What a surprise. “Iran’s Persian statement on ‘deal’ contradicts Obama’s claims,” by Amir Taheri, New York Post, April 4, 2015:
“Iran Agrees to Detailed Nuclear Outline,” The New York Times headline claimed on Friday. That found an echo in the Washington Post headline of the same day: “Iran agrees to nuclear restrictions in framework deal with world powers.”
But the first thing to know about the highly hyped “historic achievement” that President Obama is trying to sell is that there has been no agreement on any of the fundamental issues that led to international concern about Iran’s secret nuclear activities and led to six mandatory resolutions by the United Nations Security Council and 13 years of diplomatic seesaw.
All we have is a number of contradictory statements by various participants in the latest round of talks in Switzerland, which together amount to a diplomatic dog’s dinner.
First, we have a joint statement in English in 291 words by Iranian Foreign Minister Muhammad Javad Zarif and the European Union foreign policy point-woman Federica Mogherini, who led the so-called P5+1 group of nations including the US in the negotiations.
Next we have the official Iranian text, in Persian, which runs into 512 words. The text put out by the French comes with 231 words. The prize for “spinner-in-chief” goes to US Secretary of State John Kerry who has put out a text in 1,318 words and acts as if we have a done deal.
It is not only in their length that the texts differ.
They amount to different, at times starkly contradictory, narratives.
The Mogherini and French texts are vague enough to be ultimately meaningless, even as spin.
The Persian text carefully avoids words that might give the impression that anything has been agreed by the Iranian side or that the Islamic Republic has offered any concessions.
The Iranian text is labelled as a press statement only. The American text, however, pretends to enumerate “Parameters for a Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action” and claims key points have been “decided.” What remains to be done is work out “implementation details.”…
The Iranian text opens by insisting that it has absolutely no “legal aspect” and is intended only as “a guideline for drafting future accords.”
The American text claims that Iran has agreed to do this or that, for example reducing the number of centrifuges from 19,000 to 6,500.
The Iranian text, however, says that Iran “shall be able to . . .” or “qader khahad boud” in Farsi to do such a thing. The same is true about enrichment in Fordow. The Americans say Iran has agreed to stop enrichment there for 15 years. The Iranian text, however, refers to this as something that Iran “will be able to do,” if it so wished….
Peter Buckley says
Apparently, authorities in Iran are reporting a “tsunami of Atheism” amongst the country’s young:
http://en.qantara.de/content/turning-away-from-shia-in-iran-a-tsunami-of-atheism
As I keep on repeating, by the middle of the century Iran will no longer be a muslim-majority country. I have absolutely no doubts about this. I believe this will also be true of Egypt, followed by other countries like Lebanon. I won’t be around to see it, but I know it will happen.
Mark Spahn (West Seneca, NY) says
Peter Buckley, What you link to is two years old, but still interesting. Particularly interesting is the photo of Mohsen Razai, who looks somehow familiar.
Dee says
That would be a relief if true .. but imagine the desperation it would cause in their leadership.
There is nothing more unpredictable and dangerous than desperation.
Israel is the canary in the mine shaft.
Peter Buckley says
Please read:
http://iranian.com/posts/why-is-christianity-growing-so-fast-in-iran-45232
BC says
Possibly, but if true they know they have to keep very quiet about it. The religious police are everywhere
and the penalties are lethal. I do not think you should hope for any mass rejection of Islam. It would be ruthlessly suppressed by the fanatical revolutionary guard. Those who reject it are mostly the young and they try to emigrate if they can
Peter Buckley says
“…It would be ruthlessly suppressed by the fanatical revolutionary guard…”
Of course. But how long do you think this regime has got? I did say the middle of the century. Every day the mullahs are in power, the more muslims leave the faith…
“Those who reject it are mostly the young….”
Precisely.
jihad me at hello says
David P. Goldman in his book “How Civilizations Die (and why Islam is dying too)” touches on this growing apathy towards Islam amongst Iranian youth. This coupled with a birth rate that has plummeted from an average of 7 children per woman in the 1970’s to approximately 1.5 today and the demographic problems this will cause mid this century could result in the Iranian leadership lashing out like a threatened animal sensing it’s own demise.
Peter Buckley says
“…lashing out like a threatened animal sensing it’s own demise.”
That’s pretty much how I view Islam now.
