muhammad, oh yes and do tell.
    Find your place Muslims, in a Muslim society where you feel you belong.
    Before your prophet bow; go and do it well.
    Who am I to say if Muslims wish to go peacefully to hell?

    • ROB says

      Nov 30, 2014 at 10:06 pm

      JAY BOO, you cannot co-exist with people that want to kill you, and it would be suicide to try.BAN THE KORAN!!!!!!!

  2. Michael Copeland says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 11:44 am

    Their presence will not be “conducive to the public good”.

    • David, Thailand says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 8:02 pm

      That is only accepted against non-Muslims.

    • rightrightright says

      Nov 29, 2014 at 2:36 am

      In their own Islam-speak, their return to the host nation will ‘spread corruption in the land’

  3. cs says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 11:46 am

    In this is scary, look at the pool that shows approval for ISIS among arabic speaking sites in Europe:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/nov/28/support-isis-stronger-arabic-social-media-europe-us-than-syria

    You can check also on the comments, that there is a lot of people Islam aware writing there, more and more people are coming to realize what is going on.

  4. Neil Jennison says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 12:17 pm

    Britain is still governed by the rule of law. The fact that many of those laws are now perverse and anti-freedom or downright dangerous is irrelevant.

    These Jihadis are British citizens for better or for worse (well let’s be honest, for worse). We allowed the uncontrolled immigration of people with an ideology that is incompatible with our own and we are now stuck with them.

    • Jay Boo says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 1:24 pm

      Neil Jennison
      Translation of your white flag comment of surrender

      “we are to blame”
      “There is nothing we can do”

    • Guy Macher says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 8:09 pm

      Mistakes shoud be corrected.

    • gravenimage says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 10:05 pm

      Another call for surrender from Neil Jennison.

      • Neil Jennison says

        Nov 29, 2014 at 8:23 am

        You are bonkers! That isn’t what I said at all.

    • Mirren10 says

      Nov 29, 2014 at 10:18 pm

      ”Britain is still governed by the rule of law. The fact that many of those laws are now perverse and anti-freedom or downright dangerous is irrelevant”

      Do you believe that there are **bad** laws, which should not be obeyed by anyone with morality and conscience ?

      What you seem to be saying is, that a law, however unjust or dangerous it may be, is still a law, and therefore must be obeyed. That’s suicidal, *and* immoral.

  5. Beagle says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 12:45 pm

    Yeah, it’s a real mystery what to do with people guilty of murder and crimes against humanity. What charges could they bring?

    • Neil Jennison says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 12:57 pm

      The trouble is that they haven’t committed these crimes in areas of British jurisdiction.

      • Beagle says

        Nov 28, 2014 at 1:04 pm

        Then ship them to the ICC which claims universal jurisdiction over crimes against humanity. Or, in the alternative, extradite them to the Syrian government. Yes, I know, the HRA will not permit it. You folks need to get rid of that suicidal ‘human rights’ legislation which only respects the rights of jihadis, not their victims.

      • Jay Boo says

        Nov 28, 2014 at 1:30 pm

        Neil Jennison
        One cannot get any ‘softer’ on jihad than that without becoming a Muslim

        • Neil Jennison says

          Nov 28, 2014 at 2:35 pm

          Jay Boo, I think you are misunderstanding me. I am just saying that in Britain the law prevails, and that is the law.

          I am not condoning the law at all. There are things that could be done. It could be made an offence (treason maybe?) for a British citizen to fight abroad for a foreign army.

          Though there are problems with that, many British citizens have joined the French Foreign Legion for example, we wouldn’t want that made illegal. But I am sure wording could be found or a list of “friendly armies” set up.

          I am just pointing out that this isn’t the government’s fault (many things are but not this). The rule of law prevails in the UK.

        • Mirren10 says

          Nov 29, 2014 at 10:23 pm

          ”I am just pointing out that this isn’t the government’s fault (many things are but not this). The rule of law prevails in the UK.”

          It is **governments** that pass laws. And they also *repeal* them, when it suits. You appear to me to be looking at law as if it was Holy Writ, like the Ten Commandments.

    • Ms says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 2:19 pm

      If this crime was committed in the US these people would be extradited to Britain and arrested and tried. The reason Cameron the wimp won’t do it is because he doesn’t have the guts. He’s more afraid of offending the Muslm population which in my book is too darned bad

      • Neil Jennison says

        Nov 28, 2014 at 2:39 pm

        If the offence was committed in the USA than the USA would try them even though they are British citizens.

