

Says Abu Bakr of his wife’s arrest on jihad terror charges: “I don’t believe any of it, period. We are all shocked, the whole community. That’s not who she is.” But back in 2007, Abu Bakr was photographed at the Muslim Day Parade in New York City with the black flag of jihad. He carried it at other parades as well.
Urban Infidel recognized him from this NY1 video and has the details, including more video, here. Urban Infidel writes to me: “He slips and mentions his ‘wives’ in that NY1 interview. I presume he has more than one.” Probably so.
“Queens woman suspected of plotting bomb strike worked at preschool,” by Erik Badia, Rocco Parascandola, and Larry Mcshane, New York Daily News, April 4, 2015:
…One of the two Queens women accused of plotting a homemade bomb strike on American soil worked at a preschool, where officials remained tight-lipped Friday after her arrest on terrorism charges.
Asia Siddiqui, a 31-year-old native of Saudi Arabia, was behind bars Friday, locked up with her best friend and accused sister in jihad Noelle Valentzas, 28.
“We have no comment at this time,” said a worker at 82nd Street Academics in Queens on the day after FBI agents arrested the two Al Qaeda-linked suspects at their homes….
Outside their South Jamaica home on Friday, Valentzas’ husband, Abu Bakr, defended his wife and her friend against the federal charges that carry a potential life sentence.
He was left at the home with their two kids, ages 5 and 11, after federal agents took Noelle (pictured) away in handcuffs. The 27-year-old Valentzas, a home health-care worker, was born in Florida, authorities said.
“I don’t believe any of it, period,” said the stoic Bakr. “We are all shocked, the whole community. That’s not who she is.”
He was left at the home with their two kids, ages 5 and 11, after federal agents took Noelle away in handcuffs. The 27-year-old Valentzas, a home health-care worker, was born in Florida, authorities said.
She and Siddiqui became close friends and co-conspirators united by a desire to “make history” through a terrorist attack in the U.S. Both women are American citizens.
“I can’t say anything bad about her,” Bakr said of Siddiqui. “She never showed anything to us like that. They were good friends — very good friends.”
But a federal criminal complaint said the two suspects were overheard repeatedly discussing violent activities with the undercover agent — including a plot to bomb a police funeral.
Siddiqui was arrested in possession of propane gas tanks and instructions on converting them into bombs. And authorities say Valentzas became obsessed with pressure cookers after the 2013 Boston Marathon bombing.
“If anyone who had a pressure cooker in their house would be charged for it, a lot of people would be (arrested),” said Bakr. “It’s like having a butter knife.”
The federal complaint charged Bakr’s wife carried a far more menacing knife in her bra.
cs says
While Torah teaches you to tell the truth, they learn otherwise in their peaceful religion, they lie all the time. Lie without shame, they don’t have honor, nothing.
Charli Main says
Yes, indeed. Muslims are PROFESSIONAL liars. They are taught to lie in Mosques and Madrassas from about age 3 upwards. Lying to infidels is part of the Muslim DNA.
Betty says
SOOOO that is where obama learned to lie so well. leave to to those imams. what great teachers they are.
mezcukor says
yes Betty you are right
Cicero says
You have so eloquently expressed this Charlie Main. Lying is embedded in the. muslim mind from the very day they begin at the madrassah. Before that they are exposed the lying as a way of life within their muslim families and muslim communities. When they become adults. They are well versed liars- it Isi printed on their DNA.
Islam is a totalitarian system. After the evening classes are ended (7pmor thereabouts)one can see the leaders of the mosque walking the streets clipboard in hand and knocking on the doors where muslim families live.
After madrassah classes they call on the Muslim families who have not sent their children tothe madrassah on that day and impress ( coerce) them, to,send their children on the following day.
Oliver says
CS– the Torah is JEWISH, NOT MUSLIM/ISLAMIC.
Why are you mentioning it?
It is their Koran (?, Quoran? Toilet paper-used?) that is their main (un)holy book.
Shane says
Yes, Muhammad lied to his enemies and he encouraged his followers to do the same thing. It is called Taqiyya. Liberals practice the same thing!
Georg says
“If anyone who had a pressure cooker in their house would be charged for it, a lot of people would be (arrested),” said Bakr. “It’s like having a butter knife.”
