No one wants civilian deaths. How many civilian deaths in the US will result from this decision?
“U.S. has mapped ISIS hiding spots, but won’t launch strikes for fear of civilian deaths,” by Guy Taylor, Washington Times, December 14, 2015:
In a secret project tied to the overall U.S. campaign against the Islamic State, intelligence officials have spent months mapping out known physical locations of media safe houses where the extremist group’s operatives are compiling, editing and curating raw video and print materials into finished digital propaganda products for dissemination across the Internet.
Most of the locations are embedded in heavily residential areas in Syria, Iraq and Libya and are not being targeted by U.S. airstrikes because of Obama administration concerns about civilian casualties, according to sources who spoke to The Washington Times only on the condition of anonymity.
The White House also has been pressing the intelligence community to continue studying the facilities for a deeper understanding of how the Islamic State and its media enterprises operate, the sources said.
While the White House, CIA and Pentagon declined to comment on the clandestine mapping project, its existence was revealed amid mounting debate over whether the administration’s strategy is robust enough for countering the professionalized blitz of digital propaganda that the Islamic State group, also known as ISIS and ISIL, is using to recruit fighters and radicalize supporters around the world.
The administration is engaged publicly in a dual-track approach that involves an interagency push to spread carefully crafted messaging online and through local partners in various corners of the world to counter the Islamic State, while ramping up pressure on American social media companies to block extremist content and links from their online platforms.
But critics, including a growing number of lawmakers on Capitol Hill and some current and former officials directly involved in the project, say the administration’s effort is badly mismanaged and underfunded, allowing the Islamic State to maintain a physical footprint of media production houses upon which creation of the terrorist group’s most influential products depends.
The propaganda operation’s vastness and sophistication are considered unprecedented in Islamic terrorism. Although its penetration across the Internet relies on a seemingly endless spray of links posted by the Islamic State on social media sites, it is the core media products that such links lead back to that analysts describe as most worrisome.
Twelve issues of the group’s official propaganda magazine Dabiq are now online in several languages, including Arabic, English, Russian, French and Turkish. The shiny content, organizational integrity and layout are more thorough and professional than those of many American newsmagazines….

Aron says
COLLATERAL AS AN ALIBI IS OLD HAT FOR NOT TAKING OUT ISIS FACILITIES AND LEADERS
The issue of Collateral Civilian casualties let Osama Bin laden to escape when they had him in their cross fire and gun sight.
That resulted in thousands of Civilians to die in 9/11.
The same Collateral argument justified not sending the Drones after ISIS when they were openly regrouping at Iraq and Syria.
When Russia began bombing ISIS and swiftly degrading its infrastructure- they showed what can be done in a few months what couldnt be done over a year by Allies.
Oil logistic supply lines of ISIS were also spared using same alibi.
Its leadership was spared.
There were leaks that most sorties by Allied fighter jets returned without firing a single shot- 75% of them.
Nate says
Russia has degraded ISIS? Okay. Is this the “they shaved their beards version and left” or “they are within hours of annihilation” version?
Andrew says
Thats funny…….so they are primarily killing civilians, or unarmed soldiers; always by surprise and with every intent to kill as many as possible – Trying to make it so we can’t go to the bar without being afraid.
our army is doing this…..lol, so when will be a suitable time to attack them? What is the point in even gathering intelligence at all? Why not just declare alah is better then all of us and all our gods?
In my opinion they don’t have civilians, if you look at how islamic state operates – everybody in the city is working in some capacity or at least completely believes that infedls must be taught a lesson by alah.
old white guy says
if we are not prepared to kill everyone around them we will not be able to kill them.
Asian Crusader says
Think of Raqqa as Hiroshima, Dresden, Tokyo, Cologne …
Surely, two world wars and ideological regional wars (Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan) should have taught us that there are no “civilians.”
The hijra jihad can only be defeated once collective responsibility and positive obligations to inform and cooperate are imposed on the entire “ummah,” i.e. all Muslims whether recent intruders or long-term settlers. This, of course, will not happen while Saudi Arabia remains unglazed.
Charli Main says
The Allies did not defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan by worrying about civilian casualties any more than the Germans and Japanese did when they were bombing British and Chinese cities to rubble. People that think that wars can be won by being “Mr. Nice Guy ” are living in La La land.
Eric says
Thinking of civilian deaths.
Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
Not the same situation exactly since ISIS is basically an invading army differentiates from existing civilian population. Tough call. If it means ending ISIS you have to bomb, regardless of civilian casualties.
Richard says
“U.S. knows ISIS hiding spots, won’t launch strikes for fear of civilian deaths” under Obama’s rules of engagement.
So instead he bombs empty parks till the bombs run out.
There’s little impact (from the airstrikes) because most areas are empty, or ISIS evacuated before the strikes,…. When we were in Raqqa city, for example, the court (was) hit three times. It was empty.”
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/12/07/middleeast/raqqa-isis-refugee-testimony/
“The U.S. is running out of bombs to drop on ISIS …the Air Force is now “expending munitions faster than we can replenish them,” Air Force chief of staff Gen. Mark Wels
This man is protecting ISIS and destroying America.
Anonymous says
Anyone who believes in this excuse about civilian collateral damage being the reason for not bombing ISIS is indulging in a wee bit of willful blindness.
