This effort is foredoomed; how much of Belgium will be left before the Belgian government figures that out? “Last year it was revealed that a young Moroccan imam who had preached in the officially recognised ‘moderate’ mosque, the Dome in Borgerhout, had gone to Syria with two other men to join the jihadists. Youssef El G. — the imam in question — had not been monitored, and the police said his departure came as a surprise.” There will be many, more such surprises.
“Belgian Government To Fund Imams And Muslim Consultants To ‘Stimulate A Moderate European Form Of Islam,’” by Sarkis Zeronian, Breitbart, February 19, 2016 (thanks to The Religion of Peace):
The Belgian Federal Government has set aside a multi-million euro fund to work alongside the Muslim Executive on a project aiming “to help stimulate a moderate European form of Islam”.
The Belgian Government has earmarked €3.3 million to be able to pay the wages of 80 new Imams, reports Flemish daily newspaper De Standaard. The move was announced in the light of applications filed in recent months by mosques seeking official state recognition.
Justice Minister Koen Geens said official recognition of mosques forms “part of our strategy to promote a more integrated form of Islam”, one intended to counter radicalisation, violent extremism and terrorism. He added:
“A recognised mosque is a sign of an integrated Islam. In the fight against radicalisation, it is important that young people don’t drift into the arms of radical mosques. This also provides us with more interlocutors.”
Mosques that receive official approval are given public funding to pay the wages of Imams and other pastoral staff. In order to qualify for money from the Federal Justice Department the mosques and their staff are scrutinised by the Belgian State Security Service to ascertain whether their version of Islam is deemed to be acceptable. Other input comes from the local municipality and state.
Very few new mosques were granted recognition in recent years, especially in Flanders. Until recently only 30 had been certified, but there are now almost 50 mosques in the Flemish region with pending recognition requests.
Unfortunately official recognition of a mosque has not proved to be the miracle solution against radical Islam the Belgian state would hope.
Last year it was revealed that a young Moroccan imam who had preached in the officially recognised ‘moderate’ mosque, the Dome in Borgerhout, had gone to Syria with two other men to join the jihadists. Youssef El G. — the imam in question — had not been monitored, and the police said his departure came as a surprise.

Champ ✿ says
https://youtu.be/PyotLRHMOIk
Godwin says
Interesting. As mentioned the original IS member is ………………………….!
Fred says
I thought Saudi Arabia was taking care of this.
Rob Porter says
Mickey, what incredibly stupid and cowardly people are the leaders of Belgium! However, the public put them in office, so how stupid is the public? On the other hand, the American people put pathological liar and Islam supporter Barack Obama in office and the Canadian people put the shallow, empty-headed Muslim promoting fool Justin Trudeau in office, so how much smarter are the American and Canadian people? I get the feeling that Americans are waking up to Islam – thanks in part at least to Robert Spencer, Pamela Geller and other brave souls, but in Canada politically correct, complacent and apathetic public is fast asleep – thanks very much to a useless media.
Voytek Gagalka says
Surprise, surprise! (Not for me.) Idiots! (People currently populating that Belgian government. It will not stay “Belgian” for long.)
Angemon says
Whatever those imams don’t blow on hookers and, well, blow, it’ll certainly be used to finance the trips of devout Belgium muslims to Syria.
mortimer says
The imams and their followers are the biggest users of pornography in the world. Muslims are the winners in the fantasizing contest.
CogitoErgoSum says
Will this moderate European version of Islam use an edited version of the Quran which leaves out the verses advocating killing Christians, Jews and infidels? Will Quran 9:29 be replaced with the golden rule? Just how does a “moderate” Muslim interpret Quran 9:29 anyway … without making some people inferior to others?
mortimer says
CES wrote: “Just how does a “moderate” Muslim interpret …” the violent passages in the Koran.
Good point. The answer has to do with the ‘Koran-only’ Islam that omits the hadiths and then fantasizes on the meaning of Koranic verses by radically revising Islamic history.
Their project fails because without the hadiths there is no Islamic history within which they may contextualize the Koran. The original Muslims realized that most of the Koran was impenetrably obscure and inexplicable, so they created the hadiths and Sira to explain the Koran. Unfortunately, much of the Koran is still obscure because all of it isn’t covered by a hadith.