Who says we trust him with a butter knife?
Aardvark says
You beat me to it, Georg! We obviously both had the same thought!
Georg says
That one told itself. :-p
Aardvark says
“If anyone who had a pressure cooker in their house would be charged for it, a lot of people would be (arrested),” said Bakr. “It’s like having a butter knife.”
I bet he has a razor-sharp edge on his butter knife…
Lioness says
Several sizes of razor-sharp butter knives, Aardvark, for different jobs. The long sharp butter knife for the head treatment, the short sharp butter knife for the hands, and a few in between for various parts of the body. Just a normal, well equipped kitchen.
lacey says
is this how one shows respect to a country that greets them open armed.i am sure that there are many people includeing my self would like to live in sutch a great country.
Betty says
I’m not opening my arms to any muslims or any other foreigner. am sick of them up to and including my eye balls. enough is enough all ready.
gravenimage says
Betty wrote:
I’m not opening my arms to any muslims or any other foreigner.
……………………
Betty, this has nothing to do with “foreigners” per se—most of our ancestors were foreigners if you go back a handful of generations or less.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali is a foreigner. Wafa Sultan is a foreigner. Nonie Darwish is a foreigner. All Muslim apostates, and all staunch Anti-Jihadists.
Heck, the stalwart Mark Steyn is technically a foreigner, as well—he was born in Canada. Robert Spencer’s own ancestors were Christians oppressed by Muslims in the Middle East who found freedom in America.
And what you seem to have missed is that while Asia Siddiqui is indeed a foreigner—she is a native of Saudi Arabia—that Noelle Valentzas is almost certainly a native-born American *convert* to Islam. The same may, in fact, be true of Abu Bakr as well.
So the threat is not just from foreign-born Muslims.
For myself—and I would venture to say, most people here—it does not matter at all what someone’s background is, but whether they hold and will defend civilized Western values, or seek to destroy them like the vile Jihadists in the story above.
voegelinian says
Or, if non-Muslim immigration in various ways presents certain sociopolitical problems, the anti-Islam movement should always keep such problems separate from the problem of Islam. It’s amazing how many different ways even many people within the Counter-Jihad can find to distract from the unique and exclusive problem of Islam with a whole amorphous constellation of other problems.
quotha raven says
Gravenimage – Glad you stepped up to the plate for “foreigners” – People who become exhausted from thinking might fall into the pointless trap of generalizing one’s hostility, instead of focusing it where it should be: Islamic Jihadists, all of the various types and classifications of them – stealth jihadists being at the top of MY list. But this is only the tip of the iceberg…it is dizzying, the multi-faceted attacks the West is now being subjected to. An understanding of taqiyya is enough to turn one into somebody one thought one wasn’t! For people who become worn out with trying to understand, the next step is putting the whole head in a hole and covering it with sand.This, I do NOT recommend! Cheers! Quotha
quotha raven says
(@gravenimage_ Add to above: Then try to keep track of those inadvertent or purposeful supporters of all those complex aspects of PC MC…It is all worth the effort and a committed application of “zee leetle grey cellz” Quotha
Charli Main says
Well said Graven. I´m sick and tired of ” foreigners” having sh*t thrown at them because of the behaviour and activities of Muslims. AKA “Asians” in Britain.
If you are a Christian—our Lord has risen.
JamesonRocks says
I do Most of the cooking in our household. I’m damn near 60 years old and I have never owned a pressure cooker nor have we ever had one in our home. Butter knife? We have two…
quotha raven says
Jameson – My mother had a pressure cooker in the 50s and 60s, and it was a scarey and dangerous thing to see, hissing there on the stovetop with that little thingy to let off steam? As a kid, one of my earliest scientific questions was: What are the chances of that thing blowing up? Would the steam ever explode the whole pot? I’m sure they’ve improved them by now, but I wouldn’t go near one.
Betty says
my mother had one also and I was afraid of it. because I had heard of them blowing up and killing people and it was so scary to. thanking my GOD OF THE HOLY BIBLE IT NEVER HAPPENED.
voegelinian says
My mother’s face was blasted by a pressure cooker when I was about 9. Though it had no lasting physical damage, I suspect it was a major trauma for her (though I don’t remember clearly the fallout) and affected her life thereafter.
