The Russian plane was there to attack the Islamic State. Could Erdogan’s Turkey possibly make it clearer which side it is on? The NATO alliances were constructed during the Cold War, and they are outmoded. Turkey is neither a friend of the United States nor a foe of the global jihad. NATO drastically needs reconfiguring.
“Turkey shoots down Russian warplane on Syria border,” BBC, November 24, 2015:
Turkish warplanes have shot down a Russian military aircraft on the border with Syria.
Russian President Vladimir Putin said the Su-24 was hit by air-to-air missiles fired by Turkish F-16s while it was flying over Syrian territory.
But Turkish military officials said the plane was engaged after being warned that it was violating Turkish airspace.
Mr Putin described the incident as a “stab in the back” committed by “accomplices of terrorists”.
The crew ejected before the jet crashed in Latakia province, but Syrian rebels said at least one was dead.
It is the first time a Russian aircraft has crashed in Syria since Moscow launched air strikes against opponents of President Bashar al-Assad in late September.
The Nato military alliance, to which Turkey belongs, said it was following the situation “closely” and was in contact with the Turkish authorities. There will be an “informational meeting” of ambassadors in Brussels at 16:00 GMT.
‘Exclusively above Syria’At a meeting with King Abdullah II of Jordan in Sochi, Russia’s president confirmed that the Su-24 had been shot down over Syrian territory, 1km (0.6 miles) from the Turkish border, by an air-to-air missile from a Turkish F-16 jet.
It crashed in Syrian territory 4km (2.5 miles) from the border, he added.
“This goes beyond the normal struggle against terrorism. This was a stab in the back by the accomplices of terrorists,” Mr Putin stated, an apparent reference to Turkey’s support for Syrian rebel groups.
“Our pilots and our plane did not in any way threaten Turkey. It is quite clear,” he added.
“They were carrying out an operation against [Islamic State militants] in the mountains of northern Latakia, where militants who originate from Russian territory are concentrated. So they were carrying the key task of preventative attacks against those who could return to Russia at any time.”…

Ellie says
The misinformation from the media and their “experts” is just beyond belief. No sane person who is awake and paying attention to what is going on would imagine that Obama is trying to defeat ISIS or that Turkey is a US ally.
mortimer says
The US and Turkey are cooperating with Saudi Arabia to make a pipeline through Syria to Turkey and then Europe.
Spot On says
Obama is allied with Islamic Turkey against Russia? Turkey would not even support us when we fought in Iraq or anywhere else. All Putin needs to do is turn off Europe’s oil. If the world was given an enema, somewhere over there in the Middle East is where the tube would go.
Peggy says
According to Australian media the Russians were hitting Assad opposition not IS. They claim that there is no IS in that area, only the moderates.
They also claim that the pilot was warned about ten times to leave as Turkish airspace was invaded so they had to defend their airspace.
Since most people rely on MSM this will be accepted by the majority.
Peggy says
Also, they are saying that there is no ISin that part but only Al-Qaida (moderates).
I really can’t see the difference.
Lee says
Well observed. The ABC online headline yesterday was ‘How Turkey brought down one of Putin’s warplanes’, and it continues today in the same vein. Apparently someone blowing up your plane and killing you is “bringing down” – almost a soft landing – “a warplane” – not a person. Thus journalists create the impression no one was deliberately hurt, let alone killed, or murdered to the tune of ‘Allahu Akbar’.
Journalists are running the line that it’s fine to shoot and kill Russian pilots if they cross into a fraction of your airspace high above for 17 seconds.
But if a million Muslims personally barge across your borders without invitation – many making the invasion with Turkey’s approval – not only must you not shoot at them, but the only acceptable response is “Welcome! What can we give you?”. Grand hypocrisy from mad ideologues.
? says
He even admitted as much in an earlier story…
BommelBen says
The Russian airplane flew with a speed of at least 720 km/hr or 12 km/minute. If the Turkey’s warnings took 5 minutes then they must have started their warnings when the Russian was still 56 kilometers inside Syria for they shot it down when it flew over a stretch of Turkey of only approx. 4 km wide according to the Turkey’s version of the incident.
So Turkey is lying over the warnings, maybe also over the course of the Russian.
Pig Jizya says
“NATO drastically needs reconfiguring.”
Exactly Robert, and the terrorist state Turkey needs to be booted the hell out.