        I suppose if the evidence exists we could allow them to be extradited to Assad’s Syria for trial? But there I suspect the ludicrous Human Rights laws would stop us.

      • Wolfgang says

        Nov 28, 2014 at 8:25 pm

        That fool has 5 million reasons to be afraid….

  6. Don McKellar says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 1:14 pm

    I don’t get it. Why can’t they just revoke their passports so they cannot simply get on a plane and fly back to terrorize the UK? They are stopped at the airport or whatever and have no choice but to return to the Islamic State.

    As much as I believe a modern day Devil’s Island is the answer — Jihadi Island, somewhere off Antarctica in international waters — obviously there is not the intelligence and will to do so.

    In any case, this is the exact topic which should be the NUMBER ONE topic of the UN. They need to be drafting up new international laws to deal with this crisis, and they should have been doing it YESTERDAY. In fact, if all these lying bastard moslem countries and their spokesmen really did believe that ISIS had nothing to do with Islam, then they would be on top of such legislation, too.

    • BW022 says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 2:10 pm

      Few countries have controls in place to prevent people from leaving the country. Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, etc. doesn’t have access to UK passport computers and has no idea whether a passport can been cancelled. It is up to individual countries to turn people back after they land if they don’t have the correct passport or visa.

      They can certainly add them to the “no fly” list, but that doesn’t stop them from taking a ship into the EU and then traveling to the UK via train or boat.

      The issue is… once in the UK… they are UK citizens. You can take their passport then, but you can’t deport them. Other countries have no obligation to take them back and certainly don’t want to deal with them. They are UK citizens. The UK needs to deal with them.

      You could arrest them on some terrorism charges, but you’d need to be able to prove this. This typically means long trials, bail, and exactly how you are proving that someone was fighting in Syria is rather iffy — baring them plastering messages on Facebook. Now… if they can say there are 2,000 British passport holders fighting in Syria… then they must have some evidence of this.

      Sorry… if western countries want to deal with this… they need to deal with it rather than making silly comments that they won’t allow such people back in the country. If they have evidence that these people are fighting overseas… they need to immediately charge them, have trials in absentia (if necessary), and be willing to jail them upon arrival. This means being ready to use intelligence information in court, have jails built and setup to handle this, hire more courts/judges/lawyers to handle 2000+ cases, etc. You need to ensure you have life or extremely long sentences (minimum sentencing) and judges willing to lay down lengthy sentences. Once convicted, you want people to come home so you can arrest them and place them in jail. This may mean lots of Guantanamo-like facilities for hardened jihadists.

      • Don McKellar says

        Nov 28, 2014 at 2:49 pm

        “trials in absentia”

        WE HAVE THE ANSWER! THIS MUST START AT ONCE.

        Good post. No, GREAT post.

        There is absolutely no excuse whatsoever from the Cameron government as to why this is not happening RIGHT NOW. No excuse, Cameron, you bought and sold bastard, this is what must happen RIGHT NOW.

      • Don McKellar says

        Nov 28, 2014 at 2:53 pm

        “This may mean lots of Guantanamo-like facilities for hardened jihadists.”

        No. Not at all. It means ONE Jihadi Island. In Antarctica. No guards, no facilities, they are simply parachuted in, and defend for themselves. Dirt cheap to the taxpayers compared to what they would pay in the long term otherwise. As a nod to political correctness, give them a compass so they can locate Mecca to pray to.

        • deja vu says

          Nov 28, 2014 at 5:00 pm

          Why Antarctica, Don? We don’t want them contaminating our patch thanks. Bad enough testing nuclear weapons in the South Pacific. At the moment Antarctic waters are pristine.

          Putin doesn’t seem too keen on these guys – how about in a remote labour camp in northern Siberia? Breaking rocks, digging holes and filling them up again. Survivable rations only. No luxuries, no TV, no Internet, no contact. Compass for locating Mecca only concession.

        • Wolfgang says

          Nov 28, 2014 at 8:28 pm

          Put them all in the Simpson desert in Australia……build a detention facility there 500 klms of scorching mind bending heat, venomous snakes…….easy fix .

      • Neil ennison says

        Nov 28, 2014 at 3:41 pm

        Just so.

        It is not “being weak on Jihadis”. It is the law.

        Yes Britain is weak on Jihadis and that is a political problem. It is also a freedom of speech problem, because it is (almost) illegal in the UK to tell the truth about Islam. Not quite illegal yet…..but that is where we are heading.