Mo says
@ voegelinian
“My mother’s face was blasted by a pressure cooker when I was about 9. Though it had no lasting physical damage, I suspect it was a major trauma for her (though I don’t remember clearly the fallout) and affected her life thereafter.”
Oh, how awful! My mom doesn’t use hers that often. I never liked that creepy hissing sound. But I guess I just never thought about it blowing up. I’m not going to have peace now until I can sneak a peek and see if she’s still got that thing in a cabinet somewhere!
Oliver says
I have one, it belonged to my mother, who passed away over 20 years ago. I doubt that she used it more then twice in the last 20 or so years that she was alive, and I have never used it. I don’t know how to-if I even wanted to. and, like Q.– above- my mom’s also had that thingy on top.
i think all of them, in those days, did.
Jay Airahs says
Liar, liar, man-dress on fire, Hanging by a telephone wire.
At least he has matching shoes to go with his man-dress.
I assume he puts that tent on one leg at a time just like his jihadi wife.
particolor says
But don’t they look Resplendent in their Nighties ! 🙂 It might catch on as a Fashion Trend ? 🙂
pumbar says
“Someone asked me to hold that flag because it’s very tricky relieving yourself in a dress and pyjamas. I have no recollection who it was and would never contemplate anything but peace allahu ackbar”.
That rests the case for the defence m’lud.
Rob says
This is similar to the father of a ‘British’ girl who took herself off (with 3 friends) to join ISIS.
The British police were castigated by one parent and various sympathisers for not stopping them.
Turns out the main parent complainer had been spotted at anti-West rallies previously.
The ease with which these people are allowed into the victim role is sickening.
for those who haven’t seen anything by Douglas Murray before he is on a per with Robert.
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2015/03/is-britain-losing-the-war-against-radical-islam/
duh_swami says
‘They were framed’…They always are…It reminds me of a line from an old Bowery Boys movie, where Mugs is on the hot seat at the police station and he says…’What did you arrest me for, fragrancy? Well I ain’t fragrant’…
I bet neither of these women can pass the fragrancy test either…
voegelinian says
In flagrante jihado…
Babs says
Wasn’t Abu Bakr one of mo’s brutal fixers? That this wretch has his name would mean that he would follow in Abu Bakr’s footsteps.
It is symptomatic of divorce from reality not only to lie, but to keep on lying and then to believe one’s own lies to the extent that one insists that others believe them.
Beagle says
Abu Bakr, father of Aisha, was one of Muhammad’s closest companions. He was the first Sunni “rightly-guided” caliph. He is the latest Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi’s selected role model.
If our leaders really wanted to understand and defeat IS they would learn about the first Abu Bakr in addition to Islamic theology and sharia, which is just applied Islamic theology.
voegelinian says
Yes. This would be analogous to the following speculative news story:
A Bronx man, Heinrich Himmler (his given name, Elroy Putz) who said recently that he was “shocked” that his wife, Maria von Braun (née Gertrude Murgatroyd) had gone off to join the Neo-Nazi War currently destabilizing Europe, was seen back in 2007 hoisting a flag with a swastika on it… Himmler insists it was an innocent act, and also maintains that his black bangs over his forehead and his tiny moustache resembling that of his Prophet, Adolf, was the result of a “barber shop accident”…
Mirren10 says
It becomes clearer every time one of these plots is revealed, that the parents, husbands, wives, families of these scum are always **complicit** to one degree or another.
I no longer put any credence whatsoever ( never put much) in the lying claims of these people that they were/are shocked, or that the criminal plotters were ‘radicalised on the internet’, or any other of their specious excuses.
If the West ever gathers the balls to deal with these scum properly, the families, friends, parents etc should be automatically assessed as guilty also, and deported along with the plotters themselves.