Volumetric says
This is wonderful news,if true, in an otherwise bleak world where all the news seems to be about murder in the name of Holy Islam. But does the title equate Islam with “Civilisation ” or oppose it?
gravenimage says
I’d love to believe this, but we’ve been hearing that Iran is on the brink of jettisoning Islam for decades now, and yet they’re still screaming “Death to America!” in the streets. I’ll believe it when I see it.
Wellington says
I’d like to believe it too, gravenimage. I do think that Islam as a whole is in its last great gasp because long term it simply will not be able to stand up to a scrutiny the likes of which it has never endured before, but this awful deal with Iran, short and mid-term, will actually prolong theocratic rule there because of virtually all sanctions being lifted. I suspect those in Iran who despise the regime there the most have been greatly deflated by yet another profoundly foolish initiative by Obama.
Spot On says
Communism suddenly fell while everyone believed it to be a foe for the foreseeable future. It could happen with Islam as well. However, the followers of totalitarian Communism lives on to this day. Many have Communism in their hearts. While they may have different names today, they continue to undermine every free country at its core. Evil (or it’s modern equivalent) is here to stay, I’m afraid, in one form or another.
However, I hope you are right.
rob774 says
Iran is so far down the road of lies and subterfuge that anything they have to say publicly is to be disregarded. That said I don’t trust our side that much either.
Israels reaction in deeds is probably the best meter to gauge what is going on.
Transmaster says
So after years of throwing Israel under the bus, brown nosing with the Palestinians, kissing earth in front King Saud, destroying the stability of Libya, Syria, and almost destroying Egypt. Arming and training fantasy moderate Muslim freedom fighters in Syria. accusing Israel of war crimes while failing to do the same thing with ISIS when they massacre Christians,Yarsanins, Yazidis, Zoroastrians. Shi’a’s, homosexuals, smokers, etc. Slavery, forced marriages. All of this kowtowing and all the waste of skin’s Kerry and Obama have to show for it is a verbal agreement that is even worth the paper is it written on. What needs to be done is first you wipe out their nuclear capacity then you come to the negotiation table and put a metaphorical gun to their head and tell them how it is going to be.
American says
I like Transmaster’s plan. Let’s go with that….
Lia Wissing says
You have my vote, too.
Brian Hoff says
Russia is protect Iran than attrack on Iran is than attrack on Russia. Also China protect Iran. You are insane.
duh_swami says
Brian…I doubt either one of them love Iran enough to go to all out war over it…They have more to lose doing that than any gain they could get…
Volumetric says
Amazing. You (duh…) understand what Hoff was saying? Some kind of special “attrackion” between you two?
gravenimage says
Nope, Volumetric—Swami and I just understand troll.
I found that several years of teaching illiterate adults helped considerably in this endeavor.
umbra says
China only cares about the oil and nothing else. Russia simply wants another buffer zone, but not enough to go to war if the purpose of the war is to destroy iran’s nuke capability rather than conquering the country or changing the government.
Jay Airahs says
Also whatever agreement Iran makes, the regime has had years to prepare and calculate on how to hide stockpiles deep underground knowing full well that even if they get caught Obama will just renegotiate.
ben traina says
AGREED and AGREED and AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ben traina says
MY COMMENT WAS TO TRANSMASTER!
Ernie says
We agree !
Jay Airahs says
Let’s see how NPR spins it.
Will they own up and say yes this will end in a bad deal for the West or will they try to save face for Obo and say, “Yahoo! — it is not as bad a deal as it might have been”
David, Thailand says
Let’s cut to the chase.
No final deal between the Obama administration and Iran would compel Iran to divert from its ultimate goal of joining the Nuclear Club.
And for any honest people out there, it should be clear that if Iran does not then deliver a nuke to Israel and or the West, that will be done by one of its proxies under a weak and stretched layer of plausible deniability.
gravenimage says
Iran’s Persian statement on ‘deal’ contradicts Obama’s claims
……………………………
It’s a damed shame that I am no more apt to believe the words of my own president than I am a bunch of genocidal millenialist nutters who regularly froth at the mouth screaming “Death to America!”.
2016 can’t get here soon enough…
Scott says
That would be January 20th at noon in D.C. in 2017 “can’t get here soon enough”…….:-)
I expect BHO to pull shenanigans to the last possible moment!
Ed says
What part of “death to America” contradicts Barrak Hussain?