How come the U.S. isn’t bothered about all the civilian casualties caused by the arms it supplies to its allies in the middle east – Al Qaeda, Al Nusra, Al Whatever?
Bottom line – The U.S. (government) has allied with ISIS this time around and is shy to admit it.
islam :- the religion of chaos says
And how much collateral damage is being inflicted on Europe, Britain , Sweden, Germany, soon to USA and Canada, then storming off into the rest of the world ….
???? has anyone been reading the statistics on the world trade centre,, San Bernadino ???
the Muslim countries opinion poles ???
Just harden up Americans and get on with it,,,, or at least give the information to the Russians ,,, they know how to kick ass
Michelle Norris says
ISIS purposely hides behind women and children in order to use them as shields
Matthieu Baudin says
“… U.S. has mapped ISIS hiding spots, but won’t launch strikes for fear of civilian deaths…”
Oh really? Or is this just another excuse for doing as little as possible? Instead of talking softly and carrying a big stick the incumbent president is now talking loudly and carrying a small stick.
Peter says
President Clinton knew where bin Laden was, and shied away from taking him out for fear of collateral damage; i.e., killing women and children (some of whom later matured into …. Jihadists). He even stated, if he had to do it all over again, he would make the same decision.
No surprise that Obama thinks the same way. The unintended consequences of such niceties and delusions, however, can significantly outweigh rational action (obsta princiii), as we found out on 9/11, and even the Obama administration is finding out the longer the ISLAMIC State’s life expectancy gets.
Both men were out of their depths, though, admittedly, Clinton wasn’t in the kiddie pool.
Nate says
ISIS and other groups and in fact, the regime too, are filled with Russian speakers, the Russians got caught trying to sell radioactive material to ISIS in Moldova and Assad buys oil from ISIS. Makes one wonder?
Nate says
The things one reads, of course, the Assad dynasty helped Hezbollah and Iran bomb and kill 250 Marines in Lebanon.
Andrew H. says
Nobody wants to kill innocent people but war is about killing the enemy before he kills you and through the ages innocent civilians have been killed for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Do what the Israeli’s do – communicate to the civilians that you will be eradicating this and that block and to stay out of there. Then obliterate that target. After that you can disrupt their operations wildly by repeatedly sending such warnings without following up every time. This will have them fleeing their homes and workplaces continuously – both ISIS and civilians. Inform them that we know where ISIS is and to stay away from their places. This will have civilians running off to field – perhaps some ISIS, too. Bit by bit, you’ll get them all.
eduardo odraude says
Andrew H., that sort of compromise might be the best that can be done for civilians.
ISIS must be destroyed, but there is more than one way to do that, and we should pick the method that minimizes civilian casualties, unless an ethical argument can be made otherwise (for example, quick devastation of ISIS without regard for civilians might in practice kill fewer civilians — including our civilians — than the slower war that attempts to avoid civilians?)
Obama’s people would do well to ask advice from the Israeli government about the human shield problem. Israel has been dealing with the ethical and practical quandaries around civilian shields for ages.
We also want to avoid doing anything that will send huge numbers of refugees toward Europe.
Angemon says
Good for them – living close to work saves time in the commute.
#ISISLivesMatter.
Jim Peters says
When you declare war on another society, you are putting your own society at risk. The Jihadis are cowards and do not regard women or children the same way we do. Women and children are part of the Jihad. They automatically become part of the collateral damage. Islam thinks it can use our courts, our morals, our constitution, our Christianity against us. Barry knows this and is complicit in whatever ISIS is doing.
Lenny Thetruth says
I have doubts about President Obamas will to destroy ISIS. He will go against ISIL, but then, he is not calling a spade a spade. Terrorists don’t care who they kill, but they do want a body count. They hide behind civilians, because they feel they are either protected, or if struk, they can always play the “poor me” card.
The UN is no help. They want an even body count. Look what critiszim Israel gets for killing attacking “Palestinians.” This may be only self defense, but if you come at me with a knife, I will shoot you. Common sense, but Ban Ki-Moon thinks disproportionate killing is wrong. Nobody is executiong anybody, but the practice of self defense is not being honored.
Anybody who thinks they can win a war strictly with air support has never fought in a war. It helps a lot, but usually works best in support of ground troops. So, Obama pledges to remove troops. Then he puts some back. Then more, then less. He applies pressure, but then removes it. Who is he supporting?
David, Thailand says
Would be nice if the America-hating, white-hating, Jew-hating Muslim Socialist in the White House also concerned himself with protecting the civilised world.
UNCLE VLADDI says
Since mujihadeen aren’t part of they Iraqi or Syrian government of military, leftards get to classify them ALL as “CIVILIANS!”
Whee.
? says
I find it notable that the human shield predicament only works on those who actually have a conscience…
Kimilady says
Who are the US, Britain, France and the useless Arab Allies trying to kid? If they had wanted ISIS sent off to Surga to meet their virgins, they could have done it within days. If one cares to view some of You Tube videos one could be blown away by the latest American arsenal of war. That goes for Britain too. Why cant these weapons be deployed to wipe these assholes off the face of the earth. It’s a matter of whether they are genuinely interested in taking down ISIS like Russia and France do right now. Collecteral damage my eye. In the end there would be thousands dead on the streets. None of them spineless leaders is willing to do something until something big really happens but then it would be too late. Adieu Europe and America.