Noman says
I am glad that someone noted that family members are not always innocent in these cases. In this case, in particular, I can’t believe that a black-flag-waving, supermuslim-costumed beardo is not keeping tabs on his family. How could his ultra-Muslim wife would do anything on her own initiative, without her husband knowing and blessing her acts, if not giving her orders? If they don’t investigate this guy, then someone should investigate DeBlasio for treason.
somehistory says
Laws on the books are there to prosecute any who are found to have *conspired* with the criminal who is caught. Conspiring can mean simply knowing and agreeing to hide the fact, weapons, contraband, fruits of the crime, or the criminal before, during or after the fact. Husbands and wives have certain areas where they cannot give testimony against the other, but they cannot *conspire* and stay free of punishment if the conspiracy becomes known.
Georg says
Considering what you all have said, this is what makes the 5,000, or however many it is, potential jihadis monitored within France alone, and then consider all the thousands from Europe who have gone to join IS, so horrifyingly treacherous. They are not alone. Their ideologies are likely not easily concealed from their friends and families- it’s often as easy as studying their fuzzy features, ie beard : non-moustache ratio (“Ohhhhhhhhhh how politically inocorrect!” [to use the lying eyes and frontal cortex whose effectiveness has been honed over eons]).
As much as we focus on jihad, and we should, I am more frightened of the Islamic zeitgeist mushrooming in the West. I have several Muslim friends and a Muslim ex-girlfriend. I know- not a huge sample size, not statistically representative, etc. I don’t think I have known one who didn’t hold what most people would characterize as a strong, if not virulent contempt for the West- of course to some degree understandable. But however understandable (I know we could debate the understandability in circles forever) it is still problematic for our society. One of the first things learned in Civics is that people in a society need some semblance of unity in order to get on. The virulence of their anti-Western attitudes, to me, seemed neurotic. Everything would always turn into a dissertation about how evil the West is, or how wonderful Islam is. It became apparent to me it was much less grievance than it was supremacism. And this supremacist ideology, which is in fact their religion, is what a large portion of the left CANNOT come to terms with due to their credo that whites and do no right and browns no wrong. This is, of course, a plain example of bigotry, but as long as the political right is critical of a thing, the left, it seems all too often, can only embrace and promote it. Essentially what we see if a flight from logic, which can only go on for a short time before reality asserts itself.
Oliver says
Georg,
Question ( probably rhetorical, I know) if they ( these Muslims that you knew) hated the west, etc– WHY THE HELL DID/DO THEY STAY HERE/ ( PROBABLY FOR THE FREEBIES)
the US has an EXCELLENT EMIGRATION POLICY—DON’T LIKE IT; GET YOUR ASS THE HELL OUT. AND STAY OUT.
(I KNEW 2 MUSLIMS-SCUM OF THE EARTH. ONE BECAME A GOOD MUSLIM- TRIED TO RIP OFF A COLOMBIAN COCAINE CARTEL FOR 2 KILOS OF COCAINE; WAS SHOT TO DEATH; ( happened about 22-23 years ago; and, never had any children; his brother, also a doper- ended up being sent ot Saudi Arabia) (after serving 12 or so years in federal prison).
Oliver says
To continue,
Both brothers, both drug dealers and users, used to criticize western morality and drug and alcohol use. (They, however, did not drink ( very much) booze or beer but they did fast during Ramadingdong time.
Georg says
Oliver,
Although I can understand why you suspect that question might be rhetorical, I don’t think it should automatically or necessarily be. I can give a crude (literally and figuratively) analogy to answer: They were here for reasons not unlike those a guy who has sex with a beautiful girl he otherwise cannot stand. I could go on, but I think you get the point, and as we both agree, the question isn’t far from rhetorical to begin with.
They, like everyone, want stuff. Where there is stuff, they want to be. We’re in a place with stuff.
I understand your indignation. I suppose I befriended them like I would anyone else- with good intentions. It’s undeniable the strain of the relationships invariably grow, and I am hesitant to even consider them friends at this point.
I’m not particularly shocked at their eyes-glazing-over hypocrisy. They tend to hold themselves to a different standard than they do you- ever the mark of a prick.
voegelinian says
Yes, it should be the reasonable inference of all Westerners that all Muslims are lying when they say and do things that ostensibly indicate willing compliance with our non-Islamic laws and values.