Islam is a series of lies, damn lies and guesses by the mullahs to cover up the fact that Mohammed’s followers assassinated him when they feared for their lives and Mohammed became a raving, psychopathic madman.
Without the hadiths, the Koran still has 64% of it which is the ranting argument that Allah hates kafirs and wants Muslims to hurt them.
The Koran is a troop motivator. Allah is a preacher of Arab world conquest. Islam is an excuse to hurt women and ‘others’. The GREATEST problem with the Koran is that it contains no Universal Golden Rule…quite the reverse.
CogitoErgoSum says
Yes, and as for what the Jizya is, I don’t recall there being any definition as to its meaning contained within the Quran. The determination that the word actually refers to some sort of tribute or monetary payment has to be found outside the Quran. Even then, the type and amount of this payment is not specific and is left to the discretion and imagination of the one in charge of collecting the Jizya. However, it is clear that the purpose of the Jizya is to establish quite firmly the authority and superiority of Muslims over those who are not Muslims…. and to insure that those who have been subdued acknowledge their submission and their inferiority.
DFD says
CogitoErgoSum says: “…leaves out the verses advocating killing Christians, Jews and infidels? …”
What a good idea! Just think, a Koran of only 30-40 pages. Soothing reading, apart from treatment of women and the hilarious mathematics of assigning shares in inheritance matters. And the Muslim kids wouldn’t have to spend more than 6-12 months, depending upon their level of intelligence, in a Madrassa.
We can but dream…
mortimer says
FOOLS AND THEIR MONEY ARE SOON PARTED! THIS IS FOOL’S ERRAND!
Didn’t we just hear from ADUNIS ASBAR, the greatest Arabic poet? He just claimed that Islam cannot be reformed. Whatever is ‘perfect, complete and eternal’ cannot be reformed without making it imperfect, incomplete and a mere snapshot of 7th century Arab culture, rather than an eternally important message.
To touch Islam is to shatter it into a million broken pieces. The mullahs know this and will defend it with the BIDA DOCTRINE which claims that any ‘DEVIATION’ from the ‘CONSENSUS’ of Islam is a crime and a sin punishable by death if the sinner doesn’t repent his error.
No mullah will attempt to reform Islam for it will be his death sentence.
Western elites are such ARROGANT FOOLS. They have not studied Islam’s source texts but preposterously present themselves as experts on the subject. The blind elite leading the blind voters.
Atheist7 says
To make Islam friendly and non-violent you would have to eliminate the Muhammad of Medina, most of Muhammad’s life, and Sharia Law. Since this could not and would not be done, one can predict that the entire project will fail for us – and be an overwhelming success for Jihad. Again, money will flow out of the pockets of the Belgian tax-payer and into the pockets of the stealth jihadists. It would be interesting to note the criteria used to determine what constitutes a “moderate European version of Islam”
Champ says
To make Islam friendly and non-violent you would have to eliminate the Muhammad of Medina, most of Muhammad’s life, and Sharia Law.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Preciiisely! …muhammad was pure evil, and you can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear.
Bottom line: “moderate islam” is a total MYTH.
mortimer says
‘Atheist’ wrote: “you would have to eliminate …Muhammad”
Mohammed is the greatest liability to Islam’s credibility. Muslims hide all the repulsive, negative stories about Mohammed.
mortimer says
Many of the standard prayers used in mosques are purely supremacist. It would require purging much of the familiar mosque ceremony.
One of the suggestions made to ‘moderate’ mosques is to force mullahs to submit their sermons to the authorities a week in advance of delivery.
Wellington says
Again can be seen that the chief problem is not Islam, problem though this wretched religion is, but rather willful ignorance of Islam. Western elites, in this case Belgian elites, keep doubling down again and again in the face of OVERWHELMING evidence that there is no moderate Islam.
There are many Muslims who don’t implement Islamic tenets fully but so what? This should never lead someone to conclude that therefore there is a moderate Islam lurking out there. There isn’t.