If Obama wasn’t in bed with Turkey and the Gulf states things would be totally different and a coalition could be easily formed by all against ISIS. But Obama and his bedfellows only care about ousting Assad, not fighting ISIS. If Assad is toppled, who will fill the void? Most likely ISIS or some group just as bad.
The problem is Obama’s pathetic weakness. When Saudi Arabia, Turkey and the Gulf States say “jump”, Obama says “how high?” It doesn’t matter if it is totally against the West’s interest what they want, Obama will kiss their ass and do it.
They don’t like Assad because he is Shiite. Well to bad — deal with it.
Christianblood says
“NATO drastically needs reconfiguring.”
Exactly right and I wish Nato members wake up to this fact. I believe some Nato members, especially France and Germany and other smaller Eastern European members see it the same way but as usual America wants to keep Turkey as a Nato member. It seems from America’s secular moral relativist perspective that a Russia that is following its traditional Christian moral values is the bigger threat than the genocidal barbaric islamic fascist states such as Turkey or Saudi Arabia or ISIS.
Peggy says
This goes way back before Obama. Bush was in bed with the Saudis before the first gulf war. It’s all about the oil.
Christianblood says
Peggy
As long as the Saudi Arabia is concerned it may be about the oil but in addition to that there is another more sinister reason for this crazy Russophobia in America and in the West. Since the collapse of the Soviet Union Americans were pushing some very hard Western liberal secularist anti-Christian and moral relativist agenda on Russia and they were doing this under the guise of promoting ‘human rights and democracy” and Russians with a huge resurgence of their Orthodox Christianity rejected this and then America and Nato started to spread their evil anti-Christian moral relativist agenda in the countries that are neighbouring Russia and under President Putin, Russia started to push back hard on this also. This is the main reason that America and the West hate Russia. They (America/Nato/West) want to destroy the Russian soul/spirit and Russians will not accept that and that is another main reason that Americans and Westerners hate and demonise Russia. What is really shocking is that to push their evil moral relativist agenda, Americans and Westerners are allying themselves with the genocidal islamic fascist jihadists and we will see where this will lead them at the end and it will not be a good place.
Peggy says
The west is suicidal.
If they think they will have any benefit in destroying Russia by being in bed with Islam they are dreaming. Islam will have all the benefit of Christians against Christians. The way to defeat a much stronger enemy is to turn them against each other first and then take what’s left down when they are all worn out.
Christianblood says
Peggy
To curtail Russian expansion in the early 1900’s Turkey was used as a bulwark on the south. So as not to piss off the Turks America and the West looked the other way while the Turks were torturing and slaughtering their entire christian population of about 2 million Assyrians, Armenians and Greeks. At the time, the British and the Americans had a huge naval presence in the area at the Greek- Armenian city of Smyrna but didn’t lift a finger. Much later Serbia which is christian nation wanted to stay an ally of Russia the U.S. and NATO used the Kosovo civil war to reduce it to rubble and carve out two islamic states for muslims there and we see the same thing unfolding all over again.
gravenimage says
I wish the Americans and British had acted sooner than they did, but the fact is still that all the Christians who were saved were saved through the efforts of Westerners who ferried thousands to safety in Greece–350,000 in all.
The main hero was American Asa Jennings, a a Methodist Pastor with the YMCA.
You may choose to pretend he did not exist, but Greece awarded Jennings its highest civilian honor, the Cross of the Order of the Redeemer, and the highest war honor, the medal of Military Merit.
Ernie says
I’m a Dutchman , Westerner , and I am NOT anti Russian or Russiophobic . Please don’t generalize ! That Russia(n politics) and the West(ern politics)are at odds with each other is obvious . If only people would know those problems are mainly produced by politicians , who would gladly sacrifice others for their own sinister plans . If I criticize Mr. Putins politics for example, that doesn’t mean I’m against Russia . Criticizing Mr. Obama’s politics doesn’t mean I am against the USA . Besides , Mr . Bashar el-Assad and his administration are the only lawful representers of the Syrian People . And Russian troops in Syria have all my blessings fighting all forces against Syria’s government . There are no moderate rebels . The word MODERATE means : WESTERN BACKED in this context , and is a LIE . Turkey’s regime is playing it’s own DIRTY POWER GAME . I hope very much Mr. Putin’s government will keep Iran and Hezbollah from harming Israel in any way . With POWER comes RESPONSABILITY .