The rational reasons why such an inference should be cultivated by us are two-fold:
1) the mountain of evidence (and ocean of dots to be connected) indicating that deceit (taqiyya) for the furtherance of the supremacist expansionist goals of Islam is a deep and broad sociological, cultural and psychological phenomenon in Islam – the evidence (data & dots) from History, Texts, and recent News & Testimonies (experience of ex-Muslims and various victims of Islam).
2) The mountain of evidence (and ocean of dots to be connected) indicating that the aforementioned goals of Islam, which fanatically motivates Muslims to employ & deploy various means (violence or deceit) to realize those goals are killing us, have been killing us, and portend far more horrific terror attacks to mass-murder us in the coming decades.
Once we really digest and process this inference (including the pointedly implicit point I made though didn’t spell out (hoping that at least some in the Counter-Jihad have learned Logic 101) that the problem of Muslims killing us is metastasizing under our complacent feet) and think intelligently about it (rather than find elaborate emotional ways to deflect our logical conclusions about it), we will be faced with no other conclusion than to work toward the Deportation Meme.
Georg says
I definitely think we’re coming up against some wall or inflection point. What that is, exactly, could hardly be more unnerving. I think there are litmus tests along the way that offer us some reasonable expectations for what’s to come. For example, how will the upcoming British elections turn out, and what will this say about the likelihood of future outcomes? More specifically, how is Paul Weston treated at the ballot box and in the press? The one I’m most curious about is what will happen with Le Pen in 2017. But there are many others, such as how will the spread of Islamist schools in Britain be dealt with, what will the reaction be after the next mass terrorist atrocity? I guess what I’m saying is there should be something of a trajectory, however steady it is/will be, which can be ascertained if one is astute in studying the symptoms of trends.
Georg says
Sorry, I meant to say that part of why observing the trends is so difficult is because they must be perceived in spite of the media and not because of it.
Fortunately there are some exceptional news sources, if you poke around enough 🙂
voegelinian says
” I guess what I’m saying is there should be something of a trajectory…”
In broad strokes, an inferential trajectory based upon the data & dots I described in my previous comment above, and resting upon a faith in the relative strength and health of our West (despite the litany of imperfections and blemishes we can harp on but not lurch and lunge and veer off about in strangely gnostic alienation toward Conspiracy-Theory La-La Land), we can plot the following trajectory:
It’s going to get horribly worse —>
(this process will go on past the point of rationality to the tune of a few million of our men, women and children being mass-murdered (and thundreds of thousands more suffering fallout from chemical and biological attacks as well as conventional destruction of infrastructure, along with episodes in various places of survivors of horrific tortures and/or rapes by Muslims)
—> Muslims will continue to metastasize (“get horribly worse in various ways” in plain English, where “horribly” mainly pertains to physical violence, not some vaguely amorphous abstract concept at which we may abstractly wrinkle our noses)
____> the West will eventually wake up, just in the nick of time (but too late to prevent the aforementioned millions of mass-murdered and hundreds of thousands maimed, infected and tortured, and so shame on all the PC MCs and their CJ Softy Cousins)
_____> the West will deport Muslims and quarantine the vast swath of territory roughly approximating the historical Dar-al-Islam where they have been deported to (millions of square miles, plenty of space to house all the Muslims in the West, for those strangely insipid Counter-Jihad individuals who ask “Where are you going to deport them to…???).
This last part of the trajectory will likely be far messier, costlier, and bloodier than it could have been, had the West woken up earlier and stopped dithering with its collective dick with its collective pants around its collective ankles — but, alas, the PC MCs who dominant and mainstream (so much so, they even find their way into the Counter-Jihad in various forms and degrees) will likely prevent that waking-up process from unfolding in a sufficiently timely manner…
Georg says
Interesting analysis, and yes, that’s what I meant about being able to infer a trajectory from evidence/”the dots”.
I suppose my own sense is that the attack against the West will be much more political than it will be militant (of course there will be recurrent militant attacks). Maybe we’ll call this a “Warm War”. I see Islam advancing much faster along that front, literally with political seats taken by Muslims, but also less directly through Muslims districting themselves and indoctrinating themselves in Muslim schools (whether or not they’re labeled as such). But I don’t argue that this won’t be strongly associated with militant Islamist violence.