        • Neil Jennison says

          Nov 29, 2014 at 1:54 pm

          Hmm, technically we kicked our own arses since north America was largely populated by Britons with British accents at the time of the war of American Independence.

          I would also point out the USA arrived rather late for the two more recent global conflicts…..it may come as news to the USA but WW2 started in 1939 not 1941. 🙂

  7. Salah says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 3:45 pm

    “Battle-Hardened Terrorists Will Return to The UK, And There is Nothing we Can do About it,”

    He’s right, there is nothing the govenment can do about it. But there’s a lot the people can do about such a government.
    How about a peaceful MASS demonstration?

    http://crossmuslims.blogspot.com/2013/07/the-end-of-muslim-brotherhood.html

  8. RCCA says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 3:49 pm

    Can’t believe that the UK has not already passed legislation to make illegal anyone joining or supporting ISIS. With hundreds of fighters already in Syria obviously the UK allowed this situation to get way out of hand, the horses have already left the barn.

    U.S. Steps Up Fight to Block ISIS Volunteers
    By MICHAEL S. SCHMIDTOCT. 8, 2014 http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/09/world/middleeast/us-steps-up-fight-to-block-isis-volunteers.html?_r=0

    • RCCA says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 3:54 pm

      Seeking Information
      Help Identify Individuals Traveling Overseas for Combat http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2014/october/help-identify-individuals-traveling-overseas-for-combat/help-identify-individuals-traveling-overseas-for-combat

    • RCCA says

      Nov 28, 2014 at 3:59 pm

      Correction: Thousands of UK citizens fighting for ISIS. FUBAR.

  9. mortimer says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 4:43 pm

    The point is well taken: Cameron will not allow “Foes of jihad terror…(Pamela Geller and Spencer)… to enter Britain. But the British authorities cannot figure out how to bar JIHAD TERRORISTS from returning”.

    How can they allow the return of VERY DANGEROUS KILLERS who are at war with UK to enter UK???

  10. gravenimage says

    Nov 28, 2014 at 10:13 pm

    Foes of jihad terror — Pamela Geller and I — are not allowed to enter Britain. But the British authorities cannot figure out how to bar jihad terrorists from returning from the Islamic State.
    ……………………………….

    This sums up the suicidal madness of modern official Britain. And it is the native British people who will suffer most because of it.

  11. Truth says

    Nov 29, 2014 at 7:37 am

    The UK is a nation of sheep, being overrun by Muslims.

  12. change watch says

    Nov 29, 2014 at 9:16 am

    We have already let hundreds back in. May has stated that a terrorist attack is inevitable. The facts are our contemptuous political elite are not capable of protecting the own citizens. Read A Consequence of Apathy by NR Baldwin. The future is already here.

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Consequence-Apathy. NR Baldwin

  13. Jae M says

    Nov 29, 2014 at 1:31 pm

    Do you get the feeling there is more to this denial of reality by political figures than meets the eye? They are happily putting their citizens at risk and inviting psychotic serial killers to live in their Country. All because they want to make peace with a ideology that is all about war.

  14. clifford hall says

    Nov 29, 2014 at 1:36 pm

    Neil Jennison

    You quite properly outline the legal dilemma.

    Perhaps Mr Anderson will come up with something to get us out of it. De-radicalisation clearly wont.

    How do you declare war on a ‘state’ which isn’t a ‘state’?

    Perhaps someone will scrutinize why it is that the police are NOW appearing to act partially against Britain First. And is this partiality in fact serving the best interests of BF?

    • Neil jennison says

      Nov 29, 2014 at 1:46 pm

      Indeed. I am just recognising the facts, despite the abuse heaped on me by some people.

  15. clifford hall says

    Nov 29, 2014 at 2:18 pm

    Neil Jennison

    Where would the team be without a strong defence?

  16. PatnCats says

    Nov 29, 2014 at 7:57 pm

    hmmmm, I’m wondering if we still have some vacancies available at GITMO? Or if the French still have Devil’s Island? I’m sure Britain has an island prison somewhere. People who are traveling to murder innocent people in other countries should not be allowed carte blanche to return to the country of departure. AND start picking up their unemployment benefits and their free housing and food stamps. Snag them coming in – usually by airport – but whatever means can be managed and put them in a holding cell until this madness is all sorted out. War Crimes? Crimes Against Humanity? Shouldn’t Europe be putting together another one of those programmes? Actual witnesses and Facebook will eventually bear out the faces, if indeed the names when they start bragging, which they love to do. What good is jihad if you can’t BRAG about how many people one killed?
    Barbarians.

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