Christianblood says
Ernie
Thanks, I agree with your points. I wish Western/Nato politicians would understand that Russians share common values with the Western world but muslims whether it is Turkey or Saudi Arabia or others all share their evil islamic supremacist values and if they could, they would either killed us all or subjugate us and enslave us under islam. People in the West have NO clue of this reality whereas people in Orthodox East understand this deeply because they have been subjugated and massacred in the millions under islamic rule for centuries. How can we convince Americans and other Westerners that Russians are not your enemies but followers of islam are your enemies and they want us all dead.
Jay Boo says
Europe is still reeling from jihad attack and Obama is in his last year,
With any luck both Merkel and Obama will be impeached if they climb deeper in bed with Erdoğan.
Our NATO (MUSLIM) ‘ally’ better not get too cocky with the Russians hoping that big brother US and EU will come to the rescue because their are still many in both places who are fed up Turkey’s crap.
Don McKellar says
“accomplices of terrorists”
That about sums it up. Once again, in the topsy-turvy world in which we now live, a Russian dictator is the voice of truth.
Jay Boo says
Obama was just on TV saying Turkey has the right to defend its airspace.
Obama could have easily taken out ISIS oil facilities month ago yet Obama is more angry at Russia than ISIS.
Turkey has asked for emergency NATO meeting..
Peggy says
As opposed to the US dictator you mean?
Ernie says
Alas Peggy , you are RIGHT .
Alondra says
You are BRAINWASHED by Lame Lying PROPAGANDA about “Russian dictator” !!!
Before you open your mouth LEARN the TRUTH !!!
gfmucci says
The US should have recognized its differences with Turkey as soon as Islamist Erdogan took over. But no, our alliance with Turkey was like slogging through mud, with US policy unable to respond to hostile regime changes in a timely manner. Now the obsolete alliance requires us to support a nation that has turned fundamentalist Islam with a culture at odds with our own. At best, Turkey is now a pawn.
gravenimage says
We never should have considered Turkey an ally to begin with. But yes–things are–or should be–even more obvious under Erdogan.
Cecilia Ellis says
Although news reporting is being updated constantly on this incident, current information indicates that the plane violated Turkish airspace, which includes a 12.5 nautical mile air zone from Turkish borders. While the news programming is showing that ISIS is not in the area in which the plane was shot down, those news programs are relying on information that depicts areas controlled by ISIS. That programming is misleading in that it does not address the concentration of Russian jihadists who could easily return to Russia and execute more terrorist plots. Those Russian jihadists are indeed in northern Syria.
What is not reported is this:
Within ten minutes of recognition, by Western intelligence assets, the President of the United States was informed of the incident. That is required protocol, a program that overrides all existing message flow. As the Russian plane was allegedly in Turkish national airspace for ten minutes and allegedly was warned five times to turn around, that means that the United States potentially knew of the violation prior to the plane being shot down and no later than ten minutes after the plane was shot down. As a member of the NATO alliance, America should respond immediately. It has not.
Both Putin and Erdogan are ruthless. Putin is supporting Assad, as well as targeting the Islamic State. Erdogan is supporting Sunni efforts against Assad and Iranian military involvement. As such, Erdogan is supporting ISIS. Obama is missing in action.
French President Hollande is in Washington today to meet with Obama. One can expect nothing other than Obama’s staunch position of superfluous rhetoric backed up by no real action.
Yes, it is time to reconfigure the NATO alliance, as it no longer has worthwhile meaning. Neither Putin nor Erdogan can be trusted. Obama, on the other hand, can be trusted to do absolutely nothing. The strength behind NATO was once the United States. That has now changed, because Obama has not only fundamentally transformed America; he has managed to accomplish the same with NATO.
Putin, in this case, is right; Erdogan is wrong. Once again, Obama is on the wrong side of history . . . In so very many ways.
miriamrove says
Erdogan is one of the most evil of all jihadists. That no good bastard knows that if anything, he would invoke article 5 of NATO which means we have to go to his help. Why Turkey is in NATO is beyond comprehension. m
Jack Diamond says
and Marco Rubio was just on Fox reaffirming support for Turkey as our NATO ally and decrying everything Russian, especially the defense of Assad. That Turkey is acting on behalf of ISIS here, just as they facilitated every foreign fighter trying to enter Syria to join the Islamic State, just as they buy IS oil, just as they joined the coalition against ISIS by…attacking the Kurds (and now the Russians) is lost on Rubio. Destroying the Islamic State is way down the list of priorities.