As far as “sending them back”, it’s so far from politically feasible now that I don’t consider it a possibility. It’s also hard for me to picture any scenario where it would become feasible.
To my mind, there must be:
1) A serious rollback on Muslim immigration.
2) A concerted resistance put up against the Islamization of the West
3) People who do these things, not people who say they’ll do these things – politicians/potential politicians must show us some war wounds on these issues. What they have done regarding the issue/s must be demonstrated BEFORE they are elected.
Georg says
As we’re not interested in hearing about what they’ll do, but in seeing what they’ve done, the clarion call will be:
YES, WE DID.
voegelinian says
“I suppose my own sense is that the attack against the West will be much more political than it will be militant (of course there will be recurrent militant attacks). Maybe we’ll call this a “Warm War”. I see Islam advancing much faster along that front, literally with political seats taken by Muslims, but also less directly through Muslims districting themselves and indoctrinating themselves in Muslim schools (whether or not they’re labeled as such). But I don’t argue that this won’t be strongly associated with militant Islamist violence. ”
Let’s dissect this:
“I suppose my own sense is that the attack against the West will be much more political than it will be militant…”
This is a perfectly fine analysis of the stealth jihad, as long as one keeps in mind three things:
1) the only reason Muslims are pursuing a non-violent stealth jihad is because they can’t (yet) pursue a violent takeover
2) given the nature of the transformation of our societies which Muslims desire, and given the nature of our worldview & values, it is impossible for them to realize their ultimate goal without comprehensive violence against us – therefore, obviously, the stealth jihad is only a tool or lever for them to get a foothold for more violence, not an end in itself.
3) As long as the Counter-Jihad continues to perceive and analyze the stealth jihad (which includes false assimilation, taqiyya, propaganda, grievance-mongering, and lawfare) as something strangely separate from the violent jihad – and not, as I indicated above, a lever to enable deeper penetration in order to wreak worse violent jihad against us, precisely because of the logic of #2 above – they will continue to mnimize the problem whose only logical solution is to deport Muslims from the West.
I’m not entirely sure that Georg’s parenthetical concessions – e.g., “(of course there will be recurrent militant attacks)” – are coming from the framework I described above.
Georg says
voegelinian,
Thanks for the great response, you’ve definitely helped me to see things a bit differently.
1) I entirely agree they’re restrained only be their means and not their intentions. I also agree many of their intentions are militant, discussed more below.
2) ” it is impossible for them to realize their ultimate goal without comprehensive violence against us “.
Are we assuming the “ultimate goal” is shari’a, etc? My fear is that they may get very near or reach their “ultimate goal”, without the native Europeans taking action, without violence. In some ways violence may actually even be counterproductive for them and make it more difficult for them to achieve their goal. The bad publicity draws the ire of native Europeans who will respond not with violence, generally speaking, but with institutional resistance/impediments. Muslims aren’t stupid, well in some ways, save the grist of the exceptions for later arguments, and will therefore largely be persuaded by their leadership not to use violence, not because it’s wrong but because it puts their “ultimate goal” further out of reach.
Take Tommy Robinson. He was and is absolutely vilified by the media. He was called a racist, Islamophobe, and everything else. If he really were those things he’d be gone by now, but he’s not. He’s devastatingly quick and articulate (which can be dampened for the unwise’s ears because of his colloquial presentation and demeanor) and ceaselessly dignified. The left AND Muslims would like nothing more than for him to act like a “knob”, as they endlessly and shamelessly do toward him, or a raging belligerent jackass so they could point and say, “See!” But he doesn’t, and this is what’s making him a thorn in the side of those opposing our counterjihad. I think Islamists do or will understand why this works and proceed accordingly, those that don’t are filtered away, like an evolutionary process, and we’re left with Tariq Ramadans and the like who are much more insidious– resistant, like with a pathogen.
If they reach large enough relative populations, take Rotterdam as a case study, to what ends can they use our democratic systems against us?
I hope my feelings here aren’t interpreted as “jihad isn’t as bad as stealth jihad”, or anything like that, I just think stealth jihad is not only more insidious, but likely more effective. A huge caveat to this is that there will be jihadist violence, but I’m not sure it will be their counter-European magnum opus.