Volumetric says
Colloquially, what part of “death to America ” does Barry not understand?
gravenimage says
Unfortunately, I think it likely that he understands it all too well…
duh_swami says
Just exactly what does America get out of this game of ‘Deal or no deal’?
duh_swami says
Happy Easter for all who celebrate it…for those who don’t, the pool hall opens at 10 AM…
gravenimage says
Yes—a Happy Easter to all who celebrate it, both as a joyous Christian holiday and a charming secular holiday! And a happy day to everyone (except for the trolls) whether you celebrate or not.
ApolloSpeaks says
WITHOUT REGIME CHANGE IN IRAN IT WILL ABSOLUTELY BECOME A NUCLEAR ARMED STATE
Click http://www.apollospeaks.com for the dirty little out in the open “secret” that Obama doesn’t want you to know and that makes a complete sham of Lausanne.
cs says
OT:
Guys, I know there is a text that says: “Why make peace when you have the upper hand?”
I think this is taken from the Hadith isn’t it? Taken from the Hudaybiyyah treaty?
Thanks
gravenimage says
cs, this is from ibn Kathir, one of Islam’s premier exegetes:
“So be not weak and ask not for peace (from the enemies of Islam), while you are having the upper hand. God is with you, and will never decrease the reward of your good deeds.”
And yes—he makes specific reference to the Treaty of Hudaybiyah, where Muslims accepted peace when weak and broke the treaty as soon as they were sufficiently militarized.
Sunni commentator al-Jalalayn says the same:
“So do not falter, do not be weak, and do not call for peace, that is to say, a truce with the disbelievers should you encounter them, when you have the upper hand”
And like you, I believe the Iranians very much believe they have the upper hand right now. What have we done—especially under Obama—to disabuse them of this notion?
cs says
@gravenimage
Thank you so much mate. It is a very telling passage from a prominent scholar.
cs says
And yes, I came to the same conclusion, I think it is the subtext on this situation, they detected the weakness and they are exploring to the maximum, pushing the envelope.
Lia Wissing says
This is the question: ayatollah Khamenei s the political, judicial & spiritual head of Iran. Is his signature on the ‘deal’? If not, you can throw it away. And if it is … he may still be lying.
Jerry says
If the deal, according to the Obamination, is so good for the USA and Israel, why are the Iranian and Hizboullah Jihddists celebrate it?
Lioness says
This deal is another “Munich Agreement”, like the one between Chamberlain and Hitler before WW2, just as meaningless and just as dangerous. The difference: Chamberlain was naive and could not fathom that a head of state could lie. Obama is a traitor that wants to destroy the west. Another glaring difference: there is no Churchill that would stand up and proclaim : “We have sustained an unmitigated defeat”
Baucent says
The beauty of an unwritten “agreement” is all sides with hand on heart can say what they like and they may be right. Trying to prove them wrong is the problem.
Volumetric says
Australia’s national broadcaster, the ABC, gave us the news with a man standing in explanatory mode and telling us that it was “historic”.
Hysterical. Die laughing.
P0rk Ch0pian says
Notice: Your “Please help spread the truth about jihad
Sign Up for Our Daily Digest” signage and LINK are inoperative! Have you been infiltrated by muslins?
gravenimage says
If you are having a technical problem, notify Jihad Watch. There is a box near the bottom of the page to do so.
P0rk Chopian says
“Religion of Peace? Islam’s War against the World” ~ Gregory M. Davis
rcourtemanche says
No way to make head or tail of this whole so-called “agreement” because of lies and deceit all around. The only sure truth is that Iran cannot be trusted.
American says
Neither can Obama be trusted. Not sure who’s less trustworthy between the two..
Watcher87 says
I think I remember that under Islam, if the believers are in the weaker position, a “treaty” can be made, but only to last for no more than 10 years. And, the “treaty” can/should be broken as soon as the believers are in the stronger position, i.e., have the bomb.
Could it all be just that simple?
BlueRaven says
The only agreement with Iran that can work is the one that dictated to them after their N-facilities are destroyed. You do not need any mettings. Obo and his team are a worthless piece making the US weaker by the minutes.
mathew says
This is for mr spencer
Obama admits that iran is antisemitic and threatens israel with genocide yet he wants to lift sanctions on them. If this was a rascist anti black regime would he want to lift sanctions in his books he was pro sanctions on south africa i believe i