An ideology should NEVER be judged by the inevitable fact that many adherents of the ideology in question don’t fully implement its tenets. After all, many Nazi Party members were just functionaries who themselves never committed violence against Jews or anyone but that never made Nazism OK or should have led any sensible person to conclude that a moderate Nazism was a real possibility. And so is it the case with Islam.
Wake up Belgium. Wake up all the West. Islam is a totalitarian ideology and can only be discarded and never reformed. For Christ’s sake, you’d think more Western elites would have gotten this by now. But they haven’t, now have they? Well, just as no amount of education can trump ideology (e.g., Joseph Goebbels had a PhD), so is it the case that no amount of education can trump inherent foolishness. Islam produces people with totalitarian inclinations and the West produces overeducated fools. Right now these two groups are cooperating with one another. To put it mildly, this is not a good combination for the preservation of liberty. The evidence of this truth is all over the place. In fact, it’s the greatest truth of our time which is dismissed, excoriated when stated, laughed at, and which actually invites the contempt of totalitarians and fools aplenty.
Yes, just look at who is dismissing truth telling about Islam. Without exception it is either someone malevolent or ignorant. Yes, not one exception here. Not one.
Atheist7 says
Thanks Wellington, for neatly defining the major problem. To paraphrase: “The problem is not Islam. The problem is our ignorance of Islam”.
DFD says
Atheist7 says: “Thanks Wellington, for neatly defining the major problem. To paraphrase: “The problem is not Islam. The problem is our ignorance of Islam”.
Permit me to cosign your post in reference to Wellington, done herewith. —–
Further to the stats, the link dovetails, and also emphasizes what I said about the stats being far to ‘mild’. The German police agrees, and be sure, it’s worse in France and particularly, by now, in Sweden. Link: http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/7470/germany-migrants-crime
As a rough guess I’d say the situation here, UK, is similar – if not worse. The MP for Birmingham stated that what happened in Cologne happens for several years by now in Birmingham, right on the high streets. Google her up under ‘MP Birmingham UK’ and ‘daily mail Birmingham MP’ And check on population of Birmingham
Additional, are you aware that the Muslims started with only one (ONE!) town in Arabia? Yathrib/Medina. Think about Hamtramck/Michigan… I posted an excerpt about this, an old poem, I modernized it a bit, took a little bit of liberty, but true enough. If you want to I’ll re-post here. It’ll give you an idea about the level of violence in percentage terms. Though the exact population is unknown, from other numbers one can extrapolate that it must have been between 10 and 20 thousand at the most. Number of Muslims expelled from Mecca, approx 150-200. Do the maths.
Mike says
Western leaders still don’t get it !
Sam says
Sorry, the west will not wake up to Islam until the western civilization is largely invaded by Muslims and civil bloodbath ensues. Maybe than we will start fighting.
In the meantime, I don’t feel sorry for Europe
DFD says
Sam says : “… Maybe than we will start fighting….In the meantime, I don’t feel sorry for Europe.”
We Euros have already started. In Germany everyday at least one ‘asylum center’ goes up in flames or is drowned. Street battles occur, more and more frequent. In Sweden they burn ’em as well. Here in Britain the EDL fights street battles too. PEGIDA UK and Britain First are (a bit) more civil.
You don’t feel sorry for Europe? How tough you are. FOR SOMEBODY WHO DOESN’T FIGHT – EVEN THOUGH YOU HAVE EASY ACCESS TO ARMS! Very noble. Do you understand this?
I do fell sorry for America. Very much so.
We are in the same boat, unity is of the order. And there are people like you, belonging an armed people in whose country murders occur weekly. A country that has the highest number of ‘infidels’ murdered by Muslims anywhere in the western world. And you do nothing! Except pathetic big-talk by people like you of what you will do when it comes to you. I’ve got news for you Pal: It’s already happening to you! WAKE UP!
Please believe me, all those Allah-u-Akbar killings in the US, they have *something to do with Islam*. Well, it may just be a hunch…
For God’s sake man, WAKE UP!
Haroldpom says
There are no two Islams, no moderate one and no radical one, there is just one Qu’ran that includes everything: verses on Jihad and all out war against unbelievers along with verses that speak of recognizing the “other” and living beside him.