But then if Article 5 of NATO wasn’t invoked for the Paris attacks maybe we won’t have to declare war on Russia either.
Turkey should have been kicked out of NATO years ago.
mortimer says
Thanks for those well-informed comments. We are being manipulated by our politicians. No one is giving us the facts. Our supposed ‘allies’ are all betraying us one way or another. The cost of the alliances should be evaluated. Turkey doesn’t act like an ally…that’s for sure. They are acting treacherously…like Iran.
miriamrove says
Turkey should have been kicked out of NATO years ago…
Yes and they should never be accepted to the EU either. M
Peggy says
Isn’t it strange how one NATO country can force all the rest to go to war to settle a score they have.
This all for one and one for all only works when all the members are conducting themselves with honour, otherwise the organisation is just muscle for the bullies.
Myxlplik says
Obama doesn’t have it in him to back a NATO partner, if I were Putin I’d destroy the airfield which launched the F16.
Godwin says
This will lead to WW3, if NATO attack Russia in retaliation.
Myxlplik says
Time for a crazy Ivan, NATO is toothless.
Peggy says
Do you believe that NATO will retaliate? Are they that gullible that one rogue country can drag them into a war with no good outcome?
If NATO retaliates then it’s clear that Turkey was used as a catalyst. NATO had plans to do it and needed a spark.
Kepha says
I would urge every Christian who reads JW to be in prayer over this incident. This is just the sort of thing from which World Wars are made–especially since we’ve been in a new Cold War since the Crimean crisis..
Yes, NATO as now configured is outmoded. But the fact of the matter is that institutions are there, and tend to become rigid. As things go, Turkey is still a NATO ally, and if push comes to shove, we and the rest of NATO are in this mess up to our ears, with all the potentiality for a nuclear war.
I am not of the mind that NATO put Turkey up to this shooting over its own airspace. The Turks under Erdogan have purged their military of the older, cooler heads who might’ve consulted with their colleagues elsewhere. Its command structure is newer, less experienced, and more Islamic; hence more likely to provoke a fight on its own.
This mess is also a monument to the folly and ineptitude of the Obama maldaministration. We should’ve made it abundantly clear that we could never support the neo-Ottoman ambitions of Erdogan’s Turkey. We should also have noticed very clearly that despicable as Bashir al-Assad is (and I would not intervene to save his regime), the rebellion against him was directed by the selfsame movement that brought us 9-11. For both sides, the USA is the power that they love to hate, and I cannot see this changing any time soon.
We probably ought to use this opportunity to recognize that history is still going to happen, and that among its victims will be Sykes and Picot’s lines in the Middle East.
rooare says
The Ottoman’s at it again.
Westman says
The MSM is playing Putin as reactively angry in his talk with King Abdullah II. Taking the time to actually view the “conversation” there was to tone or expression of anger in Putin’s appearance. Even, “stab in the back”, was delivered with the tone of a prepared bureaucratic speech.
This is more dangerous by far than an emotion releasing expression of anger. Instead of being defused in expressions of anger, Putin’s concern will go into cold plotting of future damage to Turkey.
Myxlplik says
Good, the west is too pussified to do anything anyways.
I think it’s time to take the minarets down, which are defacing the Hagia Sofia.
I was watching a documentary on the cisterns of Constantinople, and they are just amazing. Ironically, a feat of engineering and beauty Muslims have yet to surpass. Time to take it back into the light.
Angemon says
I don’t know whether the order came from the top or if it was just a zealous muslim fulfilling his duty to with the caliphate and protecting his fellow muslims from attack. None of thbose alternatives sounds good.
In the age of GPS, it shouldn’t be difficult to tell who’s lying.
Mike says
Kick Turkey out of NATO.
Then let them be Putinised.
Sam says
Clueless Obama is blaming Putin for the downed Russian plane. This Obama is so stupid he has no idea what the hell is going on and everything he does, everything, is against the interest of the average American citizen.
In the meantime, the Middle East is (was) becoming more confused where no one knows who is an enemy, who is a friend as alliances change daily. All the idiot Muslims in the area are against the only jewel in the region, Israel.
I would not send one American soldier to the region with this clueless Obama in charge. We need God’s intervention. Help us God.