And of course maybe I’m flatly wrong and the violence will ratchet up with increased population levels. I believe it was Wilders who spoke about them “changing their tune” upon reaching critical mass, which I think will definitely happen. I took that to mean they’ll start becoming more demanding, insistent and brazen in their eroding Europe from within, but not necessarily violent.
3) If mass deportation is the only option I worry because it seems politically untouchable right now. I don’t mean to minimize any problem related to Islamization of the West, even if I did think deportation was the only solution, it wouldn’t matter much because I consider it to be unreachable. If it proves possible- sign me up.
If we can put outright deportation aside for sake of argument, what do you think of luring them out (if they can’t be forced out)? Are there any incentives to offer them which you think would be sufficient to get them out of Europe? They seem to hate it so much, and love where they’re from, yet it doesn’t seem to get asked, “How do we get them there?” What could change either on our shores or theirs which would make it worthwhile pursuit?
Last thing:
If I could add an important #4 to my above proposed response to our Islamization, I’m interested to hear your thoughts on this because I think it’s of very serious importance and nary discussed:
4) Stop the demoralization of Europeans. This constant sleet in the face of Europeans delivered as accusations of racism, colonialists, bigots, thieves, miscreants (no matter if they’re Scandinavian), coupled with the “gimme gimme or i’m gonna”, and on and on and on has the intended effect by Islamists of water on stone. Ordinary Muslims relish it not because it’s an ethically appropriate, forget polite, way to behave where you’ve been offered sanctuary *get barf bucket* but because it gets them things from the demoralized, and who cares how much you trample on the dignity of the welcoming kafirs, which of course they take perennial glee in.
As a complete and total aside, we need to begin to talk about how few asylum seekers Quatar et al. take in. And it’s time for Japan and some other places to take some of the burden. Europeans are the only ones who take them in in droves and get a spit in the face for it. How often do Muslims rant about the racism of the Japanese? They don’t do it because they aren’t demoralized and won’t give them anything, not because they aren’t comparatively racist.
My last last last idea: It’s bad but not too late. It looks to be a fairly thankless and lifelong endeavor, but the people who take these on are the ones who matter most.
Georg says
Cliff notes: I feel their ultimate goal can possibly be achieved in more than one fashion, and because the stealth fashion is easier, it is more likely to be the predominant method of jihad in Europe.
I wish I’d reread a bit more before posting. I did not give violence its due credit for effectiveness- and we know what’s effective will be utilized. I think violence will be used particularly as a form of intimidation, especially having to do with sharia compliance.
Anyway, thanks again for the response. Nice to sometimes get something more substantive than the normative quips.
Georg says
I’m already moving closer to your argument… I suppose this is what you were admonishing:
Truly, if the Hypocrites, and those in whose hearts is a disease, and those who stir up sedition in the City, desist not, We shall certainly stir thee up against them: Then will they not be able to stay in it as thy neighbours for any length of time: They shall have a curse on them: whenever they are found, they shall be seized and slain (without mercy).
— Quran 33:61
It makes one shudder that we aren’t to act against such a book about us.
voegelinian says
Georg,
“Are we assuming the “ultimate goal” is shari’a, etc? My fear is that they may get very near or reach their “ultimate goal”, without the native Europeans taking action, without violence.”
This question and comment indicates you haven’t fully factored in the two things I mentioned:
1) the nature of Islam
2) the nature of our civilization.
Anything less than an ISIS-style system is not Islam; it’s only Islam in various stages of having to make do with limitations imposed by circumstances. If Muslims take over, why would they limit themselves from implementing full Islam, when that’s what they desire? The only limitation is our unwillingness to submit. The only way to overcome that limitation is to use violence against us until we submit.
I don’t see why this is so difficult to grasp. Logically, your difficulty must be based in believing there are different types of Islam (ironically, this is the framework our PC MC mainstream labors under). There’s no other logical explanation for your difficulty in grasping this simple formula. But there is only one Islam which Muslims desire, and if we see different degrees of Islam in various places, that only has to do with limitations of circumstance (in the modern era, mostly to do historically with Western Colonialism + Islamic corruption and regression relative to progress).