There are no two types of hadith, one radical and the other moderate; there is just one body of hadith that includes everything, both violent and moderate ideas.
Muhammad does not have a moderate biography and a radical one; there is only one life story of the prophet of Islam and it has stories that express a radical, violent approach and others presenting a moderate one.
There is also just one Sharia that includes everything, from the radical cutting off of a thief’s hands to the unquestionably moderate admonition to care for the poor and indigent.
That being the case, there is no “moderate Islam” and no “radical Islam”, just one Islam that incorporates both terms, ranging from extreme radicalism to extreme moderation. In practice, we see people with different cultures, some of them extremists and some moderates, all finding verses, ideas, precedents and laws that support their views on life and society in the same Qu’ran, Hadith, Sira and Sharia. The radical Muslim chooses to quote sources that support his extremist approach, while the moderate Muslim finds sources to buttress his moderate approach.
خَليفة says
The questions EVERYONE in the west should ask is “Where is moderate islam’s statement of faith and how does it differ from the other forms of Islam?”
We followers of JW know there is no difference. And that taqiyya and circumstance determine how Muslims behave, Mecca vs Medina.
Belgium will soon be known as WTFistan.
Mo says
“moderate European version of Islam” – Now that’s funny!
Good luck with that.
gravenimage says
Alas, Mo, these are not the only such fools–how often do you hear some idiot in the US nattering on about the ‘moderate American form of Islam’?
Mo says
@ gravenimage
“Alas, Mo, these are not the only such fools–how often do you hear some idiot in the US nattering on about the ‘moderate American form of Islam’?”
Funny how no one can ever demonstrate examples of either one!
The thought just occurred to me as I am typing this – I wonder if both Europeans and Americans just don’t have a framework to understand people who actually live out their religious beliefs? After all, there are many Western people who would identify as this or that religion, but seem to live entirely secular lives. If they didn’t tell you, or perhaps have some minor outward sign of it, you’d never guess they were religious at all.
Maybe that’s also a component of this mass confusion about Islam? I think maybe they expect Muslims to do simple things like the women wear pretty scarves and families attend mosque service once a week, and that’s it. Maybe that’s what they mean by “moderate Islam.”
The problem is that in non-Western cultures, people are much more devoted to their religions (whatever they may be) than in Western cultures. We think being generally secular is the norm. But in much of the world, it is not.
It’s a culture clash of the most basic sort. And in the case of Islam, a fatal one!
خَليفة says
Good observation. Religious people I know go to service every week, others a few times a year, some not at all but still self describe as religious.
By and large most people away from church/temple are quite secular and keep religion to themselves. BUT the thing they all have in common is the judeo-Christian American culture. People don’t think of religion as the driving force – the culture is the binding glue, religion is like the hair colour you are born with – you can dye your hair, but still embrace and celebrate the parts of the overall culture that appeals to you. Some people do Christmas in a small way, others light up the whole house and yard – and no one thinks better or worse of any one’s method to celebrate. For the most they assume everyone else is like them. The idea of religious uniformity and that religion should rule every aspect of daily life is more the making of a fantasy movie than reality,
revereridesagain says
Wasn’t it P.T. Barnum who said, “There is a sucker born every minute”?
How the heck did the Muslims hear about P.T. Barnum?
Westman says
Yes, the Circus is coming to Belgium featuring Muhammad and the magnificent flying Buraq. See the amazing legs of Buraq as they stretch to the horizon. Even if you’ve seen Pegasus, you don’t want to miss it! See the splitting of the moon, the famous crying tree, and rainmaking on demand.
gravenimage says
Belgian government to fund imams and Muslim consultants to “stimulate a moderate European form of Islam”
…………………………….
Yeah–the only “European form of Islam” will be Islam imposing itself in Europe on Europeans.
And this will be funded by the victims! Suicidal madness.
More:
Last year it was revealed that a young Moroccan imam who had preached in the officially recognised ‘moderate’ mosque, the Dome in Borgerhout, had gone to Syria with two other men to join the jihadists. Youssef El G. — the imam in question — had not been monitored, and the police said his departure came as a surprise.
…………………………….