Sam says
Mr Putin described the incident as a “stab in the back” committed by “accomplices of terrorists”.
As of now I agree 100%
antikythera says
July 2015
http://uk.businessinsider.com/turkish-and-greek-jets-engaged-in-dogfight-2015-7?r=US&IR=T
A formation of Turkish fighter jets violated Greek airspace a total of 20 times on Wednesday before being chased off by Greek aircraft, Kathimerini English reports.
A total of six Turkish fighter jets flying in formation carried out repeated violations of Greek airspace, according to the newspaper, which is one of the most respected in Greece. The reported violations took place in Greek airspace over the north, central, and southern Aegean Sea
Reply ↓
Plutarchus says
ONE OF PUTIN’S STRATEGIC GOALS
in the restoration of Russia as a great world power is the destruction of the NATO alliance. Has Turkey just handed him the means for testing the alliance and bringing it down? If Putin retaliates against Turkey will Obama rally NATO to its defense? Place your bets: I’m giving 1000:1 odds that he won’t.
http://www.apollospeaks .com
gravenimage says
Turkey shoots down Russian warplane on Syria border
The crew ejected before the jet crashed in Latakia province, but Syrian rebels said at least one was dead.
…………………….
This is *much* worse than the above implies.
I have seen the video–the pilots are parachuting to safety and Jihadists on the ground are screaming “Allahu Akbar!” and shooting at them, in utter contravention of the Geneva Convention.
ffinder says
Russian Jet Shoot Down: What They’re Not Telling You –
YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxTVwHXGfvI
TURKEY BLATANTLY SUPPORTS ISIS ! !
WHAT DOES A NATION OF ISLAMOFASCISTS IS DOING INSIDE NATO
WHEN THEIR PLAN ALWAYS WAS TO CONQUER AND ISLAMIZE ALL NATO COUNTRIES
AS COMMANDED BY THEIR PEDOPHILE, RAPIST, SLAVER, MASS MURDERER, FALSE PROPHET MUHAMMAD ? ! !
Baucent says
It’s a funny old world when a NATO Ally country seems more like an enemy of the West and the supposed enemy more like a friend. Maybe NATO should expel Turkey and add Russia to it’s membership.
wjsonl says
Turkey is trying to lure NATO (which includes the US, of course) into a confrontation with Russia, for the sole purpose of protecting ISIS. Naturally, Obama is happy to go along and “stand behind” our dear ally in NATO. What a joke and what a joker. Turkey is to be eaten at this time of year, nothing else.
Jim Peters says
My daughter, an Airforce Major, served in Turkey. She said, “don’t worry, Dad, whenever the civilian government gets out of control , the military steps in and settles things down with coup-d-etats and brief military juntas”. I don’t see that going on here. The President of Turkey is tight with Islam. Looks like the military is the same way.
There was no need to shoot down the Russian jet. It was not attacking Turkey and could have been escorted out of Turkish airspace. Do the Turks think that the Russians are not going to get even?
Semeru says
Jim Peters says
My daughter, an Airforce Major, served in Turkey. She said, “don’t worry, Dad, whenever the civilian government gets out of control , the military steps in and settles things down with coup-d-etats and brief military juntas”
Aint going to happen Erdogan has removed all the Kemalist.generals
gravenimage says
This is true.
As of two years ago, a full 15% of the active admirals and generals in the Turkish armed forces are now on trial for conspiring to overthrow the government.
Not only is this taking out the most prominent secularists, but it is sending a clear message to any others.
Baucent says
News today has the Russian air force claiming to have destroyed 1,000 oil tanker trucks that transport the oil for Islamic State to Turkey and sale. If correct, it will knock a hole in the terror group’s cashflow. But contrast the Russian activity,of 60 airstrikes per day compared with 5 from the US forces and 7 per day from France.
If Obama had been serious about “degrade and destroy” those oil tankers would have been destroyed a year ago. Once again the “international coalition” is looking like mostly talk and little action.
BommelBen says
The Russian airplane flew with a speed of at least 720 km/hr or 12 km/minute. If the Turkey’s warnings took 5 minutes then they must have started their warnings when the Russian was still 56 kilometers inside Syria for they shot it down when it flew over a stretch of Turkey of only approx. 4 km wide according to the Turkey’s version of the incident.
So Turkey is lying over the warnings, maybe also over the course of the Russian.