Georg says
I suppose I was imagining “different Islams”, and in that regard you’re right, I misunderstood you. If IS-style Islam, or simply Islam, if it’s the only one, is their “ultimate goal” I am 100% with you, and they will have to use violence for submission.
But if there is only one Islam, why have there been Sunni and Shiite for so long?
I think I have a hangup in my mind because of the contrast between the classical caliphate and the Islamic State. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t want to live in something resembling the classical caliphate at all, but they were obviously markedly different from Islamic State and I would argue the classical caliphate was hugely more powerful than Islamic State. In your opinion were the classical caliphates still simply limited by circumstances in implementing IS-style Islam?
I thought that it’d be theoretically possible for them to simply use democracy/demographics, in the very long run, to implement whatever Islam they liked. My thinking was that in the long term democracy simply implements the people’s preference, even if it’s an Islamic State.
And I apologize in advance if I misunderstand/fail to understand nuances of your writing, and certainly never mean to be argumentative in the colloquial sense.
nolongerdhimmi says
My comment from few minutes ago is in reply to Shabeer-Hassan’s outrageous comments.
Baucent says
Looks like Abu has packed on the pounds. Life has been good in the land of the Great Satan.
LairdKintyre says
Muslim duplicity at its best. Except these days we have better opportunity to expose them for what they are.
gravenimage says
Husband of NY jihad plotter “shocked,” but had black flag of jihad at Muslim Day Parade
……………………………
This is just like the Muslim father of the Jihadist in Britain, who was also “shocked”—but then it turned out that he had turned up at a similar Jihad-supporting parade there.
Taqiyya, all of it.
somehistory says
Someone may have said this already, but he is so very ugly, the cops should expect to be arresting his other wives in the near future. Death by jihad or death by ‘honor’…both are still death and who would choose to live with such as him. Poor kids that have to.
mortimer says
Abu Bakr said about his wife: “I don’t believe any of it, period. We are all shocked, the whole community. That’s not who she is.”
The late jihad teacher Anwar Awlaki said about the 9-11 killers: “There is no way that the people who did this (9-11) could be Muslim, and if they claim to be Muslim, then they have perverted their religion.”
Of course, both men were lying. Should we be impressed that they lie so strongly when caught red-handed? Obviously, it’s disgusting and insulting to our intelligence.
Do Muslims denounce them for their lies? No.
Does their silence mean approval? Yes.
Should Muslims living among us be held in contempt for approving our betrayal and doing nothing? Yes.
mortimer says
Everyone who sees Abu Bakr should spit.
quotha raven says
Morti – See Voegelinian and come up with a plan! ))))quotha
Demsci says
Yes, this was Muslim taqqiya, duplicity, yes, Muslims are killing non-Muslims, yes, Muslims do wish the whole world to be conquered for Islam, yes, they are in majority very much anti-Western, anti-Democratic. Yes, Westerners have some cold war on their hands. Yes, yes, yes.
But in “Arrow” an agent said: I was told I could never win this war, because I did not know what I was FOR. But now, I know what I am For. And he then mentioned something he was for.
WILL the majority of Westerners automatically wake up and eject the Muslims? To protect the democratic status quo? Or will they fail to do so? Do we have to wait before these stubborn mules move?
And: Are Japan, South Korea good examples of already almost “Muslim-free countries”? Which we could study and emulate?
From the 17th century onwards some Christian religious communities sought to start new life with their own lifestyle in America. I am not saying that us Democracy-loyalists should physically move, but in future we could formulate what we fight FOR and unite amongst ourselves, get majorities in SOME countries or cities and operate from our own strength.
That is a positive response, aimed at growht, while deportation, while very logical, is a negative response, aimed at nothing more than the current situation in Japan, South Korea, or the old status quo in the West before the mass immigration of Muslims.
No to trying to save people whose attitude we often despise and who often despise our attitudes, against their will.No to refusing to give up nothing at all costs, perhaps even at the cost of democracy itself! Yes to concentrate and strengthen ourselves.
So that we do not have to wait for ever on the majority to come around. But rather so that we present that majority, then in the middle between 2 ideologies, us and the Muslims, from which they can choose or refrain to choose.
Demsci says
I meant no to refusing to give up ANYTHING