There will be many, many more such surprises to come…
robm says
Thats like giving an arsonist, gasoline and matches…..some dip-shittery for sure
Nimrod says
More socialist arrogance. They turned a bunch of Christians into good neo-Marxist socialists using “Liberation Theology”. Obviously they think they can do the same with Islam.
There’s no flexibility in Islam. The sharia manuals were written 1000 years ago and the gate of ijtihad is still closed. The socialists aren’t even smart enough to know that something like this would need to be reopened. Instead they’re just going to pay money to any imam willing to spout sufficient taqiyya.
Westman says
Daniel Greenfield explains why it won’ t succeed:
http://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/243473/you-cant-reform-islam-without-reforming-muslims-daniel-greenfield
billybob says
That was interesting – and deep. Daniel Greenfield is an original thinker.
DFD says
Westman says: “Daniel Greenfield explains why it won’ t succeed:”
I too value the articles by Daniel Greenfield, well researched, thought out.
Though, I beg to differ, Islam may not be reformable, but it can be defeated. However, it grieves me how it will have to be done.
Before I commence, let me point out that it genuinely grieves me and why. I am Anglo-German and grew up in Germany, well post WW2. I still saw enough of the damage, and learned from the people, their thoughts, emotions, grievances, etc. The torture bombings (oil, petrol, napalm and phosphor; so called firestorms, sucking people into the flames) during the last year were horrific, and inhumane, there was nothing strategic about these. However, as far as the defeat of Nazism is concerned, they were actually necessary. As horrible as that is. For without these the Germans would have merely accepted the military defeat, incidentally, there’s still no peace treaty or surrender as a nation. But in addition to that, there would have been countless ‘dagger-in-the-back’ legends. The years of Nazi indoctrination and inculcation would have made sure of that. That may explain why the German Neo-Nazi movement(s) are so small when compared with those in other major European countries, I don’t know about the US. It was the sheer brutality, the deliberate burning of women, children and the old, that slammed the point home – namely to dump that ideology. Note here, most Germans were not Nazis, in fact, they tried to get rid of that Austrian loony no less than 13 times in twelve years… Nevertheless, they went along; like most people do when living under ruthless tyranny. As is the case in Islam.
Which leads to the point, and a most grievous one at that. It will require massive destruction accompanied by sad, and I mean sad, personal loss; of lives and goods. The major population centres will have to be hit, at least several times. Not just palaces with smart bombs. That is the only way the Muslim Ummah will realize: No, the (the west and the east, perhaps even Russia) will slaughter us for what we believe in, for what we promote actively or passively. And yes, that means massive, unrestricted war. Plus occupation. And of course: DE-ISLAMIZATION. In the schools and the media. It also means getting the mullahs/Imams and promoters/financiers. And it will have to be major, total war. That is from the west, Egypt, the entire Peninsular, Pakistan and Iran. May be even Turkey. Nürnberg, no. Cairo, Damascus, or better still, Constantinople, yes. It has to be, otherwise we will never have peace, just look at the last 1,400 years. Unpalatable, yes, but so are many medicines and medical treatments – and I don’t mean this as a cliché.
Some have suggested nuke this city or that city, no. Means nothing, the Jihadis give a damn about death, and much less about the death of other Muslims. They’d welcome it, martyrs raising more Mujahideen.
The emotion which is keeping the ideology alive, that emotion has to be destroyed. The defeated must realize that that ideology will result in a repeat performance. Only then will they recoil from it, and dump it. What must be avoided are those propagandistic idiocies like the “German natural military aggression…ingrained etc.” Total bull. Britain for instance has attacked over 200 countries in the last few centuries, the US has attacked several countries, and so on. Which gives of course rise to the “stabbed-the-back” legends. I believe they even exist in the US. Now think about a supremacist ideology cloaked with the mantle of religion, 1,400 years old. That propaganda bull must be avoided. Further, we have natural allies in many of those countries, namely and primarily the Christians. And they are reliable!
As I said, it really grieves me to suggest this, but there is no other way. Give them warning, an inflexible ultimatum, they laugh and will want to talk. Point out ‘inflexible’, let the ultimatum run out and declare war. Everything else failed for 1,400 years, and will continue to do so. Islam, M ohammed and his Koran make sure of that.
One poster said in a thread that Islam is like a ratchet, it goes only one way. Exactly. Destroy the hatchet and shock everyone who wants to use it or make a new one. The occupation will have to last much longer than that of Germany, but as I said, we have an utterly reliable population base in there. Likewise, we must train an army of Missionaries. The more Muslims turn Christian or atheist, the better. Comparison between Christianity and Islam has to be made in their schools as part of the curriculum, for two generations if not three. What comes after is as important as the battles. We are dealing with an ideology that has 1,400 years under it’s belt. We have to deal with it as such.
Sorry for being so gloomy, and believe me, I don’t like it either. In fact, I hate it. But there is no choice, if somebody shoots at you, wants to rape your women and steal your property – all you can do is shoot back. And if that is done by a coalition of nations, a coalition of those under attack has to fight back. Look into history, ancient Egypt, Babylon, Persia and Greece, Rome, Europe, Asia, the Americas before and after discovery. There is no other way. We face a coalition of 57 nations who hold as the basic emotion, which is upholding an ideology, that sanctifies slavery, torture, extortion, persecution, mutilation, killing of offspring for ‘honor’, lying, ethnic cleansing, rape on massive scales (the first rape and torture camps were installed by the Bosnians. The Serbs merely retaliated), destruction and prohibition of knowledge, right down to historical artefacts. Do I need to continue? There is no other way.
worldcitizen1919 says
Wrong! Wong! Wrong! The LAST people you want coming up with a modern or moderate form of Islam is Muslims and especially their clerics who are the instigators of violence throughout the world and the driving force behind oppression of minorities and terrorism.
This is a Muslim tradition you can find anywhere on the Internet which condemns future imams as the most evil of mankind to date.
A day shall be witnessed by My people,” their own traditions condemn them, “whereon there will have remained of Islám naught but a name, and of the Qur’án naught but a mere appearance. The doctors of that age shall be the most evil the world hath ever seen. Mischief hath proceeded from them, and on them it will recoil.”
gravenimage says
“worldcitizen1919” wrote:
This is a Muslim tradition you can find anywhere on the Internet which condemns future imams as the most evil of mankind to date.
A day shall be witnessed by My people,” their own traditions condemn them, “whereon there will have remained of Islám naught but a name, and of the Qur’án naught but a mere appearance. The doctors of that age shall be the most evil the world hath ever seen. Mischief hath proceeded from them, and on them it will recoil.”
………………………….
This has nothing to do with Islam itself, of course–instead, it is word for word taken from the Baha’i Library:
The text of certain Muḥammadan traditions, the authenticity of 179 which Muslims themselves recognize, and which have been extensively quoted by eminent Oriental Bahá’í scholars and authors, will serve to corroborate the argument and illuminate the theme I have attempted to expound: “In the latter days a grievous calamity shall befall My people at the hands of their ruler, a calamity such as no man ever heard to surpass it. So fierce will it be that none can find a shelter. God will then send down One of My descendants, One sprung from My family, Who will fill the earth with equity and justice, even as it hath been filled with injustice and tyranny.” And, again: “A day shall be witnessed by My people whereon there will have remained of Islám naught but a name, and of the Qur’án naught but a mere appearance. The doctors of that age shall be the most evil the world hath ever seen. Mischief hath proceeded from them, and on them will it recoil…”
http://reference.bahai.org/en/t/se/WOB/wob-48.html
So as for this being “a Muslim tradition you can find anywhere on the Internet”, it actually is not.
And this text is pretty equivocal, in any case–it could just be Muslims bemoaning the idea that Islam would be *less* violent in its practice, not more.
billybob says
You’re right on the ball, gravenimage!
rod elliot says
It has already been written. It is called the Enlightenment Koran, by ‘Martin Luther’, and it is on Amazon.
Aton
Annak says
Good luck with that Belgium……..
Oh, and also R.I.P.
Florida Jim says
This is nonsense MUslims want to rule women, dogs, all other people and everyone not in their small sect they spew hatred and lies endlessly were they trained by Obama? Muslims infect everything they touch everywhere.